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 Nightlord1987 wrote:
Hmm, well, that kinda steps on Kommandos toes so it seems strange that you'd be able to Infiltrate regular boyz even for a Blood Axe army.

That is why I think it was probably a stratagem costing CP so Kommandos would still have a use by saving the CP cost. However, being a horde army means Orks have plenty of access to CPs, so that would explain why they were able to do it to entire armies. Something like that definitely should have a unit maximum like some of the other similar stratagems already out there in order to avoid such

I can see why say 3 infiltrated units of Boyz, plus Kommandos and some potentially buffed Stormboyz (plus Da Jump) would be quite broken.

Enjoy 200~ Orks making relatively easy charges in turn 1.

Tyel wrote:
I can see why say 3 infiltrated units of Boyz, plus Kommandos and some potentially buffed Stormboyz (plus Da Jump) would be quite broken.

Enjoy 200~ Orks making relatively easy charges in turn 1.

Again, competitiveness could damage orks... XD but I geuss it's their job to find broken tactics...if this was in the game on launch then 1 dude would do it and the whole community would freak out about how orks are OP and orks would be nerfed into oblivion never to be touched again. Like Ig... tournaments players use soup and call it IG and suddenly everyone claims billy at the local club who has a fluffy cadian only force is OP and need sa nerf.

So when an Impeeial unit is deemed OP, the usual response is "Just wait for an FAQ/Chapter Approved.

Also, Infiltrating a whole army is already GSC territory m, but they're a new army with new kits so they're gonna get the best rules.

I just played against a DW army, where a single aggressor in with Intercessors ripped through 30 boyz per turn, and he only brought 2! Then when I'm finally in range to charge, he pops the Stratagem to completely neuter the charge. My opponent felt so bad, he let me bring units back on the board. People keep saying Orks can't deal with knights, but a 30 pt Aggressor is more than enough trouble for us.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
Edit: just discovered my opponent was playing autostorm gauntlets wrong, giving then 24 shots when stationary.

Stygies VIII has a a deep strike stratagem that can be used over and over (of course at least half the army has to be on the board at the start of the game, so there is a limit). It's true that orks have more good choppy units than AdMech, but AdMech has some good close range shooting.

I can see it being too powerful with orks against certain armies, so it might make sense to make it a more limited stratagem like Tallarn or Eldar get.

I watched a video of Krogskulls Boyz kill team unboxing/review by Too Many Metal Men (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Dv0kQpa7FY) because I wanted to see what the unique Ork kill team stratagems are, because GW thought it was a good idea not to include everything in the big rule book.

Anyways, in the comment section of the video the creator states: I've been told by someone at HQ to expect new, bigger boyz, more like Ironjawz, along with more vehicles. Basically the Ork range is getting a substantial update as some of it is pretty old.

Obviously this is just a rumour and I have no connection to this youtube channel whatsoever, is his stuff reliable? Does anybody know? I could sure use some good news on the ork front right about now

 Dakka Flakka Flame wrote:
Stygies VIII has a a deep strike stratagem that can be used over and over (of course at least half the army has to be on the board at the start of the game, so there is a limit). It's true that orks have more good choppy units than AdMech, but AdMech has some good close range shooting.

I can see it being too powerful with orks against certain armies, so it might make sense to make it a more limited stratagem like Tallarn or Eldar get.

I think the Tallarn one lets you put 3 units in reserve (for 3 CP), so its limited and not at the same time.


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PiñaColada wrote:
I watched a video of Krogskulls Boyz kill team unboxing/review by Too Many Metal Men (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Dv0kQpa7FY) because I wanted to see what the unique Ork kill team stratagems are, because GW thought it was a good idea not to include everything in the big rule book.

Anyways, in the comment section of the video the creator states: I've been told by someone at HQ to expect new, bigger boyz, more like Ironjawz, along with more vehicles. Basically the Ork range is getting a substantial update as some of it is pretty old.

Obviously this is just a rumour and I have no connection to this youtube channel whatsoever, is his stuff reliable? Does anybody know? I could sure use some good news on the ork front right about now

I dont know how reliable he is, but im hoping that hes right. I dont know how I feel abot bigger boys but bigger and updated nob models would be nice imo. This isnt the first time we have heard rumors of orks getting a revamped line, im wondering if there is some validity to it or if its just people parroting the same rumor. Also, they way he talks about it sounds like its going to happen "later in the year". That sounds like either the codex is still a few months out or there will be a re release of some of our model line separate from the codex release

Anything that makes me feel like I wasted my money on all my boyz I dislike. I know people tell me that I can still use them but you gotta admit it would hurt you a little if GW brought out a new line that will (over the next 10 years) completely replace the old stuff until it's like you're bringing rogue trader models and everyone in the store looks at you funny (this happens to make when I brought my older models. XD ).

