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Oh, I'm not worried about MG here. It will be a kickstarter, they know how to hype and advertise it, they have a faithful community that is always there when they need it, so they'll easily gather close to 1 million IMHO.

Let's see what they'll show. They have big names working on the rules, so it sounds promising. Good thing it's Q1 2024, launching now is not a good time period for Kickstarters.

Though TBH, I don't believe Matt here when he says MG chose Kickstarter after talking with their fans, as if it was really what they were asking MG to do. I think Kickstarter was always what MG planned to do, because they know that's how they can gather a whole lot of money in a short amount of time (it's merely a giant pre-order, at this point). And MG certainly needs it.

I'm not a fan of this strategy of always using Kickstarters, but it's just my personnal opinion on the topic. I just hope MG isn't going the Spartan Games way, that's all.

I think Mantic could release it without KS by doing a book/PDF and resin minis/STLs but many people would rather see a KS so they can get lots of frames of plastic miniatures.

I've personally been asking Ronnie to do this scale of game for the last 8 or so years whenever I see him at shows and things.

 mattl wrote:

I've personally been asking Ronnie to do this scale of game for the last 8 or so years whenever I see him at shows and things.

According to the video, that's what Ronnie always wanted to do with Warpath : big epic battles with huge armies, and a smaller scale is the easiest way to represent that.

I suppose Mantic did plan to do a KS anyway, but I believe them that customers also prefer this release model for them as it's clearly faster and cheaper than the releases that have gone straight to retail. Mantic is one of the prime culprits that people expect insane value in wargaming KS in the first place.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I suppose Mantic did plan to do a KS anyway, but I believe them that customers also prefer this release model for them as it's clearly faster and cheaper than the releases that have gone straight to retail. Mantic is one of the prime culprits that people expect insane value in wargaming KS in the first place.

Customers in UK, without any doubts. Customers from other countries...not so much. Value is quickly crippled with import taxes.

But Mantic Games is a UK company and they always listened more to their UK community. It's perfectly normal and logical.

However, there should be something made for the 3D printing community, and if files are part of the Kickstarter, that's a whole another outcome since they can be delivered with a simple download link.

Thanks for reminding me it's gonna be a headache to get the pledge through customs... didn't use to be an issue for EU back in the crazy KS days.

wasn't a problem with the latest terrain crate, and we will see how DSO works out, the only KS from them I ever did but in general it looks like they found ways to solve that problem

and yes, Ronnie always wanted to have the big battles but in the past he did not want to do a dedicated model line but 28mm to keep compatible with the other company
(something he once said to be his biggest mistake in the past 10 years)

and there will be STLs as per the videos/articles, question is just what those will be

Hmmm. First Mantic Kickstarter in a long time I'm somewhat interested in! Depending on what they produce, and how much they charge, might be a good way to get some small scale sci fi...

Sarouan wrote:
Though TBH, I don't believe Matt here when he says MG chose Kickstarter after talking with their fans, as if it was really what they were asking MG to do. I think Kickstarter was always what MG planned to do, because they know that's how they can gather a whole lot of money in a short amount of time (it's merely a giant pre-order, at this point).

Well we already discussed this on a video. We were planning on a more limited straight to retail launch but it would have hit at exactly the same time as LI, so rather than go head to head with the guys down the road, we put it out to the community via survey and after about 2000 or so responses, the overwhelming feedback was to make it a bigger thing using KS. So we are

Dungeon Saga Origin kickstarter recently announced they should be soon begin to ship the rewards once they received everything in their hubs (estimation is about end of november for everything, so that best outcome of backers getting their stuff before Christmas looks really on track). Everything should be done before this Warpath Kickstarter, which is the best look for everyone and give fair confidence and good will for the next. The Hype building will have very sane foundations and give an overall positive feeling.

I've been very critical about them in the past (and I admit, quite negative), but this time for me, they give good signals. I still don't like the way they use Kickstarters, but at some point, I have to get over it - they're not gonna change their business model if it works and that's normal in the end. If the majority of their community is happy with it, let's roll with it.

