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2020/12/24 21:48:56
Subject: Conspiracy Theorists - a ‘but why?’ Discussion.
Bran Dawri wrote: I don't think there's an agenda behind that. It's pandering to the lowest common denominator - most people aren't very smart and think that's what smart people are like, so the media portray them that way, which reinforces the stereotype.
Since "smart people" aren't considered to be a minority that can be discriminated against, it's a fairly safe stereotype to use without getting accused of discriminating against anyone - which especially in comedy shows is a useful thing to have. Perceived unworldliness makes such characters a great straight man in setting up a joke.
Alternatively (or perhaps both are at play, one feeding off the other) there's a famous quote by Asimov about anti-intellectualism in the US that seems to point more towards a deeper cultural disdain for intellect that is being portrayed (and enhanced) by the media rather than them inventing it, at least when it comes to entertainment.
I'd say its a bit chicken and egg here. . . When I was in Uni, I saw a number of psychology studies that outlined how people, even unconsciously, start to exhibit traits that they see often enough on TV. Some religious "family advocacy groups" have picked up on this, and use the Disney Channel's programming as a prime example of how media is leading to kids disrespecting their parents and "getting away" with it. Other parenting groups have noted that, during the period of time when Tim Allen's "Home Improvement" was on, nearly every tv sitcom involving a family unit, portrayed the dad in much the same way as "Tim 'the toolman' Taylor" was, and thus have noticed an increase in "hapless morons with a heart of gold" fathers raising kids after that show.
As others have noted, media is out to make money, and in America, that means more more more. Look at the sport of football. When I was a teenager, NFL games were Monday nights, and Sunday. The only exception to that was the thanksgiving day doubleheader, and then saturday playoff games after the NCAA season was finished. . . . Today, you've got Monday nights, Thursday nights, Sunday and Sunday night primetime games. There's the occasional saturday primetime game, the entire pre-season is televised. IF you go to the right channel, you can watch old games any day of the week. You've got 24h channels devoted solely to "analysis" and highlights, explaining why a team is doing a thing better than another. Media execs said, "hey, the people like this football thing, lets give them so much football, 365 days a year!!! They'll love that!!"
Hell, even baseball, with its 162 game season does not go to the lengths that football has in terms of televising all the things all the time.
And, well, lets be real here. . . Most of us on this forum are reasonably intelligent/smart. We get and understand that learning things is hard, at least when compared to turning on whatever latest sitcom is on, and mindlessly soaking up nonsense for an hour a night. It makes total sense that people believe that society as a whole is getting dumber, given the spate of "popular" shows out there now, but to lay the blame solely on the media, and some conspiracy doesn't make much sense.
2020/12/24 22:52:24
Subject: Conspiracy Theorists - a ‘but why?’ Discussion.
Dumb TV can also be a pressure valve, or at least I’ve found it so.
I do a fairly stressful job. Whilst the stakes for me are low, I’m aware others have far more riding on it.
I’ve been doing it 8 years now - though 3ish my current role where it’s proper serious business.
When I’ve had A Heck Of A Day, I find a neat injection of pure, calculated stupidity genuinely helps. Something which makes me give a proper belly laugh of appreciation.
Examples include, but are by no means limited to......
Beavis & Butthead, Mr Pickles, What We Do In The Shadows, and a serious favourite, Uncle Grandpa. Really depends what I’m in the mood for. Uncle Grandpa is reserved for when I really, really need to disengage my brain.
Example for those unfamiliar?
Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?
Eh, I don't think society is particularly dumber that it always has been. We have regressed in some places, but moved forward in others. I'd even go so far as to say we've gotten smarter, as even the low-bar stupid shows need to pack in more content happening faster to keep up.
But while I have little concern over our intelligence score, I feel our wisdom score has suffered over the course of the 21st century. The internet proved to be a catalyst for the reaction between a certain portion of politics and US-led culture for an extremely loose definition of 'protected free speech'. It's a low wisdom score that more often than not feeds these conspiracy theories, and they only get fully stupid once they have the momentum of popularity to rope in the actual idiots while keeping the fools onboard.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/01/01 07:37:10
Matt Swain wrote: In the awful flash gordon one season series the SFC did Dr. Zarkov was a pathetic spazz...
Scotty was a spastic dweeb...
...a selfish, shallow, stupid blockhead...