Unless, that is, the new models look like Orks! I mean real Orks! Orks I'd want to own! I fear GW will make them more rounded like Orcs rather than keep their rugged tecky boxy shape. Anyway, if you wanna go into that argument in depth just look about 10 pages back.

 Nightlord1987 wrote:
So when an Impeeial unit is deemed OP, the usual response is "Just wait for an FAQ/Chapter Approved.

Also, Infiltrating a whole army is already GSC territory m, but they're a new army with new kits so they're gonna get the best rules.

I just played against a DW army, where a single aggressor in with Intercessors ripped through 30 boyz per turn, and he only brought 2! Then when I'm finally in range to charge, he pops the Stratagem to completely neuter the charge. My opponent felt so bad, he let me bring units back on the board. People keep saying Orks can't deal with knights, but a 30 pt Aggressor is more than enough trouble for us.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
Edit: just discovered my opponent was playing autostorm gauntlets wrong, giving then 24 shots when stationary.

ok first off, agressors are just a hard counter for melee hoards. by and large they're not considered that great, they just happen to hard counter the "wall o' Boyz"

moving on, just because play testers (incidently I find it doubtful they're still play testing Orks now, assuming even an October release play testing would be done by now) subject something as a issue doesn't mean it'll be fixed. Sometimes a play tester will bring some data back and say "we don't like this because of XYZ" and the devs response will be "yeah but thats ok we're gonna not make the changes because of ABC"

I mean every army has gone through it for the most part, getting updated models is not a bad thing. I’d argue few people will want to play an army that never gets updated models, especially when all the other armies get new sculpts from time to time.

I do agree that I dont want to buy 200 new models, but unless the new ones are AMAZING I wouldnt anyway ill just keep using my old boys. Tbh I probably wouldnt have 200 boys in the first place if it wasnt for AOBR

 Billagio wrote:
I mean every army has gone through it for the most part, getting updated models is not a bad thing. I’d argue few people will want to play an army that never gets updated models, especially when all the other armies get new sculpts from time to time.

I do agree that I dont want to buy 200 new models, but unless the new ones are AMAZING I wouldnt anyway ill just keep using my old boys. Tbh I probably wouldnt have 200 boys in the first place if it wasnt for AOBR

Luckly you won't have to, GW's ALWAYS maintained a "you can use your old stuff" philophosy. that said people tend to slowly shift to new because the new looks so much better

BrianDavion wrote:

 Billagio wrote:
I mean every army has gone through it for the most part, getting updated models is not a bad thing. I’d argue few people will want to play an army that never gets updated models, especially when all the other armies get new sculpts from time to time.

I do agree that I dont want to buy 200 new models, but unless the new ones are AMAZING I wouldnt anyway ill just keep using my old boys. Tbh I probably wouldnt have 200 boys in the first place if it wasnt for AOBR

Luckly you won't have to, GW's ALWAYS maintained a "you can use your old stuff" philophosy. that said people tend to slowly shift to new because the new looks so much better

Oh for sure, I was just pointing out to lolman that getting new models is almost never a bad thing, if anything its something every army needs

 Billagio wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:

 Billagio wrote:
I mean every army has gone through it for the most part, getting updated models is not a bad thing. I’d argue few people will want to play an army that never gets updated models, especially when all the other armies get new sculpts from time to time.

I do agree that I dont want to buy 200 new models, but unless the new ones are AMAZING I wouldnt anyway ill just keep using my old boys. Tbh I probably wouldnt have 200 boys in the first place if it wasnt for AOBR

Luckly you won't have to, GW's ALWAYS maintained a "you can use your old stuff" philophosy. that said people tend to slowly shift to new because the new looks so much better

Oh for sure, I was just pointing out to lolman that getting new models is almost never a bad thing, if anything its something every army needs

yup meanwhile there's little if any downside to boot.

Kdash wrote:
Ok, so, i have a bit of news that i haven't seen mentioned anywhere in this thread yet.

