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It always entertain me that people feel like GW needs defending from those awful people that question it.

Finecast was a top shelf financial decision.

I think there’s a lot of overthinking the decision to sell these old starter sets, they are clearly just a nostalgia cash grab, make some money of old moulds they are most likely binning and it must have worked for the last one for them to do it again.

As for finecast, this explains the “thinking” behind this car crash, all compromises and bad objectives.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TG169qKPIgQ

MaxT wrote:
It always entertains me that people think they know more about this than games workshop, a company with a market cap of 3.3 billion pounds. They didn't get that big by making bad economic decisions

You're right. Very much like Amazon, they got that big on the back of a global pandemic...

Same price but it's exactly like the old starter (rules, dice, whippy sticks and clear plastic templates!) and I'd be tempted. But I'm sure they don't really have the production capability for that any more.

 Nevelon wrote:
3rd ed also had 2 corner ruins in addition to the lame trees.

And some crates and barrels

 Lord Damocles wrote:
Finecast was a top shelf financial decision.

The "GW must know what they're doing" crowd are just outing themselves as being too young to remember Dreadfleet

MaxT wrote:
It always entertains me that people think they know more about this than games workshop, a company with a market cap of 3.3 billion pounds. They didn't get that big by making bad economic decisions

It always amazes me when people think that Games Workshop is some inscrutable or unknowable company that us mere mortals couldn't begin to fathom.

Hey Bob I found those old plates for the Battle of Macragge set in the warehouse.

Oh cool

Hey how about we put them up for sale on Christmas? Nids and Marines are really popular right now and it was a big set in its day

Sure thing, oh but make it made-to-order. I don't want to use the machines to make it over Christmas.



Is probably how it went or something like that. Sometimes I don't think there's some big deep meaning behind releases, esp a made to order old thing like this. Sometimes Gw acts like a big firm with lots of user data and metrics and stuff; other times it acts like an excited geek in a toysho....hobby store.

 McDougall Designs wrote:

 nels1031 wrote:
I feel like an Island of Blood MTO would’ve been better received.

they already did one of those I thought?

Years ago now. I know I missed it and would love to see it return.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:
3rd ed also had 2 corner ruins in addition to the lame trees.

And some crates and barrels

How could I forget about those (and the tank traps)

I’ve still got them sitting in my primed, to be painted pile!

 Overread wrote:
Hey Bob I found those old plates for the Battle of Macragge set in the warehouse.

Oh cool

Hey how about we put them up for sale on Christmas? Nids and Marines are really popular right now and it was a big set in its day

Sure thing, oh but make it made-to-order. I don't want to use the machines to make it over Christmas.



Is probably how it went or something like that. Sometimes I don't think there's some big deep meaning behind releases, esp a made to order old thing like this. Sometimes Gw acts like a big firm with lots of user data and metrics and stuff; other times it acts like an excited geek in a toysho....hobby store.

This, exactly. Peachy described GW as being a big global company that is still run like a cottage industry. Sums it up perfectly.

I won’t be buying any of this stuff, not being a GW defender or anything I just don’t think this release is a big deal or having a huge impact on their production or warehousing issues. It’s just a bit of fun.

Battle for Macragge was THE starter set for me... And seeing it again, suddenly, out of nowhere like that, it brings a lot of nostalgia, indeed. Ahhh, the 4th edition... But seeing it now, its a testimony of how far we went in such a small timeframe ! Yeah the models weren't exactly the best even in those times but nowadays I have no incentive buying it. It's like in old game of PS2 : I cherish the memory but actually playing it wouldn't be a good experience anymore

I guess wages have TRIPLED since 2004?.... I still have the receipt for the original. $60 CAD.

Without the Books, Templates and other accessories, it's just an incomplete cash grab of nostalgia.

I got my copy of BfM from Barnes and Noble at the end of their partnership with GW (at that time). Someone forgot to sticker it discounted, forgot to sticker all the GW stuff as discounted, because when I went to buy it it was 75% off! I rushed back to the GW display and grabbed as much as I could, including boxes of Space Hulk-era Genestealers and Spinny-waist SH Terminators (amusingly priced at 5 for $50 or something ridiculous like that). I bought all that I had the cash for (this was back then, you see), and asked if they would put the rest on hold for me. Since there were no bargain stickers, they did! When I returned a few days later, each of the boxes had been reduced to $1!!

So yeah, I’m good.

Wonder who are these people that buy these overpriced decrepit old models???

 streetsamurai wrote:
Wonder who are these people that buy these overpriced decrepit old models???

Yea, not trolling, not arguing good or bad or whatever, but is any person really interested in this set, especially since the Tyranid side was literally redone like a few months ago with much better miniatures? This is a serious question.

