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 Kanluwen wrote:

 ImAGeek wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
Death Guard, Thousand Sons, Renegades and Heretics, Chaos Marines, and Daemons of Chaos are all Chaos factions so the point kinda stands, I guess?

Not really, because if you treat every Chaos faction as the umbrella of 'Chaos' as a way of saying Chaos gets the most attention, then the umbrella of 'The Imperium' gets far more attention than Chaos does.

And yet, the bits I was replying to were treating every Chaos faction as the umbrella of 'Chaos'...and I mean, it is worth mentioning that if one were to actually look at things?
-Reworked Chaos Daemon ranges for Tzeentch, Nurgle, and Slaanesh. This was a knock-on effect from Age of Sigmar.
-A Chaos Knight kit with weapons exclusive to it...and a whole faction that is otherwise shared models with Imperial Knights.
-Death Guard range with new character, vehicle, and infantry models. Plus Mortarion and a Typhus resculpt.
-Thousand Sons range with new characters and infantry models. Plus Magnus and an Ahriman resculpt.
-Chaos Space Marine range saw a rework of the core infantry, Havocs, Terminators(a still relatively new kit!) and some new characters plus a rework of Abaddon. Add to this the new Start Collecting set from Shadowspear with Obliterators and easy build CSMs. Also the release of the CSM Sorcerer with Faith & Fury.
-Blackstone Fortress has been pretty clearly a testing ground for potential new goodies down the line.


Imperium has seen, by comparison:
-Marines saw the addition of Phobos stuff post-Shadowspear and the supplement books/Psychic Awakening have added a single character to each.
-Reworked Sisters of Battle range(which has been phenomenal)
-A small amount of new AdMech stuff, of which a big chunk hasn't actually released yet.

Marines have got the whole Primaris line since Thousand Sons came out.

Dudeface wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
Death Guard, Thousand Sons, Renegades and Heretics, Chaos Marines, and Daemons of Chaos are all Chaos factions so the point kinda stands, I guess?

Is it unfair that those 5 factions have had a whole 3 release waves over 8th? It's hardly showering them with affection.

Especially when of those releases all were either totally new units or replacements of finecast/3rd ed kits apart from the terminators which admittedly seemed... odd.

If you want to get into "release waves", you're talking about more than 3. The newer Daemons were replaced as part of AoS, not 8th proper--and were released as part of 3 different books.

You're also forgetting that Imperial Knights shared "their" releases(the Armiger Helverin/Warglaive and the Castellan/Valiant) with Chaos Knights while the opposite isn't true. CK get all the Imperial Knight stuff(barring Canis Rex/Preceptor) while IK didn't get anything out of the Chaos Knight release(which was a single kit--but again, it just makes up for the lack of CR/Preceptor)...unless you want to count the legs from the Chaos Knight, I guess?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 ImAGeek wrote:

Marines have got the whole Primaris line since Thousand Sons came out.

And that whole Primaris line is shared across 4 factions while Thousand Sons share their releases with...I guess, Chaos Marines? Maybe?

Frankly, it seems like you just missed the point of my original reply. If someone says that "it's 5 different factions" when someone calls out builds that are Chaos and have done well at tournaments, it doesn't stop them from being Chaos.

 Kanluwen wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
Death Guard, Thousand Sons, Renegades and Heretics, Chaos Marines, and Daemons of Chaos are all Chaos factions so the point kinda stands, I guess?

Is it unfair that those 5 factions have had a whole 3 release waves over 8th? It's hardly showering them with affection.

Especially when of those releases all were either totally new units or replacements of finecast/3rd ed kits apart from the terminators which admittedly seemed... odd.

If you want to get into "release waves", you're talking about more than 3. The newer Daemons were replaced as part of AoS, not 8th proper--and were released as part of 3 different books.

You're also forgetting that Imperial Knights shared "their" releases(the Armiger Helverin/Warglaive and the Castellan/Valiant) with Chaos Knights while the opposite isn't true. CK get all the Imperial Knight stuff(barring Canis Rex/Preceptor) while IK didn't get anything out of the Chaos Knight release(which was a single kit--but again, it just makes up for the lack of CR/Preceptor)...unless you want to count the legs from the Chaos Knight, I guess?

