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Castellan knight needs to increase in points, stompa needs to decrease, and all titans need to return to their original points and/or get better designed rules.

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Castellan knight needs to increase in points, stompa needs to decrease, and all titans need to return to their original points and/or get better designed rules.

Gotta disagree on Castellan. Have you tried fighting one without Cawl's Wrath, re-roll 1's strat and an innate 4++? It actually feels kinda weak. It's the relic/strat/Warlord Trait that's a problem, not the actual datasheet.

With a rumored new Keeper of Secrets coming I'm hoping to see a points drop with the greater demons. Such nice models yet they hardly see a competitive table. I would love to get mine out of the display case and into a tourney but that's not gonna happen at their current points and rules.

Decrease in cost for terminators?

That sure would be nice!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 bullyboy wrote:
Honestly, the things I'm really wanting to know any changes about are...

Wraithknight
Corvus Blackstar
Dreadnoughts
harlequin neuro disruptor
Haywire (harlequin)
Ravenwing bike/speeder changes

Wraith Knight are way too expensive

Along with Wraith Lords and Wraith Guard being generally overcosted or having little to no saves against ap -.

Though that is general theme with most heavy infantry.

Yeah my ideal wish list for tons would be:

-pts drop for rubric, scarab, exalted sorc, predator, vindicator, helbrute, heldrake, forgefiend, land raider (sounds like that's happening so yay)

-Nerf ahriman DP shaman and enlightened with spears

-pts drop for screamers flamers and lords of change

There is a perfectly functional book I'm tsons screaming to get out of the hell of hero hammer it's trapped in.

Audustum wrote:

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Castellan knight needs to increase in points, stompa needs to decrease, and all titans need to return to their original points and/or get better designed rules.

Gotta disagree on Castellan. Have you tried fighting one without Cawl's Wrath, re-roll 1's strat and an innate 4++? It actually feels kinda weak. It's the relic/strat/Warlord Trait that's a problem, not the actual datasheet.

This mostly proves the point Relics aren't something that should've ever been free. That's purely bad design.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Audustum wrote:

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Castellan knight needs to increase in points, stompa needs to decrease, and all titans need to return to their original points and/or get better designed rules.

Gotta disagree on Castellan. Have you tried fighting one without Cawl's Wrath, re-roll 1's strat and an innate 4++? It actually feels kinda weak. It's the relic/strat/Warlord Trait that's a problem, not the actual datasheet.

This mostly proves the point Relics aren't something that should've ever been free. That's purely bad design.

Not really, it just needs a competent team to understand that some combos are just too good and shouldn't be included. For example, a warlord trait for +1 Invuln on say a harlequin warlord (since Sol can't take trait, no way to get 2++) would not be the same as +1 invuln on knight. You just have to know that.

the_scotsman wrote:
Yeah my ideal wish list for tons would be:

-pts drop for rubric, scarab, exalted sorc, predator, vindicator, helbrute, heldrake, forgefiend, land raider (sounds like that's happening so yay)

-Nerf ahriman DP shaman and enlightened with spears

-pts drop for screamers flamers and lords of change

There is a perfectly functional book I'm tsons screaming to get out of the hell of hero hammer it's trapped in.

Really enlightened with spears? I have them and they are not worth what TS pay now and don’t need a nerf. I wish I was in your meta cause they die to a stiff breeze if your opponent targets them with anything

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Audustum wrote:

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Castellan knight needs to increase in points, stompa needs to decrease, and all titans need to return to their original points and/or get better designed rules.

Gotta disagree on Castellan. Have you tried fighting one without Cawl's Wrath, re-roll 1's strat and an innate 4++? It actually feels kinda weak. It's the relic/strat/Warlord Trait that's a problem, not the actual datasheet.

This mostly proves the point Relics aren't something that should've ever been free. That's purely bad design.

Yeah, who would have tought that one model vs the same model but with +1S and +1D in his weapon, reroll 1's and 4++ for the same cost would bee much more powerfull...

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Castellan knight needs to increase in points, stompa needs to decrease, and all titans need to return to their original points and/or get better designed rules.

(Added emphasis to quote.)

I wouldn't be expecting any changes to Codex Ork units, given the book only came out a week or two ago - which should be after CA2018 was locked down for print.

The changes I would love to see (being a Deathwatch and Tau player)

Corvus dropped by about 20 points and to gain access to POTMS which would make it awesome again, shortly more unrealistic wish is for it to be able to carry primaris, stormraven should be able to as well.

Combi meltas to drop in points for Deathwatch vets, they are ludicrously expensive.

Battle suit weapons to be decreased in cost slightly and to be cost less in general as a suit of 3 bare bones suits with flamers costs 207 points!! Absolutely nuts costing there.

Just POTMS would do the job, imo.

