Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Only because I couldn’t see it in the thread (I may just be being thick) here’s the roadmap.
Hopefully OP can add it to the first post
If only gw had a brain and therefore this roadmap would be from right to left. Alas "why bother with HH when the core isn't there" will be a common reason for lack of growth heard by the community.
Mk III is just Mk II with extra forwards facing armour plates. They also figured out how to make the helmet turn sometime before Mk IV became a thing, but this seems to have been more or less immediately retrofitted to every still functional suit of MkII or III available.
I think Kinfolk Helots from imperialis militia are supposed to be votann. Or more/less accurately, squats since that name seems to get use for imperial votann like on necromunda.
I think Kinfolk Helots from imperialis militia are supposed to be votann. Or more/less accurately, squats since that name seems to get use for imperial votann like on necromunda.
Definitely squats, as they're armed more like the old Imperial Squats.
Tamereth wrote:
Mystery faction, probably admech but maybe imperial army? One can hope.
I will always be hoping for Solar Auxilia in plastic. The naval breaching team in killteam is close in a lot of respects... but gosh the Solar Auxilia still end up cooler.
Those new MK III marines are perfection! I've been holding off getting into the Horus Heresy simply because I'm just not a very big fan of the mk VI suits, and because the current mk 3's and 4's are so poorly proportioned.
But these! Holy carp... I can see myself ordering 100 of these new mk III marines. Easily. Especially if they're priced the same as the current mk VI squad.
Alpharius wrote: New Primarch really should be AlphariusOmegon and his diorama base should be him cutting off Dorn's hand.
Yes, he's a Loyalist too, but still, that was his actual brother!
Sanguinius needs a model without super-saiyan hair or the awkward action pose... he should look regal and aesthetic imo, inspiring. I waited years for that to come out then ended up passing on it, sure I wasn't the only one! Most of the rest are decent to great. Though Fulgrim has super saiyan hair too and alphie yes probably on the more boring end, an alph/omegon set would be good.
lol even dead Sanguinius would be better than the current, to me anyways. Current Sanguinius is kinda like Alien 3, by no means terrible, but so far off from what I wanted it was borderline offensive , and then my opinion softened over time but the 'what could have been' remains.
Sanguinius at ease, or perhaps expressing remorse over a fallen son would be an interesting diorama.
Spoiler:
Like that one time an outsider who's identity is lost on me right now, stumbles in to a destroyed cathedral while the angel is putting down a marine lost to the red thirst.
Do we think that the updated Mark II/III armour arms will be backwards compatible with the special weapons upgrade weapon sprues? The heavy weapon upgrade sprue arms are off as they lack the wrist armour, but as the special weapons are just hands maybe they will work?
Any new plastic Dreadnought is great for me. I currently have 9 plastic Contemptors and 6 Leviathans painted so Deredeo me up.
I would hope they're backwards compatible. I'd hate to think that they're going to spend time, effort and money on a whole new suite of heavy and special weapon bitz boxes.
Do we think that the updated Mark II/III armour arms will be backwards compatible with the special weapons upgrade weapon sprues? The heavy weapon upgrade sprue arms are off as they lack the wrist armour, but as the special weapons are just hands maybe they will work?
As long as the bolter arms have the same positioning as the mk6 kit, the special weapons should be fine.
The heavy weapons on the other hand have two problems with mk3. The shoulder plate and the arms. The shoulder plate issue looks like it could be solved by the new kit as the upper trim seems to be less pronounced. The arms are tricky though. I see four possible options, 1st the new mk3 has separate wrist armour that can fit onto the existing mk6 heavy weapons arms, 2nd GW make a mk3 specific set of arms and either sell that solo or pack it with the guns as a new box, third is the same as the 2nd but FW, 4th is they don't bother and you either make do with no mk3 heavy weapons or they all have mk6 arms.
Just something that irks me about the new MK 3?
Do they have a reddot / sensor that is lower than the frontsight on their boltguns? Because it looks like that. (hey maybee something for use as seekers seeing as we don't get infantry until next year...)
H.B.M.C. wrote: I would hope they're backwards compatible. I'd hate to think that they're going to spend time, effort and money on a whole new suite of heavy and special weapon bitz boxes.
What is more likely, GW tooling 6 redundant sprues of repeated weapons or any one new unit that people have been begging for for the past year?
It is a bit sus to just have a random art piece with 4 distinct units on it, 3 of which are currently unreleased. And the roadmap is strangely lacking in books.
Alternate theory, however: this is (half of) the cover of a Cthonia box that was supposed to happen, but was dropped due to production delays and the kits are now parted out for single releases as roadmapped...
Alpharius wrote: New Primarch really should be AlphariusOmegon and his diorama base should be him cutting off Dorn's hand.
Yes, he's a Loyalist too, but still, that was his actual brother!
Sanguinius needs a model without super-saiyan hair or the awkward action pose... he should look regal and aesthetic imo, inspiring. I waited years for that to come out then ended up passing on it, sure I wasn't the only one! Most of the rest are decent to great. Though Fulgrim has super saiyan hair too and alphie yes probably on the more boring end, an alph/omegon set would be good.
OK, that's probably a more realistic choice - and I feel for BA fans in general and MT11 in particular - so sure, let's make that happen!
H.B.M.C. wrote: I would hope they're backwards compatible. I'd hate to think that they're going to spend time, effort and money on a whole new suite of heavy and special weapon bitz boxes.
What is more likely, GW tooling 6 redundant sprues of repeated weapons or any one new unit that people have been begging for for the past year?
And literally anything else from Forge World vs. another 18 helmet and should pad sets?
H.B.M.C. wrote: I would hope they're backwards compatible. I'd hate to think that they're going to spend time, effort and money on a whole new suite of heavy and special weapon bitz boxes.
What is more likely, GW tooling 6 redundant sprues of repeated weapons or any one new unit that people have been begging for for the past year?
And literally anything else from Forge World vs. another 18 helmet and should pad sets?
Seems like there won't be a Forgeworld/Specialist Games Open Day this year as well, which sucks...
H.B.M.C. wrote: I would hope they're backwards compatible. I'd hate to think that they're going to spend time, effort and money on a whole new suite of heavy and special weapon bitz boxes.
What is more likely, GW tooling 6 redundant sprues of repeated weapons or any one new unit that people have been begging for for the past year?
And literally anything else from Forge World vs. another 18 helmet and should pad sets?
If they do have Forge World produce anything for the Heresy, about half the people here will bitch and moan about it.
H.B.M.C. wrote: I would hope they're backwards compatible. I'd hate to think that they're going to spend time, effort and money on a whole new suite of heavy and special weapon bitz boxes.
What is more likely, GW tooling 6 redundant sprues of repeated weapons or any one new unit that people have been begging for for the past year?
And literally anything else from Forge World vs. another 18 helmet and should pad sets?
If they do have Forge World produce anything for the Heresy, about half the people here will bitch and moan about it.
Rightfully so. GW just released a few more plastic event exclusive minis. The cost argument doesn't hold up anymore.
Event exclusives tend to be used at all sorts of events for a year, and some locations all the time and have the collectible aspect to them. Easier to justify in plastic than optional upgrades or characters for 1/18 factions of the 3rd tier game. Would I like more plastic HH? Yes though my wallet says no.
Apparently, the Q&A soft confirmed it wouldn't be the Khan but rather a "Primarch who went through some changes during the Heresy".
It won't be Angron, Mortarion, or Magnus because they have plastic Daemon models. Fulgrim is unlikely as the EC is going to be in 40k as a faction and Fulgrim will get released, probably in 10th considering the last three Editions have all seen a Daemon Primarch.
I'd say the best bet is a new Lorgar to represent Lorgar Transfigured. Curze, Alpharius, and Perturabo didn't change their styles during the Heresy (well Alpharius went from alive to dead but that doesn't count) and Horus has a new model. The Loyalists likewise didn't change (apart from Ferrus going from alive to dead) so I'd be surprised if it was one of them.
Given that both the next dread and armour mark are out in Autumn you may be right. They can retire the £180 AOD box and replace it with a cheaper £100-120 starter box, similar to what happened with Adeptus Titanicus.
Apparently, the Q&A soft confirmed it wouldn't be the Khan but rather a "Primarch who went through some changes during the Heresy".
It won't be Angron, Mortarion, or Magnus because they have plastic Daemon models. Fulgrim is unlikely as the EC is going to be in 40k as a faction and Fulgrim will get released, probably in 10th considering the last three Editions have all seen a Daemon Primarch.
I'd say the best bet is a new Lorgar to represent Lorgar Transfigured. Curze, Alpharius, and Perturabo didn't change their styles during the Heresy (well Alpharius went from alive to dead but that doesn't count) and Horus has a new model. The Loyalists likewise didn't change (apart from Ferrus going from alive to dead) so I'd be surprised if it was one of them.
Apparently, the Q&A soft confirmed it wouldn't be the Khan but rather a "Primarch who went through some changes during the Heresy".
It won't be Angron, Mortarion, or Magnus because they have plastic Daemon models. Fulgrim is unlikely as the EC is going to be in 40k as a faction and Fulgrim will get released, probably in 10th considering the last three Editions have all seen a Daemon Primarch.
I'd say the best bet is a new Lorgar to represent Lorgar Transfigured. Curze, Alpharius, and Perturabo didn't change their styles during the Heresy (well Alpharius went from alive to dead but that doesn't count) and Horus has a new model. The Loyalists likewise didn't change (apart from Ferrus going from alive to dead) so I'd be surprised if it was one of them.
I could see them doing a Perturabo eventually. They'll probably have him tinker with his armour to mitigate what Fulgrim did.
Apparently, the Q&A soft confirmed it wouldn't be the Khan but rather a "Primarch who went through some changes during the Heresy".
It won't be Angron, Mortarion, or Magnus because they have plastic Daemon models. Fulgrim is unlikely as the EC is going to be in 40k as a faction and Fulgrim will get released, probably in 10th considering the last three Editions have all seen a Daemon Primarch.
I'd say the best bet is a new Lorgar to represent Lorgar Transfigured. Curze, Alpharius, and Perturabo didn't change their styles during the Heresy (well Alpharius went from alive to dead but that doesn't count) and Horus has a new model. The Loyalists likewise didn't change (apart from Ferrus going from alive to dead) so I'd be surprised if it was one of them.
I could see them doing a Perturabo eventually. They'll probably have him tinker with his armour to mitigate what Fulgrim did.
We know Perty's armor is way bigger/bulkier/jury-rigged by the time of the heresy. He's constantly adding on more life support to keep himself alive because of Fulgrim. I could see them fixing him up like that and making him strong enough to take on daemon angron since he did that lore-wise in his current state.
