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Beardedragon wrote:
Yikes i got destroyed during my battle with TS.

He brought 10 terminators that teleported around, and 3 Defilers, + 2 daemon princes and magnus. and some minor rubrics + a hellbrute. I brought 2 bonebreakers with MANZ in them, 50 boyz, 2x 5 kommandos and 15 tankbustas that i deepstriked. and 5 rokkit deffkoptas with a warboss on warbike. Sadly i lost the battle somewhat hard. He got turn one, which made a massive difference. I think i had a somewhat chance of winning if i went first, but i didnt. An army shouldnt fall or rise only based on whether one goes first or not, so my deployment was either bad, or my composition was bad.

In hindsight maybe i should have focused more on staying out of sight from his defilers with my bonebreakers, which i didnt. I started at the front line in the straightest and fastest line to his enemy line, for that T1 charge. If i was hidden, i could probably not do a turn 1 charge, which i wanted, but it left me open for being demolished by the defilers, staying far behind. The stage map also didnt help me. But i will use the army again against him i think, and try and play differently and better next time maybe.

On a positive notice his terminators, while being dangerous, didnt do AS much damage as i feared versus units in a KFF. even boyz.

Maybe ill try a more shooty list instead. i just dont have a lot of shooty units though

It looks like you fell into the typical (and saddening) pitfall of trying to run a combined arms style force as Orks. You simply dont have enough threat overload of either type of unit so your giving the enemy peak efficiency for all his types of guns. You either run all vehicles or all infantry (with a smattering of Trukks if you want to use MANZ), not a mix of either. High toughness doesnt really matter when it comes to fighting Thousand Sons, especially with Magnus in the list. MWs just bypass T8. From the looks of your list you tried to do a bit of everything, but that means you dont do anything well. You kind of want to make supremacy units that do their job well and dont really trade to do it. MANZ are great at that, hordes of Boyz/Buggies too but your list just feels too divided. 50 Boyz literally means nothing in this edition, the Scarab Occult would probably kill 25-30 in 1 turn.

Hopefully the new Codex will fix this issue for Orks, but right now you need to be more focused in your list building. Thousand Sons arent really a tough match up for Orks in either build whether thats greentide or speed freaks, the +1 save vs damage 1 can be a hard nut to crack though if your army doesnt really have the tools. Another thing about 9th edition, you dont have to charge turn 1. Conserve your units and commit them when the time is right to earn/deny victory points. Dont just kill things for the sake of killing things. Might sound unorky to be restrained and patient but thats something you eventually learn. Most people expect Ork players to be over the top and get tunnel vision, that might be true for the more casual Ork player but in competitive play you just need to slow things down. I wouldnt have thrown 2 Bonebreakas up turn 1, you exposed them and they died/failed at what you wanted them to do.

These are just a few bits of advice! How I play might not work for you but I have a pretty good track record with my Orks even though I play my Admech more nowadays (Won a fair few events and tournies in my day! )


Automatically Appended Next Post:

zoltan88 wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:

zoltan88 wrote:

Spoiler:

Anyone have any luck running Ghaz in a Deffskullz infantry list? This allows you to go heavy on elites with only 60 or less boyz.

Pros

1) less squishy boyz w/ 6++. Yes, I know they can get a 5++ with a KFF but that confines them to a 18" circle on the board. As soon as you da jump or simply move out of the bubble I find that they die to a stiff breeze before they ever get to use the benefits of skarboyz. Also, the 6++ works in melee.

2) obsec for all infantry - this is huge for MANz, nobz, kommandos, characters not named ghaz. I find that this alone gets me at least 10-15 points per game, and denies my opponent the same. that's a 20-30 point swing.

3) rerolls for Power Klaws, Killsaws, KMB dreads. Especially the reroll damage is very helpful.

4) Ghaz's great waaagh still works - advance & charge and +1A

Cons

1) Ghaz doesn't receive kultur benefits - I find that he doesn't need it

2) Ghaz' rerolling 1s aura turns off - At least for me this is only useful in certain situations. I find that I usually run ghaz away from the boyz to hide behind obstructing terrain as much as possible. As such, his auras rarely get used. Am I just doing this wrong?

3) No skarboyz - I find skarboyz is overkill for most things if the boyz can get in combat, and wasted if they die before they get there. Regular boyz with warpath can kill damn near anything and are more likely to survive the carnage.

If you're not running goff, why bother with Thrakka? A warboss on warbike does very similar damage to Thrakka without trait, so just save yourself the points.

That said, in my opinion skarboyz is what makes goff work, Thrakka is just the icing on the cake. Wounding marines on 3s is very much necessary to kill them reliably, and I've watched in disbelieve an entire mob of 30 ES bounce off a unit of deathshrouds who then turned around and murdered most of them.

I completely agree on Skarboyz. When I run goffs, that's an autotake and i'm also running thrakka. I ran a goffs list against blood angels last weekend and at the end of round 1, 60 boyz were dead with no chance to green tide. That wouldn't have happened if I was running deffskullz. Not having a save in melee against space marines is brutal. Almost everything has at least AP -1, and some chapters can even make sure they fight first. Even without the fight first, counter-offensive is something I see used often to soften the blow from a unit of boyz.

This was more of a question about using Thrakka in a Deffskullz list. I prefer deffskullz in 9th for the extra obsec units and the 6++ mainly. The extra re-rolls are a nice bonus and especially good on the weapons I mentioned in my original post. Being able to throw an obsec unit of MANZ or nobz on an objective is very useful. Thrakka at the very least is a huge distraction that affects deployment phase and draws attention to him rather than the boyz. Deffskullz thrakka is just as effective at demoralizing the opponent in melee. But from the sounds of it, no one here does this so forget I asked.

When you run a warboss on a warbike with a footslogging army, are you giving him follow me ladz and bubble wrapping him with boyz?

From my personal experience Ive never really valued the 6++ from Deathskulls. Yeah it might save a few Boyz here and there but the power behind Deathskulls is Obsec on all the infantry units and the rerolls they get that boost the accuracy and lethality of our units (mainly Boss Nobz and Rokkits/KMB). Whilst the 6++ is better than nothing, I havent really missed it when playing Evil Sunz, or when I used to play Goffs. No matter what Clan you play however, your gonna loose handfuls of Boyz, thats sadly the reality of 9th edition. Everything has more attacks, more strength, AP, Damage and synergies. Those same Blood Angels would of killed lets say 50 Deathskull Boyz, yeah you get to greentide them maybe but you havent really got any good odds to make the change from doing it, and youll probably still lose them the next turn again.

Deathskulls just dont feel like the best Clan to horde it out. They arent noticably tougher (if you have a KFF and Painboy) until they get into melee and even then I wouldnt really say its noticable. They arent the quickest to get into krumping range and they arent the most choppy when they reach melee. They are just great at holding objectives which is an amazing trait to have in 9th. As Jid has stated, I dont think you need Ghaz in this army, a standard Warboss of either kind is suitable for the job.

 deffrekka wrote:

Beardedragon wrote:
Yikes i got destroyed during my battle with TS.

