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Not only that, they took basically everything from ANH all the way up to TFA and said, "Meh, who cares about resolving this stuff. We don't need any of this old baggage because we own the rights!"
Vaktathi wrote: Ultimately I walked out of there thinking "I don't ever need to see another Star Wars now".
Another saga film, at least. I mean think about it:
Han is gone. Luke is gone. Leia is gone (not anyone's fault, but reality is reality - Carrie Fisher isn't going to be in another SW film). Chewie was reduced to cutaway gags to sell Porg toys. R2 was in one scene. 3P0 was ignored. We got a noble last-ditch sacrifice of a character that means something to the fandom, Admiral Akbar... oh no wait, Holdo got the sacrifice. Akbar got killed off screen.
What meaning is left in any of this?
I like Rey (or did, more on that below), I think Adam Driver is fantastic as Kylo, and I think Oscar Issac is amazing in everything he does... but this isn't the Star Wars saga any more. If these were standalone films, then I'd be cool with it (like Rogue One, which I thought was fantastic). But this is meant to be the continuation of the actual mainline SW story. Last Jedi... ended it.
Manchu wrote: This is my feeling. In the theater, I was stunned. The next couple of days, I felt angry. Now I am just empty about it. I realized it was meant to be disposable. The movie was exactly like a bucket of popcorn - something you mindlessly eat and then never think about again.
That's pretty much my feelings. I'm going to see it again with my parents next week, and I actually kinda don't want to. I want to see the cool battles again (the first battle, the hyperspace ramming speed bit which is simply the most amazing moment in all 9 (to date) SW films), but the idea of having to sit through all the Luke bs again. Uhh...
Manchu wrote: I actually liked TFA. I thought it was bad that TFA did not sufficiently characterize Rey but I figured they would certainly get around to it in TLJ.
I didn't like TFA because it's a near beat-by-beat remake of ANH but one of the things I did like was Rey, and I did not agree with the cries of how she was a 'Mary Sue'.
I always figured that there would be a reason she is so innately strong with the force, and that that would be the mystery that we eventually resolve in the third new film.
But no. She's a nobody. She comes from nothing. She has no significance. She is a Mary Sue.
What a fething waste...
Manchu wrote: bbb, don't forget Luke wasted his whole life doing nothing
And then had the worst death in the whole saga except for Padme losing the will to live in ROTS.
They killed my fav character, and it didn't feel earned. I can't forgive the film for that.
My fav character in the MCU is Captain America. I'm certain that he's dead in either one of the next two Avenger's films. I hope he goes out with a bang, and not by collapsing on a rock and then disappearing.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/22 01:33:03
I dont think this was meant to be a continuation of the old starwars saga. I think 7 8 9 is meant to be a bridge and foundation for a time jump forward. I think the end of 9 will see a new order put in place that isnt about the light or dark but the balance. And 500-1000 years later we will see a story based around the new order in episode 10.
This saga isnt just about the skywalkers anymore. Good.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
Thats what I (and I assume many) were expecting. I just hoped we'd get a satisfying passing of the torch.
BlaxicanX wrote: A young business man named Tom Kirby, who was a pupil of mine until he turned greedy, helped the capitalists hunt down and destroy the wargamers. He betrayed and murdered Games Workshop.
If they wanted to time jump, there was no reason to piss on the triumph of the Rebellion from ROTJ. They could move forward a thousand years and make Knights of the New Republic without upsetting anyone. Luke and company had their happy ever after, but Disney tore it all up for the sake of two half-hearted films.
BobtheInquisitor wrote: If they wanted to time jump, there was no reason to piss on the triumph of the Rebellion from ROTJ. They could move forward a thousand years and make Knights of the New Republic without upsetting anyone. Luke and company had their happy ever after, but Disney tore it all up for the sake of two half-hearted films.