It is a bit sus to just have a random art piece with 4 distinct units on it, 3 of which are currently unreleased. And the roadmap is strangely lacking in books.
Alternate theory, however: this is (half of) the cover of a Cthonia box that was supposed to happen, but was dropped due to production delays and the kits are now parted out for single releases as roadmapped...
I think it's pretty in line to what's already happened with the previous HH Big Box.
Original boxed set.
New big tank
New Contemptor
New MK 6 troops
Cataphractii terminators
This "boxed set"
Big tank
New dread
Reworked (new) MK troops
Support squad sprues.
In theory this would come out in Autumn when the road map says "Armour MK update" and "Dreadnaught". Probably will be teased further in July.
Apparently, the Q&A soft confirmed it wouldn't be the Khan but rather a "Primarch who went through some changes during the Heresy".
Sanguinius went through some changes right at the end of the Heresy.
But I'm thinking Lorgar. I just can't imagine anyone wasting their time on a giant, spindly, fragile, poorly cast, resin version of Daemon Fulgrim.
Why wouldn’t they? They made the Lion as the last loyalist primarch and released a plastic version, albeit for 40k, a few years later. The only difference is the 40k one has a big shield. If anything, they’ll probably make daemon primarch vs loyalist diorama sets, like mortarion vs the khan, fulgrim vs Dorn, etc
Apparently, the Q&A soft confirmed it wouldn't be the Khan but rather a "Primarch who went through some changes during the Heresy".
It won't be Angron, Mortarion, or Magnus because they have plastic Daemon models. Fulgrim is unlikely as the EC is going to be in 40k as a faction and Fulgrim will get released, probably in 10th considering the last three Editions have all seen a Daemon Primarch.
.
From what I have heard, the 4 daemon primarchs will be getting 30K models, regardless of the fact that there are also 40K versions of the same characters. There is sufficient demand for both.
What demand? Who's asking for a version of a model that already exists to be made in a more difficult material to work with at a more expensive price point? I have literally never seen that anywhere.
Gert wrote: What demand? Who's asking for a version of a model that already exists .
At present there are no rules for Daemon Primarchs in 30k, so of course no one is asking. People weren't asking for a Horus Ascended model either until rules appeared, and he has hardly sat on the shelf gathering dust, despite people being able to use the original Horus model with the ascended rules. And when I say 'There is sufficient demand for both', I mean that is how GW are viewing the market, not 'I have heard people ask for this online. Given the sales of all the primarch models so far, they are hardly going to worry that they wouldn't make a profit from doing 30k versions of some of the most iconic special characters in the history of the game, even if there is a plastic alternative.
Eventually he'll run out of ways to keep himself alive, and that's when Lorgar steps in and helps him become a daemon prince.
Perturabo is already a daemon prince by "modern" 40K.
If i remember correctly the precise point of Perturabo's ascension is known, afaik it was at the conclusion of the Iron Cage, he used the slaughtered Imperial Fists as the final sacrifice to seal the deal. That may have been retconned in the meantime though, it's from the Index Astartes IW from way back in 3rd or 4th edition and has not been mentioned that often since as far as i know.
GaroRobe wrote: Why wouldn’t they? They made the Lion as the last loyalist primarch and released a plastic version, albeit for 40k, a few years later. The only difference is the 40k one has a big shield.
Did you miss the whole giant, spindly, poorly cast bit of my post? Who would ever want that in resin when there's a plastic version coming?
JamesY wrote: At present there are no rules for Daemon Primarchs in 30k, so of course no one is asking. People weren't asking for a Horus Ascended model either until rules appeared, and he has hardly sat on the shelf gathering dust, despite people being able to use the original Horus model with the ascended rules. And when I say 'There is sufficient demand for both', I mean that is how GW are viewing the market, not 'I have heard people ask for this online. Given the sales of all the primarch models so far, they are hardly going to worry that they wouldn't make a profit from doing 30k versions of some of the most iconic special characters in the history of the game, even if there is a plastic alternative.
You're misinterpreting what I said. People are actually asking for Daemon Primarch rules, especially now that only one remains to be made and half of them became Daemons about halfway through the Heresy. What they aren't saying is "Why isn't FW making Daemon Primarchs", not since Magnus was released at the end of 7th Ed 40k. That signalled that GW would be making at least the Big Four, locking FW out of needing to do so.
The original Horus model represents him at the end of the Crusade and the opening acts of the Heresy while the Horus Ascended model is effectively his version of a Daemon Primarch model. As for how GW views the market, producing the same model twice, one of which won't sell nearly as much isn't going to happen. Just like GW doesn't need to produce an entire line of Ruinstorm Daemons or Solar Auxilia Leman Russ's, it doesn't need to make a resin version of the Daemon Primarchs. The logic that the current Primarchs sell therefore resin Daemon ones will sell doesn't hold up when the only alternate GW-produced Primarchs either don't fit the setting or don't have rules to represent the models. The exception to the rule is the Lion because it's very similar to the Heresy version. The one current Daemon Primarch that doesn't quite perfectly fit their Heresy state is Angron, which can be solved by simply removing the big axe.
@ Gert in this thread, I've suggested that in the future, we'll see non-marine armies. New army pointed towards on the road map. I've also said a remake of mkiii (teased over the weekend) and mkiv (hinted at on the road map.) How about rather than keep telling me that I'm wrong, you maybe consider if I might be right?
JamesY wrote: @ Gert in this thread, I've suggested that in the future, we'll see non-marine armies. New army pointed towards on the road map. I've also said a remake of mkiii (teased over the weekend) and mkiv (hinted at on the road map.) How about rather than keep telling me that I'm wrong, you maybe consider if I might be right?
You made an extremely generic and long-term suggestion, that's hardly what I'd call vindication. And if we're being specific, the roadmap does not say "New Army Release" it says "Mystery Army Release" which is about as vague as your "GW will release plastic Mechanicum at some point within the next 18 months" bet.
I've never denied that the other armour patterns would get a redesign but good for you that you guessed it would happen at some point in this 162-page thread. I also don't see any suggestion of a redesigned Mk4, just that there is going to be an updated armour pattern and there was a teaser image released featuring something similar to Mk3. That doesn't suggest to me that Mk4 is getting a redo but rather the teaser we've seen is the updated kit getting released alongside a Deredeo.
I'm not going to consider your attempt to justify your belief that there will be duplicate resin models of plastic Daemon Primarchs as being right because you guessed one thing correctly.
JamesY wrote: @ Gert in this thread, I've suggested that in the future, we'll see non-marine armies. New army pointed towards on the road map. I've also said a remake of mkiii (teased over the weekend) and mkiv (hinted at on the road map.) How about rather than keep telling me that I'm wrong, you maybe consider if I might be right?
You made an extremely generic and long-term suggestion, that's hardly what I'd call vindication. And if we're being specific, the roadmap does not say "New Army Release" it says "Mystery Army Release" which is about as vague as your "GW will release plastic Mechanicum at some point within the next 18 months" bet.
I've never denied that the other armour patterns would get a redesign but good for you that you guessed it would happen at some point in this 162-page thread. I also don't see any suggestion of a redesigned Mk4, just that there is going to be an updated armour pattern and there was a teaser image released featuring something similar to Mk3. That doesn't suggest to me that Mk4 is getting a redo but rather the teaser we've seen is the updated kit getting released alongside a Deredeo.
I'm not going to consider your attempt to justify your belief that there will be duplicate resin models of plastic Daemon Primarchs as being right because you guessed one thing correctly.
To be fair, they said in the stream that the 'mystery army' will specifically be plastic non-Marines. The roadmap does not contain all the information they revealed.
JamesY wrote: @ Gert in this thread, I've suggested that in the future, we'll see non-marine armies. New army pointed towards on the road map. I've also said a remake of mkiii (teased over the weekend) and mkiv (hinted at on the road map.) How about rather than keep telling me that I'm wrong, you maybe consider if I might be right?
You made an extremely generic and long-term suggestion, that's hardly what I'd call vindication. And if we're being specific, the roadmap does not say "New Army Release" it says "Mystery Army Release" which is about as vague as your "GW will release plastic Mechanicum at some point within the next 18 months" bet.
I've never denied that the other armour patterns would get a redesign but good for you that you guessed it would happen at some point in this 162-page thread. I also don't see any suggestion of a redesigned Mk4, just that there is going to be an updated armour pattern and there was a teaser image released featuring something similar to Mk3. That doesn't suggest to me that Mk4 is getting a redo but rather the teaser we've seen is the updated kit getting released alongside a Deredeo.
I'm not going to consider your attempt to justify your belief that there will be duplicate resin models of plastic Daemon Primarchs as being right because you guessed one thing correctly.
Okay. I've no interest in trying too hard to convince a stranger on the internet of anything. We'll see what comes along down the road.
JamesY wrote: @ Gert in this thread, I've suggested that in the future, we'll see non-marine armies. New army pointed towards on the road map. I've also said a remake of mkiii (teased over the weekend) and mkiv (hinted at on the road map.) How about rather than keep telling me that I'm wrong, you maybe consider if I might be right?
You made an extremely generic and long-term suggestion, that's hardly what I'd call vindication. And if we're being specific, the roadmap does not say "New Army Release" it says "Mystery Army Release" which is about as vague as your "GW will release plastic Mechanicum at some point within the next 18 months" bet.
I've never denied that the other armour patterns would get a redesign but good for you that you guessed it would happen at some point in this 162-page thread. I also don't see any suggestion of a redesigned Mk4, just that there is going to be an updated armour pattern and there was a teaser image released featuring something similar to Mk3. That doesn't suggest to me that Mk4 is getting a redo but rather the teaser we've seen is the updated kit getting released alongside a Deredeo.
I'm not going to consider your attempt to justify your belief that there will be duplicate resin models of plastic Daemon Primarchs as being right because you guessed one thing correctly.
Okay. I've no interest in trying too hard to convince a stranger on the internet of anything. We'll see what comes along down the road.
I have faith in your sources buddy, any future info is very welcome
I have faith in your sources buddy, any future info is very welcome
Cheers mate. I only say anything if I've heard it from a few different directions. But like I said, we'll see what's down the road. The heresy team is absolutely massive, so even before anyone says anything specific that can only vaguely be repeated, it is clear that there is a lot more to come.
I’m surprised mk 4 isn’t being redone first given that it’s the older kit. Given that Fafnir Rann is sculpted with the new mk3, I guess it was easier to make more models based around him.
Speaking of which, how does Fafnir scale with the mk 6 marines?
GaroRobe wrote: I’m surprised mk 4 isn’t being redone first given that it’s the older kit. Given that Fafnir Rann is sculpted with the new mk3, I guess it was easier to make more models based around him.
