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Nurglitch wrote: The theology of 40k is what keeps us coming back to it.
The... theology?
The only theology present in 40k is that religion is total self-enslavement and debasement, and that's true for eldar, imperials and chaos alike.
The only ones who don't get hit with that stick are orks (divine anarchy and living only for the moment, only possible by rejecting higher thought) and the necrons, who killed and enslaved their gods. And the a-religious tau and tyranids (though the gsc makes the latter more religious enslavers and debasers)
it's a fair word to use, I know I've compared the primarchs from the HH books as being very much like greek gods. (everything about them is greater, including their flaws)
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
The emperor may have been a scientific genius but I'd say that, as cultures, necrons and eldar reached greater heights.
I think there's a theory that the eldar gods were created weapons of the aeldari themselves?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/14 00:21:16
kingheff wrote: The emperor may have been a scientific genius but I'd say that, as cultures, necrons and eldar reached greater heights.
I think there's a theory that the eldar gods were created weapons of the aeldari themselves?
This is the case. When the Eldar were fighting the C'tan with the Old Ones they created psychic weapons that later evolved into gods. This is probably why in their myths the Eldar gods seem more coherent and act more like people than the Chaos gods ever do; they were designed rather than having just spontaneously emerged. So yeah, the Emperor might have made some puny flesh and blood 'demigods', but the Eldar created actual warp deities.
kingheff wrote: The emperor may have been a scientific genius but I'd say that, as cultures, necrons and eldar reached greater heights.
I think there's a theory that the eldar gods were created weapons of the aeldari themselves?
This is the case. When the Eldar were fighting the C'tan with the Old Ones they created psychic weapons that later evolved into gods. This is probably why in their myths the Eldar gods seem more coherent and act more like people than the Chaos gods ever do; they were designed rather than having just spontaneously emerged. So yeah, the Emperor might have made some puny flesh and blood 'demigods', but the Eldar created actual warp deities.
maybe but they're NOT the Pheonix Lords. now should the avatar be insanely powerful? hell yeah he should be on par with demon prince angron in terms of power level. or at LEAST a blood thrister. being arguably the same thing (an avatar of a war god)
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
kingheff wrote: The emperor may have been a scientific genius but I'd say that, as cultures, necrons and eldar reached greater heights.
I think there's a theory that the eldar gods were created weapons of the aeldari themselves?
This is the case. When the Eldar were fighting the C'tan with the Old Ones they created psychic weapons that later evolved into gods. This is probably why in their myths the Eldar gods seem more coherent and act more like people than the Chaos gods ever do; they were designed rather than having just spontaneously emerged. So yeah, the Emperor might have made some puny flesh and blood 'demigods', but the Eldar created actual warp deities.
You mean the Old Ones created the eldar gods when making weapons for them to use, not the primitive eldar randomly made gods while the Old Ones were using the species as tools/cannon fodder in their war. Right?
Else this is probably the biggest random retcon yet.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/14 03:42:40
You mean the Old Ones created the eldar gods when making weapons for them to use, not the primitive eldar randomly made gods while the Old Ones were using the species as tools/cannon fodder in their war. Right?
Else this is probably the biggest random retcon yet.
No, it was the Eldar who created the gods. The Old Ones merely 'encouraged ' them.
Liber Chaotica wrote:"I watched as the First Ones encouraged the younger race to reach further into the other realm, and with their vibrant minds and passionate souls create beings of power to fight the star gods."
TheFleshIsWeak wrote: Regarding the Autarch vs. Exarch debate earlier, am I right in thinking that Eldar didn't used to have Autarchs at all?
I seem to recall them only having Farseers with their melee HQ being the Avatar.
Correct. The Autarch in its current 40K incarnation was only introduced in 4th edition, being introduced as walking the Path of Command sometimes also known as the Path of the Leader.
An interesting thing though is Autarchs are NOT trapped on the Path of Command. How do we know this? Yriel was an Autarch of Iyanden before going corasair. That should not have been possible if he had been trapped on the Path. Therefore the question arises of what one trapped on the Path of Command would be?