He brought 10 terminators that teleported around, and 3 Defilers, + 2 daemon princes and magnus. and some minor rubrics + a hellbrute. I brought 2 bonebreakers with MANZ in them, 50 boyz, 2x 5 kommandos and 15 tankbustas that i deepstriked. and 5 rokkit deffkoptas with a warboss on warbike. Sadly i lost the battle somewhat hard. He got turn one, which made a massive difference. I think i had a somewhat chance of winning if i went first, but i didnt. An army shouldnt fall or rise only based on whether one goes first or not, so my deployment was either bad, or my composition was bad.

In hindsight maybe i should have focused more on staying out of sight from his defilers with my bonebreakers, which i didnt. I started at the front line in the straightest and fastest line to his enemy line, for that T1 charge. If i was hidden, i could probably not do a turn 1 charge, which i wanted, but it left me open for being demolished by the defilers, staying far behind. The stage map also didnt help me. But i will use the army again against him i think, and try and play differently and better next time maybe.

On a positive notice his terminators, while being dangerous, didnt do AS much damage as i feared versus units in a KFF. even boyz.

Maybe ill try a more shooty list instead. i just dont have a lot of shooty units though

It looks like you fell into the typical (and saddening) pitfall of trying to run a combined arms style force as Orks. You simply dont have enough threat overload of either type of unit so your giving the enemy peak efficiency for all his types of guns. You either run all vehicles or all infantry (with a smattering of Trukks if you want to use MANZ), not a mix of either. High toughness doesnt really matter when it comes to fighting Thousand Sons, especially with Magnus in the list. MWs just bypass T8. From the looks of your list you tried to do a bit of everything, but that means you dont do anything well. You kind of want to make supremacy units that do their job well and dont really trade to do it. MANZ are great at that, hordes of Boyz/Buggies too but your list just feels too divided. 50 Boyz literally means nothing in this edition, the Scarab Occult would probably kill 25-30 in 1 turn.

Hopefully the new Codex will fix this issue for Orks, but right now you need to be more focused in your list building. Thousand Sons arent really a tough match up for Orks in either build whether thats greentide or speed freaks, the +1 save vs damage 1 can be a hard nut to crack though if your army doesnt really have the tools. Another thing about 9th edition, you dont have to charge turn 1. Conserve your units and commit them when the time is right to earn/deny victory points. Dont just kill things for the sake of killing things. Might sound unorky to be restrained and patient but thats something you eventually learn. Most people expect Ork players to be over the top and get tunnel vision, that might be true for the more casual Ork player but in competitive play you just need to slow things down. I wouldnt have thrown 2 Bonebreakas up turn 1, you exposed them and they died/failed at what you wanted them to do.

These are just a few bits of advice! How I play might not work for you but I have a pretty good track record with my Orks even though I play my Admech more nowadays (Won a fair few events and tournies in my day! )

advice is advice and i take it either way (that sounded quite kinky actually). All advice is welcome.

But the thing about the T1 charge was, that his rubric marines, which blocked me, were right in front of the defilers. My idea was to charge in to the rubric marines, kill them, and consolidate in to the defilers. Yes eventually the bonebreakers would die, but my MANZ would spill out and cause havoc near his backline. One notable thing i didnt mention was that Magnus was in deepstrike so i had screened out my backline, and i didnt have to worry about him the first turn.

Sadly the whole charge and consolidate never happened because, well i didnt go first, nor was i hidden. The first Bonebreaker died turn 1 shooting, the other was down to less than a quarter hp.

But to be fair, my army did considerably worse than average in terms of die rolls. I had more dakka on my 5 deffkoptas and got only 1 extra hit roll, and i only managed to actually get 3 hit rolls total out of my 10 rokkits + more dakka. Only 1 wounded from there and he saved it. Maybe i was overconfident because i had never used deffkoptas nor tankbustas before, but i planned to have the first defiler die to my more dakka Deffkopta barrage in turn 1, and then turn 2, deploy the tankbustas, and pop the last 2 defilers with a mix of bomb squigs and the tankbustas themselves also with more dakka. This did not, at all go according to plan. Even if it would go according to plan, i think maybe i was a bit greedy in expecting my 5 deffkoptas to reliably kill the first defiler even.

When we reached turn 2 and i deployed my tankbustas, a lot of my important units, like MANZ and bonebreakers were dead so i just tried to kill magnus and a daemon prince with my 15 tankbustas with more dakka and all 6 bomb squigs. I know they are not vehicles, and they are stupid choices to go for, but i had already more or less lost at this point. Needless to say all 6 bomb squigs managed to deal 5 damage total, and my 15 tankbustas were split between 5 for magnus and 10 for another daemon prince (stupid choice but i was just trying stuff by then as i had already lost). the last 5 tankbustas hitting Magnus did no wounds. I dont even recall that they hit.

the 10 other tankbustas managed to make 3 wounds go through on his daemon prince. So needless to say, i had some very terrible rolling, with my rokkits, with my saves, with everything really.

Im not saying thats why i lost, but i definitely rolled way below average, in fact, ive never rolled so many 1's in my life as i did during that match.

I think the biggest problem i have with your advice (which isnt really the advice but ill elaborate) is my own lack of units. Im not able to make a fully mech or buggy list because.. well i have 3 buggies total, 1 KBB, 1 dragsta, 1 scrapjet.

This is what i have total, and with these units, would you mind actually give me your thoughts about what you think i should field? Like, lets say you know you should face Thousand Sons, of what units i have, what would you field? Because i want to play better. maybe by seeing what you would put down, i can understand better what you mean about peak efficiency. The way i see it, i thought it could be fun to field a maximum of MANZ maybe but i just dont have the actual models. The same goes for a big buggy list or 18 Mek Gunz but alas, i dont have them.


The point is, i dont think im fully able to actually field correct armies with what i have right now.

Do i go Goff infantry storm against him? why? str5 boyz are great but all is dust leaves them little to be desired, thats why i went with 50 boyz for simply meatshields. I thought about going infantry heavy Deathskulls with MANZ and Nobz, or maybe spice it up with a kannon wagon from the back and Zapzap.

Jidmah, do you really think, it is not waste of the relic to give Killa klaw on MA mek? He' s slow, stucked in back, T4 so die fast..

I'm thinking about this issue the whole week. MA mek withou killa klaw is useless. Right but does it even worth the points?

If you skip him to regular kff mek, you spare 60p and relic. That is prety huge.

I'm using MA Bigmek last few months and now I doubt about him...

Honestly when playing goff instead of the killa klaw a mega armor mek with the lukky stikk and kleverest boss leading a bunch of goff characters is pretty awesome.

Hmm, how would you run that? By nature it would be a bit of a slow burn army as you sort of need to footslog it to get everything in place at the right time. A bunch of bosses on foot, a megamek or two perhaps. Maybe toss in Ghaz to give them some extra attacks and re-rolls and of course a painboy to try and do some healing. Then fill the rest of the points with boyz or something for board control and look out sir?

cody.d. wrote:
Hmm, how would you run that? By nature it would be a bit of a slow burn army as you sort of need to footslog it to get everything in place at the right time. A bunch of bosses on foot, a megamek or two perhaps. Maybe toss in Ghaz to give them some extra attacks and re-rolls and of course a painboy to try and do some healing. Then fill the rest of the points with boyz or something for board control and look out sir?

