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No wolves on Fenris wrote:


abby updated stats
for ref thats:
+1T
+1W
Wasn’t he already T5? Isn’t it his Strength that has increased to 5? Plus his extra wound? Think that now makes him Str 10 with the Talon and Str 6 with his sword

my mistake in the rush to post, its +1S not T
woo hoo can wound a knight with the talon on 3's now

It does my heart well to see the older style marine helmets on the trophy racks, not primaris. I wouldn't mind seeing primaris helmets on there, but I don't want them to completely forget about all the dead old marines.

Yep. Some good stuff here, the new Chaos stuff is pretty nice.

My Loyalist heart feels a little despair that we'll likely only see these marks of armour in chaos going forward.

 Latro_ wrote:
legion focus up
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/03/18/18th-mar-heretic-astartes-focus-the-black-legiongw-homepage-post-1/?fbclid=IwAR1eBmUdY_5loKxxUNOsoUldZCd85o9DhgdIUZy-fEpfcZO70ak2lI1g4V4

Spoiler:

Grey Knights on Vigilus?!

stormcraft wrote:

 Latro_ wrote:
legion focus up
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/03/18/18th-mar-heretic-astartes-focus-the-black-legiongw-homepage-post-1/?fbclid=IwAR1eBmUdY_5loKxxUNOsoUldZCd85o9DhgdIUZy-fEpfcZO70ak2lI1g4V4

Spoiler:

Grey Knights on Vigilus?!

Yes because the Grey Knights need to see the extreme loss in numbers to justify more Primaris.

That's a pretty darn strong Relic Bolter that's for sure.

I actually quite like that the Terminators don't look aesthetically different from the old ones. Just better proportioned and with more options (anyone else notice the combi-plasma?).
But it's nice that you'll be able to have both side by side with no significant differences

-

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
That's a pretty darn strong Relic Bolter that's for sure.

Yeah, that combi bolter on a termi lord would be savage. I would even be wreckless enough to pop VoTLW and or Endless Cacophony on that dude in a pinch.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
That's a pretty darn strong Relic Bolter that's for sure.

It'll pop a basic Custodian per failed save. I like it.

Hmmm. The 'heretic Astarte's focus index' has me a little disappointed. Partly because world eaters and emperors children are in there (rather than left out as a tease for later), partly because renegades are a catchall (which doesn't really match up with special rules for specific renegade groups)

Can anyone work out how big those CSM Termies are compared to other TEQs?

They look taller but thinner to me? Am I imagining things?

Veterans means that relic bolter wounds T8 on a 4, and endless means 8 shots from that thing... If you are facing imperium, its a potential 24 wounds from 8 shots... lol That's a lot from one mere bolter!

Voss wrote:
Hmmm. The 'heretic Astarte's focus index' has me a little disappointed. Partly because world eaters and emperors children are in there, partly because renegades are a catchall (which doesn't really match up with special rules for specific renegade groups)

Well what did you expect? They need to have something for World Eater and Emperors Children players to utilize in the interim of potential stand alone books.

As to Renegades, They can easily have multiple chapter relics and WLT/Strats under that one umbrella, it would put them on par with the legions in the current book and they can't exactly have +5 or so extra faction focus articles for each.

The bolter is really nice. Tip of the spear is a nice idea, but we already have good sources of re-rolls, especially black legion. Abaddon gives them, now we have this Chosen of Abaddon to give them. Couldn't tip of the spear have been re-roll wounds or something? Chaos has no source of that for shooting right now. (EDIT: Chosen of the Warmaster is only for Bringers of Despair. So that's really limited.)

Field Commander is nice, but you're gonna pay for it.

Kind of sad to see them pushing Haarken again when he's such hot garbage. Hopefully they'll realize they need to fix him.

The terminator models look good. Nice combi-weapon options too. But yeah, how are we supposed to use these?

As usual, it all comes down to if they are giving CSM and terminators any stat changes or other fixes to actually make them worthwhile.

Also worth noting that Tip of the Spear has no exception to handle if your closest unit is in melee, or has no ranged weapons. So if you go second, your opponent can shut it down pretty easily if you haven't setup right.

Well, we can have maybe plasma bikes in the lead using the speartip strategem to overcharge. They are usually so far ahead they are out of range of Abaddon's aura. Then Abaddon moves up with the rest of the battleline giving the battleline rerolls to hit. And finally, a termi sorceror or lord deep strikes into the back line with bringers of despair terminators (with plasma) and gives those rerolls too.

And definitely go with overcharged plasma. If we are going to get maximum use out of all this rerolling to hit, might as well just overcharge all our plasma guns. lol

Notice the Terminators have several Mk VII heads on them? That is pretty awesome. I think they look pretty great.

I think the bringers of despair ability is gonna be situational but it'll be handy if you've an opponent who likes to tarpit

the relic bolter just screams "use me to kill custodes"

Does Abaddon's wound count of 8 qualify him for the varsity team in terms of stat degradation with wound loss or is still below the cutoff where he fights at 100% until he suddenly drops dead suddenly? I don't play the current edition so am not sure myself.

 warboss wrote:
Does Abaddon's wound count of 8 qualify him for the varsity team in terms of stat degradation with wound loss or is still below the cutoff where he fights at 100% until he suddenly drops dead suddenly? I don't play the current edition so am not sure myself.

