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Death Skulls I would like to see some exploding hits on 6s or exploding damage on 6s to wound to represent their better luck. Goff, just a simple +1 to Str. Bad Moons add 1 to shots of shooting weapons (for assault 3 shootaz, assault 2 got blastaz), blood axe outflanking and prevent Overwatch. Evil Suns 2d6 pick highest for advances. Snake bites... I want something a bit more clever than a 6+fnp.

I would be fine with that, but to me the clear winners would be Goffs or Bad Moons (for infantry). Blood axes would be really strong for mechanized lists.

I'd also love to see a rule to where ork shooting can never be modified below a 5+. At the moment that would be required to even hope to play shooty orks or have shooty ork elements in your army due to all the negative to hit modifiers out there.

I havnt played against a army that has a lot of - to hit modifiers, but is it possible to lower it below a 6+? aka you cant hit at all?

 Billagio wrote:
I havnt played against a army that has a lot of - to hit modifiers, but is it possible to lower it below a 6+? aka you cant hit at all?

Then you have never played against half of the marine lists, half of the admech lists,half of the chaos lists, or all of the Aeldari lists. These are all either army wide -1 to hits or feature a great deal of - to hit stratagems or abilities. Yes it is possible to modify a dice roll above 7, but not below one meaning that if an ork loota shot at a unit with a -2 to hit (or a -1 to, but the loota moved) it is literally impossible for the loota to hit it.

gungo wrote:
That’s not what they said at all. What they said was orks were getting a larger release unlike the past few codexs. This is the exact opposite of the webway gate.

The community page said the ork codex will be packed with new content.
And the dev video said they reworked most of the ork units.

No where did they say anything what you quoted.

Were you there? Multiple people who did attend said what I wrote in my previous post. That the later codex releases have tended to have models and the same is likely to be true of Orks. It could be a Knight sized release or a Harlequin sized one.

The community page have said every codex has been "packed with new content".

Don't remember a dev video? Care to post it?

Tyel wrote:
Because currently green tide works reasonably well tournament wise, and laughs at everything else in the codex, and with a half decent chapter tactic it would be even better?

I mean lets imagine Boys became 5 points, Blood Axe Clan rules were -1 to hit outside 12", and there was a vaguely decent set of stratagems with a CP farm warlord trait/artefact.

Its hard not to see how boy spam wouldn't be top tier, and also make the rest of the codex look like a joke.
This is probably the case even leaving Boys at 6 points.

The fix is to make our currently underpowered units as good as Boyz, not to make Boyz worse. I can't see us getting the -1 to hit trait either, it's not for hordes really.

They do have to be careful with how the do the "Chapter Tactics" for orks. Have something that is rather minor for most units can get magnified exponentially when applied to boyz due to volume.

I am worried that even if they make the rest of the codex somewhat decent and dont touch boyz at all except for chapter tactics that boyz spam will still be the go-to list simply because theyre already good and would only be getting better.

On the other hand I dont want to see my boyz nerfed :/

 Billagio wrote:
They do have to be careful with how the do the "Chapter Tactics" for orks. Have something that is rather minor for most units can get magnified exponentially when applied to boyz due to volume.

I am worried that even if they make the rest of the codex somewhat decent and dont touch boyz at all except for chapter tactics that boyz spam will still be the go-to list simply because theyre already good and would only be getting better.

On the other hand I dont want to see my boyz nerfed :/

I agree with this.

Another reason they have to be careful is that a lot of Chapter Tactics fir Clans might look fitting and lore-friendly on the surface, but actually promote playstyles that aren't lore friendly.

For instance, if all Evil Sunz models get an extra inch or two of movement or get to roll 2d6 and pick the highest when advancing, I think we'd see a lot of footslogging Evil Sunz infantry. Maybe they limit it to vehicles, but then do we get a bunch of Evil Sunz dread mobs? Movement bonuses definitely seem in line with the Evil Sunz way of war, but at the same time I think small movement bonuses favor slow units more than units that are already fast.

 Jidmah wrote:
I'd love a Council of da Waaagh! box

I even fielded them once in 7th, it was hilarious.

