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I've had a half-dozen real games with Dark Angels in 9th Edition. I have used the Codex and Ritual of the Damned along with their FAQs. My impression is that 9th favours armies that can physically dominate the middle of the board early and then challenge the opponent's deployment zone. The terrain rules mean that while a gunline still has value, it is not the path to victory.

I have found that Deathwing Terminators and Aggressors have done well. An Azrael and Lieutenant bubble of either of these units moving up to the middle objectives has done well. Two squads of Deathwing or two squads of Aggressors have been effective. A Chaplain walking along allowing Aggressors to shoot as if they remained stationary cranks up the firepower, especially in Turn 2 when Tactical Doctrine kicks in. A Deathwing Ancient with the 5+++ aura can keep Deathwing Terminator squads on their feet. A Ravenwing Apothecary can allow a squad of Deathwing Knights to either kill that one enemy unit unit that you hate or mess up the enemy's deployment zone.

Regarding the new Indomitus units, the Outriders have been money even without the Ravenwing keyword (yet.) Finally we have a bike unit that isn't afraid to mix it up in melee while also dishing out the dakka. Once they receive the Ravenwing keyword they will be even better with Speed of the Raven. Black Knights will still have a place, but Outriders should become a staple.

The Bladeguard have done well, but I'm not yet seeing how they will really benefit from the Deathwing keyword (when they presumably receive it) unless some changes are made to the existing stratagems. It would be great if the Bladeguard Ancient is allowed to take the 5+++ Relic allowing the Bladeguard to be more resilient.

The Eradicators do not really benefit from anything inherently Dark Angels with the exception of walking along with Azrael. Chaplain inspired Aggressors for crowd control while the Eradicators deal with big targets all under an Azrael aura is a decent combo.

Looking towards the new Codex and Supplement, the changes to Grim Resolve offer pluses and minuses. Standing still is not a great idea, but heavy weapons with a +1 to hit and a reroll from a Master or Azrael is not a bad thing. We'll see how the Dark Angels' Chaplain Litany works out in the new edition. He could become an auto-include. The expected changes to plasma overheating mean that leaving Plasma squads on their own without a reroll will be more dangerous than today (no native reroll 1). It will also mean that we can't shenanigan our way out of overcharging. It will also mean that our opponent can't shenanigan our Plasma guys into overheating on 2s. All in all I think its a positive thing.

What are the top three to five best Dark Angels units? Thank you.

BillyN831 wrote:
What are the top three to five best Dark Angels units? Thank you.

That's a tough question and somewhat subjective. Your Mileage May Vary is going to be especially applicable as some units will be meta dependent. That being said, here's a few units that I think will be very solid in 9th (take with a grain of salt as I have yet to play a game of 9th thanks to our old pal COVID...):

Ravenwing Talonmaster: Probably better than ever before now that it has come down in points (especially good since almost everything else went up in the edition change). Solid firepower and it's a character to boot. And it gives a Lieutenant buff and allows Ravenwing (including itself) to ignore the benefits of cover. Very spicy!

Sammael in Sableclaw: Similar reasons to the Talonmaster above; probably our best Captain analogue.

Leviathan Dreadnought: Between the DA super doctrine and the smaller table sizes of 9th edition, I think this is the Leviathan's time to shine. Even if he gets bad touched, we can use the Intractable stratagem to keep his guns firing (unless we want to shoot whatever was dumb enough to touch him of course!).

Eradicators: 6 Melta shots for 120 points, on T5 3W platforms. Yes please!

Aggressors: These guys were brutal before, and I think they are still very good, benefitting greatly from our doctrines (extra range in Devastator is handy on the first turn, and then we of course get the -1AP from Tactical). I think Azrael babysitting a unit or three of these could be a decent core of a list, although you also will want a Chaplain of some kind so that one unit can move and still double tap.

Inceptors: Plasma Inceptors are another of the few units that actually got cheaper with the edition change, and if the changes to Plasma weapons filter through to all plasma they'll be safer when firing at -1 to hit enemies. A full unit of these with a couple of buff characters and Weapons from the Dark Age can delete a Knight in one round of shooting.

I am wondering if they are going to make Successor Chapters a more diverse group in the next codex? I want to do my custom chapter as Dark Angels and am hoping that we get something worthwhile.

