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2020/10/30 16:36:46
Subject: Re:Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
changemod wrote: I have a ton of forge world stuff across several armies, and aren’t very enthusiastic about this so far.
Of course for me to be genuinely hyped rather than merely pleasantly surprised they’d have to finally do the absolute financial no brainer of printing a few data sheets for the 30k mechanicus units I bought in the safe and comfortable knowledge Cyraxus was coming.
Luckily I stopped at a single Domitar, which is easily proxied as a Kastelan (same base size even). I'm not sure how big the base is on a Thanatar, but I suppose you could proxy it as an Onager or Armiger?
Would have loved to have gotten the mid-sized transport (I forget what it's called--smaller than Triaros) and used it as a Dunerider, but they were discontinued before the dunerider came out. I'd also love a Triaros but it's so big that it doesn't really work as a proxy for anything :(
2020/10/30 16:38:33
Subject: Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
The people who invested money into FW's 'premium' products are exactly the type of diehard fans you'd think they would want to keep on side with a throwaway set of rules. What's the ink on that bit of paper compared to the thousands people spend on FW products?
Thing is those aren't gw's focus. Plastic is more profitable with higher rate of pure profit. 1000 spent on plastic is far superior to 1000 on resin. Then you factor in lot more plastic buyers and...
Fw is designed for collectors who don't play. There's reason gw makes damned sure resin model rules suck. They don't want gamers to buy them.
Only reason fw even exists is collectors don't spam broken stuff so trying to sell broken plastic doesn't get you far
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/10/30 16:39:24
2024 painted/bought: 109/109
2020/10/30 16:40:34
Subject: Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
The people who invested money into FW's 'premium' products are exactly the type of diehard fans you'd think they would want to keep on side with a throwaway set of rules. What's the ink on that bit of paper compared to the thousands people spend on FW products?
Thing is those aren't gw's focus. Plastic is more profitable with higher rate of pure profit. 1000 spent on plastic is far superior to 1000 on resin. Then you factor in lot more plastic buyers and...
Fw is designed for collectors who don't play. There's reason gw makes damned sure resin model rules suck. They don't want gamers to buy them.
Only reason fw even exists is collectors don't spam broken stuff so trying to sell broken plastic doesn't get you far
I'm sure that's the reason why they have released all those HH minis and books.
Sure.
2020/10/30 16:52:26
Subject: Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
JohnnyHell wrote: Hah I love this bizarro world where I’m the bad guy and everyone has Sabre Platforms. That’s not gloating, disgraceful, callous... whatever adjective you may try and apply. It’s a ridiculous assertion that the removal of that unit affects vast swathes of the player base. It does not. And for all we know it will have Legends rules so you don’t even have to buy a book. Perspective is useful, though not if trying to frame me as the villain I guess, HBMC.
Seriously, people. You know GW only makes rules for stuff it sells now. It isn’t news, it shouldn’t be a shock, sure, be disappointed but direct it at GW. Not at a guy who says “but many of you don’t even play those units...”
If GW had removed units the majority of the world bought and use then HBMC might have a point. As it is, he doesn’t. More people have spent ten years going “I’m definitely going to get a DKoK army” than have actually bought one. I know it’s a popular niche force and it’s sad for anyone whose units have been moved to Legends. They are still playable... they aren’t gone. There are hardly any tournaments as the world is screwed. Again, perspective.
And honestly, call me what you like... all five people who own Sabre Platforms have a small right to be upset but come on. The salty mountains you’re trying to make out of molehills here are ridiculous HBMC.
GW sells 40k as a "hobby", not just on the merits of crafting, but that there is something beyond just the building and painting of miniatures. When GW chooses to no longer support something with rules, they are cutting in half that value for your money, time, and effort that is the basis for their premium pricing.
You'd be frustrated if you bought a car and after an uncertain number of years the company repossesses the computer that controls the engine. Hearing someone say "Well you still have a car." or "Well they're in the business of selling cars." or "Well they didn't do it to my car" or "You didn't drive it that often" its dismissive, but its actually worse than just being dismissive. Your comments go beyond just being apathetic.
No matter if its true, its a moot point because at the end of the day the value of something you own and have invested time, effort, and money into has through the conscious decision of someone else, and due to nothing you've done, been diminished in value.
What might be hard to grasp is that a certain value people have in their collection isn't just what's in that collection; as a hobby sold on the depth and diversity of lore where that bleeds into the rest of the hobby is the expectation that as much of that permeates all depths of the hobby. Even if you don't own a Tyranid army, your sense of value in the hobby would be diminished if one of your favorite stories were Ultramarines fighting tyranids on Ultramar, then GW got rid of Nids. Even if you don't play DKoK, but in your mind they represent your notion of the IG better than anything else, having them dropped invalidates part of what you were sold on. Its a kind of personal investment that makes this hobby a hobby and a big part of its success. If you've been sold on the diversity and depth of what FW had added to the hobby seeing that diminished through non-support, diminishes the value you see in it as a whole.