What we really need for Land Raiders is for assault ramps to come back. And for marines to have any good melee units to put in them.

 Drudge Dreadnought wrote:
What we really need for Land Raiders is for assault ramps to come back. And for marines to have any good melee units to put in them.

Wulfen 8^)

I don't know why trukks don't have assualt ramps seen as they're modelled with then.

Because it’s not a mechanic they want in 8th, seemingly. Old rule from old ruleset not being in new ruleset is a choice the designers made.

 JohnnyHell wrote:
Because it’s not a mechanic they want in 8th, seemingly. Old rule from old ruleset not being in new ruleset is a choice the designers made.

It was a bad choice. They took away the rules that made landraiders and terminators viable, and now nobody uses them. Same with...75% of other marine units. I'm amazed they aren't doing anything due to greed alone. Marines aren't selling anywhere near what they could be.

Landraiders dropping to <300pts is interesting. They benefit from beta DS rules too, stoppin them being tied up in cc so easily. They still suffer from being Castallan piñatas, but prepared positions make them 4+ against lascannons on T1. There's some hope for them yet imo.

 Galas wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Audustum wrote:

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Castellan knight needs to increase in points, stompa needs to decrease, and all titans need to return to their original points and/or get better designed rules.

Gotta disagree on Castellan. Have you tried fighting one without Cawl's Wrath, re-roll 1's strat and an innate 4++? It actually feels kinda weak. It's the relic/strat/Warlord Trait that's a problem, not the actual datasheet.

This mostly proves the point Relics aren't something that should've ever been free. That's purely bad design.

Yeah, who would have tought that one model vs the same model but with +1S and +1D in his weapon, reroll 1's and 4++ for the same cost would bee much more powerfull...

Indeed. Anyone who thinks relics are balanced when some are blatantly far more powerful/useful than others, and are ok with them being free are obviously using one of the armies with better relics and not not as interested in a balanced game.


"Well, my army's fine...…"

 xeen wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:
Yeah my ideal wish list for tons would be:

-pts drop for rubric, scarab, exalted sorc, predator, vindicator, helbrute, heldrake, forgefiend, land raider (sounds like that's happening so yay)

-Nerf ahriman DP shaman and enlightened with spears

-pts drop for screamers flamers and lords of change

There is a perfectly functional book I'm tsons screaming to get out of the hell of hero hammer it's trapped in.

Really enlightened with spears? I have them and they are not worth what TS pay now and don’t need a nerf. I wish I was in your meta cause they die to a stiff breeze if your opponent targets them with anything

Rumormill has it that 1k sons is getting a smite nerf of some sort, while GK are getting a smite buff of some sort. My thoughts are they are going to make both armies smite work differently from the norm, but still always succeed on a 5+... then maybe allow them the ability to cast psychic powers a second time? Maybe change the spells to have differing effects, ala Eldar? A common complaint from GK players at least is limited spell selection for an army where everyone can cast spells.

Slagmar wrote:
With a rumored new Keeper of Secrets coming I'm hoping to see a points drop with the greater demons. Such nice models yet they hardly see a competitive table. I would love to get mine out of the display case and into a tourney but that's not gonna happen at their current points and rules.

Agreed.
Each greater daemon probably needs at least a 50 point drop if not more.

 Drudge Dreadnought wrote:

 JohnnyHell wrote:
Because it’s not a mechanic they want in 8th, seemingly. Old rule from old ruleset not being in new ruleset is a choice the designers made.

It was a bad choice. They took away the rules that made landraiders and terminators viable, and now nobody uses them. Same with...75% of other marine units. I'm amazed they aren't doing anything due to greed alone. Marines aren't selling anywhere near what they could be.

Uh Land Raiders weren't ever viable in the first place, and honestly this is the first edition I've seen where Terminators were even remotely durable.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 bullyboy wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Audustum wrote:

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Castellan knight needs to increase in points, stompa needs to decrease, and all titans need to return to their original points and/or get better designed rules.

Gotta disagree on Castellan. Have you tried fighting one without Cawl's Wrath, re-roll 1's strat and an innate 4++? It actually feels kinda weak. It's the relic/strat/Warlord Trait that's a problem, not the actual datasheet.

This mostly proves the point Relics aren't something that should've ever been free. That's purely bad design.

Not really, it just needs a competent team to understand that some combos are just too good and shouldn't be included. For example, a warlord trait for +1 Invuln on say a harlequin warlord (since Sol can't take trait, no way to get 2++) would not be the same as +1 invuln on knight. You just have to know that.

That's an issue with the team throwing as many different Households as they could in the codex. If you have that many things to balance, you'll never be done. That's why Super Smash Brothers is always one of the worst balanced fighting games (and this new one will be even worse). Too many options IS a bad thing sometimes.

