Manchu wrote:I think Bosmer make the best bow-rogues.
Actually, I think I'm going to try a Conjuration Warrior Breton.
Should be interesting.
if by that you mean heavy armour with conjured weaponry then go for it, that's what my most recent one is and it's a blast
Can you summon up a weapon and it immediately goes into your summoning hand?
Where do you find Bound Weapons?
I was actually going to roleplay a sort of Magika Guard; conjuring bows/weapons while wearing a Guards uniform (love that hat).
Do you need arrows to shoot a bound bow, do you know?
I don't think you get magic bows, that is what lightening bolt is for.
With bound weapons, I think you cast it as a normal spell, and it appears in your hands automatically for a short time. You can buy the Bound Weapon tomes from any vendor who sells spells.
I know of 3
-Riverwood trader
-Farengar
-That conjurer guy at the Mage College
It wasn't challenging even when I didn't use tailor made stuff. I've said so before. I started breaking it after I discovered I was already pretty much done with and just wanted a quick spin around all there was to it.
Oh and the Guild quests are dumb. You need zero skill in any of the things they represent to actually complete them.
Mages guild? Used staves on the 2 occasions a spell was required.
Thieves guild? You can just grab stuff and run away, regardless of discovery, theres no penalty at all.
Dark Brotherhood? Same again.
They should have at least some way of punishing you when you screw up, but I don't think you actually can screw up.
I completed all the guilds with a pure warrior character :\
Hey, I already accepted it's more my problem then anything with the game
I like the game, don't get me wrong, but I don't get the endless hours out of it as some of you are able too.
I mean, 100 hours out of a single game (all enjoyed thoroughly mind you) is still not something any other single player game on the current market can even get close too.
Manchu wrote:I think Bosmer make the best bow-rogues.
Actually, I think I'm going to try a Conjuration Warrior Breton.
Should be interesting.
if by that you mean heavy armour with conjured weaponry then go for it, that's what my most recent one is and it's a blast
Can you summon up a weapon and it immediately goes into your summoning hand?
Where do you find Bound Weapons?
I was actually going to roleplay a sort of Magika Guard; conjuring bows/weapons while wearing a Guards uniform (love that hat).
Do you need arrows to shoot a bound bow, do you know?
Whichever hand you have the bound weapon spell in holds it upon summoning (you can dual wield bound weapons by having the spell in both hands and casting them both). Bound sword uses 1 hand, Bound battleaxe probably uses both, bound bow uses both, they all, however, only need 1 hand to summon, which can be confusing.
You find them from spell vendors. Bound sword is a novice level spell, so can be found on most traders of magic books (the Jarl's wizards are the best source, since they're everywhere, the closest being Whiterun). Bound battleaxe is less common, but I prefer the use of a shield, so I haven't gone looking for it. Never seen a vendor with bound bow, but the tome can be found in Fort Amol prison (you can find the location on any map with red and blue flags on it (can be found at any Imperial or Stormcloak camps, and I believe there's one in the room where you sign up for the Imperials in Solitude, simply hover on the blue flags till you see 'Fort Amol' and hit the action button to save the location to your map), and I believe it's stormcloak held unless you're an imperial and you've done the quest to capture it).
In the prison, look for a bucket with a lantern in it, lift the lantern out and the spell tome is sitting beneath where it was in the bucket, which can save a lot of time running between vendors, and can save a few gold. It starts off as needing 137 magicka to cast though, so unless you're increasing magicka every few levels (since I only use BS and BB, I don't bother) you'll need to spend a perk to half the cost of Adept level spells before you can use it.
Bound bow comes with 100 arrows every time you cast, but unless you're a terrible, terrible shot and fire off one every second or so, you shouldn't run out of them before you need to re-cast it (if your bound item is out for a few minutes straight, it'll disappear and you'll need to re-cast it).
Manchu wrote:@Sol: If you want challenge try being a dual-wielding stealth character. Good luck with dragons.
Thats what I am, and I have no problem with dragons
Well, I'm archery too. I shoot the dragon while he's being a baby and flying around, when he lands, I switch to my 2 swords, sprint up into his face and do the marked for death shout. Then I swing both arms and the same time, and do it again, and then again, and then it's dead If he bites me and it hurts, I just chug down a heal pot and finish swinging. Even before I discovered upgrading armor, dragons were still pretty easy for me. Sometimes I don't even fight them and just leave, cuz I just don't feel like it getting annoyed with having to swap back to my bow when he takes off again.
Bears are tougher than dragons :(
Oh and get yourself a Shadowmere. Bestest dragon tank in the whole game.
If I do a mage I was thinking of doing destruction plus conjuration, so I can have a pet hit stuff while I toss fireballs. But, I'll just stick with my sneaky guy for now and finish the stormcloak missions and then the main quests and probably hold off on a new character for a while, maybe till they put out a DLC. I need get my life back for a while ...
Skyrim is the only game where I find more quests while screwing around then when I try to get things done. Everyone and everything needs something done.
Yeah, the game is stuffed with quests. and most are out in the boonies somewhere you wouldn't ever go unless you just decided to take a walking tour of Skyrim's outer reaches.
In that same vein...
As I mentioned early, I like to ambush patrols when I find them.
I like to think that Tullius and Ulfric are sitting around lamenting their loss of men.
If you're Imperials and you dethrone and delife Ulfrik, enemy Stormcloak commanders you find in their camps are still Essential, despite serving no actual purpose now you've won the war. I can imagine that they might if you were still on the quest, like beating them down and taking them prisoner (something they left out), but they aren't even important any more. One of your 'missions' is to annihilate any Stormcloak camps you come across, and having that one essential NPC still alive in them ruins that experience.
I especially hate that they just kinda kneel down and catch their breath when you defeat them. Oblivion was kinda nice in that the vital NPCs actually became unconcious.
I tend to have more happen to me when I want to complete a quest than just randomly wandering around. Got that last item, gonna get it back, then Evil Noah's Ark explodes right over my location. So many wolves, spiders, dragons and bears. Oh, Lord the bears. Didn't know meat boxers were in the game.
Question: why are people keeping the dragon bones? I get the scales, but the bones?
thenoobbomb wrote:So far, doing random stuff and dungeons in Oblivion was more fun.
Really, I dont want to be busy for 1 hour or more for an average dungeon. In Oblivion a 30 minute dungeon was big, and I would have liked it better that way.
However, the story is better in Skyrim, but remember, Im not busy with main questline but with Stormcloaks.
thenoobbomb wrote:So far, doing random stuff and dungeons in Oblivion was more fun.
Really, I dont want to be busy for 1 hour or more for an average dungeon. In Oblivion a 30 minute dungeon was big, and I would have liked it better that way.
However, the story is better in Skyrim, but remember, Im not busy with main questline but with Stormcloaks.
Did you play Morrowind?
Sadly, I own both the GotY editions of Morrowind and Oblivion, and never beat either of them... I can never seem to pull myself out of the first area before I get bored... NOW that being said, Skyrim reminds me a lot of Fallout New Vegas, which sucked my soul for several months...
I'm thinking this is because I love PC gaming, but I'm a console gamer at heart...
I think yahtzee makes a few good points. For all the bazillion kinds of potions, not many seem to add much to the overall experience. I can't even really understand why some are worth hundreds of dollars. Worse yet, trying to organize them in any meaningful way is pretty useless. I always end up with a chest full of potions and i pretty much only use the healh restoring ones or the high damage poisons, which are always wayy way way overpriced.
