Codex Adeptus Custodes: By His will alone

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**Primark G**

If you know you’ll be up against him bring a Culexus.

**Ordana**

Primark G wrote:
If you know you’ll be up against him bring a Culexus.

Which limits his psy potential but does nothing to actually stop the guy from tearing your army apart.
And your not even going to stop the one power that matters. The Time Warp that gets him into combat T1 because no good player will let you DS a Culexus close enough, Nurglings will push you back to far.

**Dr. Mills**

As a side note, how powerful is the stratagem that allows you to deepstrike next to a vexilla bearer to allow you to be within 3" of an enemy unit?

I see great trolling potential with surprise Contemptor or a blob of Terminators lead by a captain for hilarious back line carnage.

**Audustum**

Ordana wrote:
Primark G wrote:
If you know you’ll be up against him bring a Culexus.
Which limits his psy potential but does nothing to actually stop the guy from tearing your army apart.
And your not even going to stop the one power that matters. The Time Warp that gets him into combat T1 because no good player will let you DS a Culexus close enough, Nurglings will push you back to far.

In this case Acolytes bubbling Ahriman in the back! Plus the mission had hammer and anvil deployment.

Unfortunately I didn't have my Caladius which I think would've helped a lot.

**Primark G**

Ordana you bring in the Assassin between Morty and your battleline so the daemon Primarch must pass by it. It’s a very effective deterrent. Of course you have a psyker(s) as well.

**Ordana**

Primark G wrote:
Ordana you bring in the Assassin between Morty and your battleline so the daemon Primarch must pass by it. It’s a very effective deterrent. Of course you have a psyker(s) as well.

How is he a deterrent? Mort doesn't care about 4 str 4 attacks. Shooting him doesn't do anything either. Yeah, he has some trouble hitting you back but 18 attacks and his MW aura arn't good for the assassin.

And he will happily Fly over you and charge something actually juicy.

**Primark G**

Morty can hit a gun line turn 1 unless you blunder your deployment. The Assassin is both a buffer to your army and debuffs Morty who is a psyker.

**Audustum**

Primark G wrote:
Morty can hit a gun line turn 1 unless you blunder your deployment. The Assassin is both a buffer to your army and debuffs Morty who is a psyker.

Not by a ton though. Morty's primary damage comes from a Mortal Wounds Aura which is independent of the psychic phase. That did more damage to me than all his spells and all his attacks combined and makes dogpiling him risky (because it hits everything in 7" at the start of each Fight phase).

**Slayer-Fan123**

Primark G wrote:
Morty can hit a gun line turn 1 unless you blunder your deployment. The Assassin is both a buffer to your army and debuffs Morty who is a psyker.

Except you aren't stopping the one power he really needs (Warptime). That's the point people are trying to make to you. He doesn't NEED to cast anything. Him being able to cast and deny is merely a bonus.

**Primark G**

I agree and as said before you have to kill him in one turn or he will wreck you. His invul is so so imo... I light up at range on his way in. Null Zone ruins his day.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Primark G wrote:
Morty can hit a gun line turn 1 unless you blunder your deployment. The Assassin is both a buffer to your army and debuffs Morty who is a psyker.

Except you aren't stopping the one power he really needs (Warptime). That's the point people are trying to make to you. He doesn't NEED to cast anything. Him being able to cast and deny is merely a bonus.

If you go first you can place the Assassin in range for the debuff.

**Slayer-Fan123**

Primark G wrote:
I agree and as said before you have to kill him in one turn or he will wreck you. His invul is so so imo... I light up at range on his way in. Null Zone ruins his day.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Primark G wrote:
Morty can hit a gun line turn 1 unless you blunder your deployment. The Assassin is both a buffer to your army and debuffs Morty who is a psyker.

Except you aren't stopping the one power he really needs (Warptime). That's the point people are trying to make to you. He doesn't NEED to cast anything. Him being able to cast and deny is merely a bonus.

If you go first you can place the Assassin in range for the debuff.

You do know that if your plan relies on you going first that it's a bad plan right?

Plus you do remember the range on the Cukexus aura right?

**Primark G**

You’re a gem.

**Slayer-Fan123**

Primark G wrote:
You’re a gem.

You could also answer the questions I proposed.

**Primark G**

Nah.

**Slayer-Fan123**

Primark G wrote:
Nah.

Then you're admitting the idea doesn't really work out well as:
1. You rely on going first
2. You have to go through the potential Nurglings and Pox Walkers
3. Assume that either candidate will be within range (the Sorcerer or Mortarion) to be affected.

**Meatgrinder**

Theres a lot of childishness in this thread, can we try keep it on topic and act like adults?

Substantiate claims with scenarios and math. Cmon guys its not hard.

**Primark G**

I concur.

**JNAProductions**

Primark G wrote:
I concur.

So substantiate your claims.

**Primark G**

I have explained them all before - I know you two are just trolling me now.