Stat drop off doesnt happen until like 10 wounds generally.

these termies are incredibly boring. Liked the old version, but they should have made them a bit more different.

 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:

 warboss wrote:
Does Abaddon's wound count of 8 qualify him for the varsity team in terms of stat degradation with wound loss or is still below the cutoff where he fights at 100% until he suddenly drops dead suddenly? I don't play the current edition so am not sure myself.

Stat drop off doesnt happen until like 10 wounds generally.

So for Funsies I compared Abaddon to Primaris Calgar, and they're ALMOST mirror doubles now, Abaddon has 1 more point of STR though, on the table top they're gonna be a close match up

That was a very strange way to announce the new terminators.

Sotahullu wrote:
Also, I wouldn't put it pass that there is more to the new Terminators. By looking at the picture it looks like those trophy racks could be added or removed easily.

Really? On current ones you have nice groove and simple choice of adding or leaving spikes off, on these, there is no groove and spikes look fully integrated...

 dan2026 wrote:
I love that the Chaos Termys kept theit tusks.

They didn't tho?

They had 5 pairs of different, nice ones, based on antelopes, rhinos, mammoths, elephants, etc, these have lazy, boring same-same boar tusks.

 Abadabadoobaddon wrote:
Are those *gasp* not-primaris helmets on the terminators' trophy racks? I hope they have enough to fill out a squad, otherwise I'll need to resort to bits resellers. I don't want no primaris in my collection, not even as trophies!

Gee, only what, four older mark helmets, no primaris at all?

I was wondering when someone will try to inject primaris whine into yet another completely unrelated thread, took only six posts

 Abadabadoobaddon wrote:
Too bad we'll never see loyalist termies redone to this standard.

Yup, because SMH Terminators from last year don't exist.

Oh wait...

 Albino Squirrel wrote:
That was a very strange way to announce the new terminators.

Maybe they are trying to see how long it is going to take us to notice them.

Sotahullu wrote:

 Albino Squirrel wrote:
That was a very strange way to announce the new terminators.

Maybe they are trying to see how long it is going to take us to notice them.

The fact that it takes time to notice them is worrying tho. Is "worrying" even a word?

BrianDavion wrote:

 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:

 warboss wrote:
Does Abaddon's wound count of 8 qualify him for the varsity team in terms of stat degradation with wound loss or is still below the cutoff where he fights at 100% until he suddenly drops dead suddenly? I don't play the current edition so am not sure myself.

Stat drop off doesnt happen until like 10 wounds generally.

So for Funsies I compared Abaddon to Primaris Calgar, and they're ALMOST mirror doubles now, Abaddon has 1 more point of STR though, on the table top they're gonna be a close match up

Thanks to both. Yeah, he was my personal obvious goto in regards to a comparison as well even if he hadn't been on the planet after his superprimarizing. The pics usually compare him to Robby G but that seems like it shouldn't be a fair fight despite his killing a clone primarch 10,000 years earlier.

Honestly, what more do people want? The updated chaos marines and terminators aren't super exciting, but why should they be? They are updated improved sculpts of existing units, with additional options included that weren't in the previous kit. They aren't a total re-imagining, but who wants that? They are just an improved sculpt. I kind of like that if you already own tons of chaos marines and terminators, you don't have to buy the new ones to get some great newly invented weapon that didn't exist for the old unit. They just look better.

 Albino Squirrel wrote:
Honestly, what more do people want? The updated chaos marines and terminators aren't super exciting, but why should they be? They are updated improved sculpts of existing units, with additional options included that weren't in the previous kit. They aren't a total re-imagining, but who wants that? They are just an improved sculpt. I kind of like that if you already own tons of chaos marines and terminators, you don't have to buy the new ones to get some great newly invented weapon that didn't exist for the old unit. They just look better.

Totally. They look great. Terminators with proportions that almost match the artwork and fit the updated model like? Huge improvement and well worth it.

 Albino Squirrel wrote:
Honestly, what more do people want? The updated chaos marines and terminators aren't super exciting, but why should they be? They are updated improved sculpts of existing units, with additional options included that weren't in the previous kit. They aren't a total re-imagining, but who wants that? They are just an improved sculpt. I kind of like that if you already own tons of chaos marines and terminators, you don't have to buy the new ones to get some great newly invented weapon that didn't exist for the old unit. They just look better.

The marines are leagues away from the previous ones and earned praise easily from most. Terminators are a more recent kit anyway and I agree shouldn't be a huge departure, but as their rules haven't changed nor their appearance really, they seem dull in comparison.

I like all the new Chaos models. Regarding the Termies, they’re indeed very similar to their previous versions, which is good, IMHO. Did people complain when the new Fire Warriors looked mostly the same as the previous ones? Or the most recent Tactical Marines update over the previous kit?

That said, I do hope the new Termie kit has some helmets with the more elaborate horns as well. But on the whole these look great. Clearly the torsos and legs go together in certain combinations only, but while many here don’t seem to like that, I think this result in far better and dynamic poses than the previous “ball-joint” waists.