This also makes some of the more defense-oriented linkable units like Thorakites and Sekban even worse than before. They didn't have much redeeming qualities to begin with compared to other alternatives.
To be fair, Thorakites and Sekban are both able to be Linked in ways that normal Link Teams can't be with the Greek fireteam rules and with Haris for the Sekban.
Awww man, you no longer get to place three templates with the Katyusha MRL.. now it's just one. I'm not sure why you'd bother with it versus the Uragan now :(
"Anti-material" had better be a seriously awesome weapon property to make up for it!
Siygess wrote: Awww man, you no longer get to place three templates with the Katyusha MRL.. now it's just one. I'm not sure why you'd bother with it versus the Uragan now :(
"Anti-material" had better be a seriously awesome weapon property to make up for it!
Well, Uragan has been nerfed too, Guided mode is Burst 1, AP+Shock.
Erasoketa wrote: Well, Uragan has been nerfed too, Guided mode is Burst 1, AP+Shock.
Indeed it has. Oh well, at least the new Hit Mode gives you a powerful - if inaccurate - Dam 15, B 3 weapon for close range AROs. Without the template, you don't have to worry about the shot getting cancelled because too many friendlies are in the way. Granted.. that's not much of a consolation for the poor Traktor Mul!
OMG I didn't realize that the Uragan Traktor Mul has Total Reaction now. I was thinking that unguided modes with Burst 3 meant that AROs were down to Burst 1 as usual. We haven't lost that much then.
Now that we have HS & C: P addressed, I'm underwhelmed with the rollout of N3.
The rules themselves will be solid. However, it's going to be difficult to refer to on the spot with so many sources to reference.
I thought we were going to get revised HS & C: P rules instead of a list of tweaks to keep in mind. So we have four sources for Infinity rules: N3, HS, C: P & now FAQ for the last two
Hopefully CB will make a unified PDF in the future so there is one source, not four.
Thank all powerful Atheismo for the folks who maintain the Infinity Wiki. They have their work cut out for them.
They really should have just made N3 "one book to rule them all" and updated Human Sphere, Paradiso, etc. in that, instead of going down this route of providing PDF patches.
MRPYM wrote: Is zero V smoke still in effect or is it replaced by new white zone rule?
Zero-V smoke still blocks LoF for MSV. It creates a Zero visibility zone that MSV can't penetrate. All rules from HS&CP are the same as before unless noted in the FAQ and updated profiles. Excited to be jumping back into infinity, not so excited that the rules were not all put together in one place.
Bladerunner2019 wrote: Now that we have HS & C: P addressed, I'm underwhelmed with the rollout of N3.
The rules themselves will be solid. However, it's going to be difficult to refer to on the spot with so many sources to reference.
I thought we were going to get revised HS & C: P rules instead of a list of tweaks to keep in mind. So we have four sources for Infinity rules: N3, HS, C: P & now FAQ for the last two
Hopefully CB will make a unified PDF in the future so there is one source, not four.
Thank all powerful Atheismo for the folks who maintain the Infinity Wiki. They have their work cut out for them.
But we been told since day one this was all they planned right now for HS and C. Hell I figured Link team fix was just going to be "replace LT Order to reform link with CT" and done. Plus the fluff and rules master would like to redue HS to being the fluff quality up to N3 and C level, I'll bet then they would take a big look at the rules them, of course if they did it would push AF back even more. So the choose was either focus on rewriting HS or focus on AF guess what they picked. Sure someone going to come in a say they could of done it all at once, to that "make you own game and lets see how well balanced and tactical it is and the fluff to go with it".
Perhaps it's involving the Acheron Falls campaign book. Maybe the O-12 is (forcibly) recruiting the Ariadnan Forces as storyline fluff thus introducing heavy involvement in both O-12 as a separate army and USAriadna as a sectorial.
Seems like a in-fluff teaser preview.
---
I'm still curious about the preview shot of the "twins". I'm having trouble finding it on Dakka, Data Sphere, Facebook, and the main forums. I've gotta feed the itch to collect all the Kum Bikers. I love these motorcycles.
-Loki- wrote: Twins was expected, we saw a cleavage shot of them a while ago. My wallet is unhappy.
Was there really a preview of this? I can't find it anywhere.
It wasn't confirmed but it was the sniper shot back in... November? It looked like a top similar to the female Kum concept art and was assumed to be one of the twins.
Probably just an assumption based on USAriadna being the next sectorial combined with the US butt (what what!).
I do rather doubt that there would be the release date for one specific sectorial. Not only is it odd to showcase one over others, but it wouldn't make sense for it to be a three-day event.
Didn't the player who won at GenCon win a paid trip to the Interplanetary tournament in Vigo? He played Ariadna, and the coordinates are for Spain so maybe it's their invitation. That's what someone said on the Infinity forum.
They provide alternate Auth Bounty Hunter models to use with the profiles while also providing an incentive to take part in a community based ITS league or tournament.
If you just have people collecting/painting miniatures and not visibly playing it is often hard to grow a community. But when there is an incentive to get out there and play against other real people it can motivate people to step up their game, or to come and play and introduce others into the game.
Vain wrote: Can't say I agree with you there Kanluwen.
They provide alternate Auth Bounty Hunter models to use with the profiles while also providing an incentive to take part in a community based ITS league or tournament.
If you just have people collecting/painting miniatures and not visibly playing it is often hard to grow a community. But when there is an incentive to get out there and play against other real people it can motivate people to step up their game, or to come and play and introduce others into the game.
Far from the 'worst decision evar' IMO.
You know what gets people "visibly playing"?
Having your new "streamlined" rules set finished and put into one book, not requiring people to haul a laptop/tablet or a veritable filing cabinet's worth of documentation for something that was claimed to be intended as "new player friendly".
The ITS prize packs are laughable at this point, since Authorized Bounty Hunters are models that can only be used in vanilla Human forces or the Imperial Service sectorial army.
These models should not be prizes, they should be regular releases. The "prize support" should be vouchers for a model of the player's choice, not something that quite a few people seem to just chuck onto eBay.
As it stands, this game is littered with missing profiles and the company keeps claiming that they can only do so much because of production bottlenecks and other issues...yet they continue to put out these "limited editions".
Vouchers create weird problems with CB having to compensate the retailers. If you're suggesting that it be a CB-store-only system, then who would pay for shipping? The system right now is fine with one pack.
ABHs get alternate-sculpt normal releases a year after they come in the prize packs anyways. Just buy it then if you really like it. Just be happy they're not doing deals with Romeorage Battlefoams and selling $70 YuanYuan models with extra bulk trash on the side.
CB's release schedule is their own doing. You could argue that these limited edition models take away from production of other things, but then again so do resculpts. At least the some of the limited edition models we have nowadays are alternate poses or minor changes from the digital sculpt they already spent plenty of time on. The resculpts of models like Alguaciles are what actually takes up much more time. I agree with you Kan that Nomads should not get any more reculpts and the SWC box should be delayed indefinitely until every profile with every weapon combination has been released.
Having your new "streamlined" rules set finished and put into one book, not requiring people to haul a laptop/tablet or a veritable filing cabinet's worth of documentation for something that was claimed to be intended as "new player friendly".
It is new player freindly. Putting everything in one book would have been not so friendly since the book would have been unwieldy and also it would have been too much rules at once OP and HS are additional rules and I am quite happy that beginners do not concern themself from the start on. Since stats are what changes most over time I am also quite happy that only the basics are in the book and the rest shows up via PDF. That is much easier to handle.
The ITS prize packs are laughable at this point, since Authorized Bounty Hunters are models that can only be used in vanilla Human forces or the Imperial Service sectorial army.
These models should not be prizes, they should be regular releases. The "prize support" should be vouchers for a model of the player's choice, not something that quite a few people seem to just chuck onto eBay.
Prize grabbers/ebay sellers are a problem in virtually every game with a tournament scene so I would not consider them that much of a standard. Vouchers would be way to complex to handle. Right now I am quite happy with alternate versions of existing minis and at the end of the day prizes are prizes and not army-upgrades
As it stands, this game is littered with missing profiles and the company keeps claiming that they can only do so much because of production bottlenecks and other issues...yet they continue to put out these "limited editions".
Profiles are all there right now and thanks to folks that can´t a few days we still are in the mopping-up phase for the PDF. Some minis are still not released, but hey, ask GW-customers how long they had to wait for some entries... Limited Editions are quite easy to produce since they are variants.
It looked to me like this new ABH is the same figure that came with the N3 rulebook. Why get worked up over a figure most of us already got. Also, if the ABHs get alternate generic sculpts, why haven't we seen a generic or regular release version of Miranda Ashcroft or the previous ITS ABH?
Miranda Ashcroft is an exclusive model from the artbook, so she will probably not have a generic release, last years ABH will probably get a release later this year once the new ITS kicks in.
I kind of like the idea of the mini in the ITS pack. It's usually not so amazing that you have to have it as a collector (although you can normally get hold of it if you are), but it's a nice little incentive for people taking part beyond the ITS points and other accessories you get.
Hmm, the writing seems a bit lacking. I see a lot of "...I apply VMC#xxx.xxx to shade the ___ area", which I mean is cool and all, and yeah I can def learn from observing his procedure, but I hope I don't end up just shelling out for an expensive mini and a collection of facebook 'watch-it-painted' tuts.
Barzam wrote: It looked to me like this new ABH is the same figure that came with the N3 rulebook. Why get worked up over a figure most of us already got. Also, if the ABHs get alternate generic sculpts, why haven't we seen a generic or regular release version of Miranda Ashcroft or the previous ITS ABH?
Other than the fact that this mini isn't in heavy armor, has a different pose, has an unhelmeted head, different weapons and the only similarity is it looks to have a jacket.
Petition CB for ABH releases. Maybe if they start getting lots of requests and see them being used in tournaments and events (by proxy) they will put out alt sculpts of the ITS Pack ABH's.
Petition CB for ABH releases. Maybe if they start getting lots of requests and see them being used in tournaments and events (by proxy) they will put out alt sculpts of the ITS Pack ABH's.
Ummm.... they do the ITS13 ABH alt sculpts was released 3rd quarter of 2014. CB already told us back when ITS13 started that they are going to do a alt sculpt release of the models, just after the current ITS they are prizes for.
Who said any of that, we get you hate so much stuff about the game you play, why not start a thread about all the thing you dislikein the CB sub-forums instead of nearlly every post here being "I don't like it/CB messed up". I was telling someone that CB does do Alt sculpts for the ITS ABH, while not NEW news is still news. We already heard your view about them, a few post above, but thank for posting the same again, .... it was helpful.... feel better. Lets try to help poeple out in this thread with new and info and bitch and whine somewhere else.
Michael Bishop wrote: Hmm, the writing seems a bit lacking. I see a lot of "...I apply VMC#xxx.xxx to shade the ___ area", which I mean is cool and all, and yeah I can def learn from observing his procedure, but I hope I don't end up just shelling out for an expensive mini and a collection of facebook 'watch-it-painted' tuts.