As to why it's being done, maybe its because stupid, ignorant, self indulgent, selfish, shallow people are easier to manipulate and sell junk to than intelligent people. Maybe it's cheaper to dumb down the market that make useful, well designed products.
Maybe the reason intelligent people (or, rather, people engaged in performative impressions of what they think is intelligence) are so often lampooned is because of sneering, condescending, and aloof attitudes like this?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/01/01 09:31:55
2021/01/01 10:26:46
Subject: Conspiracy Theorists - a ‘but why?’ Discussion.
Matt Swain wrote: In the awful flash gordon one season series the SFC did Dr. Zarkov was a pathetic spazz...
Scotty was a spastic dweeb...
...a selfish, shallow, stupid blockhead...
As to why it's being done, maybe its because stupid, ignorant, self indulgent, selfish, shallow people are easier to manipulate and sell junk to than intelligent people. Maybe it's cheaper to dumb down the market that make useful, well designed products.
Maybe the reason intelligent people (or, rather, people engaged in performative impressions of what they think is intelligence) are so often lampooned is because of sneering, condescending, and aloof attitudes like this?
well, considering the attitudes of the most extreme cases of both sides, this is accurate:
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
2021/01/01 16:39:35
Subject: Conspiracy Theorists - a ‘but why?’ Discussion.
Thinking there is a war on intelligence means thinking that hundreds of writers that have no connection to one another are all just....deciding to write smart people as evil when the simple answer is ....people write what they have seen before.
As to TBBT portraying the smart people as bad. It doesn't. If you paid attention, they are never mocked or insulted for being intelligent unless it is by someone framed in the wrong.
They are mocked for the social ineptitude, which was never shown to be because they are smart. Infact they are praised for being smart often.
I wish people could actually watch the show.
5000pts 6000pts 3000pts
2021/01/01 22:05:01
Subject: Conspiracy Theorists - a ‘but why?’ Discussion.
hotsauceman1 wrote: Thinking there is a war on intelligence means thinking that hundreds of writers that have no connection to one another are all just....deciding to write smart people as evil when the simple answer is ....people write what they have seen before.
As to TBBT portraying the smart people as bad. It doesn't. If you paid attention, they are never mocked or insulted for being intelligent unless it is by someone framed in the wrong.
They are mocked for the social ineptitude, which was never shown to be because they are smart. Infact they are praised for being smart often.
I wish people could actually watch the show.
This. I don't particularly like the show, but the only time their intelligence is really mocked is when it is by one of the "smart ones".
Other than that, it is really just about their having issues with social interactions and basically making fun of people with aspergers.
2021/01/05 15:31:47
Subject: Conspiracy Theorists - a ‘but why?’ Discussion.
Yeah, I think CTs have been a danger for a bit longer than the last few months. This example is just a continuation of the MMR causes autism bullgak and the Bill Gates is creating a New World Order through microchips gibberish.
Sadly, it seems the real-world consequences of CT nutjobs continue to be all-too dangerous. Seems like there's pretty good evidence the Christmas Day bombing in Nashville was by some guy convinced 5G was evil or transmitting Covid or something. As if any more evidence were really needed, this is why I detest any arguments along the lines of "well, it could be true" or "we should keep an open mind" about stuff that is clearly whacko CT fodder. Mostly it's harmless, but in many cases it isn't and for that reason anyone who perpetuates these sort of CTs should be thoroughly ashamed of themselves.
2021/01/06 12:28:49
Subject: Conspiracy Theorists - a ‘but why?’ Discussion.
i miss the tidepod challange, the people there at most would be a danger to themselves.
As for the whole bombing, wasn't it pretty much clear from the get go that it was due to a covid 5G nutcase?
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
2021/01/06 15:03:24
Subject: Conspiracy Theorists - a ‘but why?’ Discussion.
Not Online!!! wrote: As for the whole bombing, wasn't it pretty much clear from the get go that it was due to a covid 5G nutcase?
My understanding was that there was some initial mystery because the perpetrator didn't release any sort of manifesto and make a big statement prior to the boom. He was identified fast, but because he was a recluse it took a bit to put together the reasons for why.
Yeah, now. See, if idiots want to believe that vaccines are evil (And I have just a little sympathy for them as vaccines are made by corporations and i understand people seeing everything corporations do as evil.) that's mostly on them and their kids, who i do pity.
