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Okay, you may recognize me as the fellow skimming for advice on a Tyranid army a while back. I recently found a gaming group, but three out of seven people play nids. I decided to go with the next coolest looking army- the dark Eldar. Any advice for an army going fur speed and chaos-wreaking?

Venoms and more venoms.

And even more venoms. Make sure you always that the extra splinter cannon, it's the 12 4+ poison shots that make them so good.

Another tip, when building your lists, is try to keep unit cost down, so that you have more on the table. DE are so soft, so transports are a must. But even those are likley to go down when shot at, or even punched (if you let them close enough) so redundency is key. If there is only six turns of shooting, have too many targets for your opponent to get them all. This means not upgrading every unit to the max, second guessig expensive squads like incubi when the points can be used for mor darklances, and epic units like dragzar and vect are even less viable in anything less than 2000 points.

Flickerfields on everything

and a wych squad with an agonizer, a wych weapon (maybe) and some haywire grenades is a pretty survivable unit in close combat, so long as the have a pain token (given bya haemy usually), in a raider, with a liquifier gun. Just play test it, you'll see. They can tarpit a much much more expensive unit, for ever sometimes, or even beat others.

Going first helps a lot too, so if you can find a role for him, the baron + 1 to inititive roll helps a bunch in games over 1500.

And for help against nids, you need none. They rely on T6 and you are all poision and str8 ap weapons. Again chaos, try to pack a many darklances and blasters into your list as possible. 7 venoms with blasterbytes and trublasters, and ravagers and maybe a wych squad to tie up a demon prince. If there are 2 princes, tie one up, focun the other with poison fire from venoms

From the 10 or so games I have gotten in with DE, I'd say the above address is spot-on. I have struggled against fast armies list BA or armies with tons of shooting like IG though.

Venoms, got it. Also, I plan to take some of the Reavers- the Jetbikers with the caltrop thingies. Would I be better off with them, or Hellions? Or Scourges?


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Also I plan on using Duke Slicsus "The Serpent" or whatever his name is. Though I would also like to invest in a Haemunculus for pain tokens and other things. I also am entertaining the idea of using Hexrifles to snoip out enemy HQ, and plenty of Wyches for close combat- probably with Hydra Gauntlets to hopefully hit ALL the things.

As much as it pains me to say it because i love the models, Reavers, Scourges, and Hellions are all pretty bad to be honest. I personally wouldn't run any of them. If you want to run a Fast Attack unit go for Beastmasters, they can most definitly wreck some face.

Warp Beasts are scary, 5 attacks on a charge if I remember right?

Yeah, you want lots and lots of skimmers.

crunchym8 wrote:Venoms, got it. Also, I plan to take some of the Reavers- the Jetbikers with the caltrop thingies. Would I be better off with them, or Hellions? Or Scourges?


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Also I plan on using Duke Slicsus "The Serpent" or whatever his name is. Though I would also like to invest in a Haemunculus for pain tokens and other things. I also am entertaining the idea of using Hexrifles to snoip out enemy HQ, and plenty of Wyches for close combat- probably with Hydra Gauntlets to hopefully hit ALL the things.

Reavers, Hellions, and Scourges all suck. Hellions perhaps less so if they are with the baron and troops but only then do they become barely useable.

The duke is ok for his reroll combat drugs ability. His 3+ posion is lackluster and him having to start in a warrior squad when he is a CC character is annoying.

Hexrifles cannot snipe, so they are very expensive for what they do.

crunchym8 wrote:Venoms, got it. Also, I plan to take some of the Reavers- the Jetbikers with the caltrop thingies. Would I be better off with them, or Hellions? Or Scourges?


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Also I plan on using Duke Slicsus "The Serpent" or whatever his name is. Though I would also like to invest in a Haemunculus for pain tokens and other things. I also am entertaining the idea of using Hexrifles to snoip out enemy HQ, and plenty of Wyches for close combat- probably with Hydra Gauntlets to hopefully hit ALL the things.

Seems like you want to take all the things I tend to stay away from, lol. The duke is good, but not a forgiving build, remember that your unit cannot fire from the transport on the turn they deepstrike. so thats a bunch of wasted points. and he needs to be taken with the 9 kabalites in a raider with a splinter rack to make use of his 3+ poison, and you will need to protect that with both flicker and night shields. as well as careful maneuvering late game to make his 5+ rending have any effect. the idea is to keep cost down for more venoms and blasters, and the duke is costing you well over 300 points to field with his unit that will be focused with fire and burn. 11 armor remember.

Hex is cool. liquifier is better.

wyches are great. razorflails wins in math-hammer. shardnet win in utility.

Built-in wrote:
Seems like you want to take all the things I tend to stay away from, lol. The duke is good, but not a forgiving build, remember that your unit cannot fire from the transport on the turn they deepstrike. so thats a bunch of wasted points. and he needs to be taken with the 9 kabalites in a raider with a splinter rack to make use of his 3+ poison, and you will need to protect that with both flicker and night shields. as well as careful maneuvering late game to make his 5+ rending have any effect. the idea is to keep cost down for more venoms and blasters, and the duke is costing you well over 300 points to field with his unit that will be focused with fire and burn. 11 armor remember.

Armor 10 not 11
best to take the duke with 10 warriors so you get the splinter cannon, have them start the game behind their raider with him attached. then your first turn have the duke jump into another raider with some wyches and the warriors jump into their raider. Why would you give them night shields, they need to be within 12" to fire so it is very likely they are going to get shot down, after that have them run through cover.
His DS does indeed suck.



