Ossiachs are a good comparison, as this point Sisters are practically a new army too. It is utterly absurd to leave the faction effectively unplayable for this long.
Casbyness wrote: This is a masterclass in how to completely kill the hype for a product that you carefully built up for almost two full years.
I feel like when the preorders for the rest of the range finally go up we should just ignore them for at least a month, in revenge for this pointless wait.
Some of this I expected based on the wording in some of the preview articles (some things were direct about jan/feb, others were a more vague 'next year'). Especially for things like the zephyrim, which were very late on the promo pictures- and completely missed the book's deadlines.
I didn't expect the HQ (a major lynchpin to having a playable army at all) to be one of the delayed models. Its a baffling choice or a terrible mix-up.
yeah deff annoying. I'll just take it slow and steady on painting what I have, try not to elt it bother me, I've still not assmbled all my basic troops yet. and I've gotta paint em before basing them due to the type of basing I'm doing
No they won't. Release schedule was locked up months ago. Models could very well still be not even produced yet and likely aren't let alone packed and eady to go
Can see the logic behind splitting up the release, can't see much logic in the way they split it.
It's not like I'm now going to buy Junith just because I need an HQ and she is one of he few ones available. She's the wrong Order for me, and if I get her for conversion potential, I'd get her regardless. Since the starter box, I have in fact purchased nothing yet, as I want to kitbash the sets and won't assemble most figures until the other minis are available too. Would like to have all the head and weapon options out there before deciding how to equip everybody...
Coenus Scaldingus wrote: Can see the logic behind splitting up the release, can't see much logic in the way they split it.
It's not like I'm now going to buy Junith just because I need an HQ and she is one of he few ones available. She's the wrong Order for me, and if I get her for conversion potential, I'd get her regardless. Since the starter box, I have in fact purchased nothing yet, as I want to kitbash the sets and won't assemble most figures until the other minis are available too. Would like to have all the head and weapon options out there before deciding how to equip everybody...
Yep. Order of releases is odd.
As it is I expected to get most of the kits(maybe something like 10) in first 1-3 weeks and then rest summer-autumn(among them seraphims who were specifically called "sometime next year" rather than january which was noted elsewhere, maybe terrain, could see dialogus and maybe rhino or immolator.
And with that I would have been fine. But key units being unavailable after 5 weeks? And wouldn't surprise me if 7.3 is earliest for preorders for next sisters...Almost 2 months from codex coming out before you can hope to have core units in your army. Gee.
Wish we even knew what MONTH next batch comes. I have some cash budgeted for canonesses(2) and imagifiers(3) I need to buy this month. But if nothing new comes this month(like it starts to look) then might just as well buy pair of exorcists...Ah well. At least next sunday knows whether I can go to tournament or not so guess I can use that to decide. Even if they get announced week later I can skip them until next month as it's too late anyway
maybe GW was concerned Sisters won't sell as well as hoped (yeah utterly stupid I agree) and thus want other releases in the month to ensure monthly sales have some padding.
BrianDavion wrote: maybe GW was concerned Sisters won't sell as well as hoped (yeah utterly stupid I agree) and thus want other releases in the month to ensure monthly sales have some padding.
Or the opposite? They were worried it would take more demand than production capacity and therefore spaced them out to allow for production of lower selling kits and spreading sales out over multiple months.
We can speculate about this forever. But is was an odd choice to put out Judith before the Canoness.
Is it really though? After the way the Marine stuff was handled, this shouldn't be too big of a shock.
As it is I expected to get most of the kits(maybe something like 10) in first 1-3 weeks and then rest summer-autumn(among them seraphims who were specifically called "sometime next year" rather than january which was noted elsewhere, maybe terrain, could see dialogus and maybe rhino or immolator.
"Early next Year" was the terminology used. Which was the same as for the AdMech flyer, which we now know to be an April release.
And with that I would have been fine. But key units being unavailable after 5 weeks? And wouldn't surprise me if 7.3 is earliest for preorders for next sisters...Almost 2 months from codex coming out before you can hope to have core units in your army. Gee.
Three months from C: SM to the release of Infiltrators/Incursors, so I feel ya.
Wish we even knew what MONTH next batch comes. I have some cash budgeted for canonesses(2) and imagifiers(3) I need to buy this month. But if nothing new comes this month(like it starts to look) then might just as well buy pair of exorcists...Ah well. At least next sunday knows whether I can go to tournament or not so guess I can use that to decide. Even if they get announced week later I can skip them until next month as it's too late anyway
I'm guessing February 15th for the preorders on the remaining Sisters stuff.
C:sm had playable armies from get go. Especially wave 2 is completely different as they had generic hq's, troops etc already in. You could start army and get playable even without impulsor or special characters. Sisters are still something you can't really play.
Compare ossiriach that is actually comparable new faction start who got full release in 2 weeks and more than sisters have got in 5.
Apples and oranges. Marine wave 2 comparison is valid only if gw had removed all previous models from sale before that. Infiltrators missing? They are hardly only troop choice marines had now were they?
Kanluwen wrote: Three months from C: SM to the release of Infiltrators/Incursors, so I feel ya.
As annoying that was, it's not like Marines were unplayable without them.
They were for someone who was getting into them for a Vanguard list.
Because hey, let's not pretend that Sisters aren't playable now if you were someone who bought the Limited box or are willing to do some conversions/kitbashes.
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tneva82 wrote: C:sm had playable armies from get go. Especially wave 2 is completely different as they had generic hq's, troops etc already in. You could start army and get playable even without impulsor or special characters. Sisters are still something you can't really play.
Compare ossiriach that is actually comparable new faction start who got full release in 2 weeks and more than sisters have got in 5.
Yes, and Ossiarchs were an outlier rather than the norm.
Apples and oranges. Marine wave 2 comparison is valid only if gw had removed all previous models from sale before that. Infiltrators missing? They are hardly only troop choice marines had now were they?
You're not missing troops, and you've missed the point. Book dropped, Infiltrators/Incursors got hyped up as a new troop choice for Vanguard forces...and if you didn't have Shadowspear, you were waiting until the IF/Salamander books for them. Because reasons.
Hopefully the releases are soon to finish out the range. But they might not be, so buckle up.
Kanluwen wrote: Three months from C: SM to the release of Infiltrators/Incursors, so I feel ya.
As annoying that was, it's not like Marines were unplayable without them.
They were for someone who was getting into them for a Vanguard list.
Because hey, let's not pretend that Sisters aren't playable now if you were someone who bought the Limited box or are willing to do some conversions/kitbashes.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
tneva82 wrote: C:sm had playable armies from get go. Especially wave 2 is completely different as they had generic hq's, troops etc already in. You could start army and get playable even without impulsor or special characters. Sisters are still something you can't really play.
Compare ossiriach that is actually comparable new faction start who got full release in 2 weeks and more than sisters have got in 5.
Yes, and Ossiarchs were an outlier rather than the norm.
Apples and oranges. Marine wave 2 comparison is valid only if gw had removed all previous models from sale before that. Infiltrators missing? They are hardly only troop choice marines had now were they?
You're not missing troops, and you've missed the point. Book dropped, Infiltrators/Incursors got hyped up as a new troop choice for Vanguard forces...and if you didn't have Shadowspear, you were waiting until the IF/Salamander books for them. Because reasons.
Hopefully the releases are soon to finish out the range. But they might not be, so buckle up.
It's still a really stupid comparison. Imagifiers and Canonesses are mandatory to playing the army AT ALL and Seraphim and Zephyrim are two of the most competitive options in the book with Seraphim also being one of two total fast attack options. Saying 'just do some conversions bro' only emphasizes how stupid GW's strategy is because it entails replacing about 300-400$ worth of plastics to actually make a really good army list and 150-200$ worth of plastics to make a list you can play AT ALL.
Infiltrators and Incursors were fluff units for Corvax cosplayers who should really be using intercessors anyway. Utterly irrelevant to the army.
Kanluwen wrote: Three months from C: SM to the release of Infiltrators/Incursors, so I feel ya.
As annoying that was, it's not like Marines were unplayable without them.
They were for someone who was getting into them for a Vanguard list.
Because hey, let's not pretend that Sisters aren't playable now if you were someone who bought the Limited box or are willing to do some conversions/kitbashes.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
tneva82 wrote: C:sm had playable armies from get go. Especially wave 2 is completely different as they had generic hq's, troops etc already in. You could start army and get playable even without impulsor or special characters. Sisters are still something you can't really play.
Compare ossiriach that is actually comparable new faction start who got full release in 2 weeks and more than sisters have got in 5.
Yes, and Ossiarchs were an outlier rather than the norm.
Apples and oranges. Marine wave 2 comparison is valid only if gw had removed all previous models from sale before that. Infiltrators missing? They are hardly only troop choice marines had now were they?
You're not missing troops, and you've missed the point. Book dropped, Infiltrators/Incursors got hyped up as a new troop choice for Vanguard forces...and if you didn't have Shadowspear, you were waiting until the IF/Salamander books for them. Because reasons.
Hopefully the releases are soon to finish out the range. But they might not be, so buckle up.
It's still a really stupid comparison. Imagifiers and Canonesses are mandatory to playing the army AT ALL and Seraphim and Zephyrim are two of the most competitive options in the book with Seraphim also being one of two total fast attack options. Saying 'just do some conversions bro' only emphasizes how stupid GW's strategy is because it entails replacing about 300-400$ worth of plastics to actually make a really good army list and 150-200$ worth of plastics to make a list you can play AT ALL.
Infiltrators and Incursors were fluff units for Corvax cosplayers who should really be using intercessors anyway. Utterly irrelevant to the army.
While I agree it is a poor comparison, you don't get to decide which units other people think are relevant to their army, or what they should be using in their army.
The generic units which were shown as part of Codex: SM 2.0 taking as long to come out as they did is still an odd move, regardless of what you may think of said units.
Canoness is pretty essential seeing it's only generic sister HQ there is...It's not like marines where "oh librarian is bit delayed so I'll take captain instead". It's "oh canoness is delayed, I have no HQ to pick"§
Keep in mind no Marine player is saying "We had it worse" or even "Marines where just as bad" they're saying "Yes, Marines had a slow ass release too and we hated it, we feel your pain sisters"
Marine players are empathizing with sisters. IMHO marine and sister players should both start making some news to GW about this, frankly it's annoying to have GW drop releases for other 40k products when your army release isn't finished and this is the second time they'd dropped PA in the middle of an armies major release. which leads to hard feelings all around.
when PA1 came out marine players where frustrated as they where still waiting for their stuff Eldar players where frustrated because they felt like their release's thunder was stolen. No one was happy
Casbyness wrote: This is a masterclass in how to completely kill the hype for a product that you carefully built up for almost two full years.
I feel like when the preorders for the rest of the range finally go up we should just ignore them for at least a month, in revenge for this pointless wait.
Some of this I expected based on the wording in some of the preview articles (some things were direct about jan/feb, others were a more vague 'next year'). Especially for things like the zephyrim, which were very late on the promo pictures- and completely missed the book's deadlines.
I didn't expect the HQ (a major lynchpin to having a playable army at all) to be one of the delayed models. Its a baffling choice or a terrible mix-up.
Much Like the Space Wolves base marines kit you can put together a decent cannoness with the parts provided in the battle sisters kit. little bit of cutting and gluing you could probably get most of the options.
Much Like the Space Wolves base marines kit you can put together a decent cannoness with the parts provided in the battle sisters kit. little bit of cutting and gluing you could probably get most of the options.
Options? Maybe half (rod, fire, inferno pistol all seem to not be in the sisters kit).
More importantly, the canoness should stand out a bit, not blend into the basic squads.
Most importantly, it shouldn't even vaguely be an issue. GW makes a big deal about selling valid armies even out of things like the 'start collecting' boxes. For a redone line to go for a month (and counting) without the very basics of a valid army is ridiculous and completely on them. They've managed to pull new and revamped armies into existence with little trouble (and will be doing so again in the near future). Screwing this one up is baffling- you don't make entry level screw ups of your own standards 30+ years on.
Much Like the Space Wolves base marines kit you can put together a decent cannoness with the parts provided in the battle sisters kit. little bit of cutting and gluing you could probably get most of the options.
Options? Maybe half (rod, fire, inferno pistol all seem to not be in the sisters kit).
More importantly, the canoness should stand out a bit, not blend into the basic squads.
Most importantly, it shouldn't even vaguely be an issue. GW makes a big deal about selling valid armies even out of things like the 'start collecting' boxes. For a redone line to go for a month (and counting) without the very basics of a valid army is ridiculous and completely on them. They've managed to pull new and revamped armies into existence with little trouble (and will be doing so again in the near future). Screwing this one up is baffling- you don't make entry level screw ups of your own standards 30+ years on.
IMHO the basic release should have been "canoness, battle sisters, and retributors" that would have been eneugh to build basic units to fill the HQ, Troops, Heavy support, elites and fast attacks. all with 3 basic kits. I woinder if they're holding back on required stuff so as to keep attention. by holding the cannoness for last it means people don't buy an army and stop paying attention when the other goodies come out
Casbyness wrote: This is a masterclass in how to completely kill the hype for a product that you carefully built up for almost two full years.
I feel like when the preorders for the rest of the range finally go up we should just ignore them for at least a month, in revenge for this pointless wait.
