We all know one. That. Fething. Guy.
The one who brings 8 riptides in a 2000 point game. The one who uses Warlord titans in normal 40k.

Post your stories about TFGs or WAACs here.

I was playing in a tournament and I had a squad of Guardsmen on foot. They went through dangerous terrain, so I rolled 10 dice, got a single 1, failed the armor save, and removed one lasgun guy. My opponent made a stink about the fact I didn't roll for each individual model in the unit, which would have taken exponentially longer and we were pressed for time. So, to oblige him, I went back, moved every model back, and rolled a die for each individual guy. The same exact model I previously removed was the only one to fail his rolls, and I stared my opponent in the eye as I deliberately removed him. The game was miserable before it, and miserable after it.

I played a game years ago against a guy who would just yell "Don't mess up!" before every. Single. Dieroll. I don't know if that qualifies him as TFG in the traditional sense, but it was absolutely infuriating and I never played him again.

Verviedi wrote:
We all know one. That. Fething. Guy.
The one who brings 8 riptides in a 2000 point game. The one who uses Warlord titans in normal 40k.

Post your stories about TFGs or WAACs here.

Those aren't really "TFG" traits unless he does it without talking to the opponent first and only does it to get an easy win and not to try and create an interesting game for both players.

As for a TFG story: Back in 5th I was in a tournament and honestly didn't do super great. All my games were losses or ties and were against the three people who took top 3 (my poor Sisters died like martyrs many times that day. It was a weird combination of my desire to try and make non-standard Sisters lists work paired with dice rolls that were not helping at all). The person who took 3rd was someone whose history in the gaming group was legendary: he was renowned for only rolling well on scatter and leadership, and poorly on everything else. We even had an award that was given to the bottom place player for being a good sport despite being stomped that day, named after him (the An'Dru (done up with a nice certificate with some Tau things going on in the background). Well he must have gotten that curse lifted that day because he was on fire, and had won two of his games, and though he tried very hard only tied against me, costing him 1st and 2nd place. He pitched a royal fit about this and refused the 3rd place trophy (yes there were trophies for this. They weren't extravagant, but they were made specifically for the top 3 players) and yelled at me the most for "costing him 1st place" because I didn't just quit when the game had turned against me early on (I pride myself on playing until the bitter end, no matter how bitter because I believe you can learn from losing and turn it into ways to learn how to win in the future based on what happened). He then dumped all of his stuff into his box and stormed out out of the place swearing the whole way. All because he didn't take 1st place in a tournament, when he usually rates last, or at least really close to it.

THAT is what a "TFG" looks like.

Wow. That dude sounded like a kind of fun opponent until that story. I can't imagine caring about a game that much.

 Brother SRM wrote:
Wow. That dude sounded like a kind of fun opponent until that story. I can't imagine caring about a game that much.

He was only fun when stoned, when his buzz wore off he turned into a right ass with a temper and and a need to argue about everything. He also only spoke in one volume: loud. He was fine at times, but they never lasted long enough.

This one time I lost to another player and I didn't like what he ran so he is clearly TFG. I hate these threads. It's always someone bitching and moaning about what units someone else was using. The only time I want to see someone mention TFG is when it's the persons attitude that is called into question. I can loose to someone running 20 Riptides if they are a fun player. Playing an donkey-cave though is never fun regardless of what he running.

 Goldphish wrote:
This one time I lost to another player and I didn't like what he ran so he is clearly TFG. I hate these threads. It's always someone bitching and moaning about what units someone else was using. The only time I want to see someone mention TFG is when it's the persons attitude that is called into question. I can loose to someone running 20 Riptides if they are a fun player. Playing an donkey-cave though is never fun regardless of what he running.

All the stories so far haven't been like that at all, they were all about attitude... Did you even read them?

ImAGeek wrote:
All the stories so far haven't been like that at all, they were all about attitude... Did you even read them?

The two examples in the opening post were both army list complaints rather than attitude complaints, did you even read it? {/Sarcasm}

The OP did ask for both TFG and WAAC stories (I would put his two examples in the latter category), but the title of the thread only mentions TFG's.

I don't really have anything to add on-topic, but I don't attend tournaments, so I'm less likely to run into those sorts I guess.

I played against a gw staff member who had a printout of the upcoming unreleased eldar codex in a small tournament. At the time models had to have the weapons on them but holstered pistols would count. I advised him of this as i was shooting my single plasma pistol at his jetbikes he wouldnt accept this despite the fact it was in my army list and the fact he was using an unofficial army book. Didnt massively affect the game just annoyed me and still remember 15 years on! I won in the end quite nicely and my other opponents that day were happy for me to use the lone plasma pistol as that.

 Quanar wrote:

ImAGeek wrote:
All the stories so far haven't been like that at all, they were all about attitude... Did you even read them?

The two examples in the opening post were both army list complaints rather than attitude complaints, did you even read it? {/Sarcasm}

The OP did ask for both TFG and WAAC stories (I would put his two examples in the latter category), but the title of the thread only mentions TFG's.

I don't really have anything to add on-topic, but I don't attend tournaments, so I'm less likely to run into those sorts I guess.

In the opening post yeah but none since then.

One guy I used to play brought three Riptides regularly, called me names when I pointed out the Farsight Bomb no longer worked as intended (ICs can't join MCs in 7th). Insisted the Tau Firebase Support Cadre only needed one reserve roll for the entire detachment to arrive (formations that go this specifically say so). Finally stopped playing him once he started saying, quote, "Riptides suck, I'm going to field them as R'vana's."


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I don't mean to sound like I'm complaining, just giving you an idea of how it was

When I was visiting my aunt in UK, I took my army with me, because I realy wanted to go to warhammer world. On the weekend my aunt drove me there. Huge place, more terrain then I ever saw in my life. Found an opponent who didn't mind my accent . Dude was , from the looks, in his late 30s, asked about my army, where I come from and was not creepy doing this. He didn't even ask why I don't play nids or sob, which almost all new opponents ask me.
I asked for a game ,he asked for my list, if I had any other models etc. I had foot guard, with no vendettas as those would take up too much space in a plane. After seeing my army, he deployed his. 3 whirlwinds, 3 FW weapon platforms that looked like whirlwinds and a ton of 5 man squads with heavy bolters. I asked about the FW rules, as we don't play FW here, and he said he didn't have the book with him, but his friends asured me that they work how he said they did. I got almost wiped out turn 1, died turn 2. And then the fun started, first he started to laugh at me with his friend how bad my army list, then asked me why am so unhappy about his 20+min of rolling dice. And when I was walking away he told his friends how bad female gamers are and how he was trying to "go easy on me".

2.5k tourney I went to right after 6th came out. I brought my Tau (which were still old codex at the time) and got a GK player my second round. It was the relic mission so he was easily going to roflstomp me. He brought 2 max squads of pallys with draigo, a librarian, 2 minimum strike squads with razorbacks, and the rest was autocannon dreds. I blew up a razor back turn 2 which was the only full kill i got due to him look out sir ing every wound i got in to the pallys. He got so mad i got a kill against him he kicked a chair into another table that messed up their game. He ended up losing to daemons due to the white dwarf update in the next round and this time threw a chair.

Makumba wrote:
When I was visiting my aunt in UK, I took my army with me, because I realy wanted to go to warhammer world. On the weekend my aunt drove me there. Huge place, more terrain then I ever saw in my life. Found an opponent who didn't mind my accent . Dude was , from the looks, in his late 30s, asked about my army, where I come from and was not creepy doing this. He didn't even ask why I don't play nids or sob, which almost all new opponents ask me.
I asked for a game ,he asked for my list, if I had any other models etc. I had foot guard, with no vendettas as those would take up too much space in a plane. After seeing my army, he deployed his. 3 whirlwinds, 3 FW weapon platforms that looked like whirlwinds and a ton of 5 man squads with heavy bolters. I asked about the FW rules, as we don't play FW here, and he said he didn't have the book with him, but his friends asured me that they work how he said they did. I got almost wiped out turn 1, died turn 2. And then the fun started, first he started to laugh at me with his friend how bad my army list, then asked me why am so unhappy about his 20+min of rolling dice. And when I was walking away he told his friends how bad female gamers are and how he was trying to "go easy on me".

Sounds like he either tailor made that list to kill yours or you had bad luck to pull an opponent whose army was so hard counter yours, but either way he's an donkey-cave.

 Brother SRM wrote:
I was playing in a tournament and I had a squad of Guardsmen on foot. They went through dangerous terrain, so I rolled 10 dice, got a single 1, failed the armor save, and removed one lasgun guy. My opponent made a stink about the fact I didn't roll for each individual model in the unit, which would have taken exponentially longer and we were pressed for time.

You should at least have rolled to see which model died instead of just taking off a lasgun - it could have been a special weapon or sergeant.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Makumba wrote:
I asked for a game ,he asked for my list, if I had any other models etc. I had foot guard, with no vendettas as those would take up too much space in a plane. After seeing my army, he deployed his. 3 whirlwinds, 3 FW weapon platforms that looked like whirlwinds and a ton of 5 man squads with heavy bolters. I asked about the FW rules, as we don't play FW here, and he said he didn't have the book with him, but his friends asured me that they work how he said they did. I got almost wiped out turn 1, died turn 2. And then the fun started, first he started to laugh at me with his friend how bad my army list, then asked me why am so unhappy about his 20+min of rolling dice. And when I was walking away he told his friends how bad female gamers are and how he was trying to "go easy on me".

Two massive red flags right there.

Not much to tell. Apart the fact new gamers around here all want to start with Space Wolves rules and I used to play Eldar with them... not all enjoyed the game

Verviedi wrote:We all know one. That. Fething. Guy.
The one who brings 8 riptides in a 2000 point game. The one who uses Warlord titans in normal 40k.

Post your stories about TFGs or WAACs here.

You can't play a Warlord Titan in normal 40k games. The biggest one available is Reaver-class.

Scott-S6 wrote:Two massive red flags right there.

asking for opponent's list is not a red flag at all. She should have asked for his as well.

zteknon wrote:2.5k tourney I went to right after 6th came out. I brought my Tau (which were still old codex at the time) and got a GK player my second round. It was the relic mission so he was easily going to roflstomp me. He brought 2 max squads of pallys with draigo, a librarian, 2 minimum strike squads with razorbacks, and the rest was autocannon dreds. I blew up a razor back turn 2 which was the only full kill i got due to him look out sir ing every wound i got in to the pallys. He got so mad i got a kill against him he kicked a chair into another table that messed up their game. He ended up losing to daemons due to the white dwarf update in the next round and this time threw a chair.

hahaha I love those types.

Played against someone who once thought that as long as you follow force organisation you can have any model from any codex. He fielded Draigo, riptide, wraithknight, carnifex group, wave serpents with dire avengers, lots of stealers and mephiston

This isn't all that impressive, but still grinds my gears.

I joined my first league at my local store quite awhile back. I only had Necrons at the time, and was learning the game still. The guy who worked at the store said it was a friendly league to help you find new people to play, experience new armies, and the like. So I said sure, since I hate going into actual tournaments. My first game was the first time I had ever played Tau. And the guy had a gunline with Aegis, Missilesides, and 3 Riptides. Needless to say I conceded turn 3 when most of my stuff was dead. The guy who worked for the store actually apologized for pairing me against him, knowing I was a new player.

But hey, that was the game where a single Necron warrior punched a Riptide in the face and killed it. It was glorious, if only for a second.

Makumba wrote:
When I was visiting my aunt in UK, I took my army with me, because I realy wanted to go to warhammer world. On the weekend my aunt drove me there. Huge place, more terrain then I ever saw in my life. Found an opponent who didn't mind my accent . Dude was , from the looks, in his late 30s, asked about my army, where I come from and was not creepy doing this. He didn't even ask why I don't play nids or sob, which almost all new opponents ask me.
I asked for a game ,he asked for my list, if I had any other models etc. I had foot guard, with no vendettas as those would take up too much space in a plane. After seeing my army, he deployed his. 3 whirlwinds, 3 FW weapon platforms that looked like whirlwinds and a ton of 5 man squads with heavy bolters. I asked about the FW rules, as we don't play FW here, and he said he didn't have the book with him, but his friends asured me that they work how he said they did. I got almost wiped out turn 1, died turn 2. And then the fun started, first he started to laugh at me with his friend how bad my army list, then asked me why am so unhappy about his 20+min of rolling dice. And when I was walking away he told his friends how bad female gamers are and how he was trying to "go easy on me".

That Freakin' Guy was a D-bag for asking for your list before offering to show you his. He completely tailored his list to kill yours. As was pointed out elsewhere, not having the proper rules for your units that you are choosing to represent, is a big no-no in my book.

Makumba wrote:
When I was visiting my aunt in UK, I took my army with me, because I realy wanted to go to warhammer world. On the weekend my aunt drove me there. Huge place, more terrain then I ever saw in my life. Found an opponent who didn't mind my accent . Dude was , from the looks, in his late 30s, asked about my army, where I come from and was not creepy doing this. He didn't even ask why I don't play nids or sob, which almost all new opponents ask me.
I asked for a game ,he asked for my list, if I had any other models etc. I had foot guard, with no vendettas as those would take up too much space in a plane. After seeing my army, he deployed his. 3 whirlwinds, 3 FW weapon platforms that looked like whirlwinds and a ton of 5 man squads with heavy bolters. I asked about the FW rules, as we don't play FW here, and he said he didn't have the book with him, but his friends asured me that they work how he said they did. I got almost wiped out turn 1, died turn 2. And then the fun started, first he started to laugh at me with his friend how bad my army list, then asked me why am so unhappy about his 20+min of rolling dice. And when I was walking away he told his friends how bad female gamers are and how he was trying to "go easy on me".

I had a similar situation where a guy asked for my list, took it to a corner, wrote out a list of his own specifically to counter it, then proceeded to stomp me and gloat about it. I put up with it because I was new to that club and wanted to fit in, but it became pretty evident that it was not the place for me.

 Vector Strike wrote:

Scott-S6 wrote:Two massive red flags right there.

asking for opponent's list is not a red flag at all. She should have asked for his as well.

When someone asks for your list before writing theirs (and checks that you don't have any extra models) that's a massive red flag.

 Scott-S6 wrote:

 Vector Strike wrote:

Scott-S6 wrote:Two massive red flags right there.

asking for opponent's list is not a red flag at all. She should have asked for his as well.