Speaking of which, how does Fafnir scale with the mk 6 marines?
Might just be a question of popularity. If FW is confident people like the new proportions enough to buy their army all over again and Mk.III sold better than Mk.IV, there's no question which one should be redone first.
Age is probably not a consideration. The two marks weren't all that far apart and Marine casts didn't get better or crisper in that time.
Perhaps GW has decided they will make similar tac squad boxes out of all three existing plastic marks, VI, III, IV?
In the first stage, they up the model count on all tac kits to 20. Then, reintroduce recut MKIII & MKIV tac kits? This would mean that the upgrade weapon & melee sprues would be compatible across all three plastic armour mark kits. I mean, I'd love it if upcoming breacher upg kit could work on any plastic armour mark without requiring conversions.
If you think how many sprues the old MKIII & MKIV kits use, recutting the kits to use less sprues might even end up saving GW money in the long term.. besides updating the scales on em all.
I'm sure the new Mk3s will got from a full featured 40k style kit with wargear options to a quarter size sprue of 5 poses with nothing but boltguns, yes.
It's a kit more appropriate to the unit they're being sold as if so. The Mk4 and Mk3 kits were a good start but almost everyone in our gaming group ended up building them like 40k Tacticals before they got the rules and ended up running Pride of the Legion until they could buy new kits to use as Legion Tacticals. With the newer kits there's no issue there because they come with exactly the options the Legion Tactical Squad has in the rules. The additional weapon kits aren't even badly priced, especially considering most are 3 different weapons.
Gert wrote: It's a kit more appropriate to the unit they're being sold as if so. The Mk4 and Mk3 kits were a good start but almost everyone in our gaming group ended up building them like 40k Tacticals before they got the rules and ended up running Pride of the Legion until they could buy new kits to use as Legion Tacticals. With the newer kits there's no issue there because they come with exactly the options the Legion Tactical Squad has in the rules. The additional weapon kits aren't even badly priced, especially considering most are 3 different weapons.
Honestly this is the sort of copium The Outer Circle keeps talking about.
"It's good they're removing half the content so somebody doesn't give them a heavy bolter by accident"
lord_blackfang wrote: Honestly this is the sort of copium The Outer Circle keeps talking about.
"It's good they're removing half the content so somebody doesn't give them a heavy bolter by accident"
To use a Tactical or Heavy Support Squad, you previously had to fork out for FW weapons or buy 5 of the same kit to get the minimum weapons you need for a single unit. For actually building a Heresy army the new kit is objectively better in value. £73.50 from GW for a 20-man unit plus any of the Weapon packs. To do the same for the Mk3/4 kits, it was £70 for just the 20 Marines plus another £15.50 for each set of Special or Heavy weapons which came in sets of 10 and 5 respectively, leading you at the lowest into the £100 mark, higher if you went for Heavies.
But sure, I'm on "copium" because I prefer not to spend £50 on 10 Special Weapon dudes.
Nevelon wrote: The new kits don’t have all the options though. Sarges with wargear are particularly rough.
Sergeants are missing exactly one option and that's the Combi-Weapon. The older kits only came with a Chainsword, Power Sword, LC, and Powerfist, just like the Mk6 kit.
Not denying that a Volkite Serpenta or a Power Axe would be nice but pretending the new Sergeant options are largely fewer than the old ones is just plain wrong.
i think he meant the possible loss of equipment in the redone tactical squads, which is a valid argument, considering they also have melee equipment (missing in mk 6) and specials and heavies.
Yup, my big issues when putting together the new mk VI is getting the right gear on my sarge. Because both hands on on the bolter, it’s nearly impossible to make a sarge with the squad’s gear and a CC toy.
This is especially bad for support squads. I would like my volkite assault support sarge to have a powerfist, but he’s going to have to settle for a sheathed powersword, so he can keep both hands on his gun.
Nevelon wrote: This is especially bad for support squads. I would like my volkite assault support sarge to have a powerfist, but he’s going to have to settle for a sheathed powersword, so he can keep both hands on his gun.
If you are talking about volkite chargers, you can take the volkite serpenta from the Tartaros kit and use it for the Sgt. Sure, it's technically the pistol version, but the bit is 90% the same as a charger, and it doesn't make sense for a Sgt of volkite charger squad to take one anyway, so I doubt it'll be confusing.
The biggest issue is the Tartaros serpenta is right-handed, so depending on which mark or armor you go with, you might have to swap fists. Even that shouldn't be too bad given the sheer number of plasma pistols in all the tactical kits.
Nevelon wrote: This is especially bad for support squads. I would like my volkite assault support sarge to have a powerfist, but he’s going to have to settle for a sheathed powersword, so he can keep both hands on his gun.
If you are talking about volkite chargers, you can take the volkite serpenta from the Tartaros kit and use it for the Sgt. Sure, it's technically the pistol version, but the bit is 90% the same as a charger, and it doesn't make sense for a Sgt of volkite charger squad to take one anyway, so I doubt it'll be confusing.
The biggest issue is the Tartaros serpenta is right-handed, so depending on which mark or armor you go with, you might have to swap fists. Even that shouldn't be too bad given the sheer number of plasma pistols in all the tactical kits.
Nevelon wrote: The new kits don’t have all the options though. Sarges with wargear are particularly rough.
Sergeants are missing exactly one option and that's the Combi-Weapon. The older kits only came with a Chainsword, Power Sword, LC, and Powerfist, just like the Mk6 kit.
The MkIV comes with Combi-bolters and the parts to make them flamer, melta, or plasma. MkIII includes a Thunder Hammer. Also, the MkVI does not include a chainsword or unholstered bolt pistol.
Classic tanks from the Forge World range return to the Horus Heresy at the Games Workshop webstore, upgraded with new plastic sponson sprues that make it easier than ever to add weapon variety to your armoured companies.
Does that mean they're going to be on the main site, rather than FW?
If it is any consolidation to you, they'll probably sneak in a little price increase too
beast_gts wrote:
Classic tanks from the Forge World range return to the Horus Heresy at the Games Workshop webstore, upgraded with new plastic sponson sprues that make it easier than ever to add weapon variety to your armoured companies.
Does that mean they're going to be on the main site, rather than FW?
It sure reads that way - probably they want to consolidate it all under one store label.
SamusDrake wrote:It says they'll be plastic and resin. I assume they were full resin kits before?
They were full resin before, and are now resin bodies with plastic sponsons and accessories - they have been reworked to share the same sponson sprue all plastic heresy ground vehicles have.
I happen to have a spare Deimos Rhino chassis unbuilt.. If the Damocles command upgrade turns out sensibly prized, I'll bite. I also have a spare set of iconographied Deimos Rhino doors, which might make sense on a command vehicle like that. For some reason, I didn't want to use the fancy doors on a regular Rhino, seemed like a waste..
So for those concerned these new releases might be a little easier on the wallet? Not my thing as I'm eyeing up the new Lancer, but its nice to know that others have something to look forward to as well.
I don't see them getting cheaper, but I also don't see them raising the price either, since the plastic sprues will provide more options and better QA for better margins to GW
Superheavies have definitely increased in price (Glaive and Fellblade were around the £175 mark before) as well as the Arquitors (around the £105-£110 mark).
I don't think I can justify the Damocles upgrade price (44€) as it's more than the basic Deimos Rhino kit (40€). And for something that's relatively simple to either scratchbuilt, convert, or 3D print... yeah, this ain't it, chief.
Wow, I originally thought the command rhino also included the plastic kit. That's just bonkers that they're charging so much for so little resin. Guess I'll just stick with the plastic command rhino I got in the combo box from the Citadel store.
Agamemnon2 wrote: Is the dollar price for the Deimos Rhino cheaper than the regular version, like it is with the euro price?
Yes. But the 40k rhino also includes the razorback sprue, for whatever that is worth.
The Deimos is a better kit, imo.
--
I'll add to the yikes on the command upgrade. That's a ridiculous price for a dish, dish base and a little box.
It doesn't help that the picture of the rear of the dish, it looks like its listing, Tower of Pisa style.
I was thinking of dealing with my dislike of FW resin and getting a few things, but not at those prices. Certainly not for an easy kitbash like that.
CragHack wrote: What are the rules changes? Minor or something that would actually make people consider buying those things?
Assuming you talk about the command rhino:
Reserve shenanigans, actually it would be a decent addition to a AL list with allied detachment of militia that runs horde to speed up reinforcements...because remember kids Al treats allied detachments of SA as battlebrothers.
That said, a master of signals does it better and doesn't cost you 100+$ for a glorified rhino with radar dish.
Nah, I had Javelin and Mastodon in mind. They added updated profiles, so I thought they might have also changed something. But if it's only added sponson weapons... eh.
So, a resin roof hatch, radar and tiny extra aerial block, which costs more than the entire plastic tank it goes on, sold out in minutes???
Whoosh. Sometimes there's things that go right over my head.
God I'm so glad I picked up a 3D printer - you can get a set of Damocles upgrade STLs for about £5 and that does include interior detail (a nice holo-table)
most of the old Damocles kit was rendered obsolete by the deimos rhino and hatch sprue:
Charax wrote: God I'm so glad I picked up a 3D printer - you can get a set of Damocles upgrade STLs for about £5 and that does include interior detail (a nice holo-table)
Got a link to a specific file? Thank you in advance.
The first narrative expansion for the Horus Heresy arrives, and it’s a 240-page whopper. The Siege of Cthonia covers the catastrophic battle for the homeworld of the Sons of Horus, which Vheren Ashurhaddon has vowed to take back for the Warmaster. All that stands between him and victory for the True Sons is a massive, entrenched Imperial Fists garrison led by Evander Garrius.
This huge supplement features a hefty lore section, campaign rules for playing out the key battles of the siege, new rules for claustrophobic Zone Mortalis battles, as well as new options for units and wargear including Inductii, tank commanders, and the Infernus Abomination.
I'm slightly worried that the Vindicator doesn't mention the Laser Destroyer version, but the Heresy Thursday article did say "Both loadouts are included in the new kit"...
WarCom wrote:Add some close combat punch to your Legion with this set of upgrades designed for use alongside the plastic MK II, MK IV, MK V, and MK VI Tactical Squad Space Marines kits.
Product leak, or WarCom not knowing what they're on about again...
WarCom wrote:Add some close combat punch to your Legion with this set of upgrades designed for use alongside the plastic MK II, MK IV, MK V, and MK VI Tactical Squad Space Marines kits.
Product leak, or WarCom not knowing what they're on about again...
Hopefully the former. Need plastic Mark V now, now, now.........
Are GW only planning to get 12 months use out of the Despoiler kit? Or are they gonna do something daft like not putting power axes in next springs melee weapons set?
