Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Deadly Scrap is nice when attacking more models it is easier to hit.
But you’d think it would be more attacks when hitting a bigger unit (easier to hit more models as it all rains down), as opposed to higher damage (so same amount of items hit, but somehow hit harder on those same 3 people).

Unless Damage is different in AoS? It doesn’t roll over to other models in the unit I’m assuming.

Danny76 wrote:
Deadly Scrap is nice when attacking more models it is easier to hit.
But you’d think it would be more attacks when hitting a bigger unit (easier to hit more models as it all rains down), as opposed to higher damage (so same amount of items hit, but somehow hit harder on those same 3 people).

Unless Damage is different in AoS? It doesn’t roll over to other models in the unit I’m assuming.

It does, in fact. High Damage characteristics are much more useful in AoS.

Voss wrote:

Danny76 wrote:
Deadly Scrap is nice when attacking more models it is easier to hit.
But you’d think it would be more attacks when hitting a bigger unit (easier to hit more models as it all rains down), as opposed to higher damage (so same amount of items hit, but somehow hit harder on those same 3 people).

Unless Damage is different in AoS? It doesn’t roll over to other models in the unit I’m assuming.

It does, in fact. High Damage characteristics are much more useful in AoS.

Though his point still stands; 'shrapnel' artillery like the scraplauncher, plagueclaw catapult, etc, should be making multiple wound rolls per hit that each deal 1 damage instead of 1 wound roll that deals multiple damage. The way it works now the target unit either blocks every piece of shrapnel or no pieces of shrapnel, which both runs counter to the narrative and makes for a less fun all-or-nothing attack.

Chikout wrote:
There is a much simpler solution to the depravity problem. In the book it says you get depravity for a wound that doesn't kill a model. Change that to getting depravity for doing wounds to models that don't die in that phase and you have a much more interesting mechanic. Now a unit of two wound models gives you a maximum of one depravity point.
It also makes the attack twice ability worse. Let's say you attack a monster once and do six wounds. If you choose to attack again and kill the monster, you lose your depravity points because the monster died in that phase.

Anyway, it is not long now until the next faq is due. It will be interesting to see what changes gw makes.

with that change you basicly nerf it way to hard and still doesn't address the inbalance between multiwound armies and single wound armies.

Make it so depravity only affects single model units. Basically, war machines, monsters, heroes. No multi wound model units. Honestly, that should curb it in a bit without crippling it.

 timetowaste85 wrote:
Make it so depravity only affects single model units. Basically, war machines, monsters, heroes. No multi wound model units. Honestly, that should curb it in a bit without crippling it.

Aye but it again makes it very swingy. Ideally you want a system that will generate a very similar value of depravity against multiple different kind of standard army. Otherwise you're introducing a summoning mechanic that works far better against some armies over others without any actual reason for that included in the balancing of the armies.

Not sure has this been posted before? Slaves to darkness and terrain seems to be coming 14.12

I'm surprised GW squeezing it in on the 14th if that is the case, but not surprised that Slaves came after Ogors. It confirms my earlier belief of GW wanting the whole game with battletomes come Christmas. Then updating the last 3 or so armies with 2.0 Tomes early in the new year (since armies like seraphon still have a tome and are thus still able to be easily marketed and sold - heck their christmas set sold out last winter very fast).

Slaves (along with Everchosen which is likely to be rolled into it based on the store listing) is the last without a Tome in AoS. So seeing them get a tome will be great

 Overread wrote:
I'm surprised GW squeezing it in on the 14th if that is the case...

Whether this list is true or not, I think at this point it's safe to say that the December break GW used to take doesn't exist anymore since a couple of years back when Codex Imperial Agents released. That doesn't mean any December release will be big or spectacular, and the Christmas boxes will likely still be the last big thing GW releases in a year, but December is not an empty month anymore.

tneva82 wrote:
Not sure has this been posted before? Slaves to darkness and terrain seems to be coming 14.12

That list shows the Blood Bowl team as the 'Oldhiem Ogres'. The preview video shows them as the 'Fire Mountain Gut Busters'. That puts some doubt into the veracity of the list.

looking at the list again, it also lists the slave to darkness start collecting, even though its already out

terry wrote:
looking at the list again, it also lists the slave to darkness start collecting, even though its already out

It's also an early one that might potentially get replaced.

At the very least, there might be new packaging going. See this:

vs


Look at the more recent Start Collecting sets and they all feature art on one side while the other side has a breakdown of the box.

Has this happend before?
Fyreslayers, FCE and Ironjawz all kept their old SC!s with old AoS logo and old layout when they received their update.

Article on sub-factions for bonereapers: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/10/24/ossiarch-bonereapers-the-sub-factionsgw-homepage-post-1/

And these actually look kinda cool with different paint coats:

The Petrifex Elite (grey with red armour) are the best looking.

Yeah I suspected the paint scheme would make them actually pleasant and they confirmed my suspicions right there. The Null-Myriad and the Crematorians are amazing !

Rules-wise it's sad to see they're still doing the "Wide variety of sub-factions rules and one OP" thing. I know it's really early to tell but +1 to saves for a whole army is crazy good on a 4+ base army. I'm always disgusted by some 2+ rerollable SCE units and then this happens. Really durable.