That actually seems to be an odd sort of pattern with the Elder Scrolls games, actually. Starting with Daggerfall (which I think was the first 'true' ES game- Arena set up the backstory, but was still a pretty standard RPG, with experience and such), which had an enormous world, infinite quests, and a huge number of possible story arcs and plotlines (heck, 8 different endings!), we then go to Morrowind, with better graphics, but a much smaller world, and only a single final outcome. Brilliant story and scenery, and some amazing in-depth, crunchy gaming (when players regularly reverse-engineer the equations used in crafting, you know you've got something). Then Oblivion. Even better graphics, but a smaller world, in feel if not actual digital size, more run-of-the-mill setting, blase dialogue and a basic, boring questline that's as close to on rails as you're gonna get in an Elder Scrolls game. Then Skyrim, with brilliant graphics, all-new combat systems, and a decent enough story, but the actual gameplay mechanics are becoming rote and rail-like, losing a lot of the depth that was available in Morrowind and even Oblivion, especially in the realm of Magicka.
Though I suppose it may make a kind of sense- Perhaps the arts of Enchanting and Spellmaking have been lost over the years, and maybe there's changes in the ambient magickal fields of the different Provinces. In Morrowind even the most plebian of folk could weave enchantments of incredible complexity onto nearly anything with nothing but a filled gem, an item, and knowledge of the magickal energies to go into it, though you had a high chance of failure. Similarly with Spellcrafting, where it was common enough to find folk that knew the ins and outs of Mysticism (which is pretty much Metamagic in a way, knowledge and use of Magicka itself) that they could craft spells to specification, and yet even the simplest of spells could fail without enough concentration, perhaps representing the chaotic vortex of Magickal energies surrounding the Tribunal and Dagoth Ur, and the ancient Magickal traditions of the Dunmer.
Then you have Oblivion, set in Cyrodiil in the next age. A more stifled, political setting, but still one with many learned mages- the common man was not allowed to enchant outside of well-monitored, specially made stations- allowing for powerful, yet un-varied enchantments. But Magickal energies were thick in the province due to the weakening of the barriers of Oblivion, letting even the most inexperienced warrior wield the potent energies without fear of full exhaustion. And the stabilizing influence of the Ayleid wells may have calmed the ripples enough that vagaries in ambient Magicka could not disrupt casting, meaning spells would almost never fail. Alas, the Imperials were focused too much on order, and so lost many of the more esoteric uses of Magicka that the Dunmer people knew.
Now in Skyrim, the bounds of Nirn are once again weakened, as shown from the return of the Dragons- a primal magicka infuses the land, fueled by instinct and fury, letting one cast powerful, unfettered magicka with but a single hand, or cast more concentrated spells with both- alas, the Nords dislike most types of spellcasters, and as such the only source of magickal information is from ancient tomes, so delicate as to disintegrate in your hands as you read them. Enchanting practices have been learned not from the neighboring Dunmer refugees but from the Imperials, meaning that you use specially created Enchanting stations, and glassware is uncommon enough that not even the most foolish of adventurers would carry it with them, meaning Alchemy, too, must be carried out in particular locales. But much knowledge of the Mystic Arts has been lost- entire Colleges even, in the two centuries after the Oblivion Crisis.
Anywhoo. I'm just waiting for the modding tools to come out, and for a Spellcrafting Mod to be implemented. Maybe being able to craft specific Spell Tomes?
Oh, and Morrowind was one of those games where the first few hours were boring as anything else, but the game became absolutely brilliant when you got to around level 7 or so and started learning the ropes of how stuff worked in Vvardenfell.
Alfndrate wrote:Sadly, I own both the GotY editions of Morrowind and Oblivion, and never beat either of them... I can never seem to pull myself out of the first area before I get bored... NOW that being said, Skyrim reminds me a lot of Fallout New Vegas, which sucked my soul for several months...
I'm thinking this is because I love PC gaming, but I'm a console gamer at heart...
Interesting, thing is I'm wondering if everyone's second Elder Scrolls game is the one that disappoints them.
I played Morrowind first, and formed a pretty strong love/hate relationship with that game, loving the scope and the freedom, hating the almost deliberately useless quest system. I wanted Oblivion to have improved everything I didn't like, and kept everything else the same, instead they messed around with half the stuff I loved, like stumbling into a bunch of monsters way too powerful for me, so I had to flee, mark that spot on my map and come back when I was stupidly overpowered , and replaced it with that horrible monster levelling system. And what's worse, I couldn't levitate anymore.
I wonder if in hindsight I was a little unfair on Oblivion, which certainly did improve a lot of things, because it was my second Elder Scrolls game, whereas with Skyrim I'm a lot more open minded about the whole thing. Whereas people who've said they loved Oblivion and are disappointed by Skyrim aren't just doing the same thing I did with Oblivion?
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Crablezworth wrote:I think yahtzee makes a few good points. For all the bazillion kinds of potions, not many seem to add much to the overall experience. I can't even really understand why some are worth hundreds of dollars. Worse yet, trying to organize them in any meaningful way is pretty useless. I always end up with a chest full of potions and i pretty much only use the healh restoring ones or the high damage poisons, which are always wayy way way overpriced.
I think the range of potions available comes out of the ingredient crafting system. Sure most are useless, but you're kind of expected to spam crappy potions to burn through your ingredients and level up your skill.
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Melissia wrote:lol, one hour dungeon...
I remember in Daggerfall whre you didn't get out of the first dungeon for several hours unless you were on a speed run.
Man, so many fond memories of Daggerfall. Morrowind was such a disappointment in comparison...
Yeah, this is what I mean, everyone's second Elder Scrolls game is the disappointing one, except you loved Daggerfall, and were disappointed by Morrowind.
Then the Third re-applies their faith in the world? What's the fourth do? Well, I suppose for that we'll just have to see what Mellissa thinks.
Oddly enough, Arena was my second. I got Morrowind, played the heck out of it, then downloaded Arena and tried playing that. Love the weapon swinging thing, hated just about everything else.
I loved Morrowind because the Dunmer were so compellingly fleshed out. Tribunal was a crowning glory for me. I can't say I find every-fantasy-setting-has-northern-barbarians to be quite as interesting. And Cyrodiil was way too small and underpopulated to be ... well, Cyrodiil.
All the towns in Oblivion seemed a little too artificial to me. Each city basically had all the same features(Generalistic merchent, weapons and armor merchant(sometimes broken into 2), Spell merchent, and stables) with only a few variables.
and they seemed too small for the heartland of the Empire. Skyrim's cities are of a believable size and the Villages scattered about just felt natural to me. heck, I think some of the "villages" are almost the same size as Bruma was I also like that the smaller holds have no walls at all, they are just an overgrown village. helps to break the static feel of every city being defended immensly.
I do wish they had made Dragons a little rarer and more powerful. I have killed more dragons then mudcrabs, thats disturbing.
Anvildude wrote:Then the Third re-applies their faith in the world? What's the fourth do? Well, I suppose for that we'll just have to see what Mellissa thinks.
Maybe. It just seems that after being disappointed that Oblivion wasn't Morrowind v2.0, a lot of those fans are accepting Skyrim on it's own terms, more or less.
I mean, at first I just thought the reason I and so many others were underwhelmed by Oblivion was because it wasn't that good. Small, underwhelming towns, horrible levelling system, poor and really restricted voice acting and all that. But now it seems like loads of players aren't thinking like that, they remember Oblivion fondly and are a little underwhelmed by Skyrim.