Disagree. I think lukes ending was great. He got to be a legend one last time on his way out. Kids sitting around telling the story of how luke skywalker faced off against the whole first order and faced kylo ren alone. A perfect ending for luke. Much better then him just retiring post jedi and being happy tiill he died. Thats dull as dirt. And as unstarwarsy as you can get. Everyones family/friends life in sw is 24/7 drama.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
Voted liked, but a moderate like. It's a flawed film, but more like than dislike. We knew Disney would be milking that cash cow the moment they bought the IP, and this is probably the best we can expect. The new movies shouldn't exist, but sadly that isn't an option. IMO it's best to just forget that it's a Star Wars movie, the OT is done and exists in a separate universe. The new era is an alternate-universe reboot of the concept, don't put too much weight into how they resolved the story of the OT (which was finished and needed no resolution).
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
BobtheInquisitor wrote: If they wanted to time jump, there was no reason to piss on the triumph of the Rebellion from ROTJ. They could move forward a thousand years and make Knights of the New Republic without upsetting anyone. Luke and company had their happy ever after, but Disney tore it all up for the sake of two half-hearted films.
Disagree. I think lukes ending was great. He got to be a legend one last time on his way out. Kids sitting around telling the story of how luke skywalker faced off against the whole first order and faced kylo ren alone. A perfect ending for luke. Much better then him just retiring post jedi and being happy tiill he died. Thats dull as dirt. And as unstarwarsy as you can get. Everyones family/friends life in sw is 24/7 drama.
So, 90% of Luke's remaining life was spent in cabin feverish isolation dwelling on how he turned all his victories into ash, nearly gave in to fear and murdered his nephew thus creating a monster as evil as Darth Vader, but it's all okay because he showed up in time to save some but not all of his closest friends from the very threat he created?
Dull as dirt? That's why you don't follow their lives past happily ever after. Why does his life need to be all drama now and in what sense is that a Star Wars thing instead of a washed up franchise thing? And you can't think of a way to fit in any exciting stories in the life of a Gandalfish Jedi master legend who set out to rebuild a religion?
This is a failure of modern writing. You don't need to torture your characters to create drama. Buffy season 6 is not a role model.
Luke, the whinest character in sw, spwnt the last half of his life in isolation moping about his failures because all of his teachers who kicked him in the ass when he got like this were dead and not around to kick him in the ass.
Yup. Sounds like luke. And then, when rey and yoda kick him in his ass, he does his luke thing.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
Still, I would have been happier never revisiting the Iconic characters again after ROTJ.
If im right and this whole thing is about seeing the end of the jedi and the sith and the rise of a new balance order then this story is important. If they JUST time jumped to 1000 years later and suddenly there was a new order combining the 2 how pissed would everyone be? "Why the feth would the sith ever work with the jedi? And why would the jedi ever accept dark side users? This is all bs!"
And if they jumped 500 years forward to tell this story without luke and co then you would be going "who the hell trained all these people?"
This is a critical period when the jedi and sith are both down and out. These are the last of them. The time is ripe for something new to come out of their ashes NOW, not 10+ generations later.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
Vaktathi wrote:It was a fun and exciting cinema experience. Very "Marvel". Lots of beautiful special effects, impressive shots, choreographed action, etc. For a couple hours of dramatic entertainment, it was great.
As a cohesive story and structured narrative, as the continuation of a saga and as an intelligible, self consistent plot, it's complete and total garbage, screenwriting diarrhea without exaggeration.
What you're looking for will probably determine your answer between the two.
Ultimately I walked out of there thinking "I don't ever need to see another Star Wars now". I will of course, but probably not in theatres, certainly not opening night, and I dont care enough to avoid spoilers for anything that happens going forward, my emotional investment in the series is now gone.
I agree, but that happened to me with The Force Awa...
Frazzled wrote:
Vaktathi wrote: It was a fun and exciting cinema experience. Very "Marvel". Lots of beautiful special effects, impressive shots, choreographed action, etc. For a couple hours of dramatic entertainment, it was great.
As a cohesive story and structured narrative, as the continuation of a saga and as an intelligible, self consistent plot, it's complete and total garbage, screenwriting diarrhea without exaggeration.
What you're looking for will probably determine your answer between the two.