Yeah that's why I feel its like my earlier post, something done on a spur of a moment rather than any deep technical research into a potential customerbase. Another reason its a made-to-order without any apparent pre-stock.

Basically GW threw this out and if someone wants to get it they can and if not they don't have too.


If it doesn't sell well it doesn't matter, the mould was paid off years ago so in theory any sales are just profit for GW at this stage.

It's always good to remember that GW doesn't make mistakes, it's the customers who are wrong.

Anyway the shuttle would probably sell just fine by itself at modern day terrain prices.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
It's always good to remember that GW doesn't make mistakes, it's the customers who are wrong.

Anyway the shuttle would probably sell just fine by itself at modern day terrain prices.

If it had been the price it was as a starter I probably would have bought it for the shuttle and other terrain bits.

But not for £90…

And there’s TOW to save for now!

 streetsamurai wrote:
Wonder who are these people that buy these overpriced decrepit old models???

I bought the 3rd ed one, because I wanted the marines for my bitsbox, the land soeeder for its own right, and the warriors because I wanted a 3rd ed Deldar army anyway. I will admit however, I am the one specific person this box hit. 99% won’t care.

tneva82 wrote:

Spoiler:

 Dryaktylus wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

 Scottywan82 wrote:
Ouch. That's a pass. I really cannot fathom what they are thinking with these releases. Are there that many people still out there spending this much money that we don't even have on ancient stuff we won't receive for six months?

It’s a low risk thing for GW. The moulds already exist. And being MTO, pretty much zero chance of stock not selling. A filler release to be sure, but one all but guaranteed to generate profit.

But more than say casting more of 40k/aos/hh/li stuff that's out of print?

And small print run means more of time relatively spent on swapping moulds.

New mould and maybe changing the nozzle is under half an hour. Plastic is the same so you just have to wait for the right temperature (not that much with polystyrene) and start.

With a decent price, you should have a higher number of orders. Of course, you could also choose an obscene price to cover your costs. Studied economists call this the Games Workshop way.

And that under half hour is machine sitting empty and not casting stuff that a) would sell out instantly b) is chronically out of stock.

Again : we don't know if they use the same machines for the old moulds - they could use older ones. And lacking sprues isn't the only possible reason why things are out of stock - they also need printed boxes and building instructions. Moulds also need maintenance and occasionally repair.

You seem also to overestimate the run of each mould on a machine. With some exceptions (starter boxes or bases) they don't (and can't) produce the same sprue nonstop for several weeks - their machine park just isn't big enough and enough models consist of more than one sprue (and no - you can't just make a huge mould with several sprues combined and put it on a large machine...).

 streetsamurai wrote:
Wonder who are these people that buy these overpriced decrepit old models???

That’s the question here, no idea who would be interested in any of the old starter sets, my only guess is they made enough selling the 3rd edition one to sell the 4th. But no idea who would want either.

The ORKS in assault on black reach still seem sought after and have aged quite well so that could be ok, but the marines are garbage in that box too.

 xeen wrote:

 streetsamurai wrote:
Wonder who are these people that buy these overpriced decrepit old models???

Yea, not trolling, not arguing good or bad or whatever, but is any person really interested in this set, especially since the Tyranid side was literally redone like a few months ago with much better miniatures? This is a serious question.

I was genuinely interested until I saw the price tag.

Oh, well, here's hoping GW will do a MTO for the 2nd Edition boxed set!

 streetsamurai wrote:
Wonder who are these people that buy these overpriced decrepit old models???

I'm strongly considering it - I've been looking for the terrain for a while, and haven't seen it for a reasonable price for a while. The tactical squad can go into a DA Proper Marine contingent, alongside the ones from Dark Vengeance. Less sure what I'll do with the Nids, admittedly.

 Dysartes wrote:

 streetsamurai wrote:
Wonder who are these people that buy these overpriced decrepit old models???

I'm strongly considering it - I've been looking for the terrain for a while, and haven't seen it for a reasonable price for a while. The tactical squad can go into a DA Proper Marine contingent, alongside the ones from Dark Vengeance. Less sure what I'll do with the Nids, admittedly.

...and you still haven't ^^

 Albertorius wrote:

 Dysartes wrote:

 streetsamurai wrote:
Wonder who are these people that buy these overpriced decrepit old models???

I'm strongly considering it - I've been looking for the terrain for a while, and haven't seen it for a reasonable price for a while. The tactical squad can go into a DA Proper Marine contingent, alongside the ones from Dark Vengeance. Less sure what I'll do with the Nids, admittedly.

...and you still haven't ^^

I've seen the terrain sitting on the wargaming trading group on FB for the last week at £25 and nobody has even given a comment of interest.

"who are these people that buy these overpriced decrepit old models???"