Knights can have a +1 Invul trait and that's okay. They don't get that in melee after all. This IS your Warlord and he's expensive after all, but some people DO go for more offensive Warlors traits. This is something that can be balanced. However, Relics being done this same way is garbage, as there are too many variations between weapons and other items. When the Aquila and the Ollanius mask are both the same cost, which one do you go for?

 dan2026 wrote:

Slagmar wrote:
With a rumored new Keeper of Secrets coming I'm hoping to see a points drop with the greater demons. Such nice models yet they hardly see a competitive table. I would love to get mine out of the display case and into a tourney but that's not gonna happen at their current points and rules.

Agreed.
Each greater daemon probably needs at least a 50 point drop if not more.

Doubly agreed. I wanna run a Great Unclean one and feel like I'm not gimping myself on purpose, lol

 Zid wrote:

 xeen wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:
Yeah my ideal wish list for tons would be:

-pts drop for rubric, scarab, exalted sorc, predator, vindicator, helbrute, heldrake, forgefiend, land raider (sounds like that's happening so yay)

-Nerf ahriman DP shaman and enlightened with spears

-pts drop for screamers flamers and lords of change

There is a perfectly functional book I'm tsons screaming to get out of the hell of hero hammer it's trapped in.

Really enlightened with spears? I have them and they are not worth what TS pay now and don’t need a nerf. I wish I was in your meta cause they die to a stiff breeze if your opponent targets them with anything

Rumormill has it that 1k sons is getting a smite nerf of some sort, while GK are getting a smite buff of some sort. My thoughts are they are going to make both armies smite work differently from the norm, but still always succeed on a 5+... then maybe allow them the ability to cast psychic powers a second time? Maybe change the spells to have differing effects, ala Eldar? A common complaint from GK players at least is limited spell selection for an army where everyone can cast spells.

Insta - popping and removing an average of 100 points of models on a 2 or 12 on a psychic test wasn't enough of a smite nerf lol?

I really hope they don't shaft the whole army because dps ahriman and shamans are broken.

 Inquisitor Kallus wrote:
Indeed. Anyone who thinks relics are balanced when some are blatantly far more powerful/useful than others, and are ok with them being free are obviously using one of the armies with better relics and not not as interested in a balanced game.

"Well, my army's fine...…"

I don't think anyone thinks they are balanced - but I'd still be suspect on applying points (because its just another method of producing good/situational/trash never take this).

What I'd like is GW to make a small pool of relics which are all worth roughly the same amount of points (say 25-30) on top of whatever gear you need to buy to unlock the option.

Its obviously stupid though when some relics are clearly worth 50~ points, and others might be worth about 5 - or less.

No Chapter Approved Preorder next weekend. Looks like that December 15 Release Date is looking more likely than not.

Now at least another week before GW starts releasing previews

I'm just wondering with the rumoured character changes in points etc then seeing Abaddon with no change at all thinking are black legion getting a book cos why change abaddon now only to change him again early 2019....

 Motograter wrote:
I'm just wondering with the rumoured character changes in points etc then seeing Abaddon with no change at all thinking are black legion getting a book cos why change abaddon now only to change him again early 2019....

The chances of getting a Black Legion codex is practically zero. You're more likely to get an Ultramarines codex before you get a Black Legion one. Not sure where this idea keeps coming from. If anything, the next Chaos codex releases will be Emperors Children and World Eaters - though if they are going down the route of all/most Chaos Primarchs returning, then, it's likely the Primarchs will just get a "Ynnari style" release.

How do we know that Abaddon isn't getting a chance in CA?

 Motograter wrote:
I'm just wondering with the rumoured character changes in points etc then seeing Abaddon with no change at all thinking are black legion getting a book cos why change abaddon now only to change him again early 2019....

Given that Imperial Fists are getting an upgrade sprue, and they had an add-on book in 6/7e, I think they might be getting an add-on book for 8e. It stands to reason that the other SM Legions/Chapters that had add-ons might get one as well. That would mean maybe Black Legion, Iron Hands, and Crimson Slaughter. But time will tell.

I hope we see some more rumors soon. I want to know what to do with my Space Marines!

Kdash wrote:

 Motograter wrote:
I'm just wondering with the rumoured character changes in points etc then seeing Abaddon with no change at all thinking are black legion getting a book cos why change abaddon now only to change him again early 2019....

The chances of getting a Black Legion codex is practically zero. You're more likely to get an Ultramarines codex before you get a Black Legion one. Not sure where this idea keeps coming from. If anything, the next Chaos codex releases will be Emperors Children and World Eaters - though if they are going down the route of all/most Chaos Primarchs returning, then, it's likely the Primarchs will just get a "Ynnari style" release.

How do we know that Abaddon isn't getting a chance in CA?

Well there has been one in the past...