Ultimately I walked out of there thinking "I don't ever need to see another Star Wars now". I will of course, but probably not in theatres, certainly not opening night, and I dont care enough to avoid spoilers for anything that happens going forward, my emotional investment in the series is now gone.
Vaktathi wrote: my emotional investment in the series is now gone
This is my feeling. In the theater, I was stunned. The next couple of days, I felt angry. Now I am just empty about it. I realized it was meant to be disposable. The movie was exactly like a bucket of popcorn - something you mindlessly eat and then never think about again.
Wow wow back up, I have fond memories of my last bowl of popcorn!
Damn, great minds think alike.
What this poll needs is an option for "Won't watch it in the theater" as TFA has so thoroughly killed my interest in the franchise that I'd barely be motivated to Redbox TLJ
Still, I would have been happier never revisiting the Iconic characters again after ROTJ.
If im right and this whole thing is about seeing the end of the jedi and the sith and the rise of a new balance order then this story is important. If they JUST time jumped to 1000 years later and suddenly there was a new order combining the 2 how pissed would everyone be? "Why the feth would the sith ever work with the jedi? And why would the jedi ever accept dark side users? This is all bs!"
And if they jumped 500 years forward to tell this story without luke and co then you would be going "who the hell trained all these people?"
This is a critical period when the jedi and sith are both down and out. These are the last of them. The time is ripe for something new to come out of their ashes NOW, not 10+ generations later.
They're likely not going Grey Jedi or anything else like a new order. Watching enough interviews and it's pretty evident each director was given ALOT of lee-way to just do whatever, which means there isn't some iron narrative binding them.
Also, Rey isn't making anything new. She literally took the Jedi texts with her when she left Luke. You can see them in the end scenes. Yoda even tells Luke "they do not possess anything she does not already have" (paraphrase) in what appears to be a wink to that fact.
Rey's a Jedi and Kylo's a Sith (or Dark Jedi if you want to get technical). That's where we are.
As for me, I voted conflicted. Some of this movie was really great, but Rose was completely unnecessary AND trivialized Finn in his own story to such an extent that you can literally cut him out of the film and it's fine. Plus it ruined the Finn/Poe bromance by denying it screentime.
Luke's reveal was all wrong; I agree with Mark Hamill that Luke, the most hopeful man in the Galaxy who alone believed (and did) turn Darth Vader to the Light would never think his nephew was unredeemable and had to die. He also wouldn't mope about it for 30 years (though he is a whiner so he'd definitely mope some I think). His death made no sense from a meta perspective either. If you're going to kill him, put him on the planet and give him a Vader hallway scene ala Rogue One. If you aren't THEN do the cool mass Force projection trick.
The Darkside pit had a lot of build up to do jack all too. Wasted pit device (har har I made a pun).
Conversely, I liked Holdo, though she should've lived and Akbar gotten the sacrifice. She can step into a combo Leia/Mothma role for future films that way.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/12/22 13:26:36
Wasting Akbar was one of the greatest sins of this movie. He should have done the ram and preceeded it with some com chatter about surrendering to the First Order.
General Hux: Admiral Akbar, this is the end of your puny Resistance.
Admiral Akbar: Actually, General Hux, (dramatic pause) it's a trap.
bbb wrote: Wasting Akbar was one of the greatest sins of this movie. He should have done the ram and preceeded it with some com chatter about surrendering to the First Order.
General Hux: Admiral Akbar, this is the end of your puny Resistance.
Admiral Akbar: Actually, General Hux, (dramatic pause) it's a trap.
[Akbar then initiates the hyperspace jump]
Ok that would be awesome.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Still, I would have been happier never revisiting the Iconic characters again after ROTJ.
If im right and this whole thing is about seeing the end of the jedi and the sith and the rise of a new balance order then this story is important. If they JUST time jumped to 1000 years later and suddenly there was a new order combining the 2 how pissed would everyone be? "Why the feth would the sith ever work with the jedi? And why would the jedi ever accept dark side users? This is all bs!"
And if they jumped 500 years forward to tell this story without luke and co then you would be going "who the hell trained all these people?"