Yeah, I find that tough to work out, since in a Goffs list your heavy hitters is Ghaz, the Mega Mek with the Killa Klaw and that's usually it. I've seen some people use the Painboy as the Lucky Stikk wielder instead of the Mega-mek, but usually it's 3 HQ's max that make the most of it, since regular warboss damage output is fairly low without the buffs from relics or the Biggest Boss Upgrade.

Painboy relic klaw
Mega armor Mek w lukky stikk, kff, kleverest boss
Ghaz
Waagh banner
2x5 mega armor nobs w dual klaws

30 skarboys 28skar boys (both nobs w killsaws)11x Gretchin (or 10 and ammo runt)
2x5 kommandos
2x shokk jump dragstas (w kustom job to keep them out of LOS or under kff)
Wazbom jet w kff

Something like that you can play w amounts... such as drop wazbom for burna bomber and take 10 more boyz instead of 11 Gretchin. You are not giving your opponent much to work with for secondaries except kill your characters.

goff characters
Mega Mek- 5 atks, 1+ hit and reroll hit and reroll wounds
Painboy- 5 atks , 1+ hit reroll wounds, reroll hit of 1
Ghaz- 5 atks, 1+ hit, reroll hit of 1
Waagh banner- 4 atks, 1+ hit (+1 choppa hit), reroll hit of 1
Mega armor nobs- 5 atks each, 3+ hit, reroll hit of 1

Plus whomever you give warlord trait too

The Waagh banner and Lucky stick feel a little redundant. Perhaps this style of list (until the codex drops) would work best as deffskulls. It allows the characters to be more independent and you can get some handy re-rolls for damage and wounds every now and then. 6 klaw bosses wandering around maybe each with their own bodyguard mob of boyz would give the same vibe of a bunch of characters each trying to show off and krump stuff.

Lukky stikk makes the bearer reroll hit and wounds and gives them plus any CHARACTERS +1 hit... essentially it turns any killsaw into a better killaklaw plus the aura is a bonus.

The banner nob is redundant on characters giving them multiple +1 to hits but it’s needed to make mega nobs reliable to hit... because 4+ to hit even w ghaz reroll 1 aura is bad. At least your characters won’t have to worry about neg to hit modifiers. You could remove banner nob for weirdboy but I don’t think it’s better.

 Tomsug wrote:
Jidmah, do you really think, it is not waste of the relic to give Killa klaw on MA mek? He' s slow, stucked in back, T4 so die fast..

I'm thinking about this issue the whole week. MA mek withou killa klaw is useless. Right but does it even worth the points?

If you skip him to regular kff mek, you spare 60p and relic. That is prety huge.

I'm using MA Bigmek last few months and now I doubt about him...

His speed doesn't matter as much anymore, as you will always have something to charge by turn 2. Just have him advance towards an objective without any detours, he can then either help your army take it or even capture it all by himself. The 2+/5++/6W makes him rather annoying to deal with, so against many armies you can just have him sit on an objective without any protection. I have had multiple games now where the MA big mek alone scored 10-15 VP, because my opponents couldn't get rid of it with secondary shooting and didn't have a spare unit that could take him in a fight.
If I have some MANz deployed on the table, they will often act as his bodyguard until the reach the first objective, where he then remains behind while the MANz move on for more fighting.

As for the lukky stick - in my opinion the primary value of the killa klaw is 3 damage and everything else is just a nice to have. Da lukky stick does not solve any of the problems the PK/killsaw have unless you throw brutal but kunnin' on the same character, just to end up with the same thing as if you had just given the character da killa klaw.
I've occasionally thrown da lukky stick as my second relic on painboyz, which actually is quite nice since it enables them to assassinate characters or allows them hurt vehicles reliably. Since it also negates -1 to hit shenanigans vs Thrakka I guess it was worth the CP is spent on it. Definitely bring it if you feel like running Makari, the little bugger won't hit gak otherwise.
On weirdboyz any relic feels wasted - they just deal too much damage to themselves and die if ever attacked in melee.

cody.d. wrote:

 addnid wrote:
Triple kill tank would probably work very well against TS

If you're using the bursta variant maybe? But then the gun feels fairly over kill for blasting apart the (currently one wound) troops. Though it fairs better against the termies.

The dakka variant on the other hand loses some of it's punch with the all is dust rule. Would you even be able to clear out a unit a turn? Don't get me wrong I adore killtanks, but against TS they may struggle.

I run only the dakka variant (bad moons has so far been the best), the bursta is too expensive IMHO. Well I think you have so many shots and so many attacks in CC that for a 275 point unit, you will get your kill count of rubrics even if they get 3+ or 4+ save.
And anyway, you can just engage them in CC and score with the rest of the list. Bad moon dakka kill tanks, and a deathskull battalion with many obsec infantry units, with a splash of smasha gunz. Works quite well honestly.
If you don't require much kills from the kill tank shots you don't really need to have them as bad moons. As deathskulls with a waagh banner and the deathskull psychic for the extra AP, they can do a number in CC.

Also their CC profile is quite good to deal damage to magnus, as their low AP¨is not an issue.

So I stand by my statement, triple dakka kill tanks is a fine way to beat TS

Has anyone tried an army with 30 Mega Nobz before? for the giggles.

Maybe followed by 1 or 2 KFF big meks.

Has anyone tried an army with 30 Mega Nobz before? for the giggles

Yes, it was really fun. Slow as hell (luckily, my opponent had no snipers to kill my weirdboy, so da jump was possible) and very heavy (only 10 of the nobs were the new plastics...), but my opponent (who fielded a rather fluff-oriented phobos centric marine force) had no means to get rid of so many 3 wound 2+ sv. I had a KFF, but it was actually not that necessary - there was just not so much Ap-4 or higher on the table, and with only grots as standard, you should definitely go Deathskull, so you already have a 6++...Doc and weirdboy seem more important.

Beardedragon wrote:
Has anyone tried an army with 30 Mega Nobz before? for the giggles.

Maybe followed by 1 or 2 KFF big meks.

I tried a list recently using them as Deffskullz for the Obsec (I was hard debating between that and Tin Eads, but Deffskullz won out for me), where they were supported by a Warboss on Foot, a Weirdboy, and 2 battlewagons, a bonebreaka and a big trakk to help ferry them to where they needed to be. I faced against a Khorne Daemon/World Eater list and lost because he got first turn and managed to block me off from key charges by using rhinos as screens between the terrain. It was a casual game, so I should have brought more fire support to help crack transports/deal damage from afar. It was definitely fun though.

I mean 10 MANZ is like 400 points with kill saws. so 30 would be 1200 points just of CC MANZ.

I really wish they would make MANZ better at shooting like other terminators, so we actually had good all rounder infantry in the elite section.

I only have 8 MANZ though, so im far away from trying 30 of em

Beardedragon wrote:
I mean 10 MANZ is like 400 points with kill saws. so 30 would be 1200 points just of CC MANZ.

I really wish they would make MANZ better at shooting like other terminators, so we actually had good all rounder infantry in the elite section.

I only have 8 MANZ though, so im far away from trying 30 of em

I remember that back in the old days of fandexes before we had mainline klan rules again in 8th ed, there were people who wrote the Bad Moonz fandex to have Meganobz with heavy and snazzy weapons attached to them rather than shootas and power klaws so that they could make the most of the Slow and Purposeful rule they used to have. They were basically our version of broadside battlesuits.

