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I’d guess a mortal wound on a 4+ with the lance for hammer of wrath

Spartacus wrote:

 WrentheFaceless wrote:
I hope there is some super salty Eldar out there that Imperium gets Ob Sec jet bikes and they dont

Yeah... me

This is all so sweet, Im super glad I magnetised all of my Custodes weapons.

On a side note - theres a dude on Bolter & Chainsword talking about taking Celestine to give all his Custodes a further +1 invuln, so spears with 3++. Her rule only works on SoB right? I can't find anything to say otherwise but no one is correcting him, and he has talked about it twice. I also recall seeing someone else describe a similar idea using her.

yeah he's wrong - St C Won;t help them in any way since they are not Guard, Sisters or Ministorium

Spartacus wrote:

 WrentheFaceless wrote:
I hope there is some super salty Eldar out there that Imperium gets Ob Sec jet bikes and they dont

Yeah... me

This is all so sweet, Im super glad I magnetised all of my Custodes weapons.

On a side note - theres a dude on Bolter & Chainsword talking about taking Celestine to give all his Custodes a further +1 invuln, so spears with 3++. Her rule only works on SoB right? I can't find anything to say otherwise but no one is correcting him, and he has talked about it twice. I also recall seeing someone else describe a similar idea using her.

Not only does the +1 only work on SoB, but the 6++ only works on astra militarum and adetus ministorum units. Your guy needs his eyes checked.


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Guyver 3 wrote:
I’d guess a mortal wound on a 4+ with the lance for hammer of wrath

Please let them be good please let them be good please let them be good...

They're amazing and I want them, but I can only justify includong them in my budget if they're good enough to take to adepticon.

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Galas wrote:

 BrookM wrote:
From a fluff POV the Sisters of Silence are quite understrength and have been cut off / hidden away from the Imperium for millennia, fighting their own war against heresy and psykers from the shadows until someone flipped the Sister-signal and had them all regroup on Terra.

Actually reading their "codex" from 7th edition they are much numerous than the Custodes. They have been reformed and since the Heresy have been... increasing their numbers. The number they give in that book is "tenths of thousands". But I agree that by their own nature, they are too "Niche" of an army to work as a standalone. They should be mixed with the Custodes.

Whilst I think its important that we have something other than an Imperial or Chaos Dex next - there is no reason not to make Sisters of Silence a full army in the same way as Custodes or also started with a single unit.

If there are tens of thousands of them - well thats way more than any snowflake Marine Chapter.

Personally I would prefer Sisters of Battle fist but I would not be suprised by a SOS army / Codex now.

The reason I believe Sisters of Silence can't work is because they have the Grey Knight problem to the extreme. They can't be balanced both agaisn't a heavy Psyker army and a non-psyker army. Agaisnt things like Tau or Necrons they will be overpaying for a innate-antipsychic defense that they aren't gonna use.
Is not a "fluff" reason for them to not be their stand alone faction, but a gameplay reason.

 Galas wrote:

 BrookM wrote:
From a fluff POV the Sisters of Silence are quite understrength and have been cut off / hidden away from the Imperium for millennia, fighting their own war against heresy and psykers from the shadows until someone flipped the Sister-signal and had them all regroup on Terra.

Actually reading their "codex" from 7th edition they are much numerous than the Custodes. They have been reformed and since the Heresy have been... increasing their numbers. The number they give in that book is "tenths of thousands". But I agree that by their own nature, they are too "Niche" of an army to work as a standalone. They should be mixed with the Custodes.

And the book Watchers of the Throne, mentions that most of that number was scattered through out the galaxy for the most part forgotten by the Imperium at large. Valoris had been breaking the rules for a while though and sending Custodians out to gather the Sisters so he could properly reform the Talons.

Until it's revealed that SoS are the new SoB.

Their Codex will be fluffed up to include the fact that the SoB were the non-psychics that didn't make the cut and got sent to the rank and file.

I'd love to listen to that nerd rage.

There really doesn't need to be SoS codex, they can be included Imperial Agents book. They should get a HQ though.

 Crimson wrote:
There really doesn't need to be SoS codex, they can be included Imperial Agents book. They should get a HQ though.

Same could and was said about Custodes. They did not "need" a Codex

They got a Codex.

I think I need to buy that Watchers Book - was holding out till paperback but it sounds really interesting

 Iphie wrote:

Audustum wrote:
Uhhh, so that deep strike strat is already broken I think? It's 1CP/3CP but deployment is normally considered "before the battle" so you could just use it unlimited times at 1CP, right?