**Slayer-Fan123**

Primark G wrote:
I have explained them all before - I know you two are just trolling me now.

There was literally a post proving your math wrong like a page or two ago. I'm not sure what more you could possibly want after that point.

**Cephalobeard**

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Primark G wrote:
I have explained them all before - I know you two are just trolling me now.

There was literally a post proving your math wrong like a page or two ago. I'm not sure what more you could possibly want after that point.

It's been 40 pages of that. I learned to ignore it after about 20.

**Primark G**

Obviously no one counts on going first.

**Ordana**

Primark G wrote:
I redid the math for 3x Allarus and Trajann vs 3x Jetbike and Shield-Captain vs Baneblade chassis. They do roughly 9 wounds each the first round then after that the Allarus inflict more damage each subsequent turn.

So you call into the question the math on the previous page?
Have the decency to show where it is wrong.

ps
3 bikes just meleeing already do more then 9 dmg. Not counting their shooting, the captain or the 4th bike to adjust for Trajann's cost.

**Primark G**

Sorry typo. I forgot the d3... lol. Really busy at work today.

**JNAProductions**

JNAProductions wrote:
Allarus get 35/6 hits with each gun, and Trajaan gets 35/18 hits.
That becomes 245/1,296 wounds with each, except Trajaan, who gets 245/324.
At AP-1, D2, and AP-3, D1, that's 245/2,592 and 245/648 at D2, and 1,225/7,776 at D1.
Total damage in shooting? (245/2592+245/648)*2+1,225/7,776=(.09+.38)*2+.16=1.10 damage.
In close combat, you get 35/3 Axe hits, 175/36 Trajaan hits, and 35/9 from Misericordias.
That's 245/36 Axe wounds, 1,225/324 Trajaan wounds, and 35/27 Misericordia wounds.
With a 5+ save on all that except Trajaan, that's 245/54 Axe wounds, 70/81 Misiericrodia wounds, and 6,125/1,944 Trajaan wounds.
Total CC damage? (245/54+6,125/1,944)*2+70/81=(4.54+3.15)*2+.86=16.24 damage.

TOTAL DAMAGE FOR THREE ALLARUS AND TRAJAAN
17.34

Praetors get 175/3 hits.
175/18 wounds.
175/54 damage.
Total damage in shooting? 175/54=3.24 damage.
In close combat, they get 245/12 hits.
Wounding on 5s, rerolling, gets us 5/9 chance of wounding, for 1,225/108 wounds.
With -3 AP on all that, that's 6,125/648.
Total CC damage? (6,125/648)*2=18.90 damage.

TOTAL DAMAGE FOR FOUR VERTUS PRAETORS AND CAPTAIN ON DAWNEAGLE
22.14

If I had to guess, though, it'd take only a single extra round to make up the difference. Double-checking that...

11.34 damage on each next round for Praetors, 16.24 damage for Allarus. So actually, they're basically equal round two (a difference of a tenth of a point of damage) and the Allarus do better round three.

Except there is no round 3. The Baneblade is dead by then.

Now, for bonus maths, I'm going to AnyDice, and checking the odds of them one-rounding this thing.

Allarus and Trajaan can one-round a Baneblade .15% of the time (26+ wounds), drop it to the bottom bracket 5.51% of the time (20+ wounds), drop it to the second bracket 52.95% of the time (13+ wounds). All percentages are INCLUSIVE, meaning the chance of not bracketing it at all are 47.05%.

Praetors and Captain can one-round a Baneblade 24.57% of the time (26+ wounds), drop it the bottom bracket 70.23% of the time (20+ wounds), drop it to the second bracket 97.80% of the time (13+ wounds). All percentages are INCLUSIVE, meaning the chance of not bracketing it at all are 2.20%.

Edit: Also, outside of Mathhammer, the Praetors are far, FAR more likely to be doing the charging and be in rapid fire range, since they're more than twice as fast.

18.90 damage in CC from three Praetors and a Captain in CC against a Baneblade, on the turn they charge. They are quite likely to get the charge, since they can Fly, and can get a GUARANTEED charge from just under 16" away, and reliably make charges from even further.

Not to mention that, combine shooting and CC, and Allarus+Trajaan have barely over a 50% of bracketing a Baneblade, whereas Praetors have a just over 70% chance of dropping it the bottom bracket.

**Primark G**

All your stats are correct. By the way it is "Trajann".

**JNAProductions**

Primark G wrote:
All your stats are correct. By the way it is "Trajann".

My bad on the spelling. I can admit when I make mistakes, and that's definitely one of them.

But ultimately, I don't care enough to edit every post and fix that, so Trajaan it will remain for the earlier posts. Will obviously correct it going forward.

**Primark G**

Bully for you.

**str00dles1**

Just got my WD. Are the new spear options for 40k also? Or just 30k. Melta spears and Flamer spears.

**Primark G**

Just 30k.