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the_scotsman wrote:

 mokoshkana wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:

NOT RUMORS/LEAKS JUST SOMETHING ONE GUY WOULD LIKE TO SEE:
Harlequin's Blade: Chainsword bonus attack. Why do we pay 1 point to give our model no stats again? Current rule is literally S user AP- D1, 1 point....what?

Harlequin's Kiss: S4, AP-3, 3 Damage, wielder may make only one attack with this weapon.

Harlequin's Embrace: S+3, Ap-, 1 damage, wielder may make D3 additional attacks with this weapon on a turn in which they charged.

Harlequin's Caress: S User, AP-1, 1 damage, wound rolls of 6+ cause a mortal wound in addition to normal damage.

Sorry, but those changes are just bad, and they would make the army unplayable.

Changing the weapons to operate more similarly to how they were initially released in 7th ed would make the army unplayable? How did I play them all throughout 7th then? Obviously the prices would have to change around, but the fact of the matter is with the current arrangement where the Harlequins' weapons are just hurling stats at your opponent means you're pretty much always going to just have one mathematically superior weapon that's always the best (currently, that's the Embrace, which was for some reason changed from the Anti-Horde weapon to the Anti-Elite weapon of the three)

You just made it so that no one would ever choose a caress with your tweaks. S3 is absolute trash, especially with only an AP-1. You've essentially made the caress variant similar to the haywire cannon, and we all know how amazing that weapon is at bringing down vehicles (or not as is the case). Your kiss seems nice, but its strength is too low and you're giving up way too much by losing 3 attacks (4 on a troupe master). S4 is great for MEQ, but the extra damage is a waste against anything other than a primaris or a character. So, as stated above, you'd only see the embrace chosen under your tweaks as S6 is too good to pass up.

Sorry, the weapons wielded by my killer space clown dance troupe should be a tiny bit more of an interesting choice than Power Sword Power Mace Power Axe from every imperial army. At the very least, they should have kept consistent which of the three choices is supposed to be anti-horde, anti-elite, and anti-vehicle.

I agree wholeheartedly, but that doesn't mean the options have to be underpowered. Harlequins are expensive T3 models that have to win a coin flip to survive each wound they take. Being that they are glass cannons, they should actually be able to output the damage of said cannon before they die...

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/756411.page#9964342 moving the thread here because off topic. You'll find some math in there about my proposed Caress change. The kiss was intended to be weaker than the other two so it could cost less, as it is the iconic Harlequin weapon and comes six to the box, meaning (in my opinion) it should be balanced more as a basic weapon than as an upgrade on par with the new weapons that come two to the box. Note that per the rules you do not give up your other attacks if you have a weapon that only makes a single attack, as all models come equipped as standard with a Suser Ap- D1 weapon.

Now what if we weren't going to get harlequin info for another whole week...wouldn't that be fun?

- Folks over at Warhammer Community


Seriously though, I was sure there'd be something, anything today

They've already confirmed Harlequins are not going on preorder this weekend. We won't see anything until the week of the preorder.

Not sure if this is being debuffed or not, but are Harliquens being released on May 19th, and pre order is May 12 or is this what people are saying is wrong?

Davor wrote:
Not sure if this is being debuffed or not, but are Harliquens being released on May 19th, and pre order is May 12 or is this what people are saying is wrong?

Yes, it looks like the warhammer community team confirmed that Harlequins will not be up for pre-order on May 12th. They will likely be up for preorder on May19th, and released the following weekend.

If YMDC has taught me anything, it is that corrections by the community team are meaningless. It has to be in a FAQ. So the White Dwarf has the correct date.

Davor wrote:
Not sure if this is being debuffed or not, but are Harliquens being released on May 19th, and pre order is May 12 or is this what people are saying is wrong?

Literally look 1 post above yours.

rollawaythestone wrote:

Davor wrote:
Not sure if this is being debuffed or not, but are Harliquens being released on May 19th, and pre order is May 12 or is this what people are saying is wrong?

Yes, it looks like the warhammer community team confirmed that Harlequins will not be up for pre-order on May 12th. They will likely be up for preorder on May19th, and released the following weekend.

Thank you very much.

Imateria wrote:

Davor wrote:
Not sure if this is being debuffed or not, but are Harliquens being released on May 19th, and pre order is May 12 or is this what people are saying is wrong?

Literally look 1 post above yours.

I did. Without any links or context, not sure what they ment, so that is why I asked. I try to keep up to date, but haven't in a bit, so wasn't sure what White Dwarf was being discussed. Since I don't buy them no more, wasn't sure it last months or the next one coming out was being discussed.

Let's hope that we Harlequin players get something powerful.

Personally looking out (and hoping) for:
Better toughness Starweaver (or at LEAST T6 Voidweaver - it's a Heavy Support, GW)
Cheaper Shadowseer
Cheaper weapons
Some awesome Masque Forms (have my eye on a 6" auto-advance one)
Nice psychic powers (re-rolling saves or hit rolls especially)
Buff to the Death Jester (so AP to his weapons would be great, higher damage to the one-shot mode)


NOTE: These are not leaks, but wishful thinking

The Death Jester needs a big buff.
A stronger gun and maybe a different ability.

