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tneva82 wrote:
Well. Funnily enough it's working. Unless they figure out way to do more profits no need to change. Goal is max profits after all.

So far they keep breaking profit records. So it's working.

I mean, yes. Everything works until it doesn't.

 Matrindur wrote:
I'm a bit surprised we still haven't seen anything coming after the box.
For 9th Indomitus preorder started on July 11th and the four EtB kits were revealed on June 13th, on the same day the box itself was shown fully, so nearly a month earlier so I expected them to do something similar this time, maybe show off one per Monday which would fit exactly until the preorder date of June 10th if they started this week but nothing yet

Wasn't there a leak of post-Indomitus models before that release, which kind of forced their hand?

Barring another one of those I'd expect GW to wait until much closer to Leviathan before showing what's coming next. They'll want to keep focus on selling that first and avoid any confusion as to what comes in the box.

 xttz wrote:

 Matrindur wrote:
I'm a bit surprised we still haven't seen anything coming after the box.
For 9th Indomitus preorder started on July 11th and the four EtB kits were revealed on June 13th, on the same day the box itself was shown fully, so nearly a month earlier so I expected them to do something similar this time, maybe show off one per Monday which would fit exactly until the preorder date of June 10th if they started this week but nothing yet

Wasn't there a leak of post-Indomitus models before that release, which kind of forced their hand?

Barring another one of those I'd expect GW to wait until much closer to Leviathan before showing what's coming next. They'll want to keep focus on selling that first and avoid any confusion as to what comes in the box.

There was but the pics also were in the rulebook iirc, so it wouldn't have made much difference I think. Might get a reveal about the time of kansas open?

 Albertorius wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Well. Funnily enough it's working. Unless they figure out way to do more profits no need to change. Goal is max profits after all.

So far they keep breaking profit records. So it's working.

I mean, yes. Everything works until it doesn't.

Now we are going into realm of serious what if's without having actual data...

Companies don't generally operate on what if's without even any evidence it's going to happen. Maybe plastic toys get banned next year? Should gw make decision based on that what if?

What if's without actual solid data(outside gw is hard to get) aren't all that useful and if making abolute statements just embarasses yourself.

Gw keeps doing what it thinks does most profit. It simply might be their production capability can't say double leviathan output without crippling every other game production(which are lousy atm anyway. Out of stock is ridiculous level atm) while increasing production capability is too long term taking with too many risks based on their estimation of future sales based on their data.

Who knows? Not me. But i get good laugh when armschair businessmen claims to know how to run gw better than guys that are making record profits. If so good why not running your own company raking in billions...

 Matrindur wrote:
I'm a bit surprised we still haven't seen anything coming after the box.
For 9th Indomitus preorder started on July 11th and the four EtB kits were revealed on June 13th, on the same day the box itself was shown fully, so nearly a month earlier so I expected them to do something similar this time, maybe show off one per Monday which would fit exactly until the preorder date of June 10th if they started this week but nothing yet

Their faction previews are just enough to cover the rest of May, after that they have two working weeks before the preorder starts and another two weeks before the actual release, i guess they start previewing stuff after the box in the middle of that time period, they want to keep the ball rolling after all. It feels like we have a pretty complete picture about 10th now, and the articles start to feel like padding and marketing guffaw, i don't think they planned on keeping that up for yet another month.

Also Indomitus was a crazy time where everything was out of sorts. GW might even have marketed stuff earlier for after because they knew they were going to run out of stock and wanted to get people excited for other stuff that they might be able to get hold of more easily once the core stock on the boxed set ran out.

Or just a different approach to marketing. Who knows.

drbored wrote:


GW knows how many Horus Heresy boxes sold. They know how the 3rd ed AoS Dominion box sold (or didn't in some cases). They have all these numbers. They're going to be comparing them to Indomitus, and other projected growth numbers.

Wait, I wasn't aware that the AoS Doninion box set didn't sell well? I thought it sold well.

Back on topic.