If you're feeling defensive for being dismissive, you should ask yourself why do you feel a need to go steps beyond just being apathetic and insist on being adversarial to people that feel some sense of loss and betrayal? It doesn't matter whether those feelings are rational or not, the feelings are real. The action leading to those feelings are real. These feelings however come from a rational conclusion: Initial model value - GW support = new value, where new value < initial value => frustrated customers.
You're nitpicking details while ignoring the underlying and fundamental concern. Is 40k more or less interesting or fun without these FW models and units? -Most people that buy FW models would rationally say less interesting and less fun.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/10/30 16:53:52
2020/10/30 17:14:40
Subject: Re:Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
changemod wrote: I have a ton of forge world stuff across several armies, and aren’t very enthusiastic about this so far.
Of course for me to be genuinely hyped rather than merely pleasantly surprised they’d have to finally do the absolute financial no brainer of printing a few data sheets for the 30k mechanicus units I bought in the safe and comfortable knowledge Cyraxus was coming.
Luckily I stopped at a single Domitar, which is easily proxied as a Kastelan (same base size even). I'm not sure how big the base is on a Thanatar, but I suppose you could proxy it as an Onager or Armiger?
Would have loved to have gotten the mid-sized transport (I forget what it's called--smaller than Triaros) and used it as a Dunerider, but they were discontinued before the dunerider came out. I'd also love a Triaros but it's so big that it doesn't really work as a proxy for anything :(
Don’t forget thallax and ursarax, the admech “space marines” to the skitarii as admech “imperial guard”.
2020/10/30 17:22:32
Subject: Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
I think its just important to adopt a culture of "counts as" for discontinued special rules. There might not always be bespoke rules for every bespoke mode, but we should probably always be able to find something that a tank with a big gun on top can represent.
2020/10/30 17:24:24
Subject: Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
LunarSol wrote: I think its just important to adopt a culture of "counts as" for discontinued special rules. There might not always be bespoke rules for every bespoke mode, but we should probably always be able to find something that a tank with a big gun on top can represent.
Looks at the ever glowing bloated mountain of Marine models with super special rules....
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
Yeah, the timing of releasing the double-reaver rules at the exact time that they're culling FW is... unfortunate.
I think that the most reasonable approach would have been, if they really wanted to cull things, make a spreadsheet of proxy options; if they couldn't do that, add a datasheet.
"These characters can be represented by generic guys; these vehicles can be represented by their less-specific versions; these can be represented by the normal datasheet except they're allowed to take whichever wargear at regular cost that they need; these ones actually need new entries. Here's a callout box with the subfaction rule."
I get why they tried to shift from a plethora of options to datasheets that divide them, but the current format as implemented is really inflexible and often nearly redundant.
changemod wrote: So, we didn’t get unit previews to speak of, there aren’t review copies out in the wild and it doesn’t ship till next Friday?
Pretty frustrating when all the buzz has been about stuff being cut in the first place.
Do we know there aren't any review copies? It seems bizarre to try to hype a book with rules for so many different factions with only two articles about DKoK.
Not sure what I expected but the price tag is a put off given I need 6 pages of it. I kind of wish they'd broken it into smaller collections again so you're not paying rulebook prices for a small volume of supplementary units with no prior knowledge.
Ditto. 9 pages will do it for me with my current collection. Some previews or reviews would be nice. I'd hate to spend $65 just to find out gw nerfed all my fw toys into the ground. I really hope they don't, almost every vehicle in my Night Lords is from fw.
I don't mind the single book, however I had to buy 3 out of the 4 previous books anyway so the price is less of an issue, But if you only needed a single faction I get it could be more annoying/expensive.
But without someone doing a full walkthrough of the rules I have no intention of handing GW any money.
So far every update the 40K rules team has made to my FW units has either stripped rules from them without any reduction in points or just randomly increased points to make what were alternative choices cost 50-100 points more than a codex model which have better rules.
2020/10/30 18:42:15
Subject: Re:Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
changemod wrote: So, we didn’t get unit previews to speak of, there aren’t review copies out in the wild and it doesn’t ship till next Friday?
Pretty frustrating when all the buzz has been about stuff being cut in the first place.
Do we know there aren't any review copies? It seems bizarre to try to hype a book with rules for so many different factions with only two articles about DKoK.