I noticed some of those folk played Oblivion as their first Elder Scrolls game, which led me to my little pet theory.
Anvildude wrote:Then the Third re-applies their faith in the world? What's the fourth do? Well, I suppose for that we'll just have to see what Mellissa thinks.
Maybe. It just seems that after being disappointed that Oblivion wasn't Morrowind v2.0, a lot of those fans are accepting Skyrim on it's own terms, more or less.
I mean, at first I just thought the reason I and so many others were underwhelmed by Oblivion was because it wasn't that good. Small, underwhelming towns, horrible levelling system, poor and really restricted voice acting and all that. But now it seems like loads of players aren't thinking like that, they remember Oblivion fondly and are a little underwhelmed by Skyrim.
I noticed some of those folk played Oblivion as their first Elder Scrolls game, which led me to my little pet theory.
Oblivion was my first Elder Scrolls game, and I feel Skyrim is quite an improvement.
I played Morrowind, goofed off with some modding, but never knew where the heck to go, and I didn't understand why no one liked the fact I was picking up every item everywhere, and no one wanted this "skooma" stuff I had (the value was high). So I would restart my game over and over and over, etc... and just never got anywhere, the game never held my attention.
Oblivion was a little better, after playing the starting on my friends' xboxes, I finally bought it for my computer and finally left the starting area and made it to my first oblivion gate, but I never touched it after that...
I played one other character in Skyrim, a dark elf mage, at least I wanted him to be a mage. And I was like... okay, this isn't so bad...
My Nord battlemage is kicking butt and taking names now, and I love the game.
Tried it out, got to the first town past the intro, but have class later so I can't get too invovlved.
Was a definite improvement over morrowind and oblivion as far as gameplay goes.
Gonna get the crafting meltdown thing. As a mage, I really just want my dagger/sword (dagger off-hand, main offensive spell primary) to be good, which means I want iron ingots. Lots of them.
Like someone said earlier, I had the same problem with Morrowind, just not knowing where to go or what to do and wandering around aimlessly till I got bored. It managed to keep me busy for a week but I guess I lost track of the main quests and gave up.
Skyrim is much better, in fact I haven't put it down since 11/11/11. Much to the chagrin of my half-painted army men.
I dinged level 50 last night, kicked the imperials out of skyrim once and for all till the next DLC, and now I'm gonna finish up the main quests.
I think my next char will be a mage, thinking destruction/conjuration mostly, and I want to walk around everywhere and just explore, instead of fast traveling everywhere all the time.
I just had the LEAST luckiest dragon encounter ever;
Spoiler:
I'm in the main questline, at the part where I have to give away equipment to be smuggled in. I didn't know that they allowed you to give the rest of your equipment to Dephine, so I stored alot of my stuff in Breezehome, and gave the rest of it to Malborne. So what happens after I give ALL of my equipment away and am running around in my underwear?
Heh, just one of those things, was into console gaming during the late nineties, PC gaming seemed a distant place to me.
Wasn't until I got a really good job in 2001-ish, I could afford one. Plus started going out with Aurelia in 97, moved in together in 98, so had other things on my mind.
I like Bethesda, but I do have one complaint/problem. In FO3 and more so in FO:NV and Skyrim, the people in these lands are a hive mind or can communicate by telepathy. If you kill or steal, EVERYONE knows! You can be in a room and out of site, but they know. The everyone in town or in the faction know you are bad.
Wish they would fix this. Anyone else notice this?
brotherskeeper74 wrote:I like Bethesda, but I do have one complaint/problem. In FO3 and more so in FO:NV and Skyrim, the people in these lands are a hive mind or can communicate by telepathy. If you kill or steal, EVERYONE knows! You can be in a room and out of site, but they know. The everyone in town or in the faction know you are bad.
Wish they would fix this. Anyone else notice this?
Uh, I thought they did fix that in Skyrim. Crimes don't transfer between holds. Then again, I haven't had any problems with that in any of their games.
yeah, Crime doesn't transfer between holds and if you kill the last witness/there are no witnesses then your bounty is removed.
Note: You MUST be sneaking and out of sight to get away with theft or murder with no witnesses. If you are standing up straight then everyone knows you are there. Your victim must also be silenced immediatly, they can't scream or the jig is up.
Even if there are no witnesses, it's still not always perfect. A while ago I got jumped by some bandit or something, and a passing guard out on the road jumped in to "help" I killed the bandit, then the guard started hitting me and immediately it said "bounty added to whatever". I killed the guard, and there was still a bounty.. yet no one else was around at all
I am really frustrated by the lack of "good guy" things to do. I started what I hoped to be a paladin-style board'n'sword last night (Imperial seems perfect for block+onehand+resto) but couldn't think of a thing to do after character creation.
It's hard to be a nice guy in Skyrim. Every quest is about killing someone or something, or finding an item and in finding it you have to kill someones or somethings
I tried freeing captives, like one time there was a guy getting lead down the road by a group of high elves. I freed the guy by giving him a spare weapon, then we killed all the elves, and the guy just ran off without even saying thanks.
Manchu wrote:I am really frustrated by the lack of "good guy" things to do. I started what I hoped to be a paladin-style board'n'sword last night (Imperial seems perfect for block+onehand+resto) but couldn't think of a thing to do after character creation.
Bounties. Draug hunting. Dragon Slaying(well atleast the ones that attack settlements). Freeing Thalmor Captives.
Fetching someone's lost alembic and stuff of that nature does not count as "good guy" quests.
Similarly, clearing out dungeons/tombs/dragon nests is completely neutral. Taking bounties falls into this category as well.
When you help people overcome their faults (the two quests in Riften I mentioned above) or deliver some righteous justice (like in the Golden Claw quest), that's a "good guy" quest.
So what does that leave for evil doers or, at least, the good-disinclined?
- Almost all of the Daedric quests. (The not-evil ones are completely neutral, minus Meridia's and helping Erandur.)
- The Thieves' Guild quests, which are more neautral than evil but certainly not good.
- The Dark Brotherhood quests.
- Either of the sides in the main quest have very dark overtones.
Actually, the companions are the good guys. They try to help people, and when you first approach whiterun you see them killing a giant that was terrorizing some farm.
And Kodlak, the leader of the companions, wants to remove the curse.
Yes, and their quests are ... about helping people out of the goodness of their hearts?
The Companions are not good guys. They are a business. Everything that's not a job is just gang war with the Silver Hands. Even Kodlak wanting to remove his curse is just self-interest. He wants one afterlife rather than another.
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Anvildude wrote:College? Nothing more evil than a Thirst for Knowledge!
This questline was the single most disappointing aspect of Skyrim for me. Only one thnig, the huge Dwarven orrery deal, was interesting and that turned out to be much less cool than I expected.
I think I would have liked to have the option to join enemy factions and have whole different questlines.. like, you could join the Silver hand to take out the Companions, or that imperial guy who is trying to kill the dark brotherhood.. or the elves to side with the fella that wanted the eye of magnus in the college quests, etc. Joining the forsworn would have been good too. There's a quest to help some forsworn old guy, but all the other forsworns still hate you after you do it.
Do the quest for the kid, When taken by Astrid and she tells you "You can't leave until someone dies" Kill her and loot the body. You get a Quest called "Destroy the Dark Brotherhood" and you get to leave the shack, since someone died. Just not one of the folks she expected.
Cool maybe I'll do that with my other character.. is there anything else to it, or does the quest line end there? If Astid is out of the way, does that mean there can be no Shadowmere?