Some of this I expected based on the wording in some of the preview articles (some things were direct about jan/feb, others were a more vague 'next year'). Especially for things like the zephyrim, which were very late on the promo pictures- and completely missed the book's deadlines.
I didn't expect the HQ (a major lynchpin to having a playable army at all) to be one of the delayed models. Its a baffling choice or a terrible mix-up.
Much Like the Space Wolves base marines kit you can put together a decent cannoness with the parts provided in the battle sisters kit. little bit of cutting and gluing you could probably get most of the options.
How to separate her from sister superior then? Canoness doesn't even have any gear that comes in basic box that's not available to superiors so can't do that either.
Much Like the Space Wolves base marines kit you can put together a decent cannoness with the parts provided in the battle sisters kit. little bit of cutting and gluing you could probably get most of the options.
Options? Maybe half (rod, fire, inferno pistol all seem to not be in the sisters kit).
More importantly, the canoness should stand out a bit, not blend into the basic squads.
Most importantly, it shouldn't even vaguely be an issue. GW makes a big deal about selling valid armies even out of things like the 'start collecting' boxes. For a redone line to go for a month (and counting) without the very basics of a valid army is ridiculous and completely on them. They've managed to pull new and revamped armies into existence with little trouble (and will be doing so again in the near future). Screwing this one up is baffling- you don't make entry level screw ups of your own standards 30+ years on.
IMHO the basic release should have been "canoness, battle sisters, and retributors" that would have been eneugh to build basic units to fill the HQ, Troops, Heavy support, elites and fast attacks. all with 3 basic kits. I woinder if they're holding back on required stuff so as to keep attention. by holding the cannoness for last it means people don't buy an army and stop paying attention when the other goodies come out
Why make it so complex? GW has stated they think their customers are not gamers but in hobby of buying GW models. So they don't care how playable collection is. They assume every customer buys box or two of everything because that's what the hobby is all about. Buying GW models. Not even assembling or painting nevermind playing. Buy more models!
Casbyness wrote: This is a masterclass in how to completely kill the hype for a product that you carefully built up for almost two full years.
I feel like when the preorders for the rest of the range finally go up we should just ignore them for at least a month, in revenge for this pointless wait.
Some of this I expected based on the wording in some of the preview articles (some things were direct about jan/feb, others were a more vague 'next year'). Especially for things like the zephyrim, which were very late on the promo pictures- and completely missed the book's deadlines.
I didn't expect the HQ (a major lynchpin to having a playable army at all) to be one of the delayed models. Its a baffling choice or a terrible mix-up.
Much Like the Space Wolves base marines kit you can put together a decent cannoness with the parts provided in the battle sisters kit. little bit of cutting and gluing you could probably get most of the options.
How to separate her from sister superior then? Canoness doesn't even have any gear that comes in basic box that's not available to superiors so can't do that either.
Much Like the Space Wolves base marines kit you can put together a decent cannoness with the parts provided in the battle sisters kit. little bit of cutting and gluing you could probably get most of the options.
Options? Maybe half (rod, fire, inferno pistol all seem to not be in the sisters kit).
More importantly, the canoness should stand out a bit, not blend into the basic squads.
Most importantly, it shouldn't even vaguely be an issue. GW makes a big deal about selling valid armies even out of things like the 'start collecting' boxes. For a redone line to go for a month (and counting) without the very basics of a valid army is ridiculous and completely on them. They've managed to pull new and revamped armies into existence with little trouble (and will be doing so again in the near future). Screwing this one up is baffling- you don't make entry level screw ups of your own standards 30+ years on.
IMHO the basic release should have been "canoness, battle sisters, and retributors" that would have been eneugh to build basic units to fill the HQ, Troops, Heavy support, elites and fast attacks. all with 3 basic kits. I woinder if they're holding back on required stuff so as to keep attention. by holding the cannoness for last it means people don't buy an army and stop paying attention when the other goodies come out
Why make it so complex? GW has stated they think their customers are not gamers but in hobby of buying GW models. So they don't care how playable collection is. They assume every customer buys box or two of everything because that's what the hobby is all about. Buying GW models. Not even assembling or painting nevermind playing. Buy more models!
well that was the old CEO, the new one appers to at least understand people buy the models for a reason. although there is proably a sizable percentage of the market that consists of "hobbists"
Why make it so complex? GW has stated they think their customers are not gamers but in hobby of buying GW models. So they don't care how playable collection is. They assume every customer buys box or two of everything because that's what the hobby is all about. Buying GW models. Not even assembling or painting nevermind playing. Buy more models!
Wrong. Tom Kirby thought this, not GW as a whole. Now he's gone the company has changed a whole lot outwardly as they don't have to listen to his guff anymore. This doesn't change the fact that there are still some people who just like to buy/collect models, they exist, as do all other types of gamers, hobbyists etc
tneva82 wrote: How to separate her from sister superior then? Canoness doesn't even have any gear that comes in basic box that's not available to superiors so can't do that either.
However you want. It is not like the original metal Canoness was particularly obviously different from a superior either. Some sort of a backpack ornament doodah might be a good indicator, or even just slightly different colour scheme.
Old gw, new gw, only thing that changed was pr department. Rules are same imbalanced mess, attittude is same. They just put more leaves to fire to generate bigger smoke to fool fans.
tneva82 wrote: How to separate her from sister superior then? Canoness doesn't even have any gear that comes in basic box that's not available to superiors so can't do that either.
However you want. It is not like the original metal Canoness was particularly obviously different from a superior either. Some sort of a backpack ornament doodah might be a good indicator, or even just slightly different colour scheme.
A variation on the paint job could also be enough.
tneva82 wrote: Old gw, new gw, only thing that changed was pr department. Rules are same imbalanced mess, attittude is same. They just put more leaves to fire to generate bigger smoke to fool fans.
It's not as simple as that. While new GW is a marketing invention, they do put more emphasis on their various games than they did under Kirby. They don't have the skill or the will to make most of those games consistently good, but I have no doubt that they have actually learned that there is a portion of gamers among their customer base that they want to appeal to make more money. Marketing is still a more powerful tool to GW than the quality of the actual games, but the latter does seem to receive some attention under Rountree.
The Sisters release being considered a mess is people buying into the marketing a little too much, I can agree on that. Sisters really aren't any kind of special in spite of what GW's marketing would have us believe. Sister's aren't cut any slack on pricing to let the army take off. They come after last year's price hike and are priced accordingly. They got a bundle box exclusive for some time to get people to pay more for the bundle than they might have had the components been released individually. They're withholding the Canoness in hopes of people needing an HQ and buying the expensive centerpiece models instead, and hopefully the Canoness kit later as well. And like (almost) any other army they'll get their Start Collecting down the line when the individual kits have sold enough. Probably with a Christmas box this year because they're new and it's an opportunity to catch even more people. It's by the book GW sales tactics. Potentially annoying, no doubt, but also pretty foreseeable.
Still, we have plastic Sisters now and holding out for another couple of months for GW to get the releases over with and give us the full range to work with should hopefully not be as aggravating as the years and decades of waiting for plastic Sisters have been.
Geifer wrote: The Sisters release being considered a mess is people buying into the marketing a little too much, I can agree on that. Sisters really aren't any kind of special in spite of what GW's marketing would have us believe. Sister's aren't cut any slack on pricing to let the army take off. They come after last year's price hike and are priced accordingly. They got a bundle box exclusive for some time to get people to pay more for the bundle than they might have had the components been released individually.
I haven't seen anybody expect or ask for a special treatment? Just a sensible release schedule, whereby the fundamental parts of an army are the first to be released. GW doesn't release brand new armies often enough to clearly indicate their typical strategy, but I wouldn't have expected it to be this - if anything because it kills the hype rather than feed it. Based on the prices of the individual kits, the bundle was rather a good price - even if you don't care for a different cover on the codex or indeed the box-exclusive cannoness which few people were particularly enthusiastic about.
We also know that the release is a book, warscroll cards, and the pyramid....and that books are taken out of stores as early as four weeks in advance of a release.
Geifer wrote: The Sisters release being considered a mess is people buying into the marketing a little too much, I can agree on that. Sisters really aren't any kind of special in spite of what GW's marketing would have us believe. Sister's aren't cut any slack on pricing to let the army take off. They come after last year's price hike and are priced accordingly. They got a bundle box exclusive for some time to get people to pay more for the bundle than they might have had the components been released individually.
I haven't seen anybody expect or ask for a special treatment? Just a sensible release schedule, whereby the fundamental parts of an army are the first to be released. GW doesn't release brand new armies often enough to clearly indicate their typical strategy, but I wouldn't have expected it to be this - if anything because it kills the hype rather than feed it. Based on the prices of the individual kits, the bundle was rather a good price - even if you don't care for a different cover on the codex or indeed the box-exclusive cannoness which few people were particularly enthusiastic about.
I might just have a gloomier outlook than you, but I can't bring myself to believe plastic Sisters are seen as a brand new army by GW. It effectively is to us who try to make an army out of the available models, of course, but I never got the impression that to GW the new models are about the army in a game context. They're making something that was asked for in their first community survey and that they believed would make the investment worthwhile, and what was asked for was not a functional, all around army update with all the bells and whistles. Just... plastic Sisters. It's a bit Kirbyesque when you think about it but I genuinely believe GW's intention was to seize the opportunity to make and sell new models, with all the game considerations being tacked on as a kind of necessity. More importantly, GW never dropped Sisters as an army, just minimized rule support and stubbornly refused to make new models for them. As such this is much more about a model overhaul than releasing a new army.
So as far as asking for special treatment is concerned, you're right that nobody really asked for it. People asking for a sensible release plan aren't wrong. Having to wait for your bog standard HQ to be released is bogus. I'm just suggesting that too many people got carried away by the marketing hype that GW had no intention of following up on, which is kind of the point of marketing. Throughout the 18 month teasing period you'd get people who would not temper their expectations even with reminders of GW's SOP. Release in 2019 only for the army box, limited numbers for the army box the admittedly newish but not unprecedented splitting of the main release - all these things suck, especially now that GW actually raises expectations through marketing, but they are in line what GW normally does. As such, expecting Sisters to be any different is in the realm of expecting special treatment. If only because GW's... eccentric way of doing things something bears little resemblance to common sense.
As for the limited box, personally I thought it was overpriced. I used to say about Start Collecting boxes that they offered a decent price on the included models, basically what the overpriced individual boxes should cost in the first place. They're discount boxes but only a good deal in context. I feel much the same about the Sisters box. It may have a better price compared to buying everything individually, but to me the individual prices are not worth comparing to because they're too high on their own. Also the box is not just overpriced to me because of the somewhat small selection of models but especially because of the extra padding. It doesn't just include a codex to drive up the price, no, it's a special version with a different cover. So they charge extra for it. The miracle dice are the most generic dice you could possibly find, but you can bet your ass they contributed to the cost as much as a set of custom army dice because they weren't just any old dice, nope, they got their own name and game mechanic and that makes them valuable enough to charge extra for it.
Does anyone else think that Hospitilars should be able to heal any Imperium unit within 3''? Pretty sure that checks out fluff wise. I know, coulda, shoulda, woulda but it would be cool if we had the most versatile medic for the Imperium, because in the fluff we do.
As for the discussion the past couple of pages, I for one am glad for the delayed release as its given me time to get some painting done and get my luxery budget in order. All I'm waiting on is the Seraphim as of right now, but I'm only focusing on a single outrider detachment so I can understand others frustrations.
Twoshoes23 wrote: Does anyone else think that Hospitilars should be able to heal any Imperium unit within 3''? Pretty sure that checks out fluff wise. I know, coulda, shoulda, woulda but it would be cool if we had the most versatile medic for the Imperium, because in the fluff we do.
As for the discussion the past couple of pages, I for one am glad for the delayed release as its given me time to get some painting done and get my luxery budget in order. All I'm waiting on is the Seraphim as of right now, but I'm only focusing on a single outrider detachment so I can understand others frustrations.
It is kinda lame that they're locked to just Sororitas, since...ya know....they're not.
I want more seraphim as well, no wait I need SERAPHIM!!! & some Zeraphim just cuz.
I might just have a gloomier outlook than you, but I can't bring myself to believe plastic Sisters are seen as a brand new army by GW. It effectively is to us who try to make an army out of the available models, of course, but I never got the impression that to GW the new models are about the army in a game context. They're making something that was asked for in their first community survey and that they believed would make the investment worthwhile, and what was asked for was not a functional, all around army update with all the bells and whistles. Just... plastic Sisters. It's a bit Kirbyesque when you think about it but I genuinely believe GW's intention was to seize the opportunity to make and sell new models, with all the game considerations being tacked on as a kind of necessity. More importantly, GW never dropped Sisters as an army, just minimized rule support and stubbornly refused to make new models for them. As such this is much more about a model overhaul than releasing a new army.
Sorry but they wouldn't release this just for new models for old players. That would be financial suicide as the # of sister players wasn't big enough. To make any sense for this scale they have to aim for new players. At which point making non-functional army is just silly.
It's not like they didn't make all those models. They just release them in totally silly illogical order that hurts new armies starting armies which in turn costs £££
Twoshoes23 wrote: Does anyone else think that Hospitilars should be able to heal any Imperium unit within 3''? Pretty sure that checks out fluff wise. I know, coulda, shoulda, woulda but it would be cool if we had the most versatile medic for the Imperium, because in the fluff we do.