This is a critical period when the jedi and sith are both down and out. These are the last of them. The time is ripe for something new to come out of their ashes NOW, not 10+ generations later.
You say all that like you think there's a plan. There isn't a plan. This whole last movie is one guy's ego telling some other guy's ego to get bent.
I assure you fans could take those changes in stride far more easily than they are taking Old Yeller's Master Luke or the Nothing Matters Trio.
bbb wrote: Wasting Akbar was one of the greatest sins of this movie. He should have done the ram and preceeded it with some com chatter about surrendering to the First Order.
General Hux: Admiral Akbar, this is the end of your puny Resistance.
Admiral Akbar: Actually, General Hux, (dramatic pause) it's a trap.
[Akbar then initiates the hyperspace jump]
Ok that would be awesome.
Indeed. I would have loved that. Also have Lando be the master code breaker that Finn and Rose were supposed to find and you pretty much check some important boxes
However, I feel like a large portions of the fan community would find some to complain about that too
Lands is a swindler, a smoothie and an administrator. His talent lies in interpersonal skills. Having him be a master computer hacker would be asinine. Either you respect the source material or you create fansploosh.
I think the poll should be changed to -
What stage of grief are you in about TLJ. I skipped denial...I think I am still just angry.
If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder
BobtheInquisitor wrote: If they wanted to time jump, there was no reason to piss on the triumph of the Rebellion from ROTJ. They could move forward a thousand years and make Knights of the New Republic without upsetting anyone. Luke and company had their happy ever after, but Disney tore it all up for the sake of two half-hearted films.
Disagree. I think lukes ending was great. He got to be a legend one last time on his way out. Kids sitting around telling the story of how luke skywalker faced off against the whole first order and faced kylo ren alone. A perfect ending for luke. Much better then him just retiring post jedi and being happy tiill he died. Thats dull as dirt. And as unstarwarsy as you can get. Everyones family/friends life in sw is 24/7 drama.
So, 90% of Luke's remaining life was spent in cabin feverish isolation dwelling on how he turned all his victories into ash, nearly gave in to fear and murdered his nephew thus creating a monster as evil as Darth Vader, but it's all okay because he showed up in time to save some but not all of his closest friends from the very threat he created?
Dull as dirt? That's why you don't follow their lives past happily ever after. Why does his life need to be all drama now and in what sense is that a Star Wars thing instead of a washed up franchise thing? And you can't think of a way to fit in any exciting stories in the life of a Gandalfish Jedi master legend who set out to rebuild a religion?
This is a failure of modern writing. You don't need to torture your characters to create drama. Buffy season 6 is not a role model.
Yeah, damn modern writers for not leaving happy ending alone and tearing down beloved cultural icons! Never has the story of a boy who went from nothing to a great leader with the help of a wise old man and an amazing sword been so destroyed! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Le_Morte_d%27Arthur
Seriously, I do not get the outrage. SW was always a pretty mediocre series that largely just rehashed old fairy tale tropes and was propelled by some really good unknown (at the time) actors and great timing (like many iconic 80s movies). Lucas added a ton on inanity later, and the series has long been just a cash grab with some rabid fans. Now it is a corporate brand that has to push blockbusters, toys, etc. to the masses. If you get an entertaining spectacle with messages that aren't horrible, that's probably about the best you can expect.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/22 16:00:08
Still, I would have been happier never revisiting the Iconic characters again after ROTJ.
If im right and this whole thing is about seeing the end of the jedi and the sith and the rise of a new balance order then this story is important. If they JUST time jumped to 1000 years later and suddenly there was a new order combining the 2 how pissed would everyone be? "Why the feth would the sith ever work with the jedi? And why would the jedi ever accept dark side users? This is all bs!"
And if they jumped 500 years forward to tell this story without luke and co then you would be going "who the hell trained all these people?"
This is a critical period when the jedi and sith are both down and out. These are the last of them. The time is ripe for something new to come out of their ashes NOW, not 10+ generations later.
