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Jackal90 wrote:
It’s not my view at all.
Selecting specific comparisons to prove an argument (while ignoring closer comparisons) is simply pointless.

But since this is the way you wish to compare, let’s.

Mortarion and Magnus are both insanely priced for “characters” in comparison to forgeworld praetors.

This just proves how disingenuous you are and that you have no real desire for a discussion. If you think comparing a demon prince monstrous creature to a generic mid level marine character is the same thing then we're done.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Voss wrote:

 General Kroll wrote:


You’re not comparing like for like though. Mephiston is a plastic, mass produced product. The model you’re comparing it to is primarily sold as a collectors display piece. Sure it’s expensive, but it’s not filling the same niche as Mephiston.

Both are characters used for a game. It seems exactly the same niche. (Resin models, by the way, aren't some hand-crafted, unique objects. They're mould-cast pieces as well.)

You can stick either one in a case and call it a 'display piece' as well, if collection is all you want out of them.

Agreed. They're both mass produced (albeit via different methods with varying pros/cons) and can both be used as display pieces. I do agree with General Kroll that the FW character is more likely to be sold as one though but it doesn't negate its other use as a practical game piece. I don't personally see the value in that base (that I can 95% replicate by going to my bits box and back yard) to justify the cost increase. It's a different story IMO when you have those older two character dioramas that interconnect though or the more ornate personalized bases that primarchs come with (Horus and Roboute being the top two that come to mind). As always with art (even mass produced ones!), the beauty is in the eye of the beholder though so YMMV.

Why not?
You see no issue with comparing a generic plastic marine character to one of forgeworlds character series sculpts.
My comparison is simply playing by the rules of “they are both characters”

So drop the daemon primarch part, that’s irrelevant if character series also means nothing.


Comparisons are literally pointless unless you try to make them as similar as possible.
So maybe try aiming for a realistic one instead?

Something like 30k consoles and 40k marine LT’s.
Or apothecaries since both have them.
Praetors and captains.

There’s some realistic comparisons.



Granted, both have been hiked to the price of stupidity in some cases, but people are still buying them.

 Turnip Jedi wrote:
Really surprised they havent considered licensing out at least the smaller bits to other bits places

Palming the blame onto recasters is nonsence, as I understand their prices are based off % of GW rrp but FW prices are so excessive that just buying for example a legit stock rhino or a demios from a recaster comes in at the same without the morality or quality issues but all GW sees is FW stuff not selling

I suspect that FW is under orders to retain a hefty GW-like margin on their products, but that's harder when it's labor-intensive resin than the plastic that GW proper sells. I'm not advocating for recasters here. But there is obviously such a thing as a product that's just too expensive to get the volume of sales needed to keep the operation afloat.



Of course, when they sell as many Warlord Titans has they have, that suggests to me that whale-hunting might still be profitable for FW. As AT develops more Titan types, we can probably expect to see them come to resin for that select group. But in no way is 30K a growth product overall, and with most SG releases exceeding their expectations...it's certainly possible that its days are numbered. And they don't actually need steady support for 30K to sell to whales. They could end the black books entirely but still whip up a 30K datasheet when they need to for the BIG THING du jour.

The Ork Commandos set just bit the dust. That leaves as virtually the only old conversion kit the World Eaters one:-

https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-GB/World-Eaters-Conversion-Set

If you're planning on getting that one, I'd grab it now. The pads are redundant (sold separately from Heresy) and the torsos/heads not amazingly unique or necessary (there is a plastic kit) so I reckon it'll be next on the block.

 Galas wrote:
I believe the death of HH is just a normal consecuence of the death of FW.


FW as we knew it this past 15 years Is not gonna last very long. They are being repurposed as the specialist studio guys, doing core games with plastics and then resin add-ons. I believe GW just doesn't want that much resin production, I suppose the manpower and the costs aren't just as profitable as mass produced HIPS plastics .

It's not just the big centerpieces all sorts of obscure units are being made in plastic. I mean if a few years ago you'd told me plastic Escher were coming I'd call you a liar. If you'd also said a second kit of Esher juves with bows and champs with bigger hair were also coming, I'd never believe it.