Would be cool, but that's not 8th ed. GW went out of their way to implement a restrictive keyword system that strangles fluffy interactions between allies. It's what made Index Inquisition as non-functional as it was. Technically it's not even just 8th ed but the current 40k designers. 7th ed Imperial Agents codex was split up in the same way. Kind of a herald of the keyword system, half a year ahead of 8th ed. That book gutted Inquisition for 7th ed, too.
It would be cool to have better ally interactions, but unfortunately GW has given me no reason to expect such a thing to happen.
I might just have a gloomier outlook than you, but I can't bring myself to believe plastic Sisters are seen as a brand new army by GW. It effectively is to us who try to make an army out of the available models, of course, but I never got the impression that to GW the new models are about the army in a game context. They're making something that was asked for in their first community survey and that they believed would make the investment worthwhile, and what was asked for was not a functional, all around army update with all the bells and whistles. Just... plastic Sisters. It's a bit Kirbyesque when you think about it but I genuinely believe GW's intention was to seize the opportunity to make and sell new models, with all the game considerations being tacked on as a kind of necessity. More importantly, GW never dropped Sisters as an army, just minimized rule support and stubbornly refused to make new models for them. As such this is much more about a model overhaul than releasing a new army.
Sorry but they wouldn't release this just for new models for old players. That would be financial suicide as the # of sister players wasn't big enough. To make any sense for this scale they have to aim for new players. At which point making non-functional army is just silly.
It's not like they didn't make all those models. They just release them in totally silly illogical order that hurts new armies starting armies which in turn costs £££
Who said anything about targeting only old players?
Twoshoes23 wrote: Does anyone else think that Hospitilars should be able to heal any Imperium unit within 3''? Pretty sure that checks out fluff wise. I know, coulda, shoulda, woulda but it would be cool if we had the most versatile medic for the Imperium, because in the fluff we do.
Would be cool, but that's not 8th ed. GW went out of their way to implement a restrictive keyword system that strangles fluffy interactions between allies. It's what made Index Inquisition as non-functional as it was. Technically it's not even just 8th ed but the current 40k designers. 7th ed Imperial Agents codex was split up in the same way. Kind of a herald of the keyword system, half a year ahead of 8th ed. That book gutted Inquisition for 7th ed, too.
It would be cool to have better ally interactions, but unfortunately GW has given me no reason to expect such a thing to happen.
thats because 7th edition did allow that klind of fluffy interaction and was stupidly broken because of the power combos people could do
Twoshoes23 wrote: Does anyone else think that Hospitilars should be able to heal any Imperium unit within 3''? Pretty sure that checks out fluff wise. I know, coulda, shoulda, woulda but it would be cool if we had the most versatile medic for the Imperium, because in the fluff we do.
Would be cool, but that's not 8th ed. GW went out of their way to implement a restrictive keyword system that strangles fluffy interactions between allies. It's what made Index Inquisition as non-functional as it was. Technically it's not even just 8th ed but the current 40k designers. 7th ed Imperial Agents codex was split up in the same way. Kind of a herald of the keyword system, half a year ahead of 8th ed. That book gutted Inquisition for 7th ed, too.
It would be cool to have better ally interactions, but unfortunately GW has given me no reason to expect such a thing to happen.
thats because 7th edition did allow that klind of fluffy interaction and was stupidly broken because of the power combos people could do
No doubt.
That doesn't mean there can't be a more sensible way of integrating allies. As I understand it AoS doesn't have half the problems 40k does with allies. And that's GW's other main system. Clearly they have designers in house with enough of a clue to make a more balanced system (not that it necessarily solves the keyword issue, mind).
That's why I'm not a fan of GW's current three ways to play. They're samey and try to use the same basic rules to achieve wildly different things. They should have done an actual, restrictive tournament rule set that is focused on balance above all so the more competitive minded folks can have their way and not be bothered with lore considerations that, honestly, if you look at tournament lists simply don't figure into the equation anyway. Then have a narrative mode for casuals that strikes a balance between lore and game balance. And yeah, what' I have in mind is not current matched play and certainly not narrative play.
That's a pipe dream, though. GW won't do anything I'd consider good game design because they're too afraid of losing sales to army building restrictions.
Shame, really. I bought my Sisters for the display case because of the way GW writes rules at the moment. Such a long wait only to have my shiny new plastic Sister never hit the tables...
But enough of that. I think I'm straying into off topic here.
My distaste for 8th ed, my friends' distaste for 8th ed, and 8th ed being a dead game at my local store. Entirely a personal problem, I realize, but then I was just talking about my Sisters specifically.
Twoshoes23 wrote: Does anyone else think that Hospitilars should be able to heal any Imperium unit within 3''? Pretty sure that checks out fluff wise. I know, coulda, shoulda, woulda but it would be cool if we had the most versatile medic for the Imperium, because in the fluff we do.
As for the discussion the past couple of pages, I for one am glad for the delayed release as its given me time to get some painting done and get my luxery budget in order. All I'm waiting on is the Seraphim as of right now, but I'm only focusing on a single outrider detachment so I can understand others frustrations.
The Imperial Guard has a different health insurance provider. Nothing the Hospitaller can do.
I've got a couple month backlog on my Sisters' painting, so not overly concerned about the rate stuff comes out - but I sympathize with people that have a big GT coming up that wanted to bring their new army.
Getting ridiculous. Seraphim codex also totally out aka release incoming so odds good march is earliest we get. And atm i wouldn't be surprised if it's march 2021
Seraphon release is likely 1 book, 1 terrain feature, 1 warscroll pack and perhaps a collectors battletome and perhaps dice. So its really not a huge amount (in fact all of that is overseas stuff, nothing from GW main production). They could easily pair the Seraphon with the Sisters on a week if they wanted.
They could. They could have combined here as well. Or last or week after that. But what they don't generally do is combine aos and 40k. Guess they think all collect all so too many different compete with each other
Gotta be honest I've about put a dent in painting my first 10 sisters, I have a box of 10 more and a box of mortifiers in the shrink wrap. Personally I can afford to wait a little. Yay for recent dad life!
Games Workshop Executive at the end of Feb: "Huh. That's weird...there are no Adepta Sororitas armies in competitive tournaments..."
Games Workshop Executive Assistant: "Umm...sir? We still haven't released half the army yet, remember?"
Games Workshop Executive: "Whaaaat?!"
Automatically Appended Next Post: EDIT: The absolute earliest we can now get more Sisters is 29th Feb. Maybe that's deliberate, like a big leap year special day thing to complete the army.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Maybe Sisters really are getting a Psychic Awakening appearance and the rest of their minis will come out then.
Casbyness wrote: Games Workshop Underling: "Huh. That's weird...there are no Adepta Sororitas armies in competitive tournaments..."
Games Workshop Executive: "What's a Sister of Battle? Have we sold anymore of those Prime Evil Space Marines?"
Games Workshop Underling: "It's Primaris, sir."
Games Workshop Executive: "Whatever. Sell more of those. Make up some more volumes..."
Games Workshop Underling: "Chapters."
Games Workshop Executive: "Whatever they're called. Make up more to push the paints we just put out."
FIFY.
now now, if they made up space marine chapters to sell paint we'd see more gold and silver marines given the metallics are the most expensive. heck, we'd proably see a silver and gold quartered scheme..........
ya know.. that might look pretty cool
H.B.M.C. wrote: Maybe Sisters really are getting a Psychic Awakening appearance and the rest of their minis will come out then.
Casbyness wrote: Games Workshop Underling: "Huh. That's weird...there are no Adepta Sororitas armies in competitive tournaments..."
Games Workshop Executive: "What's a Sister of Battle? Have we sold anymore of those Prime Evil Space Marines?"
Games Workshop Underling: "It's Primaris, sir."
Games Workshop Executive: "Whatever. Sell more of those. Make up some more volumes..."
Games Workshop Underling: "Chapters."
Games Workshop Executive: "Whatever they're called. Make up more to push the paints we just put out."
FIFY.
now now, if they made up space marine chapters to sell paint we'd see more gold and silver marines given the metallics are the most expensive. heck, we'd proably see a silver and gold quartered scheme..........
ya know.. that might look pretty cool
That's what Sigmarines, Custodes and Grey Knights are for.
The annoying thing is we have no promises or quarantees we will get anything any time soon. Actually only thing regarding remaining is "sometime next year" for seraphim. Rest of the kits could come next year and GW wouldn't have broken any promises...
Now while that is unlikely not holding hopes for any quick release of rest. Could be easily summer-autumn.
It's GW resin, zero options, poor loadout, doesn't fit with aesthetics at all and top of that it's web order item. So as it is I'm still waiting mine that I ordered before first sisters came to even on stores...That's over 4 weeks(when was preorders for 1st week announced? That's around the time I put one on order). If it was plastic release I already could have it.
And once plastic ones comes this will never see usage in game as it doesn't look at all like rest of sisters. Might just as well put random male figure into army and claim it's canoness.
tneva82 wrote: It's GW resin, zero options, poor loadout, doesn't fit with aesthetics at all and top of that it's web order item. So as it is I'm still waiting mine that I ordered before first sisters came to even on stores...
And once plastic ones comes this will never see usage in game as it doesn't look at all like rest of sisters. Might just as well put random male figure into army and claim it's canoness.
Okay. Not sure that "I don't like the option" is the same as "there is no option", but thats fair enough.
I'm assuming they hit production capacity issues and have had to wait to stockpile sufficient stock, hence why they're just releasing lower turn over filler stuff recently.
Well I'm sticking with theory sisters are going to be in PA6 and they will accompany them.
Still could mean preorders on 28.3...So 7 weeks at worst until we get our hands on models.
I don’t think the sisters and wolves would team up against the orks. Maybe wolves and Deathwatch. I think the wolves are still mad about the Ecclesiarchy laying sedge to Fenris.
Well I'm sticking with theory sisters are going to be in PA6 and they will accompany them.
Still could mean preorders on 28.3...So 7 weeks at worst until we get our hands on models.
I don’t think the sisters and wolves would team up against the orks. Maybe wolves and Deathwatch. I think the wolves are still mad about the Ecclesiarchy laying sedge to Fenris.
I'm pretty sure Wolves dislike Orks more.
Anyway, the Codex mentions M41 battles with Necrons and Death Guard - so it could be any either of those two, or unrelated.
There's no reason to think that the next model wave would necessarily be connected with the PA release either.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Hmm... maybe Sanctuary 101 Redux really is a thing, given the Necrons haven't had their PA uplift.
according to some stuff mentioned from grteater good, a gak ton of new deamon engines where spotted by the admech. Could see us getting "Faith and Fury 2, Soritis Boogaloo" featuring some new rules for sisters, "Create a warband" rules for CSM and a buncha new deamon engines.
As a SoB player I'd be pretty ticked off, I'll admit. If those elf thingies get a splash release like the Bonereapers it'd be even more weird.
I decided to not buy a small force of Sisters to not get my pile of shame even higher...and bought several Beastgrave warbands, which are almost as expensive from GW as imported+discounted SoB squads. Sigh. But at least I can use those to immediatly play. And did. With SoBs I'd be proxying HQs. Wat.
It's not that bad a situation. Heck consider that thus far armies like Ossiarch Bonereapers and many of the AoS armies that are new are half the size of what Sisters of Battle will have - and most of those AoS armies are going to likely remain at "half size" for quite a long period of time
Meanwhile many of the older larger armies, like Seraphon and Skaven, are chock full of resin and even metal models and likely will remain so, again, for quite a long period of time.
Sisters of Battle waited ages for plastic models; the few months you've got between waves is going to feel like nothing compared to the other armies waiting. If anything sisters are in a fantastic place to start right now.
Ossiriach could be started in week 2(week 1 being basically big army box). Sisters you need to wait like 2 months after codex before you can really start it. So no I would not recommend starting sisters yet. Wait for the army to be actually released.
Dudeface wrote: I'm assuming they hit production capacity issues and have had to wait to stockpile sufficient stock, hence why they're just releasing lower turn over filler stuff recently.
Its a storage issue
slowly building up to a full release while storing all of it is a big investment in time and space
Overread wrote: It's not that bad a situation. Heck consider that thus far armies like Ossiarch Bonereapers and many of the AoS armies that are new are half the size of what Sisters of Battle will have - and most of those AoS armies are going to likely remain at "half size" for quite a long period of time
Meanwhile many of the older larger armies, like Seraphon and Skaven, are chock full of resin and even metal models and likely will remain so, again, for quite a long period of time.
Sisters of Battle waited ages for plastic models; the few months you've got between waves is going to feel like nothing compared to the other armies waiting. If anything sisters are in a fantastic place to start right now.
Without the Canoness and imagifier the army is almost impossible to play. Even adding in the boxset canoness doesn't help much. Add in two of the best units not being out yet (seraphim and Zephyrim) and it's a real hard sell to start the army from scratch. If you have 5 metal canonesses and a bunch of metal seraphim sitting around then you're fine but someone just starting the army would be on the back foot immediately.