Can I ask.. what exactly are you hoping to shell out for?!
Michael Bishop wrote: Hmm, the writing seems a bit lacking. I see a lot of "...I apply VMC#xxx.xxx to shade the ___ area", which I mean is cool and all, and yeah I can def learn from observing his procedure, but I hope I don't end up just shelling out for an expensive mini and a collection of facebook 'watch-it-painted' tuts.
Can I ask.. what exactly are you hoping to shell out for?!
The 'why?' of it all I guess, if that makes sense. I hope it isnt just a step-by-step on "how to paint this mini like this". Of course I only saw the couple of pages from the trailer, so it is likely much more in depth, and I am not Kanluwening on the book in any way. I'm just eager to see some of the vision behind his painting genius.
Let me put something politely to you right now:
I suggest you knock the "Kanluwening" commentary off right now or you and I are going to have an issue.
I get enough of that crap on the official forums, and I expect it there since the moderation team is garbage.
Pretty sure it will just be a picture by picture step by step guide on how he painted his models.
It makes sense, it's the easiest and clearest way for him to put a book out.
I would rather it be a guide on technique and process, but honestly videos are way more useful for that sort of thing.
Not a fan of putting a limited edition mini with it though. I know of more then a few people who are buying the book just for JoA which is silly and sucks for people wanting the book for the book if that means they can't get one. I like free promos, but not when they are themselves limited and attached to something else limited.
Michael Bishop wrote: Hmm, the writing seems a bit lacking. I see a lot of "...I apply VMC#xxx.xxx to shade the ___ area", which I mean is cool and all, and yeah I can def learn from observing his procedure, but I hope I don't end up just shelling out for an expensive mini and a collection of facebook 'watch-it-painted' tuts.
Can I ask.. what exactly are you hoping to shell out for?!
Red Corsair wrote:
Not a fan of putting a limited edition mini with it though. I know of more then a few people who are buying the book just for JoA which is silly and sucks for people wanting the book for the book if that means they can't get one. I like free promos, but not when they are themselves limited and attached to something else limited.
Then, let's hope that those people sell the book on if it's of no use to them.
Albertorius wrote:
Bottled talent
Actually, I was hoping for more of a bathtub-full!
Barzam wrote: It looked to me like this new ABH is the same figure that came with the N3 rulebook. Why get worked up over a figure most of us already got. Also, if the ABHs get alternate generic sculpts, why haven't we seen a generic or regular release version of Miranda Ashcroft or the previous ITS ABH?
Other than the fact that this mini isn't in heavy armor, has a different pose, has an unhelmeted head, different weapons and the only similarity is it looks to have a jacket.
Petition CB for ABH releases. Maybe if they start getting lots of requests and see them being used in tournaments and events (by proxy) they will put out alt sculpts of the ITS Pack ABH's.
Is it a brand new sculpt? All I can see is a blur that looks to be posed the same and wearing the same doofy jacket.
Kanluwen wrote: Let me put something politely to you right now:
I suggest you knock the "Kanluwening" commentary off right now or you and I are going to have an issue.
I get enough of that crap on the official forums, and I expect it there since the moderation team is garbage.
Sorry Kan, I meant it as good-natured ribbing inline with the posts at that time. I thought you'd get a laugh out of it honestly. Won't do it again if it pisses you off.
Kanluwen wrote: "The Mute" in the ITS2015 pack is a variant of the ABH that we just got with N3.
This keeps getting said and said in this thread but the picture I am looking at doesn't look remotely like a HI Mobile Brigada. The arms look like they are fabric as opposed to armour, as do much of the legs.
So we have a source saying it is the same model in a different pose or is that coming from someone looking at the picture and saying so?
Red Corsair wrote:
Not a fan of putting a limited edition mini with it though. I know of more then a few people who are buying the book just for JoA which is silly and sucks for people wanting the book for the book if that means they can't get one. I like free promos, but not when they are themselves limited and attached to something else limited.
Then, let's hope that those people sell the book on if it's of no use to them.
Kanluwen wrote: "The Mute" in the ITS2015 pack is a variant of the ABH that we just got with N3.
This keeps getting said and said in this thread but the picture I am looking at doesn't look remotely like a HI Mobile Brigada. The arms look like they are fabric as opposed to armour, as do much of the legs.
Spoiler:
So we have a source saying it is the same model in a different pose or is that coming from someone looking at the picture and saying so?
It's coming from someone looking at the picture and saying so and having paid attention to the way that Corvus Belli has described their CAD process.
The main body of the model is built first and then extraneous parts like armor plating, webbing, etc are added as separate 'items' to the mannequin. This is how they are going to be able to use the Morat "Rodok" mannequin for their planned resculpt of the Yaogat/Kurgat units for the Morat.
And for what it's worth, I have the ABH from N3. Everything about "The Mute" from that photo matches my model, barring the armor--which again is easily left off during the CAD process.
Kanluwen wrote: It's coming from someone looking at the picture and saying so and having paid attention to the way that Corvus Belli has described their CAD process.
The main body of the model is built first and then extraneous parts like armor plating, webbing, etc are added as separate 'items' to the mannequin. This is how they are going to be able to use the Morat "Rodok" mannequin for their planned resculpt of the Yaogat/Kurgat units for the Morat.
And for what it's worth, I have the ABH from N3. Everything about "The Mute" from that photo matches my model, barring the armor--which again is easily left off during the CAD process.
So, it is exactly the same model, except that it is lacking the heavy armour that makes it look HI/Mobile Brigada-like?
I don't mean to be as facetious as this sounds (I tried changing it to be a nice as possible) but isn't that like saying a Ghulam model is exactly like a Ragik except for the jetpack because they used the same armature to make the sculpt? (pretending they used traditional sculpting methods on these two models).
If you showed me a 'Space Marine in Artificer armour' model and then showed me a 'Marine in Terminator armour' model and said "Look, they both have the same stance and head because it is the same character" I would nod and smile and continue to see them as two different models, even if they were of the same character.
If you are saying the N3 ABH is meant to be a version of Le Muet in HI armour, cool I can get behind that, but that is a large enough difference for me to be happy to gun for a Muet, even if he shares a stance/jacket/backpack with enough differences to make me happy.
Whenever I see people claiming it is the same model I keep thinking it is an alternate arm/head combo that they have done previously, but this goes way beyong that level of alt. This is a whole different mold rather than casting up seperate arms and heads.
Having your new "streamlined" rules set finished and put into one book, not requiring people to haul a laptop/tablet or a veritable filing cabinet's worth of documentation for something that was claimed to be intended as "new player friendly".
It is new player freindly. Putting everything in one book would have been not so friendly since the book would have been unwieldy and also it would have been too much rules at once OP and HS are additional rules and I am quite happy that beginners do not concern themself from the start on. Since stats are what changes most over time I am also quite happy that only the basics are in the book and the rest shows up via PDF. That is much easier to handle.
I don't usually but on this I agree with Kan as I don't find it particularly new player friendly. As a new player, I would have preferred having a single goto reference book for all the rules instead of multiple (including some partly out of date and inaccurate unclear flowerly language legacy books that require separate updates to make use of) with this new edition. This would have been a great time for a fresh start. YMMV.
Having your new "streamlined" rules set finished and put into one book, not requiring people to haul a laptop/tablet or a veritable filing cabinet's worth of documentation for something that was claimed to be intended as "new player friendly".
It is new player freindly. Putting everything in one book would have been not so friendly since the book would have been unwieldy and also it would have been too much rules at once OP and HS are additional rules and I am quite happy that beginners do not concern themself from the start on. Since stats are what changes most over time I am also quite happy that only the basics are in the book and the rest shows up via PDF. That is much easier to handle.
I don't usually but on this I agree with Kan as I don't find it particularly new player friendly. As a new player, I would have preferred having a single goto reference book for all the rules instead of multiple (including some partly out of date and inaccurate unclear flowerly language legacy books that require separate updates to make use of) with this new edition. This would have been a great time for a fresh start. YMMV.
I agree immensely with this. I'm a new player myself, and I'm finding the way they decided to do it absolutely annoying.
Can't say I am huge on the exclusive figures. Some say it attracts people to contribute to the growth of the game by participating in official events and buying books, but on the other hand some people might not bother getting in at all if they look and see they'll never have Miranda Ashcroft because they got into the game too late.
To be fair you can buy the ITS exclusives by buying an ITS pack if you really want one. It's pricey but you get a few other bits and bobs like patches, weapon sprues and random blisters.
Interestingly those complaining it is not all in one book turned out during games to be the ones that had already problems with the rules that are in the book...
Duncan_Idaho wrote: Interestingly those complaining it is not all in one book turned out during games to be the ones that had already problems with the rules that are in the book...
Um, what? I didn't have already problems with that... I'm a new player.
Ok once again please take the bitching about this and that somewhere that does not involve this thread.
You guys have said your pieces about ITS exclusive models and I don't feel anymore needs to be said.
As for the damn complaining about N3, we know already. There are dozens of post in this thread already about it, please do not bring it up again. If you really feel like you need to, there is a nice sub forum where you can post your thought in a dedicated topic for the matter.
The reasons on why there is not a unified PDF has been discussed and debated to the ground and then in the underground, that s how it is.
I doubt it creates much confusion to new players or it creates more confusion than realizing the rulebook does not contain anything to play and you need to buy a new book to field your chosen faction as is with some other wargame manufacturers.
Bostria posted on his Facebook that we'll see the rest of the releases for Januarembruary within the next few hours.
Just a reminder, the releases were listed as:
-PanOceania starter(as seen in O:I)
-Nomad starter(as seen in O:I)
-Unidron SWC box
-Yan Huo with dual MLs -Ragik
So after the O-12 called upon all Mercenarians in the country of Mercenaries, it is now reaching its authority over to the country of Combined Army.
Seems like we have new fluff. The O-12 has authority to order around the Combined Army. If only they said "Swiper no swiping!" before Acheron fell. However, I'm glad to see the Combined Army eventually changing their ways and coming in defense of the Human Sphere.
Absolutionis wrote: So after the O-12 called upon all Mercenarians in the country of Mercenaries, it is now reaching its authority over to the country of Combined Army.
Seems like we have new fluff. The O-12 has authority to order around the Combined Army. If only they said "Swiper no swiping!" before Acheron fell. However, I'm glad to see the Combined Army eventually changing their ways and coming in defense of the Human Sphere.
Kanluwen wrote: Bostria posted on his Facebook that we'll see the rest of the releases for Januarembruary within the next few hours.
Just a reminder, the releases were listed as:
-PanOceania starter(as seen in O:I)
-Nomad starter(as seen in O:I)
-Unidron SWC box
-Yan Huo with dual MLs -Ragik
That I like... not as much as the Maghiraba coming out instead but I like it regardless. I'm guessing that it is the model and weapon of this concept art from last year?
Spoiler:
I didn't notice the Chuck Norris Total Gym hand pieces in the art initially but I do like how they incorporated them into the model. Best of all... it's a model with big advanced ranged weapons that isn't ignoring them to instead use its hands to shove a sharp pointed object towards you!