When someone asks for your list before writing theirs (and checks that you don't have any extra models) that's a massive red flag.

Agreed. >.<

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Scott-S6 wrote:

 Vector Strike wrote:

Scott-S6 wrote:Two massive red flags right there.

asking for opponent's list is not a red flag at all. She should have asked for his as well.

When someone asks for your list before writing theirs (and checks that you don't have any extra models) that's a massive red flag.

Agreed. >.<

Yeep, all that a person should really need to know is the points and what is or not allowed (if your FLGS goes that way).

 Scott-S6 wrote:

 Vector Strike wrote:

Scott-S6 wrote:Two massive red flags right there.

asking for opponent's list is not a red flag at all. She should have asked for his as well.

When someone asks for your list before writing theirs (and checks that you don't have any extra models) that's a massive red flag.

Ah yes, but I interpreted the guy already had a list ready. But you're right - only show your list AFTER the opponent already chose one to play.

 Brother SRM wrote:
I was playing in a tournament and I had a squad of Guardsmen on foot. They went through dangerous terrain, so I rolled 10 dice, got a single 1, failed the armor save, and removed one lasgun guy. My opponent made a stink about the fact I didn't roll for each individual model in the unit, which would have taken exponentially longer and we were pressed for time. So, to oblige him, I went back, moved every model back, and rolled a die for each individual guy. The same exact model I previously removed was the only one to fail his rolls, and I stared my opponent in the eye as I deliberately removed him. The game was miserable before it, and miserable after it.

I played a game years ago against a guy who would just yell "Don't mess up!" before every. Single. Dieroll. I don't know if that qualifies him as TFG in the traditional sense, but it was absolutely infuriating and I never played him again.

It's actually quite important to roll 'separately' cause you might have key models that may get killed and drammatically affect the way things will turn out. Like a priest in a conscript squad. Not that i insist on such rolls but i try to take them myself all the time. The key is not to roll separately, but to take different colour dice.

For example, i'm running a truck full of boyz + nob + mek + rokkits. That's 5 different types of guyz in a single 12-strong squad. And a truck explodes. I take a red die for nob, 2 green dies for rokkits, 1 blue die for mek and regular white ones for the rest of the boyz. The same way different weapon strikes are done in the assault phase. I don't see anything bad in it. It's a fine gesture to play it fair and not just casually pick an unsignificant model out.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Scott-S6 wrote:

When someone asks for your list before writing theirs (and checks that you don't have any extra models) that's a massive red flag.

Depends on how you use this knowledge.

For example, last time i came in a gaming store, there was a new sm guy looking for a game. He had 500 pt of marines, i had 1250 pt of orkses. So, i adjusted the list to match his not to make the game one-sided.

He had a plazma-cannon dread, 2 min tac squads, captain from aobr and terminators. So, i just took a 20-strong shootaboy squad with warboss and painboss, a bunch of grots and a truck of 'ard boyz. And it was an enjoyable game with each opponent having an edge in something and not hard-countering each other. My regular lists alwayz include big gunz but they'd be too devastating vs his clearly not-optimised list and lack of experience.

So, the pre-knowledge of the opponent's build is definitely not a bad thing if you're using it to match the lists for a more enjoyable gameplay. I'd actually say it's mandatory for low point games.

 Vector Strike wrote:


asking for opponent's list is not a red flag at all. She should have asked for his as well.

I did , but he said he didn't have the rulebooks with him, He did on the other hand have 4 cases full of models. He asked about me list before I even started to think about playing. He asked me first what army I play. Then said I can't be using many vendettas with just one case with me and I said I amfrom abroad and that vendattas would weight too much ,so I took a foot guard list. And then he asked me for a game.

I had a similar situation where a guy asked for my list, took it to a corner, wrote out a list of his own specifically to counter it, then proceeded to stomp me and gloat about it. I put up with it because I was new to that club and wanted to fit in, but it became pretty evident that it was not the place for me.

The thing that kept me playing was the fact that my aunt would pick me up in 6 hours and to do something till then, but after the game, I was afraid that everyone else is going to be the same. So I just walked around with my case the whole day.

My worst TFG story came from a gaming store in North Carolina. I was visiting my (now ex) girlfriend down there, so brought an army with me to play a few games while she was at work. Got paired with this one dude - total TFG attitude (e.g., If you declare shooting with one unit, stop yourself and say "wait let me do my orders" that's apparently out of sequence and unacceptable. Fingers off a model, it's already moved. It's not a fething chess tournament, calm down).

Anyway, he conveniently forgot to bring his codex with him. Great stuff - flavor of the month Necrons (air force with 3 anni barges and Imotek) at the time. Anyway, his anni barges seemed to be getting a strangely large number of shots. I asked him, "Are you sure that the guns underneath are 2x twin linked?" (for a total of 4 TL shots a piece). He insisted that they were...after the game, a casual observer came up to me and explained to me the actual rules for that unit. He was also playing his Anni barges as Fast units.

Basically, a ridiculous amount of cheating behavior with a FotM army and being a douchebag the entire time makes you TFG.

I've only had a few TFG experiences, but the one that sticks out in my mind was TFG's wife that decided to change her little nurglings' diaper on the play table behind us. Just nasty.

It's been years since I played with any random opponents. Actually, it's been at least a decade.

The one I do remember was this one jerk. He had a regular problem with body odour (turned out he's schizophrenic and was terrified of the shower). One day he's playing in a tournament against one of the younger kids, who'd brought less than the points limit of the tournament (not by a little, either, it was a 1500pts tournament and the kid had brought around 600 to 700 points or so, or maybe 900, I dunno, it was a decade ago and my memory is fuzzy on details). So the kid asked the guy if he wouldn't mind lowering the amount of points in his army to be roughly comparable. It wasn't a serious tournament or anything, just a tiny local thing. But the jerk declined to reduce his points.

I was that jerk. In what little defence there is, I had kinda lost a crapton of games (I think, actually, that I never had won a game except against my younger brother) so the prospect of what would be an easy win was too tempting to ignore.

At least I lost. And that feels kinda good in a way, since not only did that kid win a game, he won it at a severe disadvantage in points values, which must've felt really good.

 Pouncey wrote:

I was that jerk.

Did not see that coming, but good on you for being a good enough guy to recognize it and admit it was jerky.

Just had this happen.

Infiltrate confers to vehicles now (yup). However, the Warlord Trait is a specific rule that lets you infiltrate three NON vehicle units (and it doesnt give them the Infiltrate USR). Despite the incredibly clear restriction on the trait and none of them having the Infiltrate special rule, dude mosies up to me with all his arks, dudes inside, half his army. I read him the rule. No vehicles. He ignores me and plays on.

WTF?

Then he tells me he's LEAVING terrain so he doesnt have to make Dangerous terrain with his Necron skimmers.

Picks up a few 2's to hit and rolls to wound, just because he really wants to know if my glasses are working.

Then tries to tell me the game is over because I started the turn without anything on the board turn 4 (again, obviously wrong and half my army was scheduled to show up turn 4 automatically!)

WTF.

Then he tells me that esentially my vehicle thats 11 inches away by his own estimation can be Warescythed by his chariot who apparently can move on TOP of me, hover and then move back without passing over me and somehow "bumping" back an extra inch because he cant end within 1". Eh... No. Pass over me or no attack. Sorry bub. No free movement. To pull that off you gotta' be 11" to base, 0.1 to get over me, 0.1 to get back to right in front of me and then 1.1 back to be more than an inch away. 12.2 or 12.3 inches minimum... which is more than its legal move.

WTF?

I was fuming and I was hostile. If you run into this guy, punch him in the face for me. Better yet , do worse: Don't play him, ever.

 Jancoran wrote:
Just had this happen.

Infiltrate confers to vehicles now (yup). However, the Warlord Trait is a specific rule that lets you infiltrate three NON vehicle units (and it doesnt give them the Infiltrate USR). Despite the incredibly clear restriction on the trait and none of them having the Infiltrate special rule, dude mosies up to me with all his arks, dudes inside, half his army. I read him the rule. No vehicles. He ignores me and plays on.

WTF?

Then he tells me he's LEAVING terrain so he doesnt have to make Dangerous terrain with his Necron skimmers.

Picks up a few 2's to hit and rolls to wound, just because he really wants to know if my glasses are working.

Then tries to tell me the game is over because I started the turn without anything on the board turn 4 (again, obviously wrong and half my army was scheduled to show up turn 4 automatically!)

WTF.

Then he tells me that esentially my vehicle thats 11 inches away by his own estimation can be Warescythed by his chariot who apparently can move on TOP of me, hover and then move back without passing over me and somehow "bumping" back an extra inch because he cant end within 1". Eh... No. Pass over me or no attack. Sorry bub. No free movement. To pull that off you gotta' be 11" to base, 0.1 to get over me, 0.1 to get back to right in front of me and then 1.1 back to be more than an inch away. 12.2 or 12.3 inches minimum... which is more than its legal move.

WTF?

I was fuming and I was hostile. If you run into this guy, punch him in the face for me. Better yet , do worse: Don't play him, ever.

Right at the Infiltrate part, I would have packed up and left. No point playing a donkey cave like that. That or grab the other guys in the store and mob him

Quoted from another post of mine:

I would like to personally extend my thanks to the wagbag I played a game with today at my local Games Workshop. Alas your name has slipped my mind as it must have been just as forgettable as your disgusting facial hair and stench. Maybe forgettable isn't the correct word for that since i'm pretty sure your putrid odor is stuck to me.
Anyway, I would like to thank you for playing a game of good ole' warhammer 40k with me. I especially liked the parts where you stopped the game multiple times to ogle the women walking past the store, including the one that stopped and looked genuinely interested until you winked at her and she promptly left. Also thank you for outright lying to me, a new player, about some of the rules I was not familiar about.

But most of all thank you for saying your precious Necrons reanimate on a 3+. I actually checked this rule afterward so thanks for being a huge piece of gak.

 jreilly89 wrote:

Right at the Infiltrate part, I would have packed up and left. No point playing a donkey cave like that. That or grab the other guys in the store and mob him

WAH hahahahaha. Donkey Cave. I LOVE that and am TOTALLY stealing that. I'm probably dumb for not knowing that euphimism before but whatever. Its mine now.

As for packing it up, I did eventually just concede and tell him we were done. I was goingto lose, no shame in admitting it since he basically was able to rape my force turn one. I made a game of it but it was just whatevs time by round 4.

 Jancoran wrote:

 jreilly89 wrote:

Right at the Infiltrate part, I would have packed up and left. No point playing a donkey cave like that. That or grab the other guys in the store and mob him

WAH hahahahaha. Donkey Cave. I LOVE that and am TOTALLY stealing that. I'm probably dumb for not knowing that euphimism before but whatever. Its mine now.

As for packing it up, I did eventually just concede and tell him we were done. I was goingto lose, no shame in admitting it since he basically was able to rape my force turn one. I made a game of it but it was just whatevs time by round 4.

The site automatically changes a$$hole to donkeycave

Jeez I wonder where you guys find some of these guys... worst I had was a guy trying to sell me the idea DE can assault from Infiltrate.

I never REALLY had Tfg horror story experience, thankfully the worst part was when i played against the GK draigowing, his paladins mishapped in deepstrike and the argument aroused because i rolled one on the tables not him and he made a fit because of it

 Jancoran wrote:

 jreilly89 wrote:

Right at the Infiltrate part, I would have packed up and left. No point playing a donkey cave like that. That or grab the other guys in the store and mob him

WAH hahahahaha. Donkey Cave. I LOVE that and am TOTALLY stealing that. I'm probably dumb for not knowing that euphimism before but whatever. Its mine now.

As for packing it up, I did eventually just concede and tell him we were done. I was goingto lose, no shame in admitting it since he basically was able to rape my force turn one. I made a game of it but it was just whatevs time by round 4.

If you like donkey cave, you should try shat goblin, that one was floating around this site for a while.

One day, A friend and I go to our local GW and pick a table to start playing. Two guys (we both knew them and saw them play regularly) come in and ask us if we'd be interested in a 2v2 because all tables were occupied. Since we both knew the guys and from experience knew they were pleasant people, we agreed.

We set up our armies, and suddenly, one of them goes off on his friend because he didn't field any riptides.
From what I understood, he always fields at least 1 riptide when playing against him. The Tau player said he wanted to try something else. His friend just started throwing a tantrum and would continue to make remarks on it every couple of minutes.

At one point, the guy warned him that it was his army and he could field whatever he felt like, and if the guy kept nagging him about it, he'd just pack and leave.
About 1 minute later, the guy makes a snarky remark about Riptides and the other guy just starts packing his models without saying a word, walks over to our side, gives us a hand and an apology and leaves the store.
The other guy was totally dumbstruck the entire time. Haven't seen them play each other ever since although I play both of them regularly now.

There was an escalation league at my FLGS a while ago trying to get kids into the game. 500 points first week and building to 2000 points over a couple months. Pay to play every week with the money going to a weekly pot and an overall pot of store credit you could win. Pretty standard, I don't think there was anyone older than their early 20s and there were a couple kids who were probably around 15. Really nice group of people to play with and no one was bringing really beatstick tourney lists.

Until we hit like 1500 points and this dude who I'd guess was in his mid to late 30's shows up because he heard there was a tourney going on. Nothing wrong with that, it was pretty casual and people had been sort of coming in and out week to week. So he pays for the week and pulls out a daemon deathstar rerollable 2++ list and rolls everyone. Whatever, he thought it was a legit tournament.

A couple weeks later he comes back for 1850 and brings a beautifully converted traitor guard list that could have beat everyone in the store with it's 3 vendettas (kids were still buying stuff the night before and putting them together for the next day. not a lot of strategic AA going around). But he had to ally them with Inquisition for cheap divination just to make it that much better. Then kept complaining that he had somewhere to be that night and people weren't playing fast enough for him.

I couldn't make it to the final week but apparently he showed up with a third army (keeping in mind this is escalation and it was ruled that you play the same army with no allies) and beat everyone and took the tourney pot of store credit. Pissed at the dude for pulling that stunt but actually more pissed off at the FLGS worker who was running the league for allowing it.

Worst part was that all the kids in the league who had dropped a lot of money into building up their armies got fed up with 40k and stopped playing all together.