Me: *deploys battlewagon*
Opponent: "So everything else is left in reserves?"
Me: "No?"

I did this too but the baneblade I fought against deleted the battlewagon and 1200 point formation on turn 1 so yeah I stopped running that.

I know this is a super longshot, but how cool would it be if they brought BoarBoys back? I've missed them since 3rd edition.

 cuda1179 wrote:
I know this is a super longshot, but how cool would it be if they brought BoarBoys back? I've missed them since 3rd edition.

That would be pretty cool. I've got one cyboar head that I was going to use to make a Painboy on bike (boar).

I've got a bunch of old Fantasy boars that I'm not sure what to do with. I was thinking about making bomb squigs out if them (bomb pigs). The old boars look really dated though, so I might just use them as objective markers or in scenery.

This is total head cannon, and not backed up by anything I've read, but I like to think that the boars often associated with feral orks and Snakebites are actually what hair squigs grow into eventually. Orks are a travelling invasive ecosystem, and having a variety of squig that looks like a boar would explain why they are on so many ork worlds.

Similarly, I like to think that many of the poisonous serpents and other venemous critters that the Snakebites use in their rituals are often varieties of squig. This isn't completely unsupported, as IIRC there are images of Zogwort with snake-like squigs. If I ever learn to sculpt I would also like to model some bull-looking squiggoths to explain (in my own mind) the Goff clan symbol.

feth this thread. Eight pages and there isn't gak in here.

 Nightlord1987 wrote:
Blood Axe getting - 1 to hit? From their purposely bad Camouflage patterns? Please Gork no. An Outflanking deployment and No Overwatch seems better fitting.

Agreed. I like Tibs' suggestion of +1 cover, which gives a straight 20% reduction in damage against AP0, vs 20% - 50% with -1 to hit. The latter is an example of GW terrible balance.

I don't want to play the "That Guy" army. Nor do I want everyone to play Blood Axes because they are auto takes vs the other clans.

I like the idea of them counting as being in cover, as long as it isn't dependent on them not moving like it was for the Tyranids and Tau.

 Dakka Flakka Flame wrote:
I agree with this.

Another reason they have to be careful is that a lot of Chapter Tactics fir Clans might look fitting and lore-friendly on the surface, but actually promote playstyles that aren't lore friendly.

For instance, if all Evil Sunz models get an extra inch or two of movement or get to roll 2d6 and pick the highest when advancing, I think we'd see a lot of footslogging Evil Sunz infantry. Maybe they limit it to vehicles, but then do we get a bunch of Evil Sunz dread mobs? Movement bonuses definitely seem in line with the Evil Sunz way of war, but at the same time I think small movement bonuses favor slow units more than units that are already fast.

The simple fix to the Evil Sunz problem you mentioned is to make the bonus different for models with the bike and transport keyword.

GW just need to be intelligent in how they apply the Clan rules.

For Evil Sunz, people always just expect extra movement in some way, I'd rather they have a hit and run type ability, that's what sums up their way of war best to me.

FWIW I think if Orks had got their Codex 9 months ago they would have got -1 to hit, but I agree even GW have twigged this is a ability that is loathed by everyone who doesn't play said factions (and even then...) and so they won't hand it out any more.

I'd be interested to see how a "Orks never suffer negative to hit penalties" rule would play out. Might slightly screw with Eldar especially but they deserve it.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
The simple fix to the Evil Sunz problem you mentioned is to make the bonus different for models with the bike and transport keyword.

GW just need to be intelligent in how they apply the Clan rules.

For Evil Sunz, people always just expect extra movement in some way, I'd rather they have a hit and run type ability, that's what sums up their way of war best to me.

That fix would do it. It leaves a few units like Buggies out in the cold, but there's probably a fix even for that.

My point was, like you said, that GW needs to think the clan bonuses through and not just copy/paste them from previous codexes. When the early codexes were coming out I was worried about that happening, but it seems like the later codexes don't have as much copy)paste and so I'm more optimistic.

I like the idea of hit and run as well. I'd also like to see a Red Goes Gasta type of rule, but that could easily be a stratagem or wargear upgrade. Lastly I'd like to see a bailin' out stratagem kind of like the Trukk Boyz had back in 3rd. Maybe something like it increases the disembarkation range to 6", and during emergency disembarkations re-roll 1s when detrermining if anyone was killed?