They're likely not going Grey Jedi or anything else like a new order. Watching enough interviews and it's pretty evident each director was given ALOT of lee-way to just do whatever, which means there isn't some iron narrative binding them.
Also, Rey isn't making anything new. She literally took the Jedi texts with her when she left Luke. You can see them in the end scenes. Yoda even tells Luke "they do not possess anything she does not already have" (paraphrase) in what appears to be a wink to that fact.
Rey's a Jedi and Kylo's a Sith (or Dark Jedi if you want to get technical). That's where we are.
As for me, I voted conflicted. Some of this movie was really great, but Rose was completely unnecessary AND trivialized Finn in his own story to such an extent that you can literally cut him out of the film and it's fine. Plus it ruined the Finn/Poe bromance by denying it screentime.
Luke's reveal was all wrong; I agree with Mark Hamill that Luke, the most hopeful man in the Galaxy who alone believed (and did) turn Darth Vader to the Light would never think his nephew was unredeemable and had to die. He also wouldn't mope about it for 30 years (though he is a whiner so he'd definitely mope some I think). His death made no sense from a meta perspective either. If you're going to kill him, put him on the planet and give him a Vader hallway scene ala Rogue One. If you aren't THEN do the cool mass Force projection trick.
The Darkside pit had a lot of build up to do jack all too. Wasted pit device (har har I made a pun).
Conversely, I liked Holdo, though she should've lived and Akbar gotten the sacrifice. She can step into a combo Leia/Mothma role for future films that way.
Rian Johnson is heading up the next trillogy. Disney has made him the Kevin Fiege of episodes 10-12.So look at episode 8. Time for the Jedi to end. No dark jedi apprentice. The Jedi texts so the knowledge isn't lost but can be used as a foundation for something new. Yoda says its time for it to end. Luke says its time for it to end. Snoak and Kylo say time to end.
Ridley and Driver have both said they are not in the next trilogy and 9 is likely their last SW movie.
As for Rose and Finn, their plot was about giving Finn a reason to believe in the resistance. Finn wasn't actually FOR the resistance yet. He was only about getting away from the First Order. Rose showed him the people who got hurt by the first Order and by the end of it Finn gained a conviction to not just leave the first order but to actually fight against it. Before that casino bit Finn was only doing what he could to help his 2 friends (Rey and Poe) and otherwise to just get away. After that he was willing to die to help the resistance.
He hasn't moped for 30 years. He maybe Mopeds for the last 10-15? How old Is driver in these movies? How old was he when he turned?
The Darkside pit showed the lure of the Darkside on Rey. She literally explains it's pull, it's promise, and how those promises are empty. That it feeds on your desires. I think the pit did a better job of showing how tempting the darkside can be to someone just starting out with the force then 1-3 ever did.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
It was a movie "good enough" to do a bit more clean-up of breaking ties with the old and bring in the new.
- Throw away big-bad Snoke... I think they had no idea what to do with him.
- Leia acting like a Sith-Lord in hiding... it was a WTF moment.
- Kylo acting like some spoiled brat Emo, I had more respect for Joffrey in Game of Thrones.
- Luke acting like the literal weird uncle that smoked too much force weed. I kept looking for his Wookie companion "Scooby".
- I always wanted to see the Emperor's Royal Guard in action, too bad they seemed more fierce than what they were guarding.
- Poe seemed a bit more of a "meat-head" than what we saw in him before.
- Ackbar I agree really needed to be the one to use his ship in a "trap"... that would have been utterly epic.
Looked awesome and DJ was a really neat character that was worth seeing the movie just for him.
A revolution is an idea which has found its bayonets.
Napoleon Bonaparte
Still, I would have been happier never revisiting the Iconic characters again after ROTJ.
If im right and this whole thing is about seeing the end of the jedi and the sith and the rise of a new balance order then this story is important. If they JUST time jumped to 1000 years later and suddenly there was a new order combining the 2 how pissed would everyone be? "Why the feth would the sith ever work with the jedi? And why would the jedi ever accept dark side users? This is all bs!"