I've only had a few cases with TFG but they are memorable.
So a guy who used to frequent my local store, typical douche picked on young kids bought a new army every month and always played over points. So he's playing a game of triumph and treachery with a few of the other regulars and first turn loses a single DE executioner decides to throw the model onto another table and then continues to swear loudly about how gak they are, so this goes on for the entire game which he ended up winning but it resulted in next to nobody wanting to play with him so karma kind of caught up.
Typical TFG.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
I've only had a few cases with TFG but they are memorable.
So a guy who used to frequent my local store, typical douche picked on young kids bought a new army every month and always played over points. So he's playing a game of triumph and treachery with a few of the other regulars and first turn loses a single DE executioner decides to throw the model onto another table and then continues to swear loudly about how gak they are, so this goes on for the entire game which he ended up winning but it resulted in next to nobody wanting to play with him so karma kind of caught up.
Typical TFG.

I am that guy… eating pizza and touching your models with greasy fingers. Ha ha ha ha ha ha.

Back in 5th I had a guy go buy some glue and a librarian. He put it together in the parking lot while I set up the table. Nullzone landraider shenanigans on my poor poor daemons. Boooo!

 Jancoran wrote:

 jreilly89 wrote:

Right at the Infiltrate part, I would have packed up and left. No point playing a donkey cave like that. That or grab the other guys in the store and mob him

WAH hahahahaha. Donkey Cave. I LOVE that and am TOTALLY stealing that. I'm probably dumb for not knowing that euphimism before but whatever. Its mine now.

As for packing it up, I did eventually just concede and tell him we were done. I was goingto lose, no shame in admitting it since he basically was able to rape my force turn one. I made a game of it but it was just whatevs time by round 4.

Yeah, but winning through cheating =/= not really a loss in my book


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 bubz wrote:
There was an escalation league at my FLGS a while ago trying to get kids into the game. 500 points first week and building to 2000 points over a couple months. Pay to play every week with the money going to a weekly pot and an overall pot of store credit you could win. Pretty standard, I don't think there was anyone older than their early 20s and there were a couple kids who were probably around 15. Really nice group of people to play with and no one was bringing really beatstick tourney lists.

Until we hit like 1500 points and this dude who I'd guess was in his mid to late 30's shows up because he heard there was a tourney going on. Nothing wrong with that, it was pretty casual and people had been sort of coming in and out week to week. So he pays for the week and pulls out a daemon deathstar rerollable 2++ list and rolls everyone. Whatever, he thought it was a legit tournament.

A couple weeks later he comes back for 1850 and brings a beautifully converted traitor guard list that could have beat everyone in the store with it's 3 vendettas (kids were still buying stuff the night before and putting them together for the next day. not a lot of strategic AA going around). But he had to ally them with Inquisition for cheap divination just to make it that much better. Then kept complaining that he had somewhere to be that night and people weren't playing fast enough for him.

I couldn't make it to the final week but apparently he showed up with a third army (keeping in mind this is escalation and it was ruled that you play the same army with no allies) and beat everyone and took the tourney pot of store credit. Pissed at the dude for pulling that stunt but actually more pissed off at the FLGS worker who was running the league for allowing it.

Worst part was that all the kids in the league who had dropped a lot of money into building up their armies got fed up with 40k and stopped playing all together.

Feth that. I would have told the manager or whoever was running it the second he brought the 2nd army. That's a total violation of rules. I'm all for escalation tournies, but that crap makes my blood boil

Nothing TOO bad from me in the past few years, apart from one of those guys who will force you to move a unit inch by inch to be precise, and then go fast and loose with his movement. The guy was kind of an ass, he'd bring in pretty beefy fantasy lists with his son who ran far less toothy lists and armies and would just wail on him. Not a pleasant guy.

oftenwrong wrote:
I am that guy… eating pizza and touching your models with greasy fingers. Ha ha ha ha ha ha.

Back in 5th I had a guy go buy some glue and a librarian. He put it together in the parking lot while I set up the table. Nullzone landraider shenanigans on my poor poor daemons. Boooo!

Still got nothing on Warp Quake d-bagery on poor, poor Daemons...

One of the worst cases of TFG in 40k/Fantasy that I've seen was the gakhead who pulled out a full-on quake-shunt list against a poor kid's Daemon army. Poor Little Timmy never got to put a single model on the table as TFG took Coteaz for to help ensure 1st turn, quaked the entire table, and then pulled the juggling shenanigans to get the 50/50 "unit dies" result on the mishap table.
And then he had the stones to brag about his epicness, while telling the poor kid if he wants to win he should go buy a real army and not bring a Fantasy army to a 40k fight...


Mind you, I've seen way worse behavior from adults belittling kids during my days of on-ice officiating in hockey... you haven't seen real TFG attitudes until you see a grown 40-something year old man ragging on a 9 year old kid for allowing 8 goals in a freaking HOUSE LEAGUE game.
People like that deserve to burn in a car fire imho... I mean, it's freaking house league hockey for feth's sake!

The majority of these stories make me feel like a literal curb stomp on all of their models is justified, especially when they just have to win at the expense of fun for other people.

Don't have any stories of my own to share but I did hear of a guy at my old gaming club who would roll dice and decide where they went - whichever would benefit him more, never specified what he was rolling dice for, only saying 'yeah that's dead' for whatever. Played over points too and had the cheek to ask if whatever he did was fine, which of course it was not. I guess you can argue that the opponent should have made sure they weren't cheating but I'll give credit where it's due and it's not due here, TFG was garbage at playing, he almost always lost. No strategy whatsoever.

The funniest thing I heard about this was that he was playing Tau one day and had a few FW models on the table and hadn't brought IA:3 with him to show rules, merely stating what the rules were and what he could do with the model. My friend who plays Tau had, would luck have it, brought his copy and calmly but firmly pointed out to his opponent at the time how TFG couldn't do what he was doing.

Guy didn't get a lot of matches after that

There's a guy at who games at my local GW, he's looks about 50, and writes really cheesy lists and when you play him he's very patronising and every time you ask some things' toughness will pull out his codex just in case you don't believe him.

In one of my first games ever last year he used 3 tervigons against me in 500pts. He showed up to a 750pts tournament with 3 Wraithknights. Within weeks of new space wolves he had a 750pt drop pod list including murder fang with 3 pods falling on the 1st turn.

I talk to the other guys I game with and they all just tell me he's really good at writing lists, but when does writing good lists turn into spoiling the fun?

to be fair, most of the TFG people come from major metro areas where they can afford to get away with this stuff. Happens less in "local pools" but in hard core tourneis and on forums? theres a guy a minute asking "now the rules saaaay..."

Anyways, that guy screwed with the wrong hombre with me. I run most of the tournies locally. So...

Taffy17 wrote:
There's a guy at who games at my local GW, he's looks about 50, and writes really cheesy lists and when you play him he's very patronising and every time you ask some things' toughness will pull out his codex just in case you don't believe him.

In one of my first games ever last year he used 3 tervigons against me in 500pts. He showed up to a 750pts tournament with 3 Wraithknights. Within weeks of new space wolves he had a 750pt drop pod list including murder fang with 3 pods falling on the 1st turn.

I talk to the other guys I game with and they all just tell me he's really good at writing lists, but when does writing good lists turn into spoiling the fun?

Was that guy playing Unbound?

We have one guy at our club who may not really qualify as THE FG, but he's certainly an amusing variety of FG.

He plays guards, and space marines, which he plays as every chapter under the sun. He dedicates his life to finding, then either forgetting to read and misinterpreting the rules of some obscure unit, and convincing himself he's found the most hidden super secret broken OP thing in the codex.

Then he builds a list around it, usually dedicating like 800-1200 points to just fielding his weird ass unit. Then, when someone points out that he's misread the rule or the unit is actually illegal, he throws a tantrum that would make a seven year old blush and pouts as he loses while complaining about literally every die roll. He then proceeds to complain that the IG and SM are the most underpowered weak cod exes out there and whatever his opponent was playing was broken no matter what it was.

Some of my favorite highlights:

-SM biker squads with combat shields and Power Swords. maxed out squads, just swarms of them. He was convinced they would outperform terminators by a mile. I think he actually got the rules right on them. They got crunched by a foot-and-artillery guard list (broken OP of course).

-IG fortress with eight Battlecannon vengeance batteries. He didn't read the auto targeting rule and I believe had twice as many as he was allowed to

-Around thirty Lascannon armed SM Devastators. "They kill EVERYTHING! With 30 of them I can even wipe platoons of infantry off the map!" Got the rules right. Still hilarious.

-A whole army of just melta gun toting Militarium Tempestus.

-Five Paskishers "What do you mean, vehicles can't be independent characters they're not infantry!"

-6 vendettas back in the Age of Fliers "They're dedicated transports!"

-about twenty IG mortar teams. He thought they were armed with stormshard mortars.

Weirdo. Maybe he needs a sounding board for his lists. Local forums are good for that. I dont post many lists HERE because you either get what i call the sniper, who makes some one liner about it as if that says it all, or you get the guy whose telling you a hundred glittering generalities, like "Mutilators just arent points efficient" instead of looking at what it does IN the LIST which was the point of posting it in the first place.

TFG's are on forums 24/7 I guess. hehehehe.

I've only ever had good experiences. I attribute this to lucking out with the flgs's I've played at having really good people at them and having played relatively few serious games.

Not so much a TFG as a TFC...

Every other time I try and post on Daergthjuytka That Fricken Cat walks across my keyboard.

Apparently one of our two FLGSs were witness to one this weekend.

Now, bear in mind this info is second hand as I was told this story today when at the store.

But a guy turned up to a tourney, who, lets just say, had a very... odd way of playing. He literally destroyed his units, such a crushing a unit of Wraiths and also to go so far as to hurl one out he door of the FLGS when he was caught misinterpreting a rule or something (I think. I told you this was second hand), as this was "How he was taught to play at his other store."

Well, there was "Ironman Magic" where every time a card was sacrificed, buried or destroyed it was physically destroyed, perhaps he got taught Ironman 40K.

Hell of a way for a store to maintain it's sales!

 Grimtuff wrote:
Apparently one of our two FLGSs were witness to one this weekend.

Now, bear in mind this info is second hand as I was told this story today when at the store.

But a guy turned up to a tourney, who, lets just say, had a very... odd way of playing. He literally destroyed his units, such a crushing a unit of Wraiths and also to go so far as to hurl one out he door of the FLGS when he was caught misinterpreting a rule or something (I think. I told you this was second hand), as this was "How he was taught to play at his other store."

Is this GW's new way of getting people to buy new models?

 TheCustomLime wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:
Apparently one of our two FLGSs were witness to one this weekend.

Now, bear in mind this info is second hand as I was told this story today when at the store.

But a guy turned up to a tourney, who, lets just say, had a very... odd way of playing. He literally destroyed his units, such a crushing a unit of Wraiths and also to go so far as to hurl one out he door of the FLGS when he was caught misinterpreting a rule or something (I think. I told you this was second hand), as this was "How he was taught to play at his other store."

Is this GW's new way of getting people to buy new models?

I made that quip as well, but apparently he's banned from the local GW....

I really want to see this guy in action, but whilst my own figs are safely locked away.

Frozocrone wrote:

Taffy17 wrote:
There's a guy at who games at my local GW, he's looks about 50, and writes really cheesy lists and when you play him he's very patronising and every time you ask some things' toughness will pull out his codex just in case you don't believe him.

In one of my first games ever last year he used 3 tervigons against me in 500pts. He showed up to a 750pts tournament with 3 Wraithknights. Within weeks of new space wolves he had a 750pt drop pod list including murder fang with 3 pods falling on the 1st turn.

I talk to the other guys I game with and they all just tell me he's really good at writing lists, but when does writing good lists turn into spoiling the fun?

Was that guy playing Unbound?

Only with the Wraithknights, the Tervigons was still when you could apparently have one as an HQ and 2 as Troops.

 Grimtuff wrote:
Apparently one of our two FLGSs were witness to one this weekend.

Now, bear in mind this info is second hand as I was told this story today when at the store.

But a guy turned up to a tourney, who, lets just say, had a very... odd way of playing. He literally destroyed his units, such a crushing a unit of Wraiths and also to go so far as to hurl one out he door of the FLGS when he was caught misinterpreting a rule or something (I think. I told you this was second hand), as this was "How he was taught to play at his other store."

At my local GW, they call it ultimate warhammer and they'd actually bring hammers to smash dead units.

 Jancoran wrote:
Just had this happen.

Infiltrate confers to vehicles now (yup). However, the Warlord Trait is a specific rule that lets you infiltrate three NON vehicle units (and it doesnt give them the Infiltrate USR). Despite the incredibly clear restriction on the trait and none of them having the Infiltrate special rule, dude mosies up to me with all his arks, dudes inside, half his army. I read him the rule. No vehicles. He ignores me and plays on.

He was right. Master of Ambush gives "Your Warlord and three non-vehicle units of your choice have the Infiltrate special rule."

This gives the Necron Warriors Infiltrate. Since they have Infiltrate, so does their Dedicated Transport. The Warlord trait gave nothing to the vehicle.

 Jancoran wrote:

Then tries to tell me the game is over because I started the turn without anything on the board turn 4 (again, obviously wrong and half my army was scheduled to show up turn 4 automatically!)

He was potentially right. If you went first, you did lose since you had nothing on the board at the end of game turn 3. If you went second, then the game continues.

The "lose the game" check only happens at the end of game turns, not at the start of game turns or player turns.

 Brother SRM wrote:
I was playing in a tournament and I had a squad of Guardsmen on foot. They went through dangerous terrain, so I rolled 10 dice, got a single 1, failed the armor save, and removed one lasgun guy. My opponent made a stink about the fact I didn't roll for each individual model in the unit, which would have taken exponentially longer and we were pressed for time. So, to oblige him, I went back, moved every model back, and rolled a die for each individual guy. The same exact model I previously removed was the only one to fail his rolls, and I stared my opponent in the eye as I deliberately removed him. The game was miserable before it, and miserable after it.

I played a game years ago against a guy who would just yell "Don't mess up!" before every. Single. Dieroll. I don't know if that qualifies him as TFG in the traditional sense, but it was absolutely infuriating and I never played him again.

I was playing against this guy who, when moving a squad of guardsmen through dangerous terrain, decided to ignore the rules and just roll collectively and take off a lasgun guardsman to avoid taking anything more worthwhile. I naturally called him out on it and made him redo the rolls. He then glared at me when he removed the lasgun guy, who died anyway.