From the 2 images we've got so far I'm fairly underwhelmed with the Yan Huo. I hope more angles on the model will change my opinion, but he's such a fatty.
Do we know who painted this? The green doesn't go well with the lighter orange Yu Jing has adopted.
I'll still buy it anyway I'm sure...
Other than the drill bit sniper (which is just silly), A solid bunch of releases even if starter sets are not particularly new.
Any clue whats going on in August? Specifically the 14th-16th?
Ragik looks AWESOME! It looks to not only be one of the few AD troops with both feet on the ground, but he's one of the only Haqqislam models that's actually aiming its Spitfire! The redesign overall looks really good, too. It seems to be borrowing elements from the Barid's uniform.
Barzam wrote: Ragik looks AWESOME! It looks to not only be one of the few AD troops with both feet on the ground, but he's one of the only Haqqislam models that's actually aiming its Spitfire! The redesign overall looks really good, too. It seems to be borrowing elements from the Barid's uniform.
Sorry to burst your bubble on the feet thing.
It's still the best new model in this batch of releases IMO
Barzam wrote: Ragik looks AWESOME! It looks to not only be one of the few AD troops with both feet on the ground, but he's one of the only Haqqislam models that's actually aiming its Spitfire! The redesign overall looks really good, too. It seems to be borrowing elements from the Barid's uniform.
Sorry to burst your bubble on the feet thing.
It's still the best new model in this batch of releases IMO
Aw man! So close! *sigh* well, I'll be attaching that other foot to the base. I notice his wings look thicker. I hope they redesigned the backpack like they did for the Hellcats, making the whole thing one piece.
Just mount the Ragik differently on the base; it looks like if you put his one foot close to the front, the back foot wil be completely over the base. This plus the Barid lets us know how the concepts for the Hassassin will end up. Very nice, but not so much that I will get it instead of continuing using my Ragik HMG as the spifire version.Based on past experience with the Ragik and the Akalis, I'm pretty certain that the jump pack will be three pieces-- pack and 2 wings. Plus two arms and a body-- not sure if the head will be separate--giving us 6-7 pieces to the new Ragik.
I hope we see the Govads soon enough. Oh, and Army Builder 5.
Oh man that Ragik. The armour redesign is interesting. I wonder if we'll get replacements for the old Rifle in the starter and hacker blister? There's also a boarding shotgun profile, but I can't see them doing a 4 model box. Maybe a 3 model box?
I'm gonna pass on this personally. Nothing about it really grabs my attention. The model is nice but the content looks like it's just rehashed from his Facebook page.
Something's been bothering me about the Yan Huo and I just figured it out.
The thing is the size of a Gecko. But the Gecko is a 3STR TAG and the Yan Huo is a 2W HI. This really feels like the 40k monstrous creature/walker situation again.
-Loki- wrote: Something's been bothering me about the Yan Huo and I just figured it out.
The thing is the size of a Gecko. But the Gecko is a 3STR TAG and the Yan Huo is a 2W HI. This really feels like the 40k monstrous creature/walker situation again.
Huh?
Gecko is a S6, Yan is a S5
The Gecko sucks for what it is (don't lie, it does, ive tried it a lot recently) and comparing it to proxying of Yans, Yans are super great. They have the really deadly weapons and better BS for about the same points. Their role is obvious and they are really good at what they do. The Gecko is just lost in what it is to do.
My wallet groans, strained with many recent expenditures, but opens just enough to allow this purchase. Can't wait to feel bad about myself when I flip through Angel's book.
.Mikes. wrote: Looks like I prompted it into existence. Note to self: only use this power for good.
Edit: Huh, wait a minute. Angel is saying in Facebook that preorder starts on February 2nd.
PRE-ORDER FEBRUARY 2nd
If this video-post reach 80.000 views, I'll give away a Painting Miniatures from A to Z Angel Giraldez Volume 1
You have to be follower this page
Share this video Emoticono wink
http://youtu.be/7g_s6q0068g
“If there is a date which is important to me is the October 24th of 2013. That day I decided to start a new stage in my career, a step up to become a better artist. This new goal was to release a painting book to show and teach my personal painting techniques applied to the Infinity models.”
In that moment Angel decided to start a new adventure. And now Corvus Belli is pleased to present you “Masterclass Vol.1”, the first painting book by Angel Giraldez.
Ángel has matured as an artist within Corvus Belli, and his tireless work has earned him a place among the foremost professional miniature painters in the world.
This manual describes, in meticulously detailed step-by-step tutorials accompanied by hundreds of full-color pictures, how Ángel applies his technique to some truly extraordinary Infinity pieces.
With the book, you could find an exclusive model that has been totally and re-designed and re-sculpted of the special character Joan of Arc. This model follows the new PanOceania design as featured in the “Infinity. Operation: Icestorm” Battle Pack.
Enjoy it!
-Preorder starts next monday February 2nd at our online store while stock lasts. Limited units.-
Ask your FLGS for availability of this book. Stocks are very limited.
I actually really love the loincloth going between and behind the legs like that. It really gives the mini a sense of motion and 3D-ness that you really don't see on other miniatures nowadays.
Well that presents a dilemma, got my O:I direct from CB since I wanted the gencon triple pack so discounters weren't a huge discount and I got it way earlier than most seemed to. This however looks to have no such incentive making discounters a tempting option, but all the horror stories of 'I didn't get my order as they didn't get enough stock' one hears from limited releases bought through such companies make me nervous. I mean just how popular are we expecting it to be?
Ignatius-Grulgor wrote: Well that presents a dilemma, got my O:I direct from CB since I wanted the gencon triple pack so discounters weren't a huge discount and I got it way earlier than most seemed to. This however looks to have no such incentive making discounters a tempting option, but all the horror stories of 'I didn't get my order as they didn't get enough stock' one hears from limited releases bought through such companies make me nervous. I mean just how popular are we expecting it to be?
I got my N3 from my discounter the day it was released, the O:I was just bad planning.
Also preordered my book
I am going to bet the full release Joan will have a more actiony pose
PsychoticStorm wrote: Because having a tabard is bad enough, it covers such great detail.
This is such a bad direction to go. I know Infinity models are famed for the detail they manage to squeeze in, but they were known for this for years. This new direction of 'show as much detail as possible' really detracts from the design of miniatures, leading to design problems like the now infamous rage-fist poses to show chest armour.
Yes, a back tabard would detract from the detail of the armour on the back, but the act of breaking up all those armour plates and tubes would improve the model massively. Not that its a bad model, IMO, just that I do agree that a back tabard would improve it a lot.
I really wish one day Haqqislam would get one of these awesome limited edition models. So far I've had no reason to spring for much more than book pre orders, and that's because I would have gotten those anyway and the pre order models have been faction agnostic.
Joan of Arc is female. Any cloth on the chest would block the boob-plate, and thus is a no-no for CB.
-Loki- wrote: I really wish one day Haqqislam would get one of these awesome limited edition models. So far I've had no reason to spring for much more than book pre orders, and that's because I would have gotten those anyway and the pre order models have been faction agnostic.
To be fair, the preorder miniatures and ITS-win models have usually been civvies, neutrals, and mercs up until this point. I think Joan really is the first faction-specific promo.
However, there was that $70 YuanYuan promo a while back that came bundled with some junk. In a way, that's a Haqqislam mini.
I am going to bet the full release Joan will have a more actiony pose
Not going to touch that. Nope
There's already concept art for the more actiony, full release Joan:
Spoiler:
Honestly, I just hope the regular release is as good as the limited, I have championed the virtues of the older models in the past, but this
just can't hold a candle to this
I want that model quite a lot, but not so much as to buy a $50 (after discounts!) art book. As for the pose, it's a little bit too Avengers poster Black Widow for my taste (and prime Hawkeye Initiative candidate), but it's still a really great figure
Absolutionis wrote: To be fair, the preorder miniatures and ITS-win models have usually been civvies, neutrals, and mercs up until this point. I think Joan really is the first faction-specific promo.
Of course you remember the Reverend Healer and Father Knight who can only be bought with a ~$100 set, and the Cosplay Bolt...
Absolutionis wrote: However, there was that $70 YuanYuan promo a while back that came bundled with some junk. In a way, that's a Haqqislam mini.
It was actually bundled with a really good foam bag from Battlefoam. But it's still a merc.
Seems like including any cloth on a power armored individual is a bit silly... I mean rip, rip shred tear, before the game ever starts. I guess at least it won't be stout enough to trip up the servo motors like it could unassisted legs.
Ugh for $55 it is tempting.
I thought it would retail closer to $100.
While I wanted her to go with the O:I PanO, I'm not really impressed with the exclusive Joan.
I was expecting something awesome, but the 2.0 (mobility armor) model is superior in character & pose.
However, this view shows the sword isn't as bad as I had initially thought.
I'm on the fence on preordering this one...
Albertorius wrote: That's... sad, really. But true. And then there's the combat high heels... and the tactical midriff.
I can't argue over the lack of tabard but the CHH (Combat High Heels) have been upgraded to CW (Combat Wedges) so maybe there is a slight improvement there.
And as for the "Tactical Midriff" I can buy it as she is meant to be hyper mobile she would need to be able to bend at the waist, and she has enough Ab Plates to deflect those pesky bullets with a good flex of her core body muscles.
Yeah I was gonna say this model is far from being chainmail bikini. I mean boob shaped armor is kind of ridiculous unless you're talking about some kind of cloth-thin form-fitting armor plates/material... but she's better than some.
The old mobility armor isn't bad, but I still favor this new one I think. If I got to play more, I may agree with the dynamic pose, but this newest iteration of JoA would look the best sitting on my painted minis shelf with the others.
GrimDork wrote: Seems like including any cloth on a power armored individual is a bit silly... I mean rip, rip shred tear, before the game ever starts. I guess at least it won't be stout enough to trip up the servo motors like it could unassisted legs.
That said... pretty model nonetheless!
I think its just the artistic prerogative .. if every miniature was made 100% with practicality/realism in mind, we would have some extremely boring sculpts!
Infinity is probably closer than most in that you can see the sculptors have really put thought into how something might work (the Penthesilea bike and rider is the perfect example of that)
Absolutionis wrote: Joan of Arc is female. Any cloth on the chest would block the boob-plate, and thus is a no-no for CB.
That's... sad, really. But true. And then there's the combat high heels... and the tactical midriff.
CB loves it's cheesecake, but most of those points are most certainly not true. All the PanO HI has that same "tactical midriff" of flexible plates, even the original ORC trooper, and not all of the knights have full tabards, the most recent example being the Father-Knight who only has a tabard from the belt down. Indeed, assuming all of the female ORC armor has tactical combat wedges and boob-plates (and the old ORC HMG/shotgun models had both) this new Joan model looks to be wearing new ORC armor modified to have a tabard on the front, a cut down left shoulder pad and a few crosses on the vambraces and chestplate, and no backpack.
