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So I made a conversion for one of my DG and the bolter he is equipped with has an aquilla on it. I was playing it off as the marine had just stole it from the battlefield from a loyalist. From my understanding bolters made for Astartes will work in the hands of any Astartes and no one else.

Someone then said bolters are personalised and wouldn't work for anyone other than the marine its assigned to. But I remember garro during the flight of the eisenstien used one of his fallen comrades bolters that got passed down to him. Then the guy said its probably just legion specific.

I like keeping my armys fluffy and I'm struggling to find any source on it. Anyone help shed some light in this subject.

pappanurgle wrote:
Someone then said bolters are personalised and wouldn't work for anyone other than the marine its assigned to.

Really? Unless its a recent Primaris thing, don't think I've ever heard that, outside of Judge Dredd.

Only thing I'd consider "problematic" is that Marine bolters are designed for Marines or at least those in power armour, such that those used by other troops are lighter and smaller versions, or at least that has been my understanding.

3rd edition core rulebook is the source. A diagram of a storm bolter clearly shows it has a palm print scanner with genetic identification code built into the handle. But there's a bunch of ways to work around this:

It might only be storm bolters, as a piece of gear almost always restricted to veterans, and not standard bolters.

It might be a feature that's not present on all bolter patterns or limited to only relic bolters.

It might work for all astartes, looking specifically for the presence of geneseed.

It might simply be considered non-canon, seeing as there doesn't seem to be a later source that carries this forward.

It's up to you what route you want to take for it but it's definitely a thing that has existed.

jareddm wrote:
3rd edition core rulebook is the source. A diagram of a storm bolter clearly shows it has a palm print scanner with genetic identification code built into the handle. But there's a bunch of ways to work around this:

It might only be storm bolters, as a piece of gear almost always restricted to veterans, and not standard bolters.

It might be a feature that's not present on all bolter patterns or limited to only relic bolters.

It might work for all astartes, looking specifically for the presence of geneseed.

It might simply be considered non-canon, seeing as there doesn't seem to be a later source that carries this forward.

It's up to you what route you want to take for it but it's definitely a thing that has existed.

The 3rd Edition rulebook also still has Bolters using caseless ammunition, something that's since been changed. As such, the fluff and diagrams are suspect as to how "canon" they still are.

https://warhammer40k.fandom.com/wiki/Bolter

Mentions a gene sensor. How this works through power armour the Emperor alone knows.

jareddm wrote:3rd edition core rulebook is the source. A diagram of a storm bolter clearly shows it has a palm print scanner with genetic identification code built into the handle. But there's a bunch of ways to work around this

That'll be why then, I skipped 2nd to 6th and most of 7th editions.

Kayback wrote:https://warhammer40k.fandom.com/wiki/Bolter

Mentions a gene sensor. How this works through power armour the Emperor alone knows.

Yea..depends, if the sensor isnt contact based, no reason it cant scan through the armour.

jareddm wrote:
3rd edition core rulebook is the source. A diagram of a storm bolter clearly shows it has a palm print scanner with genetic identification code built into the handle. But there's a bunch of ways to work around this:

It might only be storm bolters, as a piece of gear almost always restricted to veterans, and not standard bolters.

It might be a feature that's not present on all bolter patterns or limited to only relic bolters.

It might work for all astartes, looking specifically for the presence of geneseed.

It might simply be considered non-canon, seeing as there doesn't seem to be a later source that carries this forward.

It's up to you what route you want to take for it but it's definitely a thing that has existed.

How exactly does a bio scanner scan your genetics when there is 4 inches of metal between the bolter and your flesh?

 Togusa wrote:

jareddm wrote:
3rd edition core rulebook is the source. A diagram of a storm bolter clearly shows it has a palm print scanner with genetic identification code built into the handle. But there's a bunch of ways to work around this:

It might only be storm bolters, as a piece of gear almost always restricted to veterans, and not standard bolters.

It might be a feature that's not present on all bolter patterns or limited to only relic bolters.

It might work for all astartes, looking specifically for the presence of geneseed.

It might simply be considered non-canon, seeing as there doesn't seem to be a later source that carries this forward.

It's up to you what route you want to take for it but it's definitely a thing that has existed.

How exactly does a bio scanner scan your genetics when there is 4 inches of metal between the bolter and your flesh?

very carefully

pappanurgle wrote:
So I made a conversion for one of my DG and the bolter he is equipped with has an aquilla on it. I was playing it off as the marine had just stole it from the battlefield from a loyalist. From my understanding bolters made for Astartes will work in the hands of any Astartes and no one else.