The Death jester needs a cool new ability, the current is useless.


I'd hope for something like "A unit targetted by the Death Jester is at -1 leadership until the end of the turn and if it fails it's morale test it suffers d3 mortal wounds"

Now yes that's pretty powerful (would come with a points increase) however I think it would make the death jester worth taking and be pretty thematic.

Then an artifact that gives enemies -1 leadership from Chapter approved and a psychic power to lower leadership further and it's a powerful but thematic synergy.

I suppose people could then spam Death Jesters, but with the FAQ you can have what, max 3 of them? 3 d3 mortal wounds is good but not game breaking.

dan2026 wrote:The Death Jester needs a big buff.
A stronger gun and maybe a different ability.

I fully agree, I forgot about the Death Jester. I'll edit my previous post, because that's quite important.

Aren73 wrote:The Death jester needs a cool new ability, the current is useless.


I'd hope for something like "A unit targetted by the Death Jester is at -1 leadership until the end of the turn and if it fails it's morale test it suffers d3 mortal wounds"

Now yes that's pretty powerful (would come with a points increase) however I think it would make the death jester worth taking and be pretty thematic.

Then an artifact that gives enemies -1 leadership from Chapter approved and a psychic power to lower leadership further and it's a powerful but thematic synergy.

I suppose people could then spam Death Jesters, but with the FAQ you can have what, max 3 of them? 3 d3 mortal wounds is good but not game breaking.

It sounds strong, but (in my opinion) it really isn't. How often do you fail a Morale test? No opponent I've ever played has.

I think a better weapon is key.

I actually like the current Death Jester ability. It's just that too many people ignore morale.

 JNAProductions wrote:
I actually like the current Death Jester ability. It's just that too many people ignore morale.

Yeah. If he reduced leadership or increased the amount of models that fled that would be better, but his weapon still needs some AP and damage.

Unnamed Harlequin wrote:

dan2026 wrote:The Death Jester needs a big buff.
A stronger gun and maybe a different ability.

I fully agree, I forgot about the Death Jester. I'll d]edit my previous post, because that's quite key.

Aren73 wrote:The Death jester needs a cool new ability, the current is useless.


I'd hope for something like "A unit targetted by the Death Jester is at -1 leadership until the end of the turn and if it fails it's morale test it suffers d3 mortal wounds"

Now yes that's pretty powerful (would come with a points increase) however I think it would make the death jester worth taking and be pretty thematic.

Then an artifact that gives enemies -1 leadership from Chapter approved and a psychic power to lower leadership further and it's a powerful but thematic synergy.

I suppose people could then spam Death Jesters, but with the FAQ you can have what, max 3 of them? 3 d3 mortal wounds is good but not game breaking.

It sounds strong, but (in my opinion) it really isn't. How often do you fail a Morale test? No opponent I've ever played has.

I think a better weapon is key.

With a -3 (the synergy from the other two parts I mentioned) failing a morale test shouldn't be that crazy. Yes they could use a stratagem to pass it, but firstly that's making them pay 2CP and secondly would only work on one unit.

Giving him a better weapon would be better than nothing, but for Harlequins especially I think we'd all appreciate inventive ways of dealing damage that are other than "hits hard in combat/shooting". If there is any army that should have weird/funny/inventive ways of dealing damage it should be Harlequins.

Aren73 wrote:

Unnamed Harlequin wrote:

dan2026 wrote:The Death Jester needs a big buff.
A stronger gun and maybe a different ability.

I fully agree, I forgot about the Death Jester. I'll d]edit my previous post, because that's quite key.

Aren73 wrote:The Death jester needs a cool new ability, the current is useless.


I'd hope for something like "A unit targetted by the Death Jester is at -1 leadership until the end of the turn and if it fails it's morale test it suffers d3 mortal wounds"

Now yes that's pretty powerful (would come with a points increase) however I think it would make the death jester worth taking and be pretty thematic.

Then an artifact that gives enemies -1 leadership from Chapter approved and a psychic power to lower leadership further and it's a powerful but thematic synergy.

I suppose people could then spam Death Jesters, but with the FAQ you can have what, max 3 of them? 3 d3 mortal wounds is good but not game breaking.

It sounds strong, but (in my opinion) it really isn't. How often do you fail a Morale test? No opponent I've ever played has.

I think a better weapon is key.

With a -3 (the synergy from the other two parts I mentioned) failing a morale test shouldn't be that crazy. Yes they could use a stratagem to pass it, but firstly that's making them pay 2CP and secondly would only work on one unit.

Giving him a better weapon would be better than nothing, but for Harlequins especially I think we'd all appreciate inventive ways of dealing damage that are other than "hits hard in combat/shooting". If there is any army that should have weird/funny/inventive ways of dealing damage it should be Harlequins.

