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2023/02/07 15:11:23
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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 The Phazer wrote:Valrak's latest video says the release day is June 24th, and that GW staff are being told they're not allowed to book leave around then.
FWIW, I know GW have done the not allowed to book leave around previous 40k launches and this is about the same level of notice, so I can believe that.
He also speaks a bit about how he's not sure how much of a "reset" the rules are, but just that it is a codex reset and the edition will have indexes at launch. So sounds a bit more consistent with the other rumours.
In one of his videos from a few months back he said he'd heard 10th edition would be coming towards the end of the year, though.
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2023/02/07 15:11:41
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Terrifying Doombull
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The Phazer wrote:He also speaks a bit about how he's not sure how much of a "reset" the rules are, but just that it is a codex reset and the edition will have indexes at launch. So sounds a bit more consistent with the other rumours.
A codex reset with indices at launch means a pretty big rules change. An incremental core rules change doesn't require that, or at least didn't for past edition changes.
If they're jumping ship already, that would honestly make 8th/9th the shortest and least successful 'era' of 40k.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2023/02/07 15:14:57
Efficiency is the highest virtue. |
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2023/02/07 15:15:50
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Servoarm Flailing Magos
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Voss wrote: The Phazer wrote:He also speaks a bit about how he's not sure how much of a "reset" the rules are, but just that it is a codex reset and the edition will have indexes at launch. So sounds a bit more consistent with the other rumours.
A codex reset with indices at launch means a pretty big rules change. An incremental core rules change doesn't require that.
The B&C rumours say that the rules itself are changing only incrementally, but the Stratagem system is basically reset totally. That would fit with these rumours, because almost every faction has alternative force org rules etc. that at the moment work with or through stratagems, and that would need to be adressed by an index or a FAQ/ruling of some sort.
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2023/02/07 15:19:21
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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The Marine Standing Behind Marneus Calgar
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The out of control power creep of the codexes is the biggest issue with 9th, IMHO. The framework of the rules doesn’t need a hard reboot, just all the books with their layerd special rules, strats, and damage/resilience proliferation arms race.
A set of indexes might be just what the Dr. ordered. Plus GW gets to sell us a set of those at the start, and new codexes when they get around to it.
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2023/02/07 15:23:27
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Terrifying Doombull
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Tsagualsa wrote:Voss wrote: The Phazer wrote:He also speaks a bit about how he's not sure how much of a "reset" the rules are, but just that it is a codex reset and the edition will have indexes at launch. So sounds a bit more consistent with the other rumours.
A codex reset with indices at launch means a pretty big rules change. An incremental core rules change doesn't require that.
The B&C rumours say that the rules itself are changing only incrementally, but the Stratagem system is basically reset totally. That would fit with these rumours, because almost every faction has alternative force org rules etc. that at the moment work with or through stratagems, and that would need to be adressed by an index or a FAQ/ruling of some sort.
Hmm, I would think a FAQ (or online 'index') would be the way to go then. Because the most likely scenario (in line with those B&C rumors) is bringing the other books (and their pages and pages of strats, traits and etc) in line with a much shorter lists in the World Eater's codex. (And avoid the outrage that would come from invalidating the ~4 month old codex)
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/02/07 15:28:26
Efficiency is the highest virtue. |
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2023/02/07 15:28:30
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Servoarm Flailing Magos
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Voss wrote:Tsagualsa wrote:Voss wrote: The Phazer wrote:He also speaks a bit about how he's not sure how much of a "reset" the rules are, but just that it is a codex reset and the edition will have indexes at launch. So sounds a bit more consistent with the other rumours.
A codex reset with indices at launch means a pretty big rules change. An incremental core rules change doesn't require that.
The B&C rumours say that the rules itself are changing only incrementally, but the Stratagem system is basically reset totally. That would fit with these rumours, because almost every faction has alternative force org rules etc. that at the moment work with or through stratagems, and that would need to be adressed by an index or a FAQ/ruling of some sort.
Hmm, I would think a FAQ (or online 'index') would be the way to go then. Because the most likely scenario (in line with those B&C rumors) is bringing the other books (and their pages and pages of strats, traits and etc) in line with a much shorter lists in the World Eater's codex.
