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kaiseric wrote:
just brought LoD and have only 1 venom crawler so which daemon-engine is the best for melee ?
1. Maulerfiend
2. Venomcrawler

The LoD,
Bettter then both.

Maulerfiend is better in melee and a bit better still even if you include the VCs guns. Obviously the VC has better projection and can actually do something on turn 1. They are both very even so pick Mauler for melee focus or VC if you need a bit of extra shooting.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Has anyone tried out the MoP to summon after moving? I am wondering if it could be an option for the new Keeper of Secrets, as if you deploy her/him/it on the board T1 it's toast.

saint_red wrote:
Maulerfiend is better in melee and a bit better still even if you include the VCs guns. Obviously the VC has better projection and can actually do something on turn 1. They are both very even so pick Mauler for melee focus or VC if you need a bit of extra shooting.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Has anyone tried out the MoP to summon after moving? I am wondering if it could be an option for the new Keeper of Secrets, as if you deploy her/him/it on the board T1 it's toast.

Thx!! i love maulerfiend but the price for 3 of them is expensive but i think i can invest them. but i hope venomcrawler have a separate box, ithink it will cheaper than maulerfiend.

Has anyone tried out the MoP to summon after moving? I am wondering if it could be an option for the new Keeper of Secrets, as if you deploy her/him/it on the board T1 it's toast.

Depends on the PL you need to roll to summon the good thing.
Also you need to be slaanesh and or unaligned MoP wise.

 ArcaneHorror wrote:
Another question that I have is concerning the Aspiring Champion model, the one with the plasma gun, axe and knife. I love the model design as it syncs well with the new CSM designs, but I'm confused as to how it's placed into a larger CSM army. The rules state that each CSM unit has one Aspiring Champion which is armed with one chainaxe, but the AS stand-alone model has a power axe. As I can't find any special rules for this model (I'm guessing that the rules concerning Vrosh Tattersoul are now obsolete), I don't exactly know how this guy could be placed into a larger CSM force.

I don't think he's really intended to be a unit champion he's more of a HQ but you can use him for anything you like. I actually kitbashed him into a warpsmith but he'd make a really good base for an exalted champion especially if you were planning to give him the axe of blind fury. Or swap the axe out for a thunder hammer?
You could even keep the axe and run him as the new master of executions. I can't see anyone having an issue with that, you'd just need to fit a different back pack so he's not carrying the melta...

Abaddon303 wrote:

 ArcaneHorror wrote:
Another question that I have is concerning the Aspiring Champion model, the one with the plasma gun, axe and knife. I love the model design as it syncs well with the new CSM designs, but I'm confused as to how it's placed into a larger CSM army. The rules state that each CSM unit has one Aspiring Champion which is armed with one chainaxe, but the AS stand-alone model has a power axe. As I can't find any special rules for this model (I'm guessing that the rules concerning Vrosh Tattersoul are now obsolete), I don't exactly know how this guy could be placed into a larger CSM force.

I don't think he's really intended to be a unit champion he's more of a HQ but you can use him for anything you like. I actually kitbashed him into a warpsmith but he'd make a really good base for an exalted champion especially if you were planning to give him the axe of blind fury. Or swap the axe out for a thunder hammer?
You could even keep the axe and run him as the new master of executions. I can't see anyone having an issue with that, you'd just need to fit a different back pack so he's not carrying the melta...

I’m not quite clear who we’re talking about, here?

There’s a new AC model in Shadowspear with a Plasma pistol and Chainaxe. A Heretac AC may take two items from the Champion Equipment list, which includes both of these.

There’s many AC options in the new Heretac set, all of which are covered under Champion Equipment, including the plasma pistol and power axe on the studio unit in the photos.