Honestly, whether or not their shooting is meaningful at all in our next codex will depend on what they do with shootas as a whole. Right now shootas are pretty meh in terms of mainline infantry weapons, especially on an Ork BS platform. Depending on how they buff big shootas, I think making them give an extra shot would make them more effective in terms of the volume of shots we get from it. Kustom Shootas should be our equivalent of master crafted bolters, Assault 4, AP-1 D2. That makes it so when they hit they actually do something versus just getting marginally more shoota shots.

Overall though, I'd rather Meganobz be more tough (T5, an extra wound?) or more killy (+1WS or +1A, +1D to melee attacks) to compete with the newer CC units. Shooting is better left for the specialists.

Since Terminators got the 3rd wound (and almost always the 3rd attack), they are in almost every possible way better than MANZ, which is really a shame... Better Shooting, built-in DS and invul save, more weapons options, options to field more than 30 (if you really want to), more buff characters plus all the other marine shenanigans (chapter tactics, ATSKNF, doctrines or even INNER CIRCLE) that are more than equivalent to our best clan traits, and that all for about the same points cost... Even in CC, marines are at least equal, the bonus strength and double-saw-option in my opinion don't make up for TH/SS... In comparison to a terminator, MANz should be a maximum of 30 points or get a significant stat boost...

I just want MANZ to be T5 and either have an extra attack or WS2+. A little bit tougher and a little bit killier. I wouldn't be shocked if they go up to 5" move since DGs termies went from 4 to 5.

With all of the above they'd be great IMO. Still weak to super high AP and/or flat damage 3 and terrible shooting, but at least they'd feel powerful in CC.

I wish they'd either let them have decent shooting or make them more durable/more effective in combat. Ever since -1 damage has been dropping I've lost a lot of the effectiveness on my Killsaws and Powerklaws against things like dreadnoughts or just deathguard in general. I have a LOT of Meganobz, not 30 but I can field a full squad of 10 of them. Just wish they were better.

My terminators feel significantly more durable and more powerful than my Meganobz, along with having significantly more powerful offense.

Making HIT EM HARDER a bespoke rule as opposed to a stratagem is a good step, its better than just flatout adjusting all Ork weapons up, or at least making Meganobz seem to be a cut above the rest which they should be. The reason I say this is because their isn't much point moving them down in price, as they already outcompete Nobz and making them cheaper just invalidates Nobz more. Make them worth what they cost, either through a durability buff, an offensive buff, or both.

One of the things I wish they'd do and this is more of a wishlist. Instead of just giving Deff Dreads a simple durability buff like -1 damage, give them the Ramshackle rule but also Dreaded Deff Machine as a bespoke rule. Let Ork vehicles be more potent on the offensive along with occasionally being more durable to weapons than a marine dreadnought. Also Killa Kanz should have Klan rules. It has been stated that most Orks don't realize that there is a Grot inside the thing and well they, along with mek gunz are the only units in their category that just don't benefit from Klan Rules or their counterparts. It would be like if Devastators didn't get the Imperial Fist chapter tactics because they're new, or perhaps more accurately Scouts. (and they shall know no unfavorable rules)...

well guessing from the cavedrawing video theres gonna be mega armor that isnt using klaws/saws.
Possible that spawns another meganob box with more melee weapons and theyre actually good, with shoulder-grot gunners n whatnot.
A guy can dream...

Also yeah Meganobz should be T5. Nobz in general should be T5 but Megas should definitely be T5.

Beardedragon wrote:

zoltan88 wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:

zoltan88 wrote:
This was more of a question about using Thrakka in a Deffskullz list. I prefer deffskullz in 9th for the extra obsec units and the 6++ mainly. The extra re-rolls are a nice bonus and especially good on the weapons I mentioned in my original post. Being able to throw an obsec unit of MANZ or nobz on an objective is very useful. Thrakka at the very least is a huge distraction that affects deployment phase and draws attention to him rather than the boyz. Deffskullz thrakka is just as effective at demoralizing the opponent in melee. But from the sounds of it, no one here does this so forget I asked.

"Distraction" and "Demoralizing" are just euphemisms for your opponent playing badly because he is afraid of a specific model though, not actual tactical assets. This can work, but you are essentially relying on your opponent to make mistakes. He should just be shooting Thrakka with big guns until he does 4 damage and keep shooting all the anti-infantry guns at your boyz.

When you run a warboss on a warbike with a footslogging army, are you giving him follow me ladz and bubble wrapping him with boyz?

The big thing the biker boss has over Thrakka is benefiting from LoS!, so you should always keep him near boyz so he can't be shot and arrives mostly unharmed. You hold him back until there is a good way to utilize his fighting power: take out a valuable target, clear out objectives or make a path for your boyz. With biggest boss, he usually survives his first fight and can get into a second, if he survives till late game, he can often flip objectives all on his own.
If I make him a warlord, I run him with Brutal But Kunnin' and a killsaw, so I can have the killa klaw for a MA big mek.
If you feel like you need the Waaagh! aura, just run a foot warboss instead of a big mek. For a third choice, I feel like a weird boy might be a good choice to fight all the powerful combatants you are facing so you can buff your boyz and debuff the enemy.

Form your explanations, it also feels like there is another issue, getting 60 orks blended in turn one isn't normal in 9th, and a 6++ would still cause you to lose 50 of those boyz. Maybe expand on what your game plan usually is?

I won that match. I am just offering an example of how squishy boyz are. Having 10 boyz left can be huge for stalling an army for another turn, and/or being able to use your green tide strategem. Way to ignore the fact that I was playing blood angles who can deploy 9" away from your units and nearly every other fact that I presented. If an army with that capability wants to kill 60 boyz turn 1, they will have no problem doing so.

This site sucks. There's 2-3 people that respond to every question with their advice based on the pre-text that they think orks are terrible and unplayable until we get our new codex. I literally asked if anyone has experience using ghaz in a deffskullz list and I still don't have an answer. Just multiple judgmental responses that assume I must not know what I'm doing because I'm asking an outside the box question.

I have made a list for deathskulls with Ghaz in it, but sadly i havent tried it yet. Im also not the most skilled nor the guy with the most models to make the best combinations of units. So sadly i have no knowledge of having Ghaz in anything BUT a Goff detatchment.


But ive seen Ghaz in different klans on youtube battle repports. I think i once saw him in a bad moonz group as well, holding the line in a chokepoint while the backline was shooting.

But i do think Ghaz in a deathskulls army could work. and i mean think, because i havent tried it. The idea of deathskulls infantry army with MANz and blobs of boyz or maybe even Nobz, which would be more duable due to the 6++ and then having Ghaz as well, might be an interesting way of going about it. While i do think the 6++ is great, im more about that reroll and Obsec from deathskulls though. I feel like thats where its at, for things like maybe buggies and such.

if im not mistaken, i think that Dangliboy ork youtuber showed a winning tournement list with a ghaz in a deathskulls company. But im not 100% sure if my memory is right on that point.

If I may, I can tell you about my exp with a mechanized DS list with Ghaz.