Bear in mind this comes from groups of players that contain known play testers and i don't know how "recent" this is or not.

Essentially, i was at an event last weekend, and there were quiet chats about the Ork codex going on.

From what was said, there have been a few issues with the codex and the play testers have kicked it back to GW to be fixed.

Now, i'm not sure whether this will require a complete re-write, but, a significant part of it needs to change from what i believe.

Essentially, the codex is said to be perfect for open play and narrative player, however, it is a hot broken pile of "REALLY?!?" when it comes to matched play.

The biggest issue, was that Orks were able to infiltrate EVERYTHING. I'm not sure whether this was in the deployment phase or turn 1, but, essentially to cut a long story short, the play testers realised that having 2000 points worth of orks all within 9" of your opponents army turn 1 might be a little bit of an issue.

I'm not sure what the other issues are/were, if there were actually any, nor do i know what the impact on release the kick back will have - but i think it is 100% worth to get the info out there that there has been a delay because GW went from codex creep to codex creep with half a dozen space rockets strapped to the back.

No idea in regards to SW and GSC though.

I'm just gonna drop the same response I posted in the other thread to this post here;

Sounds like bs to me.

A few things to consider -

1. I don't think GW have ever made Orks broken good.
2. I can't see the playtesters having such an impact on release schedules.
3. Many other codexes have released with totally broken things that were not fixed prior to release.
4. I could not imagine any circumstance where GW allowed an entire Ork army to infiltrate/deep strike/forward deploy turn one. It would render certain units completely useless and redundant.
5. Its not really an Orkish thing, much more GSC.

This feels to me like some hard trolling. 'Orks were strong but are preemptively nerfed lol', doesn't sound legit at all.

It will become an urban legend shared amongst the Skar-boyz and the Yoofs. Da Greatest Kodex (almost) eva written by Gork (or possibly Mork) 'Imself! A book so powerful, forces from outside the known universe had to alter history completely in ways only an Eldar can dream of!

Beings known as "The Testers". And they scared of the Orkzes. They know we will crump Da Universe flat!


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You know what I would really like to see?

Orks get the Made to Order treatment for somne of the metal Grots from Gorkamorka! I would totally buy in on some AK wielding gretchin.

I could see them at least re-boxing our kits, which would make sense with all the "last chance to buy" ork kits we are seeing. Most of them are still with the yellow/warzone background and theyre trying to move everything over to the uniform blue background. Good opportunity to get new sculpts, but doesnt necessarily mean that.

https://www.facebook.com/1575682476085719/photos/a.1576243776029589.1073741828.1575682476085719/1905700039750626/?type=3&theater

been noticing this guy on the main post on the 40k facebook page (jerome swensen). hes been posting everyday for about a week asking if there's going to be any ork related news coming up. so far has only gotten a single non answer from the facebook guys (said he would keep posting until gw posts an article or something).(if you want to look at all of the the guys posts youll have to make sure the facebook comments are set to "new" and then you can see his comments going back about a week).

so, what you guys think? is it worth hounding the Facebook guys with constant questions? would it be worth while for us to try joining in?

personally im not sure of what to think of this. this is on the facebook page so no telling if these questions will ever be relayed to GW proper, but its much more public and easier for the community to see there are many who are wanting to know about the greenskinz. in the past many here on dakka dakka have said to "email GW" or something like that, maybe instead of emails that can easily be mass trashed we can try flooding the main facebook post with our detest of "why no ork news" (of course if we do this it would be best to be civil). who knows, maybe gw might cave in and say something.

I've got mixed feelings. While I think that GW has messed up with their complete silence on what's coming for orks, I also don't know if a campaign of annoying them is a good thing to do. I wouldn't feel bad for them (maybe a little bit for the people stuck with managing the Facebook page) if that's what they wound up with, as I think they've brought it on themselves, but I also don't think I'd participate or encourage it.

If people keep things good-natured and funny that's cool. If it's a bunch of angry shouting then it's not so cool and probably counter-productive.

I think pushing too hard could definatly be counter productive, the best thing to do is not ask questions but to simply talk passionatly. link pics of armies etc and demonstrate a passion. you want if word does get back to the GW brass from their facebook folks for the word to be "Man Ork players are awesome, they have such a passion and love for the game, so many of their conversions are imaginative" etc. not "ohh god Orks.. their players are such a whiny and entiled group of children"

I don't play Orks but I LOOOVE the people who do because their conversions are awesome. Orks are IMHO the best conversion artists in 40k, (chaos is the only faction that comes close)
If Ork players wanna REAAALY show their love for Orks on Facebook? a campaign to show off your favorite "Kuztom Orked up Konversion" would proably be a great idea.