However I like it when there's a twist to the bonus, like with the Ivory Host who get +1 to Hit but -1 to save. Now why do THEY have a malus but not all other sub-factions ?

Don't have much experience in AoS but that's how I feel reading these.

But yeah definitely starting a cavalry army next year if the price aren't too bonkers !

Personally the Petrifex Elite have the best paint scheme.

 Aaranis wrote:
However I like it when there's a twist to the bonus, like with the Ivory Host who get +1 to Hit but -1 to save. Now why do THEY have a malus but not all other sub-factions ?

It's a preview. We're not necesssarily seeing all of the rules,

I'll also side with the Petrifex as a far superior scheme.

My interest in the Bonereapers has been waning as they drag this on. I get that they need to introduce the army to us so people know what they're getting into, but I'm just not sure I see anything in the rules that has me excited.

That said, Endless Spells for Slaves to Darkness? You have my attention since I've been waiting for them to get a proper update for a while so this is an interesting way to go.

EDIT: I just realized I completely missed the StD battletome that's on the list too. Welp, looks like I might need to buy some angry heavilly armoured barbarians.

That kind of settles it, I just don't like the aesthetic. Alt-paint jobs here do not help.

I always like it when they do a whole bunch of sub-factions and after Sylvaneth I am optimistic about them all being viable (I assume there will be 1 or 2 of 'the good one' but will withold judgement until we see them all). Really enjoying the unique theme options for all of these as well. Also those amber weapons on the ivory guys look gorgeous.

I dunno, they're ugly models, but some of the paint jobs do help.

The rules don't. Way too many rules-exceptions and 'even more better because we're new,' which I thought GW had worked past.

 Hanskrampf wrote:
Has this happend before?
Fyreslayers, FCE and Ironjawz all kept their old SC!s with old AoS logo and old layout when they received their update.

Not sure. The big thing is that if the contents remain the same, then you might never notice it.

Voss wrote:
I dunno, they're ugly models, but some of the paint jobs do help.

The rules don't. Way too many rules-exceptions and 'even more better because we're new,' which I thought GW had worked past.

Rules exceptions? There's run & charge for one subfaction but that's relatively common. The army ignores battleshock, but for an elite army with bravery 10 across the board that amounts of a small upgrade. Did I miss some?

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

Voss wrote:
I dunno, they're ugly models, but some of the paint jobs do help.

The rules don't. Way too many rules-exceptions and 'even more better because we're new,' which I thought GW had worked past.

Rules exceptions? There's run & charge for one subfaction but that's relatively common. The army ignores battleshock, but for an elite army with bravery 10 across the board that amounts of a small upgrade. Did I miss some?

Probably referring to the artefact that ignores all saves and wound-negation, which is only available to the anti-magic faction, and possibly ignoring that it is a singular item that does nothing useful against hordes, likely mostly because it’s specifically called out as countering Gotrek. Which is silly because it doesn’t actually counter Avatar of Grimnir at all…

They are referring to the Shoulder Plate ability that gives him a 3+ fnp.

The two spell lores plus prayers of the Ogors via Facebook:

 Mr_Rose wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

Voss wrote:
I dunno, they're ugly models, but some of the paint jobs do help.

The rules don't. Way too many rules-exceptions and 'even more better because we're new,' which I thought GW had worked past.

Rules exceptions? There's run & charge for one subfaction but that's relatively common. The army ignores battleshock, but for an elite army with bravery 10 across the board that amounts of a small upgrade. Did I miss some?

Probably referring to the artefact that ignores all saves and wound-negation, which is only available to the anti-magic faction, and possibly ignoring that it is a singular item that does nothing useful against hordes, likely mostly because it’s specifically called out as countering Gotrek. Which is silly because it doesn’t actually counter Avatar of Grimnir at all…

Nope. I'm referring to nothing of the sort.

I was referring to immune to battleshock (no matter how 'small' an upgrade it is), and negate wounds, and roll a bunch of dice for bonus not!command points and treating troops as heroes with their own command abilities, plus the various modifiers for each unit and subfaction.

Voss thing is many of those bonuses make sense.

The battleshock makes sense for an army which is basically all close combat barring (currently) one model (trebuchet) with a very short movement distance as standard.

We've also not seen the stats for any of their faster moving elements which could likely have worse saves to counter their faster movement.

The additional command point system sounds like the units might have less universal abilities like regular armies. Instead having slightly more powerful ones, but tied to a limited (per turn) resource.

The subfaction modifiers do sound pretty strong overall, but they are also currently without full context.



Again don't forget GW is currently selling the army to pre-order people. They are going to make them sound really strong and really interesting and are not going to dwell on any potential negatives half as much. We'll likely hear a far more balanced overview once the pre-view material embargo expires (I forget when but that either happens when the pre-orders go live or when the product goes live for sale).


Right now I'd say those looking to power-play the meta are waiting for the Tome; many of those leaping into the army right now are more after them because of their visual and lore design and overall rough concept of tactics (that they are a predominantly close combat army).

I don't know why, but I thought the General Greviouses had a bunch of nipples on the front of their chests. Turns out, its bolts or something for their armor.


Or is it....