Ghaz
Weirdboy-mek with da jump, warpath and DS relic
2x10grot
1x28 boys with nob dual saw
1x5 MANs
9+1 nobs with bc on a trukk
3scrap with corkscrew
Morkanaut with sparkly bits
Battlewagon with death rolla.

So basically you divide the force on classical hammer and anvil. Hammer holds the battlewagon with MANs and 1xgrot (to absorb casualties (block charges after explosions or even grot shield on the MANs), also Ghazz and as second line and fast reaction the trukk with nobs. Anvil flank has the morka scorted by the scraps.

Boys are utility. I use da jump to send them forward into objetives or simply blocking the enemies advance.

The "synergy" from Ghaz is on the heavy obsec hitters giving them +1 or +2 attacks (warpath) and run and charge.

Usually Ghaz is ignored until turn 3 as battlewagon and morka are much pressing threats for antitank and then is when he can krump some hummies!

Weirdboy is my warlod with kunning but brutal and after jumping the boys hands around fixing vehicles, smitting and buffing things.

Orkimedez_Atalaya wrote:

Beardedragon wrote:

zoltan88 wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:

zoltan88 wrote:
This was more of a question about using Thrakka in a Deffskullz list. I prefer deffskullz in 9th for the extra obsec units and the 6++ mainly. The extra re-rolls are a nice bonus and especially good on the weapons I mentioned in my original post. Being able to throw an obsec unit of MANZ or nobz on an objective is very useful. Thrakka at the very least is a huge distraction that affects deployment phase and draws attention to him rather than the boyz. Deffskullz thrakka is just as effective at demoralizing the opponent in melee. But from the sounds of it, no one here does this so forget I asked.

"Distraction" and "Demoralizing" are just euphemisms for your opponent playing badly because he is afraid of a specific model though, not actual tactical assets. This can work, but you are essentially relying on your opponent to make mistakes. He should just be shooting Thrakka with big guns until he does 4 damage and keep shooting all the anti-infantry guns at your boyz.

When you run a warboss on a warbike with a footslogging army, are you giving him follow me ladz and bubble wrapping him with boyz?

The big thing the biker boss has over Thrakka is benefiting from LoS!, so you should always keep him near boyz so he can't be shot and arrives mostly unharmed. You hold him back until there is a good way to utilize his fighting power: take out a valuable target, clear out objectives or make a path for your boyz. With biggest boss, he usually survives his first fight and can get into a second, if he survives till late game, he can often flip objectives all on his own.
If I make him a warlord, I run him with Brutal But Kunnin' and a killsaw, so I can have the killa klaw for a MA big mek.
If you feel like you need the Waaagh! aura, just run a foot warboss instead of a big mek. For a third choice, I feel like a weird boy might be a good choice to fight all the powerful combatants you are facing so you can buff your boyz and debuff the enemy.

Form your explanations, it also feels like there is another issue, getting 60 orks blended in turn one isn't normal in 9th, and a 6++ would still cause you to lose 50 of those boyz. Maybe expand on what your game plan usually is?

I won that match. I am just offering an example of how squishy boyz are. Having 10 boyz left can be huge for stalling an army for another turn, and/or being able to use your green tide strategem. Way to ignore the fact that I was playing blood angles who can deploy 9" away from your units and nearly every other fact that I presented. If an army with that capability wants to kill 60 boyz turn 1, they will have no problem doing so.

This site sucks. There's 2-3 people that respond to every question with their advice based on the pre-text that they think orks are terrible and unplayable until we get our new codex. I literally asked if anyone has experience using ghaz in a deffskullz list and I still don't have an answer. Just multiple judgmental responses that assume I must not know what I'm doing because I'm asking an outside the box question.

I have made a list for deathskulls with Ghaz in it, but sadly i havent tried it yet. Im also not the most skilled nor the guy with the most models to make the best combinations of units. So sadly i have no knowledge of having Ghaz in anything BUT a Goff detatchment.


But ive seen Ghaz in different klans on youtube battle repports. I think i once saw him in a bad moonz group as well, holding the line in a chokepoint while the backline was shooting.

But i do think Ghaz in a deathskulls army could work. and i mean think, because i havent tried it. The idea of deathskulls infantry army with MANz and blobs of boyz or maybe even Nobz, which would be more duable due to the 6++ and then having Ghaz as well, might be an interesting way of going about it. While i do think the 6++ is great, im more about that reroll and Obsec from deathskulls though. I feel like thats where its at, for things like maybe buggies and such.

if im not mistaken, i think that Dangliboy ork youtuber showed a winning tournement list with a ghaz in a deathskulls company. But im not 100% sure if my memory is right on that point.

If I may, I can tell you about my exp with a mechanized DS list with Ghaz.

Ghaz
Weirdboy-mek with da jump, warpath and DS relic
2x10grot
1x28 boys with nob dual saw
1x5 MANs
9+1 nobs with bc on a trukk
3scrap with corkscrew
Morkanaut with sparkly bits
Battlewagon with death rolla forktress

So basically you divide the force on classical hammer and anvil. Hammer holds the battlewagon with MANs and 1xgrot (to absorb casualties (block charges after explosions or even grot shield on the MANs), also Ghazz and as second line and fast reaction the trukk with nobs. Anvil flank has the morka scorted by the scraps.

Boys are utility. I use da jump to send them forward into objetives or simply blocking the enemies advance.

The "synergy" from Ghaz is on the heavy obsec hitters giving them +1 or +2 attacks (warpath) and run and charge.

Usually Ghaz is ignored until turn 3 as battlewagon and morka are much pressing threats for antitank and then is when he can krump some hummies!

Weirdboy is my warlod with kunning but brutal and after jumping the boys hands around fixing vehicles, smitting and buffing things.

Orkimedez_Atalaya wrote:

Beardedragon wrote:

zoltan88 wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:

zoltan88 wrote:
This was more of a question about using Thrakka in a Deffskullz list. I prefer deffskullz in 9th for the extra obsec units and the 6++ mainly. The extra re-rolls are a nice bonus and especially good on the weapons I mentioned in my original post. Being able to throw an obsec unit of MANZ or nobz on an objective is very useful. Thrakka at the very least is a huge distraction that affects deployment phase and draws attention to him rather than the boyz. Deffskullz thrakka is just as effective at demoralizing the opponent in melee. But from the sounds of it, no one here does this so forget I asked.

"Distraction" and "Demoralizing" are just euphemisms for your opponent playing badly because he is afraid of a specific model though, not actual tactical assets. This can work, but you are essentially relying on your opponent to make mistakes. He should just be shooting Thrakka with big guns until he does 4 damage and keep shooting all the anti-infantry guns at your boyz.

When you run a warboss on a warbike with a footslogging army, are you giving him follow me ladz and bubble wrapping him with boyz?

The big thing the biker boss has over Thrakka is benefiting from LoS!, so you should always keep him near boyz so he can't be shot and arrives mostly unharmed. You hold him back until there is a good way to utilize his fighting power: take out a valuable target, clear out objectives or make a path for your boyz. With biggest boss, he usually survives his first fight and can get into a second, if he survives till late game, he can often flip objectives all on his own.
If I make him a warlord, I run him with Brutal But Kunnin' and a killsaw, so I can have the killa klaw for a MA big mek.
If you feel like you need the Waaagh! aura, just run a foot warboss instead of a big mek. For a third choice, I feel like a weird boy might be a good choice to fight all the powerful combatants you are facing so you can buff your boyz and debuff the enemy.

