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Praying to the Ruinious Powers they show at least one model for the Monday Preview. Though we're probably due for a Warhammer+ subscriber model reveal, which is also chaos marine themed.

I never cared for the BSF Cultist of the Abyss models, which is what it looks like we're getting (and rumors hinted at). Definitely more of a fan of the Dark Vengeance models, though at least the new cultist have flame icons all over them so they'd be great for WBs

You know I should be mad that our Codex is now after both Nids and Knights, but I got into an argument with a Redditor who assured me we would be getting our Codex in April and I should "stop bitching", so its gonna be real nice to tell him how wrong he was

Interestingly enough some of these rumors like the 3 attacks base are being disproven, here's fingers crossed that the no Jumppacks for lords and weird equipment rules are wrong too. The equipment rules for chosen would shelf 4 of my squads but the no Jumppacks for Lords would absolutely kill me, I don't have a single power armored lord without wings or a jetpack

Sorry might have missed it in the many pages of this thread, but is there any indication that traitor guard like the ones in BSF will be included in the codex or is it just cultists still?

Lokuste wrote:
Sorry might have missed it in the many pages of this thread, but is there any indication that traitor guard like the ones in BSF will be included in the codex or is it just cultists still?

Supposedly traitor guard are part of the dex, along the line of BSF style cultists.

--------------

Tbh, i found the trailer gak.
Also getting memed for the 2 wounds is really low, the cultists were a bunch of worthless backsides and considering we kinda have to go on with no traits for them, why bother ?

 Gadzilla666 wrote:

 Sersi wrote:
"I didn't ask for this." Horus

Well...upside the Tzeentch and Nurgle marks aren't actually better than Khorne and Slaanesh... Balance!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Interesting, the 2W Legionnaire stat line only have 2 attacks not the rumored 3. but its Warhammer community they probably just Photoshop'd in the 2W.

Maybe? But it also had the buffed Leadership of 8 for the Legionaries, and 9 for the Aspiring Champion. If it is 2A, and we lose Hateful Assault as expected, then we'll be behind loyalists in melee. That ain't right.

Edit: And bolters, bolt pistols, and chainswords are exactly as they are currently. So worse in melee and at shooting than Cawl's overgrown goons.

Personally, I think First Born are more flexible and useful than Primaris. The only reason we don't see them more is because mostly, because people like new models and marine infantry isn't making waves. At the very least it means we'll get a slight discount on points, which is great for loading up on specials and heavies.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 Gadzilla666 wrote:

 Sersi wrote:
"I didn't ask for this." Horus

Well...upside the Tzeentch and Nurgle marks aren't actually better than Khorne and Slaanesh... Balance!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Interesting, the 2W Legionnaire stat line only have 2 attacks not the rumored 3. but its Warhammer community they probably just Photoshop'd in the 2W.

Maybe? But it also had the buffed Leadership of 8 for the Legionaries, and 9 for the Aspiring Champion. If it is 2A, and we lose Hateful Assault as expected, then we'll be behind loyalists in melee. That ain't right.

Edit: And bolters, bolt pistols, and chainswords are exactly as they are currently. So worse in melee and at shooting than Cawl's overgrown goons.

Personally, I think First Born are more flexible and useful than Primaris. The only reason we don't see them more is because mostly, because people like new models and marine infantry isn't making waves. At the very least it means we'll get a slight discount on points, which is great for loading up on specials and heavies.

Eh, I think you're partially correct. If my math is right, and so are the rumours for what the various Marks and Icons do, then a properly Marked + Icon unit of "Legionaries" will be able to beat intercessors in a fistfight. So they'll probably be cheaper base (possibly even cheaper than TACs), but once you start spending points on "extras" they'll be better than loyalists. So you can go "cheaper but worse", or "more expensive, but better". Sounds.... familiar.

Anyone notice the power level for the legionaries was 6?

Tacticals and intercessors are power level 5.

The marks must be doing some heavy lifting

Depends on how many special/heavy weapons you can put in a 5 model squad. And don’t forget the KT specialist.

Not Online!!! wrote:

Lokuste wrote:
Sorry might have missed it in the many pages of this thread, but is there any indication that traitor guard like the ones in BSF will be included in the codex or is it just cultists still?

Supposedly traitor guard are part of the dex, along the line of BSF style cultists.

