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Just play a Xenos army. You'll get 1 book every 10 years or so.

Tyranids got a codex, so i won't need to buy another book for at least 5 years.

 Marmatag wrote:
Just play a Xenos army. You'll get 1 book every 10 years or so.

Tyranids got a codex, so i won't need to buy another book for at least 5 years.

"I like my codex like I like my women: 10 years old and nearly dead."
-Dark Eldar players prior to 5th Edition.

tneva82 wrote:
(HAH! Who plays 1 faction armies these days?)

Is that not normal?

Also, your FLGS probably has store copies - mine does, at least.

 MagicJuggler wrote:

"I like my codex like I like my women: 10 years old and nearly dead."
-Dark Eldar players prior to 5th Edition.

They came in the 3e box, for some reason, and that was the most support the got for a long time...

M.

 MagicJuggler wrote:

 Marmatag wrote:
Just play a Xenos army. You'll get 1 book every 10 years or so.

Tyranids got a codex, so i won't need to buy another book for at least 5 years.

"I like my codex like I like my women: 10 years old and nearly dead."
-Dark Eldar players prior to 5th Edition.

haha gross

tneva82 wrote:

 Hans Chung-Otterson wrote:
I don't see it being a problem that you have to own a codex, the main rules, and the yearly Chapter Approved. The "index option" stuff is just for people who want to use old models; a new player doesn't need to worry about that crap.

I don't think GW is fragmenting 40k. However, I think a very strong move they could have (and SHOULD have) made would be to do away with codexes altogether. I really expected this after AOS, and was strongly disappointed that it didn't go this route. A wargame in 2017 does not need dedicated, REQUIRED army books.

Of course this means that by december 2019 you are looking at, assuming you play just one faction(HAH! Who plays 1 faction armies these days?) you have minimum of 5 books to carry around. Index, codex and 3 chapter aproved's. Nevermind other indexes/codexes for your allies or forge world books.

That's a lot of books to lug around. Makes one almost hope they would redo codexes fully once a year. At least would keep to 2 books to carry around. Index and codex.

So how many books did you have to lug around in 7th to have the same content available? You know, those books that were consolidated in the Advanced Rules. Or, in the case of FW, in one thin Index per faction.
And honestly - you're already carrying around 2000 points of models, aren't you?

I made an awesome list last edition that required the following to play:
Rulebook
KDK Codex
Agents of the Imperium
SW Codex
Champions of Fenris
SM Codex
FW: IA 2
SoB Codex

SoB w/ Repressors and Old Celestine, Thundercav, and Librarius Conclave summoning Demons.

 MagicJuggler wrote:

"I like my codex like I like my women: 10 years old and nearly dead."
-Dark Eldar players prior to 5th Edition.

Gross and sigged.

 Kriswall wrote:
Just curious as to everyone's thoughts. Over the weekend, I was working on a very small Space Wolves Patrol Detachment list. I realized that I needed the following rule books to build a simple list and play a Matched Play game. I'm including the Chapter Approved book since it'll be out shortly.

Patrol Detachment including a Wolf Lord with Jump Pack and dual Wolf Claws, a Grey Hunter Squad in a Razorback and some Fenrisian Wolves.

1. Warhammer 40,000 (Core Rules) - 60 USD (For the Matched Play rules)
2. Index Imperium 1 - 25 USD (for most of the Space Wolf units)
3. Codex Adeptus Astartes Space Marines - 50 USD (for the current Wolf Lord datasheet - uses SM Captain)
4. Chapter Approved 2017 - Guessing 25 USD (for updated points)

That's 160 USD in rules to run a very simple Space Wolves Patrol. Am I wrong here? I thought 8th Edition was supposed to be simplified. It seems like it's just like 7th in terms of the number of rule books required for a Matched Play game using the most current rules.

Thoughts? Is this sort of nonsense going to continue?

You know, I was thinking the same thing when I saw the Chapter Approved stuff. Don't get me wrong, I'm glad Chapter Approved is returning but now I have 5 books I have to carry around just to play:

1. Warhammer 40,000 (Core Rules)
2. Index Imperium 2 (IG)
3. Codex Astra Militarum
4. Forgeworld Index Forces of Astra Militarum
5. Chapter Approved 2017

One might ask why I need index if I have codex? GW thought it would be a good idea to omit half the options available to units in the codex, despite being legal & in the index.

I assume that GW just assumes everyone is going to pirate the books anyway. There's almost no money to be made on the books themselves once you account for shipping, stocking, etc.