I just played my first 9th edition game the other night, and I used Dark Angels. Kind of a throw-together list. My opponent was playing Necrons.
My list:
His list:

Won't go over the whole game or anything, but I got my butt handed to me pretty spectacularly because I basically didn't play the mission and just tried to kill things instead. Not smart in 9th. My Outriders and Dark Talon both died turn 1 (I went second), but I feel like I responded well with the Leviathan wiping out the Praetorians and my speeder characters taking out all of the Heavy Destroyers on my turn 1. It went downhill for me from there since I was out of position to score much. I think the Sammael + 2 Talonmasters core will be in nearly every DA list I play since that combo is SO nasty. Protecting them is not even terribly difficult since, being vehicles, as long as there are two of them (and they are not the nearest models) they cover each other due to a quirk of the Look Out, Sir rules. The Leviathan put in serious work too, although he's perhaps not an auto-include and I don't think I'd run 2 of them. Jury's still out on the Outriders and Dark Talon as they died before they could do anything. Necron Destroyers are nasty, y'all...

On another note, is it time perhaps for a new DA tactics thread, dedicated to 9th edition tactics for our boys in green (and black, and bone)?

The FAQ that came out today has cleared up Look Out Sir so that only Vehicles with 10 or more wounds provide protection. So Sammael and the Talonmasters cannot use Look Out Sir for each other. I think this makes sense. It also means that normal Landspeeders cannot protect Sammel.

Regarding a new thread, I know they are looking at "banning" the mega threads. Its too bad, since I think this one was fairly good. Maybe we see what comes from the Codex Space Marines for us and start one then?

ps - They just adjusted the Look Out Sir again. Character vehicles do not protect each other, but non-character vehicles can. So Landspeeders can provide character protection again. At least until tomorrow's FAQ...

Agreed, not worth a new thread until October.

3 wound Terminators are going to be awesome.

 Reivax26 wrote:
3 wound Terminators are going to be awesome.

Couldn't agree more. I've been using them at two wounds in Salamanders the last few weeks, and they're currently better than they've been since 4th edition. An extra wound is the cherry on top!

So, it seems that all of our old MiniMarine units are going to 2 wounds now, except probably Scouts. How does that affect us? I might actually consider using Tacticals instead of Intercessors for some things, like if I need a heavy weapons platform with a bunch of ablative wounds.

 ZergSmasher wrote:
So, it seems that all of our old MiniMarine units are going to 2 wounds now, except probably Scouts. How does that affect us? I might actually consider using Tacticals instead of Intercessors for some things, like if I need a heavy weapons platform with a bunch of ablative wounds.

It's good news options-wise! It obviously depends on what the point gap is up to the newbie stretch-marines, but some of the old minis might actually be viable again. It's been a while...

2 Drop Pods land in front of their lines turn 1. Turn 2 10 Deathwing Knights, Ancient, Apothecary and Master land on center objective.

Laughter ensues..

 Reivax26 wrote:
2 Drop Pods land in front of their lines turn 1. Turn 2 10 Deathwing Knights, Ancient, Apothecary and Master land on center objective.

Laughter ensues..

I don't think I'd use Knights for that, but rather regular Termies. They can shoot at least even if their saves aren't quite as good. Replace that Master with Belial and profit!

Also, what might be good in Pods these days? Tacticals? Tooled-up Company Veterans?

Tactical squads with Triple Plasma. Our current Trait makes a drop pod assault really good. So you take Plasmagun, Plasma Cannon and Combi Plasma in the squad.

Drop in. Well all 3 Plasma weapons have a +6 inch range 1st turn. So the Combi Plasma and Plasmagun are going to be in Rapid Fire range even if they get out behind the door of a drop pod.

They land side by side with the doors touching each other. Now you have a wall in front of your opponent blocking him from getting to an objective early on in the game.

Took part in a 1500 point local tournament yesterday - our first for 9th Ed and our first under social distancing protocols. It was a three round format, with no Lords of War and you had to have a named character as your Warlord. I went with something I had been using in the twilight of 8th Edition: Sammael in Sableclaw, a Talonmaster, five Black Knights, a Ravenwing Squad (four bikes with two Plasma) with an Attack Bike, Outriders, three Tactical Squads and a squad of Deathwing Knights. Oh, and a squad of Eradicators. The Outriders do not have the Ravenwing keyword yet, but I included them to see how they would perform at baseline level.