Indeed, but 'Indexes' can mean a lot of different things, it may be just that, some sort of free online resource, printed in or alongside WD, sold as a book or even all of that. We have historical examples for all of that, so until we get more solid rumours it would be foolish to rule that out. I agree that the most likely outcome is pages and pages of 'Remove stratagem X. Remove stratagem Y. Stratagem Z now costs no CP. Remove...'
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2023/02/07 15:30:10
Subject: Re:10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Valrak did a new video today with some interesting things, its not from his usual sources but as he said:
This is not from my sources but does match some of what I've heard from my own:
Summary:
Video:
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This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2023/02/07 16:44:40
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2023/02/07 15:37:52
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Gore-Drenched Khorne Chaos Lord
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LET THE SALT FLOW!!!!!! (If true).
I'd find that philosophy interesting for basic infantry but I'm not sure it'll feel great and a lot of people will up and out the hobby as a guess.
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2023/02/07 15:46:45
Subject: Re:10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Servoarm Flailing Magos
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 Matrindur wrote:Valrak did a new video today with some interesting things, its not from his usual sources but:
Just want to share this, now I don't really go off other peoples sources but some stuff in here is what I've been told and haven't spoken about so it peaked my interest:
Summary:
Video:
Condesed and added that to the OP.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/02/07 15:57:51
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2023/02/07 15:57:46
Subject: Re:10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Matrindur wrote:Valrak did a new video today with some interesting things, its not from his usual sources but:
Just want to share this, now I don't really go off other peoples sources but some stuff in here is what I've been told and haven't spoken about so it peaked my interest:
Summary:
Video:
I find this quite difficult to believe because of the broadness of it. Not only has this guy supposedly seen marketing material, he's also seen miniatures close to release, stuff even further off including brand new unannounced army plans, new codex books, new waves for already existing armies, has seen the rules in upcoming codexs, has specific dates for releases, and knows what GWs buisness plans are regarding paints.
That's the sort of thing covering aspects of several different jobs and/or someone higher up. It's too varied in scope to seem like something someone could have actually found out/leaked themselves.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/02/07 15:58:17
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2023/02/07 16:01:13
Subject: Re:10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Servoarm Flailing Magos
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 Mentlegen324 wrote: Matrindur wrote:Valrak did a new video today with some interesting things, its not from his usual sources but:
Just want to share this, now I don't really go off other peoples sources but some stuff in here is what I've been told and haven't spoken about so it peaked my interest:
Summary:
Video:
I find this quite difficult to believe because of the broadness of it. Not only has this guy supposedly seen marketing material, he's also seen miniatures close to release, stuff even further off including brand new unannounced army plans, new codex books, new waves for already existing armies, has seen the rules in upcoming codexs, has specific dates for releases, and knows what GWs buisness plans are regarding paints.
That's the sort of thing covering aspects of several different jobs and/or someone higher up. It's too varied in scope to seem like something someone could have actually found out/leaked themselves.
Yeah, unless the source of that rumour got hold of something like an internal report, training material for staff seminars that are months off or something like that that list stretches belief in some aspects - it looks like wishlisting added in to known rumours and spiced up with some guesswork. What gives it away IMHO is the stuff about the background, that usually does not get included in the material that leaks with that amount of detail. Usually it's just parts of backcovers, short fluff blurbs from boxes or store descriptions and such if anything at all.
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2023/02/07 16:03:18
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Dominating Dominatrix
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Apex Swarmlord? I call it BS.
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2023/02/07 16:07:55
Subject: Re:10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Gore-Drenched Khorne Chaos Lord
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Mentlegen324 wrote: Matrindur wrote:Valrak did a new video today with some interesting things, its not from his usual sources but:
Just want to share this, now I don't really go off other peoples sources but some stuff in here is what I've been told and haven't spoken about so it peaked my interest:
Summary:
Video:
I find this quite difficult to believe because of the broadness of it. Not only has this guy supposedly seen marketing material, he's also seen miniatures close to release, stuff even further off including brand new unannounced army plans, new codex books, new waves for already existing armies, has seen the rules in upcoming codexs, has specific dates for releases, and knows what GWs buisness plans are regarding paints.
That's the sort of thing covering aspects of several different jobs and/or someone higher up. It's too varied in scope to seem like something someone could have actually found out/leaked themselves.