Being able to get digital versions helps too.

 Galas wrote:


But to play I don't even use books, as Elbows I have all my stats and army rules in MTG-sized cards that the group of Wikihammer is doing. So when I make an army I just pick a "deck" with the units and weapons I'm gonna use, besides the "generic card" that has all the Army rules.

An interesting idea I'm curious to try - would you happen to have a link?

 Desubot wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 Hans Chung-Otterson wrote:
I don't see it being a problem that you have to own a codex, the main rules, and the yearly Chapter Approved. The "index option" stuff is just for people who want to use old models; a new player doesn't need to worry about that crap.

I don't think GW is fragmenting 40k. However, I think a very strong move they could have (and SHOULD have) made would be to do away with codexes altogether. I really expected this after AOS, and was strongly disappointed that it didn't go this route. A wargame in 2017 does not need dedicated, REQUIRED army books.

Of course this means that by december 2019 you are looking at, assuming you play just one faction(HAH! Who plays 1 faction armies these days?) you have minimum of 5 books to carry around. Index, codex and 3 chapter aproved's. Nevermind other indexes/codexes for your allies or forge world books.

That's a lot of books to lug around. Makes one almost hope they would redo codexes fully once a year. At least would keep to 2 books to carry around. Index and codex.

what makes you think they wont just override the previous years chaprooved.

ultimately the way these books are being released it only hurts for people that run many factions. its fine for new players or people that are conservative in there collection. (or people with out updated codex)

GW greed plus what makes you think they will put more and more point change pages to new book? Bunch of point changes this year, new ones next year. List grows pretty fast.

Plus doubtful they put all the rules from chapter approved 2017 to 2018 version. Or does the page count double each year

At 1500 points I need...

Core Rules
FAQs
AM Codex
Index 2 [For my Inquisitor, Assassins, or Rough Riders]
And Chapter Approved. [When it comes out.

My Partner needs -
Core Rules
FAQs
Tyranid Codex
Index Xenos [Whichever one it was] For her Shrikes
Imperial Armour - For her Malanthrope
And soon too need Chapter approved.

It is getting a little silly.
And

Apart from the cost, the weight is also significant, especially since they insist on doing nothing but hardcover.
I wish they released some type of mini-dex with just the rules (no art, no fluff, and no weapon profile on the datasheet, only at the end), softcover, A5 size. Since GW will never sell that by itself, they could include it with the normal codex.
I think most of us seldom open our codex during the games, so a hard-to-read light version would be sufficient. It's just to have some sort of official thing when someone asks (i.e., not show the stats/rules on battlescribe).

AdmiralHalsey wrote:

My Partner needs -
Core Rules
FAQs
Tyranid Codex
Index Xenos [Whichever one it was] For her Shrikes
Imperial Armour - For her Malanthrope
And soon too need Chapter approved.

And

Actually all your partner needs is:
Core Rules (and honestly you only need one per game rather than one per side)
FAQ (soon to be voided as the FAQ/errata are appearing in the Chapter Approved)
Tyranids Codex

The rest are optional extras that players agree to be allowed to use prior to the game.
Index Xenos - optional expansion of the core game rules.
Imperial Armour - optional expansion of the core game rules.
(also as its only one profile from each of those two books you could always photocopy the specific page for use at the club rather than carrying the whole book in every time)


GW intends the core of the game to be Rulebook and Codex. That many players have legacy models that are not currently in production is why the index are still valid as it means that they can still have fairly balanced rules in the current edition for those models; but its clear that GW is not intended to support those models further with rules updates unless they release new sculpts for those models (or re-releases old sculpts for them). GW is thus trying to appease you by offering options that have been removed; but at the same time in the long term is not likely to continue to support those models in a big way.

The hyperbole in this thread is amazing. Especially when a lot of it comes down to player agency. No one forces you to play Imperial Soup or old models GW doesn't want to support anymore.

I run AdMech, Sisters, Grey Knights and IG in varying mixes and I don't complain because I've run these armies (except AdMech) since 6th and its the price you have to pay. It's the army I want to run and I'll accept that there are some downsides to that.

I'll also say that in this day and age if you don't want to buy a codex you don't really have to unless you're technology illiterate. If you only need one entry from an Index like the Space Wolf captain just screenshot the datasheet on your phone. I can't believe no one hasn't thought of these things or ways around it.