But, when they start sabotaging vaccinations that the rest of us choose to get, that's a whole new level, and a real public threat.
On one hand i think america has way too many people doing waay too much time in it's for profit prison system, OTOH I think this guy needs to go to prison for at least a decade.
"But the universe is a big place, and whatever happens, you will not be missed..."
2021/01/06 20:50:43
Subject: Conspiracy Theorists - a ‘but why?’ Discussion.
As others have noted, media is out to make money, and in America, that means more more more. Look at the sport of football. When I was a teenager, NFL games were Monday nights, and Sunday. The only exception to that was the thanksgiving day doubleheader, and then saturday playoff games after the NCAA season was finished. . . . Today, you've got Monday nights, Thursday nights, Sunday and Sunday night primetime games. There's the occasional saturday primetime game, the entire pre-season is televised.
You think you got it bad - try watching football (soccer) in England. There's a game every night and for 10 hours each day on the weekend. Premier League, Championship, Champions League, UEFA Cup, FA Cup, League Cup - it's relentless! And between seasons we have the national competitions. And since I've been getting into (American) football more and more I have to pick and choose what to watch otherwise sports become mundane. And I'm double screwed if it's an F1 weekend, but at least that's only 2 hours on Saturday and 3 on Sunday.
But yeah, that's not a conspiracy, it's capitalism without a plan or understanding of how to make the product consumable.
2021/01/06 23:15:25
Subject: Re:Conspiracy Theorists - a ‘but why?’ Discussion.
I never thought I would see Americans advocating to overthrow their own democracy based on a bunch of easily disproved and debunked lies and conspiracy theories.
I feel that its getting closer to the time to start showing a lot less tolerance of "harmless" bs.
"All their ferocity was turned outwards, against enemies of the State, foreigners, traitors, saboteurs, thought-criminals" - Orwell, 1984
2021/01/06 23:18:04
Subject: Conspiracy Theorists - a ‘but why?’ Discussion.
I never thought I would see Americans advocating to overthrow their own democracy based on a bunch of easily disproved and debunked lies and conspiracy theories.
I feel that its getting closer to the time to start showing a lot less tolerance of "harmless" bs.
Right, because freedom of speech is clearly the problem here. We better had some more rights to the list while we’re at it just to make sure nobody even thinks about the need to reform antiquated election laws. Gotta male sure that any hyperbolic narrative the media churns out is parroted by as many people as possible.
Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
2021/01/07 00:08:15
Subject: Conspiracy Theorists - a ‘but why?’ Discussion.
I never thought I would see Americans advocating to overthrow their own democracy based on a bunch of easily disproved and debunked lies and conspiracy theories.
I feel that its getting closer to the time to start showing a lot less tolerance of "harmless" bs.
Right, because freedom of speech is clearly the problem here. We better had some more rights to the list while we’re at it just to make sure nobody even thinks about the need to reform antiquated election laws. Gotta male sure that any hyperbolic narrative the media churns out is parroted by as many people as possible.
I'm guessing you're not referring to the "hyperbolic narrative" of NTD, OAN and Fox then?
I think you have a problem when "freedom of speech advocates" are wandering around the houses of your democracy and attempting to overthrow legitimate democratic process advocated by the sitting President.
"All their ferocity was turned outwards, against enemies of the State, foreigners, traitors, saboteurs, thought-criminals" - Orwell, 1984
2021/01/07 00:22:35
Subject: Re:Conspiracy Theorists - a ‘but why?’ Discussion.
Notice how its usually the left on this board who starts the political crap throwing.
When 47% of the voters including 30% of democrat's think some hanky panky went on, the dumbest possible response the political class can use is STFU plebes, yet that's what they've been doing.
Honestly what it really is comes simply down to how lawsuits over libel/slander are approached in the US. Obviously there are a variety of legal details but the core concept is needing to prove that one entity spoke falsely with the specific intent of damaging another. Which is nearly impossible to prove. In the US lawsuits are one of the main mechanisms for regulating the behavior of groups/entities, so if those don't work things can run amok.
Jerram wrote: Notice how its usually the left on this board who starts the political crap throwing.
When 47% of the voters including 30% of democrat's think some hanky panky went on, the dumbest possible response the political class can use is STFU plebes, yet that's what they've been doing.