In fact it's so close I wonder it it isn't going to be a base model for a new ORC HMG/Boarding Shotgun in the near future
It is the underlying fiber muscle that makes Powered Armour what it is, a form fitting fiber muscle suit that enhances the wearers strength and probably mobility, its not "armoured" because it would be impossible to move.
GrimDork wrote: Yeah I was gonna say this model is far from being chainmail bikini. I mean boob shaped armor is kind of ridiculous unless you're talking about some kind of cloth-thin form-fitting armor plates/material... but she's better than some.
The old mobility armor isn't bad, but I still favor this new one I think. If I got to play more, I may agree with the dynamic pose, but this newest iteration of JoA would look the best sitting on my painted minis shelf with the others.
Is the book going to only be about air brushing? I am very interested in the book but I worry it'll just be air brushing, air brushing and nothing but air brushing.
I always get mildly annoyed when a tutorial starts out listing paints, okay, then what spray to use, okay, then they whip out an airbrush, not okay, because I don't have an airbrush. :V
Oh... now I kind of want the book. I've got a top-shelf airbrush but bottom rung skills. Still... watching a bunch of youtubes would probably help just as much without tying up the monetary resources.... Hmm Hmm. Darn ,that puts me from not interested to potentially interested.. drat.
Yeah I started the thread because I saw several players talking how they only wanted one or the other, so I wanted to help centralize the search.
And yes Angel does do some brush work, ABs are awesome for most applications, but they still can not handle the super fine details such as eyes and such.
Angel has explicitly stated that you cannot paint a whole mini with only an airbrush. Of course he does brushwork, and all his step-by-steps have traditional brushwork as well.
Albertorius wrote: That's... sad, really. But true. And then there's the combat high heels... and the tactical midriff.
I can't argue over the lack of tabard but the CHH (Combat High Heels) have been upgraded to CW (Combat Wedges) so maybe there is a slight improvement there.
And as for the "Tactical Midriff" I can buy it as she is meant to be hyper mobile she would need to be able to bend at the waist, and she has enough Ab Plates to deflect those pesky bullets with a good flex of her core body muscles.
Ah, no, I was really talking more about the trend in Infinity female models more that in this specific case. I mean, the midriff in this case at least have myomers!
Absolutionis wrote: Joan of Arc is female. Any cloth on the chest would block the boob-plate, and thus is a no-no for CB.
That's... sad, really. But true. And then there's the combat high heels... and the tactical midriff.
CB loves it's cheesecake, but most of those points are most certainly not true. All the PanO HI has that same "tactical midriff" of flexible plates, even the original ORC trooper, and not all of the knights have full tabards, the most recent example being the Father-Knight who only has a tabard from the belt down. Indeed, assuming all of the female ORC armor has tactical combat wedges and boob-plates (and the old ORC HMG/shotgun models had both) this new Joan model looks to be wearing new ORC armor modified to have a tabard on the front, a cut down left shoulder pad and a few crosses on the vambraces and chestplate, and no backpack.
In fact it's so close I wonder it it isn't going to be a base model for a new ORC HMG/Boarding Shotgun in the near future
As I said, I was thinking about the other CB minis in that comment, but I guess I could have explained myself better.
I was answering to this:
Joan of Arc is female. Any cloth on the chest would block the boob-plate, and thus is a no-no for CB.
...and specifically, to the bolded part.
And even then, except for the tactical midriff, she got the boobplate and the CHH...
Um... not true. He uses traditional painting once he gets his base colors down.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
NuclearMessiah wrote: Yeah I started the thread because I saw several players talking how they only wanted one or the other, so I wanted to help centralize the search.
And yes Angel does do some brush work, ABs are awesome for most applications, but they still can not handle the super fine details such as eyes and such.
They also struggle to make sharp lines which is why he still needs to put in brush time, alot of it in fact.
Alpharius wrote: Arguing about combat heels and cheescake in Infinity seems...odd.
Arguing about it in the News and Rumors thread, when we have a nice selection of INFINITY Sub-Forums here on Dakka Dakka?
Not cool.
That's why I brought it around to talking about the armor itself and how close it is to female ORC armor. Seems highly possible to me that the digital Joan model is going to be the base for a digital ORC HMG/shotgun resculpt
Just look at his facbook guide. He explains what is highlighted, glazed, etc. The Ko Dali mini I recall specifically that the red 'technoflesh' parts and such were inked. Of course it's not all airbrushed.
Absolutionis wrote: Just look at his facbook guide. He explains what is highlighted, glazed, etc. The Ko Dali mini I recall specifically that the red 'technoflesh' parts and such were inked. Of course it's not all airbrushed.
For the Kun Rider step by step that was on BoW, he airbrushed the bike to get the smooth nmm look, the rider was entirely painted with a normal brush.
Seems that the book is sold out of Warstore and Miniatures Market. Can no longer find the listings on those sites. Firestorm Games explicitly states it's out of stock. Wayland Games has it still, it seems.
Element Games are now also saying 'out of stock' so looks like their allocation has gone as well.
I have to say though.. I just can't believe that, if this sells out as quickly as it looks like it has, that this book will never get a re-print.
I don't work in publishing, but I can't imagine that repeat runs would be anything like the cost of an original, considering the work and costs that have gone into making the book in the first place? Someone who does know might want to correct me on that.
You're going to get a lot of non-Infinity players getting this book, Angel's work has reached across the wargaming industry, to the point where you have to say most 'serious' hobbyists and modellers/painters are aware of his work. You would have to think more than 2000 customers globally!
Pacific wrote: Element Games are now also saying 'out of stock' so looks like their allocation has gone as well.
I have to say though.. I just can't believe that, if this sells out as quickly as it looks like it has, that this book will never get a re-print.
I don't work in publishing, but I can't imagine that repeat runs would be anything like the cost of an original, considering the work and costs that have gone into making the book in the first place? Someone who does know might want to correct me on that.
You're going to get a lot of non-Infinity players getting this book, Angel's work has reached across the wargaming industry, to the point where you have to say most 'serious' hobbyists and modellers/painters are aware of his work. You would have to think more than 2000 customers globally!
It's easy to say that, but it might not have sold that well if it wasn't limited edition.
Absolutionis wrote: Seems that the book is sold out of Warstore and Miniatures Market. Can no longer find the listings on those sites. Firestorm Games explicitly states it's out of stock. Wayland Games has it still, it seems.
Yikes!
I couldn't find it on Miniature Market so I went ahead and ordered it via The Warstore.
Pacific wrote: Element Games are now also saying 'out of stock' so looks like their allocation has gone as well.
I have to say though.. I just can't believe that, if this sells out as quickly as it looks like it has, that this book will never get a re-print.
I don't work in publishing, but I can't imagine that repeat runs would be anything like the cost of an original, considering the work and costs that have gone into making the book in the first place? Someone who does know might want to correct me on that.
You're going to get a lot of non-Infinity players getting this book, Angel's work has reached across the wargaming industry, to the point where you have to say most 'serious' hobbyists and modellers/painters are aware of his work. You would have to think more than 2000 customers globally!
Correct. I work for a printing company. It's a completely production ready item that is simply fed to a printer that can print on the stock needed to the quality needed, then get it bound to printed covers. The costs are all in the production side. It's a very easy thing to send through a second print run from a design/IT perspective.
However, as said, the consideration might not be cost of the print run. The fact that it's limited edition, and has an equally limited edition miniature, will have been huge selling points, particularly to people buying it with the intention of reselling for profit, at least the book if they bought it for the miniature. Once a second run is done, it's no longer limited edition, and might not sell as well, and the miniature won't be there either.
Miniature Market never posted it, but the retailers could have took it down since it was not suppose to go on order till the 2nd, so I would check around again then.
This is what happens when I don't check this thread for a few days. I preorder all of my stuff through Warstore, was very disappointed to see it was already sold out. I guess I'll have to try to go through the CB page on the 2nd...
I thought he used an airbrush and normal brush on everything but primarily an airbrush. But if you mean he uses an airbrush on every model then yeah thats true. So the book may be pointless for anyone without one.
Edit: others have already said this, should have read the whole thread before replying.
1) Angel posted "The book will be available for preorder on Monday, but ask CB/Vallejo for details" on FB last week
2) Monday: Nothing happens, I blame Spain time™
3) On Thursday The Warstore puts it up for preorder, other stores (slowly) follow.
4) The "pre-order before the 30th" image pops up, lots of gnashing teeth about having only 3 days to get it.
5) Not all stores, especially not the CB store and few non-US/UK stores, EU forum members get a bit anxious and demand answers about store allocations and stuff.
6) Koni comes in, says that pre-order date is February 2. Later (?) clears up that the image was just for retailers because THEY have to order before February.
That's the timeline, roughly.
If you haven't managed to get a copy from those "sold out before the real pre-order date" stores, F5 the CB store next Monday. Stores get an amount of copies relative to their size and are not allowed to offer more, as they won't GET more. Another smooth and totally not confusing Infinity product launch At least I got my copy unless the store screwed up.
But it is not really an Infinity product launch. This thing is pure Angel Giraldez. Self financed (very risky taking a bank loan out in Spain these days too.) etc. Very much a one man show.
It is sold out at Warstore. I do not think Miniature Market ever offered it for sale. I hope he sells all 5500 copies via pre-order.
I watched the quantity at the store I was going to order from run down to 0. Nice book, but I decided it wasn't the best purchase for me. My brother got one, so I'll be able to peruse the book and see the Jaon model anyway.
Next monday February 2nd the Angel Giraldez Masterclass book will become available to preorder at our online store at 12:30 PM (CET) http://infinitythegame.com/store/articulo.php?f=1&o=3&id=2378 Limited to 3 units per customer. Very limited units.
Next monday February 2nd the Angel Giraldez Masterclass book will become available to preorder at our online store at 12:30 PM (CET) http://infinitythegame.com/store/articulo.php?f=1&o=3&id=2378 Limited to 3 units per customer. Very limited units.
Thanks for the info ! Does that mean half past noon, Spanish time ?
-Loki- wrote: I watched the quantity at the store I was going to order from run down to 0. Nice book, but I decided it wasn't the best purchase for me. My brother got one, so I'll be able to peruse the book and see the Jaon model anyway.
Were you watching The Combat Company Countdown as well?
@REdHarvest: I believe Angel financed the book himself with savings.
He stated he didn't want to do it through CB or others because he wanted to pay for everything himself, and that was why he it was going to be limited in numbers.
All this came from his own pockets, and seems to be why he's doing a lot of the work at the actual printing house, himself. He's been posting pictures of doing work on the book at the printing house.
Teucer, at last comment on him, was indefinitely postponed due to production issues...as much as I would like to see him.
Remember that there are a few more characters coming for Steel Phalanx. IIRC one was "Charibdyss" and they were mentioned to be a really big Hacker for the SP.
Teucer, at last comment on him, was indefinitely postponed due to production issues...as much as I would like to see him.
Remember that there are a few more characters coming for Steel Phalanx. IIRC one was "Charibdyss" and they were mentioned to be a really big Hacker for the SP.