I dunno about everyone else, but I haven't even gotten close to finishing building let alone painting my Sisters, so I honestly don't get everyone being worked up over things not being out yet, are you guys already sat with 2k points built, painted and based or something, or are we all just so used to complaining as Sisters players that you guys just need something new to complain about?
foenixphate wrote: I dunno about everyone else, but I haven't even gotten close to finishing building let alone painting my Sisters, so I honestly don't get everyone being worked up over things not being out yet, are you guys already sat with 2k points built, painted and based or something, or are we all just so used to complaining as Sisters players that you guys just need something new to complain about?
As someone who isn't a sisters player, not having the basic (and only non-SC) HQ is a pretty major problem.
Every army GW has done for the last... two decades or so is started on the premise that you can do a functional, if small, army out of the gate (sometimes literally out of a single box, with battalions and start collecting and whatever).
Except this one, because reasons (which are swallowed by the current wall of absolute silence about _The_ Major Army Release of 2019/2020).
It's a completely legit thing to complain about. They either finally got to the starting line and tripped, or Lucy just yoinked that football away from Charlie Brown... again.
foenixphate wrote: I dunno about everyone else, but I haven't even gotten close to finishing building let alone painting my Sisters, so I honestly don't get everyone being worked up over things not being out yet, are you guys already sat with 2k points built, painted and based or something, or are we all just so used to complaining as Sisters players that you guys just need something new to complain about?
Some people don't want models just be paper weights but actually play. Maybe people in your place are okay with empty base proxies but less so here.
I get models to play. Not sit on shelves. Models that can't be used to play are worthless
and note you don't need models to be painted to play. you do need models to play with.Ergo if I would have canoness kit already it would be useful to me regardless of painting status. Having ability to play doesn't hurt painting. It just means models are actually useful rather than just overpriced paper weights.
The thing is, people could have maybe been patient if the Canoness had come out on the first release because at least then players could have done small gunline armies even if they didn't have the powerhouses or force multipliers.
Currently the army is unplayable unless you already had a a large metal collection beforehand or the Sisters of Battle box.
That's it. GW lost tons of PR by withholding that basic HQ. Have that and there would have been lot less problems. Doubt that many expected to get all 16 kits to begin with(I for one had been preparing for at least6 month wait for seraphim...).
It's the lack of basic core units for possibly even 2.5 months after codex released(assuming worst case of 28.3 for preorders for their "in march" statement) that's so infuriating.
foenixphate wrote: I dunno about everyone else, but I haven't even gotten close to finishing building let alone painting my Sisters, so I honestly don't get everyone being worked up over things not being out yet, are you guys already sat with 2k points built, painted and based or something, or are we all just so used to complaining as Sisters players that you guys just need something new to complain about?
I'm in a similar situation - everything is built, but I've still got a bunch of painting to catch-up on. I have a Missionary, Army Box Canoness, Celestine and Triumph for HQs currently, so I'm not hurting for options there. I've also still got 3 Battle Sisters Squads and 3 Exorcists to paint before I'm ready for the next wave.
If I really wanted to get my BR detachment going, I could get Veridyan as my Beneficence Canoness - but I'd rather wait for the multi-part kit instead.
The lack of Seraphim is more of an issue for me currently, since I want to use some bits from the full kit to convert the Sergeant from the Army Box.
foenixphate wrote: I dunno about everyone else, but I haven't even gotten close to finishing building let alone painting my Sisters, so I honestly don't get everyone being worked up over things not being out yet, are you guys already sat with 2k points built, painted and based or something, or are we all just so used to complaining as Sisters players that you guys just need something new to complain about?
I also haven't gotten close to finishing building the new Sisters.. but then I have barely started because I want to kitbash the various sets together, and several of the sets I want for that are not yet available. Lacking access to the repentia, some tank or a named HQ would be largely irrelevant, but I'd like to have the Seraphim and Cannoness kits before I start gluing too many things together.
Sisters have gotten more releases in the last four months than Orks (my primary army) have gotten in four years. The whining is getting pretty ridiculous. Are GW nefariously holding back a standalone HQ to try to move box sets and Junith packs? Probably. Does that make the army "unplayable"? feth no.
Put your big-girl flak-panties on, build a perfectly legit Canoness model out of a Battle Sisters box. Then when the generic HQ of your dreams comes out a week later, you can demote her to a Sister Superior and move on with your awesome life. (Or just keep her as a Canoness, I suspect everyone's gonna be running 2-3 of them in every army anyway.)
Y'all starting to sound like a bunch of Space Marine players!
Overread wrote: If anything sisters are in a fantastic place to start right now.
If we had our canoness already, I'd agree.
We don't, though.
See my posts above - there is a Canoness model available on the website and through shops. People may not like it, but the option is there.
Me, I'd like to retire my Ragnar Blackmane at some point. Thats been a long wait.
I mean, not unless you want 200+ dollars of monopose miniatures. Twice, if you're some kind of crazyman like me who'd like to field a battalion detachment
This is identical to the whole "But you CAN buy Suppressors right now, you might not LIKE it but you CAN so technically they're not waiting to be released!!!" thing. Or ditto for new Drazar/Jain/Banshees/Incubi. Tons of new kits get strapped to huge army bundles and just...sit there, leaving the army and new units in a state that's not functionally playable to people who don't drop "Ultra super duper mega-tier EA preorder" levels of cash.
Hankovitch wrote: Put your big-girl flak-panties on, build a perfectly legit Canoness model out of a Battle Sisters box. Then when the generic HQ of your dreams comes out a week later, you can demote her to a Sister Superior and move on with your awesome life. (Or just keep her as a Canoness, I suspect everyone's gonna be running 2-3 of them in every army anyway.)
This is more or less my plan (though it is on hold because I want to incorporate bits from the Repentia into said canonesses and my other main sisters units) but it was something I was going to do anyway. That doesn't mean GW is above criticism; they made a call, I'd argue the wrong one, and it's a problem sisters players now need to work around or wait on a fix for.
Frankly, the only thing that really bothers me about it is the lack of communication. Was this a supply chain interruption? Was the plan to space out releases of major and minor kits so they wouldn't sell out for a year like they did with the DoK hero kit? Did they know mid February that the rest wouldn't come out till March or were they all on a best effort basis with no deadline?
You'd say that sounds like an unreasonable expectation, but GW advised the community when the Sylvaneth were delayed and I thought that worked really well for them.
Contrast that to this case, where after week two people were asking after the remaining sisters releases on every Warhammer Facebook article, getting no response save for gifs of crying babies from one sadly persistent fellow.
I feel like everyone forgot that they did release a new plastic Canoness late last year. In a box full of other Sisters stuff, which is still very available.
Cannoness Verdiyan is also still available.
So thats two available options for everyone. (not counting older metal models, conversions and a wide variety of 3rd party proxies and Junith, who can easily be fielded as a normal Cannoness).
Yes, we all wish that the new multi-part model was available now. But in a month or two it will be, and at that point it will be available forever. So this is just an extremely minor inconvenience in the first few months of the armies release.
Hankovitch wrote: Sisters have gotten more releases in the last four months than Orks (my primary army) have gotten in four years. The whining is getting pretty ridiculous. Are GW nefariously holding back a standalone HQ to try to move box sets and Junith packs? Probably. Does that make the army "unplayable"? feth no.
Put your big-girl flak-panties on, build a perfectly legit Canoness model out of a Battle Sisters box. Then when the generic HQ of your dreams comes out a week later, you can demote her to a Sister Superior and move on with your awesome life. (Or just keep her as a Canoness, I suspect everyone's gonna be running 2-3 of them in every army anyway.)
Y'all starting to sound like a bunch of Space Marine players!
Orks can be played. They don't need new kits to play.
Apples vs oranges. Sheesh. "we deserve bonus kits more than others need core kits needed to even play the damn army". Lol.
But hey what you have to worry. You get to play game. All is fine. What it matters for YOU when YOU have it good. Others can have it bad as long as YOU have it good. That's all that matters.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
BrianDavion wrote: yeah I actually snagged a Verydia myself. I figure GW assumes those despirate for a cannoness will make do with that.. or already had one
Wish it wouldn't be web order item. Getting to be about 7 weeks since I ordered one. Where is it? Whoever knows.
Overread wrote: If anything sisters are in a fantastic place to start right now.
If we had our canoness already, I'd agree.
We don't, though.
See my posts above - there is a Canoness model available on the website and through shops. People may not like it, but the option is there.
Me, I'd like to retire my Ragnar Blackmane at some point. Thats been a long wait.
Wonderful. Just 7 weeks and counting to get one. It's good race on do I get it first or the plastic canoness whenever that comes out.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
jake wrote: I feel like everyone forgot that they did release a new plastic Canoness late last year. In a box full of other Sisters stuff, which is still very available.
Please show where it is available. I don't find it.
Just because SOME independent stores still have copies doesn't mean it's universally available. Not everybody has such a store. GW doesn't sell it. And frankly telling pay 160e for single canoness is pretty ridiculous.
Doesn't have the options I need, and it's ugly. It's a one-off monopose named character, not a customizable generic HQ.
Also everyone, shove off with the "you're sounding like marine players!" gobbledygook. Marines haven't gone without having a generic HQ available to them on the store since before you were born. It's perfectly reasonable to want a basic and core aspect of your army to be available to purchase. If anything, you just sound like you're entitled and self-important brats for trying to put down people for wanting such a basic part of their army. You're basically coming off as entitled jerkoffs-- "how dare someone else complain when I'm perfectly happy!".
Doesn't have the options I need, and it's ugly. It's a one-off monopose named character, not a customizable generic HQ.
Or you can Use the Superior body from the basic battle sister kit which contains some of the options, you might need to get creative (some minor kit bashing) for some of the other options but should have most of what many are looking for. The domion kit supiror is also an option.
jake wrote: I feel like everyone forgot that they did release a new plastic Canoness late last year. In a box full of other Sisters stuff, which is still very available.
Cannoness Verdiyan is also still available.
So thats two available options for everyone. (not counting older metal models, conversions and a wide variety of 3rd party proxies and Junith, who can easily be fielded as a normal Cannoness).
Yes, we all wish that the new multi-part model was available now. But in a month or two it will be, and at that point it will be available forever. So this is just an extremely minor inconvenience in the first few months of the armies release.
I don't know what your definition of "very available" is, but I have a feeling it rather differs from mine.
I think it would have helped a lot of GW was just a bit more communicative. Doesn't feel great to invest in e.g. a resin mini I personally dislike, or convert something using only the Superior bits (which, in all likelihood, will make her look like a Sister Superior), when you know the very nice multipart plastic set is just around the corner, but you don't know if it's weeks or months away, and had expected to have had it available some weeks ago already.
If they were planning to slowly release the range rather than all within a few weeks, it also would have helped if they simply kept the metal range available for purchase. Certainly not ideal (different size/style; models you'll likely want to replace when the plastics are released anyway), but at least most of the roster would be there.
This is not about having to convert some models that don't exist, this is about having to convert models that kind of exist and for all we know, could have been on sale weeks ago, but aren't.
Fenrir Kitsune wrote: And thus we conclude that Sisters players will never be happy.
As much as some posters have had wildly over zealous reactions to any suggestions/criticisms, it is fair to be annoyed for new sisters players like myself who didn't buy the army box and hence can't actually buy a cannoness to make a legal army, especially if I don't want to cannibalise a box of sisters which will leave me with incomplete squads.
I imagine GW has got themselves backed into a corner where they weren't ready to release the army in Jan but had no choice to release the codex because of the army box they promised to deliver in 2019, but couldn't have a codex with no models at all and hence here we are.
fox-light713 wrote: Or you can Use the Superior body from the basic battle sister kit which contains some of the options, you might need to get creative (some minor kit bashing) for some of the other options but should have most of what many are looking for. The domion kit supiror is also an option.
You just showed you don't know what you are talking about, the Dominion (not domion) kit is the same as a BSS kit. Guess you meant the Retributor kit.
It is totally fine to be annoyed about the release schedule. Your disappointment is totally valid.
But don't take suggestions to mitigate your particular circumstances as dismissing the issue. Some may be doing that in their tone, but trust that most suggestions in this thread are put forward to help you. If you are presenting your problem as an inability to play without a specific Canoness build, and others have supplied you ways to easily replicate that build with freely available kits today, then rejoice!
You can still be salty about the delay in the release without having to justify that position with increasingly hyperbolic outrage. We all know and agree it is not ideal, but the fury is misplaced.
To be perfectly blunt, the options if you don’t want to perform short term on the order of a few months financially dubious actions (track down a huge box set that isn’t available everywhere so might cost you a bunch extra to source, buy a poorly executed sculpt of a rather marmite artist’s old drawing that doesn’t fit in well with the range, convert a sister when you know the cannoness isn’t that far out and you’ll have ruined that sister to do so) are exactly two:
Already own a cannoness from some earlier iteration or proxy.
Now, I’m fine because I did get the box set and have been pretty slow building sisters anyhow as I work on painting my iyanden, but people who are stuck in the above situation have plenty of reason to gripe and don’t really need to get harassed by the bizarre anti-gripe brigade that seems to infest every part of this website.
Some of the same options with exceptions - Canoness's can't take combi-weapons or hand flamers, and Superiors can't take Blessed Blades (though your could use a Power Sword for that and no one would know the difference I guess), Rods of Office, Braziers or Null Rods. Those last three aren't exactly the easiest to convert, though I guess you could fashion a RoO or Null Rod from the Power Maul you get in the Retributor kit and random non-sister bits.