--------------

Tbh, i found the trailer gak.
Also getting memed for the 2 wounds is really low, the cultists were a bunch of worthless backsides and considering we kinda have to go on with no traits for them, why bother ?

I think one of the reasons I resent being memed for this is because GW is drawing attention to one of their own glaring flaws: consistency.

There wouldn't be a meme if they had just kept Chaos Marine wound-count consistent with the rest of the game. Two years ago they could have updated the wound and points in a chapter approved. Instead, they strung us along and have us as one of the last codexes of the edition. Tyranids, Chaos Knights, and Imperial Knights will come out ahead of us, and then only Chaos Daemons and Astra Militarum will be left afterwards.

GW really needs to address their own internal consistency when it comes to supporting their own product and game. If they want us to buy all those extra books they keep pumping out, then they need to make sure its worthwhile to do so.

 alextroy wrote:
Depends on how many special/heavy weapons you can put in a 5 model squad. And don’t forget the KT specialist.

Yeah, it's kinda hard to judge points by power level, because they assume you'll be taking some optional stuff. Still interesting to note that Plague Marines, Rubrics, and Grey Knights Strikes are also all 6 PL, considering how many special rules those units have "baked in". Maybe there's something else further down that datasheet that we haven't seen yet?

Doohicky wrote:
Anyone notice the power level for the legionaries was 6?

Tacticals and intercessors are power level 5.

The marks must be doing some heavy lifting

Doubtful looking at the rumored mark abilities. But GW tends to overvalue even minor buffs so there's that.

Power level factors in cost of all possible upgrades, so between marks and unit equipment it could be possible for a CSM squad to have a higher cost than loyalist

 alextroy wrote:
Depends on how many special/heavy weapons you can put in a 5 model squad. And don’t forget the KT specialist.

Chaos Space Marines have strictly followed the Codex Astartes since the 4th Ed 'Chaos' Codex was released.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 alextroy wrote:
Depends on how many special/heavy weapons you can put in a 5 model squad. And don’t forget the KT specialist.

Chaos Space Marines have strictly followed the Codex Astartes since the 4th Ed 'Chaos' Codex was released.

Now now, they used to get a Chainsword WITH their Bolter and Bolt Pistol, the audacity.

I surely miss the days of 3 weapon Chaos marines. I also wish Khorne Berserkers could take bolters again, just for us old farts with vintage collections

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
Should be noted that Tactical Marines and both kinds of Troop Intercessors are Power Level 5, though this is probably just GW putting the cost of marks and icons into the base PL of the Legionaires and not a sign that they'll have a higher base cost than Intercessors

Spike tax, man.

 Gadzilla666 wrote:

Eh, I think you're partially correct. If my math is right, and so are the rumours for what the various Marks and Icons do, then a properly Marked + Icon unit of "Legionaries" will be able to beat intercessors in a fistfight. So they'll probably be cheaper base (possibly even cheaper than TACs), but once you start spending points on "extras" they'll be better than loyalists. So you can go "cheaper but worse", or "more expensive, but better". Sounds.... familiar.

Eh so you are better than objective campers. Whoo. How about actual threat? Basic marines are there to be obsec bodies on objective you trade for vp's. Not for killing.

Via a friend of a poster on B&C (because we never get our own news on dakka) who was in attendance for the Q&A at the preview.

CSM may be after the army set, but before the Knights codices

This does confuse me greatly NGL.

Dudeface wrote:
Via a friend of a poster on B&C (because we never get our own news on dakka) who was in attendance for the Q&A at the preview.

CSM may be after the army set, but before the Knights codices

This does confuse me greatly NGL.

If I understand this: Nid dex -> New Knights in a box with a limited release of the knight dex -> csm dex -> actual knight dex

 DreadfullyHopeful wrote:

Dudeface wrote:
Via a friend of a poster on B&C (because we never get our own news on dakka) who was in attendance for the Q&A at the preview.

CSM may be after the army set, but before the Knights codices

This does confuse me greatly NGL.

If I understand this: Nid dex -> New Knights in a box with a limited release of the knight dex -> csm dex -> actual knight dex

Aye gotta milk fomo with the knight codex box and allow for preorder milking...
Gotta love GW pulling a worst practices study on the videogaming industry and then adopting them...