Necros wrote:Cool maybe I'll do that with my other character.. is there anything else to it, or does the quest line end there? If Astid is out of the way, does that mean there can be no Shadowmere?
Spoiler:
Maro in Dragon bridge gives you the password to the Sanctuary. You break in and start killing. Then you go back to maro and get 3000 gold (and any loot you took from the Brotherhood Corpses.
Yeah, see how many "good guy" possibilities this game has. I guess it's to be expected considering TES games have never been black/white. But at least in Oblivion, helping Martin seemed heroic. Now you're choices are joining up with loser cowards or moronic racists. Yay.
Forgive me if this was already mentioned, but the Creation Toolkit is expected in January (YES! )
and also, Beth is interested in doing the Steam Workshop much like TF2. There is a bit of a problem with that, highlighted with this news post from Skyrim Nexus (the main modding site for Skyrim) as there are those that wonder "Is Steam Workshop just going to be used for FREE content, or also for PAID content?"
We jumped off a tiny slope (about 10ft)
He instadies like all horses do from big falls. Which is dumb, the horse would die from hitting the ground, not by starting to fall
Manchu wrote:Yeah, see how many "good guy" possibilities this game has. I guess it's to be expected considering TES games have never been black/white. But at least in Oblivion, helping Martin seemed heroic. Now you're choices are joining up with loser cowards or moronic racists. Yay.
The Nord seperatist thing was created to try and give people reasons to join both sides, so is pretty grey by necessity. But helping Martin in Oblivion is like the main quest in this game - you're saving the world. It's basically heroic by definition.
I've also gone and gotten all kinds of ancestral airlooms for people, defeated evil necromancers returning from the dead, and other similar quests. There's plenty of 'good' things to do.
Thing is, Evil is easy. Good is hard. You have to actively try in order to be good- search out those in need, root Evil from its lairs. To be Evil, all you need to do is find the nearest guard and start swingin.
Taking my husband for a stroll and making him get eaten by Odahviing is a past time, as is stacking bodies into a pile and Fus Ro Dahing them into guards and children. Dressing as an Imperial and Running into a Stormcloak base is always fun when the butchery begins.
The best, however, is definitely the Torture room in the DB Sanctuary. Oh how I do love that room.
Manchu wrote:Yeah, see how many "good guy" possibilities this game has. I guess it's to be expected considering TES games have never been black/white. But at least in Oblivion, helping Martin seemed heroic. Now you're choices are joining up with loser cowards or moronic racists. Yay.
The question is, why would you want to be "good" in this game?
If you want to be a good guy, settle down, get married, have a dozen kids and live happily ever after. and maybe kill a dragon every now and then for funzies.
sebster wrote:But helping Martin in Oblivion is like the main quest in this game - you're saving the world. It's basically heroic by definition.
Defeating the dragons is saving the world. But you can do that (while missing out on big chunks of content) without joining either side. The character of Martin, his own motivations and sacrifices, gave moral shape to your involvement in a way that stumbling across and slaughtering dragons does not ... even after a mysterious, amoral group of old dudes validates what you're already up to.
I've also gone and gotten all kinds of ancestral airlooms for people, defeated evil necromancers returning from the dead, and other similar quests. There's plenty of 'good' things to do.
Fetch quests can be good guyish (Mjoll's is a good example) but it's hardly a counterpoint to the Dark Brotherhood ... along with a large portion of the rest of the game. In this game, I see no moral distinction between killing an "evil" necromancer and killing a sabre cat. I'll give you preventing the Wolf Queen's return. That brings us up to about four of five good things.
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Grey Templar wrote:The question is, why would you want to be "good" in this game?
Because I don't want every one of my characters to be thuggishly amoral or maniacally evil? For a game of wide possibilities, this is a surprisingly distinct lacuna.
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Grey Templar wrote:If you want to be a good guy, settle down, get married, have a dozen kids and live happily ever after. and maybe kill a dragon every now and then for funzies.
That's my point. If you want to be good in Skyrim, don't play the majority of the game.
Maybe we'll see an expansion like Knights of the Nine was for Oblivion. a heroic good guy quest(which I actually liked much better then the main quest)
I hope so. KotN was pretty weak, IMO, but I doubt we'll see anything larger in scale than that devoted to good guys antics. But they did makeTribunal so maybe there's hope for it.
Manchu wrote:Fetch quests can be good guyish (Mjoll's is a good example) but it's hardly a counterpoint to the Dark Brotherhood ... along with a large portion of the rest of the game. In this game, I see no moral distinction between killing an "evil" necromancer and killing a sabre cat. I'll give you preventing the Wolf Queen's return. That brings us up to about four of five good things.
Sure, there isn't a huge number of quests you do just because you're good. I'll grant that. I'd guess most quests you do leave the world a better place than when you entered it, but the way the quests are written it's mostly focussing on the reward you'll get, not solving problems for people.
To some extent I don't mind this. I found the way the companions were written in Skyrim to be just plainly more believable than other Warrior Guild types in other games, because they were swords for hire - their morals gave them boundaries, but they didn't prompt them to do dangerous things for no reward. And elsewhere, I didn't mind the general reliance on bounties and looting. I mean, good or not, it just doesn't make any sense for a person to make his fortune by wandering from town to town, bumping into people who need a travelling right at that very moment.
Instead, a guy who makes his money turning in bounties, and sometimes doing something heroic just because he's that kind of guy seems pretty plausible.
Because I don't want every one of my characters to be thuggishly amoral or maniacally evil? For a game of wide possibilities, this is a surprisingly distinct lacuna.
Yeah, I'll agree with that. I've never really enjoyed evil in games like this, for a host of reasons, and think that if a game is going to embrace 'you can do anything' there should be content written for characters who maintain good reputations. Perhaps a series of heroic style quests that'll trigger when a character has built a good enough reputation in a certain area?
In Skyrim I enjoy the fetch quests, delivering a letter is nice and normal compared to killing a dragon or frost troll.
Also the dragons are coming back to enslave humanity so that makes killing them heroic. Anyone who took the time to read the little engravings on the climb up to the grey-beard's crib would know that dragons are dicks.
You can do good and bad with some of the daedric quests, for example there is one where you can become a cannibal or you could just kill the person who offers you the chance. There are plenty of neat options and opportunities to show yourself as a good or bad character. Now as a side note, if you take a bounty from a keep and fulfill that bounty by killing the bandit chieftain in the bounty then that's a morally positive thing.
There really aren't plenty of opportunities to be good. And there is a huge disparity between the good things you can do and the bad.
Being good in Skyrim:
Sure, I'll give you a minor healing potion that I just happen to have five bajillion of (and cannot sell because all the merchants are out of gold after buying reclaimed armor/weapons). What's that? It's to get clean from Skooma? Yeah, whatever. Ah gak, did you just give me potions for this?
Being evil in Skyrim:
So, let me get this straight, although I don't worship or in any way venerate you, you want me to go kill a bunch of savages who have imprisoned one of your rival's worshippers just so I can lead him back here and while you hold him I mercilessly beat him over and over until he begs you to be his master? And I get a sweet mace? I'm in. : open map :
Any word on the kinds of updates they're doing other than that last one? They said for PS3's they fixed the performance issues for playing for a long time.. But I still get lots of slowdowns and having to pause to let stuff load.. it's fine for the first hour or so, but then it starts chugging more and more, I guess memory is getting used up quick.