There’s a stand-alone ‘Apiring Champion’, about five years old, with a power axe, bolt pistol, and combi-melta. This model built as-is cannot be used WYSIWYG in 40k (or even Kill Team, for which it was specifically promoted) as an AC. The only ways to make good of it are:
- say the holstered pistol is out of ammo and never use it (be honest, half the time we forget to point-blank when it’s even an option)
- use it as a Chosen that’s swapped their bolter for a combi-weapon and gained a melee weapon (bit expensive);
- just pool the parts into your bits box to build models with useful, legal loadouts (CM isn’t terrible on a midfield Lord who doesn’t want to overheat his Plasma in a meta full of hit modifiers. Especially if he’s on a bike. Oh, hello, RC Relic)

I think we are talking about exalted champion not aspiring.. That EC model for Red Corsairs can have the Maelstorm's Bite relic weapon, which is.. atleast fluffy.

Hello everyone,

I'm more daemon player but started looking more into daemon engines now and daemonkin (to me it's still fluffy to mix them up but not with regular CSM) as well.

Yesterday having some practice game I started to think, is there any way (CP, spell, ability) to make vehicles explosion more possible? For example instead of it exploding on 6+ making it explode on 4+ for CP?

Sorry if someone has already asked for this and I'm bringing it up again.

So, looks like most of our FAQ concerns were valid.

115 points for Oblits
Renegades are locked to specific gods.

For those that have been playing their oblits at 115? Do you still feel like they're worth the investment?

Where did you find that renegades are locked to specific gods? I can't find the errata for vigilus ablaze, which I imagine would be the right one.

I'm not happy with the clarification to butcher's nails at all. It wasn't a great legion trait to begin with and now they completely removed all synergy with berzerkers and Kharn. :(

Gidun wrote:

Spoiler:

necrotekkie wrote:
So, looks like most of our FAQ concerns were valid.

115 points for Oblits
Renegades are locked to specific gods.

For those that have been playing their oblits at 115? Do you still feel like they're worth the investment?

Where did you find that renegades are locked to specific gods? I can't find the errata for vigilus ablaze, which I imagine would be the right one.

In the vigilus ablaze FAQ. For me, it's the first one amongst 40k FAQs on the Warhammer community website.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The way I understand the CSM FAQ, legion traits now apply to "Characters", so Lord Discordants benefit from them.
With a built in +1 to-hit, I'm really tempted by a flawless host supreme command.

hortsmann wrote:

Gidun wrote:

Spoiler:

necrotekkie wrote:
So, looks like most of our FAQ concerns were valid.

115 points for Oblits
Renegades are locked to specific gods.

For those that have been playing their oblits at 115? Do you still feel like they're worth the investment?

Where did you find that renegades are locked to specific gods? I can't find the errata for vigilus ablaze, which I imagine would be the right one.

In the vigilus ablaze FAQ. For me, it's the first one amongst 40k FAQs on the Warhammer community website.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The way I understand the CSM FAQ, legion traits now apply to "Characters", so Lord Discordants benefit from them.
With a built in +1 to-hit, I'm really tempted by a flawless host supreme command.

Anyone who didn't know oblits were a typo and were going to be 115 was pretty dumb. That being said it's obvious the 115 points was written prior to CA 2018 and was waaaaayyyy overpriced.

And i'm still not seeing anywhere about locking renegades chapters into one god. I just triple checked. There isn't even a Vigilus ablaze FAQ on the FAQ site, the first one in the list is shadowspear. The Chaos FAQ only locks world eaters and Emperors Children into a specific god.

Lastly, yeah i believe Lord Discordants now get legion traits. My Corsairs LD is happy to be able to advance and charge...too bad demon engines still don't get it. I guess we can't all be Eldar/IG and asking for some rules consistency is too much.

hortsmann wrote:

Gidun wrote:

Spoiler:

necrotekkie wrote:
So, looks like most of our FAQ concerns were valid.

115 points for Oblits
Renegades are locked to specific gods.

For those that have been playing their oblits at 115? Do you still feel like they're worth the investment?

Where did you find that renegades are locked to specific gods? I can't find the errata for vigilus ablaze, which I imagine would be the right one.

In the vigilus ablaze FAQ. For me, it's the first one amongst 40k FAQs on the Warhammer community website.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The way I understand the CSM FAQ, legion traits now apply to "Characters", so Lord Discordants benefit from them.
With a built in +1 to-hit, I'm really tempted by a flawless host supreme command.

yeah legion traits now apply to Lord Discordants. that's a nice change

My Juggerlord is very happy.