 Kriswall wrote:

Index Imperium 1 has most of the Space Wolves datasheets. For the Wolf Lord, it tells you to instead use the Space Marines Captain datasheet. The latest version of the Space Marines Captain datasheet is in Codex Space Marines. Isn't the general consensus/FAQ instruction to use the most recent version of a datasheet and only go to the Index if there are deprecated wargear options? I would assume that if I'm instructed to use the Space Marines Captain datasheet, "standard play" would expect me to use the most recent version?

Honestly, the rules are a total nightmare. Does my Space Wolves Wolf Lord use the Space Wolves Melee Weapons List or the Space Marines Melee Weapon List? After all, he's not really a Wolf Lord right now. He's a Captain we're pretending is a Wolf Lord. Can I take Wolf Claws for my Wolf Lord?

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/07/05/codexes-your-questions-answered-july-5gw-homepage-post-2/

If I have a Blood Angels, Dark Angels or Space Wolves army, will I need to buy Codex: Space Marines to use my army?
You don’t have to. Other Space Marines factions not covered in the new codex will continue to use all the datasheets, rules and points values in the index until their own codex is released. Rules for new models not covered in the index (like the upcoming Redemptor Dreadnought) will be available in the box with the model and matched play points for these units will be made available online.

 Sim-Life wrote:
The hyperbole in this thread is amazing. Especially when a lot of it comes down to player agency. No one forces you to play Imperial Soup or old models GW doesn't want to support anymore.

Sure nobody does. Of course hopefully you then enjoy losing your games. Or not using models you already own because GW decided they want to charge you more to use your existing models.

tneva82 wrote:

 Sim-Life wrote:
The hyperbole in this thread is amazing. Especially when a lot of it comes down to player agency. No one forces you to play Imperial Soup or old models GW doesn't want to support anymore.

Sure nobody does. Of course hopefully you then enjoy losing your games. Or not using models you already own because GW decided they want to charge you more to use your existing models.

There's that hyperbole again. Also companies have never suppoted products they don't make anymore indefinitly. Video game companies don't release patches to games they made 10 years ago. Microsoft eventually stops supporting old versions of Windows. Why should GW be any different?

 Sim-Life wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 Sim-Life wrote:
The hyperbole in this thread is amazing. Especially when a lot of it comes down to player agency. No one forces you to play Imperial Soup or old models GW doesn't want to support anymore.

Sure nobody does. Of course hopefully you then enjoy losing your games. Or not using models you already own because GW decided they want to charge you more to use your existing models.

There's that hyperbole again. Also companies have never suppoted products they don't make anymore indefinitly. Video game companies don't release patches to games they made 10 years ago. Why should GW be any different?

If you limit yourself to non-soup in soup-edition you are going to lose. You are throwing up too much power by not doing it. Well of course maybe you are Napoleon compared to your opponents or roll like dice god.

But sure if you disagree let's wait for Imperial or Chaos score big on tournaments with just one book source Good thing about this is it's provable so if you disagree you can prove it by taking on big tournament with single book Imperial list and show I am wrong.

And support is going to be at least until 9th ed thus. Index is printed and legal. So again unless they are worthless crap options you are just going to lose more by not taking them. Plus of course you have pile of models you can't use if you don't buy. Not much choice there which is why GW did this. They didn't do this out of goodness of heart but to get MORE MONEY from players by forcing them to buy it.

All they care is getting your money. they aren't doing it smart way but that's their goal.

Sure, I guess my partner could not take units to take less books. I mean it's not like competative Tyranid lists run Malanthropes anyway. And we definately won't be expected to take actual GW Books to GW events. I'm sure they'd be fine if I just downloaded a dodgy PDF or something...

tneva82 wrote:

 Sim-Life wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 Sim-Life wrote:
The hyperbole in this thread is amazing. Especially when a lot of it comes down to player agency. No one forces you to play Imperial Soup or old models GW doesn't want to support anymore.

Sure nobody does. Of course hopefully you then enjoy losing your games. Or not using models you already own because GW decided they want to charge you more to use your existing models.

There's that hyperbole again. Also companies have never suppoted products they don't make anymore indefinitly. Video game companies don't release patches to games they made 10 years ago. Why should GW be any different?

If you limit yourself to non-soup in soup-edition you are going to lose. You are throwing up too much power by not doing it. Well of course maybe you are Napoleon compared to your opponents or roll like dice god.

But sure if you disagree let's wait for Imperial or Chaos score big on tournaments with just one book source Good thing about this is it's provable so if you disagree you can prove it by taking on big tournament with single book Imperial list and show I am wrong.