Of course, converting a Canoness from a Superior means she is going to look the same as your unit leaders, instead far more ornate like they're meant to.
And once you put in this work, you have a conversion that in about a month and a half will have an actual released model for the unit it's meant to represent.
It's like telling a Marine player to convert a Captain from the Tactical Marine and Devastor boxes because the only place they buy from doesn't have any Captains in stock, and won't for a month and a bit. I mean, they technically can but it isn't really going to look like it fits the part.
Kanluwen wrote:There's a third option in the form of kitbashing utilizing the parts for the Superiors in the Retributors and standard Battle Sisters.
For the most part, Canonesses have similar if not the same weapon options right?
If anything the Canoness has slightly less now. And the BSS sprue has basically everything you'd need to do it (except apparently the inferno pistol?) and still have enough left over to build a superior.
In fact, I'd like to reiterate how versatile the BSS squad kit is. It looks like you can build a 5-girl squad with superior and simulacrum, and still have parts enough left over to build another 5-girl squad with its own superior and simulacrum, and have enough heavy and special weapons across the sprue to kit out both to (admittedly distinct) flavor.
Matt.Kingsley wrote:Some of the same options with exceptions - Canoness's can't take combi-weapons or hand flamers, and Superiors can't take Blessed Blades (though your could use a Power Sword for that and no one would know the difference I guess), Rods of Office, Braziers or Null Rods. Those last three aren't exactly the easiest to convert, though I guess you could fashion a RoO or Null Rod from the Power Maul you get in the Retributor kit and random non-sister bits.[/spoiler]
The Simulacrum's pole could work as a staff for RoO. I also really like the ret Superior's book, and the arm raising the rosette.
Of course, converting a Canoness from a Superior means she is going to look the same as your unit leaders, instead far more ornate like they're meant to.
And once you put in this work, you have a conversion that in about a month and a half will have an actual released model for the unit it's meant to represent.
It's like telling a Marine player to convert a Captain from the Tactical Marine and Devastor boxes because the only place they buy from doesn't have any Captains in stock, and won't for a month and a bit. I mean, they technically can but it isn't really going to look like it fits the part.
To be fair, I think marine players do feel pressure to convert ancients and lieutenants, if they want to field them - if anything with the right paint job and application of bits said converted canoness would look fine as a palatine - which mechanically works as one's 'non-warlord' canoness.
I'm generally more fond of "made a captain" options anyway. The missing stuff is notable and problematic, and frustrating, but its completely out of everyone's hands at this point and the result of bad decisions made months ago. Being upset about it now is just a waste of energy. It'll come when it comes.
fox-light713 wrote: Or you can Use the Superior body from the basic battle sister kit
Which is what I am doing, temporarily. That doesn't make missing the Canoness set a good thing like people are making it out to be, nor does it excuse people acting like condescending donkey caves about it in this thread.
LunarSol wrote: Being upset about it now is just a waste of energy.
Us saying "this is dumb" doesn't mean we're apoplectically upset about it, no matter how much certain posters in this thread are attempting to make it out as such. One can complain about something without somehow raging or being unhappy with everything else.
I suppose the idea of "I like most of this, but wish they did it better in one particular area" blows some peoples minds and is way too complex and intricate for them to comprehend. Go figure .
No, but the thread has also become a "no news alert". Bumping to the top constantly with the same "still nothing" announcement to repeat the same cycle of complaints. The waiting game sucks. Lets play Hungry Hungry Hippos.
LunarSol wrote: No, but the thread has also become a "no news alert".
And for that, you can blame the people bashing anyone who is not more than 100% happy with the releases thus far, which you are participating in. Whee. Welcome to creating your own problem and then complaining about it.
And since we're now off topic, I'm going to go somewhere far away from this thread and check it again in a week or t wo I guess.
Melissia wrote: And for that, you can blame the people bashing anyone who is not more than 100% happy with the releases thus far, which you are participating in. Whee. Welcome to creating your own problem and then complaining about it.
Sororitas fans and enthusiasts should have already had the required miniatures in metal and be fully willing to field them
jake wrote: I feel like everyone forgot that they did release a new plastic Canoness late last year. In a box full of other Sisters stuff, which is still very available.
Cannoness Verdiyan is also still available.
So thats two available options for everyone. (not counting older metal models, conversions and a wide variety of 3rd party proxies and Junith, who can easily be fielded as a normal Cannoness).
Yes, we all wish that the new multi-part model was available now. But in a month or two it will be, and at that point it will be available forever. So this is just an extremely minor inconvenience in the first few months of the armies release.
You can also just magnetize the triumph of st katharine and end up with MANY canoness proxies
jake wrote: I feel like everyone forgot that they did release a new plastic Canoness late last year. In a box full of other Sisters stuff, which is still very available.
Cannoness Verdiyan is also still available.
So thats two available options for everyone. (not counting older metal models, conversions and a wide variety of 3rd party proxies and Junith, who can easily be fielded as a normal Cannoness).
Yes, we all wish that the new multi-part model was available now. But in a month or two it will be, and at that point it will be available forever. So this is just an extremely minor inconvenience in the first few months of the armies release.
You can also just magnetize the triumph of st katharine and end up with MANY canoness proxies
Totally. And that was one of the major topics of conversation here and in other Sisters spaces for weeks.
Doesn't have the options I need, and it's ugly. It's a one-off monopose named character, not a customizable generic HQ.
Or you can Use the Superior body from the basic battle sister kit which contains some of the options, you might need to get creative (some minor kit bashing) for some of the other options but should have most of what many are looking for. The domion kit supiror is also an option.
Which will then look like sister superior. Funny that. Sister superior model being used looking like sister superior. What a wonder! Totally unexpected result indeed!
I have yet to see anybody do canoness from sister superior that doesn't look like sister superior. Particularly as the canoness only bits(blessed blade, rod, brazier) haven't even been released so can't do that.
That's literally proxying. You proxy canoness with sister superior. Fine for those who are okay with proxies but others aren't.
Doesn't have the options I need, and it's ugly. It's a one-off monopose named character, not a customizable generic HQ.
Or you can Use the Superior body from the basic battle sister kit which contains some of the options, you might need to get creative (some minor kit bashing) for some of the other options but should have most of what many are looking for. The domion kit supiror is also an option.
Which will then look like sister superior. Funny that. Sister superior model being used looking like sister superior. What a wonder! Totally unexpected result indeed!
I have yet to see anybody do canoness from sister superior that doesn't look like sister superior. Particularly as the canoness only bits(blessed blade, rod, brazier) haven't even been released so can't do that.
That's literally proxying. You proxy canoness with sister superior. Fine for those who are okay with proxies but others aren't.
a sword and bolt gun is a perfectly legit loadout for a cannoness or sister superior.
Doesn't have the options I need, and it's ugly. It's a one-off monopose named character, not a customizable generic HQ.
Or you can Use the Superior body from the basic battle sister kit which contains some of the options, you might need to get creative (some minor kit bashing) for some of the other options but should have most of what many are looking for. The domion kit supiror is also an option.
Which will then look like sister superior. Funny that. Sister superior model being used looking like sister superior. What a wonder! Totally unexpected result indeed!
I have yet to see anybody do canoness from sister superior that doesn't look like sister superior. Particularly as the canoness only bits(blessed blade, rod, brazier) haven't even been released so can't do that.
That's literally proxying. You proxy canoness with sister superior. Fine for those who are okay with proxies but others aren't.
a sword and bolt gun is a perfectly legit loadout for a cannoness or sister superior.
What visually separates a canoness with power sword and bolter from a sister superior? (Genuine question)
Fenrir Kitsune wrote: A cape? Possibly the easiest possible thing to make with some green stuff? All this over a cape?
Eye of the Beholder I guess.
When I think back to my first Canoness, the one with the combi-flamer, I'm sure only the raised icon in her other hand made her stand out from a Sister.
Now the second metal Canoness had a lovely fur cape.....
I still do not see why a Canoness would have to HAVE a cape. Plenty of scope to do up a Superior model. I used to use basic Sisters as Superiors all the time. I distinguished them by painting the robes purple rather than black for the Order Of The Valourous Heart. Makes the model stand out from a basic trooper, no actual bling or converting required.
alphaecho wrote: When I think back to my first Canoness, the one with the combi-flamer, I'm sure only the raised icon in her other hand made her stand out from a Sister.
She had 1,5 times the mass of a sister superior, and iirc (not sure) she had the cool brasero on the backpack.
Fenrir Kitsune wrote: A cape? Possibly the easiest possible thing to make with some green stuff? All this over a cape?
I would rather just gimp my army than feth around with green stuff, tbh. I pay the money I pay for these models because I HATE stuff like that. Anything more involved than just assembling the plastic can go feth itself.
Also, the reason you can't really do a superior as a canoness instead is A. Because it'd be another in a LONG line of terrible butcherings of a model people alway come up to you and say 'look at this cool conversion I did, think I could ebay it for 150$?' And B We lack the bits for the null rod, brazier, or inferno pistol. I.e. the 3 good options.
Fenrir Kitsune wrote: A cape? Possibly the easiest possible thing to make with some green stuff? All this over a cape?
Regardless of how one feels about converting a basic Sister into a character, this statement is dubious at best. Sculpting a cape that has similar quality and style as the rest of a modern GW model is by no means the easiest thing you can do with green stuff and not something you should expect to be able to do without sufficient skill.
The easiest thing to add in green stuff, in my experience, is cigars. And even that ain't that easy.
I also did add military caps but those were quite hard and never up to the quality of commercial sculpts. But it did make my trollbloods looks like a proper, cool, unified subfaction so still a win .
alphaecho wrote: When I think back to my first Canoness, the one with the combi-flamer, I'm sure only the raised icon in her other hand made her stand out from a Sister.
She had 1,5 times the mass of a sister superior, and iirc (not sure) she had the cool brasero on the backpack.
And? Plus my canoness was given a jump pack so the braziers were never a problem.
As the rest of my post says, I've always upscaled some of models to a higher Rank ever since the first release of the Sisters in 2nd Ed.
Not one opponent has complained about my using a Sister as a Superior OR a Superior as a Canoness/ Palatine (remember those good old days).
I even demoted a Superior once by doing a hand swap and giving her the metal Blood Angels Assault Marine standard to turm her into a Simulacrum bearer....
I tend to find that nowaday, seeing as we have so much choice, some gamers seem less willing to convert or kitbash.
No Rod of Office, use the cool skull topped staff from the Scions kit.
No inferno pistol, ask around for a Blood Angels bit.
No Canoness model that you like, use an upgrade paint job on a Superior.
And more than "only the raised icon in her other hand" did "made her stand out from a Sister".
All I'm saying.
Gotta defend that awesome model which was imo much better than the 3rd ed replacement.
And more than "only the raised icon in her other hand" did "made her stand out from a Sister".
All I'm saying.
Gotta defend that awesome model which was imo much better than the 3rd ed replacement.
I love both.
Sometimes I felt guilty about using the Black Library Ephrael Stern model as a jump pack equipped Palatine. I suppose she'd look good as a Zephyrim Sister Superior now.
I just took that other sister model - the one based off the art, but not the Blanche one - did some minor conversion work to give her a power sword and bolter hanging around her shoulder, then gave her a paint job that makes the model stand out from amongst the rest of the models and draws the eye.
Didn't see the need for capes, flaming backpacks and OTT headgear. My girl gets in the trenches alongside her brethren and is a warrior. Left the dressing gown in the car.
I've done a nice conversion using her to outfit her with a Power Sword and Bolter hanging off her shoulder. Given her neutral stance, its a pretty good base for simple conversion work and her ornate armour (relative to other battle sisters) suits repurposing her for other uses.
Oppl wrote: I've done a nice conversion using her to outfit her with a Power Sword and Bolter hanging off her shoulder. Given her neutral stance, its a pretty good base for simple conversion work and her ornate armour (relative to other battle sisters) suits repurposing her for other uses.
You can't just say that and not have an image or something.
Looks like the only Adepta Sororitas previews this week are of the new Avenger Strike Fighters for Aeronautica Imperialis
We're now at March 15th as the earliest possible release date of the Canoness. Wonder when GW people organising conventions/tournaments will finally start noticing there are no SOB armies being played...
Well we knew already today would be nothing. Gw told more sisters(nothing on how much. Just 1 kit would fulfill statement) comes march. This means preorders will be on 7, 14, 21 or 28.3.
So unless they announce the preorders 2 weeks in time today was never on card. Next week preorders are february releases. Gw specifically said march.
One of next 4 sundays we hear of something but what and how many kits no-one outside gw knows
Automatically Appended Next Post: On one side gw confirming march something comes was nice as at least we know month. Otoh this made this sunday boring for as i knew already nothing there for me.
tneva82 wrote: Well we knew already today would be nothing. Gw told more sisters(nothing on how much. Just 1 kit would fulfill statement) comes march. This means preorders will be on 7, 14, 21 or 28.3.
So unless they announce the preorders 2 weeks in time today was never on card. Next week preorders are february releases. Gw specifically said march.