Not sure what I expected but the price tag is a put off given I need 6 pages of it. I kind of wish they'd broken it into smaller collections again so you're not paying rulebook prices for a small volume of supplementary units with no prior knowledge.
Ditto. 9 pages will do it for me with my current collection. Some previews or reviews would be nice. I'd hate to spend $65 just to find out gw nerfed all my fw toys into the ground. I really hope they don't, almost every vehicle in my Night Lords is from fw.
I don't mind the single book, however I had to buy 3 out of the 4 previous books anyway so the price is less of an issue, But if you only needed a single faction I get it could be more annoying/expensive.
But without someone doing a full walkthrough of the rules I have no intention of handing GW any money.
So far every update the 40K rules team has made to my FW units has either stripped rules from them without any reduction in points or just randomly increased points to make what were alternative choices cost 50-100 points more than a codex model which have better rules.
Just 50-100? Cries in 880 PPM Hellforged Fellblade.
2020/10/30 18:44:32
Subject: Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
changemod wrote: So, we didn’t get unit previews to speak of, there aren’t review copies out in the wild and it doesn’t ship till next Friday?
Pretty frustrating when all the buzz has been about stuff being cut in the first place.
Do we know there aren't any review copies? It seems bizarre to try to hype a book with rules for so many different factions with only two articles about DKoK.
Not sure what I expected but the price tag is a put off given I need 6 pages of it. I kind of wish they'd broken it into smaller collections again so you're not paying rulebook prices for a small volume of supplementary units with no prior knowledge.
Ditto. 9 pages will do it for me with my current collection. Some previews or reviews would be nice. I'd hate to spend $65 just to find out gw nerfed all my fw toys into the ground. I really hope they don't, almost every vehicle in my Night Lords is from fw.
I don't mind the single book, however I had to buy 3 out of the 4 previous books anyway so the price is less of an issue, But if you only needed a single faction I get it could be more annoying/expensive.
But without someone doing a full walkthrough of the rules I have no intention of handing GW any money.
So far every update the 40K rules team has made to my FW units has either stripped rules from them without any reduction in points or just randomly increased points to make what were alternative choices cost 50-100 points more than a codex model which have better rules.
Just 50-100? Cries in 880 PPM Hellforged Fellblade.
I more mean like hear is a normal predator and here is a demios hellforged predator the codex one is 100 points the hellforged demios with same weapons is now 150 before weapons type deal.
You just endup using the nice shiney thing wuth weapons the codex one can't have as counts as codex model half the time.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/10/30 18:53:56
2020/10/31 00:08:59
Subject: Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
None of the units in the FW books where used.
What WAS used was Infantry and bullgryns.
What people are forgetting is alot of the units that are gone, sucked.
5000pts 6000pts 3000pts
2020/10/31 07:57:24
Subject: Re:Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
Irillyth - 140pts,
4++, still -1 to hit, -1 to Enemy LD when within 6', Deep Strike, Shadow Spectres reroll 1's within 6'
24'' Assault 3, -4, 3 Damage, S5, -3 2 Damage in Melee
Shadow Spectres - 26pts, 5-10 models in Squad, still -1 to hit
Prism Rifle - Dispersed Assault D6, 18’, S5, -1, 1 Damage Blast
Focused - Assault 1, 24’, S3, -3, 3 Damage
Hornets - 80pts, -1 hit base, Starcannons 5pts, Bright Lance & Aeldari Missile Launcher 10pts
Heavy weapons reduced for Hornets
Hornet Pulse Laser - Lost -1AP, 36’, S7, Same damage? 5pts
Warp Hunter - 195pts
S12, D3+3 Damage in Artillery Mode, 24’’, AP4, Blast, D3 Shots Lost 12 in Artillery Mode
Flamer Mode - 12’, Flat Heavy 3, S12, AP4, D6 Damage, Auto Hit
Wraithseer - Doesn’t mention points level
9W, Access to Runes of Battle, Cast 1 Power per turn, Lost Character rule, 5++, doesn’t profile degrade, Heavy Support choice.