I find it odd that one of the original factions haven't been previewed yet, Orks. They are pretty much the defacto xenos race that plagues the IoM the most. Odd to leave them so late in their preview.

 stonehorse wrote:

drbored wrote:


GW knows how many Horus Heresy boxes sold. They know how the 3rd ed AoS Dominion box sold (or didn't in some cases). They have all these numbers. They're going to be comparing them to Indomitus, and other projected growth numbers.

Wait, I wasn't aware that the AoS Doninion box set didn't sell well? I thought it sold well.

Back on topic.

I find it odd that one of the original factions haven't been previewed yet, Orks. They are pretty much the defacto xenos race that plagues the IoM the most. Odd to leave them so late in their preview.

Dominion sold well, there were two issues though

1) It did not sell as well as Indomitus did. I think in part because AoS isn't as big as 40K; but it also didn't capture the same mania that Indomitus had the year before during the Pandemic period.

2) GW pushed/encouraged/contracted more stock to 3rd parties of Dominion. What happened then was Dominion sold, but didn't sell out fast enough for those stores who are on tight margins. There was thus a short period where some stores were selling them at trade price just to clear them out of stock to free up money that they could buy inventory that would sell faster. So it was more of a cashflow issue and overstocking problem for some 3rd parties.

Though not impressive there's still dominion's on flgs.

Not helped that sigmarines didn't archieve marine level of sure sellers, kruleboyz new faction whose look was divisive and never been very good in-game. And what's good in tournaments for sigmarines tends to be what isn't in dominion box.

But hard to say was problem it not selling much or gw overproducing.

 Overread wrote:

 stonehorse wrote:

drbored wrote:


GW knows how many Horus Heresy boxes sold. They know how the 3rd ed AoS Dominion box sold (or didn't in some cases). They have all these numbers. They're going to be comparing them to Indomitus, and other projected growth numbers.

Wait, I wasn't aware that the AoS Doninion box set didn't sell well? I thought it sold well.

Back on topic.

I find it odd that one of the original factions haven't been previewed yet, Orks. They are pretty much the defacto xenos race that plagues the IoM the most. Odd to leave them so late in their preview.

Dominion sold well, there were two issues though

1) It did not sell as well as Indomitus did. I think in part because AoS isn't as big as 40K; but it also didn't capture the same mania that Indomitus had the year before during the Pandemic period.

2) GW pushed/encouraged/contracted more stock to 3rd parties of Dominion. What happened then was Dominion sold, but didn't sell out fast enough for those stores who are on tight margins. There was thus a short period where some stores were selling them at trade price just to clear them out of stock to free up money that they could buy inventory that would sell faster. So it was more of a cashflow issue and overstocking problem for some 3rd parties.

There were stores in Florida selling them for $90 USD last year just to clear all the copies they had taking up shelf space.

I can still find stores with copies because they refuse to drop them below retail. It sold well, but they definitely overproduced.

We still have one or two copies of Dominion from the initial order on our shelves, having recently clearanced a pair of them to get down to that level.

They were handing them for free at Adepticon last year.

Chalk another one up for Valrak, the normal SM boxnaught is going Last Chance to buy:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/05/18/warhammer-40000-and-forge-world-legends-and-last-chance-to-buy/

Includes a rare acknowledgement that the Internet exists (other than their own pages, that is):

Importantly – and despite what heretical elements in the noosphere might be claiming otherwise – the humble Tactical Squads (as well as many other classic kits) are not being retired. In the new edition of Warhammer 40,000 you will still be able to play a Space Marines army without deploying so much as a single Primaris Marine, if you so choose.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/05/18/warhammer-40000-and-forge-world-legends-and-last-chance-to-buy/

Talking about Legends, some kits leaving the range and ongoing support for non-Primaris Marines.


"Those who own these classic models needn’t worry – they can still find a place on the battlefields of the new edition of Warhammer 40,000, representing kits that are still supported (like the new Sternguard Unit)."

"Importantly – and despite what heretical elements in the noosphere might be claiming otherwise – the humble Tactical Squads (as well as many other classic kits) are not being retired. In the new edition of Warhammer 40,000 you will still be able to play a Space Marines army without deploying so much as a single Primaris Marine, if you so choose."