Well chaos knights weren't dragged into this previously so that's now 6 factions. But it's ok, space marines, custodes, knights, admech and sisters have had more love given to them than the listed factions for chaos.

Dudeface wrote:

Well chaos knights weren't dragged into this previously so that's now 6 factions. But it's ok, space marines, custodes, knights, admech and sisters have had more love given to them than the listed factions for chaos.

AdMech has seen two releases in 8th. The Skorpius Disintegrator/Dunerider and the Techpriest Manipulus.

The Engine War items aren't out yet, so if you want to count unreleased items? Imperial Knights are getting rules in Engine War, Chaos Knights are getting rules in Engine War and Chaos Daemons are getting rules in Engine War.

War of the Spider is bringing a new Fabius Bile with his own faction added in and Death Guard are getting the same 'subfaction style setup' as other factions have been getting.

You tried to claim that "Chaos" didn't get any love. Even discounting Thousand Sons(who saw their releases in 7th), you're still talking about two 'major' faction releases(Death Guard and Chaos Space Marines) for 8th, three 'incidental' faction releases(Disciples of Tzeentch for AoS brought in a new Kairos/Lord of Change, Tzaangors. Maggotkin brought in a new Great Unclean One/named GuO, new Beasts, and the assorted Daemons. Hedonites brought stuff that has, AFAIK, been only in WD/CA), and a 'minor' faction release(Chaos Knights).

Oh, FFS, quit it with the pissing match. It just drags the thread down every. Damn. TIME.

At this point, I almost blame the mods for NOT swinging the banhammer around more.

 Kanluwen wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

Well chaos knights weren't dragged into this previously so that's now 6 factions. But it's ok, space marines, custodes, knights, admech and sisters have had more love given to them than the listed factions for chaos.

AdMech has seen two releases in 8th. The Skorpius Disintegrator/Dunerider and the Techpriest Manipulus.

The Engine War items aren't out yet, so if you want to count unreleased items? Imperial Knights are getting rules in Engine War, Chaos Knights are getting rules in Engine War and Chaos Daemons are getting rules in Engine War.

War of the Spider is bringing a new Fabius Bile with his own faction added in and Death Guard are getting the same 'subfaction style setup' as other factions have been getting.

You tried to claim that "Chaos" didn't get any love. Even discounting Thousand Sons(who saw their releases in 7th), you're still talking about two 'major' faction releases(Death Guard and Chaos Space Marines) for 8th, three 'incidental' faction releases(Disciples of Tzeentch for AoS brought in a new Kairos/Lord of Change, Tzaangors. Maggotkin brought in a new Great Unclean One/named GuO, new Beasts, and the assorted Daemons. Hedonites brought stuff that has, AFAIK, been only in WD/CA), and a 'minor' faction release(Chaos Knights).

Half of that is moving goal poats or wrong, but I never claimed they got nothing, that's objectly wrong, I claimed they weren't unduly showered with the best of everything and shown favouritism.

Either way none of this is relevant to the topic so I'll hush.

 Kanluwen wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

Well chaos knights weren't dragged into this previously so that's now 6 factions. But it's ok, space marines, custodes, knights, admech and sisters have had more love given to them than the listed factions for chaos.

AdMech has seen two releases in 8th. The Skorpius Disintegrator/Dunerider and the Techpriest Manipulus.

The Engine War items aren't out yet, so if you want to count unreleased items? Imperial Knights are getting rules in Engine War, Chaos Knights are getting rules in Engine War and Chaos Daemons are getting rules in Engine War.

War of the Spider is bringing a new Fabius Bile with his own faction added in and Death Guard are getting the same 'subfaction style setup' as other factions have been getting.

You tried to claim that "Chaos" didn't get any love. Even discounting Thousand Sons(who saw their releases in 7th), you're still talking about two 'major' faction releases(Death Guard and Chaos Space Marines) for 8th, three 'incidental' faction releases(Disciples of Tzeentch for AoS brought in a new Kairos/Lord of Change, Tzaangors. Maggotkin brought in a new Great Unclean One/named GuO, new Beasts, and the assorted Daemons. Hedonites brought stuff that has, AFAIK, been only in WD/CA), and a 'minor' faction release(Chaos Knights).