Someone then said bolters are personalised and wouldn't work for anyone other than the marine its assigned to. But I remember garro during the flight of the eisenstien used one of his fallen comrades bolters that got passed down to him. Then the guy said its probably just legion specific.

I like keeping my armys fluffy and I'm struggling to find any source on it. Anyone help shed some light in this subject.

He's a Plague Marine. A Technovirus could have made short work of the gene scanner. Nurgle's gifts let even necrons rust, I'm pretty sure they can overcome some imperial security system .

A scanner of that nature might help with stopping someone else picking up your gun and shooting you with it there and then, but if its been looted form a battlefield, I'm sure the ruinous powers have all.kinds of ways to disable the scanner given a bit of time.

And to the question of how a genetic scanner would work through an armoured gauntlet, the answer is of course space magic. Star trek style medical equipment can scan down to the molecular level and probably beyond without touching the subject.

Everything can be hacked, you are underestimating the resourcefulness of chaos. Besides, what would be a better way to piss off marines than to "dishonour" them by using their own sacred, holy weapons against them?

In fact, having rusty/slimey aquila-adorned bolters on DG sounds fluffy af to me

In my mind, no. What's the point? If you're a space marine you're going to have a bolter, and anyone who isn't a space marine isn't really going to be stealing yours are they? The only ones I could see that being the case for would be master crafted, artificer weapons held by the big boss folks.

If gene scanners are still a thing? I can’t imagine Traitor Astartes don’t have a work around.

Granted it’s an age of technological ignorance, but whatever can be switched on, can be switched off.

As with the Dreddiverse’s Lawgiver, it’s likely a fail safe for the heat of battle, rather than when it’s been claimed and someone has had time to tinker.

I know 40k is built on the impractical, but gene locking your gun seems like a lot of tech (which the Imperium isn't great with) for no gain at all. A marine is much more likely to have to pick up a bolter from a downed battle brother than have it stolen out of his hands by an enemy.

Not to mention like a lot of the details in the setting it's contradicted by other bits of the fluff.

 ScarletRose wrote:
I know 40k is built on the impractical, but gene locking your gun seems like a lot of tech (which the Imperium isn't great with) for no gain at all. A marine is much more likely to have to pick up a bolter from a downed battle brother than have it stolen out of his hands by an enemy.

Not to mention like a lot of the details in the setting it's contradicted by other bits of the fluff.

I always thought it was because Holy Bolters were Marine only equipment. No one else is allowed to own one.

Then they started appearing everywhere.

I do think the 2000AD esque Lawgiver style gene lock is a hold over from before they became widespread.

Kayback wrote:

 ScarletRose wrote:
I know 40k is built on the impractical, but gene locking your gun seems like a lot of tech (which the Imperium isn't great with) for no gain at all. A marine is much more likely to have to pick up a bolter from a downed battle brother than have it stolen out of his hands by an enemy.

Not to mention like a lot of the details in the setting it's contradicted by other bits of the fluff.

I always thought it was because Holy Bolters were Marine only equipment. No one else is allowed to own one.

Then they started appearing everywhere.

I do think the 2000AD esque Lawgiver style gene lock is a hold over from before they became widespread.

Orks often used bolters in 2nd ed. They've been pretty widespread for a long time.

Kayback wrote:

 ScarletRose wrote:
I know 40k is built on the impractical, but gene locking your gun seems like a lot of tech (which the Imperium isn't great with) for no gain at all. A marine is much more likely to have to pick up a bolter from a downed battle brother than have it stolen out of his hands by an enemy.

Not to mention like a lot of the details in the setting it's contradicted by other bits of the fluff.

I always thought it was because Holy Bolters were Marine only equipment. No one else is allowed to own one.

Then they started appearing everywhere.

I do think the 2000AD esque Lawgiver style gene lock is a hold over from before they became widespread.

They're less common now than they used to be.

Orks, as mentioned, but every race/faction had d100 charts of Ehat they could be armed with in RT. You'd get marines with shuriken catapults and tyranids with bolters (they didn't originally have their own weapons, just bio versions of normal ones.

I miss RT, flying rodent gak insanity on a regular basis.


Honestly, I'm not even sure GW knows what's canon about some details.

 Insectum7 wrote:
Orks often used bolters in 2nd ed. They've been pretty widespread for a long time.