And while we are talking future armour releases. Anyone else think that Evander Garrius could based on a reworked Cataphractii design?
GoatboyBeta wrote: Are GW only planning to get 12 months use out of the Despoiler kit? Or are they gonna do something daft like not putting power axes in next springs melee weapons set?
I'm hoping that the Melee Weapons pack is more like the FW MKII / MKIII Power Weapon Sets with a small assortment of different stuff.
WarCom wrote:Add some close combat punch to your Legion with this set of upgrades designed for use alongside the plastic MK II, MK IV, MK V, and MK VI Tactical Squad Space Marines kits.
Product leak, or WarCom not knowing what they're on about again...
And it's been edited:
Add some close combat punch to your Legion with this set of upgrades designed for use alongside the plastic MK III, MK IV, and MK VI Tactical Squad Space Marines kits.
I don’t get how the arms could be used outside mk6.
It’s not like space marine armors share identical arm designs. Mk3 arms are pretty distinct. Plus, if these were designed for mk6, they’ll probably look way too big when used on the older plastic heresy mks
Since Valrak has been saying MKII and MKV are done and are just waiting to be released and his sources have been right about releases for a while now (for example he talked about the Cerastus Knight 5 months ago) I'm leaning towards accidental leak instead of just a mistake
Given that plastic melee weapons are coming in the future, and the only armor mk released before then is mk3, I’m not sure if this was a leak. I don’t know if these despoiler arms will be around long term or if they’re just a resin placeholder
MajorWesJanson wrote: If II and V are done and ready, why show off new mk III, a redo of an existing mark?
II, III and V might all be done. But GW might still feel III will sell better and is more important to get out than II or V.
Shouldn't V be the most important seeing as it is literally strapped together adhoc common for 30k used by all somewhat decently equiped fighting forces? And considering the HH community is a bit more stickler for the background wouldn't the natural order then be V, IV and III? and not III, ?, ?
Boringstuff wrote: Aren't the breachers supposed to have a modified Mark III if going by lore? That could be a consideration?
The only other reason I can think of for releasing in that order is that III looks best.
For some legions. Certainly IW and DG will have a lot of happy times with it.
That said, i can see GW throwing out immediatly a breacher shield kit. Which would atleast make us 4/ 6 troopslots available. Depending upon kit (and the contents) it may even cover the Assault marines so we'd be at 5/6 types of troops.
I'd say it's more just that the only dedicated full Breacher kits happened to have Mk3, the bog standard Breachers, Invictarus (which sort of aren't really Breachers by tactical role), and Medusan Immortals. The Ultramarine Praetorians and the original Breacher upgrades aren't specific but when the only generic option is Mk3, it sets a precedent. The Phalanx Warders are even modified Mk4.
Mk3 is the heavier type of Power Armour but it wouldn't be a requirement to wear for a Marine in a Breacher unit.
Could be a new Chaos flyer kit/kits on the way in plastic with the new codex if they are retiring both FW kits.
The Greater Daemons make sense as the newer plastic ones are big enough compared to the old metal ones that were available when they FW ones were first made.
Hoping Zhufor means new WE terminators coming in plastic at some point.
Could be a new Chaos flyer kit/kits on the way in plastic with the new codex if they are retiring both FW kits.
The Greater Daemons make sense as the newer plastic ones are big enough compared to the old metal ones that were available when they FW ones were first made.
Hoping Zhufor means new WE terminators coming in plastic at some point.
IMHO they're removing all the old-scale Terminators that are not Heresy models - Tyberos, the TDA inqusitor, Gabriel Angelos in TDA etc.
tauist wrote: That greater daemon of Tcheentzh was going to be my "centerpiece model" in the near future.. such a shame, its a gorgeous sculpt
It's the Internet. Nothing's ever truly gone.
'Somehow, (checks notes) Aetaos'rau'keres returned' indeed... i guess there will be a lively secondary market for those, as they're quite iconic, including recasts...
well, I just checked the plastic AOS alternative and while the FW model did look iconic, the Kairos Fateweaver build of the Lord of Change plastic kit aint too shabby either
SirDonlad wrote: Tyberos is gawn?
Damn, he had the best looking lightning claws FW/GW have ever done.
I'll pour one out for him and Valthex.
He'll probably be back, and be even more f***koff huge.
When would GW ever bring Tyberos back? I love the Space Sharks and would love to see him done in plastic, but there's more popular chapters that don't have characters in plastic, why would Tyberos get a release and when?
drbored wrote: When would GW ever bring Tyberos back? I love the Space Sharks and would love to see him done in plastic, but there's more popular chapters that don't have characters in plastic, why would Tyberos get a release and when?
Tie-in with the next novel? Or a Black Library Celebration model like Captain Messinius.
Legiones Astartes: Inductii – Rules for fielding Inductii, the hastily-created Astartes used as reinforcements in the latter days of the Horus Heresy, with specific rules for each Legion.
Neat (from the Cthonia book). I don't recall seeing this mentioned before. Some previews would have been nice.
SirDonlad wrote: Tyberos is gawn?
Damn, he had the best looking lightning claws FW/GW have ever done.
I'll pour one out for him and Valthex.
He'll probably be back, and be even more f***koff huge.
When would GW ever bring Tyberos back? I love the Space Sharks and would love to see him done in plastic, but there's more popular chapters that don't have characters in plastic, why would Tyberos get a release and when?
As others have said, as a Black Library tie-in, or celebratory miniature. You could also add him as a supplementary character to Codex:SM (with a Detachment for Fleet-based raiding forces like Space Sharks, Ashen Claws, Soul Drinkers etc.) or even Deathwatch without too much hassle, or if they ever come around to doing something Badab-themed again. Otherwise, he could also come back as a resin upgrade pack for plastic Assault termies. The 'last chance to buy' article said nothing negative about upgrade packs.
queen_annes_revenge wrote: Forge world finally moving completely away from making interesting figures for less mainstream characters into a pure heresy company. Sad.
Heresy and TOW, eventually. If their tone-deaf pricing continues on that, the latter will probably be the final nail in the coffin.
I have some spare sprues of the Mk6. I've been waiting for the bolt pistol / chainsword arms, just to make a unit of 10.
BUT, £20 for 5. They're now clearly taking the p155.
Not bothering. I think I'll stick using the HH stuff I have for small games of Xenos Rampant.
queen_annes_revenge wrote: Forge world finally moving completely away from making interesting figures for less mainstream characters into a pure heresy company. Sad.
Heresy and TOW, eventually. If their tone-deaf pricing continues on that, the latter will probably be the final nail in the coffin.
They're still making a fair number of Necromunda and Blood Bowl releases, with no sign of stopping that side of things any time soon.
queen_annes_revenge wrote: Forge world finally moving completely away from making interesting figures for less mainstream characters into a pure heresy company. Sad.
Heresy and TOW, eventually. If their tone-deaf pricing continues on that, the latter will probably be the final nail in the coffin.
They're still making a fair number of Necromunda and Blood Bowl releases, with no sign of stopping that side of things any time soon.
Forgeworld WHFB tanked before, while the system still got main-GW plastic support and regular marketing and releases. I don't want to doomsay or anything, but ultimately paying multiple hundreds of dollars for a single regiment in FW resin is not happening for the great majority of people, and especially not for a game that looks more like being DoA/stillborn with every lukewarm preview they're doing for it. If they really are investing a sizeable portion of their development and machine time in TOW that has a real chance at 'killing' FW so far as they cancel the whole thing and just focus on Heresy and Bloodbowl in the future, as these things sell reliably and predictably. I hope i'm wrong, but they really seem to go full-speed ahead at the Iceberg with that project.
TOW will work like lotr with a huge (old) plastic range to choose from, supported by MTOs and range rotation of some older metals and then continued by FW resin and the occasional plastic releases that support new books. At least I think that's how they will do this. 3 large fantasy ranges and universes from the same company are hard to handle, even for GW.
Sgt. Cortez wrote: TOW will work like lotr with a huge (old) plastic range to choose from, supported by MTOs and range rotation of some older metals and then continued by FW resin and the occasional plastic releases that support new books. At least I think that's how they will do this. 3 large fantasy ranges and universes from the same company are hard to handle, even for GW.
Don't forget that there seems to be something happening with LotR, what with the new films announced by New Line cinema and GW's cryptic mumblings about not being able to tell anything about the future of the game for now at Warhammerfest. There have been movements in license holdership in the recent past, who knows what all of this amounts to.
Well, this sucks. US preorders of the Deimos Vindicator are limited to 1.
Not to be terribly unreasonable, but with two variants, I wanted 2. There is such a thing as being too conservative about order protection. No idea if they'll sell out or when they'll be back if they do.
Got one despoiler upgrade, I wanted that Eviscerator, but I don't know what I'm going to do with the bits just yet. I'll probably hold on to it until the plastic Assault Squad kit arrives
Inductii Rules that Goonhammer posted on Discord Copy And Pasted directly before they were nuked from the server;
World eaters are very simple. Despoiler squads. Replace hotl with ravening madmen
AL is tacs, replace heart with treacherous lure, they can't be shot turn one except in interceptor reactions and >from scatters
Dark angels: replace bolters with volkite
White scars: despoilers, replace heart of the legion with proof of valour. You get a 5+ damage mitigation when locked in combat with an enemy unit with WS5+. If you save at least one wound with it and a unit survived that combat, at the end of the game you get 1VP
Death guard give up heart of the legion for Barbaran Resilience which gives a 5+ damage mitigation when 5 or fewer models are left, 6+ when 10 or fewer, or none above that. Plus 1 alchem flamer per 5 models
Night lords: They're for despoiler squads, they reduce sergeant leadership to 7, replace all chajnswords with killer blades (strength user ap - breaching 6+) and instead of heart of the legion you get a weird thing where you have a chance for a group of your guys to dogpile someone in a challenge
TS: Can't take asphyx weapons. Replace fury with Unattuned Practitioners. This gives the aetheric guidance power but stops them having a minor arcana. This powrr means when you shoot you can roll for it, if it passes the shooting gets breaching (6+) and if it fails it perils but with an extra wound
BA: Replace spite with Revenant Legion. This makes it so they can't sweeping advance but if they win a combat and their enemy is destroyed or falls back, they get Fear (1) for the rest of the game.
