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Captain Brown wrote:

 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
At this point, armies are based on their unique characters.

I do think it's possible to run Sisters without Celestine. 250 points does buy another squad of meltaguns in a transport. The thing is that Celestine can pull her own weight at 200-250 points, whereas Canoness mostly sit around and take up space and points.

That does seem to be the case, I have not seen a Sisters army fielded with Celestine yet.

CB

Do you mean 'without'? Because I've haven't seen one recently without her.

And thanks for all the positive feedback folks.

 pretre wrote:

Do you mean 'without'? Because I've haven't seen one recently without her.

And thanks for all the positive feedback folks.

Yes.

Fixed.

Cheers,

CB

Captain Brown wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
At this point, armies are based on their unique characters.

I do think it's possible to run Sisters without Celestine. 250 points does buy another squad of meltaguns in a transport. The thing is that Celestine can pull her own weight at 200-250 points, whereas Canoness mostly sit around and take up space and points.

That does seem to be the case, I have not seen a Sisters army fielded without Celestine yet.

CB

You can, but why would you?

You still need to put something in your HQ slot, so you have to take a Canoness, so you're really only getting 200 of her 250 point cost to spend on something else.


Celestine offers AoF support to foot Sisters, and keeps up with mech Sisters.

If Canonesses could be fast enough to stay with Vanguarding Dominions, or had the ability to distribute Acts of Faith, I could see lists passing over Celestine in favor of a Canoness and another, more specialized unit, but as long as Canonesses are basically a brick, there's no good reason not to bring Celestine. You can forgo her and probably have a good enough list, but you really should bring her. In addition, unlike other characters for other armies, she's not locked to an Order so you don't have to be Order of Our Martyered Lady to benefit from her buffs while you do have to be Catachan to bring Harker or Dark Angels to bring Azarel.

I just noticed today that Repressors are -1 AP in assault. Holy crap. How many more rules have I been missing...

Yeah why wouldn't you bring celestine? People bring her in non-sister armies. No reason for us to not bring BigC.
But so far we are still in better place than ad mech is with Cawl. Cannones is cheap, so you can easily justify her, and sprinkle one or two.
Taking TPD over Cawl anywhere above 1000pts is shooting yourself in the knee.

BEFORE answering my post, please re-read the concerned rules in the Index.
Note also that I play rules as they are written.

Are we sure that resurrected Gemina via healing tears JOIN Celestine as a single unit. It just says to ''set up'' a slain Gemina '' within 2'' '' of Celestine. What do you think?
RAW they are now separate units.
(Celestine's rule doesn't say that the Gemina ''returns to the unit'' as in the case of an Act of faith.)

I think it's better! You can send them fay away as a distraction that will kill stuff and die, and then they come back next to Celestine! Amazing!

It is stated they are a unit to began with, bringing back a model doesnt mean they stop being a unit. It just stats you set it up within 2"

 RenegadeKorps wrote:
BEFORE answering my post, please re-read the concerned rules in the Index.
Note also that I play rules as they are written.

Are we sure that resurrected Gemina via healing tears JOIN Celestine as a single unit. It just says to ''set up'' a slain Gemina '' within 2'' '' of Celestine. What do you think?
RAW they are now separate units.
(Celestine's rule doesn't say that the Gemina ''returns to the unit'' as in the case of an Act of faith.)

I think it's better! You can send them fay away as a distraction that will kill stuff and die, and then they come back next to Celestine! Amazing!

The original unit is Celestine plus 0-2 Gemini. You don't have permission by RAW to break up that unit. The index pretty clearly lays out that Gemini are always returned to the original unit of Celestine plus X Gemini. Otherwise you could resurrect Gemini after not purchasing any.

Even the rules for bringing Gemini back prevent you from getting models you didn't pay for. The rule says return a slain model back within 2. If you never brought the model, she was never there to be killed.

 RenegadeKorps wrote:
BEFORE answering my post, please re-read the concerned rules in the Index.
Note also that I play rules as they are written.

Are we sure that resurrected Gemina via healing tears JOIN Celestine as a single unit. It just says to ''set up'' a slain Gemina '' within 2'' '' of Celestine. What do you think?
RAW they are now separate units.
(Celestine's rule doesn't say that the Gemina ''returns to the unit'' as in the case of an Act of faith.)