And support is going to be at least until 9th ed thus. Index is printed and legal. So again unless they are worthless crap options you are just going to lose more by not taking them. Plus of course you have pile of models you can't use if you don't buy. Not much choice there which is why GW did this. They didn't do this out of goodness of heart but to get MORE MONEY from players by forcing them to buy it.

All they care is getting your money. they aren't doing it smart way but that's their goal.

The 40k tournament scene is a pretty small, vocal part of the community friendo. Judging how GW should go about their buisness based on maybe 30% (being generous) is folly. Casual play is the norm not the exception. Something a lot of people on the internet forget.

 Sim-Life wrote:
Video game companies don't release patches to games they made 10 years ago.

-Looks at Diablo 2, StarCraft and Blizzard in General-

Yeah, it never happens

AdmiralHalsey wrote:
At 1500 points I need...

Core Rules
FAQs
AM Codex
Index 2 [For my Inquisitor, Assassins, or Rough Riders]
And Chapter Approved. [When it comes out.

My Partner needs -
Core Rules
FAQs
Tyranid Codex
Index Xenos [Whichever one it was] For her Shrikes
Imperial Armour - For her Malanthrope
And soon too need Chapter approved.

You'll need:
- 1 set of core rules (can easily be printed on 4 pages, and you'll almost never need to look at it anyway)
- 1 chapter approved (FAQs will be rolled into this)
- Your codex
- At most 1 printed page with the various special units you want to include

Seriously, you want to have legacy support for all old models, you don't want to have multiple books, but the books should also be free.. what else?

 Desubot wrote:

 Kriswall wrote:
Just curious as to everyone's thoughts. Over the weekend, I was working on a very small Space Wolves Patrol Detachment list. I realized that I needed the following rule books to build a simple list and play a Matched Play game. I'm including the Chapter Approved book since it'll be out shortly.

Patrol Detachment including a Wolf Lord with Jump Pack and dual Wolf Claws, a Grey Hunter Squad in a Razorback and some Fenrisian Wolves.

1. Warhammer 40,000 (Core Rules) - 60 USD (For the Matched Play rules)
2. Index Imperium 1 - 25 USD (for most of the Space Wolf units)
3. Codex Adeptus Astartes Space Marines - 50 USD (for the current Wolf Lord datasheet - uses SM Captain)
4. Chapter Approved 2017 - Guessing 25 USD (for updated points)

That's 160 USD in rules to run a very simple Space Wolves Patrol. Am I wrong here? I thought 8th Edition was supposed to be simplified. It seems like it's just like 7th in terms of the number of rule books required for a Matched Play game using the most current rules.

Thoughts? Is this sort of nonsense going to continue?

Right up until space wolves get there own codex.

sucks to have bad luck i guess.

So... at that point I'd need...

1. Warhammer 40,000 8th BRB for Matched Play Rules and Army Building Options
2. Index Imperium 1 - For legacy wargear options
3. Codex Space Wolves
4. Chapter Approved 2017

List looks pretty much the same to me. I do acknowledge that I could simply throw away any models with wargear options not in the Codex and eliminate the need for the Index, but that seems crazy.

Sure looks like GW has parleyed it's "free rules" game into a game that requires $150+ of rules to run a basic army in a Matched Play setting.

 Kriswall wrote:

 Desubot wrote:

 Kriswall wrote:
Just curious as to everyone's thoughts. Over the weekend, I was working on a very small Space Wolves Patrol Detachment list. I realized that I needed the following rule books to build a simple list and play a Matched Play game. I'm including the Chapter Approved book since it'll be out shortly.

Patrol Detachment including a Wolf Lord with Jump Pack and dual Wolf Claws, a Grey Hunter Squad in a Razorback and some Fenrisian Wolves.

1. Warhammer 40,000 (Core Rules) - 60 USD (For the Matched Play rules)
2. Index Imperium 1 - 25 USD (for most of the Space Wolf units)
3. Codex Adeptus Astartes Space Marines - 50 USD (for the current Wolf Lord datasheet - uses SM Captain)
4. Chapter Approved 2017 - Guessing 25 USD (for updated points)

That's 160 USD in rules to run a very simple Space Wolves Patrol. Am I wrong here? I thought 8th Edition was supposed to be simplified. It seems like it's just like 7th in terms of the number of rule books required for a Matched Play game using the most current rules.

Thoughts? Is this sort of nonsense going to continue?