Manchu wrote:There really aren't plenty of opportunities to be good. And there is a huge disparity between the good things you can do and the bad.
Being good in Skyrim:
Sure, I'll give you a minor healing potion that I just happen to have five bajillion of (and cannot sell because all the merchants are out of gold after buying reclaimed armor/weapons). What's that? It's to get clean from Skooma? Yeah, whatever. Ah gak, did you just give me potions for this?
Being evil in Skyrim:
So, let me get this straight, although I don't worship or in any way venerate you, you want me to go kill a bunch of savages who have imprisoned one of your rival's worshippers just so I can lead him back here and while you hold him I mercilessly beat him over and over until he begs you to be his master? And I get a sweet mace? I'm in. : open map :
You are surprised that "good" quests are selfless and "evil" quests are self rewarding?
Okay you're looking at Molag there, the guy is the daedric god of Domination. Did you think that his quest would involve you petting puppies?
Being Good: What's that you want me to be a cannibal and lure someone here so you can kill them and eat them in the name of Namira? How about I just stab all of you then for being evil cannibals.
Dragons want to take over the world? Screw that, get my sword and shield, its hero time.
There's an evil bandit in that cave/burrow/general area? I'll make sure that they meet their maker soon enough.
You want me to go into someone's subconscious and help them out with insecurities? Okay I guess I'll do that for you.
There are plenty of opportunities to be good in the game and there are plenty of opportunties to be evil or neutral. That quest that you mention is part of a rivalry between one daedric god and another so you can't really call it being evil seeing as though both of the gods are nasty characters to begin with.
Now if you want to be Thane of any region then you have to do good things for the people of the hold. There was one quest where you kill a vampire who wanted to control the entire hold and use them as cattle, if you can't call that doing good I don't know what you can.
Whiterun is a great homebase, there's almost all the merchants you need right there to sell all the junk you find. I felt the house was kinda small and cramped, but had a nice amt of chests and storage which is what I needed most.
I also got the house in Wilhelm, and I like it better. It's a lot bigger and I like the armory option for hanging up all the weapons I don't feel like selling. I have a weapon rack with nothing but magic staffs, and swords hanging on the walls. It has 3 manequins for hanging up armor, but for me only 1 of them displays the armor, and the other 2 are just a disembodied wooden face.
I didn't want to give too much away corpses, just in case people didn't want to know where it was.
I liked Whiterun, but the Companions upset me. Its not their fault, its the developers fault but I plan on killing them all one and the same eventually.
Riften is my favorite out of my current three houses. Solitude is huge and has a Stone of Berenziah in the master bedroom when you upgrade it so its kind of necessary to get it eventually. But Riften... I have my own personal little dock with fishing rods, and a garden, and a tanning rack, and its centrally located with a grindstone, forge, and workbench nearby. Its the prime location for anyone seeking on developing their smithing skills. Oh and the thieves guild is cool too, I think that the Nightengale armor looks damn sexy.
I like morthal mostly due to it being all cold and swampy, plus the irony of them loving me for killing all the vampires who were trying to rule the town and thus making me thane even though I was a vampire the whole time is too good to neglect.
I do have a problem with collecting the dragonstone from bleakfalls barrow though, I cleared the dungeon before going to whiterun to get the quest from the jarl's mage and so I can't collect it from the non-existant corpse of the draugr overlord.
Stupid fething game! Had to be up at 4am and wanted to finish Forelhost. That fething dungeon went on and on and on... Kept telling myself, just in the next room, just the next room. Finally got to Rahgot and kept running out of potions. Left and went back to Whiterun to resupply.
Why, oh, why does Arcadia hate me so? She has around 100 potions but none of them are health potions. So, ran around to different towns to get more and once I got back to Forelhost, it was 11:45. Stupid work getting in my way of killing Rahgot!
Or if you're having a tough time but want to get something done before a certain time there is a difficulty adjuster in the options. I have to be in bed by 12:00am so if I'm having issues with the dungeon I'm on I turn down the difficulty and finish the dungeon and then go to bed. Of course I turn it back up the next time I play.
Okay, chaps. Let me deconstruct my example for you.
Here's what it was NOT about:
- a critique of incidental selfishness/getting rewards
- a complaint that Daedric Pinces are (mostly) evil
- a declaration that there are no good guy things to do in Skyrim
Now here's what it was about: contrasts!
Quest complexity:
- Bad guy quests usually have multiple stages and may even be part of a sequence of events defining an entire faction, which in turn makes up a significant chunk of the game's content.
- There are no good factions; if you want to be good, you will miss out on a significant portion of the game just by not doing the evil quests. What remains is extremely simplistic: good guy quests are usually (always?) one-off and involve few to no complications -- in fact, they don't even require you to leave town/end a dialog in some cases.
Intentionality:
- Because they are complex, or perhaps one of the facets of being complex is that bad guy quests require you to participate more deeply -- to carefully plan and deftly enact that assassination, theft, torture, etc.
- Good guy quests are just fighting, little thinking. "Oh that was an evil necromancer? Okay, fine." The best example of this is preventing the Wolf Queen's return: "fight, fight, fight, fight, oh look the world happened to get saved." Same with dragons.
Actually, there's an idea! Get the Dakka community in on creating a mod to add at least one 'Good Guy' faction into the game, along with more 'good guy' quests and such!
It is possible. All we need are people with mics for voice acting, folks that can do Bethesdian Scripting, writers for the quests and personalities, and folks who can do the graphical stuff (like myself).
yes, but they will cost 5,000 gold and carry incurable diseases. Effects might include slowing your movement(from the itching), and extreme vulnerability to all diseases. now even the lowely skeever will kill you in just a couple of swipes.
Actually, there's an idea! Get the Dakka community in on creating a mod to add at least one 'Good Guy' faction into the game, along with more 'good guy' quests and such!
It is possible. All we need are people with mics for voice acting, folks that can do Bethesdian Scripting, writers for the quests and personalities, and folks who can do the graphical stuff (like myself).
Whaddaya say?
I could try plotting out some quests, provided that the mod support Bethesda give us is essentially just a Skyrim version of the the construction set, I might be able to test it too, assuming of course I can remember how it works.
Oblivion, Fallout, and Skyrim all regulalry crash on me about three or four hours into gameplay, usually when attempting to save or doing something (like going into/leaving a building) that would cause an autosave.
Since the game first came out, I've only had my PS3 freeze up twice. But, both times were when I was opening the start menu, which is a pain because that's the dumb location your quest tracker. But, I also went into the settings and I set it to autosave after every 5 minutes on the O button menu too, so I can get a backup that way if it ever crashes again.
Because clearly playing on a console instantly means no crashes, oh wait...
Grey Templar wrote:Its been happening to PS3 people with some regularity. They are working on a fix I think, but it takes longer to fix PS3 bugs then PC.
Manchu wrote:Oblivion, Fallout, and Skyrim all regulalry crash on me about three or four hours into gameplay, usually when attempting to save or doing something (like going into/leaving a building) that would cause an autosave.
Usually how it hits me, I've noticed the Thieves guild cistern, entering/exiting crashes a lot more regularly for me than anywhere else.
Just get used to hitting quick save and it's not normally an issue.
I'm playing on a PS3 so there's no quicksave button. But the crashes don't bother me. What bothers me are the quest-ending glitches (because there is also no console command bar). Autosave sometimes helps/sometimes hinders.
Because clearly playing on a console instantly means no crashes, oh wait...
