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 Thairne wrote:
I'm worried about that as well.
I just dont get why they refused to give the Codex ONE 3D weapon. At all.
Everything is forgeworld... I guess someone just search&replaced them by the rule D3->2D and didn't think twice about it.

Trajann has one, technically.

Something I just picked up on, that kata references "auric" weapons. Clearly this is a new tag for some specific weapons. I wonder if it's a name level tag like "bolt" or "plasma" or will it be a rules level tag like blast ? The latter seems easier to do but would require renaming half our weapons to be auric spears or something which I think we would have seen mention of by now

xerxeskingofking wrote:
Something I just picked up on, that kata references "auric" weapons. Clearly this is a new tag for some specific weapons. I wonder if it's a name level tag like "bolt" or "plasma" or will it be a rules level tag like blast ? The latter seems easier to do but would require renaming half our weapons to be auric spears or something which I think we would have seen mention of by now

I think there will just be a list on the last page of the codex which weapons count as "auric". Guess what, Venatari pistols and Sagittarum Bolters will 99% not be on that list until some obscure FAQ comes out 2 months from now.

Do you guys think the "give a unit access to both abilities of current Kata" captain commander ability will give our bog standard shield captain a place in lists? Cause nobody played a normal shield captain in idk....two years? Ever?

Tiberias wrote:

xerxeskingofking wrote:
Something I just picked up on, that kata references "auric" weapons. Clearly this is a new tag for some specific weapons. I wonder if it's a name level tag like "bolt" or "plasma" or will it be a rules level tag like blast ? The latter seems easier to do but would require renaming half our weapons to be auric spears or something which I think we would have seen mention of by now

I think there will just be a list on the last page of the codex which weapons count as "auric". Guess what, Venatari pistols and Sagittarum Bolters will 99% not be on that list until some obscure FAQ comes out 2 months from now.

Do you guys think the "give a unit access to both abilities of current Kata" captain commander ability will give our bog standard shield captain a place in lists? Cause nobody played a normal shield captain in idk....two years? Ever?

Yeah I'm also betting on a list. Sag are 'adrastic' in their name I think so I could see them not making said list. Ever.

Ok, so back to 3d Printing the the rest of 9th? Can't pay for resin Custodes. Don't have those types of funds.

Honest opinion time: given the presupposition that what we've seen is all we are getting for changes, what are you grading this release on 1-10?

I'm gonna say 7. it's several things we wanted, several things we didn't need/want, and a bunch of steps in the right direction. For me the biggest help was fixed damage. And the sisters.

Auric weapons are likely going to be added to the weapon's datasheet like Drukhari and Poisoned Weapons and DG and Plague Weapons if I had to guess.

Hooray for being golden orks... Or overpriced Space Marines.

We will be wiped in T1.

Well I was a page late it seems

So just like that, without even mentioning FW, GW has nerfed some of our best options. These Multiple Small Special Rules are killing the hobby. Can we please go back to USRs?

They should have went back to USR's at the start of 9th, but instead doubled down on the madness of Command Stratagems.

I'm just saying I'm glad Custodes aren't my only army.

Unstoppable destroyer is basically useless and wont see play in this new rendition. Termy captain is gonna be stuck with the +a if he's hurt trait, which is fine if its only like 5 points.

The double ka'tah buff might see play and gives us a reason to take a standard captain now.

The bike captain is almost always gonna take reroll 1's if he takes anything, but he wont really have to. He is going up to 9 wounds standard so thats a buff. I just hope he doesnt go up in points. 175 was already a bit too much considering what orks got.

 Eihnlazer wrote:
Unstoppable destroyer is basically useless and wont see play in this new rendition. Termy captain is gonna be stuck with the +a if he's hurt trait, which is fine if its only like 5 points.

The double ka'tah buff might see play and gives us a reason to take a standard captain now.

The bike captain is almost always gonna take reroll 1's if he takes anything, but he wont really have to. He is going up to 9 wounds standard so thats a buff. I just hope he doesnt go up in points. 175 was already a bit too much considering what orks got.

There's 3 for each Captain I think so some hope for the Allarus still. The Bike Captain will be hard pressed to not take the re-rolls though. That's a great one.

If RR of 1 is a bike captain trait...
Does that mean RR of Wounds for Standard Lances if charged is gone?
Leaker said, afaik, that it would be a +1 to wound. Which could be nice, but still, only 2D...

 Thairne wrote:
If RR of 1 is a bike captain trait...
Does that mean RR of Wounds for Standard Lances if charged is gone?
Leaker said, afaik, that it would be a +1 to wound. Which could be nice, but still, only 2D...

Looks like it, or otherwise it would be completely redundant for a bike captain.

Pretty rough, the weapons leaks really don't make things look promising.

Holding out hope that auric weapons ignore damage reduction.

It seems plausible, have a list at the start of the book that covers which weapons count and it plays into custodes being able to counter most things and mean they are decent against most targets.

That said I cant help but remember that hope is the first step on the road to disappointment

 WisdomLS wrote:
Holding out hope that auric weapons ignore damage reduction.