Tbh, that doesn't qualify as a TFG story at all.

 DarknessEternal wrote:

 Jancoran wrote:
Just had this happen.

Infiltrate confers to vehicles now (yup). However, the Warlord Trait is a specific rule that lets you infiltrate three NON vehicle units (and it doesnt give them the Infiltrate USR). Despite the incredibly clear restriction on the trait and none of them having the Infiltrate special rule, dude mosies up to me with all his arks, dudes inside, half his army. I read him the rule. No vehicles. He ignores me and plays on.

He was right. Master of Ambush gives "Your Warlord and three non-vehicle units of your choice have the Infiltrate special rule."

This gives the Necron Warriors Infiltrate. Since they have Infiltrate, so does their Dedicated Transport. The Warlord trait gave nothing to the vehicle.
.

Ahem.

Necrons are an Alliance of Convenience.

Which as the rule states in the 40k Rulebook, quote: "Cannot benefit from the Warlord Trait of an Allies of Convenience Warlord"

Thus it is illegal.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

 DarknessEternal wrote:

 Jancoran wrote:
Just had this happen.

Infiltrate confers to vehicles now (yup). However, the Warlord Trait is a specific rule that lets you infiltrate three NON vehicle units (and it doesnt give them the Infiltrate USR). Despite the incredibly clear restriction on the trait and none of them having the Infiltrate special rule, dude mosies up to me with all his arks, dudes inside, half his army. I read him the rule. No vehicles. He ignores me and plays on.

He was right. Master of Ambush gives "Your Warlord and three non-vehicle units of your choice have the Infiltrate special rule."

This gives the Necron Warriors Infiltrate. Since they have Infiltrate, so does their Dedicated Transport. The Warlord trait gave nothing to the vehicle.
.

Ahem.

Necrons are an Alliance of Convenience.

Which as the rule states in the 40k Rulebook, quote: "Cannot benefit from the Warlord Trait of an Allies of Convenience Warlord"

Thus it is illegal.

Page 125 of the core rule book #3 under Strategic Traits is the Master of Ambush trait. I also didn't see anything about the Warlord not being a Necron in that original post so there is no reason to assume it's the similar rule from the CSM codex that gives D3 units Infiltrate.

 DarknessEternal wrote:

 Jancoran wrote:
Just had this happen.

Infiltrate confers to vehicles now (yup). However, the Warlord Trait is a specific rule that lets you infiltrate three NON vehicle units (and it doesnt give them the Infiltrate USR). Despite the incredibly clear restriction on the trait and none of them having the Infiltrate special rule, dude mosies up to me with all his arks, dudes inside, half his army. I read him the rule. No vehicles. He ignores me and plays on.

He was right. Master of Ambush gives "Your Warlord and three non-vehicle units of your choice have the Infiltrate special rule."

This gives the Necron Warriors Infiltrate. Since they have Infiltrate, so does their Dedicated Transport. The Warlord trait gave nothing to the vehicle.

 Jancoran wrote:

Then tries to tell me the game is over because I started the turn without anything on the board turn 4 (again, obviously wrong and half my army was scheduled to show up turn 4 automatically!)

He was potentially right. If you went first, you did lose since you had nothing on the board at the end of game turn 3. If you went second, then the game continues.

The "lose the game" check only happens at the end of game turns, not at the start of game turns or player turns.

NON vehicles. Yes. Not going there.

As for the other issue, no. If you END YOUR turn without anything then you lose. And I obviously did not.

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

 DarknessEternal wrote:

 Jancoran wrote:
Just had this happen.

Infiltrate confers to vehicles now (yup). However, the Warlord Trait is a specific rule that lets you infiltrate three NON vehicle units (and it doesnt give them the Infiltrate USR). Despite the incredibly clear restriction on the trait and none of them having the Infiltrate special rule, dude mosies up to me with all his arks, dudes inside, half his army. I read him the rule. No vehicles. He ignores me and plays on.

He was right. Master of Ambush gives "Your Warlord and three non-vehicle units of your choice have the Infiltrate special rule."

This gives the Necron Warriors Infiltrate. Since they have Infiltrate, so does their Dedicated Transport. The Warlord trait gave nothing to the vehicle.
.

Ahem.

Necrons are an Alliance of Convenience.

Which as the rule states in the 40k Rulebook, quote: "Cannot benefit from the Warlord Trait of an Allies of Convenience Warlord"

Thus it is illegal.

Page 125 of the core rule book #3 under Strategic Traits is the Master of Ambush trait. I also didn't see anything about the Warlord not being a Necron in that original post so there is no reason to assume it's the similar rule from the CSM codex that gives D3 units Infiltrate.

*Checks* Huh, didn't realize there was a copy of that, it's the exact same as CSM's, never roll on anything but the CSM table so I suppose it slipped the mind.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

 DarknessEternal wrote:

 Jancoran wrote:
Just had this happen.

Infiltrate confers to vehicles now (yup). However, the Warlord Trait is a specific rule that lets you infiltrate three NON vehicle units (and it doesnt give them the Infiltrate USR). Despite the incredibly clear restriction on the trait and none of them having the Infiltrate special rule, dude mosies up to me with all his arks, dudes inside, half his army. I read him the rule. No vehicles. He ignores me and plays on.

He was right. Master of Ambush gives "Your Warlord and three non-vehicle units of your choice have the Infiltrate special rule."

This gives the Necron Warriors Infiltrate. Since they have Infiltrate, so does their Dedicated Transport. The Warlord trait gave nothing to the vehicle.
.

Ahem.

Necrons are an Alliance of Convenience.

Which as the rule states in the 40k Rulebook, quote: "Cannot benefit from the Warlord Trait of an Allies of Convenience Warlord"

Thus it is illegal.

Page 125 of the core rule book #3 under Strategic Traits is the Master of Ambush trait. I also didn't see anything about the Warlord not being a Necron in that original post so there is no reason to assume it's the similar rule from the CSM codex that gives D3 units Infiltrate.

*Checks* Huh, didn't realize there was a copy of that, it's the exact same as CSM's, never roll on anything but the CSM table so I suppose it slipped the mind.

It'd not exactly the same though as the Strategic one gives it to 3 units, not D3 units.

DaPino wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:
Apparently one of our two FLGSs were witness to one this weekend.

Now, bear in mind this info is second hand as I was told this story today when at the store.

But a guy turned up to a tourney, who, lets just say, had a very... odd way of playing. He literally destroyed his units, such a crushing a unit of Wraiths and also to go so far as to hurl one out he door of the FLGS when he was caught misinterpreting a rule or something (I think. I told you this was second hand), as this was "How he was taught to play at his other store."

At my local GW, they call it ultimate warhammer and they'd actually bring hammers to smash dead units.

That's utterly fethed up. What a massive waste of time, money, and paint.
As a person who carefully maintains every model, that is so WRONG to my conciousness...
WHY THE HELL WOULD YOU DO THAT, ESPECIALLY TO MODELS THAT ARE SOLD FOR 5x THEIR WORTH!
I wish... I had brain bleach.

EDIT=Groxshit. No google results whatsoever for that crime against the hobby.

Well honestly.
I have been TFG, my old Blood Angels list was nasty, 5th and 6th I never lost one match with it it was very simple Mephiston, Chaplain, Lemartes, multiple DC squads, Stormravens. The tactics was very simple they all had JP's. I never went for an objective because I had nothing to keep it so I just went yard. Most of the games ended before end of turn 3 because of boarding. To help with finding opponents I used to give a free 200 pionts to them extra. This was very hillarious when a friend feom the UK came down ( happeneds to work for GW)and played a game of apocolypse with us. It was 2v2 3k each or something like that. We rolled for team's. Then we set up. I placed Mephiston right out front. The partner he had said," You know what that model does right". His reply was yes it is all right I got it. Then everyone set up. My partner just set up a defencive force for us and told me go nuts do not let up. Well 2 turns later mephiston had killed his hq and 1k worth of his force solo. The DC killed his tanks and was working on the remainder of his army. His teamate was trying to get troops over to stop the slaughter. Needless to say the game ended soon. And was asked is the guy do that every game. I said sure if you let me lol. 6 attacks on the charge and 5 base at str10 is nasty

Verviedi wrote:

DaPino wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:
Apparently one of our two FLGSs were witness to one this weekend.

Now, bear in mind this info is second hand as I was told this story today when at the store.

But a guy turned up to a tourney, who, lets just say, had a very... odd way of playing. He literally destroyed his units, such a crushing a unit of Wraiths and also to go so far as to hurl one out he door of the FLGS when he was caught misinterpreting a rule or something (I think. I told you this was second hand), as this was "How he was taught to play at his other store."

At my local GW, they call it ultimate warhammer and they'd actually bring hammers to smash dead units.

That's utterly fethed up. What a massive waste of time, money, and paint.
As a person who carefully maintains every model, that is so WRONG to my conciousness...
WHY THE HELL WOULD YOU DO THAT, ESPECIALLY TO MODELS THAT ARE SOLD FOR 5x THEIR WORTH!
I wish... I had brain bleach.

EDIT=Groxshit. No google results whatsoever for that crime against the hobby.

I will echo this sentiment. I love my models. If anyone seriously suggested to smash them I'd give them a strange look and politely tell them to go feth them self.

 Jancoran wrote:
Weirdo. Maybe he needs a sounding board for his lists. Local forums are good for that. I dont post many lists HERE because you either get what i call the sniper, who makes some one liner about it as if that says it all, or you get the guy whose telling you a hundred glittering generalities, like "Mutilators just arent points efficient" instead of looking at what it does IN the LIST which was the point of posting it in the first place.

TFG's are on forums 24/7 I guess. hehehehe.

Guyz from our lgs sit on a russian warforge forum. You think dakka is filled with flavor-of-the month and "take a heldrake" stuff? Well, it feels like a relaxed casual approach compared to what's happening there
Besides, 'the inquisition' pulled a warning on me cause i stated that tactical marines are good and the only logical solution they could find was that i was trolling and flaming

But even though the local guyz are uber-competitive, they're rather fine to play with and with the new awesome ork dex, my footsloggas are doing fine and actually counter the meta of low-model count cheezy stuff to the point of pulling wins quite occasionally. There are a few new guyz with "that's all what i've got" sm lists. And in all fairness, i like this games much more. The funny part is ork's win rate is almost identical vs fun casual lists and uber-cheezy tournament lists...probably if there was a pure serpent-spam list around, i'd loose every game but the eldar guy runs 3 knights + serpents. And knights are more than manageble with orks.

 TheCustomLime wrote:
I will echo this sentiment. I love my models. If anyone seriously suggested to smash them I'd give them a strange look and politely tell them to go feth them self.

I can't even imagine this being a thing that would actually happen. Seriously. I can't even imagine someone deliberately destroying a model. Ugh.

 toasteroven wrote:

 TheCustomLime wrote:
I will echo this sentiment. I love my models. If anyone seriously suggested to smash them I'd give them a strange look and politely tell them to go feth them self.

I can't even imagine this being a thing that would actually happen. Seriously. I can't even imagine someone deliberately destroying a model. Ugh.

Uhhh, I did that once. But it was more out of rage after some people on the forums here taught me their interpretation of the Blood Tide thing in the 5e Grey Knights Codex. About a year later someone set me straight.

Similar bursts of rage have come from learning about stuff in World of Warcraft. Like Theresa, the human woman captured by the undead, who proceded to torture, mutilate and lobotomize her into being a mindslave or something. Or the incident at Aldor Rise on Draenor, where the Orcs violated the Draenei priestesses, cut their throats and threw them off the cliff. And the third one was in the upcoming expansion (so I guess spoilers incoming if anyone here plays WoW), where the Iron Horde murder Draenei and use their souls to fuel a portal to Azeroth through which they'll invade. And then later they end up murdering yet more Draenei and use their souls to empower their evil magic to destroy the Draenei for some reason. I dunno why they're after killing the Draenei in the alternate timeline, since the guy who set the whole thing in motion was pissed off at main timeline people, and presumably Gul'dan didn't get manipulated by Kil'Jaeden into thinking the Draenei were plotting to wipe out the Orcs. I dunno, whatever. Anyways, those bursts of rage ended up with many hundreds of dead Orcs in-game. Because feth those fething Orcs.

 Pouncey wrote:

 toasteroven wrote:

 TheCustomLime wrote:
I will echo this sentiment. I love my models. If anyone seriously suggested to smash them I'd give them a strange look and politely tell them to go feth them self.

I can't even imagine this being a thing that would actually happen. Seriously. I can't even imagine someone deliberately destroying a model. Ugh.

Uhhh, I did that once. But it was more out of rage after some people on the forums here taught me their interpretation of the Blood Tide thing in the 5e Grey Knights Codex. About a year later someone set me straight.

Similar bursts of rage have come from learning about stuff in World of Warcraft. Like Theresa, the human woman captured by the undead, who proceded to torture, mutilate and lobotomize her into being a mindslave or something. Or the incident at Aldor Rise on Draenor, where the Orcs violated the Draenei priestesses, cut their throats and threw them off the cliff. And the third one was in the upcoming expansion (so I guess spoilers incoming if anyone here plays WoW), where the Iron Horde murder Draenei and use their souls to fuel a portal to Azeroth through which they'll invade. And then later they end up murdering yet more Draenei and use their souls to empower their evil magic to destroy the Draenei for some reason. I dunno why they're after killing the Draenei in the alternate timeline, since the guy who set the whole thing in motion was pissed off at main timeline people, and presumably Gul'dan didn't get manipulated by Kil'Jaeden into thinking the Draenei were plotting to wipe out the Orcs. I dunno, whatever. Anyways, those bursts of rage ended up with many hundreds of dead Orcs in-game. Because feth those fething Orcs.

War. War never changes. fethed up gak happens in war. Erm, but this should either be taken to PM or have a new topic devoted to it.

 TheCustomLime wrote:

 Pouncey wrote:

 toasteroven wrote:

 TheCustomLime wrote:
I will echo this sentiment. I love my models. If anyone seriously suggested to smash them I'd give them a strange look and politely tell them to go feth them self.

I can't even imagine this being a thing that would actually happen. Seriously. I can't even imagine someone deliberately destroying a model. Ugh.