BrianDavion wrote:
I think pushing too hard could definatly be counter productive, the best thing to do is not ask questions but to simply talk passionatly. link pics of armies etc and demonstrate a passion. you want if word does get back to the GW brass from their facebook folks for the word to be "Man Ork players are awesome, they have such a passion and love for the game, so many of their conversions are imaginative" etc. not "ohh god Orks.. their players are such a whiny and entiled group of children"

I don't play Orks but I LOOOVE the people who do because their conversions are awesome. Orks are IMHO the best conversion artists in 40k, (chaos is the only faction that comes close)
If Ork players wanna REAAALY show their love for Orks on Facebook? a campaign to show off your favorite "Kuztom Orked up Konversion" would proably be a great idea.

Why would it be counter productive? Let's look at the evidence for a second;

1. Players complain that a certain aspect of the game is "broken" or not performing as intended in competitive play (Flyrants, Commanders, Conscripts, Storm Talons etc). GW fix it by implementing or changing rules.
2. Sororitas players (and another large section of the community) complain that their models are old and too expensive. GW state they're going to re-do the entire line and release it next year.
3. GW is a business and we are it's customers.

We have already talked passionately, linked pics of armies and conversions etc. We've already been positive and hopeful for the future and we have posted this all over social media. Go back and take a look at posts from Ork players at the start of 8th. Unfortunately GW has taken a massive dump all over that positivity and hope by their actions. Our excitement has turned to bitterness and disappointment. Many Ork players are literally 'taking a break' from the game or selling their miniatures to switch armies. This isn't only because of recent treatment either, this is due to years and years and years of the same repeated, shafting of the Ork community by GW. The latest in this long line of awful treatment is announcing a codex 2 months ago (while simultaneously bragging how many they had released so quickly) then releasing a ton of other games and giving absolutely no information. Any player of any faction would be pissed off in the same circumstance.

If anything your idea is counter-productive because GW thinks; "Ork players will always play Orks, regardless of how gak we treat them", which is obviously not true. They need to be shown this is not true and told this is not true or they will keep treating the community as if it is. Telling GW that as customers we are pissed off at the constant bs treatment is the better alternative which for many is to leave the faction or leave the hobby altogether.

It is common for GW to release products 3-4 months after they were first teased. The Necromunda stuff is the textbook examples.

I don't think it is weird that the Ork and SW codices were announced about that far in advance. It is the other codices that were unusual.

However, it is odd that we have heard nothing else since. Typically there are a few snippets to remind people this product previewed a month ago still exists. I am wondering what we will see in August.

 Haighus wrote:

However, it is odd that we have heard nothing else since. Typically there are a few snippets to remind people this product previewed a month ago still exists. I am wondering what we will see in August.

we arent really complaining about how long it will take the codex to come out after it was announced, we are mostly complaining of the lack of any "hype" articles.

im gonna make a wild prediction. warhammer fest happens, there will be cool pics/previews/videos of new boxed games, more specialist games will be announced, new aos stuff will be announced (including more stormcast models), fw will yet again try to justify their existence with previews of ...drum roll....space marine stuff. then somewhere stuck in between all that new stuff a guy will simply say "ork and SW coming soon" and then the fest will be over.
im predicting absolutely nothing form warhammer fest. and maybe with such a bold claim i can be pleasantly proven wrong.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:
I think pushing too hard could definatly be counter productive, the best thing to do is not ask questions but to simply talk passionatly. link pics of armies etc and demonstrate a passion. you want if word does get back to the GW brass from their facebook folks for the word to be "Man Ork players are awesome, they have such a passion and love for the game, so many of their conversions are imaginative" etc. not "ohh god Orks.. their players are such a whiny and entiled group of children"

I don't play Orks but I LOOOVE the people who do because their conversions are awesome. Orks are IMHO the best conversion artists in 40k, (chaos is the only faction that comes close)
If Ork players wanna REAAALY show their love for Orks on Facebook? a campaign to show off your favorite "Kuztom Orked up Konversion" would proably be a great idea.