It seems plausible, have a list at the start of the book that covers which weapons count and it plays into custodes being able to counter most things and mean they are decent against most targets.

That said I cant help but remember that hope is the first step on the road to disappointment

maybe, MAYBE as a strat, but i highly doubt it.

yeah, at this point its just wishlisting with a chance of close to 0.
It might be that the army is just fethed.

Listing known and probably 3D weapons:

Trajan (melee)
Blade Champion (against Characters)
Adrastus Bolt Caliver (shooting)
Achillus/Galatus (melee)
Ven Contemptor Dread (melee)
Pallas Grav Attack (shooting)
Caladius (shooting)
Telemon (both)

I mean its not all doom and gloom.There are a few options still, but they're all on FW plattforms basically which are capable of obliterating most targets that have a -1D in itself.
Gravis will be a real challenge tho.

Well, we are going to know soon enough. Come saturday goonhammer will have a review up and most youtube warhammer channels will go through the book in detail.

If it's truly the worst case scenario and the book won't give us much to work with, we still have FW options as others have already said. And those FW choices are still very solid...I'd even argue that the FW units get a straight buff, because they won't change (well maybe some point changes) but get the added benefit of the new Katas and passive shield host buffs.
This still leaves us with the problem however that our codex should be able to function without FW.

Venerable Contemptor dread Melta is still 3-8, or d6+2. So at minimum if both shots hit and wound you still get 6-16 damage.

For 150 points, that might be our best plastic dakka platform now. Sag's aren't getting the buffs, so they are a worse replacement to the standard guardians with just spears.

Speaking of which are we anywhere on whether or not Guardian Melta spears get the +2 damage treatment?

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Venerable Contemptor dread Melta is still 3-8, or d6+2. So at minimum if both shots hit and wound you still get 6-16 damage.

For 150 points, that might be our best plastic dakka platform now. Sag's aren't getting the buffs, so they are a worse replacement to the standard guardians with just spears.

Speaking of which are we anywhere on whether or not Guardian Melta spears get the +2 damage treatment?

The pyrithite spear? Yes, its d6+2 damage at half range (ie at 6"), I just looked it up on the app.

Saw this on the canhammer discord in the custodes channel.

from suposed leaker:

Auric weapons: Watchers Axe, Guardian Spear, Gnosis, Watchers axe, Sentinel blade

Aegis: 4++ 6+++ vs mortals

Moment shackle: Once per battle reduce damage to 0 from a failed save roll. Fight again. Free interrupt if eligible

Bikes: No obsec, +1 to wound on charge for bikes

Shields: Now called Praesidium shield. +1 to armour saves, plus 3pts per model

Every custode model counts as 1 extra model

Wardens: Bodyguard rule

Trajann: Reroll now core, no 3++ but gets 5+++

Allarus 65 Warden 50 Guard 45 Bikes 85 + 5 for Salvo

Dreadhost: +1 ap in 9 inches, reroll charge

Rendax:

Stance 1 - Each time amodel in this unit makes an attack vs a vehicle or monster unit an unmodified hit roll of 6 automatically wounds

Stance 2 - Each time a model in this unit makes a melee attack against a vehicle or monster unit, if that models unit made a charge, was charged or performed a HI, add 1 to the strength characteristic of that attack

Eagles eye gives a 3++ for a turn

Auric aquilas no 3++

which means even with the +4" range from the ka'tah, we cant deep strike in to half range without using our precious teleport homer strike.

The extra range is mostly gonna help us get into rapid fire easier and with the saggitarum's adrathic shots.

 Eihnlazer wrote:
which means even with the +4" range from the ka'tah, we cant deep strike in to half range without using our precious teleport homer strike.

The extra range is mostly gonna help us get into rapid fire easier and with the saggitarum's adrathic shots.

If nordsturmking's leaks are right, not really worth it though as Sag won't get double shoot since they're not on the auric list.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 nordsturmking wrote:
from suposed leaker:

Auric weapons: Watchers Axe, Guardian Spear, Gnosis, Watchers axe, Sentinel blade

Aegis: 4++ 6+++ vs mortals

Moment shackle: Once per battle reduce damage to 0 from a failed save roll. Fight again. Free interrupt if eligible

Bikes: No obsec, +1 to wound on charge for bikes

Shields: Now called Praesidium shield. +1 to armour saves, plus 3pts per model

Every custode model counts as 1 extra model

Wardens: Bodyguard rule

Trajann: Reroll now core, no 3++ but gets 5+++

Allarus 65 Warden 50 Guard 45 Bikes 85 + 5 for Salvo

Dreadhost: +1 ap in 9 inches, reroll charge

Rendax:

Stance 1 - Each time amodel in this unit makes an attack vs a vehicle or monster unit an unmodified hit roll of 6 automatically wounds

Stance 2 - Each time a model in this unit makes a melee attack against a vehicle or monster unit, if that models unit made a charge, was charged or performed a HI, add 1 to the strength characteristic of that attack

Eagles eye gives a 3++ for a turn

Auric aquilas no 3++

Let's see here:

Rendax seems pretty bleh. Maybe if you're stacking Misericordia Sag the auto wound could be nice. Stance 2 helps Spear units cross the divide by going S7 -> S8. Hmm, actually, it might be nicer than I thought. Jetbikes get the S8 bonus too.