Eldritch Wraith Construct - Enemy ranged AP1, is changed to AP0
Ghost Spear - S10, AP3, D3+3 Damage
Nightwing - 220pts
BS3, T6, 14W, Can go into Hover, wings extend, loses airborne, hard to hit, agile interceptor, 5++, +1 to other enemy aircraft units
Skathach - 325pts
55pts per Deathshroud Cannon, 65pts Inferno Lance, can mix and match the Scattershield
Inferno Lance - 24’, S8, AP4, D6 Damage, within half range D6+2 Damage
Still has the Webway Shunt
Revenant - 1500pts, Distortion Field 4++ against ranged attacks
Sonic Lance -18’, Heavy 3D6, S4, AP3, auto hits, wounds Infantry on 2+
Pulse Laser - Revenant Pulsar, Heavy 6, 60’, S12, AP4, Damage 4
Cloudburst Missile Launcher - 36’, Heavy 2D6, S8, AP2, 2 Damage Blast
Source: Splintermind Podcast - Patreon Episode 98
I must say that I am disappointed with the Wraithseer losing the character rule and moved to Heavy Support. It was one of the cool things about it as you could have a spiritseer lead your forces.
2020/10/31 08:09:50
Subject: Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
hotsauceman1 wrote: None of the units in the FW books where used.
What WAS used was Infantry and bullgryns.
What people are forgetting is alot of the units that are gone, sucked.
Granted. Most of them were not competitive rule wise.
But I still believe it was not the point in the first place:
Most of them were nice models,
which may be the main reason most people bought them.
Having subpar rules and still be able to use these expensive
models is not exactly the same than not having rules altogether.
As said the product value tanked here, period.
And I will field a pair of nice griffon mortars against
these butt ugly bullgryns everyday:
because I like the look of them even if they finish
the game without being marine killers.
2020/10/31 08:13:27
Subject: Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
hotsauceman1 wrote: If you like the look of them without performance being affected, then legends should be just fine then shouldn't it?
For 1 or 2 editions...
Maybee afterwards the disconect Breaks that capability.
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
2020/10/31 08:38:45
Subject: Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
hotsauceman1 wrote: If you like the look of them without performance being affected, then legends should be just fine then shouldn't it?
Maybe a unit should continue to have rules regardless whether it sucked previously or not.
Not being in production is a difficult topic and I understand why they're doing it, but taking options away from people never helps.
First, technically they are not taking away options as they keep the rules alive in Legends. Your beef is with the people and TOs who disallow them.
Second, the reason I don't want out of print models in tourneys is because it has the potential of creating weird synergies and if a synergy accidentally becomes too strong then recasters are going to make a lot of money because people will want one of those(for the record that's not good). For Friendly, Narrative, and Open games? I see no reason to ban Legend units.
Third, can we put this thread back to the original subject and maybe spin this Legend rule debate into a separate discussion? This is obviously a very passionate subject and would probably be served better with a dedicated thread of its own rather than in a news and rumor discussion.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/10/31 09:23:11
2020/10/31 09:28:03
Subject: Re:Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
hotsauceman1 wrote: If you like the look of them without performance being affected, then legends should be just fine then shouldn't it?
Maybe a unit should continue to have rules regardless whether it sucked previously or not.
Not being in production is a difficult topic and I understand why they're doing it, but taking options away from people never helps.
First, technically they are not taking away options as they keep the rules alive in Legends. Your beef is with the people and TOs who disallow them.
Second, the reason I don't want out of print models in tourneys is because it has the potential of creating weird synergies and if a synergy accidentally becomes too strong then recasters are going to make a lot of money because people will want one of those(for the record that's not good). For Narrative and Open games? I see no reason to ban Legend units.
Third, can we put this thread back to the original subject and maybe spin this Legend rule debate into a separate discussion? This is obviously a very passionate subject and would probably be served better with a dedicated thread of its own rather than in a news and rumor discussion.
It involves the discussion of the books contents and any legends dara is part of the release. I fail to see how it isn't on topic to discuss what is/isn't included, especially since you opt to weigh in your thoughts on the topic anyway.
To respond to your points, legends rules aren't updated, or rebalanced, so once they're in there they'll eventually become invalid.
Your reason for disallowing oop models from tournaments is at best, weird. If it's in print, isn't balanced and people spam recast versions it's fine. If it isn't in print, isn't balanced and people spam recast versions it isn't OK?
Why does the economy of recasters impact tournament balance?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/10/31 09:28:37
2020/10/31 09:30:07
Subject: Re:Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
hotsauceman1 wrote: If you like the look of them without performance being affected, then legends should be just fine then shouldn't it?
Maybe a unit should continue to have rules regardless whether it sucked previously or not.
Not being in production is a difficult topic and I understand why they're doing it, but taking options away from people never helps.
First, technically they are not taking away options as they keep the rules alive in Legends. Your beef is with the people and TOs who disallow them.
Second, the reason I don't want out of print models in tourneys is because it has the potential of creating weird synergies and if a synergy accidentally becomes too strong then recasters are going to make a lot of money because people will want one of those(for the record that's not good). For Friendly, Narrative, and Open games? I see no reason to ban Legend units.