I believe this is from a different source than the previous rumours, the other set were form someone in marketing and Valrak also mentioned knowing about their training days etc. so it's not impossible he has a few higher ups feeding bits. Automatically Appended Next Post:
Well they've already used alpha and prime, not a huge stretch that the evolved form might get a different name, agree it's unlikely though.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/02/07 16:10:30
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2023/02/07 16:15:04
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Ollanius Pius - Savior of the Emperor
Gathering the Informations.
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That's assuming the Swarmlord doesn't get "reabsorbed" ala the Doom of Malan'tai.
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2023/02/07 16:33:06
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Gore-Drenched Khorne Chaos Lord
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"This is not from my sources but does match some of what I've heard from my own" - if that helps clear it up. They came off a dark angels discord.
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2023/02/07 16:54:20
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Infiltrating Broodlord
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Interesting that we've now heard three different chapters are the "poster boys" for the starter set. But Dark Angels would make sense to me, they're going to want to tie everything back to the Lion's return for a while, and a Dark Angels versus Tyranids conflict hasn't really been done before, unlike Ultramarines and Blood Angels. Then again, there are some fundamentals that speak to the other direction - one of the reasons for picking Ultramarines before was the ease of painting them, and for Dark Angels in a box like this you're going to end up with different coloured Marines for example.
Having said that, I was also of the opinion before that they might lean into Ultramarines versus Tyranids to go with Space Marine 2, so who knows at this point.
Edit: On the rules I'm not a big fan at all of removing stat checks in the game depending on special rules, but I guess that is conditional that the toughness value needs a complete reset to use the range much more. If we remain in a situation where all general infantry is either three or four I guess it makes sense.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/02/07 16:56:24
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2023/02/07 17:10:49
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Crazed Cultist of Khorne
Bremen (Germany)
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Source: Trust me bro.
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2023/02/07 17:24:26
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Posts with Authority
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I'm not saying anything about the potential valdity of these rumours, but dropping toughness altogether from basic troops sounds like an interesting change! Should make heavier armour mean something again.
Condensing most hit-wound-save rollathons to just hit-save sounds like it would speed combat resolution up considerably, especially when bucketfulls of dice are flying around.
If these rumours turn out to be true, we will be moving into uncharted waters.. exciting! Maybe it will be rubbish, or maybe it'll turn out an improvement, remains to be seen of course..
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/02/07 17:25:31
"The larger point though, is that as players, we have more control over what the game looks and feels like than most of us are willing to use in order to solve our own problems" |
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2023/02/07 17:39:48
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Unless GW suddenly get better at writing, that sounds like a lot of awful.
So much of the current bloat seems to come from trying to make the streamlined rules interesting.
And I can’t see that getting better if they just streamline it more.
Will probably just lead to more issues and wouldn’t be happy for most of that.
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2023/02/07 18:13:18
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Painlord Titan Princeps of Slaanesh
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Assuming the rumor regarding toughness saves is true it will be interesting to see where the break point between roll and no roll falls. Per the rumor Terminators will get a roll. I imagine anything less than power armor (or the equivalent) will not get a roll. I wonder which side of the rule power armor will fall on?
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2023/02/07 19:37:15
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Gore-Drenched Khorne Chaos Lord
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Minor extra observation I've see elsewhere, the boarding action warriors are the stock image GW models but have been repainted, which would make sense in light of a wider faction revamp. The broodlord and stealers however, have not.
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2023/02/07 19:52:35
Subject: Re:10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Ultimately the thing that bugs me most about 'no toughness' is that people buying the books neat the end of the edition and getting to use them all of none months.
It's a raw friggin' deal, if true.
On the subject of the actual rules I am not sure I understand how weapons will function. A lascannon will be a single shot ( made up scenario ) that wound-hits on a 2+ and then maybe you get a save ( if not modded away )? And perhaps this 'heavy armor' modifies that roll so it's a 4+ against a tank?
If it isn't a D10 system that seems like it will make everything feel really flat.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/02/07 20:16:58
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2023/02/07 19:55:03
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Regular Dakkanaut
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We really need like some sort of Addendum that recaps the full extent of these rumours, with the specific sources seperated so we aren't bonked down in this plethora of rumours.