Round 1 - Sweep and Clear vs Slaneesh Demons. He had three Keepers of Secrets and Shalakshi along with several blobs of Nurglings and a big unit of Poxwalkers. I went with Bring it Down, Abhor the Witch and the tourney special secondary which was basically a variant of Thin the Ranks but that had to be performed by your Warlord. By the end of the first turn I was quite worried - I had crippled one Keeper but the rest were unscatched and he was all over the middle objectives. The -1 to ranged damage Exalted trait was a major hit to my speeder fire. I essentially sacrificed the Black Knights and Outriders to draw him in. The Deathwing Knights then came in, guided by the Ravenwing bikers and took down a Keeper and Shalaksi in the following turns while the Sammy, Talonmaster combo and the Eradicators killed the third. The Character speeders then mopped up. A nail-biting game, with him slightly ahead on Primary (45 to 40) but I pretty much maxed out my Secondaries and won.

Round 2 - Scorched Earth vs Slaneesh Demons. He had Shalaxi, three Keepers and something I called Big Bird. He also had four units of Daemonettes. My first round of shooting was dismal, and at the end of Turn 1 my army was in tatters. The Deathwing Knights, Eradicators and Sammy/Talonmaster took down three of the big monsters and crippled two others, but I went down hard by Turn 5. My opponent won a convincing victory, but my Secondaries (same as the first) gave me a decent number of victory points. I also interrupted his Ritual, which was thematically satisfying. Take that foul demon.

Round 3 - Surround and Destroy vs Tzeench Demons. Really? Demons again? What did we do to deserve this? He had two of the Big Bird thingies, a Herald, a massive unit of Pink Horrors, those Flamer dudes and a bunch of Nurglings. I took Abhor the Witch (saw that coming), Assassinate and the Warlord Thin the Ranks variant. My target selection in the first turn was horrible and I also dispersed my Ravenwing units. 1000 points of firepower killed precisely three bases of Nurglings that came back. My opponent, though, put his Herald on his own during his Turn 1 to support his upcoming Turn 2 Pink Horror Strike. I was able to snipe him in my Turn 2, earning my a bunch of VPs. The Deathwing Knights went into his army like a wrecking ball, dying in the process but putting him on the back foot and crippling a Keeper that Sammy finished off. Sammy and the Talonmaster also mowed down little Demons who had come from in from Reserves. The low point for me was when his second Big Bird took control of the Talonmaster. The possessed Talonmaster wasn't able to kill Sammy, but Sammy had to kill him in the Fight Phase. Should have brought a Deathwing character with the Watched trait!

What did I learn? Lookout Sir is something you have to pay attention to. 8th Edition muscle memory will get your characters killed. My list was (unintentionally) very good at denying Secondaries to my opponent. Never give up, as you can scape VPs as you go. The Outriders should be great once they get the Ravenwing keyword. Deathwing Knights are wonderful, but of course you need plenty of CPs to power them. Sammy and a Talonmaster are still great fun, but you need much better protection than in 8th Edition.

I came third, after the two Slaneesh Demon lists I faced. Next time...Next time.

I have a feeling that 3 KoS with Shalaxi is going to be popular as it moves fast and has hard-hitting monsters. Kind of like the old triple Discolords for CSM was. Nice writeup; I definitely think Sammy with 1-2 Talonmasters is the way to go as far as HQs, which is kind of a mixed blessing. It's great because it's powerful, but it sucks because most of our HQ selection is completely invalidated by those guys in a competitive setting. I'd love to have a reason to take the Indomitus captain or something but models like that just don't do anything DA need.

In light of 2W buffs, what do we reckon to a plasmastator squad in a firstborn army?

 lindsay40k wrote:
In light of 2W buffs, what do we reckon to a plasmastator squad in a firstborn army?

I assume you mean a Devastator Squad with four Plasma Cannons? They are great now, and I figure they will still be when we go to 2W. They will be a little more durable, while their weapon can delete W2 opponents.