One of next 4 sundays we hear of something but what and how many kits no-one outside gw knows
Automatically Appended Next Post: On one side gw confirming march something comes was nice as at least we know month. Otoh this made this sunday boring for as i knew already nothing there for me.
That's incorrect. Today is the 23rd Feb. Preorder previews shown this afternoon would have been for Saturday the 7th March. Sisters today would have been possible.
Oh please not this again. I'm getting dejavu's from orktober...
For GW it's the PREORDER day that dictates month. This week's preorders are in for 29.2. Note the .2. February. Preorders are in february, in GW's book that's february release.
In similar way preorders that come in 28.3 are march releases for GW despite stores getting them in april.
For you and me it's in store day that counts. For GW it's the preorder date.
I already went through this once with orks who got preorder for codex in last weekend of october with in store november and ork players furious at GW claiming codex release is in october when stores had them in november. But it was already known them and it's same now. It's PREORDER date that counts for GW. Sucks but that's it is.
Preorder for sisters is 7.3, 14.3, 21.3 or 28.3 with in store day 14.3, 21.3, 28.3 or 4.4. If it goes later than that GW was in error when they said "in march".
That's why I'm getting nasty feeling preorder day will be 28.3. Dejavu's from orktober getting strong.
If it was up to me GW saying "march" would mean it would be in stores in march. But alas it isn't and I have already been experiencing GW saying specific month and then have product come on preorder on last weekend and in store next month and it wasn't even that big of a surprise(though big dissapointment. I missed tournament with new codex thanks to that as codex was in stores on day of tournament with list deadline before...) then. It's weird system but nothing I can do. I doubt GW changes it just because I would send email to them
So I was sat looking at exorcist sprues and the images of the new immolators, they the same size and sprue volume pretty much. I'm now concerned we'll get what is essentially a £50 razorback.
It's one sprue from exorcist and one new sprue. So quite likely.
(oh and on other news seems GW did say in FB all kits in march so just the preorder date is still open. 7.3, 14.3, 21.3, 28.3. Or multiples of course is possible)
PA6 somewhere there(still wonder if sisters don't get their rules in PA6 along. Of course PA8 or PA9 is still option) as well. And something for AOS(seraphim).
Maybe PA6 on 7.3, seraphom 14.3 and sisters 21 and 28.
Let's see prices. Hoping i can afford canoness 2 imagifier, terrain 3 boxes of jump packers. 10 zephyr and 5 seraphim with hand flamers to hopefully clear hole for zephyr to land to
GW hasn't released a non-monopose character model in forever. At least the Cannoness has far more options than any character model I can think of that been released in over a decade.
Even with the same weapons, you have 4 heads, two chests, and 2 backpacks to keep them from being exact carbon copies of each other. Yes, the pose will be the same, but the models will be different.
What non mono pose model has come last time? Marine commander wasn't mono pose but that kit is ancient.
If you keep hoping for non monopose you are just in dissapointing. Hell entire sister line so far has been monopose. Would have to have lived under the rock for decade to not know it's going to be monopose canoness.
Sisters are way ahead any other faction. We got head, weapon and chest optioks. Most are lucky if they have alternative pistol to go with
tneva82 wrote: What non mono pose model has come last time? Marine commander wasn't mono pose but that kit is ancient.
If you keep hoping for non monopose you are just in dissapointing. Hell entire sister line so far has been monopose. Would have to have lived under the rock for decade to not know it's going to be monopose canoness.
Sisters are way ahead any other faction. We got head, weapon and chest optioks. Most are lucky if they have alternative pistol to go with
The tau commander is the last true multi part hq I think, before that, maybe the mega armoured big mek or the admech tech priest dominos? Although hes still fairly static.
I like how the text empasizes the extra bits and different heads... as if this makes up for monopose everything.
The zephyrim look much cooler than stock seraphim. All blinged out.
And the new and improved base sizes... between 25 and 32. 28.5 is the new 25. I would be interested in plastic rings to slide around existing 25s. Will require a slit however in order to uodate already based models..
Dysartes wrote: Only two? Given your kit-bashing of terrain, I'd've thought half-a-dozen or more...
Strange as I may sound, I've not invested in any of the new Sector Imperialis stuff. I have the newer Manufactorum stuff that came with all the Derelict Factorums I got, but that's it. Still not 100% on whether to get any because I have so much CoD stuff already, and more ruined buildings is dull.
Dysartes wrote: Only two? Given your kit-bashing of terrain, I'd've thought half-a-dozen or more...
Strange as I may sound, I've not invested in any of the new Sector Imperialis stuff. I have the newer Manufactorum stuff that came with all the Derelict Factorums I got, but that's it. Still not 100% on whether to get any because I have so much CoD stuff already, and more ruined buildings is dull.
But think of the potential in... diagonal walls!!!
MajorWesJanson wrote: Most excited about the sanctum. Didn't know it had a balcony, which is awesome. Hope the angled walls and floors show up in other boxes down the line.
Yeah, the balcony is a nice touch. Gives the otherwise plain walls something interesting so the focus isn't entirely on the statue.
Melissia wrote: That the canoness is monopose is... bothersome.
I need three canonesses for my army, possibly more. And it's disappointing that they released such a limiting miniature for it.
I suppose I'll use novena and a modified flag-bearer model from the battle sisters box, but then I'll be one short for one of my squads...
I don't think I'm the most demanding of customers. I will agree that the foot on masonry pose is limiting but with the different chest, head, backpack mount and weapons, I don't see that the kit does not have enough variety. Add in spares from other kits, use subtly different paint schemes and, for me, there wouldn't be any issues.
Maybe it's because my first Sisters army had just one Canoness model available in metal with zero options.
Maybe it's because I haven't built a list that requires three or more Canonesses.
Maybe a Canoness should be the new Primaris Lieutenant when drawing on GW design and manufacturing resources.
tneva82 wrote: What non mono pose model has come last time? Marine commander wasn't mono pose but that kit is ancient.
If you keep hoping for non monopose you are just in dissapointing. Hell entire sister line so far has been monopose. Would have to have lived under the rock for decade to not know it's going to be monopose canoness.
Sisters are way ahead any other faction. We got head, weapon and chest optioks. Most are lucky if they have alternative pistol to go with
The tau commander is the last true multi part hq I think, before that, maybe the mega armoured big mek or the admech tech priest dominos? Although hes still fairly static.
TPD is completely monopose. He has one alternate head and 1 alternate gun but otherwise is identical to canoness in terms of one body.
Canoness has more poseability than TPD.
Here's how you make a differently posed canoness, in my 1-part tutorial series:
Step 1: Take extra heads, weapons and bits from your first canoness kit.
Step 2: Put them on the body of any sisters of battle model you like the pose of.
You now have a canoness posed however you like.
At least all the bits are in-scale and fairly generic for the canoness as opposed to some other factions like orks or tyranids where the characters are completely differently scaled to the other models.
Half my GSC characters are custom, and all our character sculpts are totally 100% monopose.
I'm trying very hard not to look at my wallet which is CLEARLY already on fire..I only need 2 canonesses, an imagifier, 2 immolators, and 6 BOXES OF ZEPHYSERIPHIM.
I can pretty much convert the canonesses at least. The rest is uh...ouch
Dysartes wrote: But think of the potential in... diagonal walls!!!
I know... I know... the design is elegant and the ability to do walls at 45 degrees and inside corners without giving yourself an aneurysm is quite an attractive feature.
And this big statues. Saw a nice table that used one each of those nice new statues and two of the older Marine statues to make a cool looking courtyard. I just happened to have two of those older Marine statues...
A tiny corner of my mind is conceptualising an Imperial cathedral with an octagonal spire and main doors from the old chapel kit with the giant eagle and someone needs to stop me before I accidentally order a half dozen shrine kits…
Oh, I didn't even see the sector imperialis stuff. My nephew might love the statue and etc. Terrain is one of the things he geeks out the most about. (I prefer Ork terrain myself, but he enjoys industrial and city terrain in general)
Melissia wrote: That the canoness is monopose is... bothersome.
I need three canonesses for my army, possibly more. And it's disappointing that they released such a limiting miniature for it.
I suppose I'll use novena and a modified flag-bearer model from the battle sisters box, but then I'll be one short for one of my squads...
The Repentia Superior from the box set also makes a good Canoness. Her robes are more elaborate than the battle Sisters, and you can easily amputate her whip hands and replace them with Canoness weapons.
It's disappointing that they specifically state that the statue is supposed to represent Celestine.
Of all the saints and heroes, and all the shrines on all the worlds, having the special character show up everywhere just makes the universe feel so much smaller.
Lord Damocles wrote: It's disappointing that they specifically state that the statue is supposed to represent Celestine.
Of all the saints and heroes, and all the shrines on all the worlds, having the special character show up everywhere just makes the universe feel so much smaller.
Yeah, but making the entire universe into the story of a couple dozen space marines who constantly keep bumping into each other already did that.
so, whatever. Celestine tm is the only Living Saint tm why do you ask? we can't make a model depicting any other living saint, some artist on the internet might make a buck by designing a model of her.
tneva82 wrote: Nobody has leaked prices? Usually they get leakea on monday
I saw some prices over on BOLS. (prices in USDs)
55$ for seriphium
75$ for immolator
35$ for cannoness and imaginfier
60$ for the rhino
and 35 bucks for the battle sanctum.
35 bucks seems pretty cheap for the terrain. the Rhino is...kinda pricy. I'd need a look at the sprue before I made a final judgement, if it included eneugh bits to bling out two seperate rhinos it might not be too bad, buy one SOB rhino and one marine rhino for every 2 rhinos you need. but if it's just eneugh to kit one rhino out? proably too much of a price jump
tneva82 wrote: Nobody has leaked prices? Usually they get leakea on monday
I saw some prices over on BOLS. (prices in USDs)
55$ for seriphium
75$ for immolator
35$ for cannoness and imaginfier
60$ for the rhino
and 35 bucks for the battle sanctum.
35 bucks seems pretty cheap for the terrain. the Rhino is...kinda pricy. I'd need a look at the sprue before I made a final judgement, if it included eneugh bits to bling out two seperate rhinos it might not be too bad, buy one SOB rhino and one marine rhino for every 2 rhinos you need. but if it's just eneugh to kit one rhino out? proably too much of a price jump
These are the prices in GBP from Valrak on B&C, so one of the prices is wrong for the terrain...
So imagifier tad cheaper than I expected, canoness about what I expected, seraphim what I dreaded and terrain went from get one right now to "sometime in future".
Think I'll settle for 2 imagifiers, canoness and 3 boxes of seraphim
So glad I don't need an army at this point. The odd box here and there to get my Sisters fix is viable*, but boy does it take a heap of money to pick up a full army these days...
*Of course I haven't done a damn thing with my Sisters yet since I was waiting for the Repentia - thanks for the delay, GW!
Terrain is particular oddity. Dollar price shown would be way too cheap but pound price makes it like double price to others. 35 as pounds would be about what i expected
Also pound price match basic sisters right? Dollar doesn't. And immolator would be tad cheaper than exorcists which surprises me
immolator is a dedicated transport while the exorcists is a heavy support, so gw expect people to but more immolators, so they earn it back much faster
tneva82 wrote: Terrain is particular oddity. Dollar price shown would be way too cheap but pound price makes it like double price to others. 35 as pounds would be about what i expected
Also pound price match basic sisters right? Dollar doesn't. And immolator would be tad cheaper than exorcists which surprises me
I don't think the shrine's price is an oddity at all. Much like the Tectonic Fragdrill it ties in with the matching general terrain (Mechanicus and Imperialis respectively) and that is... exotically priced. It wouldn't be like GW to sell faction terrain that basically uses the same features but for a significantly lower price.
Incidentally the Imperialis statues are also tied to the more expensive kits, which is another strike against the shrine.
terry wrote: immolator is a dedicated transport while the exorcists is a heavy support, so gw expect people to but more immolators, so they earn it back much faster
That price tag is so horrendously prohibitive for its profile that I'll just end up making proxies.
The rhino is oddly not that bad since you likely have enough bits to bling up 2 for the price of 1 upgrade sprue.
Hard pass all around here.
Still eyeing an exorcist and a basic squad but i might just hang things up until GW fixes the basic game.
I have plenty to paint and too little time to spend on poorly written and poorly conceived trademarks to send some marketeer's kid to Oxford.
Man. That Rhino price. It's 178% the price of the Marine Rhino, and the Marine Rhino comes with the regular Marine vehicle accessory sprue and the Razorback sprue. This kit removes two sprues, adds one, and goes up by that much?
H.B.M.C. wrote: Man. That Rhino price. It's 178% the price of the Marine Rhino, and the Marine Rhino comes with the regular Marine vehicle accessory sprue and the Razorback sprue. This kit removes two sprues, adds one, and goes up by that much?
Never change GW, you greedy fethers...
Huh? The Space Marine Rhino/Razorback is GBP 27.50 versus GBP 35 for the Sororitas Rhino. That's only 27% more. And we haven't seen the new sprue yet.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Man. That Rhino price. It's 178% the price of the Marine Rhino, and the Marine Rhino comes with the regular Marine vehicle accessory sprue and the Razorback sprue. This kit removes two sprues, adds one, and goes up by that much?
Never change GW, you greedy fethers...