Yeah, but so were the Alguaciles until the last Mayacast episode, and they're apparantly out next month. But I didn't realise there was more stuff for SP, so it could be them. It's definitely Aleph at least
To be fair, there was a similar situation to the Alguaciles/Teucer with the Ekdromoi character "Diomedes".
He would get listed as a release for a specific month, they would say production issues prevented it--then several months later for the second(and third) time Corvus Belli would say the same statement but different issues prevented it again.
I'll believe that the Alguaciles SWC box is out when it's out.
-Loki- wrote: I watched the quantity at the store I was going to order from run down to 0. Nice book, but I decided it wasn't the best purchase for me. My brother got one, so I'll be able to peruse the book and see the Jaon model anyway.
Were you watching The Combat Company Countdown as well?
yep.
As an aside, I got an email from my FLGS where I first enquires about the book that they've reserved a copy for me.
[MOD EDIT - Dakka Dakka in no way supports or condones piracy. - Alpharius]
Edit:
Oh FFS, I didn't post any links or contact info or even names of any recasters, that "piracy" edit is BS! That "mod edit" deleted my entire point about this book being artificially limited by Angel who supposedly wants to self-publish and self-finance the book, but refuses to expand production even to meet pre-demand of a book that has yet to officially go up for PRE-order, but is (and has been) using CB and BoW and the Infinity community to hype this book since Gencon.
My point was: this is a bad thing for CB, to be so closely tied to a product they allow themselves to have no control over. CB have made an official model for this book, they are actively advertising for this book (it's every other Facebook update on CBs main page!) but they are letting Angel dictate all the terms and allowing him to refuse to let them help him meet demand. I would think that bears some discussion since it's the only thing coming out of CB right now...especially as it's not actually coming out of CB right now. This isn't just being advertised as an artbook, it's being advertised as an artbook for Infinity, with a model for infinity. You already have people buying a book they don't want to get a mini they do, and people buying a book they DO want for a mini they don't while even more people can't get either based on a rough guess at numbers made by an artist over 6 months ago.
My single sentence re piracy was mostly to emphasize: THIS. IS. RIDICULOUS.
adhuin wrote: It's just a Book with pretty pictures and an Alt-sculpt for existing miniature. No one needs either of them.
While I agree it's a first world issue, Kalamadea has a point that I have felt since the beginning. I am a serious painter and have wanted this book for my shelf since it was announced and I have loathed the fact that the model given away as a promo is a special limited run. Heck I hate that the book is limited as it creates an artificial collectors market. While I normally can live with collectables being bought up and traded and unreasonably hard to acquire, I really HATE when educational and informational texts get such treatment. In an age of kick starter there really is no excuse IMO. He could have crowd funded his book and made enough copies to meet demand, and if he really wanted to give away promos he could have made them optional stretch goal add ons. No idea why someone with his exposure wouldn't take such a route.
Before this goes on anymore, I think it is time we take the Art Book discussion down to the sub forums. We are all well aware that it is sold out everywhere and there isn't much to add and besides a dedicated thread to post who has copies would be beneficial.
I will add my 2¢ about the number of copies. Although CB would have been happy to help Angel asked them not to, why, well that is between Angel and CB. CB advertises the book and made the model it would seem as a huge thank you to Angel, if it was not for his work Infinity wouldn't have got half the recognition it has. You know that is the cool thing about CB, they support those that have helped them grow or gain recognition. Angel is one notable example, Tabitha Stevens (Artyflakes) they still make her Bolt model and she sells it exclusively from her store, hell they even made a model for Magnos an exclusive WARCOR model.
My point is CB is a business yes, but they are a business run by miniature gamers, not businessmen and they will do what they feel is right and look out for their community and those that support them, not what will make them the most $$$, go check out GW if you want to see how that works out.
So anyways if we want to keep debating on the merits of CB business model we can do so in the Infinity General Discussion board.
Sooo... any speculation on the second Feb (or March or whenever, I have a bit of temporal distortion in my head right now) mysterious blister? (the first one is probably Teucer or a Corvustroll (tm) Dactyl/Acmon)
My guess is Yu Jing will rest this time so something PanO?
aldo wrote: Sooo... any speculation on the second Feb (or March or whenever, I have a bit of temporal distortion in my head right now) mysterious blister? (the first one is probably Teucer or a Corvustroll (tm) Dactyl/Acmon)
My guess is Yu Jing will rest this time so something PanO?
I wonder how many of the new units in N3 will be out before AF?
Seems no rush for USAriadna units or new CA because they're the main feature in upcoming sectorials.
I wouldn't expect Acheron Falls stuff outside of Aleph or Tohaa for a while. N3 introduced new units that need models, plus the backlog of existing units without models, plus CBs resculpt habit. But we'll undoubtedly see Acheron Falls units before the book but much closer to release, since they did that for both Human Sphere and Paradiso.
-Loki- wrote: I wouldn't expect Acheron Falls stuff outside of Aleph or Tohaa for a while. N3 introduced new units that need models, plus the backlog of existing units without models, plus CBs resculpt habit. But we'll undoubtedly see Acheron Falls units before the book but much closer to release, since they did that for both Human Sphere and Paradiso.
Yeah I think the only Acheron Falls stuff we'll see soonish is things like the Grunts and Hardcases, stuff in the core rulebook that will be in Acheron Falls sectorials (Grenzers, Yan Huo, Batroids etc). Stuff we already have rules for basically.
aldo wrote: Sooo... any speculation on the second Feb (or March or whenever, I have a bit of temporal distortion in my head right now) mysterious blister? (the first one is probably Teucer or a Corvustroll (tm) Dactyl/Acmon)
My guess is Yu Jing will rest this time so something PanO?
Possibly the regular re-sculpt of Jeanne D'Arc, given that they already have the LE version ready to go. The regular release is supposedly the same body, but different arms (and maybe head?) I'd like to see something for Acontecimento, but <shrug> Vamos a ver.
aldo wrote: A Stephen Rao that wasn't wearing Bolt armour would be great.
He's not wearing Bolt armor.
He's wearing Bagh-Mari armor. The Medium Infantry for PanOceania have used interchangeable armor pieces on the models since...well, forever. The only real difference has been helmets.
aldo wrote: A Stephen Rao that wasn't wearing Bolt armour would be great.
He's not wearing Bolt armor.
He's wearing Bagh-Mari armor. The Medium Infantry for PanOceania have used interchangeable armor pieces on the models since...well, forever. The only real difference has been helmets.
*looks at BM*
*looks at Rao*
*looks back at BM*
*looks at Rao*
Suuure, if you say so...
Yes, I know he is wearing BM armour but being a relatively recent sculpt and the scale changes when he is side to side with a BM he looks rather different.
-Loki- wrote: I wouldn't expect Acheron Falls stuff outside of Aleph or Tohaa for a while. N3 introduced new units that need models, plus the backlog of existing units without models, plus CBs resculpt habit. But we'll undoubtedly see Acheron Falls units before the book but much closer to release, since they did that for both Human Sphere and Paradiso.
Yeah I think the only Acheron Falls stuff we'll see soonish is things like the Grunts and Hardcases, stuff in the core rulebook that will be in Acheron Falls sectorials (Grenzers, Yan Huo, Batroids etc). Stuff we already have rules for basically.
The units in N3 that are planned for upcoming sectorials in Acheron Falls shouldn't be classed as Acheron Falls pre-releases. They're N3 units, because their profiles and fluff are all there. Acheron Falls will just change their AVA and potentially make them linkable.
What I meant about Acheron Falls units before the book is how we got, say, Odalisques before Human Sphere released, and the Odalisque Haris profile and rules before Paradiso. Just like the Tohaa Kotail, Nikaul, Rasail, etc are Acheron Falls units which we have gotten early (though I'd guess this is because they made the choice to release AC after N3 and if they don't give Tohaa early releases they'll be getting nothing for over a year).
*looks at BM*
*looks at Rao*
*looks back at BM*
*looks at Rao*
Suuure, if you say so...
Yes, I know he is wearing BM armour but being a relatively recent sculpt and the scale changes when he is side to side with a BM he looks rather different.
That's been in line with all the other PanO resculpts, it's been quite a while since we got a Bagh Mari unit. Just compare the new Akalis to old, the new ORC to the old, the Nisses, the Fusiliers, all of them are changing styles slightly (and sometimes not so slightly). Rao armor doesn't look like Bolt armor at all to me, he has the same chestplate but his neckpiece has the gasmask filters that the Bolts do not have on their necks. His shoulderpads and forearm guards are different from the bolts, the thigh armor is different (more in line with the Akalis thigh armor). Kneepads are different, shins are the same but the pad on top of the foot is different too. There's more that's different than merely the helmets. I like it, makes them look unified on the table but more interesting to paint when you really stick your face in there. I can't wait for more resculpts, I've got my old Bagh Mari on my painting table and while the figure itself is still fairly decent, those old PanO combi rifles are ghastly things.
Went to preorder from CB the paint book. Kept hitting F5, shows up to preorder.....then their server fails . Well saved a bundle since shipping was as much as the book .
Chrysis wrote: I can view the webstore no problems, but if I hit pre-order it doesn't add it to the cart.
Ditto. That's kind of annoying. The rest of the website works nicely.
I had the same thing, opened in IE and surprise surprise, the pre-order button is gone and the book is labelled 'No stock', shoot, and I was, what, an hour late?
Yeah, I was refreshing the site to no avail. Not to be a wet blanket, but with such a demand for this book, release could have been handled a lot better.
I would still keep an eye out on some FLGS' pages today, MM never posted it up for preorder when other retailers did, they may be waiting on an accurate stock number before posting, and they have been historically slow to post preorders in the past.
New Bagh-Mari would be nice, but I doubt that is the mystery blister this month. The difference between the B-Msniper, the B-M Combi rifle from the ASA starter and RAO is quite pronounced.
Part of the design philosophy behind the Pan-O look is uniformity, at least according to Bostria, so similarity in look for the Bolts, the Nisse and the Bagh-Mari is expected ( and means I can readily proxy Tabitha Bolt as a Bagh-Mari ). You want variety; you play 'Mads.
Baalirock wrote: Not to be a wet blanket, but with such a demand for this book, release could have been handled a lot better.
A guy seemingly self funded an artbook that has been his passion and has been a personal labour of love.
The company he works for helped him out with providing an alternate sculpt to help sell/promote his book.
Unsure of the demand he sets what he believes to be an achievable sales goal and hopes people like his book enough not to end up out of pocket.
Due to the quality of his work and/or spiffiness of alternate model the first run of the book is totally sold out in a matter of minutes with people still clamouring for more.
As far as I am concerned that is a great result for Angel, and while sucky for the individuals who couldn't get one (and I may be jinxing my own order) it shows that there is a nice market for his work which is a good result for us. As it means the likelihood of a second book coming sooner rather than later (or not at all) is increased.
With a bit of review I would like to see another run done, with or without the model, and let people get their hands on it that way. But I am not going to harsh on the success by expecting an answer about it right now.
I am very disappointed that I was unable to pre-order a copy, despite sitting on the website and refreshing every minute. They even announced on their FB page that it sold out in 30 seconds.