Lord Discordant’s getting legion traits is very nice. I’m already running a red Corsair battalion with triple lord D’s and this a very nice buff for that list. Also alpha legion Lord D’s are extremely good, now there’s a serious consideration for what legion you go for.

Captyn_Bob wrote:
My Juggerlord is very happy.

now if only juggerlord's hadn't been squated. I know there's the whole 'index flow chart' to do cheeky things, but most tournaments do not allow index anymore now that every army has a codex (except SOB)
Sucks too because i love the juggerlord model i kitbashed. It fits my fluffy khorne army. I honestly don't blame people who don't want to allow index anymore, those should be retired. But GW also should have included that iconic unit in the codex.

Danny slag wrote:

hortsmann wrote:

Gidun wrote:

Spoiler:

necrotekkie wrote:
So, looks like most of our FAQ concerns were valid.

115 points for Oblits
Renegades are locked to specific gods.

For those that have been playing their oblits at 115? Do you still feel like they're worth the investment?

Where did you find that renegades are locked to specific gods? I can't find the errata for vigilus ablaze, which I imagine would be the right one.

In the vigilus ablaze FAQ. For me, it's the first one amongst 40k FAQs on the Warhammer community website.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The way I understand the CSM FAQ, legion traits now apply to "Characters", so Lord Discordants benefit from them.
With a built in +1 to-hit, I'm really tempted by a flawless host supreme command.

Anyone who didn't know oblits were a typo and were going to be 115 was pretty dumb. That being said it's obvious the 115 points was written prior to CA 2018 and was waaaaayyyy overpriced.

And i'm still not seeing anywhere about locking renegades chapters into one god. I just triple checked. There isn't even a Vigilus ablaze FAQ on the FAQ site, the first one in the list is shadowspear. The Chaos FAQ only locks world eaters and Emperors Children into a specific god.

Lastly, yeah i believe Lord Discordants now get legion traits. My Corsairs LD is happy to be able to advance and charge...too bad demon engines still don't get it. I guess we can't all be Eldar/IG and asking for some rules consistency is too much.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/warhammer_40000_imperium_nihilus_vigilus_ablaze_en.pdf

 Red Corsair wrote:

Danny slag wrote:

hortsmann wrote:

Gidun wrote:

Spoiler:

necrotekkie wrote:
So, looks like most of our FAQ concerns were valid.

115 points for Oblits
Renegades are locked to specific gods.

For those that have been playing their oblits at 115? Do you still feel like they're worth the investment?

Where did you find that renegades are locked to specific gods? I can't find the errata for vigilus ablaze, which I imagine would be the right one.

In the vigilus ablaze FAQ. For me, it's the first one amongst 40k FAQs on the Warhammer community website.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The way I understand the CSM FAQ, legion traits now apply to "Characters", so Lord Discordants benefit from them.
With a built in +1 to-hit, I'm really tempted by a flawless host supreme command.

Anyone who didn't know oblits were a typo and were going to be 115 was pretty dumb. That being said it's obvious the 115 points was written prior to CA 2018 and was waaaaayyyy overpriced.

And i'm still not seeing anywhere about locking renegades chapters into one god. I just triple checked. There isn't even a Vigilus ablaze FAQ on the FAQ site, the first one in the list is shadowspear. The Chaos FAQ only locks world eaters and Emperors Children into a specific god.

Lastly, yeah i believe Lord Discordants now get legion traits. My Corsairs LD is happy to be able to advance and charge...too bad demon engines still don't get it. I guess we can't all be Eldar/IG and asking for some rules consistency is too much.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/warhammer_40000_imperium_nihilus_vigilus_ablaze_en.pdf

Thank you. For some reason it's not listed on the FAQ page, unless you switch to a language other than english, then it's there.