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Built-in wrote:
wyches are great. razorflails wins in math-hammer. shardnet win in utility.

with the duke you get 2 rolls to try and get reroll to wound(the best drug) which ends up making hydras better than razorflails. Still none of the wych weapons are worth their points.

Man, I can't believe reavers suck. They're the coolest looking thing dark Eldar have! Surely they can be used fire some army build... I do want my army to be very close-the-gap to get to melee. I figured with duke I could deep strike into cover, our something to blitz forward?

crunchym8 wrote:Man, I can't believe reavers suck. They're the coolest looking thing dark Eldar have! Surely they can be used fire some army build... I do want my army to be very close-the-gap to get to melee. I figured with duke I could deep strike into cover, our something to blitz forward?

Reavers dont SUCK, they just arent very good. I use them a lot in casual games and I know some other DE players who use them. They are pure fun. They are versatile and can fit into almost any list for a little bit of excitement. They die super quick, especially to flamers and get raped in assault but by all means do throw them into casual games.


If you deep strike into cover you take a dangerous terrain test, lost your raider 1/6 of the time. When you DS you get a 4+ cover save for moving fast. in cover it is doubtful you are going to get any better.

I am playing Casual games for the most part, so I do plan to use them. Rule of cool dominates my life. Anyway, next question. Harlequins. I want them. How should they be ran, and should I get whole troupes?

Also, the bombers... They look interesting, as well as the Pain Engines. I've seen little information on the Mandrakes as well.

Peopel keep telling me to get Haemonculi for pain tokens, but in the book the only Haemonculus that gives pain Tokens is Urien Rakarth, and that's only to Wrack and Grotesque units.



I was going to make my DE a long-range army, but then two of the people in my group got Basilisks and they can hit anywhere, forever. Any tips for a get up and personal army?

(I've played one 1500 point game against Blood Angel Space Marines. I ripped into them for the first two rounds, then proceeded to be beaten back and decimated.)

Haemy's wracks and grots all start with a pain token. Since the harmonculus is an IC he can start with a unit, giving them his pain token

I disagree that hellions suck, the 15-20 man unit with baron and a haemy is a huge amount of points but it can take and dish out crazy amount damage.

I ran a venom spam list and since I added them it made a huge difference, I was finding my opponents would just rush me, and since I added them I was able to keep them at arms reach which is the best place to be.

Exergy wrote:
If you deep strike into cover you take a dangerous terrain test, lost your raider 1/6 of the time. When you DS you get a 4+ cover save for moving fast. in cover it is doubtful you are going to get any better.

Actually you dont, when you deep strike you are moving at cruising speed, you need to move flat out to get the 4+ save.

I like Hellions and think the internet tends to overlook their advantages, being put off by a superficially high cost.

Sathonyx, 16-20 hellions, a haemonculus and a token unit of wracks can via pain token swapping shennanigans on turn one give you a large unit of Stealthed hellions who don't have to worrry about dangerous terrain tests (1/36 fails), and have FNP and FC to boot. Assuming the enemy has BS4 and S4 shooting, that's over 7 shots to remove one model. The hellions have a 30" threat range on their shooting (12" move plus 18" range) and 18 hellions dish out as much splinter fire as 3 venoms and can charge at S5 and I7 with FC getting 54 attacks... against MEQ that's 18 wounds caused or 6 dead marines. And that's before taking into account any bonuses from Combat Drugs. Being a large and mobile squad they're also good at grabbing multi-objectives.

Given Sathonyx is often taken as an HQ anyway, 18 hellions at 288 points is only 38 points more than two units of Warriors with a blaster in Venoms, is more durable and far better in assault. They also have better move and fire potential.

You may object that I haven't allowed for the cost of the Haemonculus and wracks, but the wracks bring another venom and the haemonculus is always used to swap pain tokens (usually to wyches).

the downside of the Hellions is really that it's sometimes hard to bring all guns to bear given the size of the unit (unless one clumps over-much which is a bad idea) and they're not as durable in combat as wyches (though they'll tend to deal more damage which can mitigate that considerably as the enemy gets fewer his back).

Dont forget the baron gives assault and defensive grenades to the hellions, a unit of 20 can take an assault from marines to the face and win. I just bounce them cover to cover and hit anything along the way, once you get that second pain point they are decent tank hunters, more so if you get +1S from combat drugs.

crunchym8 wrote:I am playing Casual games for the most part, so I do plan to use them. Rule of cool dominates my life. Anyway, next question. Harlequins. I want them. How should they be ran, and should I get whole troupes?

Also, the bombers... They look interesting, as well as the Pain Engines. I've seen little information on the Mandrakes as well.

Harlequins are in a tough spot as they cant take a transport and their 5++ save on T3 still leaves them dying in droves. Their kisses(rending) are expensive. I would go with a mid range sized squad with 7-8 models. 2 with fusion pistols and kisses, a troupe master with power weapon and a shadowseer so they cant be shot. The death jester just doesnt seem worth it to me and overdoing on kisses is a bad idea. Maybe 1 with a kiss and plain for wound allocation but with 5++ you arent going to make many saves.

The voidraven bomber is TERRIBLE. The razorwing fighter is ok and can be a lot of fun to launch missiles and then fly around.

Mandrakes are super bad, if you run them without a haemy you'll be half dead before they shoot anything, run them with a haemy and they lose infiltrate. Long story short is they require alot of effort and/or points just for "meh" abilities.

This is an extremely helpful starting place for anyone considering DE. My advice is to read every word of it, read your codex cover to cover and make a list. If you just go with what the internet suggests you'll end up with a really generic spammy list that you might not really like the feel of. Write a list with what you like the look of, then people can give advice on how to best tweek the list to make it even better.