Right up until space wolves get there own codex.

sucks to have bad luck i guess.

So... at that point I'd need...

1. Warhammer 40,000 8th BRB for Matched Play Rules and Army Building Options
2. Index Imperium 1 - For legacy wargear options
3. Codex Space Wolves
4. Chapter Approved 2017

List looks pretty much the same to me. I do acknowledge that I could simply throw away any models with wargear options not in the Codex and eliminate the need for the Index, but that seems crazy.

Sure looks like GW has parleyed it's "free rules" game into a game that requires $150+ of rules to run a basic army in a Matched Play setting.

Again, why do you need Chapter Approved 2017?

Codex: Space Wolves isn't out yet.

For my 2000pt army I need:-

Codex Death Guard
....
....
....

and that's it

Core rules are easy to remember, relevant FAQ's are written in the codex and Chapter Approved isn't out yet so ignore it

Ushtarador wrote:

AdmiralHalsey wrote:
At 1500 points I need...

Core Rules
FAQs
AM Codex
Index 2 [For my Inquisitor, Assassins, or Rough Riders]
And Chapter Approved. [When it comes out.

My Partner needs -
Core Rules
FAQs
Tyranid Codex
Index Xenos [Whichever one it was] For her Shrikes
Imperial Armour - For her Malanthrope
And soon too need Chapter approved.

You'll need:
- 1 set of core rules (can easily be printed on 4 pages, and you'll almost never need to look at it anyway)
- 1 chapter approved (FAQs will be rolled into this)
- Your codex
- At most 1 printed page with the various special units you want to include

Seriously, you want to have legacy support for all old models, you don't want to have multiple books, but the books should also be free.. what else?

Games Workshop's other game, Age of Sigmar has...

1. Legacy Support for all old models. (free warscrolls)
2. No requirement for multiple books. (battletomes are largely optional and not yet released for most factions)
3. Free core rules. (that actually include everything you need to play a game, unlike the 40k free rules that don't explain even basic army selection or deployment)
4. Free unit warscrolls (datasheets).

Realistically, you need to buy the General's Handbook ($25) for the points and Matched Play rules. You can also buy a Battletome (Codex) if you want, but it's very, very optional for most armies. Given that AoS has legacy support, free core rules and free unit rules... I don't think it's unreasonable to expect the same from 40k and be a little irritated that a small army requires multiple, expensive rules sources.


Both Matched Play...

AoS:
To run a Stormcast Eternal army with at least one Legacy unit AND a Seraphon army with at least one Legacy unit AND not caring about extra army rules requires $25 worth of purchases.
* General's Handbook 2017 ($25)
* Everything else is free

40K:
To run a Space Marines army with at least one Legacy unit AND a Tyranids army with at least one Legacy unit AND not caring about extra army rules requires $225 worth of purchases.
* Warhammer 40,000 BRB ($60)
* Index Imperium 1 ($25)
* Codex Space Marines ($50)
* Index Xenos 2 ($25)
* Codex Tyranids ($40)
* Chapter Approved 2017 ($25 - probably)

Just saying... it's not an unreasonable expectation since GW is actually doing it right now for their other game.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Rolsheen wrote:
For my 2000pt army I need:-

Codex Death Guard
....
....
....

and that's it

Core rules are easy to remember, relevant FAQ's are written in the codex and Chapter Approved isn't out yet so ignore it

Just because you've seen the rules elsewhere and have a good memory, doesn't mean you don't need the core rulebook to play a game. It's a false statement to say that you only need the one book. Also, Chapter Approved may not be out today, but it will be within about 10 days or so, so I think it's very reasonable to include in the discussion.

No-one plays AOS so there is no money to be made in selling rules. I would bet the most unpopular (plastic) army in 40k outsells the entirety of AOS.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Kriswall wrote:

 Desubot wrote:

 Kriswall wrote:
Just curious as to everyone's thoughts. Over the weekend, I was working on a very small Space Wolves Patrol Detachment list. I realized that I needed the following rule books to build a simple list and play a Matched Play game. I'm including the Chapter Approved book since it'll be out shortly.

Patrol Detachment including a Wolf Lord with Jump Pack and dual Wolf Claws, a Grey Hunter Squad in a Razorback and some Fenrisian Wolves.