Removed - BrookM
In their own commentary they've stated that the legion/renegade traits "allow you to play your own chapter, just pick whichever trait feels fit's your custom chapter closest" this has always been the case. No other army, not a single one, outside chaos has restrictions put on which chapter/faction/legion/ect trait you can pick. Once again chaos getting the shaft. Seriously what harm would there be in letting people play whichever trait they want in an army for their own chapter? Every single army in the game is built that way so that you can homebrew your own fluff and paint your dudes however you see fit, then just pick the trait which best fits your fluff as long as you follow the rules of the trait.

Where is the point change for obliterators verified?

Not Online!!! wrote:
Where is the point change for obliterators verified?

New Chaos Space Marine codex errata. Page 1, bottom right column.

Also worth nothing that its clarified that Rubrics can take the wounds from Perils instead of the aspiring sorc.

 argonak wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:
Where is the point change for obliterators verified?

New Chaos Space Marine codex errata. Page 1, bottom right column.

Well gak.
Probably final nail in the Oblits as is.

“no part of (tactical reserves) applies to units that are added to your army during the battle (such as those that require reinforcement points to be added); these units cannot be set up anywhere (on the battlefield or otherwise) during deployment because they do not exist until the point where the rule that ‘creates’ them is used, and that point is always after deployment has finished.”

Right, well, this seems to resolve some confusion I had. I think we need to have another look at Summoning, since it now enables us to create units in no man’s land on the first turn.

Characters embedded near the front of our lines can effectively drop units just before the halfway line (in most deployment maps).

For Pink Horrors, that’s the difference in not having to Advance to get within hadouken range of a cautiously deployed enemy, and a guarantee of shooting at full unit strength. .

A Bloodmaster can be dropped in on the first turn, ready to Summon a Skull Altar right in the enemy’s face on the second turn, right as a load of Warp Talons come in to play.

A Master of Possession can crank this up by running up the table and casting Incursion. If he starts the game in a Transport and Advances, that’s a minimum of 22” Summoning range - easily enough to drop something as close to the enemy as possible.

That could be a flock of Flamers, blasting away at a melee horde and daring them to charge.

It could be a slow unit; Skull Throne, Horticulous, Plaguebearers, or Beasts of Nurgle, overcoming their poor movement. On that note, if you’re a Word Bearer or near a Gnarlmaw, a GUO isn’t impossible. And speaking of Gnarlmaws, Horticulous could then drop one on the same turn, right in the enemy’s face. If you’ve also Warptimed a Defiler up there, that could get messy.

Might be worth dropping an Enrapturess up close to some armies, especially if you’ve got units in place to prevent her getting blasted.

I suppose these shenanigans would ideally have a Chaos Daemons detachment in play, so as to have various loci and Stratagems available.

Not Online!!! wrote:
Where is the point change for obliterators verified?

Link for the lazy
https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/warhammer_40000_chaos_space_marines_en.pdf

Not Online!!! wrote:

 argonak wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:
Where is the point change for obliterators verified?

New Chaos Space Marine codex errata. Page 1, bottom right column.

Well gak.
Probably final nail in the Oblits as is.

Oblits are just fine at 115 points. It makes their weapons profile balanced as compared to havocs and combi-plasma terminators, and their survivability per point. And then they gain huge benefits from strat and buff synergy. They could be 130pts and still be worth using.

 Drudge Dreadnought wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:

 argonak wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:
Where is the point change for obliterators verified?

New Chaos Space Marine codex errata. Page 1, bottom right column.

Well gak.
Probably final nail in the Oblits as is.

Oblits are just fine at 115 points. It makes their weapons profile balanced as compared to havocs and combi-plasma terminators, and their survivability per point. And then they gain huge benefits from strat and buff synergy. They could be 130pts and still be worth using.

We will see.
I wouldn't bet on it though.

There worth the single unit now since after buffs and EC they are still extremely efficient. This made it less desirable to spam 3 units, which I would argue is better for the game over all.

Wow legion traits applying to lord discordants is huge. AL versions become much more survivable. Red corsairs can yolo and advance and charge (even better in a soulforged detachment).

Oblits at 115 are just fine, i have been able to find good uses for them with the mark of nurgle and the nurgle tree (0+ save? Thanks, i will take that). My biggest issue with them is the venom crawler, for 15 pts more they are much more tactically viable than oblits.