Why would it be counter productive? Let's look at the evidence for a second;

1. Players complain that a certain aspect of the game is "broken" or not performing as intended in competitive play (Flyrants, Commanders, Conscripts, Storm Talons etc). GW fix it by implementing or changing rules.
2. Sororitas players (and another large section of the community) complain that their models are old and too expensive. GW state they're going to re-do the entire line and release it next year.
3. GW is a business and we are it's customers.

We have already talked passionately, linked pics of armies and conversions etc. We've already been positive and hopeful for the future and we have posted this all over social media. Go back and take a look at posts from Ork players at the start of 8th. Unfortunately GW has taken a massive dump all over that positivity and hope by their actions. Our excitement has turned to bitterness and disappointment. Many Ork players are literally 'taking a break' from the game or selling their miniatures to switch armies. This isn't only because of recent treatment either, this is due to years and years and years of the same repeated, shafting of the Ork community by GW. The latest in this long line of awful treatment is announcing a codex 2 months ago (while simultaneously bragging how many they had released so quickly) then releasing a ton of other games and giving absolutely no information. Any player of any faction would be pissed off in the same circumstance.

If anything your idea is counter-productive because GW thinks; "Ork players will always play Orks, regardless of how gak we treat them", which is obviously not true. They need to be shown this is not true and told this is not true or they will keep treating the community as if it is. Telling GW that as customers we are pissed off at the constant bs treatment is the better alternative which for many is to leave the faction or leave the hobby altogether.

would you rather you got a codex around the time of codex space marines and got an uninspired so so codex?

BrianDavion wrote:


would you rather you got a codex around the time of codex space marines and got an uninspired so so codex?

your right, we ork players have nothing to complain about. we should all be thankfull that gw even remembered they still sold ork models. we just take we are given (or not given).

now all serious.
yeah, true enough if we did get our codex at the beggining of the edition it would most likely bland like the spezmahreen codex, but gw has shown they know how to market their product and how to hype the players for their upcoming codexs. all this they have conveniently stopped doing as soon as they announced ours.....we should be worried.

So you people are now crying for quick, low quality codex instead of GW taking their time to do it properly?

Have you gone mad?

BrianDavion wrote:
would you rather you got a codex around the time of codex space marines and got an uninspired so so codex?

A - Please don't bring Space Marine players' tears into this thread, it's entirely off topic.
B - The release date of codex has absolutely no bearing on how inspired (or not) a codex is.

I'd rather have a codex perhaps around the time of Death Guard, Craftworld, or Tyranid, that are far, FAR earlier than ours and are incredibly rewarding to play with.

 Jidmah wrote:
So you people are now crying for quick, low quality codex instead of GW taking their time to do it properly?

Have you gone mad?

See point B above. No one is asking for a 'quick, low quality codex'. Poor argument is poor. Have you already forgotten the amount of time it took GW to do other codexes in past editions that were absolute garbage?

 Jidmah wrote:
So you people are now crying for quick, low quality codex instead of GW taking their time to do it properly?

Have you gone mad?

In the grand scheme of things it's probably good to be one of the later codices (assuming they don't jump to 9th in q1 2019, which I doubt). What's annoying to me, and several others as I've understood it, is the total radio silence on Orks since they said SW & Orks are up next. A general timeframe or some tease would go a long way to appease the fans..

If they were going to release a decent range of Ork models there is no real reason not to show them. I am therefore very cynical on a significant re-vamp unless you are moving into 2019.

I know GW have always been concerned about "if we show future plastic crack, people won't buy the current plastic crack" but the record performance would indicate being more open, and therefore generating hype, is the way to go.

Also I am not convinced it takes time to issue a "high quality codex". Have a few solid chapter tactics, stratagems, warlord traits etc, dramatically reduce the cost of almost all shooting units (maybe not KMKs) and increase their damage output where points reductions don't help (see Burnas) and there you go.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:

B - The release date of codex has absolutely no bearing on how inspired (or not) a codex is.

You really believe that our 7th edition codex would have been just as poor if it had come nearer the end of 7th?
I

 warhead01 wrote:

 An Actual Englishman wrote:

B - The release date of codex has absolutely no bearing on how inspired (or not) a codex is.

You really believe that our 7th edition codex would have been just as poor if it had come nearer the end of 7th?
I

Because the Ghazghkull supplement was so great? Yes I do.