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Some consolidated rumours from Warseer.

Chaos Rumours

1) Thousand Sons have had an "extensive" overhaul

2) TS AP3 bolters were pretty much confirmed as appearing, general opinion was in line of special weapons we will get "bolter ammo" - it wasn't said if the AP3 were inferno bolts.

3) not confirmed but "highly likely": a return of the all is dust rule in some manner, a feel no pain style rule was suggested to me but that is not from the source of the AP3 rumour

4) chaos is appearing like eldar, i was not told the number of books but the book for each seems unlikely now

5) the codex is entering print, it was always referred in the singular to me

6) a redifining of the thousand sons was heavily suggested, we might be losing power fists on champions and the return of no assaulting in exchange for increase psyker power and shooting

7) deamons were implied to be having a rethink, no details

8) oblits will be heavy support

9) unconfirmed: force weapons

10) on the 2 wounds: GW think that 2 wounds is a classic sign of what thousand sons are, i heard little to suggest that we will be losing this ability
he Codex layout will be the same as for Codex: Eldar.

11)there will be three HQ choices (not including special characters): Chaos Lords, Daemon Princes and Chaos Lieutenants. Also, it will spell the end of the infiltrating speedy lieutenant.

12)Chaos Cultists will make an appearence (not sure about LaTD though)

13)There will be plastic daemons, Daemon Prince, Spawn, possessed.

14)There will be two books. One for Undivided one for Cults.

15) Chance of an all daemon army.

How will 'bolter ammo' be dealt with in terms of WYSIWYG?

Oblits as HS makes a lot of sense.

I'll wait and see on the 1K Sons rumors. The devil is really in the implementation.

A retooling of thousand sons sounds great, especially since they will be keeping two wounds. Throw in "All is Dust" and they will be VERY hard to kill. I really will hate it though if Aspiring champions can't have powerfists though, as I have mine all modeled that way, and is very effective.

Like to see Raptors come way down in points. Oblits do make sense to go to a Heavy option.

The curious part is if it still is slated for the rumoured Sept. I keep hearing differing opinions on that. I guess we have to wait until June!

Posted By Toreador on 04/18/2007 1:29 PM
1) Thousand Sons have had an "extensive" overhaul

2) TS AP3 bolters were pretty much confirmed as appearing, general opinion was in line of special weapons we will get "bolter ammo" - it wasn't said if the AP3 were inferno bolts.

I hope that's not all they change.  A 250+ pt squad with 8 bolters and a sh!tty psychic power (that can be negated by psychic hoods) is still complete crap, even if 2 of those bolters are AP3.

Posted By Toreador on 04/18/2007 1:29 PM
3) not confirmed but "highly likely": a return of the all is dust rule in some manner, a feel no pain style rule was suggested to me but that is not from the source of the AP3 rumour

Why?  The LAST thing the Thousand Sons needed was more resilience to small arms fire.  What about INSTANT DEATH?  You know, the thing that renders the 2nd wound irrelevant?  What about more resilience to things that really kill the hell out of them, like lascannons?  I mean not everyone has as much trouble fielding lascannons as Dark Angels do.

Posted By Toreador on 04/18/2007 1:29 PM
6) a redifining of the thousand sons was heavily suggested, we might be losing power fists on champions and the return of no assaulting in exchange for increase psyker power and shooting

Well that just takes the cake.  The hidden power fist was the ONLY advantage the Thousand Sons had.  Are a couple AP3 bolters and All Is Dust supposed to make up for this?  They'd better get a steep pts reduction and/or some ridiculously awesome non-psychic hood-able powers or they're gonna be in a world of hurt.  I don't understand the point of all this fiddling.  Didn't Jervis say something about needing to stop tinkering with things and get the points cost correct?  Didn't they get the memo?

I predict Thousand Sons will stick suck.  And you'll have to take Ahriman to play them.  And he still won't have a power weapon.  But I guess it's not too bad.  Afterall, what's the worst that could happen?  They give them crap rules and no one plays them?

Posted By Toreador on 04/18/2007 1:29 PM
10) on the 2 wounds: GW think that 2 wounds is a classic sign of what thousand sons are, i heard little to suggest that we will be losing this ability
he Codex layout will be the same as for Codex: Eldar.

Well, that's reassuring.  Ultimately an army with 2 wounds each has got plenty going for it.

Posted By cuda1179 on 04/18/2007 1:40 PM
 ... I really will hate it though if Aspiring champions can't have powerfists though, as I have mine all modeled that way, and is very effective.

I have a few done up like this as well.  But I'd be willing to toss them all out if we get AP3 bolter fire and more/better psychic powers.

As a long time 1KSons fan who was crushed by the last Chaos dex, I'm getting fairly excited.

Posted By Toreador on 04/18/2007 1:29 PM
7) deamons were implied to be having a rethink, no details

Ooh, I hope they go back to the generic daemons from the first 3rd ed Chaos codex.  That would be peachy.

