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 VladimirHerzog wrote:

Biasn wrote:
I am really worried that some machtups might be really scuffed , how will they balance an anti psyker army like BT against a mostly psyker army like GK or TS? I still fail to see that the Psyker keyword will do anything positive unless they are way more costeffective than similar counterparts without the Psyker keyword

anti-psyker 4+ does nothing against TS lol, You're already wounding all the psykers (except magnus) on a 4+

i addressed the rest after i was corrected.

As for the comment i'm quoting, I've never had one of these pick-up games where you show up to a store with your collection. All my pickup games have been setup on messenger before showing up to the store.

Termies are T5 now iirc , and it will ease the triggering of mortals no?

 kodos wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:
And you still can't pick a detachment after seeing your opponent's list

says who?
unless you play with tournament restrictions in casual matched play games, there is nothing that prevents you from changing the list after seeing what your opponent is bringing on the table

That is list-tailoring, and is generally frowned upon for standard pick-up games. The guy in a club who is constantly list-tailoring is not going to make a lot of friends.

Of course, doing so with both parties agreeing is a different beast. Just most games are "turn up with your 2k all-comers list and see who wants to play".

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

Biasn wrote:
I am really worried that some machtups might be really scuffed , how will they balance an anti psyker army like BT against a mostly psyker army like GK or TS? I still fail to see that the Psyker keyword will do anything positive unless they are way more costeffective than similar counterparts without the Psyker keyword

anti-psyker 4+ does nothing against TS lol, You're already wounding all the psykers (except magnus) on a 4+

You're nitpicking the example rather than addressing the issue.
Also, you're wrong, since there's more to the TS than those two datacards.
Scarab terminators will definitely be T5, for example.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Voss wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:


Also, detachments are picked in listbuilding, you can't show up to a game, know what you're facing and then pick accordingly

That's pretty contrary to my experience with pick-up games, where people often throw together a list on the fly.

i addressed the rest after i was corrected.

As for the comment i'm quoting, I've never had one of these pick-up games where you show up to a store with your collection. All my pickup games have been setup on messenger before showing up to the store.

Great? Or Bad? whichever.
Where I've played its been normal for people to bring a subset of their collection and build a list there (typically they don't take things out of their bag(s)/case(s) because they aren't planning on using it right this moment). That it isn't your particular experience doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

 VladimirHerzog wrote:
All my pickup games have been setup on messenger before showing up to the store.

That's not a pickup game, that is a preplanned game. A pickup game is where you go to a store/club and try to pick up an opponent with no forward planning.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Why does GW hate Chaos so much? Now all the Daemon Engines are "Horus Heresy" units? Piss off GW. You're drunk!

Anyway, Chapters, Chapters, Chapters! I do appreciate them doing this all at once, rather than drip-feeding us one Marine Chapter after another for a whole week.

GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units."
Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?"
Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?"
GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage leutnat!"

Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.

 Trickstick wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:
All my pickup games have been setup on messenger before showing up to the store.

That's not a pickup game, that is a preplanned game. A pickup game is where you go to a store/club and try to pick up an opponent with no forward planning.

I still rarely see those type of games involve building a list right there and then. IME, it's much more common for players to show up with a standard list, usually a 2k one, and then find an opponent. If I have to sit and wait for my opponent to build a list for 20 minutes I'm likely looking for a different opponent.

The few times I have seen someone build a list before a game, they were either new (which is fair enough), doing a cool narrative thing, or the sort of person you really don't want to play against. And it usually skewed towards the latter.

Some people would even have several lists written, and pull one out when you told them your army. Which could be hilarious when they pulled out their full tank killing list, and you started pulling out foot guard.

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

Biasn wrote:
I am really worried that some machtups might be really scuffed , how will they balance an anti psyker army like BT against a mostly psyker army like GK or TS? I still fail to see that the Psyker keyword will do anything positive unless they are way more costeffective than similar counterparts without the Psyker keyword

anti-psyker 4+ does nothing against TS lol, You're already wounding all the psykers (except magnus) on a 4+

e.