/
30% of Democrats? Can't see that figure in that report anywhere?
Besides, I'm not surprised that so many people "think" there was fraud when that is what has been said repeatedly by the media for months in the run up, lead by certain high profile politicians and commentators.
However, that means absolutely feth all without some sort of actual evidence. People "thinking" stuff means nothing. There have been ample opportunities to PROVE fraud occurred, however, and this is where the conspiracy theory bit comes in, they have been unable to and so blame a deep state cover up. Again without any evidence whatsoever.
Now, unable to accept that they have lost they have abandoned the principle of a peaceful transfer of power and just wish to coerce the system to give them what they want.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
NinthMusketeer wrote: Honestly what it really is comes simply down to how lawsuits over libel/slander are approached in the US. Obviously there are a variety of legal details but the core concept is needing to prove that one entity spoke falsely with the specific intent of damaging another. Which is nearly impossible to prove. In the US lawsuits are one of the main mechanisms for regulating the behavior of groups/entities, so if those don't work things can run amok.
Yes it was interesting to see how quickly retractions and "clarifications" were issued recently once the threat of legal action was pressed.
Perhaps that should be used more extensively? Say what you like, however, be prepared to back it up in court or have your arse sued off, or retract your BS.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/01/07 00:48:15
"All their ferocity was turned outwards, against enemies of the State, foreigners, traitors, saboteurs, thought-criminals" - Orwell, 1984
2021/01/07 00:52:15
Subject: Re:Conspiracy Theorists - a ‘but why?’ Discussion.
I never thought I would see Americans advocating to overthrow their own democracy based on a bunch of easily disproved and debunked lies and conspiracy theories.
I feel that its getting closer to the time to start showing a lot less tolerance of "harmless" bs.
Right, because freedom of speech is clearly the problem here. We better had some more rights to the list while we’re at it just to make sure nobody even thinks about the need to reform antiquated election laws. Gotta male sure that any hyperbolic narrative the media churns out is parroted by as many people as possible.
I'm guessing you're not referring to the "hyperbolic narrative" of NTD, OAN and Fox then?
I think you have a problem when "freedom of speech advocates" are wandering around the houses of your democracy and attempting to overthrow legitimate democratic process advocated by the sitting President.
I don’t know exactly which narratives those channels are promoting because I don’t have cable and don’t use their websites. From what I can gather Fox and OAN (I honestly don’t know what NTD is) have been pushing the same tired Democrats are Socialists, no wait, they’re Communists pretending to be Socialists who are taking over the Democratic Party and soon they’ll take over America and the. THE WORLD. They’re funded by a cabal of bakers that eat babies and gold leaf while worshipping pagan gods on an island, not Epstein’s Island they only go there on vacation. We have to stop them before they burn down all the churches and murder everyone who has an American flag in their yard or has attended a college football game which makes this election and every election an EXISTENTIAL THREAT!!!1!! If the Republicans don’t when every private business will be taxed out of existence to the point where Jeff Bezos will have to fly commercial. If we lose the election we’ll have exhausted the soap box and the ballot box so we’ll be forced to open up the cartridge box and water the tree of liberty with the blood of tyrants and by tyrants we mean anyone you didn’t vote for and also anyone you did vote for but who really don’t love the constitution enough.
That hyperbolic narrative is also terrible. Sure it’s amusing listening to conservative talk shows try to convince long time listeners that it’s actually not time for an armed revolt, the chair is NOT against the wall and John is totes clean shaven. Amusing but still not smart.
It’s not good when for profit media corporations chase ratings instead of actual news.
The specific narrative I was referring to in my previous post was the pearl clutching narrative that the videos of middle aged chubby people walking around the Capitol rotunda waving flags and shouting is the the darkest day in our national history even though for some reason those protestors were allowed to literally move barricades out the way and walk through the front door while Congress is in session. Protestors can get tear gassed and beaten by cops all summer long but somehow protestors can walk right through the front door into the Capitol and security could do nothing. Storming the Capitol wasn’t a smart move, people are going to get arrested and they really haven’t affected anything other than driving up weekday ratings and website views.
Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
2021/01/07 00:53:23
Subject: Re:Conspiracy Theorists - a ‘but why?’ Discussion.
5000pts 
6000pts 
3000pts