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2023/02/07 20:00:49
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Servoarm Flailing Magos
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 Segersgia wrote:We really need like some sort of Addendum that recaps the full extent of these rumours, with the specific sources seperated so we aren't bonked down in this plethora of rumours.
I will do this the coming weekend, as that needs a bit of time and i want to preserve the distinction between 'trusted' sources and other rumour origins.
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2023/02/07 21:04:04
Subject: Re:10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Gore-Drenched Khorne Chaos Lord
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 Daedalus81 wrote:Ultimately the thing that bugs me most about 'no toughness' is that people buying the books neat the end of the edition and getting to use them all of none months.
It's a raw friggin' deal, if true.
On the subject of the actual rules I am not sure I understand how weapons will function. A lascannon will be a single shot ( made up scenario ) that wound-hits on a 2+ and then maybe you get a save ( if not modded away )? And perhaps this 'heavy armor' modifies that roll so it's a 4+ against a tank?
If it isn't a D10 system that seems like it will make everything feel really flat.
I think the idea is lascannon shoots, does it hit? if yes is the target "heavy armour"? If yes then roll to wound, if not proceed to save. If the wound roll is successful roll to save.
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2023/02/07 21:15:20
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Not as Good as a Minion
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Apple fox wrote:Unless GW suddenly get better at writing, that sounds like a lot of awful.
So much of the current bloat seems to come from trying to make the streamlined rules interesting.
And I can’t see that getting better if they just streamline it more.
Will probably just lead to more issues and wouldn’t be happy for most of that.
yeah, main problem usually is that GW removes too much from the core to streamline, than runs out of possibilities to make each faction unique after a certain point and starts adding rules back for the factions coming after that point (which looks like it is not a big problem in AoS as somehow the factions are unique without adding tons of special rules)
also just by looking at the "free" core, streamlining of the core is not the problem and never was, Codex bloat was and this is now the 3rd Edition in a row GW does not understand this and again starts with a limited core
the only thing to hope is that this time they get the Index right and not just copy&paste current unit stats without adapting to the new rules like they did in 8th
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Harry, bring this ring to Narnia or the Sith will take the Enterprise |
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2023/02/07 22:12:28
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Stubborn Dark Angels Veteran Sergeant
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F28: War Always Changes streamlines toughness and armour together, and it makes for a significantly faster take on the core 40K experience without really losing anything. I wouldn't be surprised if GW is looking at how many people are leaving "the hobby" for slightly more elegant rulesets like this and One Page Rules, and has decided to copy some aspects of those rules.
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2023/02/07 22:16:44
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Regular Dakkanaut
East Tennessee
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“Promotional art will show them [the starter box miniatures] as Dark Angels and Hive Fleet Leviathan.”
Sounds like someone got potato cam pictures of the Wrath of the Soul Forge King and Tyranid boarding patrol boxes.
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2023/02/07 22:20:13
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests
Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.
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So let's fix 9th's lethality issues by making it even easier to kill things. That sounds like a GW solution alright.  Smaug wrote:“Promotional art will show them [the starter box miniatures] as Dark Angels and Hive Fleet Leviathan.” Sounds like someone got potato cam pictures of the Wrath of the Soul Forge King and Tyranid boarding patrol boxes.
Seems weird to go from "Blood Angels and Tyranids! Blood Angels and Tyranids! Blood Angels and Tyranids!" for months and months to suddenly swerve to "Nope, actually Dark Angels and Tyranids!".
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2023/02/07 22:28:53
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2023/02/07 22:39:41
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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The BA vs Tyranids is because god forbid Tyranids fight anyone else but BA, I feel.
But yeah, the original source of this was 4chan, so take that as you will. Big green text post, could be prophecy, could be nothing.
the idea that they'd go to a Warcry-esque way of hitting/saving except for 'Heavy Armor' things as a way to 'simplify' the game feels... opposite of what they are claiming. Having exceptions inherently complicates things.
Also, Crusade becoming more like Path to Glory is basically the opposite of what anyone wants. People love Crusade, hate PtG, why would they go that way?
Time will tell. I feel like some of this absolutely could happen, like a second wave of Votann and calling the new model an 'Apex Swarmlord', but a lot of the rest feels like bunk.
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Ultramarines, 3rd Co. and friends, 16k+ 
4k 
4k Points
Competition Index