IW: Tacticals replace heart of the legion with a special rule that means you have to shoot the nearest unit in Los, but are immune to pinning Imperial fists: Tactical squad, 1 in 10 gets a heavy bolter or autocannon at a small cost, once per game you make attacks from those weapons have the pinning rule
Emperors children: despoilers. Everyone can switch their chainsword for a charnbal weapon for +5pts each. You also are considering ld10 for morale checks made in the shooting phase and for pinning. But you lose combats on the draw
Word Bearers: Despoiler squads, replaces hotl with Empty Vessels and Traitor. Empty vessels: you roll a die at the end of each game turn with a +1 bonus if that unit destroyed or swept a unit, and +1 if the enemy warlord is destroyed. On a 5+ they suffer d3 ap- hits, become corrupted and get furious charge (1)
Sons of Horus: Despoilers, replace chainswords with chainaxes for 1pt a model, replace spite with creed of brutality: if you start an assault phase within 6" of a ws5+ sons of Horus friendly, you get rampage (1) and furious charge (1) for the phase
Ravenguard: tactical Squads, replace hotl with Unchained Conviction. If you'd get pinned, don't: instead retreat 7". You can't retreat off the table
Iron Hands: tactical squads. Get Heavy. The sergeant can take a phosphex bomb for 10pts. Replace fury with forbidden augmentation. At the start of your turn rol a die for each unit of this kind. On a 1-2 they take d3 ap- wounds. On a 5-6 increase their WS and BS by 1 this turn
SW: depsoilers. They don't get a sergeant. You can replace bolt pistols with combat shields for free. You can upgrade chainswords to chainaxes for +1pt a model. Replace hotl with headstrong charge. When you charge you can declare it headstrong: +2 to charge distance (not beyond 12" still) but it's disordered
Salamanders: despoilers. Your sergeant gets WS5. 1 in ten replace their cahinseord with a dragons breath flamer for +5pts or a meltagun for +15pts. Replace spite with wargear of heroes: reroll all failed hit rolls of 1 in melee
Ultramarines are basically proto 40k tactical Squads. Lose fury but get inexorable. Capped at ten models. One in five can have a flamer (5pts), plasma gun (10pts) or meltagun (15pts)
WS already had a version of despoilers with the Dark Sons of Death that also have unique colored armor. Theyre all red though, and from the artbook, it looks like Inductii for Scars have black helmets with gold icons
Inductii Rules that Goonhammer posted on Discord
Copy And Pasted directly before they were nuked from the server;
World eaters are very simple. Despoiler squads. Replace hotl with ravening madmen
AL is tacs, replace heart with treacherous lure, they can't be shot turn one except in interceptor reactions and >from scatters
Dark angels: replace bolters with volkite
White scars: despoilers, replace heart of the legion with proof of valour. You get a 5+ damage mitigation when locked in combat with an enemy unit with WS5+. If you save at least one wound with it and a unit survived that combat, at the end of the game you get 1VP
Death guard give up heart of the legion for Barbaran Resilience which gives a 5+ damage mitigation when 5 or fewer models are left, 6+ when 10 or fewer, or none above that. Plus 1 alchem flamer per 5 models
Night lords: They're for despoiler squads, they reduce sergeant leadership to 7, replace all chajnswords with killer blades (strength user ap - breaching 6+) and instead of heart of the legion you get a weird thing where you have a chance for a group of your guys to dogpile someone in a challenge
TS: Can't take asphyx weapons. Replace fury with Unattuned Practitioners. This gives the aetheric guidance power but stops them having a minor arcana. This powrr means when you shoot you can roll for it, if it passes the shooting gets breaching (6+) and if it fails it perils but with an extra wound
BA: Replace spite with Revenant Legion. This makes it so they can't sweeping advance but if they win a combat and their enemy is destroyed or falls back, they get Fear (1) for the rest of the game.
IW: Tacticals replace heart of the legion with a special rule that means you have to shoot the nearest unit in Los, but are immune to pinning
Imperial fists: Tactical squad, 1 in 10 gets a heavy bolter or autocannon at a small cost, once per game you make attacks from those weapons have the pinning rule
Emperors children: despoilers. Everyone can switch their chainsword for a charnbal weapon for +5pts each. You also are considering ld10 for morale checks made in the shooting phase and for pinning. But you lose combats on the draw
Word Bearers: Despoiler squads, replaces hotl with Empty Vessels and Traitor. Empty vessels: you roll a die at the end of each game turn with a +1 bonus if that unit destroyed or swept a unit, and +1 if the enemy warlord is destroyed. On a 5+ they suffer d3 ap- hits, become corrupted and get furious charge (1)
Sons of Horus: Despoilers, replace chainswords with chainaxes for 1pt a model, replace spite with creed of brutality: if you start an assault phase within 6" of a ws5+ sons of Horus friendly, you get rampage (1) and furious charge (1) for the phase
Ravenguard: tactical Squads, replace hotl with Unchained Conviction. If you'd get pinned, don't: instead retreat 7". You can't retreat off the table
Iron Hands: tactical squads. Get Heavy. The sergeant can take a phosphex bomb for 10pts. Replace fury with forbidden augmentation. At the start of your turn rol a die for each unit of this kind. On a 1-2 they take d3 ap- wounds. On a 5-6 increase their WS and BS by 1 this turn
SW: depsoilers. They don't get a sergeant. You can replace bolt pistols with combat shields for free. You can upgrade chainswords to chainaxes for +1pt a model. Replace hotl with headstrong charge. When you charge you can declare it headstrong: +2 to charge distance (not beyond 12" still) but it's disordered
Salamanders: despoilers. Your sergeant gets WS5. 1 in ten replace their cahinseord with a dragons breath flamer for +5pts or a meltagun for +15pts. Replace spite with wargear of heroes: reroll all failed hit rolls of 1 in melee
Ultramarines are basically proto 40k tactical Squads. Lose fury but get inexorable. Capped at ten models. One in five can have a flamer (5pts), plasma gun (10pts) or meltagun (15pts)
The World Eaters one is interesting. While it does actually increase the Ravening Madmen ecosystem and expands it's uses, it's still a garbage rule. Like sure, it's better on them than the Red Butchers since they're cheaper, but it's still paying to give yourself a lobotomy.
Inductii Rules that Goonhammer posted on Discord
Copy And Pasted directly before they were nuked from the server;
World eaters are very simple. Despoiler squads. Replace hotl with ravening madmen
AL is tacs, replace heart with treacherous lure, they can't be shot turn one except in interceptor reactions and >from scatters
Dark angels: replace bolters with volkite
White scars: despoilers, replace heart of the legion with proof of valour. You get a 5+ damage mitigation when locked in combat with an enemy unit with WS5+. If you save at least one wound with it and a unit survived that combat, at the end of the game you get 1VP
Death guard give up heart of the legion for Barbaran Resilience which gives a 5+ damage mitigation when 5 or fewer models are left, 6+ when 10 or fewer, or none above that. Plus 1 alchem flamer per 5 models
Night lords: They're for despoiler squads, they reduce sergeant leadership to 7, replace all chajnswords with killer blades (strength user ap - breaching 6+) and instead of heart of the legion you get a weird thing where you have a chance for a group of your guys to dogpile someone in a challenge
TS: Can't take asphyx weapons. Replace fury with Unattuned Practitioners. This gives the aetheric guidance power but stops them having a minor arcana. This powrr means when you shoot you can roll for it, if it passes the shooting gets breaching (6+) and if it fails it perils but with an extra wound
BA: Replace spite with Revenant Legion. This makes it so they can't sweeping advance but if they win a combat and their enemy is destroyed or falls back, they get Fear (1) for the rest of the game.
IW: Tacticals replace heart of the legion with a special rule that means you have to shoot the nearest unit in Los, but are immune to pinning
Imperial fists: Tactical squad, 1 in 10 gets a heavy bolter or autocannon at a small cost, once per game you make attacks from those weapons have the pinning rule
Emperors children: despoilers. Everyone can switch their chainsword for a charnbal weapon for +5pts each. You also are considering ld10 for morale checks made in the shooting phase and for pinning. But you lose combats on the draw
Word Bearers: Despoiler squads, replaces hotl with Empty Vessels and Traitor. Empty vessels: you roll a die at the end of each game turn with a +1 bonus if that unit destroyed or swept a unit, and +1 if the enemy warlord is destroyed. On a 5+ they suffer d3 ap- hits, become corrupted and get furious charge (1)
Sons of Horus: Despoilers, replace chainswords with chainaxes for 1pt a model, replace spite with creed of brutality: if you start an assault phase within 6" of a ws5+ sons of Horus friendly, you get rampage (1) and furious charge (1) for the phase
Ravenguard: tactical Squads, replace hotl with Unchained Conviction. If you'd get pinned, don't: instead retreat 7". You can't retreat off the table
Iron Hands: tactical squads. Get Heavy. The sergeant can take a phosphex bomb for 10pts. Replace fury with forbidden augmentation. At the start of your turn rol a die for each unit of this kind. On a 1-2 they take d3 ap- wounds. On a 5-6 increase their WS and BS by 1 this turn
SW: depsoilers. They don't get a sergeant. You can replace bolt pistols with combat shields for free. You can upgrade chainswords to chainaxes for +1pt a model. Replace hotl with headstrong charge. When you charge you can declare it headstrong: +2 to charge distance (not beyond 12" still) but it's disordered
Salamanders: despoilers. Your sergeant gets WS5. 1 in ten replace their cahinseord with a dragons breath flamer for +5pts or a meltagun for +15pts. Replace spite with wargear of heroes: reroll all failed hit rolls of 1 in melee
Ultramarines are basically proto 40k tactical Squads. Lose fury but get inexorable. Capped at ten models. One in five can have a flamer (5pts), plasma gun (10pts) or meltagun (15pts)
Hmmm. Depending on exactly what that "chance" comes down to, the 8th Legion Inductii sound pretty fun. I love me some dirty fighting cheating scumbags.
Inductii Rules that Goonhammer posted on Discord
Copy And Pasted directly before they were nuked from the server;
World eaters are very simple. Despoiler squads. Replace hotl with ravening madmen
AL is tacs, replace heart with treacherous lure, they can't be shot turn one except in interceptor reactions and >from scatters
Dark angels: replace bolters with volkite
White scars: despoilers, replace heart of the legion with proof of valour. You get a 5+ damage mitigation when locked in combat with an enemy unit with WS5+. If you save at least one wound with it and a unit survived that combat, at the end of the game you get 1VP
Death guard give up heart of the legion for Barbaran Resilience which gives a 5+ damage mitigation when 5 or fewer models are left, 6+ when 10 or fewer, or none above that. Plus 1 alchem flamer per 5 models
Night lords: They're for despoiler squads, they reduce sergeant leadership to 7, replace all chajnswords with killer blades (strength user ap - breaching 6+) and instead of heart of the legion you get a weird thing where you have a chance for a group of your guys to dogpile someone in a challenge
TS: Can't take asphyx weapons. Replace fury with Unattuned Practitioners. This gives the aetheric guidance power but stops them having a minor arcana. This powrr means when you shoot you can roll for it, if it passes the shooting gets breaching (6+) and if it fails it perils but with an extra wound
BA: Replace spite with Revenant Legion. This makes it so they can't sweeping advance but if they win a combat and their enemy is destroyed or falls back, they get Fear (1) for the rest of the game.