And if they jumped 500 years forward to tell this story without luke and co then you would be going "who the hell trained all these people?"
This is a critical period when the jedi and sith are both down and out. These are the last of them. The time is ripe for something new to come out of their ashes NOW, not 10+ generations later.
They're likely not going Grey Jedi or anything else like a new order. Watching enough interviews and it's pretty evident each director was given ALOT of lee-way to just do whatever, which means there isn't some iron narrative binding them.
Also, Rey isn't making anything new. She literally took the Jedi texts with her when she left Luke. You can see them in the end scenes. Yoda even tells Luke "they do not possess anything she does not already have" (paraphrase) in what appears to be a wink to that fact.
Rey's a Jedi and Kylo's a Sith (or Dark Jedi if you want to get technical). That's where we are.
As for me, I voted conflicted. Some of this movie was really great, but Rose was completely unnecessary AND trivialized Finn in his own story to such an extent that you can literally cut him out of the film and it's fine. Plus it ruined the Finn/Poe bromance by denying it screentime.
Luke's reveal was all wrong; I agree with Mark Hamill that Luke, the most hopeful man in the Galaxy who alone believed (and did) turn Darth Vader to the Light would never think his nephew was unredeemable and had to die. He also wouldn't mope about it for 30 years (though he is a whiner so he'd definitely mope some I think). His death made no sense from a meta perspective either. If you're going to kill him, put him on the planet and give him a Vader hallway scene ala Rogue One. If you aren't THEN do the cool mass Force projection trick.
The Darkside pit had a lot of build up to do jack all too. Wasted pit device (har har I made a pun).
Conversely, I liked Holdo, though she should've lived and Akbar gotten the sacrifice. She can step into a combo Leia/Mothma role for future films that way.
Rian Johnson is heading up the next trillogy. Disney has made him the Kevin Fiege of episodes 10-12.So look at episode 8. Time for the Jedi to end. No dark jedi apprentice. The Jedi texts so the knowledge isn't lost but can be used as a foundation for something new. Yoda says its time for it to end. Luke says its time for it to end. Snoak and Kylo say time to end.
You're wrong here. Johnson isn't in charge of any more main series trilogies. He's getting a trilogy of spin-offs.
The filmmaker is already planning his new Star Wars trilogy, which will be set outside the on-going saga.
Rian Johnson is already in the planning stages for his new Star Wars trilogy, which will be far removed from the on-going Star Wars saga and take audiences to even more unexpected places.
He's no Kevin Feige and he has no role to play in the main series anymore. You're going down a rabbit hole made by one director with no more input that the next director has literally zero obligation to follow.
Ridley and Driver have both said they are not in the next trilogy and 9 is likely their last SW movie.
Okay? Doesn't so anything for me one way or the other. Daisy's doing the best she can with a terribly written character. Driver's having a lot more success but he's not irreplaceable.
As for Rose and Finn, their plot was about giving Finn a reason to believe in the resistance. Finn wasn't actually FOR the resistance yet. He was only about getting away from the First Order. Rose showed him the people who got hurt by the first Order and by the end of it Finn gained a conviction to not just leave the first order but to actually fight against it. Before that casino bit Finn was only doing what he could to help his 2 friends (Rey and Poe) and otherwise to just get away. After that he was willing to die to help the resistance.
This is off too. Finn went through this entire arc in the Force Awakens. Johnson just felt like redoing it for who knows what reason. Not to mention, Finn literally says that he's trying to get the locator for Rey off the ship so she doesn't jump into a trap. That's no abandoning the resistance. Finn abandoning them was a misperception of Rose's (that it seems bad cinematography pushed onto a lot of audience members). Finn didn't go to Starkiller base just for Rey and Poe.
He hasn't moped for 30 years. He maybe Mopeds for the last 10-15? How old Is driver in these movies? How old was he when he turned?
Hamill (and thus Luke) is pushing 70. Return of the Jedi came out 34 years ago. It's a good approximate, but yes, it might be more like 15.