Form your explanations, it also feels like there is another issue, getting 60 orks blended in turn one isn't normal in 9th, and a 6++ would still cause you to lose 50 of those boyz. Maybe expand on what your game plan usually is?

I won that match. I am just offering an example of how squishy boyz are. Having 10 boyz left can be huge for stalling an army for another turn, and/or being able to use your green tide strategem. Way to ignore the fact that I was playing blood angles who can deploy 9" away from your units and nearly every other fact that I presented. If an army with that capability wants to kill 60 boyz turn 1, they will have no problem doing so.

This site sucks. There's 2-3 people that respond to every question with their advice based on the pre-text that they think orks are terrible and unplayable until we get our new codex. I literally asked if anyone has experience using ghaz in a deffskullz list and I still don't have an answer. Just multiple judgmental responses that assume I must not know what I'm doing because I'm asking an outside the box question.

I have made a list for deathskulls with Ghaz in it, but sadly i havent tried it yet. Im also not the most skilled nor the guy with the most models to make the best combinations of units. So sadly i have no knowledge of having Ghaz in anything BUT a Goff detatchment.


But ive seen Ghaz in different klans on youtube battle repports. I think i once saw him in a bad moonz group as well, holding the line in a chokepoint while the backline was shooting.

But i do think Ghaz in a deathskulls army could work. and i mean think, because i havent tried it. The idea of deathskulls infantry army with MANz and blobs of boyz or maybe even Nobz, which would be more duable due to the 6++ and then having Ghaz as well, might be an interesting way of going about it. While i do think the 6++ is great, im more about that reroll and Obsec from deathskulls though. I feel like thats where its at, for things like maybe buggies and such.

if im not mistaken, i think that Dangliboy ork youtuber showed a winning tournement list with a ghaz in a deathskulls company. But im not 100% sure if my memory is right on that point.

If I may, I can tell you about my exp with a mechanized DS list with Ghaz.

Ghaz
Weirdboy-mek with da jump, warpath and DS relic
2x10grot
1x28 boys with nob dual saw
1x5 MANs
9+1 nobs with bc on a trukk
3scrap with corkscrew
Morkanaut with sparkly bits
Battlewagon with death rolla.

So basically you divide the force on classical hammer and anvil. Hammer holds the battlewagon with MANs and 1xgrot (to absorb casualties (block charges after explosions or even grot shield on the MANs), also Ghazz and as second line and fast reaction the trukk with nobs. Anvil flank has the morka scorted by the scraps.

Boys are utility. I use da jump to send them forward into objetives or simply blocking the enemies advance.

The "synergy" from Ghaz is on the heavy obsec hitters giving them +1 or +2 attacks (warpath) and run and charge.

Usually Ghaz is ignored until turn 3 as battlewagon and morka are much pressing threats for antitank and then is when he can krump some hummies!

Weirdboy is my warlod with kunning but brutal and after jumping the boys hands around fixing vehicles, smitting and buffing things.

Im assuming the MANZ are inside the battlewagon, so how are the grots meant to take casulties instead? Grot Shields only work on infantry.

But interesting combination of units. Does it do well at all?


Also guys:

How much of a priority is it for you to bring a painboy if you bring Ghazzy?

Beardedragon wrote:

Ghaz
Weirdboy-mek with da jump, warpath and DS relic
2x10grot
1x28 boys with nob dual saw
1x5 MANs
9+1 nobs with bc on a trukk
3scrap with corkscrew
Morkanaut with sparkly bits
Battlewagon with death rolla

Yeah, I played againts such list twice and always beat them like a hell. And played it twice myself. And always lose masivelly. Such list suffers elementary problem of the mixed ork lists.

Orks are weak. Die fast. Do not survive. 6++ doesn' t save you.

Only way how to keep army alive is to spam one type of target.

Such list has not enought boyz to flood the field right and not enought heavy vehicles to ignore anti infantry weapons.

 addnid wrote:

cody.d. wrote:

 addnid wrote:
Triple kill tank would probably work very well against TS

If you're using the bursta variant maybe? But then the gun feels fairly over kill for blasting apart the (currently one wound) troops. Though it fairs better against the termies.

The dakka variant on the other hand loses some of it's punch with the all is dust rule. Would you even be able to clear out a unit a turn? Don't get me wrong I adore killtanks, but against TS they may struggle.

I run only the dakka variant (bad moons has so far been the best), the bursta is too expensive IMHO. Well I think you have so many shots and so many attacks in CC that for a 275 point unit, you will get your kill count of rubrics even if they get 3+ or 4+ save.
And anyway, you can just engage them in CC and score with the rest of the list. Bad moon dakka kill tanks, and a deathskull battalion with many obsec infantry units, with a splash of smasha gunz. Works quite well honestly.
If you don't require much kills from the kill tank shots you don't really need to have them as bad moons. As deathskulls with a waagh banner and the deathskull psychic for the extra AP, they can do a number in CC.

Also their CC profile is quite good to deal damage to magnus, as their low AP¨is not an issue.

So I stand by my statement, triple dakka kill tanks is a fine way to beat TS

I dunno, the bursta does pretty dirty things to Gravis type targets and tanks alike. Personally I like both in a list.

Beardedragon wrote:

Orkimedez_Atalaya wrote:

Beardedragon wrote:

zoltan88 wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:

zoltan88 wrote:
This was more of a question about using Thrakka in a Deffskullz list. I prefer deffskullz in 9th for the extra obsec units and the 6++ mainly. The extra re-rolls are a nice bonus and especially good on the weapons I mentioned in my original post. Being able to throw an obsec unit of MANZ or nobz on an objective is very useful. Thrakka at the very least is a huge distraction that affects deployment phase and draws attention to him rather than the boyz. Deffskullz thrakka is just as effective at demoralizing the opponent in melee. But from the sounds of it, no one here does this so forget I asked.

"Distraction" and "Demoralizing" are just euphemisms for your opponent playing badly because he is afraid of a specific model though, not actual tactical assets. This can work, but you are essentially relying on your opponent to make mistakes. He should just be shooting Thrakka with big guns until he does 4 damage and keep shooting all the anti-infantry guns at your boyz.

When you run a warboss on a warbike with a footslogging army, are you giving him follow me ladz and bubble wrapping him with boyz?

The big thing the biker boss has over Thrakka is benefiting from LoS!, so you should always keep him near boyz so he can't be shot and arrives mostly unharmed. You hold him back until there is a good way to utilize his fighting power: take out a valuable target, clear out objectives or make a path for your boyz. With biggest boss, he usually survives his first fight and can get into a second, if he survives till late game, he can often flip objectives all on his own.
If I make him a warlord, I run him with Brutal But Kunnin' and a killsaw, so I can have the killa klaw for a MA big mek.
If you feel like you need the Waaagh! aura, just run a foot warboss instead of a big mek. For a third choice, I feel like a weird boy might be a good choice to fight all the powerful combatants you are facing so you can buff your boyz and debuff the enemy.