IW: Tacticals replace heart of the legion with a special rule that means you have to shoot the nearest unit in Los, but are immune to pinning
Imperial fists: Tactical squad, 1 in 10 gets a heavy bolter or autocannon at a small cost, once per game you make attacks from those weapons have the pinning rule
Emperors children: despoilers. Everyone can switch their chainsword for a charnbal weapon for +5pts each. You also are considering ld10 for morale checks made in the shooting phase and for pinning. But you lose combats on the draw
Word Bearers: Despoiler squads, replaces hotl with Empty Vessels and Traitor. Empty vessels: you roll a die at the end of each game turn with a +1 bonus if that unit destroyed or swept a unit, and +1 if the enemy warlord is destroyed. On a 5+ they suffer d3 ap- hits, become corrupted and get furious charge (1)
Sons of Horus: Despoilers, replace chainswords with chainaxes for 1pt a model, replace spite with creed of brutality: if you start an assault phase within 6" of a ws5+ sons of Horus friendly, you get rampage (1) and furious charge (1) for the phase
Ravenguard: tactical Squads, replace hotl with Unchained Conviction. If you'd get pinned, don't: instead retreat 7". You can't retreat off the table
Iron Hands: tactical squads. Get Heavy. The sergeant can take a phosphex bomb for 10pts. Replace fury with forbidden augmentation. At the start of your turn rol a die for each unit of this kind. On a 1-2 they take d3 ap- wounds. On a 5-6 increase their WS and BS by 1 this turn
SW: depsoilers. They don't get a sergeant. You can replace bolt pistols with combat shields for free. You can upgrade chainswords to chainaxes for +1pt a model. Replace hotl with headstrong charge. When you charge you can declare it headstrong: +2 to charge distance (not beyond 12" still) but it's disordered
Salamanders: despoilers. Your sergeant gets WS5. 1 in ten replace their cahinseord with a dragons breath flamer for +5pts or a meltagun for +15pts. Replace spite with wargear of heroes: reroll all failed hit rolls of 1 in melee
Ultramarines are basically proto 40k tactical Squads. Lose fury but get inexorable. Capped at ten models. One in five can have a flamer (5pts), plasma gun (10pts) or meltagun (15pts)
Hmmm. Depending on exactly what that "chance" comes down to, the 8th Legion Inductii sound pretty fun. I love me some dirty fighting cheating scumbags.
yeah, the idea that the 8th's inductii are just a bunch of murderhobos with prison shivs ganging up on people is fantastic.
It's nothing if not thematic for the 8th and reminds me a bit of that short story where the Wolf pack is sent to keep an eye on Kurze but is promptly flickering-light-jumpscared to death by an entire ships worth of Night Lords before they even make it out of the hanger bay.
The 1st Legion Inductii looks like it could be fun for cheap CHOOM! spam. Although word is that they lose the Hexagrammaton rules so that means they can't be used with 4 of our 6 Legion RoWs (Not that they're particularly great anyway ).
God I hope there's something else for the WE one. Ravening Madmen is straight up worse than Heart of the Legion in... almost all situations. The only one where it's better is if you can get into combat with an elite power-weapon unit (Palantine Blades). It makes your guys better at tarpitting in that situation and that situation only; and that's if they don't just get swept.
On the flip side, the NL one sounds fething amazing. I'm seriously impressed with how the 8th's rules do an awesome job of encompassing the way the legion operates, while also being useful and fun.
morganfreeman wrote: God I hope there's something else for the WE one. Ravening Madmen is straight up worse than Heart of the Legion in... almost all situations. The only one where it's better is if you can get into combat with an elite power-weapon unit (Palantine Blades). It makes your guys better at tarpitting in that situation and that situation only; and that's if they don't just get swept.
But they're supposed to be worse than the proper Legionnaires…
I really like the Raven Guard one. Falling back 7" instead of being pinned is something I'll take any day for things like Tactical marines, and for a legion that gets more benefit for being further away from you. Really fun!
The Inductii seem interesting at least. I like to run huge blobs of infantry and a number of them seem to discourage/not affect those. As a Death Guard player mainly it'll be fun seeing the squad get tougher the smaller it gets (hope it can be taken for despoilers). A lot of the rules seem to be nailing the "different, not better" brief
Decurions seem...fine? Not sure why the vehicle selection needed to be so restricted, and the rule that you have to model them sticking out of a hatch is dumb (if I want to represent one by having a really fancy tank decked out with sensors and things, why not? are Decurions all supposed to be morons who want to be sniped at?). I love the idea of tank commanders though, so might have to make a fancy Kratos just to stick a Locus in
morganfreeman wrote: God I hope there's something else for the WE one. Ravening Madmen is straight up worse than Heart of the Legion in... almost all situations. The only one where it's better is if you can get into combat with an elite power-weapon unit (Palantine Blades). It makes your guys better at tarpitting in that situation and that situation only; and that's if they don't just get swept.
But they're supposed to be worse than the proper Legionnaires…
That’s a fair point. I guess I was operating in the assumption you’d pay for despoilers and get a straight up worse unit; being 1 or 2 points less would make them fine.
I guess the mind of the OG inductii; who required a character, but we’re straight up tacticals +1
WE Inductii lost scoring and had -1 BS but gained FNP 6+ and +1 Strength. They could also only be joined by Surlak or Apothecaries like the Destroyer Squad special rule.
The pros definitely outweighed the cons unless you only took Inductii then you would struggle to win objective games.
morganfreeman wrote: God I hope there's something else for the WE one. Ravening Madmen is straight up worse than Heart of the Legion in... almost all situations. The only one where it's better is if you can get into combat with an elite power-weapon unit (Palantine Blades). It makes your guys better at tarpitting in that situation and that situation only; and that's if they don't just get swept.
But they're supposed to be worse than the proper Legionnaires…
By the rules, they're basically tactical/despoilers with "support squad" and, in most cases, variations on heart of the legion / spite of the legion. Some of them are actually very good and some of them seem like there isn't much point to them. They don't look like they were very thoroughly playtested, but that sort of matches the whisperings I've heard that there is very little work done behind the scenes on the rules for the heresy.
They originally come form youtube hypemen that got an advance copy and got removed from their forum because they want to do two videos this week to hype the book even more, they're probably as accurate as it gets barring the odd typo.
To coincide with the Siege of Cthonia campaign book which went on pre-order today, several sets of shoulder pads for the Imperial Fists and Sons of Horus are returning for a short while on a Made to Order Basis, alongside one set of torsos.
These will be available to order on Friday, and will go off sale at 8am UK time on Monday the 5th of June. There are six sets available, all cast in resin: Imperial Fists MKIV Shoulder Pads and MKVI Shoulder Pads, and Sons of Horus MKIII Shoulder Pads, MKIV Shoulder Pads, Cataphractii Shoulder Pads, and MKIV Torsos.
Tamereth wrote: Are they going to be doing cataphractti pads for all the legions now?
They did start doing them a few years back, but stopped part way through and then they were discontinued. I always thought it was strange that they didn't bring them back when Cataphractii were in the 2nd ed launch box. But with the tease of reworked mk3 I honestly think a new kit, reworked to fit the current HH infantry design ethos(base kit plus separate upgrade sprues) is in the works.
Sgt. Cortez wrote: TOW will work like lotr with a huge (old) plastic range to choose from, supported by MTOs and range rotation of some older metals and then continued by FW resin and the occasional plastic releases that support new books. At least I think that's how they will do this. 3 large fantasy ranges and universes from the same company are hard to handle, even for GW.
Don't forget that there seems to be something happening with LotR, what with the new films announced by New Line cinema and GW's cryptic mumblings about not being able to tell anything about the future of the game for now at Warhammerfest. There have been movements in license holdership in the recent past, who knows what all of this amounts to.
They said they had loads to show, but couldn't right now. Big difference.
Very curious about those new tank driving centurions. Wonder what options they'll get? a way to mount an interesting pintle weapon perhaps? Or giving an invul to whatever tank their driving. Most likley you'll be able to take a signum to, but that's a lot of shooting to give up to pass on bs5 to the unit. Much like the solar tanks, except they can make some okay use with it by spamming vanquishers i suppose.
cody.d. wrote: Very curious about those new tank driving centurions. Wonder what options they'll get? a way to mount an interesting pintle weapon perhaps? Or giving an invul to whatever tank their driving. Most likley you'll be able to take a signum to, but that's a lot of shooting to give up to pass on bs5 to the unit. Much like the solar tanks, except they can make some okay use with it by spamming vanquishers i suppose.
According to goonhammer: you have to buy a normal gun too alongside the two generic ones any legion can take. They both give a buff related to shooting, one letting the squadron return fire/overwatch twice with their pintle guns, the other letting you return fire (but NOT overwatch) with a single battle weapon.
The imperial fists one gets an assault cannon or defensive weapon with skyfire or precision shots.
The sons of horus one gets a banner and banestrike bolt cannon, he buffs nearby infantry's morale/leadership/whatever and if anyone runs away he can shoot them like a commissar.
cody.d. wrote: Very curious about those new tank driving centurions. Wonder what options they'll get? a way to mount an interesting pintle weapon perhaps? Or giving an invul to whatever tank their driving. Most likley you'll be able to take a signum to, but that's a lot of shooting to give up to pass on bs5 to the unit. Much like the solar tanks, except they can make some okay use with it by spamming vanquishers i suppose.
According to goonhammer: you have to buy a normal gun too alongside the two generic ones any legion can take. They both give a buff related to shooting, one letting the squadron return fire/overwatch twice with their pintle guns, the other letting you return fire (but NOT overwatch) with a single battle weapon.
The imperial fists one gets an assault cannon or defensive weapon with skyfire or precision shots.
The sons of horus one gets a banner and banestrike bolt cannon, he buffs nearby infantry's morale/leadership/whatever and if anyone runs away he can shoot them like a commissar.
Oh, that's very very interesting. Returning fire with a battle weapon is very cool, especially since i'm 3rd legion who gets a buff to that. If it's one battle weapon per vehicle the character may be an auto take to me.