Grey Templar wrote:Its been happening to PS3 people with some regularity. They are working on a fix I think, but it takes longer to fix PS3 bugs then PC.
Because clearly playing on a console instantly means no crashes, oh wait...
Grey Templar wrote:Its been happening to PS3 people with some regularity. They are working on a fix I think, but it takes longer to fix PS3 bugs then PC.
yes, but they will cost 5,000 gold and carry incurable diseases. Effects might include slowing your movement(from the itching), and extreme vulnerability to all diseases. now even the lowely skeever will kill you in just a couple of swipes.
But if you're a werewolf you're immune to all diseases... unless of course there are werewolf hookers which just sounds like a bad idea.
@Manchu, I get what you're saying but I'm still saying that you're wrong.
Go to Morthal.
- Jarl is talking to some villagers.
- Villagers are upset
- Talk to Jarl
- Investigate burnt house
- Find girl at night
- Kill first vampire
- Investigate vampire house
- Show Jarl
- Rally the mob
- Go to cave
- Mob is full of wimps
- Go into cave
- Kill Vampie
- Reward.
Then as mentioned before there is Potema and her whole quest line which is a bit longer than some of the others I've noticed.
I do see where manchu is coming from, "good" quests seem to be throwaway quests that are never mentioned again whereas quests like the dark brotherhood quests have a lasting impact.
Yeah, it's hardly a controversial point. It's like saying that Khajit play a small role in Skyrim and then having people respond with a list of all the Khajit. Fine, but if I post a list of the Nords and their roles in the game by comparison, I think you will find that my point is pretty valid.
I would argue that most of the "evil" in skyrim is in the form of daedric quests though, even the dark brotherhood aren't truly evil half the time.
That said a guild that helps people whether it's on a small scale (like the warriors guild from oblivion) or on a large scale (for example foiling potentially world changing evil plans) that aren't secretly man eating werewolves would go a long way.
Again, it's not so much about the presence of evil as the absence of good.
Speaking of Khajits, it'd be nice to see some DLC that put more Khajits and more goodness into Skyrim. Khajit are sold regularly as slaves in/through Morrowind. A KotN-scaled quest involving a sort of "underground railroad" scenario could do the trick. We could even get a few more Argonians in, I'd think.
I assume you mean the Fighters Guild in Oblivion and Morrowind?
As to the Companions, I don't like them too much, either. I did their quests with Character 1 but never since. It was fun killing the Silver Hands when I got into with my Nord but RP-wise I'm trying to find some distinction between characters. The Companions are a little over-specific. I miss the Fighters Guild.
Manchu wrote:I assume you mean the Fighters Guild in Oblivion and Morrowind?
As to the Companions, I don't like them too much, either. I did their quests with Character 1 but never since. It was fun killing the Silver Hands when I got into with my Nord but RP-wise I'm trying to find some distinction between characters. The Companions are a little over-specific. I miss the Fighters Guild.
I do mean the fighters guild, no idea why I said warriors guild...
Manchu wrote:Again, it's not so much about the presence of evil as the absence of good.
Speaking of Khajits, it'd be nice to see some DLC that put more Khajits and more goodness into Skyrim. Khajit are sold regularly as slaves in/through Morrowind. A KotN-scaled quest involving a sort of "underground railroad" scenario could do the trick. We could even get a few more Argonians in, I'd think.
Only problem with that is that you're about 3 centuries too late. Morrowind's been taken over by the Argonians of Black Marsh now.
And underground railroad helping Dunmer escape would be on-topic, but, well...
Manchu wrote:I assume you mean the Fighters Guild in Oblivion and Morrowind?
As to the Companions, I don't like them too much, either. I did their quests with Character 1 but never since. It was fun killing the Silver Hands when I got into with my Nord but RP-wise I'm trying to find some distinction between characters. The Companions are a little over-specific. I miss the Fighters Guild.
I do mean the fighters guild, no idea why I said warriors guild...
You were thinking about Lord of the Rings, Warriors of Rohan and all.
IDK, Jygalagg might not have the most... interesting quests.
Seeing as how he is emotionless and all about order he probably wouldn't stand for a mortal to do his bidding. They are far too disorderly and beligerant for his tastes.
They could prolly do something Ala Unearting Merunes Razor.
Have a dungeon built in the mountains south of Riverwood. You hear a legend of a Sword that "brings order to chaos" or something like that. While you delve into the dungeon, you fight Followers of Sheogorath ( in Amber and Madness gear of course. Top it off with some of the enchanted gear from the shivering Isles (or stuff used is Sheogorath Quests in the past, barring the Wabbajack). At a certain point, it goes from followers to the Daedra of the Madgod (Golden Saints and Dark Seducers). When you finally get through all of it, you have to fight the Champion of Order and use his heart to unlock the door that holds The Sword of Jygalagg (which would now have an effect of extra Damage against Daedra). WITH an added Bonus. If you kill Ufric, Tullius, Astrid, Alduin, Arcano, the Forsworn Leader, or anyone else whose sole purpose is to be killed by you and wreaking havoc at some point, the sword gets Unlimited Charge and some crazy effect to help follow the whole "Brings order to Chaos" bit.
Necros wrote:Just found this, if you need help with alchemy Lists every item and what you can make with it, and you can sort by the kind of potion you want
Loving playing as a combat-mage, more towards Mage, but damn I seem to be heavy on the healing pots on some fights, anything that helps me have more ingredient sources to make them is greatly appreciated.
CthuluIsSpy wrote:Isn't Jygalagg Sheoggarrath (or however it is spelt)? They are the same person are they not?
They were separated during the Third Era. Jygalagg was turned into Sheogorath when the other Daedric Princes though he was too powerful, but during the events of Shivering Isles, The Champion of Cyrodiil took the role of the Madgod and Jygalagg was freed from his little slice of Hell.
Has anyone noticed that in the Active Effects tabs, the Blessing of Talos decreases time between shouts by 0%? I'm not sure if it's a bug or a typo, but has anyone tested to see if the Talos blessing actually does anything? or if you need to complete a quest first?
I don't know if I said this or not but I was playing while one of my buddies was staying over the house and I came upon the Clavicus Vile quest. To my delight he sounded just like my friend and said things my friend would say.
I don't care how unkillable that damn dog is, he should be grateful I didn't split him with the Rueful Axe after all the times he nudged me forwards and got me spotted by enemies or trapped me in corners by continually running at me. Damn dog.
Tazz Azrael wrote:I hate my computer :( i bought Skyrim and my computer decides that once i start playing it crashing and blue screening is the perfect option!
I just did the siege of Whiterun. I now absolutely love Galdmar Stone Fist Ilireth was a pain in the ass when fighting the jarl, and just before I culd kill her (one last blow..), Galdmar decided to nearly kill the jarl.
Now, its time to take over some fortresses and free Skyrim!
Hey, if a khajiiti tongue isn't long enough, nothing is!
Jokes aside, I managed to work like hell on my smithing and get it up to 100 with the help of the crafting meltdown mod. So I made myself the first piece of legendary dragonscale armor
Frigging leveling world is making me mad. Stupid forsaken are forcing me to drink all my potions even with some improved steel plate. I need to get some ebony or something
Melissia wrote:Lol, just finished "night to remember", and goddamn was it hilarious. I mean the goat... and the marriage... and the giant...
My only problem with it is that I wish it were longer!