Wait until you combo anti with devastating. Mortals at 4+ to wound.

Even if you don’t pack any of the insanely powerful god-engines in your army case, you won’t want to miss it, in case a Warhound darkens your deployment zone in the not-so-far future.

Implication that Titans will be point costed properly and not given arbitrary 2000 point + values to prevent their use in normal games?

Where has Specialist Ammunition gone?
Where have Deathwatch Shotguns gone?
Black Shields?

 kodos wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:
And you still can't pick a detachment after seeing your opponent's list

says who?
unless you play with tournament restrictions in casual matched play games, there is nothing that prevents you from changing the list after seeing what your opponent is bringing on the table

Well if you do that you will find yourself playing with yourself.

Or play somebody who is aos me in 40k."oh you switched to anti-tson vs my tson? I'll pull out necrons. Oh another switch? Enjoy my knights".

If you can change list on the fly so can i

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Where has Specialist Ammunition gone?
Where have Deathwatch Shotguns gone?
Black Shields?

The way of the Chosen and Chaos terminator weapons.

Biasn wrote:
I am really worried that some machtups might be really scuffed , how will they balance an anti psyker army like BT against a mostly psyker army like GK or TS? I still fail to see that the Psyker keyword will do anything positive unless they are way more costeffective than similar counterparts without the Psyker keyword

It's only on melee weapons and it only really matters against stuff like daemon princes and triggering other rules. And the 4++ doesn't block mortal wounds.

Khahandran wrote:

 Valkyrie wrote:

Biasn wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

Biasn wrote:
What are these rules for Daddy Simba? 3++ , 4+++ against mortals , -1 to wound with damage reflection AND first strike so he minces everything in melee before even getting attacked? how are you supposed to kill this abomination. Has to be half of your 2000pt army to not be auto include in every list lol

Just shoot him

With what? Everything shy of a lascannon wounds on a 6+

Thundercoil Harpoon funnily enough is becoming more and more an anti-Primarch weapon. Hits on 2+. Wounds on 2+, on a 4+ just does 12 MW and insta-gibs him.

Only if you're in 12" when he's near another unit, it wounds on a 3+, only does the mortals on a 5+, and if you think it's likely to happen run the mortal wound aura.

Girlyman only has the 12" problem in comparison.

Anti 4+ procs critical wound on 4+. Devastating means mortals on crit wound. Hence 4+ is mortals. Doesn't matter if you are t50 -3 to wound. 4+ is mortals.

Not Online!!! wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Where has Specialist Ammunition gone?
Where have Deathwatch Shotguns gone?
Black Shields?

The way of the Chosen and Chaos terminator weapons.

Can we make "combi-weaponed" a term, like "squatted"?

So... we can assume that the Terrex Termite is being Legend'ed to HH?

Primarch hunting will probably be the grenade and tank shock strategems, move in close and shoot plus grenades.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Where has Specialist Ammunition gone?
Where have Deathwatch Shotguns gone?
Black Shields?

I’m not overly concerned with consolidation as such (saves the issue where one weapon is far superior to another so you never take the one you modeled anyway).
However, I want to know what the loadout restrictions are. Are my guys legal in buildout as they currently stand. We also haven’t seen a kill team yet, these are just your big standard veterans (I know that is an oxymoron).

 whembly wrote:
So... we can assume that the Terrex Termite is being Legend'ed to HH?

No need. Its on the list.

Secutarii Hoplites and Peltasts, and Terrax-pattern Termites

 Trickstick wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Where has Specialist Ammunition gone?
Where have Deathwatch Shotguns gone?
Black Shields?

The way of the Chosen and Chaos terminator weapons.

Can we make "combi-weaponed" a term, like "squatted"?

"Chaosistency" exists already, and seemingly corrupts everyone.