Posted By Toreador on 04/18/2007 1:29 PM
8) oblits will be heavy support

Does that mean Dreads will be moving to Elites?  If not, that's going to leave an abundance of Heavy Support and a shortage of Elites choices unless... plague marines, berserkers, noise marines, and Thousand Sons all become separate entries in the Elites section!  FANTASTIC!

Posted By Toreador on 04/18/2007 1:29 PM
11)there will be three HQ choices (not including special characters): Chaos Lords, Daemon Princes and Chaos Lieutenants. Also, it will spell the end of the infiltrating speedy lieutenant.

It sounds like we're going back to the first 3rd ed Chaos codex.  Hooray for Daemon Princes with no armor save.

Posted By Toreador on 04/18/2007 1:29 PM
14)There will be two books. One for Undivided one for Cults.

I really hope so, but I'm not optimistic.  I predict they'll squish all the cult armies into the vanilla list, get rid of the Marks of Chaos system entirely, and reduce marked marines to 4 separate Elite choices (so no more marked bikers or havocs).  If you want to play one of the 4 cult legions you take a special character that makes them Troops.  Hooray.

Re: Psychic Powers and Instant Death

Wouldn't the obvious thing be to copy the Tyranid rule and make 1K Sons immune to instant-death if within 12" of a Sorceror?

Call it a psychic power, but have it passively on in the background for all 1K Sons Sorcerors.

Abadabadoobaddon, why do you even want to post in these threads? All you do is sound pessimistic and childish. A lot of this sounds pretty good, and I think i'll be pinching my pennies to be able to buy into this.

Chuck

Posted By chuckyhol on 04/18/2007 3:23 PM
Abadabadoobaddon, why do you even want to post in these threads?

Because I like it.

Posted By chuckyhol on 04/18/2007 3:23 PM
A lot of this sounds pretty good, and I think i'll be pinching my pennies to be able to buy into this.

Well good for you.

Posted By Abadabadoobaddon on 04/18/2007 3:08 PM

Does that mean Dreads will be moving to Elites?  If not, that's going to leave an abundance of Heavy Support and a shortage of Elites choices unless... plague marines, berserkers, noise marines, and Thousand Sons all become separate entries in the Elites section!  FANTASTIC!

Posted By Toreador on 04/18/2007 1:29 PM

14)There will be two books. One for Undivided one for Cults.

I really hope so, but I'm not optimistic.  I predict they'll squish all the cult armies into the vanilla list, get rid of the Marks of Chaos system entirely, and reduce marked marines to 4 separate Elite choices (so no more marked bikers or havocs).  If you want to play one of the 4 cult legions you take a special character that makes them Troops.  Hooray.

I suspect it will be along these lines - cult Marines are Elites, if your HQ has the matching mark, they become troops.

Hard to say whether a special character will be required or not. GW has said that they want to very heavily emphasize them - so I suspect yes, but I could certainly be proven wrong about that.

Oooh, just what I always wanted. A reason to *have* to field Lucious the Eternally Inefficient.

If you've actually read the DA codex, you'll see how remarkably simple it is to not only create a character, but also to make an army. Chaos will be like this too. And Powerful. Really. You just pick your super awesome special character or one of the unnamed (but equally restricted) HQ choices and your fixed sized unit choices and violla! With no wargear, marks, gifts, mutations or other things to worry about it will be simpler to make a highly effective army.




40k has turned into an overpriced clicky game that you have to pay ridiculous amounts of money to purchase unassembled & unpainted figures to play.

staple army types must be preserved man, seriously.

Lots of us have marked troops, with appropriate wargear types.  Marked armies have been around since lost and the damned, and thats complete with sacred numbered squad choices.

Unlike Dark angels, there are way too many legions that have marked troops, so I doubt you will need lucius the eternal to field a noise marine army.

If they did this, it will go a long way to drive the final nail in the coffin for a lot of players.

The demon prince should still have the option of getting chaos armour, hop[efully they just reduce some of the more unused demon gifts like spawn and visage.

I was thinking they will make marked armies available by saying that if your commander has a mark, those models count as troops, but unlike the DA, you can make your own special character up, as they have sold entierly too many demon prince models, and they just made a terminator lord, and a new power armour lord.

I just think they will get rid of legeion specific vehicle upgrades, but as useless as the slaanesh ones where (wtf, trade down my heavy bolters for sonic blasters??) and make us use the same ones.

Interesting fact that was mentioned on Warseer...Greater Daemons were not listed as an HQ choice...

This isn't rumours, this is 'collected speculations based on nothing but hopes and dreams'.

Posted By Slave on 04/18/2007 5:25 PM
Unlike Dark angels, there are way too many legions that have marked troops, so I doubt you will need lucius the eternal to field a noise marine army.

That's ok - you can just use the Lucius' rules and "counts as".  This is fluffy and balanced and fun!  And who cares if an Emperor's Childrens army is as (in)effective as a pure Deathwing army?