I wonder.since the elder are getting an update if the next chapter in the saga will be the update for She-Who-Thirsts, and Primarch and Astartes minions...
Carlovonsexron wrote: I wonder.since the elder are getting an update if the next chapter in the saga will be the update for She-Who-Thirsts, and Primarch and Astartes minions...
I doubt it.
Chaos and in particular Slaanesh has been the recipient of a massive update relatively recently. I suspect Emperor's Children will be on the latter part of this campaign, if at all.
Carlovonsexron wrote: I wonder.since the elder are getting an update if the next chapter in the saga will be the update for She-Who-Thirsts, and Primarch and Astartes minions...
I doubt it.
Chaos and in particular Slaanesh has been the recipient of a massive update relatively recently. I suspect Emperor's Children will be on the latter part of this campaign, if at all.
Slaanesh got a big update but much of it was leaders/heroes in both AoS/40K. The actual troop side didn't get anything new added to it at all; though the fiends got a very nice update. I don't expect them to update deamonettes (the way they are deamonettes, seekers and chariots all interlink very nicely and to update one would require updating them all); but in both games Slaanesh has a very distinct lack of supporting models in anything but the leader category.
Carlovonsexron wrote: I wonder.since the elder are getting an update if the next chapter in the saga will be the update for She-Who-Thirsts, and Primarch and Astartes minions...
I doubt it.
Chaos and in particular Slaanesh has been the recipient of a massive update relatively recently. I suspect Emperor's Children will be on the latter part of this campaign, if at all.
Slaanesh got a big update but much of it was leaders/heroes in both AoS/40K. The actual troop side didn't get anything new added to it at all; though the fiends got a very nice update. I don't expect them to update deamonettes (the way they are deamonettes, seekers and chariots all interlink very nicely and to update one would require updating them all); but in both games Slaanesh has a very distinct lack of supporting models in anything but the leader category.
I disagree, I think Slaanesh has decent representation in all kits.
Regardless, for the reasons above I don't think EC are going to be the focus of this campaign any time soon/if at all.
The release of a Primarch is a campaign unto itself.
Could easily be a few books in perhaps.
But then as the books are jumping all over the place.
It could easily be the rumoured (for it seems no reason at all, or I don’t know where that came from) DA and Fallen book at some point where the next Primarch appears.
It’s too early/random to link an assumption of who could drop where, seen as they said it will move about story wise.
megatrons2nd wrote: Does anyone else think the legs on the Howling Banshee could double as Swooping Hawk legs?
I doubt it, GW seems to have swung from complicated dual use kits to even more complicated mono-pose plastics with no options and no possibility of conversion.
Noise Marines are a resin upgrade kit converted from the original metal upgrade kit made for Chaos Marines that are no longer available.
There are no dedicated Slaaneshi cultists or Traitor Guard.
Only Slaaneshi Daemons are complete and in plastic.
Nurgle has decent representation, Tzeentch has decent representation, and undivided Chaos has decent representation. Slaanesh, not so much.
An Actual Englishman wrote: Regardless, for the reasons above I don't think EC are going to be the focus of this campaign any time soon/if at all.
The release of a Primarch is a campaign unto itself.
Probably, if by campaign you mean campaign book. There is the narrative connection between Slaanesh and Eldar, but with the Ynnari stirring the pot there's plenty of material for a single book by simply covering all the different Eldar factions without any outside factions.
I very much doubt that any situation introduced for the Eldar as a race will spill outside Phoenix Rising in any meaningful way, though. The following Psychic Awakening books will have a different focus, and there's no reason they couldn't be about Fulgrim, or Angron, or Ghazghkull, or the Silent King, or whatever.
BrianDavion wrote: if fulgrim was getting a release they would have lead with that I imagine.
Failbaddon came with the last Vigilus book. Girlyman came with the last Gathering Storm book. I don't think GW feels any need to lead with these big characters and introduces them with what they think has the best narrative impact.