Uhhh, I did that once. But it was more out of rage after some people on the forums here taught me their interpretation of the Blood Tide thing in the 5e Grey Knights Codex. About a year later someone set me straight.

Similar bursts of rage have come from learning about stuff in World of Warcraft. Like Theresa, the human woman captured by the undead, who proceded to torture, mutilate and lobotomize her into being a mindslave or something. Or the incident at Aldor Rise on Draenor, where the Orcs violated the Draenei priestesses, cut their throats and threw them off the cliff. And the third one was in the upcoming expansion (so I guess spoilers incoming if anyone here plays WoW), where the Iron Horde murder Draenei and use their souls to fuel a portal to Azeroth through which they'll invade. And then later they end up murdering yet more Draenei and use their souls to empower their evil magic to destroy the Draenei for some reason. I dunno why they're after killing the Draenei in the alternate timeline, since the guy who set the whole thing in motion was pissed off at main timeline people, and presumably Gul'dan didn't get manipulated by Kil'Jaeden into thinking the Draenei were plotting to wipe out the Orcs. I dunno, whatever. Anyways, those bursts of rage ended up with many hundreds of dead Orcs in-game. Because feth those fething Orcs.

War. War never changes. fethed up gak happens in war. Erm, but this should either be taken to PM or have a new topic devoted to it.

Sorry, I tend to go on tangents. And tangents of tangents. It's kinda how my brain works, one thing leads to the next leads to the next leads to the next...

Other than the one I shared on the first page, I don't really have any TFG stories. No one really made a habit of being a jerk when I played at the local store, and for the past decade the only games I've played have been at home.

 Jancoran wrote:

NON vehicles. Yes. Not going there.

Because you were wrong,

 Jancoran wrote:

As for the other issue, no. If you END YOUR turn without anything then you lose. And I obviously did not.

Wrong here too. That isn't the rule. I already stated the rule for you.

Taffy17 wrote:

Frozocrone wrote:

Taffy17 wrote:
There's a guy at who games at my local GW, he's looks about 50, and writes really cheesy lists and when you play him he's very patronising and every time you ask some things' toughness will pull out his codex just in case you don't believe him.

In one of my first games ever last year he used 3 tervigons against me in 500pts. He showed up to a 750pts tournament with 3 Wraithknights. Within weeks of new space wolves he had a 750pt drop pod list including murder fang with 3 pods falling on the 1st turn.

I talk to the other guys I game with and they all just tell me he's really good at writing lists, but when does writing good lists turn into spoiling the fun?

Was that guy playing Unbound?

Only with the Wraithknights, the Tervigons was still when you could apparently have one as an HQ and 2 as Troops.

Looks like he didn't pay the Termagant tax for the Tervigons...and if that was the dex Nids currently have, he cheated, 3 Tervigons is over 500.

From 'Sudden Death Victory':

If at the end of any game turn, one player has no models on the battlefield his opponent automatically wins.

A 'game turn' consists of both player's turns. It is entirely possible for the player who goes first to end his 'player turn' with models on the table and yet have no models on the table at the end of the 'game turn' after his opponent finishes his shooting and close combat in his 'player turn'.

Two TFG stories, one tournament. I was playing in a small local tournament with my Khorne Marines list (shortly after 5th edition came out, I believe). I had a Terminator Lord with deep striking terminators, two squads of Berserkers in Rhinos, two squads of 3 obliterators, a plasma cannon dread and a TL lascannon/missile dread. I was having a terrible day and had lost my first two games. One loss wasn't even fun, with the game ending his turn 4. The other loss was vs. orks and was REALLY close, but I lost at the end by a point or two and really enjoyed it.

My first loss came against Grey Knights and their shiny new 5th edition codex. I didn't get to the store very often and so I didn't know anything about the new codex. I don't remember much about his list, but he had an HQ that spawned "ghost terminators" when he was wounded, plus a big squad of paladins. Other than that he had two Rifledreads and a couple units of power suit knights with halberds (don't remember specifics). Because of my inexperience with his codex, I kept asking questions about things. I was getting frustrated because of how bad I was losing, and asked a question (though I don't remember what it was). His response was "It works like all the other [things] work!" like I was an idiot. I got pissed off and almost lost my temper, but i just said "Excuse me, but I don't know anything about the Grey Knights. I don't about [thing] because I don't know about [other thing]. I didn't give him a very good sportsman score, though to be honest I probably didn't get one either.

Game three I was up against a Tau player. He had Farsight and a full retinue of suits, mostly with plasma guns and missile launchers (the old fireknife combo that was popular). Aside from that I just remember two squads of Firewarriors in Warfish and a Hammerhead.

Anyway, the game starts and goes downhill for me fast. His shooting blows up both my dreads and both my rhinos. I could already tell this game wasn't going to be fun because of the gloating. Every successful hit, every failed wounds he would comment on. When the dreads went down he was insufferable. I kept my head down and played the game, deep striking my Lord near Farsight, though they deviated way too far away for them to be useful. I moved my my beserkers through terrain and ran them towards the enemy, taking a risk that he'd shoot at my Lord. He took the bait and poured everything he had into killing my HQ and took great delight in wiping out the whole squad. I couldn't make any of my saves and he basked in my failure. On my turn I moved my (largely ignored) Berserkers up and attacked his lines. One squad hit his Firewarriors, the other his Hammerhead. This was when the true nature of his TFG-ness emerged. In 4th, skimmers always counted as moving and required a 6+ to hit in melee. In 5th, they only counted as moving if you actually moved them, and even then it was a 4+ to hit. He had parked his Hammerhead immobile the whole game, and so I rushed up and hit it with krak grenades and a power fist. This turned into an argument, and the game stopped as he looked in his BRB, the Tau Codex, back to the BRB, and then to a TO and some of his friends. Finally, after what seemed like forever he comes back and slumps into his chair. I dominated the rest of the game as two untouched Berserkers squads rolled over his army. Whenever I'd ask for an armor save he'd begrudgingly grab a die, throw it and then sit down again.

10/10 would not play again.

 DMDaddy0 wrote:
Two TFG stories, one tournament. I was playing in a small local tournament with my Khorne Marines list (shortly after 5th edition came out, I believe). I had a Terminator Lord with deep striking terminators, two squads of Berserkers in Rhinos, two squads of 3 obliterators, a plasma cannon dread and a TL lascannon/missile dread. I was having a terrible day and had lost my first two games. One loss wasn't even fun, with the game ending his turn 4. The other loss was vs. orks and was REALLY close, but I lost at the end by a point or two and really enjoyed it.

My first loss came against Grey Knights and their shiny new 5th edition codex. I didn't get to the store very often and so I didn't know anything about the new codex. I don't remember much about his list, but he had an HQ that spawned "ghost terminators" when he was wounded, plus a big squad of paladins. Other than that he had two Rifledreads and a couple units of power suit knights with halberds (don't remember specifics). Because of my inexperience with his codex, I kept asking questions about things. I was getting frustrated because of how bad I was losing, and asked a question (though I don't remember what it was). His response was "It works like all the other [things] work!" like I was an idiot. I got pissed off and almost lost my temper, but i just said "Excuse me, but I don't know anything about the Grey Knights. I don't about [thing] because I don't know about [other thing]. I didn't give him a very good sportsman score, though to be honest I probably didn't get one either.

Game three I was up against a Tau player. He had Farsight and a full retinue of suits, mostly with plasma guns and missile launchers (the old fireknife combo that was popular). Aside from that I just remember two squads of Firewarriors in Warfish and a Hammerhead.

Anyway, the game starts and goes downhill for me fast. His shooting blows up both my dreads and both my rhinos. I could already tell this game wasn't going to be fun because of the gloating. Every successful hit, every failed wounds he would comment on. When the dreads went down he was insufferable. I kept my head down and played the game, deep striking my Lord near Farsight, though they deviated way too far away for them to be useful. I moved my my beserkers through terrain and ran them towards the enemy, taking a risk that he'd shoot at my Lord. He took the bait and poured everything he had into killing my HQ and took great delight in wiping out the whole squad. I couldn't make any of my saves and he basked in my failure. On my turn I moved my (largely ignored) Berserkers up and attacked his lines. One squad hit his Firewarriors, the other his Hammerhead. This was when the true nature of his TFG-ness emerged. In 4th, skimmers always counted as moving and required a 6+ to hit in melee. In 5th, they only counted as moving if you actually moved them, and even then it was a 4+ to hit. He had parked his Hammerhead immobile the whole game, and so I rushed up and hit it with krak grenades and a power fist. This turned into an argument, and the game stopped as he looked in his BRB, the Tau Codex, back to the BRB, and then to a TO and some of his friends. Finally, after what seemed like forever he comes back and slumps into his chair. I dominated the rest of the game as two untouched Berserkers squads rolled over his army. Whenever I'd ask for an armor save he'd begrudgingly grab a die, throw it and then sit down again.

10/10 would not play again.

That Tau player was salty xD Can only imagine how much worse he'll have been now that they have their shiny new toys..

EDIT: Came across this article, not really TFG in the sense that the attitude was poor(although you could argue that fielding such a list is) but justice is served

http://imgur.com/gallery/V0gND

Not to be contrary DMDaddy0, but Grey Knights came out in 2011, 5th came out in 2008.

 DarknessEternal wrote:

 Jancoran wrote:

NON vehicles. Yes. Not going there.

Because you were wrong,

 Jancoran wrote:

As for the other issue, no. If you END YOUR turn without anything then you lose. And I obviously did not.

Wrong here too. That isn't the rule. I already stated the rule for you.

And youre not paying attention. which is fine.

I went second. so no.

 ClockworkZion wrote:
Not to be contrary DMDaddy0, but Grey Knights came out in 2011, 5th
Came out in 2008.

Fair enough, its been a while. It still would have been 5TH ed by then.

 DMDaddy0 wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:
Not to be contrary DMDaddy0, but Grey Knights came out in 2011, 5th
Came out in 2008.

Fair enough, its been a while. It still would have been 5TH ed by then.

Oh yeah, still 5th, just not early 5th.

Frozocrone wrote:

EDIT: Came across this article, not really TFG in the sense that the attitude was poor(although you could argue that fielding such a list is) but justice is served
http://imgur.com/gallery/V0gND

Yep, one of the best stories

'Story' being right, as that's an entirely fictional invention instead of what actually happened.

 Portugal Jones wrote:
'Story' being right, as that's an entirely fictional invention instead of what actually happened.

\

Know what's better than vague elitist gak? Actually sharing details

 jreilly89 wrote:

Frozocrone wrote:

EDIT: Came across this article, not really TFG in the sense that the attitude was poor(although you could argue that fielding such a list is) but justice is served
http://imgur.com/gallery/V0gND

Yep, one of the best stories

No.

I saw that when it did the rounds at Reddit, and those guys, not being familiar with 40k, bought it hook, line and sinker.

But you, I assume, are a 40k player. You should know better.

It's a funny situation, but it's disingenuous to portray the White Scars player as cheesy or a power gamer.

Used to play against a friend who discovered necron-air soon as 6th came out. Played nothing but that list for months. Me and other people in the gaming group would tell him to change his list cause it just wasnt fun to play against him, he would laugh and say we needed to get better.

Two months later the tau codex came out. I gave everything I could interceptor and skyfire (and ran 2 riptides and a unit of suits with twin missile packs AND missilesides). I tabled him on turn three.

Sometimes you gotta fight fire with fire. Once I beat him for the third time in a row he realized how unfun it is to play against a WAAC list and we are all playing fun fluffy lists again and no-one is mad at anyone lol.

As a side note I held onto a copy of that list, in case it is needed again in the future haha.

 Portugal Jones wrote:
'Story' being right, as that's an entirely fictional invention instead of what actually happened.

:O that makes me sad

 TNT925 wrote:
Used to play against a friend who discovered necron-air soon as 6th came out.

Two months later the tau codex came out.

6th came in July 2012. Tau Codex is from 2013 (march or april)...

Frozocrone wrote:

Taffy17 wrote:

Frozocrone wrote:

Taffy17 wrote:
There's a guy at who games at my local GW, he's looks about 50, and writes really cheesy lists and when you play him he's very patronising and every time you ask some things' toughness will pull out his codex just in case you don't believe him.

In one of my first games ever last year he used 3 tervigons against me in 500pts. He showed up to a 750pts tournament with 3 Wraithknights. Within weeks of new space wolves he had a 750pt drop pod list including murder fang with 3 pods falling on the 1st turn.

I talk to the other guys I game with and they all just tell me he's really good at writing lists, but when does writing good lists turn into spoiling the fun?

Was that guy playing Unbound?

Only with the Wraithknights, the Tervigons was still when you could apparently have one as an HQ and 2 as Troops.

Looks like he didn't pay the Termagant tax for the Tervigons...and if that was the dex Nids currently have, he cheated, 3 Tervigons is over 500.

No, this was last year, with the previous codex

Taffy17 wrote:

Frozocrone wrote:

Taffy17 wrote:

Frozocrone wrote:

Taffy17 wrote:
There's a guy at who games at my local GW, he's looks about 50, and writes really cheesy lists and when you play him he's very patronising and every time you ask some things' toughness will pull out his codex just in case you don't believe him.

In one of my first games ever last year he used 3 tervigons against me in 500pts. He showed up to a 750pts tournament with 3 Wraithknights. Within weeks of new space wolves he had a 750pt drop pod list including murder fang with 3 pods falling on the 1st turn.

I talk to the other guys I game with and they all just tell me he's really good at writing lists, but when does writing good lists turn into spoiling the fun?

Was that guy playing Unbound?

Only with the Wraithknights, the Tervigons was still when you could apparently have one as an HQ and 2 as Troops.

Looks like he didn't pay the Termagant tax for the Tervigons...and if that was the dex Nids currently have, he cheated, 3 Tervigons is over 500.

No, this was last year, with the previous codex

Fair enough.

Not sure if Unbound was around back then, but if he was claiming for it to be battle forged - either his list was wrong, he misread rules or he intentionally cheated. Needed to take a 50 point Termagant Tax to take a 160 Base Tervigon as Troops. 3 Tervigons base is 480.

The concepts of "Battle-Forged" and "Unbound" are strictly 7th edition which was released just over five months ago.

EDIT: Came across this article, not really TFG in the sense that the attitude was poor(although you could argue that fielding such a list is) but justice is served

http://imgur.com/gallery/V0gND

I have been looking for that article for ages. Read it once and never found it after. Pretty funny haha.