Inductii Rules that Goonhammer posted on Discord
Copy And Pasted directly before they were nuked from the server;
World eaters are very simple. Despoiler squads. Replace hotl with ravening madmen
AL is tacs, replace heart with treacherous lure, they can't be shot turn one except in interceptor reactions and >from scatters
Dark angels: replace bolters with volkite
White scars: despoilers, replace heart of the legion with proof of valour. You get a 5+ damage mitigation when locked in combat with an enemy unit with WS5+. If you save at least one wound with it and a unit survived that combat, at the end of the game you get 1VP
Death guard give up heart of the legion for Barbaran Resilience which gives a 5+ damage mitigation when 5 or fewer models are left, 6+ when 10 or fewer, or none above that. Plus 1 alchem flamer per 5 models
Night lords: They're for despoiler squads, they reduce sergeant leadership to 7, replace all chajnswords with killer blades (strength user ap - breaching 6+) and instead of heart of the legion you get a weird thing where you have a chance for a group of your guys to dogpile someone in a challenge
TS: Can't take asphyx weapons. Replace fury with Unattuned Practitioners. This gives the aetheric guidance power but stops them having a minor arcana. This powrr means when you shoot you can roll for it, if it passes the shooting gets breaching (6+) and if it fails it perils but with an extra wound
BA: Replace spite with Revenant Legion. This makes it so they can't sweeping advance but if they win a combat and their enemy is destroyed or falls back, they get Fear (1) for the rest of the game.
IW: Tacticals replace heart of the legion with a special rule that means you have to shoot the nearest unit in Los, but are immune to pinning
Imperial fists: Tactical squad, 1 in 10 gets a heavy bolter or autocannon at a small cost, once per game you make attacks from those weapons have the pinning rule
Emperors children: despoilers. Everyone can switch their chainsword for a charnbal weapon for +5pts each. You also are considering ld10 for morale checks made in the shooting phase and for pinning. But you lose combats on the draw
Word Bearers: Despoiler squads, replaces hotl with Empty Vessels and Traitor. Empty vessels: you roll a die at the end of each game turn with a +1 bonus if that unit destroyed or swept a unit, and +1 if the enemy warlord is destroyed. On a 5+ they suffer d3 ap- hits, become corrupted and get furious charge (1)
Sons of Horus: Despoilers, replace chainswords with chainaxes for 1pt a model, replace spite with creed of brutality: if you start an assault phase within 6" of a ws5+ sons of Horus friendly, you get rampage (1) and furious charge (1) for the phase
Ravenguard: tactical Squads, replace hotl with Unchained Conviction. If you'd get pinned, don't: instead retreat 7". You can't retreat off the table
Iron Hands: tactical squads. Get Heavy. The sergeant can take a phosphex bomb for 10pts. Replace fury with forbidden augmentation. At the start of your turn rol a die for each unit of this kind. On a 1-2 they take d3 ap- wounds. On a 5-6 increase their WS and BS by 1 this turn
SW: depsoilers. They don't get a sergeant. You can replace bolt pistols with combat shields for free. You can upgrade chainswords to chainaxes for +1pt a model. Replace hotl with headstrong charge. When you charge you can declare it headstrong: +2 to charge distance (not beyond 12" still) but it's disordered
Salamanders: despoilers. Your sergeant gets WS5. 1 in ten replace their cahinseord with a dragons breath flamer for +5pts or a meltagun for +15pts. Replace spite with wargear of heroes: reroll all failed hit rolls of 1 in melee
Ultramarines are basically proto 40k tactical Squads. Lose fury but get inexorable. Capped at ten models. One in five can have a flamer (5pts), plasma gun (10pts) or meltagun (15pts)
I have two questions as an AL player:
1. Are your tacs often something that gets targeted t1? Like if you don't run into a militia player that got PTSD from fury of the legion boltguns and therefore brought WW1 levels of artillery to the battle in order to surpress tacs or heavy weapons squads, i feel like my tacs survive the longest preciscly because no other marine or even admech player pays them any attention.
2. Is the effect spreading to transports? I can think an untargetable tank push T1 could be horrendous, even if the contents are glorified conscripts.
Bit random this one sprue pic exists but the lancer sprues don't, I wonder if they'll be separate upgrade sprues or individual kits with a shared chassis.
GoatboyBeta wrote: Nice to see confirmation that its not just the Lancer going plastic.
Also the reveal is pretty imminent, as this sprue is probably one that got sent out under NDA for being painted by a youtuber or whatever. We might get an emergency reveal this week even, GW usually does them when sprue/model pics get released into the wild out of turn, to control public perception.
GoatboyBeta wrote: Nice to see confirmation that its not just the Lancer going plastic.
Also the reveal is pretty imminent, as this sprue is probably one that got sent out under NDA for being painted by a youtuber or whatever. We might get an emergency reveal this week even, GW usually does them when sprue/model pics get released into the wild out of turn, to control public perception.
Need to remember the "other lords of war" are due in Autumn, so this is too early for painters imo.
GoatboyBeta wrote: Nice to see confirmation that its not just the Lancer going plastic.
Also the reveal is pretty imminent, as this sprue is probably one that got sent out under NDA for being painted by a youtuber or whatever. We might get an emergency reveal this week even, GW usually does them when sprue/model pics get released into the wild out of turn, to control public perception.
Need to remember the "other lords of war" are due in Autumn, so this is too early for painters imo.
I don't know how far in advance these usually get sent out, but depending on what definition of autum we're talking about, that could be as near as 3.5 months (1. of September going by the meteorological calendar), so it could be possible imho.
Definitely nice to see these Knights going plastic. It'll open up access to more hobbyists when they invariably drop in price from resin to plastic, and it also opens up the possibility that we could see the entries in the Imperial Knights and Chaos Knights codexes instead of in a 'forgeworld index'.
Makes me wonder if we'll see Chaos versions of these, or if we'll see the Mechanicus Knights get ported over to Plastic as well.
This is just more stuff that FW isn't going to be worrying about. Really seems like they're actively downsizing FW.
drbored wrote: Makes me wonder if we'll see Chaos versions of these, or if we'll see the Mechanicus Knights get ported over to Plastic as well.
The previewed Lancer had the Sons of Horus symbol on the top plate - people mentioned other options to go there.
I doubt we'll see a fully "Chaos Knight" version, though - at least for now.
They seem to be quite content in making money of things that can be both chaos or loyalist for now - going 'full chaos' anything is a whole new phase of the line, and much more risky than doing endless basic marine and tank variants, or even some of the non-marine forces in plastic. I guess it will be years until we see substantial full chaos kits in plastic.
Likely not, as it would be more than a single sprue swap like the acheron and castigator. FW possibly will change it from a full resin kit to a hybrid that uses the plastic core body though.
The Acheron sprue looks like a pair of arms and head. Bit hard to tell if the fuel tanks will remain mounted on the back of the hips like the resin model, or are shifted to sit on the back of the cannon arm. Either way it looks like the big fuel cable is gone.
Not really? The flamer and chainfist are on opposite arms with the chain being attached closer to the “wrist” of the fist section.
Also the flamer barrels are directly attached to the front of the mechanism, projecting from the shield.
Mr_Rose wrote: Not really? The flamer and chainfist are on opposite arms with the chain being attached closer to the “wrist” of the fist section.
Also the flamer barrels are directly attached to the front of the mechanism, projecting from the shield.
Yeah, usually with GW models you'd think the lower arm would attach at the shield, but for this model it attaches much farther behind.
Also, in their promo shots the flamer looks longer due to the angle and posing, but if you take another perspective the arms look about equally long in total:
totally out of the sort of scale appropriate for 40k but regardless it looks nice
I have one of the first plastic ones they did, bought on the day of its release
hated painting it, the thing was just too big and ended up as such a waste
still pondering another though (for 30k) not so much to actively use but for an opponent of mine who likes cheese to know I have as a sort of background threat
would need to clear space to display it here though
Seems to have lost the fuel hose, which is certainly good from a posing perspective. Good to see more than just the Lancer getting redone in plastic, I feared a similar route to what they did with some of the tanks.
Wow, so happy I've got the resin one when it was first released. All those two part bits with gaping seam lines and the 'joy' of cleaning every single tooth of that chainsword...Reeee
I’m guessing the fuel line is on another sprue with the shoulder armor. All three Imperial Cerastus Knights not only have different weapons and heads but different shoulders as well. The Mechanicum Cerastus Knight will probably be redesigned as a resin upgrade since it has different shins and back carapace.
I'm glad the radar dish/hatch on my Salamander one was in a different box from the gak that got jacked.
Was considering grabbing another one for my EC but not for $28 bucks considering it doesn't have the cool commander and console. I'm just gonna repaint it in a neutral scheme that works for either.
Snrub wrote: That would be the logical assumption. However this is GW we're dealing with, so I wouldn't be shocked if they tried that on just to see what'd happen.
Hanlons razor is getting mightly blunt with the ammount GW requires it.
Smaug wrote: I’m guessing the fuel line is on another sprue with the shoulder armor. All three Imperial Cerastus Knights not only have different weapons and heads but different shoulders as well. The Mechanicum Cerastus Knight will probably be redesigned as a resin upgrade since it has different shins and back carapace.
I can't imagine there'd be a second extra sprue for the other patterns, I would think either we will lose the variation in shoulder pads or possibly the main kit will include multiple shoulder pads, depending on space. I suspect the fuel line may just be gone unfortunately.
Alpharius wrote: Anyone know why plastic Jetbikes remain so difficult to order - even from GW directly?
Because the automated systems in the new warehouse are still riddled with bugs. From what I've heard, it's a problem that doesn't seem to have light at the end of the tunnel as yet.
£27.50 for the Imperial Fists Decurion
Nearly thirty quid for half a model. The guy doesnt even have legs.
One day i wont experience sticker shock with FW prices anymore, but today is not that day.
I do love his helmeted option tho... must. not. buy...
Nearly £30 for half a model is a bit too rich for my blood. This is my biggest shock from them in a while in terms of how they price things. I really like the mini and think it's class but not that much.
When you consider the Libby is the same price... What a whiff.
Tyranid Horde wrote: Nearly £30 for half a model is a bit too rich for my blood. This is my biggest shock from them in a while in terms of how they price things. I really like the mini and think it's class but not that much.
When you consider the Libby is the same price... What a whiff.
Still better than AL headhunters. Those are half marine infantry...
Not that this is any better though.
Nicky J wrote: £27.50 for the Imperial Fists Decurion
Nearly thirty quid for half a model. The guy doesnt even have legs.
One day i wont experience sticker shock with FW prices anymore, but today is not that day.
I do love his helmeted option tho... must. not. buy...
I've turned to FW bits sellers, which are by no means cheap, but save you from having to buy the full model. Mainly because there are certain bits on FW models that I really, really like, but either the price or the rest of the model turns me away. Egg head miniatures is my go-to, though there may be cheaper alternatives.