If resin goes away I'd give a good chance that plastic Krieg are coming, and only slightly less odds on plastic Estonian Drop Troops.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

 Galas wrote:
I believe the death of HH is just a normal consecuence of the death of FW.


FW as we knew it this past 15 years Is not gonna last very long. They are being repurposed as the specialist studio guys, doing core games with plastics and then resin add-ons. I believe GW just doesn't want that much resin production, I suppose the manpower and the costs aren't just as profitable as mass produced HIPS plastics .

It's not just the big centerpieces all sorts of obscure units are being made in plastic. I mean if a few years ago you'd told me plastic Escher were coming I'd call you a liar. If you'd also said a second kit of Esher juves with bows and champs with bigger hair were also coming, I'd never believe it.

If resin goes away I'd give a good chance that plastic Krieg are coming, and only slightly less odds on plastic Estonian Drop Troops.

at twice their current price no less....

Only reason I have a Horus heresy army is betrayal at dalton and burning of Prospero and I knew from the start that I wasn’t going to win too many games with that army.

Is anyone keeping an archive of OOP Forge World models for posterity's sake if nothing else?

I think we had a thread but can't find it.

Maybe something for Stuff of Legends?

I'm a little bummed that they didn't advertise any of the stuff going LCTB. I would bought some more UM terminator shoulder pads and land raider doors had I been aware.

Sadly the way FW often puts things out of production is to wait until the mould breaks and then just not renew it. So its not a case of "X casts and its done" but more a case of waiting till it breaks and then reviewing if they want to make another.

It's a very annoying thing, heck around christmas they dropped a good dozen or so very good AoS models. They got "last chance" warnings but it wasn't to a date it was until the mould broke so they went out of stock very fast.

Out of interest has anyone else recently received an email from FW saying "Still deciding? Time is running out..." mentioning anything they've left in their basket?
Had one very recently about the Chimera autocannon turret and sure enough it was OOP 2 days later. Latest one was for a Grey Knight Land Raider that again was in my basket.

It's most likely coincidence but you never know, this could be a way of saying there's a couple left on the shelf and the mould's knackered.

 Overread wrote:
Sadly the way FW often puts things out of production is to wait until the mould breaks and then just not renew it. So its not a case of "X casts and its done" but more a case of waiting till it breaks and then reviewing if they want to make another.

It's a very annoying thing, heck around christmas they dropped a good dozen or so very good AoS models. They got "last chance" warnings but it wasn't to a date it was until the mould broke so they went out of stock very fast.

This makes me wonder if everyone got their orders, or just order rates are sufficiently low that they have time to pull things as soon as the mould breaks and not have to worry.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
It's not just the big centerpieces all sorts of obscure units are being made in plastic. I mean if a few years ago you'd told me plastic Escher were coming I'd call you a liar. If you'd also said a second kit of Esher juves with bows and champs with bigger hair were also coming, I'd never believe it.

If resin goes away I'd give a good chance that plastic Krieg are coming, and only slightly less odds on plastic Estonian Drop Troops.

I mean if you told me the only 21st century nation to survive into the 41st millennium was Estonia I think I'd have trouble believing it too.

Fictional wrote:

 Overread wrote:
Sadly the way FW often puts things out of production is to wait until the mould breaks and then just not renew it. So its not a case of "X casts and its done" but more a case of waiting till it breaks and then reviewing if they want to make another.

It's a very annoying thing, heck around christmas they dropped a good dozen or so very good AoS models. They got "last chance" warnings but it wasn't to a date it was until the mould broke so they went out of stock very fast.

This makes me wonder if everyone got their orders, or just order rates are sufficiently low that they have time to pull things as soon as the mould breaks and not have to worry.

It used to be that the stock available from the website was the completed product ready to ship (unless it was marked 'cast to order', like the T'au Manta), so if got what you were able to order. I guess things go LCTB when they think they can only get a handful more out of the mould, and suddenly disappear if it unexpectedly dies.