Played an 1,850 game against Harlequins today. I wanted to take my 30K themed Deathwing for one last march before we see what a Relic Terminator squad looks like. I went with a Cataphractii Master (Huntsman), a Master, an Interrogator-Chaplain (Watched), Deathwing Ancient with Standard of Repentance (5+++ aura for Deathwing) a ten-man Deathwing Tartaros Squad, a five-man Cataphractii Squad, three Tactical Squads, a Devastator Squad with Heavy Bolters, a Devastator Squad with Grav Cannons, a Ven Dread and a stock Contemptor Dread. He had a bunch of characters, three squads in Vypers(?), two bike squads, two shooty Vyper thingies and a Flyer. We played Battle Lines. I took the Mission secondary, Assassinate and Abhor the Witch.

My Tac Squads, Dreads and Grav Squad pushed on the left, while my bikes would chill for a turn before delivering Deathwing on the right. I got first turn, but his debuff to range and Obscuring Terrain meant that only my Ven Dread could shoot anything - it put two wounds on his Flyer. His counterpunch looked terrifying, but The Armour of Contempt kept my Contemptor operational against all that Haywire. Watched also stopped his second bike squad from getting into range by denying a power. His bike squad assaulted one of my Tac squads and wounded Contemptor, but my Master intervened and wiped them with a Relic Blade (and the Contemptor squished one).

Turn 2 my left was looking like it was in trouble. My Cat Master, Ancient and Tartarus came down in the middle to be able to help out my left flank. The Catapractii went onto the right in close range of one of his shooty skimmers. Shooting and assault took down a couple of Skimmers, a squad of Harlies, an isolated Death Jester and his Flyer. His Turn 2 saw one of his Troops and Troope Master bring the Tartaros squad down to one model. The 5+++ was kept the squad around a little longer. The Contemptor fell to Haywire.

Turn 3 my Cataptractii cleared the enemy objective of the sole Character holding it with bolter fire as they trudged. The Grav Devastators, Tactical Squad remnants and Ravenwing took down several characters and another skimmer. The Master and Chaplain took down the second bike squad in the fight phase. His riposte took down a Tactical Squad and the Grav Devasators, but he was now down to one squad and a character. He conceeded - I was now maxing Primary and two of my secondaries.

His list had won the previous eight games. The Harlies are Marine-killers, but my 5+++ was a bit of a counter and I had lots of shots. My list would have suffered against heavy armour - I was going for a fluffy last dance with my models and got lucky with the matchup. Still, Deathwing Terminators have done well for me in the this edition. Its early, but going to 3W should only make them more resilient.

My Deathwing/Ravenwing is going to make its debut in the near future. Can't wait.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
My Deathwing/Ravenwing is going to make its debut in the near future. Can't wait.

Are eliminators still decent for da? I heard they got a nerf, but I wanted to see if you guys think I should pick up a box.

 Tagony wrote:
Are eliminators still decent for da? I heard they got a nerf, but I wanted to see if you guys think I should pick up a box.

Not a nerf per se unless I missed something, but they did get a price bump with the new edition, which hurts a little. I still think they are okay, although they're now competing for our precious HS slots with the quite frankly amazing Eradicators.

New Online Preview is up. In Dark Angels news: Marine Codex is coming in October (we knew that), DA Supplement is coming early 2021 (but we're getting some kind of "hold me over" rules before that), Bladeguard are confirmed to be getting the Deathwing keyword, new Primaris Storm Speeder will have the Ravenwing keyword for DA (so it follows that all appropriate Primaris units will be getting it), a whole bunch of new units that might or might not be really good for DA.

I'm actually really liking the Heavy Intercessors, if they are costed appropriately. With our special Doctrine (assuming it doesn't change), those guns should be pretty nasty.

Took a Hellblaster + Indomitus army for a stroll today against Iron Hands. It was like putting on an old, comfortable coat. The Hellblasters did what they do best, slagging Dreadnoughts, Landspeeders and Terminators. Bladeguard match up well right now against Terminators in melee, but 3W will reel that back a bit.

It might seem counter-intuitive, but Obscuring Terrain is a friend to Hellblasters.

TangoTwoBravo wrote:


The Bladeguard have done well, but I'm not yet seeing how they will really benefit from the Deathwing keyword (when they presumably receive it) unless some changes are made to the existing stratagems. It would be great if the Bladeguard Ancient is allowed to take the 5+++ Relic allowing the Bladeguard to be more resilient.