Biasn wrote:
What are these rules for Daddy Simba? 3++ , 4+++ against mortals , -1 to wound with damage reflection AND first strike so he minces everything in melee before even getting attacked? how are you supposed to kill this abomination. Has to be half of your 2000pt army to not be auto include in every list lol
And even untargetable beyond 12"? I really dont know how to feel about this

Your right he is a little weak for the biggest johnson in the room. Maybe they should up his shooting a little.

So thinking about the BT sword brethren what do we think the Master crafted weapons are compared to the power weapons?

No wolves on Fenris wrote:
So thinking about the BT sword brethren what do we think the Master crafted weapons are compared to the power weapons?

Probably on the unit leader only?

I was wondering if the mace and axe and lightning claws would be the power weapons and the swords the master crafted ( or possibly the other way around)

Tsagualsa wrote:

No wolves on Fenris wrote:
So thinking about the BT sword brethren what do we think the Master crafted weapons are compared to the power weapons?

Probably on the unit leader only?

But where are the lightning claws???
There’s only 5 dudes in the box, how could they miss that? Guess it’s FAQ for them.

Wow, I never thought my barebones Deathwatch Veteran squads would be hit this hard. Greatly consolidated weapons options, yes. Obviously. Basic boltguns, hard no.
I expected something more like what they did to bolt rifles, minor but versatile. Adding in a Long Vigil Assault Weapon to represent stormbolters and shotguns would also help.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Where has Specialist Ammunition gone?
Where have Deathwatch Shotguns gone?
Black Shields?

So I’m looking at all my vets (have waaayyyy too many)

Shotguns are long vigil ranged weapons?
Heavy bolter has a hidden underslung heavy flamer now? Sharp Xeno tech indeed!
Missile launcher on sheet but not in box, weird choice GW.
Thunderhammer is same as heavy thunderhammer
Storm bolter is just a regular bolter.

tneva82 wrote:

Khahandran wrote:

 Valkyrie wrote:

Biasn wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

Biasn wrote:
What are these rules for Daddy Simba? 3++ , 4+++ against mortals , -1 to wound with damage reflection AND first strike so he minces everything in melee before even getting attacked? how are you supposed to kill this abomination. Has to be half of your 2000pt army to not be auto include in every list lol

Just shoot him

With what? Everything shy of a lascannon wounds on a 6+

Thundercoil Harpoon funnily enough is becoming more and more an anti-Primarch weapon. Hits on 2+. Wounds on 2+, on a 4+ just does 12 MW and insta-gibs him.

Only if you're in 12" when he's near another unit, it wounds on a 3+, only does the mortals on a 5+, and if you think it's likely to happen run the mortal wound aura.

Girlyman only has the 12" problem in comparison.

Anti 4+ procs critical wound on 4+. Devastating means mortals on crit wound. Hence 4+ is mortals. Doesn't matter if you are t50 -3 to wound. 4+ is mortals.

I know all that. You actually mean the rule works by unmodified rolls, which I forgot.

 kodos wrote:
Rosterizer and Phalanx
but don't know what the current state of those projects is

Rosterizer is in open beta and is planning a kickstarter shortly.

Phalanx has been quiet lately but there's also newrecruit, bluescribe, and the Forces app.

 bullyboy wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Where has Specialist Ammunition gone?
Where have Deathwatch Shotguns gone?
Black Shields?

So I’m looking at all my vets (have waaayyyy too many)

Shotguns are long vigil ranged weapons?
Heavy bolter has a hidden underslung heavy flamer now? Sharp Xeno tech indeed!
Missile launcher on sheet but not in box, weird choice GW.
Thunderhammer is same as heavy thunderhammer
Storm bolter is just a regular bolter.

shotguns, stalker bolters, all the combi weapons, and I guess the special weapons and pistols, are all long vigil ranged weapons. And the statline is identical to the "combi-weapon" statline seen elsewhere. Congratulation, your flamer, sniper-rifle, shotgun, and bolter with underslung gravity projector all hit exactly the same!