I think it's better! You can send them fay away as a distraction that will kill stuff and die, and then they come back next to Celestine! Amazing!

They don't 'join' Celestine's unit, they ARE Celestine's unit. They never seperate and 'by RAW' is not what you said it is. By RAW you follow inertia, nothing made them NOT part of hee unit so they still are part of her unit.

As an aside, please don't get distracted trying clever loopy rules interpretations like this. If it's ambiguous enough to be a real issue, it'll get patched, if it isn't you'll just be instigating an argument.

 pretre wrote:
I just rename the named characters to be the leader of my army. For me, the named character is just an archetype. St Seraphine leads my army, not Celestine.

I basically do the same, but my annoying analytical side is questioning the fluff implications.

I get the impression that a Living Saint is as different from any other Living Saint as they are from anything else. Solar Mecharius is quite different from Saint Celestine, I don't even know if he was raised from the dead, I haven't read Gaunt but what little I can find about Saint Sabbat the mechanism of her rebirth seems very different from Celestine (and I can't find anything about whether she flew around in the manner Celestine does.)

Then of course you have Saint Anais who is Celestine with the serial numbers filed off. Or the Geminae, who are by definition also living saints but are more like apparition or thralls to Celestine...

Quick question: I run a Astra Militarum army with Sisters allies and am considering swapping out my Exorcist for 3 lascannon Scout Sentinels which is the same points and arguably better firepower, though much less durable. The scout move that Denies deep strike/ enemy scout moves shenanigans is the main attraction though. Thoughts?

I love Flamer Scout Sentinels, if i played IG or GSC i would play 3-4 of them.

IDK about Lascannon ones.

Edit: But if you need long range then a different tank might be better or artillery, scout sentinels are more for anti-charge/ds shenanigans

I wouldn't count on the Sentinals killing all that much. But would sure help to the disruption of Alpha Strikes.

The thought process was I could have this long range tank ( Exorcist) in the back lines with a random damage output with its d6 shots, or 3 Sentinels out front to draw fire due to their loadout, Lascannons. Which is a better investment of points atm is my question. I just think the exorcist is way too expensive for d6 shots. If I keep the Sentinels cheap, they may just get ignored which sort of defeats the purpose. Hopefully in the future ( SOON ) the Imperial Agents/Ecclisiarchy/ Adeptus Sororitas codex gives Exorcists something more then just d6 shots and a tough chassis.

 Twoshoes23 wrote:
The thought process was I could have this long range tank ( Exorcist) in the back lines with a random damage output with its d6 shots, or 3 Sentinels out front to draw fire due to their loadout, Lascannons. Which is a better investment of points atm is my question. I just think the exorcist is way too expensive for d6 shots. If I keep the Sentinels cheap, they may just get ignored which sort of defeats the purpose. Hopefully in the future ( SOON ) the Imperial Agents/Ecclisiarchy/ Adeptus Sororitas codex gives Exorcists something more then just d6 shots and a tough chassis.

I can say that you'd rather have something other than the Exorcist, but I can't say for Sentinels. I've never used them and never liked them.

I can say that IG artillery does everything the Exorcist does but better.

-----Nevermind-----

I'm looking at running an AS detachment alongside my AM army at an ITC tournament predominantly so I can take Celestine. (Imperium isn't allowed at ITC as a faction) I already have a Priest (Adeptus Ministorum count as Adeptus Sororitas in terms of ITC factions) so a vanguard would only require an extra two elites. What other AS units would you recommend that take advantage of Celestines buffs (extra act of faith etc) that will create a complete detachment with an eye on low points cost.

Also is it worth taking Gemina with Celestine. Does taking them not turn Celestine into a unit that can be targeted if in LOS rather than an independent character?

TBH, the elite choices for SOB are pretty lackluster. I'd probably just go for multiple priests.

And no, they are all characters.

Elites are indeed lackluster. If you lack in mellee howq about a mitress of repentance wit a unit of Repentia. It clocks at 140 for 6 ladies...

konst80hummel wrote:
Elites are indeed lackluster. If you lack in mellee howq about a mitress of repentance wit a unit of Repentia. It clocks at 140 for 6 ladies...

If you're already taking priests, I'd probably rather take Arcos in a rhino.

Repentia can benefit from Aof however and have rerolls on everything with a mistress. And benefit from the Saint's aura.