I wonder what they intend to do with terrain at this scale. I somewhat expect building / ruins sprues but mostly because it's a classical / safe choice from previous games from other companies made at this scale. Maybe they can do something more exotic for 3D printing files, since it could be a more risky move for going plastic (meaning they're not sure about sales being high enough to fund plastic production).

Either way, let's enjoy our time and see what the next blogs will reveal.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 mattjgilbert wrote:

Sarouan wrote:
Though TBH, I don't believe Matt here when he says MG chose Kickstarter after talking with their fans, as if it was really what they were asking MG to do. I think Kickstarter was always what MG planned to do, because they know that's how they can gather a whole lot of money in a short amount of time (it's merely a giant pre-order, at this point).

Well we already discussed this on a video. We were planning on a more limited straight to retail launch but it would have hit at exactly the same time as LI, so rather than go head to head with the guys down the road, we put it out to the community via survey and after about 2000 or so responses, the overwhelming feedback was to make it a bigger thing using KS. So we are

Thansk for answering, Matt. I know I've been quite disrespectful in the past about that, had a lot of anger in me at that time. Really appreciate your time here.

Would be nice to get a small scale terrain set that wasn't gothic ruins tbh

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Would be nice to get a small scale terrain set that wasn't gothic ruins tbh

Wonder how hard it would be for them to resize some of their existing terrain crate range?

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Would be nice to get a small scale terrain set that wasn't gothic ruins tbh

Warpath universe isn't really gothic, to me. It's more "classical SF", I expect buildings more like Infinity. Alien buildings like a Forgefather mining outpost or Asterian drone factory would be really cool (and a deeper connection to their background, IMHO).

Can the Plague have infested terrain, too ? I don't remember if it's just about bodies or if they do stuff like tyranids / zergs with "parasitic buildings" or the likes.

Oh otherwise this set looks just right, has sci-fi industrial and plague-infected parts and scales down perfectly, I've already test printed some at 25%

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/district0012/district-0012

Sarouan wrote:
Though TBH, I don't believe Matt here when he says MG chose Kickstarter after talking with their fans, as if it was really what they were asking MG to do.

They didn't ask "should we launch on kickstarter?", they asked "should we do a big range of plastic models for this or sell stls?" and the response was plastic. The tooling to produce plastic kits is expensive, therefore kickstarter because they need a lot more money up front to go this route.

If they can actually achieve this type of detail at an affordable cost in absolute terms (not just relative to GW's offerings) then it might be a success and an alternative to 3d printing. I think their designs and levels of detail translate well to the new scale if this preview image from August is any indication.

Fresh off the press

 warboss wrote:
If they can actually achieve this type of detail at an affordable cost in absolute terms (not just relative to GW's offerings) then it might be a success and an alternative to 3d printing. I think their designs and levels of detail translate well to the new scale if this preview image from August is any indication.

For transparency, that was just to show the scale. Those are 28mm models reprinted at small size. We do intend to get as close to that level of detail as we can though. I've got an article coming up in a few weeks talking about scales and sculpting and we will start to show of renders of actual sculpts before then I think too.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Would be nice to get a small scale terrain set that wasn't gothic ruins tbh

If it’s the same scale as Dropzone Commander, you can have Art Deco buildings in resin or card. There used to be an amazing line of plasticard buildings, but they’re long OOP.

The last KS from mantic I backed was the first Dungeon Saga one, because at the time it was as close as I could see to Heroquest/Warhammer Quest come again. I've been pretty happy with that choice, have it all painted, played some games and also use the minis for RPGs often.

This is the first one of theirs since then where I've gone "Oh, yes?" because it hits that Epic itch that's been growing for me for some time. I know there are people doing great Epic minis but none that I can easily access where I am without customs faff since brexit. So Mantic making something that might get a more general release (even if short) with 4 proper factions from the start is really appealing.

Like with GW's Warhammer Quest update, I'm not that interested in their Epic update, because I expect the price to be out of my comfort zone and it's subject matter isn't what I really want - I want aliens and faction diversity, so the Heresy isn't it.