Huh? The Space Marine Rhino/Razorback is GBP 27.50 versus GBP 35 for the Sororitas Rhino. That's only 27% more. And we haven't seen the new sprue yet.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Man. That Rhino price. It's 178% the price of the Marine Rhino, and the Marine Rhino comes with the regular Marine vehicle accessory sprue and the Razorback sprue. This kit removes two sprues, adds one, and goes up by that much?
Never change GW, you greedy fethers...
Huh? The Space Marine Rhino/Razorback is GBP 27.50 versus GBP 35 for the Sororitas Rhino. That's only 27% more. And we haven't seen the new sprue yet.
TBH is still a little too much of an increase for a side-grade of a VERY old kit...
Really like the jumppack icons in the seraphim box ... they look to be compatible with normal backpacks so i want those to pimp up the Triumph of St. Kathrine even more
H.B.M.C. wrote: Man. That Rhino price. It's 178% the price of the Marine Rhino, and the Marine Rhino comes with the regular Marine vehicle accessory sprue and the Razorback sprue. This kit removes two sprues, adds one, and goes up by that much?
Never change GW, you greedy fethers...
Pretty glad I stocked on old Sororitas rhino when it was possible, the new rhino isn't even better looking than the old one. Imo the new one is actually worse than the previous one, with just random bits instead of the cool special top that gave it a different silhouette before. I was planning to buying one box for the extra sprue and selling back the rhino sprues, but paying 78% of a rhino just for a very few bits it too much even for me I guess...
And before you answer me, half-bro, remember my previous sig .
So are the zephyrim jump packs completely different pieces from the seraphim jump packs? I initially thought they would be bits of wrought iron fence glued to the regular seraphim backpack but looking at it now I'm starting to wonder if we're going to have leftover jump packs with every kit?
If so, I might have to build that jump-pack canoness after all - run her as a counts-as Celestine.
Crazyterran wrote: I thought the limited edition sisters box was labeled as a faith and fury box, back during the sm v CSM book
Maybe. If you count that as pa release then sisters get 2 as gw confirmed pa rules coming for sisters. No rules in pa2. Ergo another book coming.
Sisters won't be left out of build your order all get in pa
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Galas wrote: Huh? The Space Marine Rhino/Razorback is GBP 27.50 versus GBP 35 for the Sororitas Rhino. That's only 27% more. And we haven't seen the new sprue yet.
It's new sku. Were rhino be released now it would be likely 32.5-35 pounds as well.
Gw price hike system. Rather than shop wide new sku's get price hikes
Terrain got hit hardest. Ork terrain 32.5 euro. Gsc 45e. This 85e. First 40k terrain that isn't pure junk and price nearly doubles. No surprise. Soon faction terrains will be pushing 100e mark
H.B.M.C. wrote: Man. That Rhino price. It's 178% the price of the Marine Rhino, and the Marine Rhino comes with the regular Marine vehicle accessory sprue and the Razorback sprue. This kit removes two sprues, adds one, and goes up by that much?
Never change GW, you greedy fethers...
Huh? The Space Marine Rhino/Razorback is GBP 27.50 versus GBP 35 for the Sororitas Rhino. That's only 27% more. And we haven't seen the new sprue yet.
You're right. That sprue is jammed packed with content compared to the Rhino Accessory and Razorback sprue combined. I guess that and it's being a new sprue explains why the Sororities Rhino is a bit more expense (27% not 78%).
The funny thing is how reasonable they are being with AoS prices (Morterk guard 20 new infantry for 40€, ogre plastic tyrant 25€ even cheaper than the finecast one and cheaper than primaris characters, etc, etc...) but with w40k they are surely milking that cow.
alextroy wrote: Huh? The Space Marine Rhino/Razorback is GBP 27.50 versus GBP 35 for the Sororitas Rhino. That's only 27% more. And we haven't seen the new sprue yet.
alextroy wrote: Huh? The Space Marine Rhino/Razorback is GBP 27.50 versus GBP 35 for the Sororitas Rhino. That's only 27% more. And we haven't seen the new sprue yet.
alextroy wrote: Huh? The Space Marine Rhino/Razorback is GBP 27.50 versus GBP 35 for the Sororitas Rhino. That's only 27% more. And we haven't seen the new sprue yet.
alextroy wrote: Huh? The Space Marine Rhino/Razorback is GBP 27.50 versus GBP 35 for the Sororitas Rhino. That's only 27% more. And we haven't seen the new sprue yet.
ERJAK wrote: One, I like how you're somehow smug despite the fact that your original math was literally 100% off(or a typo, wrong either way).
I said it was 178% the price. It is 178% the price. Y'know, $55 x 1.78. You're inability to understand basic multiplication is not my problem.
ERJAK wrote: Two, your problem is that the rest of us are talking about buying the kits with money not...I'm gonna guess...badly singed eucalyptus leaves?
A bushfire dig? Well there's poor taste, and then there's whatever the feth that was.
Alpharius wrote: I got the Sisters LE box but GW's handling of every thing else has effectively killed my interest in this army.
That and, of course, the price of everything else I'd need to field a fun force made up of Sisters...
Friend of mine spent a while getting a massive SoB army off eBay in the leadup to this release. He was looking forward to supplementing everything with a full plastic release. Now he's holding off buying tanks because they cost so damned much.
I don't know how he'll go on once Repressors go Legends.
Alpharius wrote: I got the Sisters LE box but GW's handling of every thing else has effectively killed my interest in this army.
That and, of course, the price of everything else I'd need to field a fun force made up of Sisters...
Friend of mine spent a while getting a massive SoB army off eBay in the leadup to this release. He was looking forward to supplementing everything with a full plastic release. Now he's holding off buying tanks because they cost so damned much.
I don't know how he'll go on once Repressors go Legends.
He could just buy space Marine Rhinos. the added bling isn't exactly nesscary
He could just buy space Marine Rhinos. the added bling isn't exactly nesscary
And there is quite a lot of bling in the Sisters Rhino kit, so one could easily get one of those and then, say, two marine Rhinos and spread the bling. I think it would achieve sufficiently sistery look cheaper.
Matt.Kingsley wrote: 55 * 178% is 98 (well actually it's 97.9, but close enough).
H.B.M.C didn't say 178% more in his initial post, he said it's 178% of the price. There's a difference.
And when people sayd 27% they said 127% of price. They are talking about same thing. What the rest didn't know is that for some reason GW has rhino price conversion all weird up compared to rest in that specific currency. For UK it's 127% price in HBMC' terms. For euro it's 128%.
For some reason in HBMC's country rhino gets unusually cheap conversion rate while rhino goes to usual high conversion rate making comparison worse than it's for rest.
tneva82 wrote: And when people sayd 27% they said 127% of price.
That was never in dispute. People just thought my maths was wrong, which it wasn't.
Your math is - theoretically, as we haven't seen the prices on the GW site yet - correct for your currency. People quoting 127% were correct for their currency of choice.
The problem we have is that your initial statement didn't make it explicitly clear which currency was being referred to, hence the confusion.
And, with that, I'll don my helmet and get back into my bunker.
tneva82 wrote: And when people sayd 27% they said 127% of price.
That was never in dispute. People just thought my maths was wrong, which it wasn't.
Your math is - theoretically, as we haven't seen the prices on the GW site yet - correct for your currency. People quoting 127% were correct for their currency of choice.
The problem we have is that your initial statement didn't make it explicitly clear which currency was being referred to, hence the confusion.
And, with that, I'll don my helmet and get back into my bunker.
I have re-read this thread twice now and I still don't find any indication where the AUD prices are coming from that HBMC is referring to... They are certainly not shown in this thread...
SKR.HH wrote: I have re-read this thread twice now and I still don't find any indication where the AUD prices are coming from that HBMC is referring to... They are certainly not shown in this thread...
It's a case of equivalencies.
Oz prices don't get leaked. We get UK, US and a lot of the time EU and CAD prices. So you take the UK price, look up something that costs the same, then look at what that costs in Oz and work out what the likely price of the new object is.
I'm feeling a lot more sympathy for you Aussies and the non-consistent exchange rates. Somehow the GBP 27.50 Rhino is AUD$55 while the GBP 27.50 Judith Eurita is AUD$77. Given that the GBP 35 Battle Sister Box is AUD$98, you can validity expect the Soroitas Rhino to be AUD$98. One must wonder why they jack up the price of new kits to Oz but not the old ones?
alextroy wrote: I'm feeling a lot more sympathy for you Aussies and the non-consistent exchange rates. Somehow the GBP 27.50 Rhino is AUD$55 while the GBP 27.50 Judith Eurita is AUD$77. Given that the GBP 35 Battle Sister Box is AUD$98, you can validity expect the Soroitas Rhino to be AUD$98. One must wonder why they jack up the price of new kits to Oz but not the old ones?
I am honestly surprised that those jump packs aren't a main body and half-a-dozen fiddly little parts. That's almost unprecedented for recent GW models.
Man, not a single of the new sisters releases has been under £30 out here. That new rhino works out at well over £60. I think I'm out fellas. No more GW for me, this gak is ridiculous. I love GW, and I love SoB especially, but there's no way I can justify those prices.
Sweet, so there are ten packs. I can replace the regular jump packs from my limited set custom Zephyrim with the new ornate style ones, and then use the original packs on something else
I think I'll be getting 3 of the Seraphim set, 2 Dialogus, 1 Canoness and 1 Imagifier.
Still can't stand those Repentia, plus I have far, FAR too many SoB vehicles already to justify purchasing any new ones.
Not really interested in the Sanctum, but would buy the statue part of it if someone splits the set into pieces.
EDIT: Hmm - so it's possible to buy two Seraphim sets plus one set of 10 battle sisters, and voila you have 10 Seraphim AND 10 converted Zephyrim, without having to buy 4 boxes. All you need is to engineer some flight stands.
I’ll repeat this because everyone seems to have missed it. There are not 10 full jump packs. There is a shield shaped plate which forms the back of the jump pack, which you only get 5 of.
If you look at the top sprue you can clearly see that the Zephyrim jump pack has a larger "wingspan" than the Seraphim pack. That's interesting.
I can definitely see converting regular sisters into Seraphim, but I don't think you want to use flight bases unless you're planning to modify the legs into flying poses. Just have them standing on the ground. It'll be fine.
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MonkeyBallistic wrote: I’ll repeat this because everyone seems to have missed it. There are not 10 full jump packs. There is a shield shaped plate which forms the back of the jump pack, which you only get 5 of.
Oh, I see. Well, it probably won't be too hard to sculpt a replacement from greenstuff, it doesn't look like a very complicated piece (if I'm looking at the right one).
EDIT: Hmm - so it's possible to buy two Seraphim sets plus one set of 10 battle sisters, and voila you have 10 Seraphim AND 10 converted Zephyrim, without having to buy 4 boxes. All you need is to engineer some flight stands.
You would also need to find or sculpt the missing part of 5 of those jump packs.
Binabik15 wrote: Ok, ok, jump packs, very cool - but you get eighteen Eviscerators per box of Repentia?!
I need to build a crazy Redemptionist/Cawdor/Inquisitorial retinue now. Eviscerators...Eviscerators everywhere.
PS: too early to type, it seems
That’s excellent. It strongly suggests two different ways to build each sister.
"The kit builds nine Repentia armed with penitent eviscerators. Each body has a choice of two sets of arms for added variety."
That's why I counted them in the first place. I was thinking that they'd have different arm pairs fitting a single Eviscerator or that two bodies share two sets of arms that you could chose from, but the sprue seemed packed. And it turns out the sculptor did actually do two sets of arms with an Eviscerator each. The brilliant madman (madwoman?)
Coenus Scaldingus wrote:
Binabik15 wrote: Ok, ok, jump packs, very cool - but you get eighteen Eviscerators per box of Repentia?!
And quite the selection of head options too by the looks of things.
I'm on my phone on a train, so I can only really see the painted heads. But those are mostly excellent already.
So the Repentia are pretty awesome once you do somethung about their gym clothes, but I can sculpt, thankfully. And 9 leftover Eviscerators makes the set a decent purchase when you take into account how much those would cost as (third) party bits.
EDIT: Hmm - so it's possible to buy two Seraphim sets plus one set of 10 battle sisters, and voila you have 10 Seraphim AND 10 converted Zephyrim, without having to buy 4 boxes. All you need is to engineer some flight stands.
You would also need to find or sculpt the missing part of 5 of those jump packs.
Well if we're being pedantic about it, I'd need 10 of that piece in the scenario I outlined, not 5, because I'd only have 10 of them to share between 20 jump pack sisters.
But sheesh, you keep talking about that small shield as if not adding it to each jump pack will somehow cause a Seraphim/Zephyrim model to explode. Just relax dude, it's a tiny shield with a purity seal on it. I'm sure people will find something else to glue on to the spot where those go. We aren't going to just throw up our hands and toss the five remaining perfectly usable jump packs into the trash just because of that small piece.
EDIT: Hmm - so it's possible to buy two Seraphim sets plus one set of 10 battle sisters, and voila you have 10 Seraphim AND 10 converted Zephyrim, without having to buy 4 boxes. All you need is to engineer some flight stands.
You would also need to find or sculpt the missing part of 5 of those jump packs.