 Jancoran wrote:


I went second. so no.

So you did lose. Well done blaming the other guy because he can read.

BobNT wrote:



EDIT: Came across this article, not really TFG in the sense that the attitude was poor(although you could argue that fielding such a list is) but justice is served

http://imgur.com/gallery/V0gND

 Portugal Jones wrote:

BobNT wrote:



EDIT: Came across this article, not really TFG in the sense that the attitude was poor(although you could argue that fielding such a list is) but justice is served

http://imgur.com/gallery/V0gND

Man, some people have the attention span of goldfish...

What actually happened was that was a tournament in Russia (iirc) and the situation was entirely coincidental - the Tau player had his kroot, and upon realizing that his all-bike opponent not only had his entire army in reserve, but had no way to bypass any models in his way, infiltrated them up on the table edge.

The issue there being that in 5th ed, there was no clear resolution for what happened to units in reserve that were blocked off the table. We had a nice, big thread about it at the time.

 DarknessEternal wrote:

 Jancoran wrote:


I went second. so no.

So you did lose. Well done blaming the other guy because he can read.

No...Are you dense? do you NOt understand the rule? Go read it again and stop being a Donkey Cave. i DIDNT end my turn with nothing on the board and therefore DIDNT lose BECAUSE I went second. Good Gawd man.

 Thud wrote:

 jreilly89 wrote:

Frozocrone wrote:

EDIT: Came across this article, not really TFG in the sense that the attitude was poor(although you could argue that fielding such a list is) but justice is served
http://imgur.com/gallery/V0gND

Yep, one of the best stories

No.

I saw that when it did the rounds at Reddit, and those guys, not being familiar with 40k, bought it hook, line and sinker.

But you, I assume, are a 40k player. You should know better.

It's a funny situation, but it's disingenuous to portray the White Scars player as cheesy or a power gamer.

Why? I don't owe him gak. I don't know either person, nor the judge or the tourney where it happened. I just think its one of the best stories because its a hilarious strategy. I do think keeping all your forces in reserves is kind of a cheese move. But guess what? That's my opinion.

Get off my back.

 Jancoran wrote:

 DarknessEternal wrote:

 Jancoran wrote:


I went second. so no.

So you did lose. Well done blaming the other guy because he can read.

No...Are you dense? do you NOt understand the rule? Go read it again and stop being a Donkey Cave. i DIDNT end my turn with nothing on the board and therefore DIDNT lose BECAUSE I went second. Good Gawd man.

Relax. You're just not explaining it properly.

Janc went 2nd.

At the end of Janc T3, he still had units on the table.
At the end of opponent's T4, he had killed everything.
Opponent says that Janc loses because he has no models.
That is wrong, as Janc had a bunch of units deepstriking onto the board on T4.

A guy is not TFG because he didn't fully understand a rule.


As for the infiltrate thing, you're just wrong. It's okay to not understand the rule. The unit (warriors) gains infiltrate. The dedicated transport does as well due to additional rules on infiltrate. The vehicle never technically gains infiltrate USR. No rules are broken here.

Again, following the rules does not make someone TFG either.

 Jancoran wrote:
As for the other issue, no. If you END YOUR turn without anything then you lose. And I obviously did not.

Technically this is not correct. If you go first and had nothing on the table at the end of your 'player turn', you would not lose until the end of the 'game turn' which would be after your opponent had his 'player turn'. The only instance that I can think of where this would matter however is if a Necron player had a squad of Deathmarks in reserve and used the 'Ethereal Interception' special rule.

 Ghaz wrote:

 Jancoran wrote:
As for the other issue, no. If you END YOUR turn without anything then you lose. And I obviously did not.

Technically this is not correct. If you go first and had nothing on the table at the end of your 'player turn', you would not lose until the end of the 'game turn' which would be after your opponent had his 'player turn'. The only instance that I can think of where this would matter however is if a Necron player had a squad of Deathmarks in reserve and used the 'Ethereal Interception' special rule.

Or if you're playing a Horus Heresy Alpha Legion army (as they can potentially bring a unit in on your opponent's turn if the unit being brought in is the same type as the one your opponent successfully rolled reserves for, in which case it comes in instead of the opponent's unit).

Fortunately, the worst story I have to tell is pretty mild - playing a game against a tau player, who had a hammerhead with no base, and all game long it hadn't been a problem, just having it cruising along at ground level.

Until the last turn, when I had... something somewhere vital, but it was out of sight behind a tall wall. He pulled out his tape measure and started picking up his dice and I asked what he was doing.

"Well, if it was on its base, it'd be high enough to see them, so I'm taking the shot."

I wasn't having any of that, and he got cranky that I wasn't willing to budge on his hammerhead suddenly getting to gain a couple inches of height.

NamelessBard wrote:

As for the infiltrate thing, you're just wrong. It's okay to not understand the rule. r.

And again... NON vehicles is SPECIFIC. Specific beats general.

So no. But you can certainly fel that way about it. It may turn into a roll off and if thats refused, then the shortest game of 40K ever. But you cant ignore the obvious black and white Restriction onthe ability. It mentions the Rule, then MODIFIES the rule. Very clearly.

You target the non-vehicle unit, eg, a Tac Squad.

The Tac Squad now has Infiltrate.

The Infiltrate USR specifies that the dedicated transport of an infiltrating unit can also be infiltrated.

You are wrong about this I'm afraid, I wonder how many more people will need to tell you?

EDIT
What the "non vehicle" clause prevents is your opponent putting a Dread, or a Soul Grinder or some other AV unit which wants to be close in, or perhaps a Vindi or Demolisher with a short range gun getting Infiltrated.

Oh i am quite certain that no one will because they can read the modifier. If they cant, they'll tell me youre right.

You never select a Vehicle to gain infiltrate, therefore you don't break the rule, as a DT the Rhino, Ghost Ark, Land Raider or whatever inherits it by the back door.

Take it to YMDC, you'll find it hard to gain support. Were it to say "deploys as if it had the Infiltrate USR" you may have a case, but it doesn't, it confers the Infiltrate USR onto a non-vehicle unit, and the entry for Infiltrate is clear on how it interacts with DTs.

This thread has become my TFG moment.

Loving it.

Not my story but heard it somewhere on the forum.

Necron player rolls for the Warlord traits and gets "Master of Ambush". Than he attempts to give infiltrate to his Necron Warriors and infiltrate his Ghost Arks, which gain this ability due to being a DT.
His TFG enemy doesn't let him do it even though he's right. Thankfully, after a short quarrel, Necron player doesn't listen to imposed restrictions and behaves like a man and does what's righteous.

 Jancoran wrote:

NamelessBard wrote:

As for the infiltrate thing, you're just wrong. It's okay to not understand the rule. r.

And again... NON vehicles is SPECIFIC. Specific beats general.

So no. But you can certainly fel that way about it. It may turn into a roll off and if thats refused, then the shortest game of 40K ever. But you cant ignore the obvious black and white Restriction onthe ability. It mentions the Rule, then MODIFIES the rule. Very clearly.

Take this to You Make Da Call. I would be surprised if anyone sees this your way. The mechanics behind it have been clearly explained to you, and it appears that you have become entrenched in what is now an obviously wrong position rather than just admit that you were wrong.

 Azreal13 wrote:
You never select a Vehicle to gain infiltrate, therefore you don't break the rule, as a DT the Rhino, Ghost Ark, Land Raider or whatever inherits it by the back door.

Take it to YMDC, you'll find it hard to gain support. Were it to say "deploys as if it had the Infiltrate USR" you may have a case, but it doesn't, it confers the Infiltrate USR onto a non-vehicle unit, and the entry for Infiltrate is clear on how it interacts with DTs.

Like I said: black and white friend. i dont know what to tell you. But I also know that it isnt getting solved here nor on any forum.

 Jancoran wrote:

 Azreal13 wrote:
You never select a Vehicle to gain infiltrate, therefore you don't break the rule, as a DT the Rhino, Ghost Ark, Land Raider or whatever inherits it by the back door.

Take it to YMDC, you'll find it hard to gain support. Were it to say "deploys as if it had the Infiltrate USR" you may have a case, but it doesn't, it confers the Infiltrate USR onto a non-vehicle unit, and the entry for Infiltrate is clear on how it interacts with DTs.

Like I said: black and white friend. i dont know what to tell you. But I also know that it isnt getting solved here nor on any forum.

No one on any forum is going to back you up since the rules clearly show that you were wrong. The problem is solved. You were wrong. The solution to this problem for you is for you to admit that you were wrong. And you should probably abstain from playing 40k until you have the skill of admitting when you are wrong.

 Jancoran wrote:

 Azreal13 wrote:
You never select a Vehicle to gain infiltrate, therefore you don't break the rule, as a DT the Rhino, Ghost Ark, Land Raider or whatever inherits it by the back door.

Take it to YMDC, you'll find it hard to gain support. Were it to say "deploys as if it had the Infiltrate USR" you may have a case, but it doesn't, it confers the Infiltrate USR onto a non-vehicle unit, and the entry for Infiltrate is clear on how it interacts with DTs.

Like I said: black and white friend. i dont know what to tell you. But I also know that it isnt getting solved here nor on any forum.

Edited by RiTides (image-only posts are not allowed on Dakka- feel free to edit, though)

I had to fight maxed out plague marine bikers with a cultist swarm. TFG, will never receive another game from again.

 BunkerBob wrote:
I had to fight maxed out plague marine bikers with a cultist swarm. TFG, will never receive another game from again.

Was his list legal?

 BunkerBob wrote:
I had to fight maxed out plague marine bikers with a cultist swarm. TFG, will never receive another game from again.

How is that TFG? Just sounds like a normal chaos force.

col_impact wrote:

 Jancoran wrote:

 Azreal13 wrote:
You never select a Vehicle to gain infiltrate, therefore you don't break the rule, as a DT the Rhino, Ghost Ark, Land Raider or whatever inherits it by the back door.

Take it to YMDC, you'll find it hard to gain support. Were it to say "deploys as if it had the Infiltrate USR" you may have a case, but it doesn't, it confers the Infiltrate USR onto a non-vehicle unit, and the entry for Infiltrate is clear on how it interacts with DTs.

Like I said: black and white friend. i dont know what to tell you. But I also know that it isnt getting solved here nor on any forum.

No one on any forum is going to back you up since the rules clearly show that you were wrong. The problem is solved. You were wrong. The solution to this problem for you is for you to admit that you were wrong. And you should probably abstain from playing 40k until you have the skill of admitting when you are wrong.

Just chiming in but it was solved in YMDC quite some time ago.

I think we have a TFG....

on another note on topic, watched a friend play someone I haven't met who says he hasn't played much (this was when malestorm was the newest of the new stuff, not long ago, but eh) and he only has a few models and so take it easy.

so the friend pulls out a bunch of orks and some other things, I didn't pay much attention, then the other guy brings our 2 knights and some other weird stuff.

he proceeded to lose as he couldn't keep up with the Malestorm points and wasn't able to table my friends orks, (4th ed. orks)

not much of a TFG, but I find it a bit odd to say you are new then pull out imperial knights... in a "friendly game". luckily thats about the worst I have seen.

Well... not at a Warhammer related event, but there was this Mini rc event I went to a while back. That one ing guy decides to look at my iwaver and xmods rc. He has the audacity to just come over and pop the chassis off pulling out the servos and ignoring me like nothing.

I nearly goomba stomped his face in. Some people just have no sense and grab anything without asking.

Dont touch something if it's not yours! Don't take apart something if it's not yours! Especially not 5 minutes before a race you arent even participating in! Don't be that mother ing guy!
...
...

I'm fine now. It's cool.

What I find very weird is that so many people think a stat or special rule isnt true(twin linked doomsday arks was brought up earlier) but then dont ask to see the codex.why?

Because if you do, your either losing game play time you paid for the table or if it is at a tournament you will be accused of trying to time the game.

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Ghaz wrote:

 Jancoran wrote:
As for the other issue, no. If you END YOUR turn without anything then you lose. And I obviously did not.

Technically this is not correct. If you go first and had nothing on the table at the end of your 'player turn', you would not lose until the end of the 'game turn' which would be after your opponent had his 'player turn'. The only instance that I can think of where this would matter however is if a Necron player had a squad of Deathmarks in reserve and used the 'Ethereal Interception' special rule.

Or if you're playing a Horus Heresy Alpha Legion army (as they can potentially bring a unit in on your opponent's turn if the unit being brought in is the same type as the one your opponent successfully rolled reserves for, in which case it comes in instead of the opponent's unit).

Forgeworld...

When I see that, or the rules for the Hornet, or the previous cost on the Lynx, I can't help but say: those rules aren't polished just yet.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Bookwrack wrote:
Fortunately, the worst story I have to tell is pretty mild - playing a game against a tau player, who had a hammerhead with no base, and all game long it hadn't been a problem, just having it cruising along at ground level.

Until the last turn, when I had... something somewhere vital, but it was out of sight behind a tall wall. He pulled out his tape measure and started picking up his dice and I asked what he was doing.

"Well, if it was on its base, it'd be high enough to see them, so I'm taking the shot."

I wasn't having any of that, and he got cranky that I wasn't willing to budge on his hammerhead suddenly getting to gain a couple inches of height.

You're supposed to count it at standard height, i.e. with a base. For all rules purposes. You're TFG.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Jancoran wrote:

NamelessBard wrote:

As for the infiltrate thing, you're just wrong. It's okay to not understand the rule. r.

And again... NON vehicles is SPECIFIC. Specific beats general.

So no. But you can certainly fel that way about it. It may turn into a roll off and if thats refused, then the shortest game of 40K ever. But you cant ignore the obvious black and white Restriction onthe ability. It mentions the Rule, then MODIFIES the rule. Very clearly.

You're wrong.
Three units get infiltrate.
Because of that, their DT receive infiltrate.
Proceed to infiltrate. Even separately if you wish.
Because that's how the rules work.
If you don't want to listen to people, go to YMDC.

SBG wrote:
This thread has become my TFG moment.

There aren't enough exalts in the world.