Posted By Slave on 04/18/2007 5:25 PM
I was thinking they will make marked armies available by saying that if your commander has a mark, those models count as troops, but unlike the DA, you can make your own special character up, as they have sold entierly too many demon prince models, and they just made a terminator lord, and a new power armour lord.

You're right.  GW would never make any changes that would render people's models useless - that would just make their customers angry!

Posted By Therion- on 04/18/2007 8:08 PM
This isn't rumours, this is 'collected speculations based on nothing but hopes and dreams'.

Well it's from Warseer so... yeah.

Even so, I don't think these speculations are based on hopes and dreams.  Unless they're slow dreams.  But everybody knows retards don't dream.

Posted By Janthkin on 04/18/2007 4:21 PM

Hard to say whether a special character will be required or not. GW has said that they want to very heavily emphasize them - so I suspect yes, but I could certainly be proven wrong about that.

Oooh, just what I always wanted. A reason to *have* to field Lucious the Eternally Inefficient.

Look at the bright side they may get rid of him and bring Doomrider back.

Thousand Sons have always sucked. In second ed. they had a nasty habit of disappearing if the wrong psychic card got played.

I Played a Khorne/Tzeentch army in second ed .

I'll reserve my judgement for the codex until I see the finished product.

Posted By Toreador on 04/18/2007 1:29 PM
Some consolidated rumours from Warseer.

8) oblits will be heavy support

 

  That item, in my opinion, will help fix the Iron Warriors abuse armies.  They can either have tons of Oblits or the Heavies (Basilisk, etc...) - but not both.  It also means IW players can still keep their models.  Not a bad compromise.

Posted By pinhead on 04/19/2007 3:59 AM

Posted By Toreador on 04/18/2007 1:29 PM
Some consolidated rumours from Warseer.

8) oblits will be heavy support

 

  That item, in my opinion, will help fix the Iron Warriors abuse armies.  They can either have tons of Oblits or the Heavies (Basilisk, etc...) - but not both.  It also means IW players can still keep their models.  Not a bad compromise.

I have no problem with this as long as dreads move to elite.  Or better yet why not make defilers a 0-1 choice or just reduce the squad size to 1-2 for oblits.   I sincerely hope GW tries out some options that will not kill the flavor of IW.  

Posted By Therion- on 04/18/2007 8:08 PM
This isn't rumours, this is 'collected speculations based on nothing but hopes and dreams'.

Which is why I'm keeping my CrapCannon safely stowed away in the closet until we see something more solid then these rumblings.  Most of what was posted makes me sad / whiney, though at least I guessed that my speed lord was late for this world.  If they make 1k Sons the next 'must have cheese unit' in 40k I'm going to chuckle nice and hard and finally paint the squad I've got sitting around

- Boss Salvage

Dice Monkey:

Don't you mean "Ghost Rider"?

Posted By beefHeart on 04/19/2007 5:28 AM

Posted By pinhead on 04/19/2007 3:59 AM

Posted By Toreador on 04/18/2007 1:29 PM
Some consolidated rumours from Warseer.

8) oblits will be heavy support

 

  That item, in my opinion, will help fix the Iron Warriors abuse armies.  They can either have tons of Oblits or the Heavies (Basilisk, etc...) - but not both.  It also means IW players can still keep their models.  Not a bad compromise.

I have no problem with this as long as dreads move to elite.  Or better yet why not make defilers a 0-1 choice or just reduce the squad size to 1-2 for oblits.   I sincerely hope GW tries out some options that will not kill the flavor of IW.  

Yea, the problem with Oblits as heavy is that it leaves the HS section WAY too saturated. Havocs, Preds, Dreads, Defilers, LR, and Oblits (am I missing anything?). But then again, the Eldar codex has that many choices so... It just seems that having so many choices in HS vs Elites (Chosen, Possessed, Marked Troops, anything else?) seems odd, at least without seeing what further restructuring they have in mind. Then again, maybe Chaos will be able to field more terminators, the way the chosen are currently arranged sucks.

Doomrider is totally sweet.  He rocks out ALL the time.

He'd totally flip out and chop off your head for no reason.  One time he chopped off a guy's head for opening a window.

Posted By LtCraggs on 04/19/2007 8:05 AM
Dice Monkey:

Don't you mean "Ghost Rider"?

No. He meant Doomrider.

One time, Doomrider killed Chuck Norris, just to watch him die.

Just for fun, how much do you want to bet that Thousand Suns become chaos new power build. Why? Because no one owns any right now!

However, to balance out Thousand Suns power, Iron Warriors will now suck the likes of which even orks have never seen! Why? Because everyone already owns a bunch of IW models!

and THAT ladies and gentleman is how you balance a game.

When Doomrider isn't flying around totally flipping out and stabbing people, he's wailing hard on his guitar. That's how totally awesome he is.