The issue is that most people usually are gunning for the same bits, ie, heads, so unless you're waiting for their restocks to go live, you'll probably miss out. I did get the esoterist consul helmet though, so its def worth a shot
queen_annes_revenge wrote: I'll be waiting for the cheaper alternatives that we can't talk about here. That's completely ridiculous pricing.
there are a number of remarkably skilled individuals who create alternatives (and entirely legal, free of any IP issues with original works), I can't imagine it will take long
ZM certainly seems fun but I've not had a chance (or a board) to use them yet.
The NL Inductii are Despoilers that lose a Ld on the Sarge, swap their Chainswords for Breaching (6+) knives and you can get two extra models to fight at Initiative 10 in a Challenge (3 total). These extra models do have a chance of knifing the Sarge instead but it's only if you roll a 1 for their test.
The story itself is really good IMO and definitely worth a proper read. Also, it has pretty pictures.
It's much better for SoH or Fists players but as someone who loved the OG campaign books, this is definitely up to par with the previous installations without having that requirement of them being vital rulebooks.
Gert wrote: The NL Inductii are Despoilers that lose a Ld on the Sarge, swap their Chainswords for Breaching (6+) knives and you can get two extra models to fight at Initiative 10 in a Challenge (3 total). These extra models do have a chance of knifing the Sarge instead but it's only if you roll a 1 for their test.
I also feel it important to point out that Inductees are both Support and Line.
Oh yeah forgot about the basic Inductii rules.
Inductii become Support Squads, can't be joined by Characters or assigned Characters, and can't take Artificer.
As additional troops I like them and NL have one that has cool rules and fits their background perfectly.
Gert wrote: ZM certainly seems fun but I've not had a chance (or a board) to use them yet.
We're having a lot of fun playing ZM at 1500 points. As an IH player it's taking some adjusting to only having a single dreadnought and not having tanks - but that's a good thing!
Gert wrote: ZM certainly seems fun but I've not had a chance (or a board) to use them yet.
The NL Inductii are Despoilers that lose a Ld on the Sarge, swap their Chainswords for Breaching (6+) knives and you can get two extra models to fight at Initiative 10 in a Challenge (3 total). These extra models do have a chance of knifing the Sarge instead but it's only if you roll a 1 for their test.
The story itself is really good IMO and definitely worth a proper read. Also, it has pretty pictures.
It's much better for SoH or Fists players but as someone who loved the OG campaign books, this is definitely up to par with the previous installations without having that requirement of them being vital rulebooks.
Wait, wait, wait. You mean if you roll a for the test they knife their own sergeant? That's........ hilarious.
Best, Night Lords rules, ever! These guys really get the 8th Legion.
"All those Loyalist Marines are swearing an Oath of Moment at my unit in the middle of a battle. I must pray harder at my gun! AHH! It exlpoded!"
Pretty much, H.B.M.C, pretty much.........
.........
................
....................Y'know, at this point, I'm beginning to think that the 40k rules writers trying to drive CSM players into the open arms of HH.
morganfreeman wrote: 30k seems legitimately better in every way, unless you absolutely cannot love without seeing your sm gunning down orks or something.
I can only perform if Dawn of War replays are showing in the background...
I am at a point where I love the direction of the aesthetics for 40k (especially the new 'nids and Terminators) but have no interest in the gameplay much less force building.
But 30K...been a fan since the 1st Black Book came out (well, really Adeptus Titanicus box set from back in the 1990s or so) and will continue to be a fan. I now just have more tanks.
That reads like they put the roll bit at the wrong point in the paragraph.
Lead with the bit about 10 or more models not being affected, then in the bit about nine or fewer, start with roll a d6 each time an unsaved Wound is suffered.
Dysartes wrote: That reads like they put the roll bit at the wrong point in the paragraph.
Lead with the bit about 10 or more models not being affected, then in the bit about nine or fewer, start with roll a d6 each time an unsaved Wound is suffered.
What's the final outcome, anyway?
The final outcome is a reroll for the dice that does nothing.
Dysartes wrote: That reads like they put the roll bit at the wrong point in the paragraph.
Lead with the bit about 10 or more models not being affected, then in the bit about nine or fewer, start with roll a d6 each time an unsaved Wound is suffered.
What's the final outcome, anyway?
The final outcome is a reroll for the dice that does nothing.
I... what?
Given how the image cut off, I thought the sub-10 unit size would explain what happened. That's just weird.
It's the Death Guard Indictii special rule. The rule means that the lower the unit size, the better the damage mitigation save. Less than ten is 6+ and less than five is 5+. It's not a reroll.
Dysartes wrote: That reads like they put the roll bit at the wrong point in the paragraph.
Lead with the bit about 10 or more models not being affected, then in the bit about nine or fewer, start with roll a d6 each time an unsaved Wound is suffered.
What's the final outcome, anyway?
The final outcome is a reroll for the dice that does nothing.
My favourite HH thing is that Land Speeders have a Chainsword as a combat weapon which means World Eaters can swap it for Chainaxes.
Land Speeders aren't vehicles, they are chariots.
Gert wrote: My favourite HH thing is that Land Speeders have a Chainsword as a combat weapon which means World Eaters can swap it for Chainaxes.
Land Speeders aren't vehicles, they are chariots.
Only one chainsword and bolt pistol, split between two dudes. Peak GW rules writing.
morganfreeman wrote: 30k seems legitimately better in every way, unless you absolutely cannot love without seeing your sm gunning down orks or something.
Or, if, like me, your primary army (and love) is Orks, which somehow were a HUGE threat at Ullanor but never troubled anyone ever again until after the Heresy.
"Look, da humies is havin' wot we call a family crisis, so we should just give 'em some time to work it out. Then come back in, say, a thousand years and krump 'em all good."
morganfreeman wrote: 30k seems legitimately better in every way, unless you absolutely cannot love without seeing your sm gunning down orks or something.
Or, if, like me, your primary army (and love) is Orks, which somehow were a HUGE threat at Ullanor but never troubled anyone ever again until after the Heresy.
"Look, da humies is havin' wot we call a family crisis, so we should just give 'em some time to work it out. Then come back in, say, a thousand years and krump 'em all good."
Incidentally you could make Militia with the right provenances into quite orky territory.
Also, since it's 7th ed based still, you could probably run the 7th ed codex. with some points changes i rekon.
Honestly the absence of orks has to do with the success of the great cursade, that they aren't a really resuring factor in the HH is a bit wierd tho.
There was a series of fan produced xenos army books made up for 30k 1.0. Had Orks, Eldar and I think Necrons. They were geared towards the 30k ruleset a bit more then the 40k codicies, so they might port over well to 2.0.
Can't for the life of me remember the dudes name. But he had actual books made up for them. Lovely green covers they had.
The game is Horus Heresy, not Warhammer 30k, so it makes sense the focus is about the civil war in the empire of man, not bothering with Eldar and Orks even if they are part of the overall setting.
That said it would be really cool to se an Ullanor expansion/prequel in the future.
Voss wrote: Same argument was made for Space Marine (Epic), oddly enough. It was 'about the Heresy,' but wow was it better with more stuff.
You remember such ancient times? I dont mind xenos in Warhammer 40k but i do mind them in Horus Heresy.
I have no problems with games like Adeptus Titanicus to jump forward 10k years and have all the xenos fun. I would actually prefer this. If you want to jump 10k from Horus Heresy i believe there is a game like this already - its called Warhammer 40k.
Gert wrote: One of the guys is driving the speeder my guy. Its literally a chariot where there's the driver and the archer/spear thrower/Marine with Chainaxe.
any sci-fi game with a flying chariot crewed by an axe wielding lunatic is a game worth playing
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Gert wrote: There are fan-made Ork rules for 2.0 at least in development if not already completed.
Any official rules would be a big mistake on GWs part. It's the Horus Heresy, not Warhammer 30k.
actually having a "Warhammer 30,000" expansion wouldn't be a bad thing, but as its own thing
though to be honest if you have a 6th/7th or even older ork codex you can probably get by, heck even back to 1st edition with a bit of adjustment works
Voss wrote: Same argument was made for Space Marine (Epic), oddly enough. It was 'about the Heresy,' but wow was it better with more stuff.
Different scale and game though. Epic isn't worrying about the individual Legions getting rules or the Provenances of the Militia nor is it worrying about the individual weapons of units. It's easier to balance a game when a bunch of units just had Small Arms and Assault Weapons rather than Bolters, Shuriken Catapults, Shootas, Chainswords, and Choppas.
leopard wrote: actually having a "Warhammer 30,000" expansion wouldn't be a bad thing, but as its own thing
though to be honest if you have a 6th/7th or even older ork codex you can probably get by, heck even back to 1st edition with a bit of adjustment works
Agree to disagree. The argument for Xenos in HH largely boils down to people not being happy with 40k and wanting a better currently supported system. While I sympathise, it doesn't mean the HH setting should have other stuff tacked on just because the current edition of 40k isn't enjoyed by some.
Voss wrote: Same argument was made for Space Marine (Epic), oddly enough. It was 'about the Heresy,' but wow was it better with more stuff.
You remember such ancient times? I dont mind xenos in Warhammer 40k but i do mind them in Horus Heresy.
I have no problems with games like Adeptus Titanicus to jump forward 10k years and have all the xenos fun. I would actually prefer this. If you want to jump 10k from Horus Heresy i believe there is a game like this already - its called Warhammer 40k.
No one said anything about jumping forward in time. Just... not pretending that the aliens around at the time mysteriously don't exist and won't try to take advantage of everything going on.
And that the canonical, recorded battles against said xenos didn't happen - Fulgrim and the Emperor's Children, for example, were happily shooting eldar in the face around the time of the daemonsword fiasco.
Platuan4th wrote: Your mean the fight that occurred before the Heresy and was about Eldrad specifically trying to warn Fulgrim about said coming event?
The novel series shows parts of the Great Crusade to give context to the actions taken by certain characters. It's the same reason that when WW2 is taught in schools the rise of the Nazis is included. Don't be dense.
Ultimately, EPIC without Xenos will not do well - or not nearly as well as it could do with them in it.
OG AT was limited because GW itself was at that time.
Doing this either at launch or shortly thereafter as either a Great Crusade and/or Scourging game would be a smart play.
I'm concerned that doing as a HH game only will only mean that when it falters, it will be used as a "See, this scale just doesn't work!" when in reality it would be faltering only because is was hamstrung out of the gate...
*EDIT*
Oops! Wrong thread!
However, I really would like to see a "Great Crusade" expansion that would bring in Eldar, Orks, etc. into the "HH" game setting...
, and then my opinion softened over time but the 'what could have been' remains.
).
Wait, wait, wait. You mean if you roll a 
for the test they knife their own sergeant? That's........ 
hilarious. 