I think this game breeds TFGs.

 raiden wrote:
I think we have a TFG....

on another note on topic, watched a friend play someone I haven't met who says he hasn't played much (this was when malestorm was the newest of the new stuff, not long ago, but eh) and he only has a few models and so take it easy.

so the friend pulls out a bunch of orks and some other things, I didn't pay much attention, then the other guy brings our 2 knights and some other weird stuff.

he proceeded to lose as he couldn't keep up with the Malestorm points and wasn't able to table my friends orks, (4th ed. orks)

not much of a TFG, but I find it a bit odd to say you are new then pull out imperial knights... in a "friendly game". luckily thats about the worst I have seen.

Except IK are a legal army, so one can be new and be using IK as an army.

 Vermis wrote:
I think this game breeds TFGs.

Every game breeds TFGs. It's just how it is.

morgoth wrote:

 Bookwrack wrote:
Fortunately, the worst story I have to tell is pretty mild - playing a game against a tau player, who had a hammerhead with no base, and all game long it hadn't been a problem, just having it cruising along at ground level.

Until the last turn, when I had... something somewhere vital, but it was out of sight behind a tall wall. He pulled out his tape measure and started picking up his dice and I asked what he was doing.

"Well, if it was on its base, it'd be high enough to see them, so I'm taking the shot."

I wasn't having any of that, and he got cranky that I wasn't willing to budge on his hammerhead suddenly getting to gain a couple inches of height.

You're supposed to count it at standard height, i.e. with a base. For all rules purposes. You're TFG.

Well I would hardly call him that. Altough what you said is correct, (at least in a way...) there is one question I must ask.
Bookwrack, in that game did you previously count yout los to the Hammerhead as if it didn't have a base?

I think that neither was TFG, it was just a misunderstanding. In situations like this, it is best to agree about using the vehicle before the game.
I personally play the models as they look. Going to the "if it was like this" is not the way to play in my opinion.

Well, he said all game long it'd 'been cruising along at ground level,' which indicates to me that they'd been treating it as being where it actually sat, and not where being based would've put it.

Right up until that last turn where being higher up suddenly became an advantage.

 soomemafia wrote:

morgoth wrote:

 Bookwrack wrote:
Fortunately, the worst story I have to tell is pretty mild - playing a game against a tau player, who had a hammerhead with no base, and all game long it hadn't been a problem, just having it cruising along at ground level.

Until the last turn, when I had... something somewhere vital, but it was out of sight behind a tall wall. He pulled out his tape measure and started picking up his dice and I asked what he was doing.

"Well, if it was on its base, it'd be high enough to see them, so I'm taking the shot."

I wasn't having any of that, and he got cranky that I wasn't willing to budge on his hammerhead suddenly getting to gain a couple inches of height.

You're supposed to count it at standard height, i.e. with a base. For all rules purposes. You're TFG.

Well I would hardly call him that. Altough what you said is correct, (at least in a way...) there is one question I must ask.
Bookwrack, in that game did you previously count yout los to the Hammerhead as if it didn't have a base?

I think that neither was TFG, it was just a misunderstanding. In situations like this, it is best to agree about using the vehicle before the game.
I personally play the models as they look. Going to the "if it was like this" is not the way to play in my opinion.

It was a misunderstanding, until our dear forum poster here decided the other guy was a TFG and denied him the rules which were correct.
By doing that, he was TFG that day.
Models are played as they should be (GW model, standard pose, standard base) because that lets you ignore modelling for an advantage.
Plus, it's the rules, so refusing that to someone is over the top.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Portugal Jones wrote:
Well, he said all game long it'd 'been cruising along at ground level,' which indicates to me that they'd been treating it as being where it actually sat, and not where being based would've put it.

Right up until that last turn where being higher up suddenly became an advantage.

I think it indicates the Skimmer moved without base all that time.
If there was a discrepancy between the non-Tau shooting phase and the Tau shooting phase then yes of course that's not acceptable.

We'll have to wait for him to weigh-in, but you'd have to be pretty oblivious to say, 'my opponent was TFG when he was following the rules and I was the one changing things.' But then again, I have been reading Jancoran's posts in this thread... *rimshot*

Seriously though, "Until the last turn-" makes it sound like something suddenly changed in how the hammerhead was being treated.

I think with Bookwracks example, there was a simple misunderstanding between the two players - the opponent thought that they were using it as it should have been (on the base) while Bookwrack thought they were using it as it was on the day (no base) - the best thing for both of them would have been for them to agree whether it would be on a base or not throughout the game (aside the fact that it really should have had a base).

I for example, have a Zoanthrope that is yet to be pinned and as it is, can be out of LOS under a low wall, so while I wait for my materials, I simply hold the model in place with my fingers when my opponent or I are interacting with the model.

Shots fired from Portugal Jones!

sadly lately I've been thinking maybe I am that one fething guy as im really into heresy so have been using my death guard to play with my friends orks but its been embarrassing for him as the last two games we played I won 18 nill he killed one guy I almost wiped him out (left gaskull and his large unit of nobs alone) the next game we swapped deployment zones and tried again I won 13 nill no casualties and completely wiped him out he wasn't bitter about it and we both had fun customising the mission get your tech marine or mek in the bastion and the weapons work and falling asteroids and what not. its not like that I took an op list or cheated he was just a really bad player very bad tactics and only two units weren't baseline why? he had no anti tank I had two dreds and I was helping sort of in trying to guide him in tactics so why do I feel so bad?

morgoth wrote:

 Bookwrack wrote:
Fortunately, the worst story I have to tell is pretty mild - playing a game against a tau player, who had a hammerhead with no base, and all game long it hadn't been a problem, just having it cruising along at ground level.

Until the last turn, when I had... something somewhere vital, but it was out of sight behind a tall wall. He pulled out his tape measure and started picking up his dice and I asked what he was doing.

"Well, if it was on its base, it'd be high enough to see them, so I'm taking the shot."

I wasn't having any of that, and he got cranky that I wasn't willing to budge on his hammerhead suddenly getting to gain a couple inches of height.

You're supposed to count it at standard height, i.e. with a base. For all rules purposes. You're TFG.

And what, praytell is "standard height"? As I can think of at least 4 different "standard" flying stem sizes produced by GW. Not to even mention brass rod.

Makumba wrote:
Because if you do, your either losing game play time you paid for the table or if it is at a tournament you will be accused of trying to time the game.

Paid...for the...? Holy crap dude your store is TFG! You're the guy with the store that doesn't allow anything not bought there weren't you?

the_scotsman wrote:

Makumba wrote:
Because if you do, your either losing game play time you paid for the table or if it is at a tournament you will be accused of trying to time the game.

Paid...for the...? Holy crap dude your store is TFG! You're the guy with the store that doesn't allow anything not bought there weren't you?

Charging for table use is something that has been mentioned by many, many, many people in the past. It's how some stores keep the lights on even if people aren't buying stuff.

Alright, this is a bit of an odd scenario to describe, but the local "TFG" isn't a "TFG" outside of the game. He's an extremely nice, social, agreeable person who goes out of his way to help other people in the club and elsewhere, but as soon as the game starts something switches inside his brain, it's an odd thing we've all noticed (unless it's a team game, because no one here takes those too seriously).

So, the game kind of follows this path:

- Decide points level and table, agree on armies
- He'll then build a list (almost everyone brings one ahead of time), he won't tailor it exactly, but he'll change a few units to match your army; if you've got a librarian, he'll bring a sorcerer to his Khorne list, if you don't have AA, he'll bring a pair of Blight Drones to his nurgle army, have a few tanks, he'll give more melta to his Crisis suits or EMP to Fire Warriors, etc
- Take out entire army model by model, arranging them in perfect formation prior to finalizing list
- Get third party to set up terrain (we always do that, avoid accusations of bias or manipulation, usually produces a more themed board, which is nice)
- Watch other player shift and move terrain to ensure as many ruins as possible are inside both table edges, and move LoS blocking terrain out of the midfield, or table entirely (note: all his armies are gunlines) End result is usually a line of ruins on either table edge, and low or scatter terrain only in the middle.
- Have brief arguement over whether or not to use Maelstrom or Eternal War missions; being a gunline player, he will never play Maelstrom
- Roll off for the 12 billion charts of randomness pre-game
- Watch player deploy a bunch of blast and long-range weapons on the absolute edge of the table, in ruins, ensuring they have line of sight and range on the entire board
- Deploy own army in 1/4 of the time
- Throughout game, player will keep cocked dice without checking if number favourable, re-rolling if unfavourable, always keen to pounce on other player for any potentially cocked dice which is favourable, claim LoS everywhere without checking, regardless of how carefully you have tried to hide even a single model from the wall of doom, and will get frustrated, unhappy and accusatory over any opponent unit performs better than he expected (I once got in gak for my Honour Guard with Relic blades killing a unit of Khorne Berserkers, "I really dislike units which have 2+ but look like normal space marines," my response, "Uh, I built them out of Grey Knights, converted them, gave them giant glowing swords in an effort to make it abundantly clear what they are," "I guess....") and will actively manipulate rules that he's been previously ruled against on, provided said person isn't in earshot, like claiming vehicles in squadrons can't be hurt in assault if there isn't an assaulting model in base contact with secondary vehicles, and will simply concede if the opponent does something he doesn't like, or in the very rare occassion where he perceives the opponent's list to be more powerful.

He also likes to call me a hypocrit when I call him out on his current favourite IG list not being as "nice" as he'd like to claim, as I run something similar over a year ago; a tank-heavy list. I used to run the Armoured Battlegroup from FW back when Russes couldn't score; I brought one of every Leman Russ in existance, gave the opponent fair warning, and gave them a few suggestions over how to counter it; it's not fun pounding an unprepared opponent into the dirt after all (and I usually lost anyways, not being able to seize any objectives, can only win by tabling). He runs Punisher Pask, a secondary commander Vanquisher, Demolisher squadron and standard battletank squadron with two vets in chimeras out of the regular codex, calls them a fluffy, nice list, and defends at as being a pretty tame list when fighting footslogging space marines because I, the person who only ever builds an army to a theme and can't roll above a 2 used a tank list back when it was, tactically speaking, terrible (and tended to run them straight into the enemy for gaks and giggles, I once had a pile three russes tall from trying to tank shock Obliterators to no avail)

And then give him an hour of vent his various frustrations over a game if it didn't follow his plan or he was challenged on something, and he's back to being just shy of a paragon of virtue. It's the damnedest thing.

On the skimmer and the flying base...

The way the post is written it sure sounds like it was treated one way by both players the whole game, then the other dude changes things at the end for his benefit.

To me if both players choose to ignore a rule all game, then one wants to use the rule at the end, he is wrong even if it is the rule. You can't pick and choose when to follow a rule. You either follow it or don't. Either one is fine as long as both players are doing it the same way.

Also, by not using the flying base, the other player is not fielding a properly modeled army. Why should he benefit from the rule while at the same time ignoring it? And if his failure to properly model has cost his opponent an opportunity to shoot, he should not then be able to shoot as if the model was properly modeled.

Grimtuff wrote:
And what, praytell is "standard height"? As I can think of at least 4 different "standard" flying stem sizes produced by GW. Not to even mention brass rod.

There are two stems that were provided for skimmers, both are valid and I think you're even allowed to change in game.

morgoth wrote:

Grimtuff wrote:
And what, praytell is "standard height"? As I can think of at least 4 different "standard" flying stem sizes produced by GW. Not to even mention brass rod.

There are two stems that were provided for skimmers, both are valid and I think you're even allowed to change in game.

I..Don't think anyone would allow that, ever, because that would open up some horrific model for abuse.

morgoth wrote:

Grimtuff wrote:
And what, praytell is "standard height"? As I can think of at least 4 different "standard" flying stem sizes produced by GW. Not to even mention brass rod.

There are two stems that were provided for skimmers, both are valid and I think you're even allowed to change in game.

While both are valid, there is nothing in the rules which would permit you to change the stem mid game.

*edit* Man, I'm not even touching those changing-stem shenanigans with a ten foot power lance.

Gwaihirsbrother wrote:
On the skimmer and the flying base...

The way the post is written it sure sounds like it was treated one way by both players the whole game, then the other dude changes things at the end for his benefit.

I forgot to mention that it was 5th edition, so True Line of Sight was in full effect as well. It wasn't an issue of communication - the whole game, shooting at (and as far as I could tell, being shot by) the hammerhead had followed TLOS for where it sat on the table. I want to say that on that same turn, it'd soaked a lascannon or multimelta shot with a cover save because I'd been worried about it doing exactly what he tried to do, but it was three or four years ago at this point. Which is why, 'well, if it was on a stand it could see them, so I'm taking the shot,' was such a *record scratch noise* 'Wait, what?' moment.

*edit 2* And why I feel it was worth including in a TFG thread was my opponent just picked up his dice to get on with the shooting - he didn't stop to ask if I'd consider letting him do it, or otherwise bring it to my attention. The only reason I jumped on it so quick, and hard, was because I'd been worried about that exact situation and had tried to position the unit to keep it from coming around. My first reaction was that I had made a mistake and missed a firing angle from his side of the table, but when I ducked down to check, I realized, nope, that groundbound hammerhead could not see my unit.

Yeah, I'm not playing the stem changing game, but it could have been added tactical depth. I would have loved it, it would have been so much fun.

Unfortunately, with the kind of reaction the community has to just about anything, it sounds like a very bad idea and a simple way to be accused of modelling for an advantage - something that only exists because of stupid TLOS.

Either way, Bookwrack, in most cases TLOS or not checking are exactly the same thing, just sometimes it's not the case.

The rules are that you count models in a standard pose with a standard base, no matter what you used as pose, alternative model or base.

That "groundbound" hammerhead should have been allowed to fire on your units, and unless you were denied shots at it because of its height (not thought so and did not ask), you had no right to deny that to your opponent.

But that's fine, everyone makes mistakes and will at times stand behind the wrong point, oftentimes because it makes total sense to them.

morgoth wrote:

That "groundbound" hammerhead should have been allowed to fire on your units, and unless you were denied shots at it because of its height (not thought so and did not ask), you had no right to deny that to your opponent.

Reading comprehension is not your strong suit, is it?
*edit*
As well as not understanding what 'True Line of Sight' means, and a penchant for making up rules as they suit you. Ir would you like to try giving a page number for where in the 5th edition rulebook it says, 'models are treated as being somewhere else than they actually are?'