Nehekhara lives! Sort of!
Why is the rum always gone?
Noise Marines are a resin upgrade kit converted from the original metal upgrade kit made for Chaos Marines that are no longer available.
There are no dedicated Slaaneshi cultists or Traitor Guard.
Only Slaaneshi Daemons are complete and in plastic.
Nurgle has decent representation, Tzeentch has decent representation, and undivided Chaos has decent representation. Slaanesh, not so much.
Well you mean Emperor's Children hasn't got decent representation but for me Slaanesh daemons are fine and, as mentioned above, have just received a substantial release. CSM also received new models and Emperors Children are ultimately CSM.
I just can't see it and I think other factions deserve the focus now.
Probably, if by campaign you mean campaign book. There is the narrative connection between Slaanesh and Eldar, but with the Ynnari stirring the pot there's plenty of material for a single book by simply covering all the different Eldar factions without any outside factions.
I very much doubt that any situation introduced for the Eldar as a race will spill outside Phoenix Rising in any meaningful way, though. The following Psychic Awakening books will have a different focus, and there's no reason they couldn't be about Fulgrim, or Angron, or Ghazghkull, or the Silent King, or whatever.
With regards Fulgrim I think its very unlikely he is released during this campaign but I take your point that its entirely possible given how other primarchs have released.
Still though, with the recent focus on Chaos (Slaanesh Daemons and CSM general) this is why I believe it's unlikely.
Failbaddon came with the last Vigilus book. Girlyman came with the last Gathering Storm book. I don't think GW feels any need to lead with these big characters and introduces them with what they think has the best narrative impact.
True, they are more the Grand Finale of each campaign than anything else. That said I do wish they would pick up the pace a bit. I don't really feel like waiting 20 more years to be the last one to get their Primarch.
An Actual Englishman wrote: Well you mean Emperor's Children hasn't got decent representation but for me Slaanesh daemons are fine and, as mentioned above, have just received a substantial release.
And from what I've seen, no one's talking about Slaaneshi Daemons. They're talking about Slaaneshi mortals, which would cover both the AoS side of things (so Slaaneshi units akin to Tzaangors, or Blood Reavers and so on) and the 40k side of things (full EC releases like the 1KSons and Death Guard got). Yes, Daemons are complete (except for a standard plastic Herald), but that's not really in question.
Well EC are a sub-sub faction..... (humour intended)
Chaos- Chaos Marines - Emperors Children - (yeah I know - just like all the Marines we have been drowned in over the last few months)
Fulgrim would be a cool release though and Slaanesh being the big enemy of the Eldar would be a nice counterpoint with perhaps a full Lost and the Damned Codex
But lets face it its mainly going to be more Marines, lot and lots of Marines - like every month.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/15 11:53:37
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
Noise Marines are a resin upgrade kit converted from the original metal upgrade kit made for Chaos Marines that are no longer available.
There are no dedicated Slaaneshi cultists or Traitor Guard.
Only Slaaneshi Daemons are complete and in plastic.
Nurgle has decent representation, Tzeentch has decent representation, and undivided Chaos has decent representation. Slaanesh, not so much.
Well you mean Emperor's Children hasn't got decent representation but for me Slaanesh daemons are fine and, as mentioned above, have just received a substantial release. CSM also received new models and Emperors Children are ultimately CSM.
I just can't see it and I think other factions deserve the focus now.
For good or ill each Chaos God has a Space Marine legion in his thrall, and the expectation is that they will get rules and models. Especially now that half of them are already covered. If you want to play mortal followers of a god, the presence of a full line of plastic Daemons does you no good. Nor do the new generic Chaos models that lack the correct wargear, not to mention aesthetics of the faction you want to play.
A lot of factions deserve focus. A lot of those factions could have gotten that focus long ago, too, if Marines didn't get redone so often. Consider, though, that when we're talking specifically about mortal followers of Slaanesh, the last time they got anything in the way of models, so did Battle Sisters. If that's not long enough for you to think of them as deserving focus, I don't know what is.