Deathwing Ancient benefits them and with the pennant of remembrance allows them to get 5+++, in addition to +1 attack from normal banner

I gotta say, I'm not convinced that Bladeguard are really any good. Only three in the unit is no bueno when it comes to efficiency (why would I waste strats like Fury of the First or Transhuman Physiology on a tiny unit?). And with 3 wounds, your opponent isn't really wasting shots if he fires his bigger guns at them.

Unless I'm missing something and they have a niche that I've overlooked?

Even worse, despite their debut set contents, they’re useless at accompanying characters, they take 3W and your smashguy can be lascannoned

Hello everyone!

I am BRAND new to playing DA as I have only really played orks for the last 8 years so bear with me when I ask newbie questions. I saw a deal on a DA army and still had 2 DV boxes in my possession so I figured I might as well pick up another army. I have also now picked up a BNIB Indomitus and was wondering what I should keep, and what I could part out.

Here is what I have so far:


So my question(s); where do I go from here, what units should be my "core" and what usints are better for fluffy games?
What is my collection missing that will make it much better.
Any tips and tricks you can share is also appreciated.

 zammerak wrote:
Hello everyone!

I am BRAND new to playing DA as I have only really played orks for the last 8 years so bear with me when I ask newbie questions. I saw a deal on a DA army and still had 2 DV boxes in my possession so I figured I might as well pick up another army. I have also now picked up a BNIB Indomitus and was wondering what I should keep, and what I could part out.

Here is what I have so far:

Spoiler:

10x Primaris Infiltrators
10x Primaris Intercessors
15x Hellblasters
1x Primaris Chaplain
1x Primaris Lt.
1x Ancient
1x Primaris Azrael (converted)
2x Librarians
1x Landspeeder
1x Sammael
1x DA Interrogator-Chaplain
1x Lt. Zachariah
1x Lt in Phobos
6x Ravenwing bikes
3x Suppressors
1x Captain
A hand full of busted landspeeders I got for my orks to loot but could be repaired with little effort.
Also the 2 Dark Vengeance boxes as well as the full indomitus box.

So my question(s); where do I go from here, what units should be my "core" and what usints are better for fluffy games?
What is my collection missing that will make it much better.
Any tips and tricks you can share is also appreciated.

Wow - no half measures there!

Recently, I’ve been running two Intercessor squads and an Infiltrator Squad as my core Troops, lead by a Master and a Lt. Looking at your collection, a squad of Hellblasters would be good, along with your Indomitus Eradicators. A unit of Bladeguard backed by a Judiciar would give you some melee. Ravenwing bikes plus the Terminators from Dark Vengeance are fluffy and now quite effective.

Who knows what Oct brings?

T2B

Do veterans have a place? I forgot I got 5 of those as well.
From a gameplay perspective, I was thinking more of a hit and run style of play (not sure how well that will work with 9th) If I wanted to play a melee heavy list, I would bring my speed freak orks.
I am assuming that the deathguard termies work well for camping objectives now that they are at 3W. I could be wrong too as i have yet to actually play a game of 9th (thanks Covid)

 zammerak wrote:
Do veterans have a place? I forgot I got 5 of those as well.
From a gameplay perspective, I was thinking more of a hit and run style of play (not sure how well that will work with 9th) If I wanted to play a melee heavy list, I would bring my speed freak orks.
I am assuming that the deathguard termies work well for camping objectives now that they are at 3W. I could be wrong too as i have yet to actually play a game of 9th (thanks Covid)

Veterans might be okay since they can all take good weapons, maybe combi weapons and storm shields. Probably better put them in a drop pod. I was also considering using Deathwing for objective grabbing (dropping them onto a midfield one and at least letting them soak up some of my opponent's nastier weapons so my other units don't have to). Not sure yet what the points situation is going to be on Vets or Termies though; that will probably determine if either unit is actually good.

As for hit and run style, Ravenwing are really solid right now and will be more so once the new changes happen. Those speeders you have should probably be kitbashed into Sammael in Sableclaw and a couple of Talonmasters. Those three characters together are insanely good and put out some horrific firepower (although with the new "core unit" changes that might go bye bye since it looks like characters probably don't give each other rerolls anymore ).

Ok I have started to build a Sammael in Sableclaw, you reckon I need two talon masters? I have 3 busted speeders I can kitbash and rebuild.