And I need to come clean. I used the Ogma Infinium exploit, but its different then console commands so whatever Exploit in spoiler
Spoiler:
(go into a storage container, go over the book and read it, pick your path, then exit the book, but not your invo. Hit x ((or w/e ps3 has) to store it in the container, then scroll up to the the container's contents and take the book back, rinse n repeat)
Melissia wrote:Hey, if a khajiiti tongue isn't long enough, nothing is!
Jokes aside, I managed to work like hell on my smithing and get it up to 100 with the help of the crafting meltdown mod. So I made myself the first piece of legendary dragonscale armor
Umm... I don't have girl parts but I could only imagine that if a Khajiti tongue is like a cat's tongue then that would not be in least pleasurable.
The Ebony Blade from the Whispering Door is supposed to be one of the best weapons in the game, with the ability to have an unlimited charge that sucks life from target.
Melissia wrote:Hey, if a khajiiti tongue isn't long enough, nothing is!
Jokes aside, I managed to work like hell on my smithing and get it up to 100 with the help of the crafting meltdown mod. So I made myself the first piece of legendary dragonscale armor
Umm... I don't have girl parts but I could only imagine that if a Khajiti tongue is like a cat's tongue then that would not be in least pleasurable.
The Ebony Blade from the Whispering Door is supposed to be one of the best weapons in the game, with the ability to have an unlimited charge that sucks life from target.
Not really...the ebony blade is difficult to power up to its full potential, and the fact that it takes its strength from the 1 hand skill (even though its a 2 handed weapon), makes it really difficult to use properly.
However, it is good at trolling giants.
halonachos wrote:Umm... I don't have girl parts but I could only imagine that if a Khajiti tongue is like a cat's tongue then that would not be in least pleasurable.
Hey, he said length, not texture (which goes to show how little he knows, but that's a topic for another... topic).
Mel, do you remember any of the dragons youve killed? Fast travel to where you did and the skeleton should be there, with bones and scales if you never looted it. Thats what I did
Pro tip, in Blackreach if you use level 3 unrelenting force on the big glowy bell in the ceiling, a dragon comes down
Melissia wrote:Or perhaps you should be thinking of the cylinder instead of the box.
Be taht as it may, let's talk about something else. Like armor.
Who here has managed to get (without cheating) dragon bone or dragon scale armor?
I havnt done it yet, I have all the materials though. Just need to find a crap tonne of iron ore/ingots to get smithing up to 100 then dragon armour here I come!
Melissia wrote:Or perhaps you should be thinking of the cylinder instead of the box.
Be taht as it may, let's talk about something else. Like armor.
Who here has managed to get (without cheating) dragon bone or dragon scale armor?
I did. Takes a while, but worth it.
I now have an armor rating of 468 thanks to full dragonplate (no shield)
Automatically Appended Next Post:
johnscott10 wrote:
Melissia wrote:Or perhaps you should be thinking of the cylinder instead of the box.
Be taht as it may, let's talk about something else. Like armor.
Who here has managed to get (without cheating) dragon bone or dragon scale armor?
I havnt done it yet, I have all the materials though. Just need to find a crap tonne of iron ore/ingots to get smithing up to 100 then dragon armour here I come!
Or leather. Hide Bracer spam is a lot easier than iron dagger spam.
Daedric...
Though IIRC only when fully upgraded.
It also costs a fair amount of ebony and for some reason people find it hard to find the daedric hearts needed to make it.
Mine deserves to be put on the sex offender's register, those annoying little girls running around Whiterun can see him clear as day as he runs around in the buff (actually, he's still got his cap on...)
I hate it when dragons appear, fly in circles and then leave...
I mean, we are supposed to be locked in an epic struggle that will decide the fate of the world.You can just fly off for no reason. I am the very antithesis of your existance, everything you hate and loathe now come back here and die!
I have the Fugitive that walks up to you in the woods.
While this is supposed to happen, too often he likes to hand me his stolen items while I'm fighting. So far I have died because of him while fighting : A Bear, A Dragon, a Sabre Cat, A Snowy Sabre Cat, Two Frost Trolls, A Thalmor hit squad, and a Hagraven.
Iur_tae_mont wrote:I have the Fugitive that walks up to you in the woods.
While this is supposed to happen, too often he likes to hand me his stolen items while I'm fighting. So far I have died because of him while fighting : A Bear, A Dragon, a Sabre Cat, A Snowy Sabre Cat, Two Frost Trolls, A Thalmor hit squad, and a Hagraven.
That guy was odd...
He gave me a bow (which i sold) then ran into a river where he promptly drowned...
I don't think NPCs can swim actually...
Still free bow!
Bilegulch (Southwest of fort sungard) - Orichalcum
Gloombound mine (Narzulburg) - Ebony
Ironbreaker Mine - Dawnstar
A large quicksilver mine - Dawnstar
Malachite Mine - Kyne's Grove
Moonstone - ????
Silver Mine - Karthwasten
Kolskeggr Mine (North of Markarth) - Gold
Left Hand Mine (Markarth) - Iron
Automatically Appended Next Post: The stupid fugitive bastard interrupted my fight with a bunch of bandits. Its a good thing I had full dragonplate, other wise they would have killed me.
Anyway, the hunter he stole from came around (after I killed the bandits), and asked if I saw anyone. I said yes, and gave him back his axe.
We then killed the fugitive together. The Moral of this story "DON'T ING INTERRUPT ME IN COMBAT"
Ps- I also killed the hunter, cause I am playing an evil character.
Moonstone is probably the most sparse ore ever. There are two veins in part of a cavern just south-east of Mzulft, a few veins in Mzulft, and a few in Blackreach, which is also where you can find Geode veins (which, when mined, give you levelled soul gems (empty usually IIRC), at a lower level you'll get petty, with level 50 being where you start being able to get Black in addition to the others, so it's only advisable to mine them at a high level.
Blackreach is also home to a few other ores like ebony and iron, but I didn't bother looking much further, all I wanted to do was finish the damned questline I was doing (the quest marker had disappeared, so I was essentially blind) and get out; I HATE Blackreach ¬.¬
Blackreach is one of my favorite TES environments, ever. I was not expecting it at all, and I ended up wandering around for a while after I cleared it out.
Did i miss something in Black Reach?
Seemed to be a fairly standard dungeon... though all/most of the dungeons in Skyrim seem to be fairly unique from each other...
Mel, what do you mean by cheating? Are you talking not using the iron dagger overload? Because for the most part I did that, but my Nord is currently wearing Dragonplate gloves, boots, helm, and shield with some daedric armor... Of course, this is all when he is not moonlighting as the Arch-Mage of Winterhold...
I was slightly disappointed when I became able to make dragon plate, not because the armor didnt look cool, but because I couldnt craft any sort of "Dragon Part Weapon A" (ie. Dragon bone War Axe).. I think it would have been cool to have a bone sword or something made from a dragon while running in the armor from a dragon that I made
I am finding the balances of the system to be a little odd.
Why do Falmer and Forsworn weapons do so much damage? I don't like the looks of either, for my character anyway, but I do use a forsworn bow. Bone, stone, and teeth can only get you so far in the weapons enviroment.
When strips of leather and bone provide more protection then a suit of iron you know something is wrong.
Since most Forsworn Follow/worship a hagraven, their equipment could be blessed by the Hagraven.
Only thing I can think of for Falmer is Elven crafting makes everything better... Which would technically work out in Oblivion. IIRC Elven and Glass are the two best(barring dragon) for light armor.
Glass, IIRC, like Ebony were made by special Materials only found in Morrowind(Prior to Skyrim) and normally only made by Dunmer smiths. Elven is well... Armor made by Elves(once against, prior to Skyrim, so this Boat doesn't hold water very well anymore).