No, the stratagem says it can only be used once per battle and you can argue that the arrival is when you 'use' the stratagem so only two could arrive by the stratagem no matter how many you put in reserve.

SilverAlien wrote:

Audustum wrote:
Uhhh, so that deep strike strat is already broken I think? It's 1CP/3CP but deployment is normally considered "before the battle" so you could just use it unlimited times at 1CP, right?

The stratagem specifically mentions once per game (so two units max).

Mandragola wrote:

Audustum wrote:
Uhhh, so that deep strike strat is already broken I think? It's 1CP/3CP but deployment is normally considered "before the battle" so you could just use it unlimited times at 1CP, right?

No because it states you can only do it once.

It's quite good but not game-breaking. 9" charges are very difficult, after all. It will let you get off a good round of shooting with spears though.

 carabine wrote:

Audustum wrote:
Uhhh, so that deep strike strat is already broken I think? It's 1CP/3CP but deployment is normally considered "before the battle" so you could just use it unlimited times at 1CP, right?

it says it must be used before battle and can only be used once.

Okay guys, I get it I get it. Haha!

 TalonZahn wrote:
Until it's revealed that SoS are the new SoB.

Their Codex will be fluffed up to include the fact that the SoB were the non-psychics that didn't make the cut and got sent to the rank and file.

I'd love to listen to that nerd rage.

Err the sisters of silence are the non psykers!

Guyver 3 wrote:

 TalonZahn wrote:
Until it's revealed that SoS are the new SoB.

Their Codex will be fluffed up to include the fact that the SoB were the non-psychics that didn't make the cut and got sent to the rank and file.

I'd love to listen to that nerd rage.

Err the sisters of silence are the non psykers!

Yea yea, reverse it, flip it, etc...

You know what I meant.

I just saw some leaks from someone (on facebook but they have been right about the other things) saying the custodes aquila guy gives a fearless bubble to imperium and some other effect, one of which was rumored to be the -1 to hit So if true, GW essentially has broken the game again since that means fearless conscripts are back and you'll see Custodes (at least the banner guy) in every single imperial list.

It depends if the bubble is for models or units, and how much cost that Vexilla guy. Is not like anyone was using 4ppm conscripts, and morale isn't that important agaisn't 10-man infantry squads.

However, -1 to be hit T5 3++ squads will be neighbors impregnable for many opponents. It's gonna be fun.

 Cephalobeard wrote:
However, -1 to be hit T5 3++ squads will be neighbors impregnable for many opponents. It's gonna be fun.

Yep, I imagine taking a footslogger screen of 12-15 Custodes with mostly Storm Shields. And behind that a horde of powerful Custodes characters, many of whom will be on jetbikes, ready to pounce when close enough.

While the terminators and jetbike units themselves will be sweet, I can imagine being expensive targets for lascannons straight away. 4++ is tough, but not that tough. By keeping them all characters you get the best of both worlds.

Any other tzeentch players peeved that GW took the Changlings bubble of -1 to hit away as it was “broken” but gave it to a new army a week later?

You mean like a 4++ KFF?

I am super surprised the leaders only have a 5++. Why would they be worse than marines?

 cuda1179 wrote:
I am super surprised the leaders only have a 5++. Why would they be worse than marines?

It's a 4++ with the faction bonus. Effectively the same. Lore-wise they just don't wear Iron Halos.


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Guyver 3 wrote:
Any other tzeentch players peeved that GW took the Changlings bubble of -1 to hit away as it was “broken” but gave it to a new army a week later?

To be fair, the Changling could cover a LOT more units/models just due to the fact that Daemons are cheaper.

 cuda1179 wrote:
I am super surprised the leaders only have a 5++. Why would they be worse than marines?

Why do veteran tau have bad BS? Markerlights.

The boost to invulnerables means uncharacteristically bad invuls for people who would have been that good already.

Wayniac wrote:
I just saw some leaks from someone (on facebook but they have been right about the other things) saying the custodes aquila guy gives a fearless bubble to imperium and some other effect, one of which was rumored to be the -1 to hit So if true, GW essentially has broken the game again since that means fearless conscripts are back and you'll see Custodes (at least the banner guy) in every single imperial list.

in the index it basicly is a ATSKNF bubble, granting re-rolls on failed morale saves. I'd guesst that

Audustum wrote:

 cuda1179 wrote:
I am super surprised the leaders only have a 5++. Why would they be worse than marines?

It's a 4++ with the faction bonus. Effectively the same. Lore-wise they just don't wear Iron Halos.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Guyver 3 wrote:
Any other tzeentch players peeved that GW took the Changlings bubble of -1 to hit away as it was “broken” but gave it to a new army a week later?