Third, can we put this thread back to the original subject and maybe spin this Legend rule debate into a separate discussion? This is obviously a very passionate subject and would probably be served better with a dedicated thread of its own rather than in a news and rumor discussion.
Assuming the thread title dictates what is discussion and therefore OT i don't think your statement holds any weight.
Secondly, recasting is a squarly GW problem, respecitvely a problem with GW pricing and margins, which is where recasters actually make their money, IF GW would lower prices GW would have less issues with recasting.
Thirdly: tied to secondly, GW has issues with resin quality and it shows, there are recasters out there that do Resin models of GW better for massively cheaper material wise alone...
Now to the tourney scene, you allready have that, and by extension, frankly, even there the issue lies within the GW rulesteam, the same rulesteam that can't bother to proof read or check if all contents are actually in the dex, cue SW , or playtest seemingly, cue IH supplement on release... out of print models are the least of your issues imo.
Now to your first point, technically is not practically, Give these units 2 editions later a thought and tell me if they are still working as intended or even working at ALL... That is an issue regardless at which level you play because sooner or later the disconect becomes unmanageable.
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
2020/10/31 09:33:05
Subject: Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
Scorpions at 500 PPM? Cobras 450? Where are these leeks coming from? If those LOWs got cuts that big and the legion super heavys didn't I'm going to riot.
2020/10/31 11:21:11
Subject: Re:Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
Gadzilla666 wrote: Scorpions at 500 PPM? Cobras 450? Where are these leeks coming from? If those LOWs got cuts that big and the legion super heavys didn't I'm going to riot.
Locally or are you going to risk corona land and 1 man riot outside a closed warhammer world, if so I might come watch and doff my cap.
2020/10/31 11:21:22
Subject: Re:Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
HS (not LOW): Barbed Hierodule 275pts
HS (not LOW): Scythed Hierodule 235pts
HS: Stonecrusher fex 105pts (1 model per unit)
* with wrecking claws 115pts
LOW: Harridan 700pts
LOW: Hierophant 850pts
Malanthrope shrouding spores work to 6" but exclude Titanic units
Tail attack is S+1 flat 2 damage with a reroll to wound
Toxic miasma ability is the same but with D3 moral wounds.
Prey adapation is now re-roll wounds of 1.
Stonecrusher chitin rams do D3 mortal wounds, or D6 to vehicles or monsters
Bio-flails are 2 hit rolls per attack
Wrecker claws are now flat 3 damage instead of D6, when hitting vehicle or monsters that increases to 5/6 (can't tell)
Tyranid units now degrade on M / WS / BS (big help for the dimachaeron)
Dimachaerons WS3+ BS3+ W18, with a builtin 5++
Talons are S8 AP-3 D3+3 damage & re-roll all hits
There's a free S7 AP-3 D2 tail attack
Spinemaw is a chance to get D6 mortal wounds on a unit nearby.
Digestion spine now gives a 5+++ if the spine maw kills any model
Hierodules start at BS 3+ W18
I think the barbed one has a 2+ save but it's not clear.
Bio-cannon is now flat 2 damage, Heirodule scything talons S+2, D3+3 damage
Harridan and Hierophant both go to S8 T8 W34
Dire bio-cannons are Heavy 8, S10, AP-3, flat 3 damage.
Frenzied metabloism is +1 to wound
Gargantuan scything talons are S+2 flat 6 damage
Hierophant has a standard transport capacity for 20 infrantry (can take multiple units now), anything with more than one wound counts as two models. Really hope this means they're doing something similar with the Tyrannocyte in future too since it will be the same rules team now.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2020/10/31 11:35:22
2020/10/31 11:26:01
Subject: Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
Sicaran down 30 points, loses all its special rules, costs a CP and down 2 shots, in return gets +1 ap and +1 damage, not sure if thats worth it. Shame it lost its rend and anti flyer niche now its jsut a boring tank.
2020/10/31 11:35:27
Subject: Inside Imperial Armour: Compendium (or not inside...)
Maybe it's now in the SM Codex?
They still sell the weapons variants, and honestly it was one of the best variant/conversion set they have... Also pretty simple and balanced rule-wise.
Another NOPE book then.
Legends is a scam, BTW. Fixed model rules while the rule book changes the core rules is something that no designer with an ounce of dignity will ever think about.
It's more a marketing stunt to hide the removal of models (the only thing GW have done correctly in the past: the life cycle of GW models have always been their strength).
I have to admit that I'm surprised to see Legends apologists: GW kool-aid is stronger that what I believe.
I can't condone a place where abusers and abused are threated the same: it's destined to doom, so there is no reason to participate in it.