As for not seeing it, well, I can't say I actually disagree. See below.
Probably, if by campaign you mean campaign book. There is the narrative connection between Slaanesh and Eldar, but with the Ynnari stirring the pot there's plenty of material for a single book by simply covering all the different Eldar factions without any outside factions.
I very much doubt that any situation introduced for the Eldar as a race will spill outside Phoenix Rising in any meaningful way, though. The following Psychic Awakening books will have a different focus, and there's no reason they couldn't be about Fulgrim, or Angron, or Ghazghkull, or the Silent King, or whatever.
With regards Fulgrim I think its very unlikely he is released during this campaign but I take your point that its entirely possible given how other primarchs have released.
Still though, with the recent focus on Chaos (Slaanesh Daemons and CSM general) this is why I believe it's unlikely.
It's a tough one. At times GW makes you think they want Chaos to be a single faction that you merrily mix and use servants of one god to cover the weaknesses of servants of another god. At other times they make rules and models for subfactions that can then stand on their own and will be advertised accordingly, even getting their own (unnecessary) codex.
That's why I'm generally cautious about predictions and prefer to not rule something out if there is a chance, because you never know which way GW is leaning at that moment.
You would think so heavy a focus as Nurgle got two years ago was not going to happen, but then it did and a lot of people were sick of it only halfway through. Slaanesh should get so lucky.
A lot of people thought that with how Nurgle and Tzeentch got releases for AoS and 40k, with it being Slaanesh's turn in AoS now that would herald something for 40k as well. Then again, a lot of people also expected models for mortal followers in AoS, and look how that turned out.
I don't actually expect noteworthy Slaanesh releases in the near future, but like I said, I think GW's Chaos release plans lack serious direction and I can't rule it out either.
Failbaddon came with the last Vigilus book. Girlyman came with the last Gathering Storm book. I don't think GW feels any need to lead with these big characters and introduces them with what they think has the best narrative impact.
True, they are more the Grand Finale of each campaign than anything else. That said I do wish they would pick up the pace a bit. I don't really feel like waiting 20 more years to be the last one to get their Primarch.
It's probably my biggest complaint about GW's release schedule. They're not even trying to get everyone on the same level and are happy to let factions rot instead of trying to give fans of that faction at least a little bit.
Nehekhara lives! Sort of!
Why is the rum always gone?
kingheff wrote: The emperor may have been a scientific genius but I'd say that, as cultures, necrons and eldar reached greater heights.
I think there's a theory that the eldar gods were created weapons of the aeldari themselves?
This is the case. When the Eldar were fighting the C'tan with the Old Ones they created psychic weapons that later evolved into gods. This is probably why in their myths the Eldar gods seem more coherent and act more like people than the Chaos gods ever do; they were designed rather than having just spontaneously emerged. So yeah, the Emperor might have made some puny flesh and blood 'demigods', but the Eldar created actual warp deities.
maybe but they're NOT the Pheonix Lords. now should the avatar be insanely powerful? hell yeah he should be on par with demon prince angron in terms of power level. or at LEAST a blood thrister. being arguably the same thing (an avatar of a war god)
Fulgrim killed an Avatar of Khaine, so I wouldn't go as far as daemon primarch Angron, but yes an Avatar is comparable enough to a Primarch which makes them comparable to a Greater Daemon.
Knowing the lore, an Avatar would just be a benchmark to establish the power level of coolness of DP Angron.
Fang, son of Great Fang, the traitor we seek, The laws of the brethren say this: That only the king sees the crown of the gods, And he, the usurper, must die.
Mother earth is pregnant for the third time, for y'all have knocked her up. I have tasted the maggots in the mind of the universe, but I was not offended. For I knew I had to rise above it all, or drown in my own gak.
Fang, son of Great Fang, the traitor we seek, The laws of the brethren say this: That only the king sees the crown of the gods, And he, the usurper, must die.