 Jack Flask wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
It's not just the big centerpieces all sorts of obscure units are being made in plastic. I mean if a few years ago you'd told me plastic Escher were coming I'd call you a liar. If you'd also said a second kit of Esher juves with bows and champs with bigger hair were also coming, I'd never believe it.

If resin goes away I'd give a good chance that plastic Krieg are coming, and only slightly less odds on plastic Estonian Drop Troops.

I mean if you told me the only 21st century nation to survive into the 41st millennium was Estonia I think I'd have trouble believing it too.

GW will reval it soon, I'm tallinn you.

 Overread wrote:
Sadly the way FW often puts things out of production is to wait until the mould breaks and then just not renew it. So its not a case of "X casts and its done" but more a case of waiting till it breaks and then reviewing if they want to make another.

It's a very annoying thing, heck around christmas they dropped a good dozen or so very good AoS models. They got "last chance" warnings but it wasn't to a date it was until the mould broke so they went out of stock very fast.

I guess that could be part of it, but when a bunch of related or similar products disappear at the same time, it surely isn't just about moulds wearing down?

It might be nothing, but the FW Facebook page seems to be re-branding itself - the logo is now the Eye of Horus and the description is:

It is an Age of Darkness – the Emperor's favourite son has turned against his father, and brother fights against brother in a battle that will determine the fate of the entire galaxy. The Horus Heresy game lets you recreate these bitter conflicts on the tabletop. Here, on the official Facebook page for The Horus Heresy, we will share all of the latest news and updates for the game, along with painting guides, model reveals, tactics and more. This is your ideal hub for everything about the 31st Millennium.

(And it's tagged "@thehorusheresyofficial")


Automatically Appended Next Post:
From today's WarCom AT article:

If you’re looking to keep up with the latest Adeptus Titanicus goings-on, we’ve got good news. The Forge World Facebook page is being transformed into the Horus Heresy Facebook page – the best spot on social media to discuss all things Age of Darkness from tiny Titans to Horus Heresy armies. If you haven’t already, give us a like to make sure you get the latest news and fun stuff delivered right to your newsfeed.

 Coenus Scaldingus wrote:

 Overread wrote:
Sadly the way FW often puts things out of production is to wait until the mould breaks and then just not renew it. So its not a case of "X casts and its done" but more a case of waiting till it breaks and then reviewing if they want to make another.

It's a very annoying thing, heck around christmas they dropped a good dozen or so very good AoS models. They got "last chance" warnings but it wasn't to a date it was until the mould broke so they went out of stock very fast.

I guess that could be part of it, but when a bunch of related or similar products disappear at the same time, it surely isn't just about moulds wearing down?

Why? Their mould certainly isn't tiny thing used to cast one bit, they use big spinning machines so it would actually make sense to have dozens of bits on one big container. If anything, I'd say bunch of things about the same age going away at once is a pretty good proof it was just the mould, if that was planned range cut they would start with worst selling stuff, not deleted random groups often including things that were in demand.

 Irbis wrote:

 Coenus Scaldingus wrote:

 Overread wrote:
Sadly the way FW often puts things out of production is to wait until the mould breaks and then just not renew it. So its not a case of "X casts and its done" but more a case of waiting till it breaks and then reviewing if they want to make another.

It's a very annoying thing, heck around christmas they dropped a good dozen or so very good AoS models. They got "last chance" warnings but it wasn't to a date it was until the mould broke so they went out of stock very fast.

I guess that could be part of it, but when a bunch of related or similar products disappear at the same time, it surely isn't just about moulds wearing down?

Why? Their mould certainly isn't tiny thing used to cast one bit, they use big spinning machines so it would actually make sense to have dozens of bits on one big container. If anything, I'd say bunch of things about the same age going away at once is a pretty good proof it was just the mould, if that was planned range cut they would start with worst selling stuff, not deleted random groups often including things that were in demand.

I very much doubt that all those WHFB/AoS monsters they dropped late last year were all on the same mould, or all their moulds wore down on the same day, and they all sold equally well leading them to disappear in the same period of time.