 DreadfullyHopeful wrote:

Dudeface wrote:
Via a friend of a poster on B&C (because we never get our own news on dakka) who was in attendance for the Q&A at the preview.

CSM may be after the army set, but before the Knights codices

This does confuse me greatly NGL.

If I understand this: Nid dex -> New Knights in a box with a limited release of the knight dex -> csm dex -> actual knight dex

I envisioned that given the size of the CSM release it'll be a 2-3 week job or 2 waves, so it might be Nids > Army box > CSM wave 1 > Knights & chaos knights > CSM wave 2 maybe. Either way it looks like May as a guess.

Not Online!!! wrote:

Aye gotta milk fomo with the knight codex box and allow for preorder milking...
Gotta love GW pulling a worst practices study on the videogaming industry and then adopting them...

Yes, because FOMO is totally going to be a thing with an all-in-one army set done two months before general release. That will probably be left to rot on shelves and end up having to get sent back, like the previous army sets have.

 DreadfullyHopeful wrote:

Dudeface wrote:
Via a friend of a poster on B&C (because we never get our own news on dakka) who was in attendance for the Q&A at the preview.

CSM may be after the army set, but before the Knights codices

This does confuse me greatly NGL.

If I understand this: Nid dex -> New Knights in a box with a limited release of the knight dex -> csm dex -> actual knight dex

Yeah, a big gap between the limited relase 'Dex and the actual 'Dex was how it went the last time a 'Dex was shoved into an army box, aka the 9th ed Ork one.

Black Templars was the most recent Army Set to General Release.


There was a little over a month between army set to general release there.

 Kanluwen wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:

Aye gotta milk fomo with the knight codex box and allow for preorder milking...
Gotta love GW pulling a worst practices study on the videogaming industry and then adopting them...

Yes, because FOMO is totally going to be a thing with an all-in-one army set done two months before general release. That will probably be left to rot on shelves and end up having to get sent back, like the previous army sets have.

Preorder practices are still gak and have said effect kan.

Not Online!!! wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:

Aye gotta milk fomo with the knight codex box and allow for preorder milking...
Gotta love GW pulling a worst practices study on the videogaming industry and then adopting them...

Yes, because FOMO is totally going to be a thing with an all-in-one army set done two months before general release. That will probably be left to rot on shelves and end up having to get sent back, like the previous army sets have.

Preorder practices are still gak and have said effect kan.

How is anyone "missing out" when GW now produce enough army boxes to cover all the orders placed, leaving scalpers with way less incentive to buy all the stock?

The only thing that would even incentivize FOMO is if there's a really nice limited codex included, or they do what they've never done with any of these boxes and released some exclusive model that can only be obtained from the box.

drbored wrote:
\There wouldn't be a meme if they had just kept Chaos Marine wound-count consistent with the rest of the game. Two years ago they could have updated the wound and points in a chapter approved.

Even if they had these posts would instead be talking about having to wait for the codex as CSM would still be comparatively underpowered.

GW really needs to address their own internal consistency when it comes to supporting their own product and game. If they want us to buy all those extra books they keep pumping out, then they need to make sure its worthwhile to do so.

On this I agree.

Some designer over at GW must be getting paid a little too much given the obvious CAD assets reuse.

tneva82 wrote:

 Gadzilla666 wrote:

Eh, I think you're partially correct. If my math is right, and so are the rumours for what the various Marks and Icons do, then a properly Marked + Icon unit of "Legionaries" will be able to beat intercessors in a fistfight. So they'll probably be cheaper base (possibly even cheaper than TACs), but once you start spending points on "extras" they'll be better than loyalists. So you can go "cheaper but worse", or "more expensive, but better". Sounds.... familiar.

Eh so you are better than objective campers. Whoo. How about actual threat? Basic marines are there to be obsec bodies on objective you trade for vp's. Not for killing.

It's more of a "thematic" thing. Basically "My objective campers can beat your objective campers". Hopefully that will carry over into the other "equivalent" units. Point taken, though.

Kanluwen wrote:Black Templars was the most recent Army Set to General Release.


There was a little over a month between army set to general release there.

But has this happened before? IE: Army Set for faction (X), then codex/model release for faction (Y), then stand alone codex for faction (X)? I can't really remember at this point.