Eagle Eye is eww now. Have to see what other relics are waiting for us. If we have no way to get a permanent 3++ on a HQ with a relic that's a decided slight against us considering Space Marines and subchapters have several 3++ relics. Even GK have Draigo.

That said, Trajann losing 3++ in return for a full 5+++ is probably a wash. A more math inclined person would need to run some numbers to be sure.

Jetbikes losing ObSec is a rough blow. If they count as 2 per-model it's helpful but not a huge bonus. You'll really have to kill everything around them and body block objectives. Whether Stooping Dive remains will be important here as it's a way to clear off cheap chaff that try to toe onto your objective.

Wardens getting bodyguard is nice. The question will be whether we really have any characters worth body guarding. Except for our two Sisters characters, our characters are super tough as is and/or being protected fairly naturally by Look Out, Sir. We're not like Death Guard who want to put a Foul Blightspawn or psyker way out front while having out-of-LoS Deathshroud block fire using bodyguard.

Storm Shield nerf is a morale blow but not actually that big a deal. Having a 0+ save with Shield + Flag means even AP-3 is still saving on a 3+. It's not unless you get hit with AP-4 that you'll suddenly feel the loss of the invuln or if you're getting hit with AP-3 melee weapons (i.e. power/force swords).

Whelp, if this is true, they killed:

Shield Guardians - No +1 to invuln
Bikes - No Obsec and a double points nerf
Trajaan - no regain wounds, a 5++ save?
And pretty much all our FW infantry doesn't get Auric weapons. Or Obsec I'm betting.

Well, at least the Wardens got a Bodyguard rule. Now they are only slightly useless.

It seems to be a realy unfun codex at this moment. Nothing new, very boring D2 weapons, no real stayingpower compared to the DMG and/or amount of attacks other armies have, nerfed traits for commanders, nerfed shields, nerfed bikes... While others feared the powercreep right now it feels like we will get a realy sh...y codex. :(

Audustum wrote:


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Let's see here:

Rendax seems pretty bleh. Maybe if you're stacking Misericordia Sag the auto wound could be nice. Stance 2 helps Spear units cross the divide by going S7 -> S8. Hmm, actually, it might be nicer than I thought. Jetbikes get the S8 bonus too.

Eagle Eye is eww now. Have to see what other relics are waiting for us. If we have no way to get a permanent 3++ on a HQ with a relic that's a decided slight against us considering Space Marines and subchapters have several 3++ relics. Even GK have Draigo.

That said, Trajann losing 3++ in return for a full 5+++ is probably a wash. A more math inclined person would need to run some numbers to be sure.

Jetbikes losing ObSec is a rough blow. If they count as 2 per-model it's helpful but not a huge bonus. You'll really have to kill everything around them and body block objectives. Whether Stooping Dive remains will be important here as it's a way to clear off cheap chaff that try to toe onto your objective.

Wardens getting bodyguard is nice. The question will be whether we really have any characters worth body guarding. Except for our two Sisters characters, our characters are super tough as is and/or being protected fairly naturally by Look Out, Sir. We're not like Death Guard who want to put a Foul Blightspawn or psyker way out front while having out-of-LoS Deathshroud block fire using bodyguard.

Storm Shield nerf is a morale blow but not actually that big a deal. Having a 0+ save with Shield + Flag means even AP-3 is still saving on a 3+. It's not unless you get hit with AP-4 that you'll suddenly feel the loss of the invuln or if you're getting hit with AP-3 melee weapons (i.e. power/force swords).

A 3++ is mathematically the same as 4++/5+++, but the latter is better as you get a save against mortals. So it is a buff.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Whelp, if this is true, they killed:

Shield Guardians - No +1 to invuln
Bikes - No Obsec and a double points nerf
Trajaan - no regain wounds, a 5++ save?
And pretty much all our FW infantry doesn't get Auric weapons. Or Obsec I'm betting.

Well, at least the Wardens got a Bodyguard rule. Now they are only slightly useless.

Igoring incoming dmg is better that healing d3 wounds. And i think i have ony once used the healing. Trajann still has a 4++ and see above. bikes losing obsec hurts i agree. losing the 3++ on shield is a nerf but remember we are getting traits and stances.

Jesus, hoping those rumors aren't true but suspecting they are :-(

I really hope there is something we're not seeing but at the moment it looks like they are taking away our toughness whist not increasing our damage. In the 9th edition land of hyper lethality that's a really bad sign.

We could be saved by a really good set of strats but earlier rumors points to them being toned down in a similar vein to blood angels were.

I also got told in the discord there's no damage strategem.

We might be the editions big dud

Oh boy... im just disappointed.

The Emperoer's Finest what a joke... .