A bunch of fairly commonly taken Xenos units are being moved to Legends too - e.g. Warboss on Bike, Dimachaeron and Malanthropes.

Notably, the FW greater demons are all going LCtB, as do the lot of old-scale Terminator characters for 40k... and a lot of Xenos stuff. Looking dire all around if i may say so.

On the other hand, for the 'Legends gonna be removed' crowd:

The good news for long-time collectors is that you will still be able to use many of your older miniatures in games of the new Warhammer 40,000. The new edition will support these units with comprehensive Legends rules, which will be available to download free online around the game’s release.

These are 100% official rules, with points, and we actively encourage you to use them in your games at home, in stores, clubs, and campaigns. Your classic units and characters are still awesome, and they deserve to see the battlefield every now and again.

Legends rules will not however be actively balanced* going forwards, so our recommendation is that these rules would not be suitable for competitive events.

Could be a new Chaos flyer kit/kits on the way in plastic with the new codex if they are retiring both FW kits.
The Greater Daemons make sense as the newer plastic ones are big enough compared to the old metal ones that were available when they FW ones were first made.
Hoping Zhufor means new WE terminators coming in plastic at some point.

Tsagualsa wrote:
Chalk another one up for Valrak, the normal SM boxnaught is going Last Chance to buy:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/05/18/warhammer-40000-and-forge-world-legends-and-last-chance-to-buy/

Includes a rare acknowledgement that the Internet exists (other than their own pages, that is):

Importantly – and despite what heretical elements in the noosphere might be claiming otherwise – the humble Tactical Squads (as well as many other classic kits) are not being retired. In the new edition of Warhammer 40,000 you will still be able to play a Space Marines army without deploying so much as a single Primaris Marine, if you so choose.

All the FW stuff is long gone, its only showing 2 or 3 items all the rest i searched for was sold out

The last few sentences are a dire portent:

There will still be Forge World units for Warhammer 40,000, but the focus for them will be on the really big stuff – like Titans, and other kits that we can’t reasonably produce at that scale (yet!).

When we add new units in future, they will almost always be in plastic – and there are a lot of plastic kits on the way over the next few years!

Not quite a death sentence yet, but we know how such things usually go down - no support for years, and then the label finally gets removed officially at a convenient time like e.g. a website reorganization/rebranding.

 Overread wrote:

 stonehorse wrote:

drbored wrote:


GW knows how many Horus Heresy boxes sold. They know how the 3rd ed AoS Dominion box sold (or didn't in some cases). They have all these numbers. They're going to be comparing them to Indomitus, and other projected growth numbers.

Wait, I wasn't aware that the AoS Doninion box set didn't sell well? I thought it sold well.

Back on topic.

I find it odd that one of the original factions haven't been previewed yet, Orks. They are pretty much the defacto xenos race that plagues the IoM the most. Odd to leave them so late in their preview.

Dominion sold well, there were two issues though

1) It did not sell as well as Indomitus did. I think in part because AoS isn't as big as 40K; but it also didn't capture the same mania that Indomitus had the year before during the Pandemic period.

2) GW pushed/encouraged/contracted more stock to 3rd parties of Dominion. What happened then was Dominion sold, but didn't sell out fast enough for those stores who are on tight margins. There was thus a short period where some stores were selling them at trade price just to clear them out of stock to free up money that they could buy inventory that would sell faster. So it was more of a cashflow issue and overstocking problem for some 3rd parties.

Ah, I see. Thanks for taking the time to explain the situation. A bit odd that GW would think AoS can even come close to the 40K level of sales, still a relatively new game and the lore is (from my understanding) still being pinned down as to what is what.

Tsagualsa wrote:
The last few sentences are a dire portent:

There will still be Forge World units for Warhammer 40,000, but the focus for them will be on the really big stuff – like Titans, and other kits that we can’t reasonably produce at that scale (yet!).

When we add new units in future, they will almost always be in plastic – and there are a lot of plastic kits on the way over the next few years!