The pre-order button wasn't working, the site crashed, etc etc. I don't blame people for getting irritated. I especially was hoping to get the model at the very least, and now it'll pop up on ebay etc for an absurd price.
Pretty much as soon as he posted that the site started crashing. Obviously lots of people eager for a copy.
Hope they end up releasing a digital version of some kind. Minimal extra cost of angel and allows anyone to get hold of it.
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Ranor wrote: I am very disappointed that I was unable to pre-order a copy, despite sitting on the website and refreshing every minute. They even announced on their FB page that it sold out in 30 seconds.
The pre-order button wasn't working, the site crashed, etc etc. I don't blame people for getting irritated. I especially was hoping to get the model at the very least, and now it'll pop up on ebay etc for an absurd price.
I have to be honest I don't care that much about the model. It was the book I wanted.
this is the reason many have left GW for infinity. Lots of Limited run product that is truely wanted by the consumer, who now either pays out the rear for a copy on ebay, or say Feth it all and leaves. i'm leaning towards option 2 as i'm nowhere near as bought into infinity as I was GW.
It really has soured me on Infinity now, yeah. Was already kinda sour when N3 came out and I saw the price tag. Really feels like they're taking lessons from GW right now and that's not something the community needs to support.
I still cannot fathom why this wasn't run as a kickstarter. People keep using his personal risk as an excuse here when crowdfunding literally shields the up and coming artist from exactly that. It annoys me because kickstarter was intended for something just like this, yet CMON, a company in no need of crowd funding continues to use that avenue over and over... There was seriously no need for this to be so limited, but people will continue to act like it was a selfless labor of passion, I mean purely as a cold calculated business move it even makes less sense. Oh well I really hope those demanding a copy eventually get theirs.
Red Corsair wrote: I still cannot fathom why this wasn't run as a kickstarter. People keep using his personal risk as an excuse here when crowdfunding literally shields the up and coming artist from exactly that. It annoys me because kickstarter was intended for something just like this, yet CMON, a company in no need of crowd funding continues to use that avenue over and over... There was seriously no need for this to be so limited, but people will continue to act like it was a selfless labor of passion, I mean purely as a cold calculated business move it even makes less sense. Oh well I really hope those demanding a copy eventually get theirs.
Not to mention that he didn't really do it "all by himself" as he had a lot of help from CB and Beasts of War in promoting it. But yeah, like you said there was really no need for him to put himself at risk in the first place, and I imagine CB would be more than willing to help with a second run, but so far all I've heard is that there's a (stubborn) refusal to do that and this strictly limited batch will be it.
Sidstyler wrote: Was already kinda sour when N3 came out and I saw the price tag.
Price tag?
You mean nowt?
I mean, I'm quite happy to read GW bashing threads as much as much as the next person, but every company that charges money for a sci-fi miniatures game is not GW.
Sidstyler wrote: Was already kinda sour when N3 came out and I saw the price tag.
Price tag?
You mean nowt?
I mean, I'm quite happy to read GW bashing threads as much as much as the next person, but every company that charges money for a sci-fi miniatures game is not GW.
The price of "nowt" only applies if you want just the rules and have no interest in the background material.
To all of you who are complaining about the limited run and it being handled badly by a big company, do you even know what your talking about? I did not get a chance to get the book and I would have really liked the painting tips as I could, really really use any help I can get learning to paint but at the same time I am aware of the circumstances. This is not per say an Infinity product. CB did not handle this badly. Angel took it upon him self to fulfill a dream he had and CB helped him. Kudos to CB for helping him. He only had so much money and had to take a calculated risk. So he released a limited run with the money he had. Can you complain about it? Yes. Does that make you ungrateful? Possibly (depending on reason).
I never said it was not a valid point, but how many people buy into a game just for the models or the gameplay mechanics?
Plus it's worth mentioning, at least in my case, that I have no interest in continually carrying my tablet with me just so that I can have the PDFs on hand.
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ClockworkChaos wrote: To all of you who are complaining about the limited run and it being handled badly by a big company, do you even know what your talking about? I did not get a chance to get the book and I would have really liked the painting tips as I could, really really use any help I can get learning to paint but at the same time I am aware of the circumstances.
Custompeeple still has their books to sell. Their website crashed so nobody has been able to buy from them.
This is not per say an Infinity product. CB did not handle this badly. Angel took it upon him self to fulfill a dream he had and CB helped him. Kudos to CB for helping him. He only had so much money and had to take a calculated risk. So he released a limited run with the money he had. Can you complain about it? Yes. Does that make you ungrateful? Possibly (depending on reason).
Nobody is complaining specifically about the fact that this was "a limited run".
They're complaining about:
1) Yet another "Limited Edition"(really just an alternate sculpt) model--which necessitated design and production time on Corvus Belli's part, which they just don't have any justification for that to happen. They still have load-outs from the N2 book(now N3) to release, and entire ranges that need to be brought up to snuff.
2) The book sold out in 30 seconds according to Corvus Belli. Whether all the sales went to customers or not is unknown; but they had it at "Limit 3 per customer"--and with how much advertising they did about the fact that it included a limited edition model--the likelihood of all the sales going to customers rather than eBay vultures is not looking good.
3) Corvus Belli reportedly spent a good deal of money upgrading their website--and yet it still went down.
To those asking why he didnt do a kickstarter....I thought the EU couldnt use kickstarter?
did that change recently?
I also think people are not seeing it from his perspective. It was just a passion project to make the book and he thought he could afford/ and would like to sel X amount of books.
He isnt a company trying to make a product he will sell forever. Just a one off like...art?
This isn't a CB thing, this is an Angel thing. He limited the number as he has very tight finances and would probably have only been able to get a bank loan for a certain amount to help fund the project, which he wanted to do by himself.
Now he's done it and it's a huge success. Doesn't mean that there won't be a reprint, And the miniature is only limited by the pose alone. It won't be a limited miniature you will want to play and can't buy else where.
People, seriously, I know it sucks not being able to get a copy (I might not be able to get one, depending on the retailer I ordered mine through and how many copies they get in), but blaming CB for all of this and saying it's making you want to throw in the game... come on, be real.
Not the end of the world folks, just a book and a miniature, of which you'll likely to be able to get a reprint and a vesion of the same miniature, just in a different pose and with no limit on the number able to be purchased.
You probably have no idea how much of a risk Angel put himself at publishing this himself. Do you have any idea how volatile the economic situation is in Spain at the moment? If it had sold poorly, he would have likely been smashed for some years to come, and with a large debt burden to get rid of. Not easy, even if you're an amazing painter such as himself.
Not everything is going to be about what you want and how much someone can service that desire for you. Let's just take a step back and see that going overboard on the hyperbole isn't helping anyone here.
I do realise that their website isn't likely to be upgraded to handle one day's worth of hammering from a bunch of guys F5'ing it until the book goes up for sale and thus causes a server meltdown for a book which isn't a core requirement of their game, but only listed as a kind gesture to the guy who make their miniatures look really pretty.
Yeah, I think I see what the real problem is...
As for it not being reprinted, eh, it's an art book when all is said and done. Won't stop you playing with the miniatures or the game system.
Awesome. This isn't N3 though. It's Angel's "how to" book. And it's very unlikely they would have upgraded it further to just see that this one day was taken care of.
Be real , you keep saying this was Angels project, and has no reflection on CB, but let's get real with our imaginary toys.
1. Angel is CB's painter, they might use others, but I haven't seen many except the ones angel in "mentoring". He is their house painter.
2. The alternate figure they made is metal, though that's all they do, it's still not reasonable to make 5-6000 of them and then retire a mold.
3. The model is great and I personally wanted the model more than the book. Though having the book was still a priority for me.
4. It was not sold on Angels website, it was sold on the CB website. While probably to get it more exposure, it's their partner and they get to share the hype/negativity.
5. It is going out through CB distributors. We haven't seen how this will work out yet, but hopefully better than N3.
Am I over reacting? Maybe, but like I said a lot of people have given up on GW for the exact same reasons. Limited supply and poor handling of releases are things that could burn CB with many of the new player base they just grabbed from GW. I don't do tournaments so my only recourse is to try and buy on eBay and pay four times the price, or not have a model that I want, or (do the things the MODS don't approve of being discussed).
Either way you look at it its operation:icestorm and N3 all over again. I understand they have no clue as to how much they have grown, but still they have the numbers showing how well those sold and should be able to better estimate future demand.
As for the smart aleck comments about "do you know what your talking about?" I've been an operations manager in fortune five company, responsible for ordering product in multimillion dollar businesses and have almost always (except for during hurricane Katrina when supplies were redirected) kept above a 97% in stock rating while still managing my bottom line and controlling excess inventory. So yes! I do know what I'm talking about. (Also managed two comic and game stores right after I graduated high school, so I have knowledge in the gaming industry as well).
I agree with the comment that this type of situation is exactly why Kickstarter exists and should have been used. If he didn't know the demand, the KS would have told him at little to no financial risk to himself instead of
1) Guessing.
2) Allowing scalpers to horde 3 per order
3) Running out in 30 seconds.
Theophony wrote: Be real , you keep saying this was Angels project, and has no reflection on CB, but let's get real with our imaginary toys.
1. Angel is CB's painter, they might use others, but I haven't seen many except the ones angel in "mentoring". He is their house painter.
2. The alternate figure they made is metal, though that's all they do, it's still not reasonable to make 5-6000 of them and then retire a mold.
3. The model is great and I personally wanted the model more than the book. Though having the book was still a priority for me.
4. It was not sold on Angels website, it was sold on the CB website. While probably to get it more exposure, it's their partner and they get to share the hype/negativity.
5. It is going out through CB distributors. We haven't seen how this will work out yet, but hopefully better than N3.
Am I over reacting? Maybe, but like I said a lot of people have given up on GW for the exact same reasons. Limited supply and poor handling of releases are things that could burn CB with many of the new player base they just grabbed from GW. I don't do tournaments so my only recourse is to try and buy on eBay and pay four times the price, or not have a model that I want, or (do the things the MODS don't approve of being discussed).
Either way you look at it its operation:icestorm and N3 all over again. I understand they have no clue as to how much they have grown, but still they have the numbers showing how well those sold and should be able to better estimate future demand.
As for the smart aleck comments about "do you know what your talking about?" I've been an operations manager in fortune five company, responsible for ordering product in multimillion dollar businesses and have almost always (except for during hurricane Katrina when supplies were redirected) kept above a 97% in stock rating while still managing my bottom line and controlling excess inventory. So yes! I do know what I'm talking about. (Also managed two comic and game stores right after I graduated high school, so I have knowledge in the gaming industry as well).
He used CB's shopping system as it would clearly be silly to set up a full merchant system on his own blog just for this.
Pre orders have been available through the infinity distributors and stockists for a while, wayland in the UK had them up for 4 days before selling their quota, warstore in the US was 3 days I think.
It isnt like this was suddenly changed into a limited release, he said, in October, 5000 only, which is likely all he could realistically afford to fund without going into the realms of succeed or bankruptcy, because that would be foolish.