To be fair, the Changling could cover a LOT more units/models just due to the fact that Daemons are cheaper.

I don’t dispute that the changling rule wasn’t great and really strong, just annoyed that it got completely nerfed but another army essentially gets the same rule within days!

Audustum wrote:

 cuda1179 wrote:
I am super surprised the leaders only have a 5++. Why would they be worse than marines?

It's a 4++ with the faction bonus. Effectively the same. Lore-wise they just don't wear Iron Halos.

Actually, Shield-Captains in lore make heavy use of Iron Halos, as do the higher ranking Tribunate. Every Custodian has a refractor field or better.
(In fact, you can spend 10pts in 30k to increase their invuln from 4++ to 3++)

I think they may have kept the Shield-Captain as having just a refractor field for balance sake. And with the +1 invuln it balances out

Wayniac wrote:
I just saw some leaks from someone (on facebook but they have been right about the other things) saying the custodes aquila guy gives a fearless bubble to imperium and some other effect, one of which was rumored to be the -1 to hit So if true, GW essentially has broken the game again since that means fearless conscripts are back and you'll see Custodes (at least the banner guy) in every single imperial list.

If there's any truth to this, I expect the buff to give fearless to all <Imperium> and -1 to hit for only <Custodes> units. If Imperials would get both, it'd be a major meta shift, and the astra infantry horde would step up again as the undisputed top dog.

If the terminators are only a 5++ save, what exactly is the point of taking terminators over normal guys? All they get is one more wound and one more attack and deepstrike.

Would be weird for them to only have a 5++ if they're in fancier cataphract armor.

Though T5 4W 3++ terminators would be pretty scary

 cuda1179 wrote:
If the terminators are only a 5++ save, what exactly is the point of taking terminators over normal guys? All they get is one more wound and one more attack and deepstrike.

No clue. But the leaks guy we've been talking to has been right about everything else so far.

+1W is still pretty major.
Free deepstrike.
Option to take the Castellan Axes (S+3 AP-2 D3D)
Also, the extra arm mounted grenade launcher can help them vs hordes. As he's been saying it can be used in melee like a pistol
Like WrentheFaceless said, a 3++ would be scary.
I think TOO scary

 cuda1179 wrote:
If the terminators are only a 5++ save, what exactly is the point of taking terminators over normal guys? All they get is one more wound and one more attack and deepstrike.

Sir, you have answered your own question

 cuda1179 wrote:
If the terminators are only a 5++ save, what exactly is the point of taking terminators over normal guys? All they get is one more wound and one more attack and deepstrike.

For sure they will have deepstrike! Maybe they will also have special abilities or better equipment! They already come with the axes so there’s that

Guyver 3 wrote:

 cuda1179 wrote:
If the terminators are only a 5++ save, what exactly is the point of taking terminators over normal guys? All they get is one more wound and one more attack and deepstrike.

For sure they will have deepstrike! Maybe they will also have special abilities or better equipment! They already come with the axes so there’s that

You can also take them in squads of 1 for cheap Vanguard detachments I'd imagine.


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Guyver 3 wrote:

Audustum wrote:

 cuda1179 wrote:
I am super surprised the leaders only have a 5++. Why would they be worse than marines?

It's a 4++ with the faction bonus. Effectively the same. Lore-wise they just don't wear Iron Halos.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Guyver 3 wrote:
Any other tzeentch players peeved that GW took the Changlings bubble of -1 to hit away as it was “broken” but gave it to a new army a week later?

To be fair, the Changling could cover a LOT more units/models just due to the fact that Daemons are cheaper.

I don’t dispute that the changling rule wasn’t great and really strong, just annoyed that it got completely nerfed but another army essentially gets the same rule within days!

Well yeah, I appreciate that kind of sting, I do.


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 Darkwrath121 wrote:

Audustum wrote:

 cuda1179 wrote:
I am super surprised the leaders only have a 5++. Why would they be worse than marines?

It's a 4++ with the faction bonus. Effectively the same. Lore-wise they just don't wear Iron Halos.

Actually, Shield-Captains in lore make heavy use of Iron Halos, as do the higher ranking Tribunate. Every Custodian has a refractor field or better.
(In fact, you can spend 10pts in 30k to increase their invuln from 4++ to 3++)

I think they may have kept the Shield-Captain as having just a refractor field for balance sake. And with the +1 invuln it balances out

I guess I meant more for the lore of the models we're fielding here. For whatever reason, these guys left theirs at home.