Warhammer 40k news and rumours. More Space Wolves revealed pg. 185

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**Platuan4th**

Mr_Rose wrote:

3. In my head this looks like a giant version of the Dwarf Gyrocopter. Or maybe the troop transport can be like the gyrobomber but with tiny individual drop pods instead of the bombs?

The Iron Eagle Gyrocopter from Epic is sitting right there waiting eagerly for an embiggening and style update.

**cuda1179**

Mr_Rose wrote:
cuda1179 wrote:
When they do get around to Votann again they have better include:

1. Either a second troops choice, bring back 20 man squads, or both.

2. Units of Jump infantry like that guy from the Kill team box.

3. A flier of some kind. (okay this third thing isn't such a huge deal).

1. What would the second choice be? More melee focused? Scouts like T’au Pathfinders?

2. Could these be the second troop choice? Don’t make them super fast just like ignore terrain or something.

3. In my head this looks like a giant version of the Dwarf Gyrocopter. Or maybe the troop transport can be like the gyrobomber but with tiny individual drop pods instead of the bombs?

1. Pure wishlisting, but a squad that had a support function and could infiltrate and have a bonus to cover would be most welcome.

2. Yeah, if they made jumppack squats a troops choice I could live with that. Even if they aren't "Fast" in the game I'd still want them to be marginally faster than foot kin.

3. Okay, a mini droppod gyrocopter bomber is the greatest idea I've heard in a long time.

**ZergSmasher**

One thing I'd like to see for Votann is some kind of a Dreadnought-type thing. Mantic's Forge Father faction (their own take on Space Dwarves) has the Iron Ancestor, so the concept isn't exactly unique.

**Dysartes**

cuda1179 wrote:
3. A flier of some kind. (okay this third thing isn't such a huge deal).

...time to bring back the Iron Eagle?

**cuda1179**

Dysartes wrote:
cuda1179 wrote:
3. A flier of some kind. (okay this third thing isn't such a huge deal).

...time to bring back the Iron Eagle?

Louis Gosset Jr. Would give it up to three sequels....

**BorderCountess**

Dark Angels points and Legends have updated, as well as the app.

**cuda1179**

Dear God. The only point adjustment for Dark Angels was an INCREASE??

About half of the army could use a 10%points reduction. Some units could use a reduction of 15+%. When units are similar, yet objectively worse, than their vanilla counterparts and cost more something is wrong. And vanilla marines themselves aren't exactly tearing it up in tourneys.

**LunarSol**

cuda1179 wrote:
Dear God. The only point adjustment for Dark Angels was an INCREASE??

About half of the army could use a 10%points reduction. Some units could use a reduction of 15+%. When units are similar, yet objectively worse, than their vanilla counterparts and cost more something is wrong. And vanilla marines themselves aren't exactly tearing it up in tourneys.

It's a massive decrease compared to what's printed in the codex at least?

**cuda1179**

LunarSol wrote:
cuda1179 wrote:
Dear God. The only point adjustment for Dark Angels was an INCREASE??

About half of the army could use a 10%points reduction. Some units could use a reduction of 15+%. When units are similar, yet objectively worse, than their vanilla counterparts and cost more something is wrong. And vanilla marines themselves aren't exactly tearing it up in tourneys.

It's a massive decrease compared to what's printed in the codex at least?

Idk for sure, I haven't picked up the codex yet. However the points adjustments are now color coded (red for increase, green for decrease, black for no change). All points are black, except for one red.

**Matrindur**

cuda1179 wrote:

Idk for sure, I haven't picked up the codex yet. However the points adjustments are now color coded (red for increase, green for decrease, black for no change). All points are black, except for one red.

Thats compared to the last MFM.
Compared to the codex these are the changes:

Codex -> MFM 1.7
Asmodai 65pts -> 70pts
Deathwing Knights 290pts -> 235pts
Deathwing Terminators 205pts -> 190pts
Ezekiel 70pts -> 75pts
Land Speeder Vengence 150pts -> 140pts
Lion El'Jonson 365pts -> 350pts
Nephelim Jetfighter 185pts -> 195pts
Ravenwing Black Knights 115pts -> 90pts
Ravenwing Command Squad 185pts -> 130pts
Ravenwing Dark Talon 200pts -> 210pts
Ravenwing Darkshroud 120pts -> 115pts
Sammael 135pts -> 130pts

So mostly decreases with a few slight increases

**Kid_Kyoto**

An armored limo for GSC and IG would be aces.

**Rolsheen**

Matrindur wrote:
cuda1179 wrote:

Idk for sure, I haven't picked up the codex yet. However the points adjustments are now color coded (red for increase, green for decrease, black for no change). All points are black, except for one red.