1. Warhammer 40,000 (Core Rules) - 60 USD (For the Matched Play rules)
2. Index Imperium 1 - 25 USD (for most of the Space Wolf units)
3. Codex Adeptus Astartes Space Marines - 50 USD (for the current Wolf Lord datasheet - uses SM Captain)
4. Chapter Approved 2017 - Guessing 25 USD (for updated points)

That's 160 USD in rules to run a very simple Space Wolves Patrol. Am I wrong here? I thought 8th Edition was supposed to be simplified. It seems like it's just like 7th in terms of the number of rule books required for a Matched Play game using the most current rules.

Thoughts? Is this sort of nonsense going to continue?

Right up until space wolves get there own codex.

sucks to have bad luck i guess.

So... at that point I'd need...

1. Warhammer 40,000 8th BRB for Matched Play Rules and Army Building Options
2. Index Imperium 1 - For legacy wargear options
3. Codex Space Wolves
4. Chapter Approved 2017

List looks pretty much the same to me. I do acknowledge that I could simply throw away any models with wargear options not in the Codex and eliminate the need for the Index, but that seems crazy.

Sure looks like GW has parleyed it's "free rules" game into a game that requires $150+ of rules to run a basic army in a Matched Play setting.

Again, why do you need Chapter Approved 2017?

Codex: Space Wolves isn't out yet.

I would need Chapter Approved 2017 between when it is released and when Codex Space Wolves comes out. I may not need it after Codex Space Wolves comes out. I won't know until then. I just know that between now and then, I WILL need it as I'm expecting things like the Razorback my Grey Hunters cruise around in to be getting new points.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 BaconCatBug wrote:
No-one plays AOS so there is no money to be made in selling rules. I would bet the most unpopular (plastic) army in 40k outsells the entirety of AOS.

You think that the Sisters of Silence outsell all of Age of Sigmar? Maybe in your local gaming world. I just don't think your statement is even remotely accurate.

But... you did hit the nail on the head. There is money to be made in selling rules. GW is trying to nickle and dime us to death, except that the nickles are $25 and the dimes are $50. GW is both a publishing company that sells models to support it's book line AND a modelling company that sells books to support it's model line. They don't operate like a gaming company. Most gaming companies either include the required rules with the models/expansions/etc OR provide the rules for free online. GW does neither. They want to sell you the game piece and also sell you the rules for that game piece. Do any of GW's direct competitors do this?

 Kriswall wrote:

Games Workshop's other game, Age of Sigmar has...

1. Legacy Support for all old models. (free warscrolls)
2. No requirement for multiple books. (battletomes are largely optional and not yet released for most factions)
3. Free core rules. (that actually include everything you need to play a game, unlike the 40k free rules that don't explain even basic army selection or deployment)
4. Free unit warscrolls (datasheets).

Battletomes also weren't ever intended to be a requirement. There is some stuff that you can't ever get via the free rules though such as the different Orders of Stormcast Eternals which they do sell as microtransactions. Imagine the whining if you had free rules for everything but people had to pay $2.50 for Ultramarines' Chapter Tactics if they didn't want to buy the codex.

Realistically, you need to buy the General's Handbook ($25) for the points and Matched Play rules. You can also buy a Battletome (Codex) if you want, but it's very, very optional for most armies. Given that AoS has legacy support, free core rules and free unit rules... I don't think it's unreasonable to expect the same from 40k and be a little irritated that a small army requires multiple, expensive rules sources.

The Battletomes are far from optional at this point. Warscroll Battalions are here to stay.

Also, General's Handbook is $35 for the 2017 edition. It's bigger than the previous one.

Both Matched Play...

AoS:
To run a Stormcast Eternal army with at least one Legacy unit AND a Seraphon army with at least one Legacy unit AND not caring about extra army rules requires $25 worth of purchases.
* General's Handbook 2017 ($25)
* Everything else is free

And what happens if you want to run any of the Warscroll Battalions that aren't the Legacy one?

40K:
To run a Space Marines army with at least one Legacy unit AND a Tyranids army with at least one Legacy unit AND not caring about extra army rules requires $225 worth of purchases.
* Warhammer 40,000 BRB ($60)
* Index Imperium 1 ($25)
* Codex Space Marines ($50)
* Index Xenos 2 ($25)
* Codex Tyranids ($40)
* Chapter Approved 2017 ($25 - probably)

Just saying... it's not an unreasonable expectation since GW is actually doing it right now for their other game.

Sure they're doing it for AoS...because they've killed off not just units but whole armies in some cases. Also worth mentioning that General's Handbook doesn't update everything and the Warscrolls that no longer exist aren't in it.

For example, my Glade Riders have no points attached to them.