I get people are disappointed, but realistically this is nothing to do with infinity the game (it is neither produced by nor required for the game) and we already know the new Joan will released as a normal in game mini soon anyway.
I'm hoping for a DVD at some point. Painting Buddha to produce and distribute would be perfect.
Theophony wrote: Be real , you keep saying this was Angels project, and has no reflection on CB, but let's get real with our imaginary toys.
1. Angel is CB's painter, they might use others, but I haven't seen many except the ones angel in "mentoring". He is their house painter. 2. The alternate figure they made is metal, though that's all they do, it's still not reasonable to make 5-6000 of them and then retire a mold. 3. The model is great and I personally wanted the model more than the book. Though having the book was still a priority for me. 4. It was not sold on Angels website, it was sold on the CB website. While probably to get it more exposure, it's their partner and they get to share the hype/negativity. 5. It is going out through CB distributors. We haven't seen how this will work out yet, but hopefully better than N3.
Lets discuss these points.
1. It was self funded by Angel, as mentioned several times already that he got a bank loan to fund it. It was a personal project done in his personal time. It's no more CB's product than a program I write at home would be the property of my company, even if it's a program that is made for the industry I work in. 2. It's not like they haven't done a limited edition model for a product they didn't make before. The Limited Edition Yuan Yuan had only 750 models made for the first 750 Battlefoam Alpha bags. While it was a licensed product, it wasn't Corvus Bellis product, it was Battlefoams. 3. That's a personal reason to be upset, it's nothing to do with it being Angel or CBs product. And as for not being able to get it reflecting badly on CB, refer to point 2. Plenty of Qapu Khalki players wanted that model. It happens. 4 and 5. It's a worldwide distribution by a person that already has a full time job. Corvus Belli offered to distribute it for him because they have the channels to get it to the people who he wanted it to get to - the Infinity playerbase.
The reason Corvus Bellis name is on the cover is because they handled distribution, and Infinity is on there I assume because they let him use their miniatures and custom miniatures based on their universe in the book. Just like Vallejos name is on the cover because he exclusively paints with their products. That doesn't mean it was partly Vallejos product as well or that we should be crucifying Vallejo now that only 5500 people will know his secrets to using their paints.
Well feth that sucks all the way around. As for personal reasons to be upset does it really matter why people are upset when they seem to be in the majority. Not really
Wow, I've not been frequenting the official forums recently, but if hell is breaking loose like that in here, I can only guess, what's going on over there.
The amount of nerdrage is frankly disturbing.
I do partly agree with both sides.
Not all of CBs recent decisions made me 100% happy.
Icestorm ran into some trouble, but imho that was to be expected if you take into consideration the massive growth CB has had recently. I'd say things didn't work perfectly there, but stuff got where it was needed with a delay that's acceptable unless you're waiting for "ya preciousssss".
N3 is far from a disaster for me, I really enjoy it, even though I would have preferred a more unified approach. Then again I do understand the strategy, while not approving of it. So my judgement would be "not perfect" again.
A-Z being limited to 5000 units is a bummer for eager customers, but reasonable for a private investor. Will it suck if I don't get one straight away? Yes! Will I be ok? Yes, and sooner or later I will have the book anyway and Joan will be released as a regular model as well.
I don't expect CB to pay Angel anything close to a five digit salary. The guy is basically working from his basement on this project. Cut him some slack.
With the massive request for this project, he would absolutely crazy if he didn't go into reproduction straight away. Come on, why would he pass on making the community and his bank account happy at the same time?
So bear with him, wait a freaking month or two and the world will be ok again.
The GW comparisons are silly if you ask me. CB has made some questionable decisions recently, but they didn't treat their customers even remotely like GW has done for years.
Baiyuan wrote: ...
A-Z being limited to 5000 units is a bummer for eager customers, but reasonable for a private investor. Will it suck if I don't get one straight away? Yes! Will I be ok? Yes, and sooner or later I will have the book anyway and Joan will be released as a regular model as well.
I don't expect CB to pay Angel anything close to a five digit salary. The guy is basically working from his basement on this project. Cut him some slack.
With the massive request for this project, he would absolutely crazy if he didn't go into reproduction straight away. Come on, why would he pass on making the community and his bank account happy at the same time? So bear with him, wait a freaking month or two and the world will be ok again....
Not to be overly quarrelsome, but... what makes you so certain "sooner or later I will have the book anyway"? It seems, protestations to the contrary by Angel, you've already determined that he will be doing follow up printings. Why?
The word here seems to be that this is it, with no planned reprinting. If you have information to the contrary, I'm certain we would like to hear it and your source for said information.
Buzzsaw wrote: Not to be overly quarrelsome, but... what makes you so certain "sooner or later I will have the book anyway"? It seems, protestations to the contrary by Angel, you've already determined that he will be doing follow up printings. Why?
The word here seems to be that this is it, with no planned reprinting. If you have information to the contrary, I'm certain we would like to hear it and your source for said information.
That's alright, mate. You don't come across quarrelsome at all.
Of course I don't have any actual insider info on the topic. So naturally my anticipation of a second production run might turn out to never happen.
What I meant to say though is that I can absolutely not imagine any reason for Angel not to follow up on the success. Seriously, why wouldn't he?
CB has been (over)using the "limited - never to be seen again" preorder incentive on every big release since Paradiso (Was there one before it? I don't recall.)
IIRC (and it's been a while, so correct me) Carlos Llauger has been saying stuff on BOW like "when it's gone, that's it" and people were led to believe Icestorm would limited to a couple thousand units.
In parts AG is using the same incentive, while having an actual reason to limit the number of units and that is to protect his neck financially.
The reason I am so convinced we will see reprints is linked to the question why AG is releasing the book in the first place:
option #1
He wants to show people what a great technique he has developed and how they can try to adapt it. If so, why would he want a very limited audience to enjoy it? Doesn't make sense.
option #2
Like option #1 plus he doesn't mind making some money at the same time. Even more obvious. There are people lining up, begging him to take their money.
Maybe I'm missing something here, but they would be out of their minds to intentionally piss off all their customers in excess of the fastest 5000 and to turn down money they just have to allow people to throw at them.
That's why I think people are getting overexcited. AG/CB will come around, even if they are still sticking to their limited nonsense for the moment.
I've said this before, and it's just spitballing, but we, and CB/AG don't know how much of the quick sell out was due to it being limited edition. If it was unlimited, who knows if it would've still sold as quick.
DoomOnYou72 wrote: Well feth that sucks all the way around. As for personal reasons to be upset does it really matter why people are upset when they seem to be in the majority. Not really
In the majority? If everyone who pre-ordered and is quite happy posted I don't think that would remotely be the case. I pre-ordered through my FLGS and am happy. I suspect that is true of many others who haven't posted on the issue. Several thousand infact.
Even if I hadn't landed one however, I still wouldn't be raging about the way it's been handled. CB aren't a huge company - Angel is just one guy who is clearly trying to deliver a previously untried product and it seems demand has been underestimated by a thousand or so, perhaps more. If I had to wait and hope for another print run I'd do so without the histrionics seen in some quarters round here.
ImAGeek wrote: I've said this before, and it's just spitballing, but we, and CB/AG don't know how much of the quick sell out was due to it being limited edition. If it was unlimited, who knows if it would've still sold as quick.
Or how much of it was due to the Joan of Arc sculpt. This is the danger in putting in a limited edition sculpt, you'll get a lot of people buying it for that and on-selling the book.
They could order a second run of 5,000 copies without the miniature, and due to the non-limited nature and lack of miniature, it could languish in a warehouse.
Customeeple's site will be back online past at 18:00CET due to "longer than expected" difficulties and supposedly they'll announce on Facebook when the book is available:
https://www.facebook.com/Customeeple
Giraldez himself has been advertising this company on Facebook as they make custom bases for him. I'd assume their book allocation isn't negligible.
Considering how the demand vastly outstripped the supply, I hope Angel and CB will reconsider their stance on only doing one printing of the book and model.
Darkjim wrote: CB aren't a huge company - Angel is just one guy who is clearly trying to deliver a previously untried product and it seems demand has been underestimated by a thousand or so, perhaps more.
I think this is their biggest problem right now. They see the growth in their sales but they're underestimating the potential growth on products people are waiting for.
There were a lot of people waiting for them to make a 2 player starter. They likely largely underestimated this with Icestorm, which is why the pre order outsold the initial print run and caused all hell with their production capacity for months.
There were a lot of people eager to try the game but wanted a cleaner ruleset. These people, and others who play the game already, were upset by the way N3 was handled and this can be seen by the quantity of newer players complaining about the product.
There's a lot of demand for people to know Angels dark painting secrets. They probably didn't expect that so many would want to try to reach his lofty heights, so threw in the Joan sculpt as an incentive. Now lots of people are complaining that they can't get the book because it was so limited.
What they need to do is actually understand that not only their playerbase has grown, but that they have a lot os potential customers waiting for them to make particular products. Do some market research and some longer sales forecasting to try to better handle these big releases.
DarkSoldier wrote: Considering how the demand vastly outstripped the supply, I hope Angel and CB will reconsider their stance on only doing one printing of the book and model.
I have a feeling the book will be reprinted. I recall seeing something in one of the facebook announcements about how it will "never be re-edited" or something along those lines, which is only relevant if you were going to be printing more at a later date. As for the miniature, CB may keep a few back for prizes etc but if there is another print run of this book, I can't see that it will include the mini.
Considering how often it was reiterated there wouldn't be any additional print runs, I think the guy will stick to it. Reputation and integrity and what have you.
But it does say Vol.1 on the cover. Putting a Vol. 1 on something is not commonly done for something that is a one-off. It seems reasonable to conclude there will be a Vol.2 at some point, and while it might have an emphasis on lighting or weathering or whatever, chances are it will be mainly be more of the same things as in Vol.1.
I totally see Vol.2 being a limited print run and coming with another LE alternate sculpt though. Maybe a bit greasy, maybe not. Meh. We'll see.
ImAGeek wrote: I've said this before, and it's just spitballing, but we, and CB/AG don't know how much of the quick sell out was due to it being limited edition. If it was unlimited, who knows if it would've still sold as quick.
Are your implying that lying to create a peak in demand somehow excuses them? They could always say, this is a limited first run, but if demand is high enough we'll do another. It's down right bogus to say you will not do another run just to ensure initial demand spikes, which if they in fact do another run, very much is what they are doing.
As to the attitude in the thread, I don't see how anyone is out of line or nerd raging. BTW saying people are nerd raging despite being civil is trolling as far as I am concerned. I can't help but be stunned that people keep defending AG as if he is some sort of martyr here. He could have used crowd funding, seriously, I can't believe people keep glossing this fact over like him going to a Spanish bank for a personal loan wasn't a seriously stupid business decision. There is no legitimate excuse why if he in fact did this on his own he wouldn't use crowdfunding.
