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HidaO-Win wrote:
The thing is you can homebrew changes to make a tournament game a narrative game pretty easily because you don't have to have things balanced, its really hard to go the other way. A tournament games mandates a rigid ruleset and tournament players are very reliable sorts for maintaining community play, which is important for recruitment and making the game seem alive and viable.

Only if you play in their very narrow segment of the sandpit - this mentality is one of the main reasons why Legends tends to have problems being accepted by groups/stores. The tournament players cry if they have to play anything outside their subset of the game, the group/store caves in to them, and there's another pot of vanilla created out there.

Also, and to be somewhat on topic for today's article - how the heck are you not giving Cadians something for a campaign book set in and around the Cadian Gate?

 Dysartes wrote:

Also, and to be somewhat on topic for today's article - how the heck are you not giving Cadians something for a campaign book set in and around the Cadian Gate?

They didn't get anything the last time Cadia was the focus either is the funny thing.

Ah yes, Cadians who got a full range refresh recently who definitely need more models.

Just like CSM needed one?

 Arbitrator wrote:
Just like CSM needed one?

CSM had mire, older kits than cadians still somehow.

 Gert wrote:
Ah yes, Cadians who got a full range refresh recently who definitely need more models.

While a model of some form would've been nice, my intent was actually for a detachment.

I've seen someone mention some Guard support in the book for Armageddon - I'm hoping for a Steel Legion character, but we'll see.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

HidaO-Win wrote:

The thing is you can homebrew changes to make a tournament game a narrative game pretty easily because you don't have to have things balanced, its really hard to go the other way. A tournament games mandates a rigid ruleset and tournament players are very reliable sorts for maintaining community play, which is important for recruitment and making the game seem alive and viable.

I'm not sure how forcing cookie cutter meta spam lists that look nothing like the lore or imagery, fugly mdf ruin corners that look nothing like the lore or imagery, and boring ass missions that look nothing like the lore or imagery on everyone, while actively hiding that any other mode of play exists, is in any way good for recruitment

It's that they are regularly at the shop practicing, so players see that and at minimum they know they'll get games if they buy in. Valuable.

Terrain is a major balancing factor in the game and the game is quite poor at explaining how to arrange a battlefield for a good match, the official terrain layouts are an actual solution for new players. They may not look great but those are concessions for ease of use.

 Da Boss wrote:
Didn't they blow up the planet and there's a galaxy spanning warp rift tearing the Imperium in half with what used to be the Cadian Gate as it's starting point?

I thought Chaos could just come out of the massive tear in the galaxy much as they could come out of the Eye of Terror. But they still have to run the same old gauntlet?

This sounds very much like GW wanting to have their cake and eat it too. They blew up Cadia and moved the timeline forward. But they still want to have Chaos continue to fight the Imperium for control of Cadian Gate. What was the point of blowing it up then?

Most any game worth investing in will also hold up to playing in tournaments. A standardized format that provides a reliable, fair experience helps players feel like its worth spending the time into learning.

Crucially though, that's not all the game can be. You need an on ramp to help players get started and to a degree, for invested players to fall back into when they tire out on the treadmill. Players will give up on the quest to be the best for all sorts of things and will cause games to dry up if you're not giving them another way to engage while building a new audience.

A lot of what the tournament crowd gets wrong is the idea that if it makes the game better in tournaments, it makes the game better everywhere. Lots of players just don't want to play under a time crunch. Lots of players want a quicker experience than a full sized game. It's important that players and developers recognize this and make sure there's more ways to play than just what you see at Adepticon.

By the same token, it's important to implement casual elements in ways that work with the game. Cool terrain is an absolute hallmark of pulling in new players, but you can design it in a way that works with the games rules in a way that players as good as it looks. Be honest about the quality of scenarios. Often times people get very wrapped up in the idea of a weird layout, but the reality of playing it doesn't quite pan out.

There's a lot of ways to play things casually competitive and the best games allow that space to thrive in a way that can pull new players in and let them have fun no matter how serious they want to get with it.