Yeah, no one said that. Just that the claim by a certain poster that Chaos is the favourite of GW is a load of rubbish.

 Kanluwen wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

Well chaos knights weren't dragged into this previously so that's now 6 factions. But it's ok, space marines, custodes, knights, admech and sisters have had more love given to them than the listed factions for chaos.

AdMech has seen two releases in 8th. The Skorpius Disintegrator/Dunerider and the Techpriest Manipulus.

The Engine War items aren't out yet, so if you want to count unreleased items? Imperial Knights are getting rules in Engine War, Chaos Knights are getting rules in Engine War and Chaos Daemons are getting rules in Engine War.

War of the Spider is bringing a new Fabius Bile with his own faction added in and Death Guard are getting the same 'subfaction style setup' as other factions have been getting.

You tried to claim that "Chaos" didn't get any love. Even discounting Thousand Sons(who saw their releases in 7th), you're still talking about two 'major' faction releases(Death Guard and Chaos Space Marines) for 8th, three 'incidental' faction releases(Disciples of Tzeentch for AoS brought in a new Kairos/Lord of Change, Tzaangors. Maggotkin brought in a new Great Unclean One/named GuO, new Beasts, and the assorted Daemons. Hedonites brought stuff that has, AFAIK, been only in WD/CA), and a 'minor' faction release(Chaos Knights).

LOL please. Death Guard are gonna get the same treatment as Thousand Sons did with their "subfactions". In other words, basically nothing.

Drdotts wrote:
Bro April fools was a few days ago, you missed the mark. I just wanted to speculate with fellow imperial knight players on what we are hoping for/expect out of PA engine war. I really don’t want a pointless conversation of who’s faction is catered to more, there’s enough of that going around

I'm just really want to have something that fixes CP for Knights so I don't feel like strategums are way over costed when you play only knights instead of cheesing it up with guard or Admech.

I'd also love someway of countering MW as they are back to being handed out like candy again

I heard a rumor that Engine War wont release digitally until the physical copy is also available. Has anyone heard this?

Ice_can wrote:

Drdotts wrote:
Bro April fools was a few days ago, you missed the mark. I just wanted to speculate with fellow imperial knight players on what we are hoping for/expect out of PA engine war. I really don’t want a pointless conversation of who’s faction is catered to more, there’s enough of that going around

I'm just really want to have something that fixes CP for Knights so I don't feel like strategums are way over costed when you play only knights instead of cheesing it up with guard or Admech.

I'd also love someway of countering MW as they are back to being handed out like candy again

I would love cp bonus to our army if we stayed mono faction knights. I do get tired of my rusty 17 and loyal 32 requirements for cp. and mw defense would be nice too!

Mariongodspeed wrote:
I heard a rumor that Engine War wont release digitally until the physical copy is also available. Has anyone heard this?

I have not. There were some postings that they would "look into" making sure that the upcoming releases(Engine War, War of the Spider, Pariah, and White Dwarfs respectively) would be available digitally but I've not seen anything substantial.

Mariongodspeed wrote:
I heard a rumor that Engine War wont release digitally until the physical copy is also available. Has anyone heard this?

That’s what the Warhammer Community team said in a reply to the question on Facebook, yeah.

It's not that I don't believe you--but do you have the quote handy? I can't find it.

I know it's not exactly the right place for that but I didn't want to make a new thread just for that:
In the previous PA (Saga of the Beast), their is no fluff about Ragnar fighting Gazghull ? Not a word a about their second duel ?

 Kanluwen wrote:
It's not that I don't believe you--but do you have the quote handy? I can't find it.

Lord Momotaro wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
It's not that I don't believe you--but do you have the quote handy? I can't find it.

They're not always right but there's an awful lot of physical product to go with Engine War that it kinda wouldn't make sense to release the book without the models.