That's true - I suppose, in a way, that's why I started playing Harlequins (well that and their speed). While I like the idea of the special harlequiny rules, I still believe that the Death Jester needs to deal more damage as well as scare people off. Maybe mortal wounds or a 'blast' kind of weapon, I dunno. I believe the current rule is great, just hardly ever comes into play as so many things have good leadership or just min-size squads.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As well as the upgrades there are a few stratagems/abilities I would like to see.

One that occupies my thoughts a lot is a kind of ability that lets Harlequins disembark from Starweavers after they move. This sounds very Harlequin-y and Alpha-Strike-y. Maybe a 2CP Strat or an upgrade that accompanies a points increase. Possibly the Starweaver moves half distance, disembarks, and then moves the other half.

Another one I think suits the Harlequin tactics would be a stratagem that lets you re-roll the roll-off to see who can go first (but can only be used once).

A few people I've talked to seem to think (1) is too good and I personally think that (2) would be a bit powerful, but I'd like to hear you guys' opinions.

Oh, yeah. The Death Jester NEEDS a better gun.

But his special rule is cool. It's just hard to use.

Didn’t the Death Jester have access to different weapons in earlier versions? Pretty sure it was the shrieked cannon and bright lance at one point.

Unnamed Harlequin - I like the disembark one! The reroll rolloff would have to be something crazy like 3-4CP but it can be costed. Do you reroll your dice or both you and opponent?

I think a stratagem to let a unit move again in the combat phase, after all attacks have been made would be cool. You could jump in, shoot, charge and blend a unit then jump back behind cover. Also powerful but I believe it can be appropriately priced.

Aren73 wrote:
Unnamed Harlequin - I like the disembark one! The reroll rolloff would have to be something crazy like 3-4CP but it can be costed. Do you reroll your dice or both you and opponent?

I think a stratagem to let a unit move again in the combat phase, after all attacks have been made would be cool. You could jump in, shoot, charge and blend a unit then jump back behind cover. Also powerful but I believe it can be appropriately priced.

Thanks! As for the roll-off reroll, I'm not sure whether to say both or just the player reroll, but oh well. Maybe you can choose?
As for the price of it, 3-4 CP sounds about right, but maybe a sort of system where the cost is dependent on the chance of the re-roll being useful? e.g. for a 1/6 chance it's 1CP, 2/6 2CP, 3/6 3CP, etc...
I like the stratagem that lets a unit move again . Although a move-AND-CHARGE-again one would be awesome, it would probably be too good

On a (TOTALLY unrelated) note, is there any GW e-mail you can send suggestions to?

Webway gate features in the regimental standard though, so that might be coming out ahead of the Harlequin release?

Tastyfish wrote:
Webway gate features in the regimental standard though, so that might be coming out ahead of the Harlequin release?

Possibly. But Harlequins are going out on preorder in four days (next week), right? So, if it does come ahead of Harlequins release it's not that much earlier. I personally assume that it will come in the codex, but this is an assumption and not fact.

Unnamed Harlequin wrote:

Tastyfish wrote:
Webway gate features in the regimental standard though, so that might be coming out ahead of the Harlequin release?

Possibly. But Harlequins are going out on preorder in four days (next week), right? So, if it does come ahead of Harlequins release it's not that much earlier. I personally assume that it will come in the codex, but this is an assumption and not fact.

This month's WD is actually wrong.
Both the Harlequin codex and webway gate should go on preorder on the 19th.
We should get the confirmation on Sunday on the WC website, and teasers of the Harlequin codex every day next week.

fresus wrote:

Unnamed Harlequin wrote:

Tastyfish wrote:
Webway gate features in the regimental standard though, so that might be coming out ahead of the Harlequin release?

Possibly. But Harlequins are going out on preorder in four days (next week), right? So, if it does come ahead of Harlequins release it's not that much earlier. I personally assume that it will come in the codex, but this is an assumption and not fact.

This month's WD is actually wrong.
Both the Harlequin codex and webway gate should go on preorder on the 19th.
We should get the confirmation on Sunday on the WC website, and teasers of the Harlequin codex every say next week.

My apologies, perhaps I should make myself clearer:
What I meant that that WEEK of the preorder is on Monday, and (therefore) it is on preorder on the 19th.

Guyyyyyyyys

IT'S HAPPENING:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/05/13/coming-soon-they-came-from-the-webway/

The WC post doesn't mention previews during the upcoming week. I hope we'll still get daily teasers.

Glad to see there's a nice collector's edition!

fresus wrote:
The WC post doesn't mention previews during the upcoming week. I hope we'll still get daily teasers.

Glad to see there's a nice collector's edition!

i think the post itself it's the 1st preview of the special rules and things in the codex, so i think we'll the teasers this week.

So only lose one to moral and on a 4+ get a single shooting or single close combat attack as it dies (so literally one attack I guess).. ... not blown away by that first masque form, but let's wait and see.
Sadly seems likely nothing new or unusual with this codex like mimes, but fingers crossed over the next few days for some cool rules.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/05/13/coming-soon-they-came-from-the-webway/

yeah, that first masque is extremely underwhelming....definitely a hard pass