CaptainO wrote:
I'm looking at running an AS detachment alongside my AM army at an ITC tournament predominantly so I can take Celestine. (Imperium isn't allowed at ITC as a faction) I already have a Priest (Adeptus Ministorum count as Adeptus Sororitas in terms of ITC factions) so a vanguard would only require an extra two elites. What other AS units would you recommend that take advantage of Celestines buffs (extra act of faith etc) that will create a complete detachment with an eye on low points cost.

Also is it worth taking Gemina with Celestine. Does taking them not turn Celestine into a unit that can be targeted if in LOS rather than an independent character?

1 Geminae is worth it, 2 isn't. They remain a single unit of 2 models that are both characters and gain all the character benefits, such as not being targeted.

Why can't you just stick Celestine in with your IG detachment as an HQ choice? ITC ranks your faction by the most points from a single faction in your list. 1800 IG + 200 SoB = IG faction for ITC.

Yeah, since when is Imperium not allowed as a faction. Heading over to the iTC site now.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Yeah, that's not in the ITC tournament format.

Enjoyed the fact that in the latest Sororitas novel from Black Library "Whispers" - transportation for the detachment and their Rhino's was a Thunderhawk gunship.

Looking forward to a conversion pack from FW

CaptainO wrote:
I'm looking at running an AS detachment alongside my AM army at an ITC tournament predominantly so I can take Celestine. (Imperium isn't allowed at ITC as a faction) I already have a Priest (Adeptus Ministorum count as Adeptus Sororitas in terms of ITC factions) so a vanguard would only require an extra two elites. What other AS units would you recommend that take advantage of Celestines buffs (extra act of faith etc) that will create a complete detachment with an eye on low points cost.

Two more priests are probably your best option. As outlined elsewhere SoB don't really have an outstanding elite choice. I'd even go so far as to suggest you go Spearhead or Outrider instead, take the priest as an optional elite.

CaptainO wrote:
I'm looking at running an AS detachment alongside my AM army at an ITC tournament predominantly so I can take Celestine. (Imperium isn't allowed at ITC as a faction) I already have a Priest (Adeptus Ministorum count as Adeptus Sororitas in terms of ITC factions) so a vanguard would only require an extra two elites. What other AS units would you recommend that take advantage of Celestines buffs (extra act of faith etc) that will create a complete detachment with an eye on low points cost.

Also is it worth taking Gemina with Celestine. Does taking them not turn Celestine into a unit that can be targeted if in LOS rather than an independent character?

You're going to be running an Outrider Detachment, not a Vanguard Detachment, and it's going to have 1 unit of Seraphim, 2 units of Dominions, and their transports. That's the short answer.


Seraphim are good when benefiting from Celestine, but pretty poor otherwise, and Dominions are just good.

The Geminae are also Characters, and none of them have 10 or more wounds, so the entire unit is still untargetable. You're fine bringing her with her Geminae.

Trying my second ever game of 8th ed tomorrow! Fighting Eldar with 2 allies

Army dictated by models preferences!

Battalion, Superheavy and Fortification - 6CP


St C + 2 Geminae
Canoness (Combi-flamer and Power Sword)

Battle Sisters (5), 2 Storm Bolters, Power Sword
Immolator with Flamer
Battle Sisters (12), Multi-Melta, Hv Bolter, Power Sword
Hospitilar
Imaginfier
Bastion with 4 hv Bolters

Battle Sisters (10)
Imaginfier

Mistress of Repenti, Repentia Squad (5)

Seraphim (5)

Dominion (5), Immolator with TL MM, 4 x Stormbolters

Dominon (5), Immolator with Flamer, 3 x Meltas

Imperial Errant Knight

Let me know how the bastion works. I'm curious since it got so much more expensive.

 pretre wrote:
Let me know how the bastion works. I'm curious since it got so much more expensive.

I hadn't read the rules for the bastion yet. 160pts for a 20 wound bubble for rets isn't terrible. I've played against two plasma obliterators and the T9 goes a long way. Plus, 1 squad of 8 rets with 4 heavy bolters gets to fire 8 heavy bolters measured anywhere from the model. Not too shabby. I think? I really can't find any rules about the squad inside firing the guns. Anyone know where they might be located? It's a shame auras don't apply to people inside transports/buildings.