Huh, when were they changed to Shootas and Blastas? I was aware of Orks using looted gear, and the presence of things like Shuriken Catapaults in the hands of Marines but I always heard of Ork guns as Bolter-like, not actual bolters.

FWIW the 'dna scanner' could be located in the power armor or the black carapace and just send an encrypted code to the bolter on contact of the bolter with the armor to unlock the bolter. Much less tech needed in contrast to a scanner located in the bolter.

If said code incorporated information of the gene-seed, it would be possible that bolters can be used only by astartes with the same gene-seed (except if they are hacked).

I've heard of it, but it could just be a bit of creative license. If you must feel you have to do something, I suggest doing like what Apologist did and have a SM hand hastily nailed to the Bolter with wires connecting it to the gun, tricking it into compliance. I know that's for Orks, but it works just as well for the brutal fashion in which CSM operate.

Wasn't Eisenhorn given a Bolt pistol as a gift from a Librarian? Pretty sure he just handed it to him and was like "enjoy".

 DeffDred wrote:
Wasn't Eisenhorn given a Bolt pistol as a gift from a Librarian? Pretty sure he just handed it to him and was like "enjoy".

And Ciaphus was given one that he handed over to Amberly.

Like most things there isn't much solid canon that is concrete.

 ScarletRose wrote:
I know 40k is built on the impractical, but gene locking your gun seems like a lot of tech (which the Imperium isn't great with) for no gain at all. A marine is much more likely to have to pick up a bolter from a downed battle brother than have it stolen out of his hands by an enemy.

Not to mention like a lot of the details in the setting it's contradicted by other bits of the fluff.

It can also be limited to specific patterns and sub-patterns.

Custodes have gene-locked weapons, and that is unique to each individual. I believe this is presented in opposition to Marines' bolters - so modern cannon would say no gene-scanning required.

Kayback wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
Orks often used bolters in 2nd ed. They've been pretty widespread for a long time.

Huh, when were they changed to Shootas and Blastas? I was aware of Orks using looted gear, and the presence of things like Shuriken Catapaults in the hands of Marines but I always heard of Ork guns as Bolter-like, not actual bolters.

In 1st and 2nd ed orks carried bolters. The plastic orks in the 2nd ed core box were armed with bolt pistols and axes as standard, which was reflected in their later codex. They could carry bp and axe or bolter.Gretchin carried autoguns (worse profile than a lasgun, as the las had a -1 ASM).

It was the 3rd ed revamp of 40k that changed everything. They started equipment locking stuff to different factions, and/or renaming and changing profiles of some weapons from 3rd onward, which has ramped up in recent editions. this is the edition where the shuriken catapult went from 24" S4 Ap-2 D1 Assault 1d3 to 12" S4 AP5 D1 Assault 2, which has effectively been their rules ever since (by comparison they were superior to a stormbolter in 1st and 2nd ed....).

 Hellebore wrote:

Kayback wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
Orks often used bolters in 2nd ed. They've been pretty widespread for a long time.

Huh, when were they changed to Shootas and Blastas? I was aware of Orks using looted gear, and the presence of things like Shuriken Catapaults in the hands of Marines but I always heard of Ork guns as Bolter-like, not actual bolters.

In 1st and 2nd ed orks carried bolters. The plastic orks in the 2nd ed core box were armed with bolt pistols and axes as standard, which was reflected in their later codex. They could carry bp and axe or bolter.Gretchin carried autoguns (worse profile than a lasgun, as the las had a -1 ASM).

It was the 3rd ed revamp of 40k that changed everything. They started equipment locking stuff to different factions, and/or renaming and changing profiles of some weapons from 3rd onward, which has ramped up in recent editions. this is the edition where the shuriken catapult went from 24" S4 Ap-2 D1 Assault 1d3 to 12" S4 AP5 D1 Assault 2, which has effectively been their rules ever since (by comparison they were superior to a stormbolter in 1st and 2nd ed....).

Cool thanks. Wish I still had my 2nd wargear and rule books to refresh my memory. Oh well.

The idea of having a gene-locked Boltgun makes Marines come across as a bit pathetic to be honest. It's as if they were putting wheel locks on their vehicles.

User authentication locks on a boltgun don't seem practical to me; it's an extra point of failure that isn't really necessary given that the majority of things Space Marines are fighting aren't likely to steal their boltguns. They're either too small and puny to handle the recoil (Tau, humans, Eldar), would be able to crack the authentication easily (Orks, CSM), don't care about guns (Tyranids, Daemons), have their own better guns (Tau, Necrons, Eldar), or some mix of the above.