In some cases, they might cut a range when one kit within it starts to require a new mould or so, but long-term plans for a range (or lack thereof) are probably more influential. And the continued production of whole sections of their product line is quite clearly not just no priority, but not something they desire to do at all. Which is fine, but it'd be nice if they could let their customers know, because in many of these cases it doesn't seem to be a sudden discovery. (Although at this stage, if you want, say, one of the few remaining FW WHFB/AoS figures or something from other abandoned lines, it's probably just a good idea to assume they'll go, and pick them up sooner rather than later.)

 Coenus Scaldingus wrote:
In some cases, they might cut a range when one kit within it starts to require a new mould or so, but long-term plans for a range (or lack thereof) are probably more influential. And the continued production of whole sections of their product line is quite clearly not just no priority, but not something they desire to do at all. Which is fine, but it'd be nice if they could let their customers know, because in many of these cases it doesn't seem to be a sudden discovery. (Although at this stage, if you want, say, one of the few remaining FW WHFB/AoS figures or something from other abandoned lines, it's probably just a good idea to assume they'll go, and pick them up sooner rather than later.)

Indeed. I think it's safe to say that 40K and possibly AoS models will be retired in time as stock runs down. Certain exceptions (superheavies for example) will remain where, as speculated elsewhere, those particular lines will be moved to the main GW website under the Warhammer Forge banner. For example, one of the Necron Tomb Stalker models has now gone to Sold Out. Expect others to vanish as stock runs down and existing moulds wear out.

Forgeworld preorders again

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/07/29/the-forges-are-relit/

This week

Is that a dreadnought 'pilot' on his base? It looks odd (and a bit like Fabius Bile's Surgeon Acolyte...)

beast_gts wrote:
Is that a dreadnought 'pilot' on his base? It looks odd (and a bit like Fabius Bile's Surgeon Acolyte...)

it does appear to be Alpha legionary from a contemptor. I actually like the base more than the Master of Keshig himself.

this is something I wish FW would really embrace. they should make new battlefield casualties and the such.

I'd be great if FW/GW did more casualty bits. The skulls box is nice for its variety of fleshless heads. But some Xenos carcasses, bits of damaged warmachines.
Good luck trying to get your hands on the old Vostroyan casualties for a reasonable price!


Once again, I think the problem with this model is once again the paint job. No where near the quality you'd expect.
I'd be interested to know how they got the bone colour they used for the armour though. I like that.

 Snrub wrote:
I'd be great if FW/GW did more casualty bits. The skulls box is nice for its variety of fleshless heads. But some Xenos carcasses, bits of damaged warmachines.
Good luck trying to get your hands on the old Vostroyan casualties for a reasonable price!

[u]
Once again, I think the problem with this model is once again the paint job. No where near the quality you'd expect.

Yup, I'm sure itll look great when untouched by the worlds best(cough, cough) painting team!

Racerguy180 wrote:
Yup, I'm sure itll look great when untouched by the worlds best(cough, cough) painting team!

To the best of my knowledge it's not the 'Eavy Metal team that does FW's paint jobs. I think it's just one of the FW guys who paints them.
They are admittedly, not bad paint jobs. They're just not up to scratch with the 'Eavy Metal work and they're certainly not the quality you'd expect GW to use given some of the talent they do have available.
If they actually got the 'Eavy Metal team to paint both GW/FW, there'd be no issue.

my comment was a dig at the FW painting team, which has a terrible track record with paint jobs on their models.

'Eavy metals style doesnt really fit 30k tho.

Tbh a lot of the official GW jobs aren't all that flash when you scrutinise them, this isn't far off that quality. Some of the edge highlights are bit off, but nothing drastic. The main difference is not going so high contrast because that's not the HH style.

The features on the oni mask look a bit too big and squat in relation to the rest of the model.

Qin Xa is up for preorder now. Seeing the 360 I think the pose works, better than I thought it would from the photo. I rather like him. Details look good and I like the helmet a lot. My one gripe is the swords are quite thick for their length (and the price, but FW gonna FW).

https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-GB/Qin-Xa-Master-Of-The-Keshig-2020

It looks nice enough... but those sode and haidate look really, really REALLY japanese instead of mongol.

Mongol:


Japanese:


Well, you get the idea.