Thats compared to the last MFM.
Compared to the codex these are the changes:

Codex -> MFM 1.7
Asmodai 65pts -> 70pts
Deathwing Knights 290pts -> 235pts
Deathwing Terminators 205pts -> 190pts
Ezekiel 70pts -> 75pts
Land Speeder Vengence 150pts -> 140pts
Lion El'Jonson 365pts -> 350pts
Nephelim Jetfighter 185pts -> 195pts
Ravenwing Black Knights 115pts -> 90pts
Ravenwing Command Squad 185pts -> 130pts
Ravenwing Dark Talon 200pts -> 210pts
Ravenwing Darkshroud 120pts -> 225pts
Sammael 135pts -> 130pts

So mostly decreases with a few slight increases

Did the Darkshroud really go up 105pts?

**xttz**

Rolsheen wrote:

Did the Darkshroud really go up 105pts?

That should say:
Ravenwing Darkshroud 120pts -> 115pts

Basically seems most point changes were made in January except for the RW command squad, which did get slightly better rules as it can now be attached to larger units of Black Knights / Outriders and make the bonuses last longer. Effective unit size changes from 3-6 to be 6-10.

**cuda1179**

Matrindur wrote:
cuda1179 wrote:

Idk for sure, I haven't picked up the codex yet. However the points adjustments are now color coded (red for increase, green for decrease, black for no change). All points are black, except for one red.

Thats compared to the last MFM.
Compared to the codex these are the changes:

Codex -> MFM 1.7
Asmodai 65pts -> 70pts
Deathwing Knights 290pts -> 235pts
Deathwing Terminators 205pts -> 190pts
Ezekiel 70pts -> 75pts
Land Speeder Vengence 150pts -> 140pts
Lion El'Jonson 365pts -> 350pts
Nephelim Jetfighter 185pts -> 195pts
Ravenwing Black Knights 115pts -> 90pts
Ravenwing Command Squad 185pts -> 130pts
Ravenwing Dark Talon 200pts -> 210pts
Ravenwing Darkshroud 120pts -> 225pts
Sammael 135pts -> 130pts

So mostly decreases with a few slight increases

Well, better. I still think Lion El'Johnson could use another 30 point drop, seeing as he lost an ability with the new codex. Ravenwing command looks better. Nephelim shouldn't have had an increase. Any notes on the Inner Circle?

**StudentOfEtherium**

Kid_Kyoto wrote:
An armored limo for GSC and IG would be aces.

it's one of our most iconic units from the RT days! i'm shocked it wasn't in the first line of support, but i guess they wanted to go for the blue collar worker aesthetic, and it doesn't really fit the current line... they need to get there someday, tho

**Shakalooloo**

StudentOfEtherium wrote:
Kid_Kyoto wrote:
An armored limo for GSC and IG would be aces.

it's one of our most iconic units from the RT days! i'm shocked it wasn't in the first line of support, but i guess they wanted to go for the blue collar worker aesthetic, and it doesn't really fit the current line... they need to get there someday, tho

It needs to be a reclaimed vehicle of privilige, the former passenger tied to the front while their workers gun it down the streets.

**Shadow Walker**

StudentOfEtherium wrote:
Kid_Kyoto wrote:
An armored limo for GSC and IG would be aces.

it's one of our most iconic units from the RT days! i'm shocked it wasn't in the first line of support, but i guess they wanted to go for the blue collar worker aesthetic, and it doesn't really fit the current line... they need to get there someday, tho

But those workers need a boss, and that boss needs a limo

**Matrindur**

xttz wrote:
Rolsheen wrote:

Did the Darkshroud really go up 105pts?

That should say:
Ravenwing Darkshroud 120pts -> 115pts

Yeah sorry, seems I missed the key there

**bullyboy**

cuda1179 wrote:
Matrindur wrote:
cuda1179 wrote:

Idk for sure, I haven't picked up the codex yet. However the points adjustments are now color coded (red for increase, green for decrease, black for no change). All points are black, except for one red.

Thats compared to the last MFM.
Compared to the codex these are the changes:

Codex -> MFM 1.7
Asmodai 65pts -> 70pts
Deathwing Knights 290pts -> 235pts
Deathwing Terminators 205pts -> 190pts
Ezekiel 70pts -> 75pts
Land Speeder Vengence 150pts -> 140pts
Lion El'Jonson 365pts -> 350pts
Nephelim Jetfighter 185pts -> 195pts
Ravenwing Black Knights 115pts -> 90pts
Ravenwing Command Squad 185pts -> 130pts
Ravenwing Dark Talon 200pts -> 210pts
Ravenwing Darkshroud 120pts -> 225pts
Sammael 135pts -> 130pts

So mostly decreases with a few slight increases

Well, better. I still think Lion El'Johnson could use another 30 point drop, seeing as he lost an ability with the new codex. Ravenwing command looks better. Nephelim shouldn't have had an increase. Any notes on the Inner Circle?