Since WD confirmed that this is the end of 10th and a new edition is on the horizon, do you wish these books were released at the beginning of 11th rather than at the end of 10th?

I'm just not as excited about these books as everyone else it seems.

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
Since WD confirmed that this is the end of 10th and a new edition is on the horizon, do you wish these books were released at the beginning of 11th rather than at the end of 10th?

I'm just not as excited about these books as everyone else it seems.

The beginning has us caught up in new codex hype. I wouldn't mind these being spread out more, but GW always spends the last 6th months doing experimental stuff with the game. Far better than getting your Guard codex months before the new edition invalidates it.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Would be nice if 40k moved away from standing in circles and pushing buttons, but considering the studio recruits entirely from and caters to the vocal minority of tournament tryhards at this point, I don't see it happening.

turnaments are hw a cmmunity grws and expands.

Not the only way.

Tournaments are valuable for data collection (on the powerful end, not so much on what's underpowered) and a great way to publicize the game.
But, in my experience, the majority of players don't do tournaments, yet they are still very much a part of the community.

turnaments are pretty much the main way peopple near me play. that and tournament prep leagues
A good, streamlined rules are important for a game. if narritive or casual wish to modify go on ahead

Pick up games and Crusade is the main way people near me play. Your experience isn't universal.

Agreed on good rules being important, though.

do those pick up games tend to be standard 2000 with the typical rules and terrain layouts?

In my area pickup games tend to be:
A) Whatever pts values those setting up the game decide on.
B) Yes, generally all the typical rules.
C) Terrain? No set way. Sometimes a table is left set to a tourney layout & gets used as such (mostly out of laziness). Sometimes the people playing set it to one of the tourney patterns. Other times whoever's playing builds the table to suit themselves.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

Spoiler:

 JNAProductions wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Would be nice if 40k moved away from standing in circles and pushing buttons, but considering the studio recruits entirely from and caters to the vocal minority of tournament tryhards at this point, I don't see it happening.

turnaments are hw a cmmunity grws and expands.

Not the only way.

Tournaments are valuable for data collection (on the powerful end, not so much on what's underpowered) and a great way to publicize the game.
But, in my experience, the majority of players don't do tournaments, yet they are still very much a part of the community.

turnaments are pretty much the main way peopple near me play. that and tournament prep leagues
A good, streamlined rules are important for a game. if narritive or casual wish to modify go on ahead

Pick up games and Crusade is the main way people near me play. Your experience isn't universal.

Agreed on good rules being important, though.

do those pick up games tend to be standard 2000 with the typical rules and terrain layouts?

Standard rules? Yes.
Set terrain layouts? No.

And they're still not tournaments or prep for tournaments.

Tournaments also provide a standard baseline for pick up games, allowing an easier time scheduling. Its the reason they exist. it may not be "prep" for tournaments, but if they are doing 2000pts and gw missions, then they are still participating in competitive play.

No, Tourneys exist for financial reasons, not easy scheduling of your games.

As for easy scheduling of your games? It doesn't get easier than posting in most shops Discords/FB/etc pages. Or sending the message out to those in your private chat/message groups.

It may well be competitive, but it's not Tourney play. That's the important part.

I'm just jealous you guys still have areas that do pick up games at all. The places I have access to all just do pre-arranged meet up games if it's not an event of some sort.

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
Since WD confirmed that this is the end of 10th and a new edition is on the horizon, do you wish these books were released at the beginning of 11th rather than at the end of 10th?

I'm just not as excited about these books as everyone else it seems.

£150 worth of books in 3 months feels like a big ask. Probably would have been better to spread them out over the last year of 10th.

I read the second volume yesterday. They’re more setting up warzone than advancing the plot.

 Del Mingus wrote:

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
Since WD confirmed that this is the end of 10th and a new edition is on the horizon, do you wish these books were released at the beginning of 11th rather than at the end of 10th?

I'm just not as excited about these books as everyone else it seems.

£150 worth of books in 3 months feels like a big ask. Probably would have been better to spread them out over the last year of 10th.