The Darkside pit showed the lure of the Darkside on Rey. She literally explains it's pull, it's promise, and how those promises are empty. That it feeds on your desires. I think the pit did a better job of showing how tempting the darkside can be to someone just starting out with the force then 1-3 ever did.
Yeah that's my point. They TALKED about the pit a lot, but when she actually goes INTO it nothing much happens and it's all rather ho-hum. That's no darkside temptation. Do you remember when Luke went into the cave on Dagobah? He was confronted by Vader except it was actually him under the helmet. It was a symbolic message of how killing Vader would make him become Vader. Rey just snapped her fingers at mirror world and looked at a fuzzy reflection.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/22 18:02:24
BobtheInquisitor wrote: Lands is a swindler, a smoothie and an administrator. His talent lies in interpersonal skills. Having him be a master computer hacker would be asinine. Either you respect the source material or you create fansploosh.
Yeah, Lando the Hacker wouldn't be an improvement.
Lando running the Casino as a money-laundering operation for the Resistance, employing a number of hackers? That would be an improvement.
BobtheInquisitor wrote: Lands is a swindler, a smoothie and an administrator. His talent lies in interpersonal skills. Having him be a master computer hacker would be asinine. Either you respect the source material or you create fansploosh.
Yeah, Lando the Hacker wouldn't be an improvement.
Lando running the Casino as a money-laundering operation for the Resistance, employing a number of hackers? That would be an improvement.
BobtheInquisitor wrote: Lands is a swindler, a smoothie and an administrator. His talent lies in interpersonal skills. Having him be a master computer hacker would be asinine. Either you respect the source material or you create fansploosh.
Yeah, Lando the Hacker wouldn't be an improvement.
Lando running the Casino as a money-laundering operation for the Resistance, employing a number of hackers? That would be an improvement.
I'd be interested to find out whether the whole "Star Wars is dead to me!" crowd were into the EU at all and if so which parts, or just OT fans.
I suspect there might be a strong correlation between the more...visceral dislike of TLJ, and people who didn't like the EU or who only liked the EU novels that essentially retold the OT story with a few first names changed around.
I quite enjoyed it, despite a few flaws here & there, but then I've spent the 25 years since I first saw ANH reading books and comics, and playing games, that cast the light/dark conflict and the importance of balance etc in a similar way to TLJ and which have made Star Wars bigger for me than just the OT and the Skywalkers.
And lets be honest, they couldn't make a new "main saga" without trampling all over the story of the OT, because the story of the OT was *finished*. The goodies won, the baddies were vanquished or redeemed, The End. And that's borne out by a lot of the EU stuff that did try and carry on directly from the OT, which pretty much told the same tale over and over again because they were too afraid to "diminish" the victory of the Alliance and Luke.
"Your society's broken, so who should we blame? Should we blame the rich, powerful people who caused it? No, lets blame the people with no power and no money and those immigrants who don't even have the vote. Yea, it must be their fething fault." - Iain M Banks
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"The language of modern British politics is meant to sound benign. But words do not mean what they seem to mean. 'Reform' actually means 'cut' or 'end'. 'Flexibility' really means 'exploit'. 'Prudence' really means 'don't invest'. And 'efficient'? That means whatever you want it to mean, usually 'cut'. All really mean 'keep wages low for the masses, taxes low for the rich, profits high for the corporations, and accept the decline in public services and amenities this will cause'." - Robin McAlpine from Common Weal
Yodhrin wrote: I'd be interested to find out whether the whole "Star Wars is dead to me!" crowd were into the EU at all and if so which parts, or just OT fans.
I suspect there might be a strong correlation between the more...visceral dislike of TLJ, and people who didn't like the EU or who only liked the EU novels that essentially retold the OT story with a few first names changed around.
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Well, I was middling on the movie and read Bunches of EU as a teen. Probably Thrawn trilogy was the best.
I thought TFA was OK but did not like TLJ. I also didn't care for a lot of EU stuff. The Rogue Squadron books were good and enjoyed playing KotOR. My favorite stuff was the early, fairly radical Dark Horse stuff - Dark Empire and Tales of the Jedi.