Form your explanations, it also feels like there is another issue, getting 60 orks blended in turn one isn't normal in 9th, and a 6++ would still cause you to lose 50 of those boyz. Maybe expand on what your game plan usually is?

I won that match. I am just offering an example of how squishy boyz are. Having 10 boyz left can be huge for stalling an army for another turn, and/or being able to use your green tide strategem. Way to ignore the fact that I was playing blood angles who can deploy 9" away from your units and nearly every other fact that I presented. If an army with that capability wants to kill 60 boyz turn 1, they will have no problem doing so.

This site sucks. There's 2-3 people that respond to every question with their advice based on the pre-text that they think orks are terrible and unplayable until we get our new codex. I literally asked if anyone has experience using ghaz in a deffskullz list and I still don't have an answer. Just multiple judgmental responses that assume I must not know what I'm doing because I'm asking an outside the box question.

I have made a list for deathskulls with Ghaz in it, but sadly i havent tried it yet. Im also not the most skilled nor the guy with the most models to make the best combinations of units. So sadly i have no knowledge of having Ghaz in anything BUT a Goff detatchment.


But ive seen Ghaz in different klans on youtube battle repports. I think i once saw him in a bad moonz group as well, holding the line in a chokepoint while the backline was shooting.

But i do think Ghaz in a deathskulls army could work. and i mean think, because i havent tried it. The idea of deathskulls infantry army with MANz and blobs of boyz or maybe even Nobz, which would be more duable due to the 6++ and then having Ghaz as well, might be an interesting way of going about it. While i do think the 6++ is great, im more about that reroll and Obsec from deathskulls though. I feel like thats where its at, for things like maybe buggies and such.

if im not mistaken, i think that Dangliboy ork youtuber showed a winning tournement list with a ghaz in a deathskulls company. But im not 100% sure if my memory is right on that point.

If I may, I can tell you about my exp with a mechanized DS list with Ghaz.

Ghaz
Weirdboy-mek with da jump, warpath and DS relic
2x10grot
1x28 boys with nob dual saw
1x5 MANs
9+1 nobs with bc on a trukk
3scrap with corkscrew
Morkanaut with sparkly bits
Battlewagon with death rolla.

So basically you divide the force on classical hammer and anvil. Hammer holds the battlewagon with MANs and 1xgrot (to absorb casualties (block charges after explosions or even grot shield on the MANs), also Ghazz and as second line and fast reaction the trukk with nobs. Anvil flank has the morka scorted by the scraps.

Boys are utility. I use da jump to send them forward into objetives or simply blocking the enemies advance.

The "synergy" from Ghaz is on the heavy obsec hitters giving them +1 or +2 attacks (warpath) and run and charge.

Usually Ghaz is ignored until turn 3 as battlewagon and morka are much pressing threats for antitank and then is when he can krump some hummies!

Weirdboy is my warlod with kunning but brutal and after jumping the boys hands around fixing vehicles, smitting and buffing things.

Im assuming the MANZ are inside the battlewagon, so how are the grots meant to take casulties instead? Grot Shields only work on infantry.

But interesting combination of units. Does it do well at all?


Also guys:

How much of a priority is it for you to bring a painboy if you bring Ghazzy?

When the transport dies you roll a number of dices equal to the transported minis. The rules does not force you to roll them by units. So I roll 10+5 dices. Each 1 is a dead gretchin. Thus saving my MANs.

As for results. So far so good. Running it in a local league I am on semi finals 5-0 so far. Went against ultras twice, custodes, deathwatch and chaos.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Tomsug wrote:

Beardedragon wrote:

Ghaz
Weirdboy-mek with da jump, warpath and DS relic
2x10grot
1x28 boys with nob dual saw
1x5 MANs
9+1 nobs with bc on a trukk
3scrap with corkscrew
Morkanaut with sparkly bits
Battlewagon with death rolla

Yeah, I played againts such list twice and always beat them like a hell. And played it twice myself. And always lose masivelly. Such list suffers elementary problem of the mixed ork lists.

Orks are weak. Die fast. Do not survive. 6++ doesn' t save you.

Only way how to keep army alive is to spam one type of target.

Such list has not enought boyz to flood the field right and not enought heavy vehicles to ignore anti infantry weapons.

What can I say, we had different experiences.

zoltan88 wrote:
I won that match. I am just offering an example of how squishy boyz are. Having 10 boyz left can be huge for stalling an army for another turn, and/or being able to use your green tide strategem. Way to ignore the fact that I was playing blood angles who can deploy 9" away from your units and nearly every other fact that I presented. If an army with that capability wants to kill 60 boyz turn 1, they will have no problem doing so.

This site sucks. There's 2-3 people that respond to every question with their advice based on the pre-text that they think orks are terrible and unplayable until we get our new codex. I literally asked if anyone has experience using ghaz in a deffskullz list and I still don't have an answer. Just multiple judgmental responses that assume I must not know what I'm doing because I'm asking an outside the box question.

First, check your attitude. I have run Gazzy in a DS list. It doesn't work - you can't heal him. You would need to bring a Goff detachment too. In mono DS skulls he loses the one thing he does well - which is avoid dieing quick. I have since removed Gazzy from my list ideas because I find the biker boss with killer klaw annd brutal but kunning actually hits way more reliably because it isn't terrified of rolling 1s like Gazzy. I had Gazzy go into two kabalite warriors yesterday and he killed 1, the dude is dead to me.

Now, to actually add some discussion, below is a thought on a While We Stand list for orks. Will try it out and let you guys know how it does - it might be a stupid idea.

Orkimedez_Atalaya wrote:

When the transport dies you roll a number of dices equal to the transported minis. The rules does not force you to roll them by units. So I roll 10+5 dices. Each 1 is a dead gretchin. Thus saving my MANs.

This is right. Plus you can put grots between enemy and MANz and protect them againts charge. And also protect them againts shooting. Grot shield has in fact almost no sence, but his existence is massive psychological weapon, that usually makes enemies shoot the grots first and MANz after.

Plus you can use emergency disembark for cheap - just kill more grots - and put your MANz in 6”. So it' s hard to kill them by blocking the space for disembark and easy to do some cool tricks about LOS or securing objectives.

Anyway - running MANz in transport without “ablative wounds” for case of destruction of the transport seems to me like a wasting. Transport with MANz is always destroied pretty fast and you roll some 1 almost every time and one MAN is 40p and about 20-33% of the squad. So let him die because of one roll seems to be stupid...

 Grimskul wrote:

Beardedragon wrote:
I mean 10 MANZ is like 400 points with kill saws. so 30 would be 1200 points just of CC MANZ.

I really wish they would make MANZ better at shooting like other terminators, so we actually had good all rounder infantry in the elite section.

I only have 8 MANZ though, so im far away from trying 30 of em

I remember that back in the old days of fandexes before we had mainline klan rules again in 8th ed, there were people who wrote the Bad Moonz fandex to have Meganobz with heavy and snazzy weapons attached to them rather than shootas and power klaws so that they could make the most of the Slow and Purposeful rule they used to have. They were basically our version of broadside battlesuits.