Would be a better representation if you did old MFM to codex to new MFM as the codex points were so whack. The numbers aren’t great and the nerf in rules just makes it so much worse.

**alextroy**

There is only one points change between MFM 1.6 and 1.7. The Ravenwing Command Squad dropped to 130 points which is marked as a change in MFM 1.7.

There were a bunch of other changes that are not marked:

Deathwing Command Squad is gone

Deathwing Knights can no longer have more than 5 models

Deathwing Strikemaster is gone

Inner Circle Champions are added

Ravenwing Command Squad can only have 3 models

Ravenwing Talonmaster is gone

Heavenfall Blade has been replaced with Weapons of the First Legion

**Rolsheen**

How long is Australia and New Zealand going to have to wait for the Dark Angels stuff?

**Dawnbringer**

alextroy wrote:
There is only one points change between MFM 1.6 and 1.7. The Ravenwing Command Squad dropped to 130 points which is marked as a change in MFM 1.7.

There were a bunch of other changes that are not marked:

Spoiler:

Deathwing Command Squad is gone
Deathwing Knights can no longer have more than 5 models
Deathwing Strikemaster is gone
Inner Circle Champions are added
Ravenwing Command Squad can only have 3 models
Ravenwing Talonmaster is gone
Heavenfall Blade has been replaced with Weapons of the First Legion

Aren't those changes implemented by the Codex though? Presumably the MFM is just noting changes from that.

**BorderCountess**

Dawnbringer wrote:
alextroy wrote:
There is only one points change between MFM 1.6 and 1.7. The Ravenwing Command Squad dropped to 130 points which is marked as a change in MFM 1.7.

There were a bunch of other changes that are not marked:

Spoiler:

Deathwing Command Squad is gone
Deathwing Knights can no longer have more than 5 models
Deathwing Strikemaster is gone
Inner Circle Champions are added
Ravenwing Command Squad can only have 3 models
Ravenwing Talonmaster is gone
Heavenfall Blade has been replaced with Weapons of the First Legion

Aren't those changes implemented by the Codex though? Presumably the MFM is just noting changes from that.

No, because the previous MFM was released after this book would have gone to print. Essentially, we should just ignore any points found in Codices.

**StudentOfEtherium**

points in codices are, at this point, an artifact. it's worthwhile for GW to still print them (people should be able to play with just the book, if they don't have access to the online points), but for people who do follow that stuff, they will never be relevant except as an amusing anecdote of "here's what they initially were". books need to be printed sixish months ahead of release, iirc, so it's hard to make points be accurate when things are changing faster than that

**alextroy**

Dawnbringer wrote:
alextroy wrote:
There is only one points change between MFM 1.6 and 1.7. The Ravenwing Command Squad dropped to 130 points which is marked as a change in MFM 1.7.

There were a bunch of other changes that are not marked:

Spoiler:

Deathwing Command Squad is gone
Deathwing Knights can no longer have more than 5 models
Deathwing Strikemaster is gone
Inner Circle Champions are added
Ravenwing Command Squad can only have 3 models
Ravenwing Talonmaster is gone
Heavenfall Blade has been replaced with Weapons of the First Legion

Aren't those changes implemented by the Codex though? Presumably the MFM is just noting changes from that.

Yes. But there was also a points differences between the Codex, MFM 1.6 and MFM 1.7.

As noted by Matrindur, Ravenwing Black Knights are 115 points in the Codex. They are 90 points in both MFM 1.6 and MFM 1.7.

**bullyboy**

My issue is with people thinking that units got points breaks by contrasting them with codex. Its far more useful to compare to previous MFM and realize that things ain’t great, especially when you factor in the unit nerfs.

**Garrac**

Didn't valrak say Agents were coming this summer? Now he's saying it's blood angels? I'm confused

I guess it could be both at the same time, but with AoS 4th coming seems like too much kits in june-july, even for GW

**Dudeface**

Garrac wrote:
Didn't valrak say Agents were coming this summer? Now he's saying it's blood angels? I'm confused

I guess it could be both at the same time, but with AoS 4th coming seems like too much kits in june-july, even for GW

The wording is a bit off, he said he believed it would be agents and he'd heard about boxsets and a new coteaz, he also said that blood angels are in summer, so the two don't necessarily contradict and in true rumour fashion, the agents was only ever his personal belief.

**Matrindur**

€ prices:

**Kanluwen**

The army set should be sitting at $220 USD