It is also strange people are acting as if this is separate from CB. This is clearly a joint production, you have to be seriously naive to believe otherwise. He is almost exclusively using infinity models and further he is using the studio models paint jobs. It's being cross promoted with a limited CB mini, and made available through their own site and distribution. In fact it's starting to make sense logically why he didn't go through crowd funding, and that's because it's so closely tied to CB.
Not trying to be negative or piss in any ones cereal, heck I supposedly got a copy from the Warstore, that doesn't make the handling of all this acceptable.
There is no legitimate excuse why if he in fact did this on his own he wouldn't use crowdfunding.
Really? It's like you've never considered what the Kickstarter comments page looks like for the people running a project.
Option #1: Get loan, print book, pay printer for book, sell book to distributor, pay off loan, be done. Distribution process deals with the rest.
Option #2: Start crowdfunding campaign, deal with crowdfunding people, collect most of the pledges (except for the pledges that didn't go through), deal with the requests to pay for the book after the crowdfunding project ends, pay printer for book, mail out the book to five thousand individual backers, read e-mail and deal with the various missing packages, misprints, etc., wonder if you're ever going to be done.
As someone who recently got a project funded through KS, it's really not that demanding if you're prepared. You'll get some people complaining and not reading announcements, but other than that it's pretty non-burdensome. You don't need to deal with people who don't pay (that's amazon's job), and don't need to deal with late backers unless you prefer to. There's nothing saying you can't shop out delivery if you get enough that it's necessary, either.
ImAGeek wrote: I've said this before, and it's just spitballing, but we, and CB/AG don't know how much of the quick sell out was due to it being limited edition. If it was unlimited, who knows if it would've still sold as quick.
Are your implying that lying to create a peak in demand somehow excuses them? They could always say, this is a limited first run, but if demand is high enough we'll do another. It's down right bogus to say you will not do another run just to ensure initial demand spikes, which if they in fact do another run, very much is what they are doing.
What are you on about, I never said anything about lying? As far as we know, this is the only run. They haven't said they're doing more, people are speculating that they will, but so far they haven't lied about anything...
All I'm saying is if it wasn't limited edition, or they did another print run or whatever, it might not sell as well, because we, and them, don't know how much of its quick sell out was due to the fact it was limited edition, or the model that came with it. So it might be risky to reprint it because then it's not LE and it might just sit there not selling. I don't think that would happen, but it might.
I don't think they will rerun it, because they've said a few times now they won't. If they did now, well, then they'd have been lying.
CB is quite reasonable for a games company. They at least understand that ramping up production might increase short-time sales, but might hurt them later when the demand goes down. They took the best approach: Ramp it only slightly up (level of expected steady demand) and stay clear of any financial trouble later.
The book will be LE, but parts of it might show up in later products that are not LE. That´s also quite normal.
CB's approach to N3. Quite good and in a decent time frame. The problem is some people with their instantly-mentality.
I will add that we do not know the terms of the deal he had with CB for the Jeanne D'Arc mini. I doubt they gave away 5500 miniatures. That is a big chunk of cash right there. CB will re-use the body, I'm guessing, and make new arms and head for the regular Jeanne D'arc. It'll be similar to the Bolt/Tabitha Cosplayer Bolt situation. This would keep the production costs down.
Anyway, the above, that CB has the molds ready for Jeanne D'Arc, leads me to believe that it will be a February release. And Teucer is the other unknown blister?
You're right, there has been enough of it in here.
I hope to not cross the line here with what I consider news:
German distributor Ulisses has given my FLGS a headsup, that the ordered number of books won't be delivered and that the available contingent will be evenly spread among the retailers by order date. First come, first served.
The owner of my FLGS expects/guesses to receive about 5 of the 25 books he ordered.
I will add that we do not know the terms of the deal he had with CB for the Jeanne D'Arc mini. I doubt they gave away 5500 miniatures. That is a big chunk of cash right there. CB will re-use the body, I'm guessing, and make new arms and head for the regular Jeanne D'arc. It'll be similar to the Bolt/Tabitha Cosplayer Bolt situation. This would keep the production costs down.
Anyway, the above, that CB has the molds ready for Jeanne D'Arc, leads me to believe that it will be a February release. And Teucer is the other unknown blister?
This please ^. Rather not sift through pages of CD hate in the news section
I will add that we do not know the terms of the deal he had with CB for the Jeanne D'Arc mini. I doubt they gave away 5500 miniatures. That is a big chunk of cash right there. CB will re-use the body, I'm guessing, and make new arms and head for the regular Jeanne D'arc. It'll be similar to the Bolt/Tabitha Cosplayer Bolt situation. This would keep the production costs down.
Anyway, the above, that CB has the molds ready for Jeanne D'Arc, leads me to believe that it will be a February release. And Teucer is the other unknown blister?
Actually I posted the links in the deal finder thread
Miniaturemarket.com is running a promotion that earns you 10x points right now on infinity figures thru the 6th of February. Also stopped in there and asked them about the painting book to see if/how many they will get. The still don't know and neither does their distributor . Points are saved under your account and normally accrue at 1 pt per dollar spent. Each point is a penny off a future order.
Miniaturemarket.com is running a promotion that earns you 10x points right now on infinity figures thru the 6th of February. Also stopped in there and asked them about the painting book to see if/how many they will get. The still don't know and neither does their distributor . Points are saved under your account and normally accrue at 1 pt per dollar spent. Each point is a penny off a future order.
Warstore is their distributor and they already did their preorders, so.... who knows.
Miniaturemarket.com is running a promotion that earns you 10x points right now on infinity figures thru the 6th of February. Also stopped in there and asked them about the painting book to see if/how many they will get. The still don't know and neither does their distributor . Points are saved under your account and normally accrue at 1 pt per dollar spent. Each point is a penny off a future order.
Warstore is their distributor and they already did their preorders, so.... who knows.
Do you have proof of that? Because I live near (2miles from MM) and stop by them regularly. The get stuff direct from manufacturers a lot and they carry stuff thewarstore.com doesn't. Plus they price under Neal on a lot of stuff, I'd have a hard time believing Neal would be all for that.
Also they got operation:icestorm before Neal did. I think they also got N3 first too.
Miniaturemarket.com is running a promotion that earns you 10x points right now on infinity figures thru the 6th of February. Also stopped in there and asked them about the painting book to see if/how many they will get. The still don't know and neither does their distributor . Points are saved under your account and normally accrue at 1 pt per dollar spent. Each point is a penny off a future order.
Warstore is their distributor and they already did their preorders, so.... who knows.
Do you have proof of that? Because I live near (2miles from MM) and stop by them regularly. The get stuff direct from manufacturers a lot and they carry stuff thewarstore.com doesn't. Plus they price under Neal on a lot of stuff, I'd have a hard time believing Neal would be all for that.
Also they got operation:icestorm before Neal did. I think they also got N3 first too.
Miniaturemarket.com is running a promotion that earns you 10x points right now on infinity figures thru the 6th of February. Also stopped in there and asked them about the painting book to see if/how many they will get. The still don't know and neither does their distributor . Points are saved under your account and normally accrue at 1 pt per dollar spent. Each point is a penny off a future order.
Warstore is their distributor and they already did their preorders, so.... who knows.
Do you have proof of that? Because I live near (2miles from MM) and stop by them regularly. The get stuff direct from manufacturers a lot and they carry stuff thewarstore.com doesn't. Plus they price under Neal on a lot of stuff, I'd have a hard time believing Neal would be all for that.
Also they got operation:icestorm before Neal did. I think they also got N3 first too.
e-figures is both their distributer.
Derp you are right, Warstore does wholesale to other stores though.
As for who got what first, it largly depends on where you live, I got my copy of N3 from Neal the day of release who overnightd it free of charge, I know other members here who ordered from MM did not receive it as quick. As for Ice storm I can not say since I did not get in on that mess, howoever fun note MM still has copies of it.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Bug it begs the question, if e-figures supplies both, why did Warstore do a preorder of Angel's book and MM didn't? If e-figures is not releasing stock numbers yet.
Either Neal is jumping the gun or maybe he has another distributor.
E-figures is actually a part of The Warstore, they use some legal technicalities to hide it, but e-figures stock is pretty much the same as The Warstore, it's basically their warehouse.
So, if something is popular, The Warstore will just sell it out from their website, and hold back on e-figures shipments to other stores. It's how The Warstore itself was so on the ball with N3 books and releases, meanwhile people were waiting for e-figures orders to come in.
This is pretty illegal, but it seems to be a common shady business tactic. I've seen it first hand in a few jobs I've had over the years.
E-figures is actually a part of The Warstore, they use some legal technicalities to hide it, but e-figures stock is pretty much the same as The Warstore, it's basically their warehouse.
So, if something is popular, The Warstore will just sell it out from their website, and hold back on e-figures shipments to other stores. It's how The Warstore itself was so on the ball with N3 books and releases, meanwhile people were waiting for e-figures orders to come in.
This is pretty illegal, but it seems to be a common shady business tactic. I've seen it first hand in a few jobs I've had over the years.
Ahhh just beat me to it, I was doing some reading and saw that they are one and the same, they even have the same address.
SO my orgignal comment stands, as for why MM has more things, Warstore only distributes Minis, you can check the e-figures site to see which. Also I think I recall that e-figures is the largest or perhaps only distributor of Infinity in the US.
My policy when it comes to ordering is I preorder from Wastore, for the reason Vertrucio stated, and anything that has been on the shelf awhile I grab from MM, for the cheaper prices.
As for the prices difference, It all comes down to the stores policies on discount pricing, what ever price They sell to MM for I am sure is the same price they use to base their profit mark-up and subsequent % knock off, MM just chooses to make less per sale then Warstore is all.
Miniaturemarket.com is running a promotion that earns you 10x points right now on infinity figures thru the 6th of February. Also stopped in there and asked them about the painting book to see if/how many they will get. The still don't know and neither does their distributor . Points are saved under your account and normally accrue at 1 pt per dollar spent. Each point is a penny off a future order.
Warstore is their distributor and they already did their preorders, so.... who knows.
Do you have proof of that? Because I live near (2miles from MM) and stop by them regularly. The get stuff direct from manufacturers a lot and they carry stuff thewarstore.com doesn't. Plus they price under Neal on a lot of stuff, I'd have a hard time believing Neal would be all for that.
Also they got operation:icestorm before Neal did. I think they also got N3 first too.
e-figures is both their distributer.
Derp you are right, Warstore does wholesale to other stores though.
As for who got what first, it largly depends on where you live, I got my copy of N3 from Neal the day of release who overnightd it free of charge, I know other members here who ordered from MM did not receive it as quick. As for Ice storm I can not say since I did not get in on that mess, howoever fun note MM still has copies of it.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Bug it begs the question, if e-figures supplies both, why did Warstore do a preorder of Angel's book and MM didn't? If e-figures is not releasing stock numbers yet.
Either Neal is jumping the gun or maybe he has another distributor.
Well I'm guessing it does help if family members run a distributor company of the same products you sell in your store front.
. Everything did end up more convoluted in the end, though.
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. Well saved a bundle since shipping was as much as the book 
Angel's book, its discussion is here 