Really?
Minis are minis and Oldhammer, collector completionism, unfinished collections, Nostalgia, Warhammer fans, miniatures fans etc... How is this so hard to understand? It's not like we are not ourselves miniature fans that buy silly expensive kits on a weekly basis just to add to a gigantic pile. Theres no difference.

Or are we back to the Rhetoric - I dont like this specific set of minis, its too pricy for me and I cannot understand who in the world could have a different opinion.

So "these people" are just having fun doing what they want to do with their hobby. shock horror I know.

 NAVARRO wrote:


"who are these people that buy these overpriced decrepit old models???"


Really?
Minis are minis and Oldhammer, collector completionism, unfinished collections, Nostalgia, Warhammer fans, miniatures fans etc... How is this so hard to understand? It's not like we are not ourselves miniature fans that buy silly expensive kits on a weekly basis just to add to a gigantic pile. Theres no difference.

Or are we back to the Rhetoric - I dont like this specific set of minis, its too pricy for me and I cannot understand who in the world could have a different opinion.

So "these people" are just having fun doing what they want to do with their hobby. shock horror I know.

I'd probably be lumped in with the Oldhammer crowd at this point and admit that a disproportionate number of my GW buys have been driven by interest in the old (I just bought a very out-of-date FW book as one of my more expensive hobby purchases this year because I liked the story from, umm, "previewing" a copy), but this set is really mediocre. Assets include a cheap box dread body, a decent base for a captain (though one of their worst box captains otherwise, IMHO of course), some okay area terrain, an interesting objective guy, and I guess some ancient infantry on both sides. Strip out the "cheap" part, and there's not much left beyond the terrain and guy. I remember getting that set and it wasn't all that impressive back then even: GW has gotten vastly better at making monopose and snap fit models that don't sacrifice a lot of quality; these guys were for the most part just worse than other models contemporary with them.

Yes, yes, we all get it, different strokes and all that, but seriously, I have a hard time seeing what value or position are you defending in this low-effort reprint of some mediocre content, other than "everyone should be able to participate in capitalism, no matter how 'decrepit' the product": care to enlighten the rest of us? It seems you know something we don't.

 spiralingcadaver wrote:

 NAVARRO wrote:


"who are these people that buy these overpriced decrepit old models???"


Really?
Minis are minis and Oldhammer, collector completionism, unfinished collections, Nostalgia, Warhammer fans, miniatures fans etc... How is this so hard to understand? It's not like we are not ourselves miniature fans that buy silly expensive kits on a weekly basis just to add to a gigantic pile. Theres no difference.

Or are we back to the Rhetoric - I dont like this specific set of minis, its too pricy for me and I cannot understand who in the world could have a different opinion.

So "these people" are just having fun doing what they want to do with their hobby. shock horror I know.

I'd probably be lumped in with the Oldhammer crowd at this point and admit that a disproportionate number of my GW buys have been driven by interest in the old (I just bought a very out-of-date FW book as one of my more expensive hobby purchases this year because I liked the story from, umm, "previewing" a copy), but this set is really mediocre. Assets include a cheap box dread body, a decent base for a captain (though one of their worst box captains otherwise, IMHO of course), some okay area terrain, an interesting objective guy, and I guess some ancient infantry on both sides. Strip out the "cheap" part, and there's not much left beyond the terrain and guy. I remember getting that set and it wasn't all that impressive back then even: GW has gotten vastly better at making monopose and snap fit models that don't sacrifice a lot of quality; these guys were for the most part just worse than other models contemporary with them.

Yes, yes, we all get it, different strokes and all that, but seriously, I have a hard time seeing what value or position are you defending in this low-effort reprint of some mediocre content, other than "everyone should be able to participate in capitalism, no matter how 'decrepit' the product": care to enlighten the rest of us? It seems you know something we don't.

If you actually "get it" then you answered your question.

You and many old vets like myself collected this very very niche hobby ages ago when it was not very popular, back then you were surrounded with these, let me say bluntly, intolerant, ignorant comments - Why you spend money on small toys? - These have no value to me, why you spend time on this? - What a childish hobby!... and so on.
To see it here, the same shades of intolerant rhetoric regarding different perceptions of value or minis is errr. silly.
You been there and probably gone through that, why gate keep it today and look down on people that just want this box for whatever reasons floats their boat.
Not here to enlighten you but then again people who dont "get it" at this point in their hobby journeys need to look at themselves in the mirror.

From a value perspective, this is a chance to get the terrain, Pilot with the genesed container then you also get some old school marines and some nid fillers. I had the old box which had different sprues and enjoyed it then. Can see someone getting it and just having fun painting this and put it on display. Not everyone was able to get it back then so its a good chance to have a trimmed version now.