ETA: Something else that I'd like to see make a comeback is the old clouds of smoke and dust save that warbikes used to get. It doesn't necessarily need to be a save, and I wouldn't mind if it applied to other fast ork vehicles either.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Tyel wrote:
I'd be interested to see how a "Orks never suffer negative to hit penalties" rule would play out. Might slightly screw with Eldar especially but they deserve it.

I'd like to see both a "6s always hit" rule and have them get rid of all the -1 to hit Chapter Tactics equivalents when they get around to re-doing the early codexes.

 Billagio wrote:
I think the intent of Prime Orks is for them to be Ork Primarch equivalents (Primeork = Primarch, very clever I know), so it would likely be limited to Warboss/Warlord types like Ghazzy.

That being said its GW so anything is possible.

From what I recall, the Orks themselves called these guys the "Primeorks".

Let's reel it back a bit here guys. We're discussing News and Rumours not Wish and Listing

 Tibs Ironblood wrote:
Anyone wanna theorize what the clan tactics will be?

I'm thinking:

Goffs: +1 strength on the charge. Can never lose more than one model to morale.

Evil Sunz: +1 to all form of movement (including charges) or +2 if a vehicle

Snakebites: 6+ FNP, all units may replace a slugga with a choppa. Restricted unit choices from tech based units (like lootas or battlewagons and stuff)

Bad Moonz: One free item for Nobs and characters OR alternatively one free item per unit (same thing as the previous, but better)

Deathskulls: +1 to invuln saves (they are the luckiest)

Blood Axes: Count as being in cover when getting shot.

Freebootaz: +1 shots on all weapon types.

Tactics

Goffs - May choose to only reroll one dice when using Ere we go, instead of being forced to reroll the whole roll.

Evil Suns - When advancing roll 3D6 and take the highest.

Bad Moons - +6" Range if they didn't move that turn.

Deth Skulls - 6+ Invuln on everything. (Maybe +1 if they already have one but that could get a lil OP w/ KFF)

Blood Axes - Count as in cover if they didn't move that turn. Or +1 to cover if they are already there.

Snakebites - 6+ FNP on non-vehicles

Freebootaz - All weapon types change to assault when advancing.


Stratagems

Goffs - 1 unit may fight again in the fight phase.

Evil Suns - 1 unit may charge even if they already advanced that turn.

Bad Moons - Improve the AP by 1 on one unit's shooting attack.

Death Skulls - Reroll all missed rolls to hit of 1 in one unit's shooting attack.

Blood Axes - Functionally the same as Teleportarium but w/ Viet Cong style tunnels for fluff. (Tellyporta would be a universal stratagem but with more limitations)

Snakebites - 1 Unit's melee attacks will wound on a 2+ vs infantry for one fight phase.

Freebootaz - Rokk bombardment, same as marine orbital bombardment.

Tyel wrote:
FWIW I think if Orks had got their Codex 9 months ago they would have got -1 to hit, but I agree even GW have twigged this is a ability that is loathed by everyone who doesn't play said factions (and even then...) and so they won't hand it out any more.

I'd be interested to see how a "Orks never suffer negative to hit penalties" rule would play out. Might slightly screw with Eldar especially but they deserve it.

Or not. No horde army got -1 to hit and orks are def an horde army.

 motyak wrote:
Let's reel it back a bit here guys. We're discussing News and Rumours not Wish and Listing

pfftt.

There's not a single new thing in this thread that's accountable.

I want a Ghaz the size of a grapefruit.

and a Squiggoth.

 matphat wrote:
feth this thread. Eight pages and there isn't gak in here.

Basically why i don't have much faith for the codex. Even the deepkin, gold special marines and AoS 2.0 had some pretty compelling evidence and leaks before they came out.

 lolman1c wrote:


Basically why i don't have much faith for the codex. Even the deepkin, gold special marines and AoS 2.0 had some pretty compelling evidence and leaks before they came out.