Well if we're being pedantic about it, I'd need 10 of that piece in the scenario I outlined, not 5, because I'd only have 10 of them to share between 20 jump pack sisters.
But sheesh, you keep talking about that small shield as if not adding it to each jump pack will somehow cause a Seraphim/Zephyrim model to explode. Just relax dude, it's a tiny shield with a purity seal on it. I'm sure people will find something else to glue on to the spot where those go. We aren't going to just throw up our hands and toss the five remaining perfectly usable jump packs into the trash just because of that small piece.
I’ve mentioned it a few times because different people have claimed that the set comes with 10 complete jump packs. It doesn’t. That piece is not just some tiny bit of decoration you can leave off. The jump packs are modelled to be hollow and that is the backplate which completes the pack. It’s difficult to tell from the photos, but I think it also forms part of the side of the lower part of the jump pack too.
I’m not for a minute suggesting that it can’t be replaced/resculpted and that the extra jump packs can’t be used. It’s just not 10 complete jump packs per set like some people were saying.
That battle sanctum is glorious. Expensive, but a glorious centerpiece of a battlefield. If I had more space to store terrain at home I'd definitely get one.
MonkeyBallistic wrote: That piece is not just some tiny bit of decoration you can leave off. The jump packs are modelled to be hollow and that is the backplate which completes the pack. It’s difficult to tell from the photos, but I think it also forms part of the side of the lower part of the jump pack too.
Are you sure about any of that, without holding the sprues in your hands?
I mean, you might be right, but at present things aren't clear either way.
Even money says there's a piece up on Shapeways within a day or two of the kit being released.
MonkeyBallistic wrote: That piece is not just some tiny bit of decoration you can leave off. The jump packs are modelled to be hollow and that is the backplate which completes the pack. It’s difficult to tell from the photos, but I think it also forms part of the side of the lower part of the jump pack too.
Are you sure about any of that, without holding the sprues in your hands?
I mean, you might be right, but at present things aren't clear either way.
Even money says there's a piece up on Shapeways within a day or two of the kit being released.
I’m as certain as I can be without holding the sprues in my hand.
Looking at the bits on the sprue photos, I don’t believe there is any complex side part on the “shield” sections but will be a counterpart socket to the extrusions on the rear of the packs.
Based on that, though, my plan would be to use Blue Stuff to make press-moulds. The “shield” parts are not structural and have a large contact area so putty copies should be quite stable.
MonkeyBallistic wrote: That piece is not just some tiny bit of decoration you can leave off. The jump packs are modelled to be hollow and that is the backplate which completes the pack. It’s difficult to tell from the photos, but I think it also forms part of the side of the lower part of the jump pack too.
Are you sure about any of that, without holding the sprues in your hands?
I mean, you might be right, but at present things aren't clear either way.
Even money says there's a piece up on Shapeways within a day or two of the kit being released.
You could just remove that entire section of the jump pack and replace it with the identical section from a regular SoB backpack. All they've done is split that lower parrt of the pack into two pieces, depth-wise, so that they could avoid the challenge of having the fiddly little purity seal molded on to the jump pack, which would have made molding the vents and other decorations more difficult.
Or you could just not use the shield piece at all and nobody would care. Once painted, the connector on the jump pack that links with that shield piece would just look like a normal part of the model.
Of course, any sane person will just dab a small piece of green stuff in the place of the shield, or glue something else there like a spare helmet, holstered pistol, grenade, vehicle smoke launcher, or small shield.
The idea that you can't use all ten packs on account of that small piece is like saying you can't use a Rhino because you're missing the top hatch piece.
MonkeyBallistic wrote: I’ll repeat this because everyone seems to have missed it. There are not 10 full jump packs. There is a shield shaped plate which forms the back of the jump pack, which you only get 5 of.
That's an easy conversion though. Those back plate are pretty flat; so you could easily press mold them from GS. Or fill the space with your favorite modeling putty and sand it smooth. Or cover it with plastic card, and glue one some purity seals or other bits from the Sisters range. The real problem with using them to convert a Battle Sister box is their heavier cassocks, and striding poses. Although. you could get around the poses if you mount them on a standard base base.
Has the GW webstore been caught in an endless checkout loop for two weeks for anyone else, requiring me to log back in when confirming my paypal details and thus rebooting the order to stage one without completing it?
I don’t know if people are wilfully misunderstanding what I’ve said regarding the jump packs. At no point have I claimed that you can’t use all 10. At no point have I claimed that making all 10 usable is not an easy conversion. All I have done is point out that when the sprue pic first came online, a few people were claiming that you got 10 complete jump packs and that this simply isn’t true.
changemod wrote: Has the GW webstore been caught in an endless checkout loop for two weeks for anyone else, requiring me to log back in when confirming my paypal details and thus rebooting the order to stage one without completing it?
I had one time it. Didn't figure any way myself to fix. Eventually fixed itseif. Gw said to clear cache etc but didn't help then
Kid_Kyoto wrote: Yay. More arms. Yay. In case I ever want an army of 4 armed battle sisters.
You cannot possibly be implying that you would rather pay 33% less to have a kit that only builds Seraphim, or a kit that only builds Zephyrims, instead of the more expensive dual kit, right?
Kid_Kyoto wrote: Yay. More arms. Yay. In case I ever want an army of 4 armed battle sisters.
You cannot possibly be implying that you would rather pay 33% less to have a kit that only builds Seraphim, or a kit that only builds Zephyrims, instead of the more expensive dual kit, right?
I'm just amused by the idea that even if they did them as single kits, there would be any kind of savings, let alone savings as high as 33%.
MonkeyBallistic wrote: I don’t know if people are wilfully misunderstanding what I’ve said regarding the jump packs. At no point have I claimed that you can’t use all 10. At no point have I claimed that making all 10 usable is not an easy conversion. All I have done is point out that when the sprue pic first came online, a few people were claiming that you got 10 complete jump packs and that this simply isn’t true.
That’s it.
Now I’m done with this.
I’m done done with all the , yes but ... answers
I’m done.
Poor dude - nah, I understood your intentions, and the others really seem to only want to say that the backpacks are still going to be useable... Thanks for the insight, for myself and others who have gained from it.
Well, at least we can all have fun assembling our new Sisters during this strange time. They might have taken a while to appear, but it seems the last batch of the new range arrived just in time before lockdowns started coming into full effect.
Now I just need to go back through all the Sisters I already asembled, because I really want to swap out parts with the great new heads/helmets and other accessories.
Zephyrim helmets in particular make for GREAT Celestian helmets, they look far more unique and easy to identify than the official Celestian helms!
Casbyness wrote: Two off-handed swords per Seraphim box. So you need 3 boxes if you want a fun squad of 5 Zephyrim all dual-wielding power swords
I'd probably just make that the leader model, but on the bright side, you're also getting a 10 man inferno pistol Seraphim unit. If you take 30 Seraphim and 15 Zephyrim you've got swords to spare.
Casbyness wrote: Two off-handed swords per Seraphim box. So you need 3 boxes if you want a fun squad of 5 Zephyrim all dual-wielding power swords
I'd probably just make that the leader model, but on the bright side, you're also getting a 10 man inferno pistol Seraphim unit. If you take 30 Seraphim and 15 Zephyrim you've got swords to spare.
Funny you mention that, I was just re-reading the equipment options for the Superior to see if I could legally get away with two swords. I think there's a weak argument for 1 power sword + 1 chainsword (each traded for 1 bolt pistol), but the wording is actually pretty clear so not really
Also tempted to use one of the dying Sisters from the Hospitaller as a carried casualty for a Seraphim.
Plus there's just no way I'm not converting the new Canoness so she can wield the brazier atop one of those Zephyrim pennants. Might even use two on an Anchorite, in place of the braziers.
Am I the only one who thinks the new design is just weird? Maybe even outright bad?
The old design had the hailer built into the staff. The new model is just holding a regular staff, then the laud hailer is some kind of floating ticker tape machine. From photos of the painted mini I assumed the hailer was connected to the front of the Dialogus, linking to the mic below her head. But nope - it's just floating in front of her as an independent model, with no clear means of propulsion. Not even a cherub or servo skull supporting it.
Then there's the book behind her back, with dripping candles above it. I dunno...it just feels like everything about this model is nonsense from any kind of practical design perspective. How is she meant to fight? She's covered in layers, scrolls and her staff looks so unimpressive.
Trying to think up a good conversion to rearrange the various parts of the model.
Am I the only one who thinks the new design is just weird? Maybe even outright bad?
The old design had the hailer built into the staff. The new model is just holding a regular staff, then the laud hailer is some kind of floating ticker tape machine. From photos of the painted mini I assumed the hailer was connected to the front of the Dialogus, linking to the mic below her head. But nope - it's just floating in front of her as an independent model, with no clear means of propulsion. Not even a cherub or servo skull supporting it.
Then there's the book behind her back, with dripping candles above it. I dunno...it just feels like everything about this model is nonsense from any kind of practical design perspective. How is she meant to fight? She's covered in layers, scrolls and her staff looks so unimpressive.
She's not meant to fight, actually. Her job is more about taking care of holy scriptures, inspiring her sisters by reading them and actually writing / translating / decyphering stuff.
For the rest, well it's 40k...that kind of stuff is pretty much what the miniatures try to convey. It's impractical and over the top, indeed, but it was never meant to be pragmatic. Hell, the whole Imperium of Mankind is the very definition of bloated and impractical.
I really like the Dialogus. Its a cool and flavorful model full of neat details. I was really pleased when I first saw it, and I can't wait to star painting mine.
Am I the only one who thinks the new design is just weird? Maybe even outright bad?
The old design had the hailer built into the staff. The new model is just holding a regular staff, then the laud hailer is some kind of floating ticker tape machine. From photos of the painted mini I assumed the hailer was connected to the front of the Dialogus, linking to the mic below her head. But nope - it's just floating in front of her as an independent model, with no clear means of propulsion. Not even a cherub or servo skull supporting it.
Then there's the book behind her back, with dripping candles above it. I dunno...it just feels like everything about this model is nonsense from any kind of practical design perspective. How is she meant to fight? She's covered in layers, scrolls and her staff looks so unimpressive.
Trying to think up a good conversion to rearrange the various parts of the model.
It is meant to be a floating version of the lecterns you see in the main aisle of churches etc.
I'm guessing it floats the same way cherubs and servo skulls do, I don't think the IoM restricts its antigrav tech to creepy babies or skulls only.
Am I the only one who thinks the new design is just weird? Maybe even outright bad?
Weird, yes. Outright bad? not particularly. The old one was a bad model and often just looks poorly cast.
Granted its actually an inquistorial henchman and not a Sister, but still. Almost anything is an upgrade to that- she looks like evil german torturer guy from Indiana Jones halfway through the Ark of the Covenant being opened.
Am I the only one who thinks the new design is just weird? Maybe even outright bad?
The old design had the hailer built into the staff. The new model is just holding a regular staff.
I mean, there's clearly an audio speaker built into the top of the new model's staff. The only real difference is that there's not a wire attached from the staff to something else, but that shouldn't really be too big of an issue. The floating lectern is similar to the Master of Rites, so it has precedent, and it lowkey would fit with the Dialogus very well. Especially since it has censers trailing at the bottom. In terms of modeling, I feel like if they were super faithful, it would look just like a sister version of the GSC Clamavus, which is also a potential conversion idea for a Dialogus
Am I the only one who thinks the new design is just weird? Maybe even outright bad?
... are we talking about by itself, or compared to the old model?
Cause the old Dialogous model is in the running for the worst model GW has ever made. Was voted on DakkaDakka to be the model most in need of update half a dozen times.
The new model is massively superior, no matter its problems, to the horrid monstrosity that was the previous model.
I can't really tell about the quality of the cast because I don't think I've ever seen a real one but I love the look on the pictures.
If you have seen one for real, does she really have a speaker inside her mouth, or is it just me? If she has I think it's brilliant!
Oh. That's slightly disappointing. I'll try to fix that up with a bit of conversion then!
I still overall like the look of the design. I mean I like the new one too, no doubt, I'll just try to get both!
The only real problem with the old Dialogous is the glasses and mouth on the head. Now that we have lots of Sisters heads to play with, replacing that head should be a snap.
I loved the old Dialogous because I honestly believed for over a decade she had her mouth reformed around a speaker. Things like that had appeared in artwork before and it was appropriately grimdark. I also thought the eyes were optics that're often depicted as a bit 'bug-eyed' and the whole design was meant to have a disturbing uncanniness to it. Maybe all that just shaped my opinions about it.
It's not so much the "dorky" look as much as it is the "low-quality crappy sculpt that's the worst sculpt that GW has ever done" bit.
Well, I get that you don't like it, but with that you can't be taken serious. Even without considering really old models, we had Nagash (and a lot of the 4th edition Undead), the Drag Queen of Athel Loren, 4th edition Daemonettes, Dieter Helsnicht's Manticore, the BB Amazon team, the metal CSM Possessed, Dwarfs with heads as large as their bodies, most of the pre Gorkamorka Orks/Orcs, plastic Catachans, the old Necron Lord, the Epic Eldar Revenant chicken etc. pp. .
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:I'm not sure why you dislike it so much, but since you are far from the only one, and most people hate it too, I guess I am the weird one here ^^'.
Nah. I like the model too, maybe even because the slightly comically face.