I hope it's a big success for Mantic. I'm not sure my own tastes are a good barometer for what's successful any more, but there must be other people who feel somewhat the same, outside of the Mantic core audience?

And those two on the rules is a plus for me, I think the KOW rules are really solid. I just hope the game has proper suppression mechanics and isn't just about killing units.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Would be nice to get a small scale terrain set that wasn't gothic ruins tbh

There will be a terrain solution too.

I forget, what was the decided scale, again?

 Da Boss wrote:

Like with GW's Warhammer Quest update, I'm not that interested in their Epic update, because I expect the price to be out of my comfort zone and it's subject matter isn't what I really want - I want aliens and faction diversity, so the Heresy isn't it.
I hope it's a big success for Mantic. I'm not sure my own tastes are a good barometer for what's successful any more, but there must be other people who feel somewhat the same, outside of the Mantic core audience?
And those two on the rules is a plus for me, I think the KOW rules are really solid. I just hope the game has proper suppression mechanics and isn't just about killing units.

same here, yet I am a little concerned about the rules because I am more in for something new and dynamic rather than classic Epic but streamlined
not that I expect bad rules but just not something I want from battalion/brigade style games

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
I forget, what was the decided scale, again?

 mattjgilbert wrote:

 Eilif wrote:
Do we have confirmation that Warpath is 6/8mm? I don't see anything specific in the previous posts.

12mm. Infantry 4 to a base (round). Walkers 1 to a base (round). Tanks on bases (oval).

I think Matt said 12mm for Enforcers so 10mm for the rest? Hopefully this stays the case I got to look at the Legions Imperialis infantry today and they are just to small and lacking in detail so I hope Warpath can be the Epic scaled game for me.

I want to go on record saying I'm against basing tanks and that Flames of War bases look better than rounds. Thanks.

 DaveC wrote:

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
I forget, what was the decided scale, again?

 mattjgilbert wrote:

 Eilif wrote:
Do we have confirmation that Warpath is 6/8mm? I don't see anything specific in the previous posts.

12mm. Infantry 4 to a base (round). Walkers 1 to a base (round). Tanks on bases (oval).

I think Matt said 12mm for Enforcers so 10mm for the rest? Hopefully this stays the case I got to look at the Legions Imperialis infantry today and they are just to small and in lacking detail so I hope Warpath can be the Epic scaled game for me.

Thank you.

Sounds like the terrain will be close enough for my tastes, and probably the vehicles and infantry as well, especially nonhuman infantry. I really hope the focus is on the vehicles, though; a plastic kit that was 50%infantry would be unattractive to me.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I want to go on record saying I'm against basing tanks and that Flames of War bases look better than rounds. Thanks.

I like bases for tanks but agree that rectangular looks better than round for

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Fresh off the press

Alessio being part of the rules team fills me with happiness. He did the original 28mm Warpath back when it was little more than Kings of War in Space, but I rather enjoyed that version and bought several starter sets at the time.

Just picked up Firefight which is the spiritual successor to that era of Warpath, but I'm looking forward to some huge games in 12mm.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I want to go on record saying I'm against basing tanks and that Flames of War bases look better than rounds. Thanks.

I agree. I dislike vehicles on bases. I wouldn't mind troops on rounds or rectangles with rounded corners, but I really dislike seeing oval bases.

Edit: And I hope they decide on a 10mm scale. I have 25/28mm terrain, 15mm, 10mm terrain and some 6mm stuff. I think I'll draw the line at another game needing a whole new set of terrain. I'd rather spend the money/time/effort on minis.

 kodos wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I want to go on record saying I'm against basing tanks and that Flames of War bases look better than rounds. Thanks.

I like bases for tanks but agree that rectangular looks better than round for

I never understood the anti tank base bias. Not basing them makes your infantry look deceptively larger by comparison. Depending on the game it also results in a bunch of unncessary degrees of complexity and arguments about which hull zone you're hitting or firing arcs, etc.