Honestly, whether or not their shooting is meaningful at all in our next codex will depend on what they do with shootas as a whole. Right now shootas are pretty meh in terms of mainline infantry weapons, especially on an Ork BS platform. Depending on how they buff big shootas, I think making them give an extra shot would make them more effective in terms of the volume of shots we get from it. Kustom Shootas should be our equivalent of master crafted bolters, Assault 4, AP-1 D2. That makes it so when they hit they actually do something versus just getting marginally more shoota shots.

Overall though, I'd rather Meganobz be more tough (T5, an extra wound?) or more killy (+1WS or +1A, +1D to melee attacks) to compete with the newer CC units. Shooting is better left for the specialists.

Great, now I have those cool expectations that are going to be shattered when the new dex hits Love the idea of rediculously rich, tooled for max dakka MANZ

Orkimedez_Atalaya wrote:

Beardedragon wrote:

Orkimedez_Atalaya wrote:

Beardedragon wrote:

zoltan88 wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:

zoltan88 wrote:
This was more of a question about using Thrakka in a Deffskullz list. I prefer deffskullz in 9th for the extra obsec units and the 6++ mainly. The extra re-rolls are a nice bonus and especially good on the weapons I mentioned in my original post. Being able to throw an obsec unit of MANZ or nobz on an objective is very useful. Thrakka at the very least is a huge distraction that affects deployment phase and draws attention to him rather than the boyz. Deffskullz thrakka is just as effective at demoralizing the opponent in melee. But from the sounds of it, no one here does this so forget I asked.

"Distraction" and "Demoralizing" are just euphemisms for your opponent playing badly because he is afraid of a specific model though, not actual tactical assets. This can work, but you are essentially relying on your opponent to make mistakes. He should just be shooting Thrakka with big guns until he does 4 damage and keep shooting all the anti-infantry guns at your boyz.

When you run a warboss on a warbike with a footslogging army, are you giving him follow me ladz and bubble wrapping him with boyz?

The big thing the biker boss has over Thrakka is benefiting from LoS!, so you should always keep him near boyz so he can't be shot and arrives mostly unharmed. You hold him back until there is a good way to utilize his fighting power: take out a valuable target, clear out objectives or make a path for your boyz. With biggest boss, he usually survives his first fight and can get into a second, if he survives till late game, he can often flip objectives all on his own.
If I make him a warlord, I run him with Brutal But Kunnin' and a killsaw, so I can have the killa klaw for a MA big mek.
If you feel like you need the Waaagh! aura, just run a foot warboss instead of a big mek. For a third choice, I feel like a weird boy might be a good choice to fight all the powerful combatants you are facing so you can buff your boyz and debuff the enemy.

Form your explanations, it also feels like there is another issue, getting 60 orks blended in turn one isn't normal in 9th, and a 6++ would still cause you to lose 50 of those boyz. Maybe expand on what your game plan usually is?

I won that match. I am just offering an example of how squishy boyz are. Having 10 boyz left can be huge for stalling an army for another turn, and/or being able to use your green tide strategem. Way to ignore the fact that I was playing blood angles who can deploy 9" away from your units and nearly every other fact that I presented. If an army with that capability wants to kill 60 boyz turn 1, they will have no problem doing so.

This site sucks. There's 2-3 people that respond to every question with their advice based on the pre-text that they think orks are terrible and unplayable until we get our new codex. I literally asked if anyone has experience using ghaz in a deffskullz list and I still don't have an answer. Just multiple judgmental responses that assume I must not know what I'm doing because I'm asking an outside the box question.

I have made a list for deathskulls with Ghaz in it, but sadly i havent tried it yet. Im also not the most skilled nor the guy with the most models to make the best combinations of units. So sadly i have no knowledge of having Ghaz in anything BUT a Goff detatchment.


But ive seen Ghaz in different klans on youtube battle repports. I think i once saw him in a bad moonz group as well, holding the line in a chokepoint while the backline was shooting.

But i do think Ghaz in a deathskulls army could work. and i mean think, because i havent tried it. The idea of deathskulls infantry army with MANz and blobs of boyz or maybe even Nobz, which would be more duable due to the 6++ and then having Ghaz as well, might be an interesting way of going about it. While i do think the 6++ is great, im more about that reroll and Obsec from deathskulls though. I feel like thats where its at, for things like maybe buggies and such.

if im not mistaken, i think that Dangliboy ork youtuber showed a winning tournement list with a ghaz in a deathskulls company. But im not 100% sure if my memory is right on that point.

If I may, I can tell you about my exp with a mechanized DS list with Ghaz.

Ghaz
Weirdboy-mek with da jump, warpath and DS relic
2x10grot
1x28 boys with nob dual saw
1x5 MANs
9+1 nobs with bc on a trukk
3scrap with corkscrew
Morkanaut with sparkly bits
Battlewagon with death rolla.

So basically you divide the force on classical hammer and anvil. Hammer holds the battlewagon with MANs and 1xgrot (to absorb casualties (block charges after explosions or even grot shield on the MANs), also Ghazz and as second line and fast reaction the trukk with nobs. Anvil flank has the morka scorted by the scraps.

Boys are utility. I use da jump to send them forward into objetives or simply blocking the enemies advance.

The "synergy" from Ghaz is on the heavy obsec hitters giving them +1 or +2 attacks (warpath) and run and charge.

Usually Ghaz is ignored until turn 3 as battlewagon and morka are much pressing threats for antitank and then is when he can krump some hummies!

Weirdboy is my warlod with kunning but brutal and after jumping the boys hands around fixing vehicles, smitting and buffing things.

Im assuming the MANZ are inside the battlewagon, so how are the grots meant to take casulties instead? Grot Shields only work on infantry.

But interesting combination of units. Does it do well at all?


Also guys:

How much of a priority is it for you to bring a painboy if you bring Ghazzy?

When the transport dies you roll a number of dices equal to the transported minis. The rules does not force you to roll them by units. So I roll 10+5 dices. Each 1 is a dead gretchin. Thus saving my MANs.

As for results. So far so good. Running it in a local league I am on semi finals 5-0 so far. Went against ultras twice, custodes, deathwatch and chaos.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Tomsug wrote:

Beardedragon wrote:

Ghaz
Weirdboy-mek with da jump, warpath and DS relic
2x10grot
1x28 boys with nob dual saw
1x5 MANs
9+1 nobs with bc on a trukk
3scrap with corkscrew
Morkanaut with sparkly bits
Battlewagon with death rolla

Yeah, I played againts such list twice and always beat them like a hell. And played it twice myself. And always lose masivelly. Such list suffers elementary problem of the mixed ork lists.

Orks are weak. Die fast. Do not survive. 6++ doesn' t save you.

Only way how to keep army alive is to spam one type of target.

Such list has not enought boyz to flood the field right and not enought heavy vehicles to ignore anti infantry weapons.

What can I say, we had different experiences.

oooh so the grots were also inside the battlewagon? Gotcha i misunderstood, I thought they ran around outside.

now i understand what you mean.


You guys know what i find annoying about Lootas? The fact that its completely random how many shots you get. Like, you could have 15 lootas and only get 15 shots. Thats definitely not worth the amount of points you pay for them. They should be flat 3 shots or something.

it feels silly to pay for a unit that isnt worth it. But on the other hand, if you get all 3 shots, it seem very much worth it.