Maybe because they aren't coming out any time soon? Leaks rarely happen more than a few weeks in advance nowadays. Space Wolves are more than likely the next 40K army and we haven't heard anything about them either.

Caederes wrote:

 lolman1c wrote:


Basically why i don't have much faith for the codex. Even the deepkin, gold special marines and AoS 2.0 had some pretty compelling evidence and leaks before they came out.

Maybe because they aren't coming out any time soon? Leaks rarely happen more than a few weeks in advance nowadays. Space Wolves are more than likely the next 40K army and we haven't heard anything about them either.

Still no reason to have 8 pages of "educated guesses" and call it news.

 Fayric wrote:

Caederes wrote:

 lolman1c wrote:


Basically why i don't have much faith for the codex. Even the deepkin, gold special marines and AoS 2.0 had some pretty compelling evidence and leaks before they came out.

Maybe because they aren't coming out any time soon? Leaks rarely happen more than a few weeks in advance nowadays. Space Wolves are more than likely the next 40K army and we haven't heard anything about them either.

Still no reason to have 8 pages of "educated guesses" and call it news.

You must have missed the very first post. Y'know - the one with the actual rumours.

It's almost like the rest of the discussion had gone from there, crazy.

I find the mod comment utterly bizarre given how many other threads they allow to run completely off topic and often toxic before they bother to get involved.

Outside of 'I think the rumour in the OP is legit' or 'I think the rumour in the OP is bs' I'm not sure what other discussion they're expecting. The single sisters model discussion spawned countless pages of wishlisting but that was ok? Strange.

tneva82 wrote:

Tyel wrote:
FWIW I think if Orks had got their Codex 9 months ago they would have got -1 to hit, but I agree even GW have twigged this is a ability that is loathed by everyone who doesn't play said factions (and even then...) and so they won't hand it out any more.

I'd be interested to see how a "Orks never suffer negative to hit penalties" rule would play out. Might slightly screw with Eldar especially but they deserve it.

Or not. No horde army got -1 to hit and orks are def an horde army.

This is getting played as a trump card but I dont see it. A Stygies Ad Mech force tends to be horde like, even if it doesnt have 120 rangers. I am hoping Ork lists wont all be 50%+ boys.

The gave -1 to hit to allaitoc and realized it's a bad idea in general to hand out -1 to hit as an army trait. No further reasoning involved. A codices before that (ad mech, CSM, SM) were not taking into account player feedback, since they were already being printed when 8th was released.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:

 Fayric wrote:

Caederes wrote:

 lolman1c wrote:


Basically why i don't have much faith for the codex. Even the deepkin, gold special marines and AoS 2.0 had some pretty compelling evidence and leaks before they came out.

Maybe because they aren't coming out any time soon? Leaks rarely happen more than a few weeks in advance nowadays. Space Wolves are more than likely the next 40K army and we haven't heard anything about them either.

Still no reason to have 8 pages of "educated guesses" and call it news.

You must have missed the very first post. Y'know - the one with the actual rumours.

It's almost like the rest of the discussion had gone from there, crazy.

I find the mod comment utterly bizarre given how many other threads they allow to run completely off topic and often toxic before they bother to get involved.

Outside of 'I think the rumour in the OP is legit' or 'I think the rumour in the OP is bs' I'm not sure what other discussion they're expecting. The single sisters model discussion spawned countless pages of wishlisting but that was ok? Strange.

Meh.... i've tried my best to keep this to rumours and trying to show how these rumours are BS... done a bit of wishlist here and there but yeah... the fatc there is nothing for SW or Orks means people are gunu wish list because we think they're keeoing it a secret. Reminds me of Half Life 3 and how like 5 years ago we used to think they were going to announce it. So much BS rumours from official leaks.. blah blah... really taught me a valuable lesson. Hope for nothing.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
ALSO the guy who made that warboss model also made this so don't be fooled if you see this going about. it kinda sees some trolls are trying to show how rumours can easily be started from BS. (it's funny how a fan can somehow make a better looking model than anything GW has come up with... if this was an official model (it's not and never will be) I would be super happy! A squig grot army would be awesome!)

This thread exploded into 8 pages. Color me disappointed about no new info.