Not quite a death sentence yet, but we know how such things usually go down - no support for years, and then the label finally gets removed officially at a convenient time like e.g. a website reorganization/rebranding.

Makes sense. GW's plastic production has come on a long way since FW's initially inception. So only realistic that eventually FW models get plastic kits, and then FW is no longer required.

I think it's a shame some of the units going, particularly xenos ones, might not get a 1:1 port, they're amazing sculpts that deserve better.

The retirement of firstborn commences, then.

A shame. The original Dreads are still my favourite. And the sternguard kit was a great kit with a ton of options.

Imperial knights

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/05/18/warhammer-40000-faction-focus-imperial-knights-2/

 Galas wrote:
The retirement of firstborn commences, then.

A shame. The original Dreads are still my favourite. And the sternguard kit was a great kit with a ton of options.

Well, we still have the ven dread kit. Which as a modeling kit is WAY better then the basic dread. Dropping the basic dread from the line will mean there is not a ML arm in print, but the ven dread should have all the other options and more.

The SG box is an amazing kit. So many awesome bits to spice up your army. It will be missed.

Why bother with the FW article? So much stuff they listed is already gone, like the ork HQs

 Galas wrote:
The retirement of firstborn commences, then.

A shame. The original Dreads are still my favourite. And the sternguard kit was a great kit with a ton of options.

I can get not liking the aesthetic change, but personally this is how the whole marine range should have been handled- just an understated upscale and update.
Using old sternguard, terminators or dreads in place of the Leviathan versions looks entirely viable.

 GaroRobe wrote:
Why bother with the FW article? So much stuff they listed is already gone, like the ork HQs

I quite like them making it official, rather than quietly retiring kits in the background, out of sight, out of mind.
Transparency is better than eliminating products in the dark and not letting customers know.

Tsagualsa wrote:
...like Titans, and other kits that we can’t reasonably produce at that scale (yet!).

That last part gives me a positive vibe - sooner or later there will be a plastic Hierophant. The countdown starts!

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/05/18/warhammer-40000-faction-focus-imperial-knights-2/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=warhammer-40,000&utm_content=ffknights18052023

Imperial Knights

feel free to puzzle over the wording. of _a_ hit roll (and wound roll) of 1..

Two deed options feel... thin... for a faction ability.

---
Rapid Fire Battle Cannon is d6+3 attacks [Blast] and [Rapid fire d6+3]. So... do you roll twice or double the number of shots? Do you double the extra attacks from blast? (Presumably not, but... GW rules)

Voss wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/05/18/warhammer-40000-faction-focus-imperial-knights-2/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=warhammer-40,000&utm_content=ffknights18052023

Imperial Knights

feel free to puzzle over the wording. of _a_ hit roll (and wound roll) of 1..

Two deed options feel... thin... for a faction ability.

---
Rapid Fire Battle Cannon is d6+3 attacks [Blast] and [Rapid fire d6+3]. So... do you roll twice or double the number of shots? Do you double the extra attacks from blast? (Presumably not, but... GW rules)

hm yup i also wonder does that mean reroll all 1's on the hit and wound roll OR does it mean 1 one per model?

I would guess 1 per model. The “a” implies singular.

I think it would be a separate roll for the rapid fire.

 nordsturmking wrote:

Voss wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/05/18/warhammer-40000-faction-focus-imperial-knights-2/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=warhammer-40,000&utm_content=ffknights18052023

Imperial Knights

feel free to puzzle over the wording. of _a_ hit roll (and wound roll) of 1..

Two deed options feel... thin... for a faction ability.

---
Rapid Fire Battle Cannon is d6+3 attacks [Blast] and [Rapid fire d6+3]. So... do you roll twice or double the number of shots? Do you double the extra attacks from blast? (Presumably not, but... GW rules)

hm yup i also wonder does that mean reroll all 1's on the hit and wound roll OR does it mean 1 one per model?

I think its 1 of each per model, just because the wording is notably different from how they've worded re-roll ones abilities in the past.
But I'd have to dig for a 10th edition example (I think somebody's datacard has reroll ones... Edit: Cawl, but it specifies for each attack)