£200 according to rumours.

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
Since WD confirmed that this is the end of 10th and a new edition is on the horizon, do you wish these books were released at the beginning of 11th rather than at the end of 10th?

I'm just not as excited about these books as everyone else it seems.

I'm in the same camp. Giving us Apoc rules and the other crap when there are ~4 months left in the edition is BS unless they are 100% compatible with 11th.

 Dysartes wrote:


Also, and to be somewhat on topic for today's article - how the heck are you not giving Cadians something for a campaign book set in and around the Cadian Gate?

Because they're all dead?

Or alternatively, they did! It'll be the servitor focused "Agripinaa" style Ordo Reductor AdMech list!

The Warhammer 40,000 Quarterly Balance Update – March 2026

Link to MFM

Meeehhhhhh - they seem evidently "done" with 10th

Seems kind of reasonable. Most of the needed nerfing to Necrons is done appropriately in the Pantheon of Woe detachment which was the one with ridiculous win rates.

Emperors Children termies at 145 is funny though - nobody wants mandatory D1 power weapons and streamlined single profile combi weapons.

 Arbitrator wrote:

 Dysartes wrote:
Do we know if this set of Combat Patrol boxes are a limited run?

The last few that weren't directly tied to a codex release have been, so I'd be on the safe side and grab one sooner rather than later if you really want one.

Think I missed this originally - local store birthday is at the end of the month, so I'm hoping they'll hang around till then, at least.

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
Since WD confirmed that this is the end of 10th and a new edition is on the horizon, do you wish these books were released at the beginning of 11th rather than at the end of 10th?

I'm just not as excited about these books as everyone else it seems.

I only bought 500 Worlds - and it's fine to get now. The detachment pamphlet is just a little pack-in that's free online anyway. The 500 Worlds/Vespator Front campaign system could be run with 2nd, 7th, 9th and presumably 11th editions just fine with only a recipe card's worth of tweaks.

 Arbitrator wrote:
Just like CSM needed one?

Considering the Defiler was 23 years old and CSM have slowly been bleeding units to the various God Factions, yeah, I think getting a new Defiler, one Character, Mutilators, and an upgrade sprue isn't too much to ask for the main bad-guy faction of 40k.

 Gert wrote:

 Arbitrator wrote:
Just like CSM needed one?

Considering the Defiler was 23 years old and CSM have slowly been bleeding units to the various God Factions, yeah, I think getting a new Defiler, one Character, Mutilators, and an upgrade sprue isn't too much to ask for the main bad-guy faction of 40k.

Plus a new unit, new generic character, new Named Character squad, and another upgrade sprue.

Took 4 years after Huron got discontinued to get a new model.

Guard got two Regiments worth of kits (including Krieg ported to plastic) in that time, alongside Rough Riders, three Kill Teams, and a new tank.

CSM got one new unit until this latest batch of releases, and it was the Nemesis Claw. Power Armour Lord and Jump Lord got new models, everything before that was 2022

 Gert wrote:
Took 4 years after Huron got discontinued to get a new model.

Guard got two Regiments worth of kits (including Krieg ported to plastic) in that time, alongside Rough Riders, three Kill Teams, and a new tank.

CSM got one new unit until this latest batch of releases, and it was the Nemesis Claw. Power Armour Lord and Jump Lord got new models, everything before that was 2022

And the Jump Lord wasn't even a direct replacement - they went through a period of NOT EXISTING before the model arrived!

Anyone else notice Cato Sicarius didn't survive the new Balance Datasheet?

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
Anyone else notice Cato Sicarius didn't survive the new Balance Datasheet?

What? He is gone? They released a new model for him just recently!

 Crimson wrote:

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
Anyone else notice Cato Sicarius didn't survive the new Balance Datasheet?

What? He is gone? They released a new model for him just recently!

Cato Sicarious (the new one) is on the Datasheet, but Captain Sicarius (the old rules) is not there. They are both on the app at this time. Old one is probably going to ledgends.