Although Ornate looks pretty cool. Can you get a partial patch with that only being on the big fancy potions?
On a side note: Anyone thing they should have had a glass recycling program? I mean I must burn through 20 potions a week, it seems wasteful to toss away the bottles.
- Because they are complex, or perhaps one of the facets of being complex is that bad guy quests require you to participate more deeply -- to carefully plan and deftly enact that assassination, theft, torture, etc.
- Good guy quests are just fighting, little thinking. "Oh that was an evil necromancer? Okay, fine." The best example of this is preventing the Wolf Queen's return: "fight, fight, fight, fight, oh look the world happened to get saved." Same with dragons.
I think your complaint is fair.
It's kind of a challenge in game design in general, though, to make good actions as interesting as the evil ones, it reminds me of a quote from Simon Weil;
"Imaginary evil is romantic and varied; real evil is gloomy, monotonous, barren, boring. Imaginary good is boring; real good is always new, marvelous, intoxicating."
Anvildude wrote:Once again, that's where Mods come in. We've already had a lot of good ideas for Good character quests, why not follow through on them?
While I like the promise of more quests(even though I still haven't finished them all yet) I tend to find modded in quests a bit of an immersion breaker. In Oblivion almost all the modded quests had no form of voice acting which was annoying imo.
Also I'm thinking of downloading some potion retextures, kinda debating on one of these three
Spoiler:
Skyrim original for comparison, looks so ugly
Spoiler:
I prefer the originals to be honest...
As for mods, skyrim on the PC will have an official modding creation kit AND the mods made with said kit will be available for download/installation via steam. Modding is not only sanctioned but encouraged so there is no reason not to make a dakkadakka-do-gooders guild (tm)!
That said console gamers (excepting maybe the ps3 due to valves deal with sony regarding the linkage of psn and steam account, but that is just speculation) don't have access to this modding goodness.
Manchu wrote:I had a good time being a boy scout in Mass Effect and ME2. Sweet Talos, am I praising BioWare over Bethesda? What is the world coming to?
True, but Mass Effect had what you were going to do all laid out for you, the only variation was in how you did it. That is, the main quest was the bulk of the game, and the roleplaying options were mostly just how you did it. The optional side quests (by memory, I only played ME 1 and that was a long time ago) weren't particularly good or evil.
In Skyrim, with it's much looser quest system, I can see it being very difficult to lay out an extensive network of 'good' quests, outside of the main campaign.
I think the real issue in Skyrim was that very few of the 'evil' quests had options for 'good' resolutions. For example there's that quest for the Thalmar, where you are asked to go and prove that a guy is a Talos worshipper. So you break into his house and steal a Talos prayer book, and go back and report it. But there's no option to go warn the guy the Thalmar are onto him, or to go and lie to the Thalmar and tell him there was no evidence. Similarly, why can't I tell the authorities about the cannibals?
Anvildude wrote:Once again, that's where Mods come in. We've already had a lot of good ideas for Good character quests, why not follow through on them?
While I like the promise of more quests(even though I still haven't finished them all yet) I tend to find modded in quests a bit of an immersion breaker. In Oblivion almost all the modded quests had no form of voice acting which was annoying imo.
Well thats why as it turns out, making quest mods isnt as simple as some may think
Sure you can make model and texture mods, but ones that require voice acting can be a lot harder
I think in all my months of playing Fallout NV, I've only found 5 or so good quest mods with voice acting (two of them were Bounty mods, another had to do with the Bison Hotel) compared to say 20-30 weapon/texture mods
corpsesarefun wrote:
I prefer the originals to be honest...
Well there was a plain jane glass high res with little, if any, extra texturing. although the page just went down. Funnily enough the mod was called "Silly Level of detail"
Manchu wrote:I had a good time being a boy scout in Mass Effect and ME2. Sweet Talos, am I praising BioWare over Bethesda? What is the world coming to?
True, but Mass Effect had what you were going to do all laid out for you, the only variation was in how you did it. That is, the main quest was the bulk of the game, and the roleplaying options were mostly just how you did it. The optional side quests (by memory, I only played ME 1 and that was a long time ago) weren't particularly good or evil.
In Skyrim, with it's much looser quest system, I can see it being very difficult to lay out an extensive network of 'good' quests, outside of the main campaign.
I think the real issue in Skyrim was that very few of the 'evil' quests had options for 'good' resolutions. For example there's that quest for the Thalmar, where you are asked to go and prove that a guy is a Talos worshipper. So you break into his house and steal a Talos prayer book, and go back and report it. But there's no option to go warn the guy the Thalmar are onto him, or to go and lie to the Thalmar and tell him there was no evidence. Similarly, why can't I tell the authorities about the cannibals?
Or similarly, why can't I go to a priest and report that yes, that goddamned house IS haunted by a powerful daedra lord, and you should kill it with fire or something. Hell, why can'tI just subdue the idiot priest who gives in, instead of killing him? (like tie him up or something)
I finished the main quest with my first char, at around level 50. I didn't kill that other dragon though that Max Von Sydow wants me to kill, cuz that dragon was nice to me.
Anyway I started over as a high elf mage and doing mostly destruction & conjuration. Like level 12 now, and I'm trying to do it without fast traveling ever. Well, maybe if I have super long hike from one end of the world to the other. But so far I've just been wandering around, checking out dungeons and caves that I find. Having a lot more fun just exploring.
sebster wrote:I think the real issue in Skyrim was that very few of the 'evil' quests had options for 'good' resolutions. For example there's that quest for the Thalmar, where you are asked to go and prove that a guy is a Talos worshipper. So you break into his house and steal a Talos prayer book, and go back and report it. But there's no option to go warn the guy the Thalmar are onto him, or to go and lie to the Thalmar and tell him there was no evidence. Similarly, why can't I tell the authorities about the cannibals?
This is a great point, especially about those particular quest -- and the one Melissia brings up, too. All of Markarth in fact felt fethed up. Not just in terms of there being little "good" to be done; it just felt rushed/shoddily plotted. Although "good" options would make for a huge improvement, I still think a "good" faction on par substance-wise with the Dark Brotherhood or Thieve's Guild is necessary.
sebster wrote:I think the real issue in Skyrim was that very few of the 'evil' quests had options for 'good' resolutions. For example there's that quest for the Thalmar, where you are asked to go and prove that a guy is a Talos worshipper. So you break into his house and steal a Talos prayer book, and go back and report it. But there's no option to go warn the guy the Thalmar are onto him, or to go and lie to the Thalmar and tell him there was no evidence. Similarly, why can't I tell the authorities about the cannibals?
This is a great point, especially about those particular quest -- and the one Melissia brings up, too. All of Markarth in fact felt fethed up. Not just in terms of there being little "good" to be done; it just felt rushed/shoddily plotted. Although "good" options would make for a huge improvement, I still think a "good" faction on par substance-wise with the Dark Brotherhood or Thieve's Guild is necessary.
The Companions seemed good for a while, but I was iffy when I got near the end.
Spoiler:
It's debatable sure, but willingly embracing the beast within seems like they're just trying to escape their humanity... believing that they need their werewolf powers to do anything is the same thing as saying they're weak. I certainly don't... I killed werewolves and dragons without needing any goddamned lycanthropic curse!
is upon my lips! His 
I also like that the smaller holds have no walls at all, they are just an overgrown village. helps to break the static feel of every city being defended immensly.