As long as Battlescribe gets updated I can wait for the actual release lol

 godardc wrote:
I know it's not exactly the right place for that but I didn't want to make a new thread just for that:
In the previous PA (Saga of the Beast), their is no fluff about Ragnar fighting Gazghull ? Not a word a about their second duel ?

I wonder if it's something that ended up in the Special Edition again - haven't most of the books so far generally detailed up to the moment of crisis, rather than the resolution.
More a case of these books being intended to set the stage, rather than detail a whole campaign - so the rematch is in your hands, rather than the author's.

Octovol wrote:

Lord Momotaro wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
It's not that I don't believe you--but do you have the quote handy? I can't find it.

They're not always right but there's an awful lot of physical product to go with Engine War that it kinda wouldn't make sense to release the book without the models.

As long as Battlescribe gets updated I can wait for the actual release lol

The battlescribe volunteers get their information from the books, so it won't get updated until something is released.

 Tastyfish wrote:

 godardc wrote:
I know it's not exactly the right place for that but I didn't want to make a new thread just for that:
In the previous PA (Saga of the Beast), their is no fluff about Ragnar fighting Gazghull ? Not a word a about their second duel ?

I wonder if it's something that ended up in the Special Edition again - haven't most of the books so far generally detailed up to the moment of crisis, rather than the resolution.
More a case of these books being intended to set the stage, rather than detail a whole campaign - so the rematch is in your hands, rather than the author's.

Didn't the first PA book only cover the lead-up to the big showdown in the box-set with the resolution only being detailed in there? Or am I mixing things up again?

 Perfect Organism wrote:

 Tastyfish wrote:

 godardc wrote:
I know it's not exactly the right place for that but I didn't want to make a new thread just for that:
In the previous PA (Saga of the Beast), their is no fluff about Ragnar fighting Gazghull ? Not a word a about their second duel ?

I wonder if it's something that ended up in the Special Edition again - haven't most of the books so far generally detailed up to the moment of crisis, rather than the resolution.
More a case of these books being intended to set the stage, rather than detail a whole campaign - so the rematch is in your hands, rather than the author's.

Didn't the first PA book only cover the lead-up to the big showdown in the box-set with the resolution only being detailed in there? Or am I mixing things up again?

No they had 2 duels between Drahzar and Jain. Both were poorly written. The ultimate conclusion was a corsair/harlequin/dark/craftworld/exodite eldar VS Slaanesh battle that ended with lelith, jain, a solitaire, yvraine and the visarch fight and barely beat shelaxi hexbane. Who then went "mwahahahha this was just a small bit of me. I'll beat you next time eldaaaaar!!!".

 Perfect Organism wrote:

 Tastyfish wrote:

 godardc wrote:
I know it's not exactly the right place for that but I didn't want to make a new thread just for that:
In the previous PA (Saga of the Beast), their is no fluff about Ragnar fighting Gazghull ? Not a word a about their second duel ?

I wonder if it's something that ended up in the Special Edition again - haven't most of the books so far generally detailed up to the moment of crisis, rather than the resolution.
More a case of these books being intended to set the stage, rather than detail a whole campaign - so the rematch is in your hands, rather than the author's.

Didn't the first PA book only cover the lead-up to the big showdown in the box-set with the resolution only being detailed in there? Or am I mixing things up again?

It just mentions that in passing without going into more than a line or two of detail - however it does end on the cliff hanger of the duel between Yvraine and her allies vs Helbane.
Did his escape feature in the special edition? The one I'm looking at ends with a duel.

"The fight that ensued was the stuff of legend. Helbane was isolated from the wider Daemon horde by the determined battle-lines of Aeldari, who braved annihilation to launch one tactical riposte after another amidst the rain of Corsair fire. No other race could have dared such a precise and potentially disastrous style of warfare; fighting in concert andperfect synchronicity, the Asuryani, Drukhari and Harlequins wove a dance of death between the searing energy columns that fell from the heavens and gutted every daemonic assault before it could break through the Aeldari lines. The fate of the conflict would be decided by the duel between Helbane and Yvraine’s champions."

is how it ends.

I can't imagine any book being released without models. That's pretty much inviting chapter house all over again. Given the way the shutdowns are going, I would be shocked to see engine war or the associated models before June at the earliest.

Engine war is supposed to come out next, and warhammer community has gone silent on it ? Now they post previews for war of the spider ? Whats going on ?? I want to see some new daemon rules previewed.

 p5freak wrote:
Engine war is supposed to come out next, and warhammer community has gone silent on it ? Now they post previews for war of the spider ? Whats going on ?? I want to see some new daemon rules previewed.

Covid19 is what's going on. GW is holding off on all releases (except White Dwarf it seems) until after everything calms down.

I said in another thread, it seems GW are playing it by ear, they are probably hoping the extent of the lockdown in the UK is relaxed soon (within the next month) so they can catch back up with their release schedule and release engine war fairly promptly, which is understandable as they probably have a lot of stock of the books already ready to go and they don't want to lose out on that by selling it digitally.

The problem with this strategy is if the UK lockdown is not relaxed in the next few weeks, and it drags on for months. They will either have a significant period of zero income then start selling again without trying to catch the schedule back up (effectively everything in the pipe is delayed by 3 months) or they try and release lots in a small time frame which can effect sales (only so many books and models people can afford in a month right?).

The downside to the first strategy is if it gives too much time for people to get bored and move away from the hobby/re-evaluate it's worth to them... This will be happening with sports also so GW is not immune from losing customers.

I think if it drags on longer than hoped (late summer till lockdown is lifted) they will have to take the hit and release digitally. Realistically, I think they will be able to open their warehouses and ship orders before that though, the stores won't be re-opened at the same time though.

Really weird times.

endlesswaltz123 wrote:
I said in another thread, it seems GW are playing it by ear, they are probably hoping the extent of the lockdown in the UK is relaxed soon (within the next month) so they can catch back up with their release schedule and release engine war fairly promptly, which is understandable as they probably have a lot of stock of the books already ready to go and they don't want to lose out on that by selling it digitally.

The problem with this strategy is if the UK lockdown is not relaxed in the next few weeks, and it drags on for months. They will either have a significant period of zero income then start selling again without trying to catch the schedule back up (effectively everything in the pipe is delayed by 3 months) or they try and release lots in a small time frame which can effect sales (only so many books and models people can afford in a month right?).

The downside to the first strategy is if it gives too much time for people to get bored and move away from the hobby/re-evaluate it's worth to them... This will be happening with sports also so GW is not immune from losing customers.

I think if it drags on longer than hoped (late summer till lockdown is lifted) they will have to take the hit and release digitally. Realistically, I think they will be able to open their warehouses and ship orders before that though, the stores won't be re-opened at the same time though.

Really weird times.

The other angle is that their consumer base has also taken a huge financial hit. Lots of people on furlough or unemployed because of business closures. Let’s face it, there are going to be a lot of local game shops that might not reopen because they exist month by month and with the door being shuttered it’s not very good for the business in general.

That’s partly what I meant when I referenced people re-evaluating it’s worth. Is your expensive plastic crack habit still justifiable in a financial uncertain world? Are you going to prioritise it over holidays, or socialising? That’s a choice a lot of people will have to make, some people won’t even have that luxury to choose, food on the table and a roof over their heads will be the absolute minimum they can do for a long time.

I expect GW to survive, but I think some projects could legitimately be mothballed for a long period of time till sale recover.

 p5freak wrote:
Engine war is supposed to come out next, and warhammer community has gone silent on it ? Now they post previews for war of the spider ? Whats going on ?? I want to see some new daemon rules previewed.

We didn't get any rules previews, period, for Engine War.

There's an interesting Voxcast bit up right now with Darren Latham and Jes Goodwin talking about the AdMech. There's definitely some teasers in there.

Sulphurhounds have what the notes label as "Phosphor Blastguns".

There is no point of releasing Engine War digitally from GW's point of view. They need to get the digital book, physical book, and associated models released together to get the best sales results.

So until GW gets model production back up and running, Engine War and it's rules previews will remain on hold.

As for the release schedule after that, while I am sure GW is frantically reworking that, it is all still mostly depended upon production. Remember they are a model company, not a game company. They need the models to go with the rules releases.