 Bookwrack wrote:
As well as not understanding what 'True Line of Sight' means, and a penchant for making up rules as they suit you. Ir would you like to try giving a page number for where in the 5th edition rulebook it says, 'models are treated as being somewhere else than they actually are?'

The BRB mentions the fact that miniatures should be used with the bases provided.
In order to prevent any "modelling for an advantage" discussion, it stands to reason that any advantage or disadvantage due to an unusual pose should be ignored when measuring range, TLOS an all that.

But hey, you can play it your way and have all the "modelling for an advantage" thing up in the air, your choice.

Morgoth, you're ignoring the fact that it was played the entire game from were it was, not were it should have been if it was on a base. The cheese wasn't that the other player wanted to pretend it was on it's base, but that he wanted to do so at the end of the game when it gave him an advantage.

 ClockworkZion wrote:
Morgoth, you're ignoring the fact that it was played the entire game from were it was, not were it should have been if it was on a base. The cheese wasn't that the other player wanted to pretend it was on it's base, but that he wanted to do so at the end of the game when it gave him an advantage.

- Edited by insaniak. Please see Dakka's Rule #1 -

 Vigilant wrote:
Well... not at a Warhammer related event, but there was this Mini rc event I went to a while back. That one ing guy decides to look at my iwaver and xmods rc. He has the audacity to just come over and pop the chassis off pulling out the servos and ignoring me like nothing.

I nearly goomba stomped his face in. Some people just have no sense and grab anything without asking.

Dont touch something if it's not yours! Don't take apart something if it's not yours! Especially not 5 minutes before a race you arent even participating in! Don't be that mother ing guy!
...
...

I'm fine now. It's cool.

You can't call him TFG because he was like, eight years old, but..store apocalyspe game a few years ago, the manager was the games master for the game. He gave out party poppers to use as artillery barrages, with the idea that you fire them up at the ceiling and then whatever they land on gets hit by a basilisk shell or whatever. It was his way of eveing things out after one of the tables turned into a superheavy parking lot.

Anyway, some kid on the chaos side - I don't know why they let eight year olds join the game, but ugh, this was in the days of GW as Free Childcare - decided that the best use for this party popper was to absolutely make sure that my Valkyries couldn't deploy infantry onto one of the other objectives, and was about to fire it directly up at the bottom of the aircraft's wing.

From an inch away.

At a fully painted, slightly fragile model.

I consider myself quite restrained in that I merely guided his hand away and told him off... and then didn't have a screaming fit at his mother when she started lighting into me for daring to interfere with her darling baby boy.

The opponent was the one who suddenly tried to ignore TLOS based on where it "would have been" despite playing the game where it actually was. The opponent was also the one who wasn't using the flight stand. It's hardly the person who didn't let his opponent abuse the game system for an advantage who was being a dick.

 Furyou Miko wrote:

 Vigilant wrote:
Well... not at a Warhammer related event, but there was this Mini rc event I went to a while back. That one ing guy decides to look at my iwaver and xmods rc. He has the audacity to just come over and pop the chassis off pulling out the servos and ignoring me like nothing.

I nearly goomba stomped his face in. Some people just have no sense and grab anything without asking.

Dont touch something if it's not yours! Don't take apart something if it's not yours! Especially not 5 minutes before a race you arent even participating in! Don't be that mother ing guy!
...
...

I'm fine now. It's cool.

You can't call him TFG because he was like, eight years old, but..store apocalyspe game a few years ago, the manager was the games master for the game. He gave out party poppers to use as artillery barrages, with the idea that you fire them up at the ceiling and then whatever they land on gets hit by a basilisk shell or whatever. It was his way of eveing things out after one of the tables turned into a superheavy parking lot.

Anyway, some kid on the chaos side - I don't know why they let eight year olds join the game, but ugh, this was in the days of GW as Free Childcare - decided that the best use for this party popper was to absolutely make sure that my Valkyries couldn't deploy infantry onto one of the other objectives, and was about to fire it directly up at the bottom of the aircraft's wing.

From an inch away.

At a fully painted, slightly fragile model.

I consider myself quite restrained in that I merely guided his hand away and told him off... and then didn't have a screaming fit at his mother when she started lighting into me for daring to interfere with her darling baby boy.

Blame the parent, not the child. (Even if the child is a total dick)

 ClockworkZion wrote:
The opponent was the one who suddenly tried to ignore TLOS based on where it "would have been" despite playing the game where it actually was. The opponent was also the one who wasn't using the flight stand. It's hardly the person who didn't let his opponent abuse the game system for an advantage who was being a dick.

Hear hear.

Played against a guy who wasn't TFG, but his list still pissed me off. He asked me beforehand if I had any fliers, I said one Nephilim. He proceeded to bring 2 Storm Ravens and 3 Storm Talons. My ADL barely did anything. He was a great opponent and I would like to play him again, but needless to say I will never play his cheese list again.

I used to get called tfg but i was more waac. I see them as different, both can be bad. I played space wolves back in 5th and i played a guy running BA mephiston and dreadnought drop pod spam. My list was my alpha legion proxy because feth that awful piece of gak that was the prviois chaos dex.

Being alphas i had spammy same equipted multipurpose units. Apparently he had been asked to the local tournament to beat me, because he told me as much "I'm the best player around my area and I was the best here so this should be quick from what I've heard of you". We exchanged lists and he scoffs going "well your list is boring" and at thiz point I'd had enoufh of his attitude and just replied "yep, and yours is bad". He proceeded to gloat about his o5her victories and how quickly he tabled his opponent. I castled in the corner and one by one his drop pod dreads ate melta and las/plas fire. Mephiston got pulped by my thunderwolves (exhalted chaos knights) and it was over turn 2.

Dude threw a huge hissy over how unsporting I was and how I ruined his tournament, were talking hall of fame hissy for 20 minutes straight. But he did set me straight, i realised i never wanted to be that bad so i picked up dark eldar and run fluffy chaos lists.

Now i still got called tfg /waac because i was good and won a lot. But i cant see how running pure 1k sons, or pure foot khorne (kharn, bersrkers, mutilators and maulers ONLY) without knowing what my opponent had is waac. Eventually i stoped playing 40k and have moved to fantasy. So far I havent had a single issue of tfg but then again the playr2 base seems more mature on the fantasy side.

 Shas'O Dorian wrote:
I used to get called tfg but i was more waac. I see them as different, both can be bad. I played space wolves back in 5th and i played a guy running BA mephiston and dreadnought drop pod spam. My list was my alpha legion proxy because feth that awful piece of gak that was the prviois chaos dex.

Being alphas i had spammy same equipted multipurpose units. Apparently he had been asked to the local tournament to beat me, because he told me as much "I'm the best player around my area and I was the best here so this should be quick from what I've heard of you". We exchanged lists and he scoffs going "well your list is boring" and at thiz point I'd had enoufh of his attitude and just replied "yep, and yours is bad". He proceeded to gloat about his o5her victories and how quickly he tabled his opponent. I castled in the corner and one by one his drop pod dreads ate melta and las/plas fire. Mephiston got pulped by my thunderwolves (exhalted chaos knights) and it was over turn 2.

Dude threw a huge hissy over how unsporting I was and how I ruined his tournament, were talking hall of fame hissy for 20 minutes straight. But he did set me straight, i realised i never wanted to be that bad so i picked up dark eldar and run fluffy chaos lists.

Now i still got called tfg /waac because i was good and won a lot. But i cant see how running pure 1k sons, or pure foot khorne (kharn, bersrkers, mutilators and maulers ONLY) without knowing what my opponent had is waac. Eventually i stoped playing 40k and have moved to fantasy. So far I havent had a single issue of tfg but then again the playr2 base seems more mature on the fantasy side.

He was definitely TFG in the situation. Props to you for busting his chops as long as you're a decent guy and not bragging, don't matter how hard you play. I think you're only a WAAC if you try to spam/cheese out your opponent

morgoth wrote:

There is no mention of the other player receiving any advantage due to anyone counting the Hammerhead as not being at the proper height.

5th edition
TLOS

I don't know what your malfunction is, but your attempt to define TRUE Line of Sight as being, 'some arbitrary position different than where the model actually is,' is just bizarre, and completely unsupported by the rules. Especially for 5th edition. Bookwrack even mentioned the hamerhead taking cover saves, and since they were using TLOS, that meant they were using where the model actually sat on the table and not some random abstract position elsewhere.

As dictated by the rules.

So, again, this was a pretty clear case of the Tau player trying to pull a fast one at the last second.

 Portugal Jones wrote:

morgoth wrote:

There is no mention of the other player receiving any advantage due to anyone counting the Hammerhead as not being at the proper height.

5th edition
TLOS

I don't know what your malfunction is, but your attempt to define TRUE Line of Sight as being, 'some arbitrary position different than where the model actually is,' is just bizarre, and completely unsupported by the rules. Especially for 5th edition. Bookwrack even mentioned the hamerhead taking cover saves, and since they were using TLOS, that meant they were using where the model actually sat on the table and not some random abstract position elsewhere.

As dictated by the rules.

So, again, this was a pretty clear case of the Tau player trying to pull a fast one at the last second.

TLOS is not the only rule. You also have to use the base shipped with the model AND ignore any advantage or disadvantage stemming from modeling.

Even if my WK was crouching, there's no way I'd ever consider anything else than the basic pose for TLOS and distance measures.

A friend of a friend... who brought a friend.

A friend of mine who I worked with would talk with me for hours about 40k, told me his friend from the next town over would be going to my flgs, looking for a game and asked if I'd like to play this guy (who 'never lost'). I agreed and the next week I went to the store to meet this friend of his. I introduced myself to the guy, who'd brought along a chum, and set up on the table against him. My army was fairly unconventional for the type (ork wagon rush) and I had really refined taking marine armies down along basic principles... I waited to see what he'd deploy and out came...

An army designed to kill mine. He had brought a list entirely designed to take down my wagon rush, the army I'd been talking through with my friend from work, it had been, I guess, relayed back to him and he knew precisely what I'd be fielding. Moderately peevish, I set up.

And then my opponent's chum started up, for the entire game, questioning every single thing I did, movement, shooting, special rules... 'is that how it works' or 'not sure I'd be doing that'. He sat there thumbing through the rulebook whenever I did anything at all.

As soon as it was apparent I'd lost, I called it. He smiled and told me he never loses and that I shouldn't feel bad... I was not amused and he was genuinely puzzled why when he looked around for another game, nobody would play him. When he left, a gamer wandered over and patted me on the back and informed me that he knew this guy from a previous store and the dude was widely reviled.

There have been a couple of others over the years, but I guess that's a good thing, that of all the games I've played, only a few have ever been negative experiences. TFG remains for me, all about behavior, not bringing a strong list or sticking to the rules, but forgetting to be a gent.

Except I did spam cheese lol. Again I was a waac tournament player and won fairly often, but I eventually realized I wasn't really having fun.

morgoth wrote:
TLOS is not the only rule. You also have to use the base shipped with the model AND ignore any advantage or disadvantage stemming from modeling.

Even if my WK was crouching, there's no way I'd ever consider anything else than the basic pose for TLOS and distance measures.

The biggest reason people don't use the base/stem for the models is because of how easy those thin stems snap off in the hole (it's even worse if you glued it on because you have to drill it out to replace it), so many people play without. The fact that it wasn't used again, is not the issue. The issue is the owning player trying to change how the model is being played strictly for an advantage.

And yes, you can pose a WK or a Riptide as kneeling. If you do then that's how it's treated. The only things ignored (last I checked) were weapons, banners, and wings when it came to determining LoS, so if it's kneeling, then it's kneeling. I'm not going to try and argue that I should be able to shoot it because it's normally taller just because that's the default way to assemble the model. To do so is frankly a dick move.

EDIT: You seem REALLY confused on what TLoS actually is now that I read over your post again. With TLoS you don't pretend the model is anywhere but where it actually is. Yes, there are some things that are ignored for modelling purposes, but the majority of the model is always treated as where it is physically is not where it would be if posed more conventionally. You can run into some situations where modeling needs to be discussed with an opponent (such as any Tyranid player who uses Space Hulk Genestealers as some are FAR taller than normal Genestealers because of what they're attached to and the like) but generally speaking it's not quite that hard. And as long as it's consistent it doesn't matter how you agree to play it as long as it doesn't change, which in the situation where you keep lambasting the OP of that story, is the problem. It was played one way, and then for an advantage the controlling player tried to change how it was played. That is a no-go with any opponent who isn't coddling your nonsense because you're the only person they have to play against.

Seriously, read the rulebook because you don't seem to actually understand the rules you're referring to.

 ClockworkZion wrote:

And yes, you can pose a WK or a Riptide as kneeling. If you do then that's how it's treated. The only things ignored (last I checked) were weapons, banners, and wings when it came to determining LoS, so if it's kneeling, then it's kneeling. I'm not going to try and argue that I should be able to shoot it because it's normally taller just because that's the default way to assemble the model. To do so is frankly a dick move.

That would be modelling for an advantage.

If you don't argue it means you don't recognize modelling for an advantage as a real issue that needs to be managed.

I recognize it as an issue and I believe Tournaments do as well.

That people who do not care for competitive play, i.e. playing fairly with equal chances for all, do not bother about that is not important to me.

morgoth wrote:

 Portugal Jones wrote:

morgoth wrote:

There is no mention of the other player receiving any advantage due to anyone counting the Hammerhead as not being at the proper height.

5th edition
TLOS

I don't know what your malfunction is, but your attempt to define TRUE Line of Sight as being, 'some arbitrary position different than where the model actually is,' is just bizarre, and completely unsupported by the rules. Especially for 5th edition. Bookwrack even mentioned the hamerhead taking cover saves, and since they were using TLOS, that meant they were using where the model actually sat on the table and not some random abstract position elsewhere.

As dictated by the rules.

So, again, this was a pretty clear case of the Tau player trying to pull a fast one at the last second.

TLOS is not the only rule. You also have to use the base shipped with the model AND ignore any advantage or disadvantage stemming from modeling.

Even if my WK was crouching, there's no way I'd ever consider anything else than the basic pose for TLOS and distance measures.

So that s the opponent not following that rule about using the base stem, taking cover saves as it was, but then at the end acting like it had the base to take a shot, and yet the OP is the dick...

This happened several years ago right when I had gotten back from basic training (US Army) and was playing in a small tournament at my FLGS. Now a little back story, there was an ex marine who thought he was a badass (was kicked out for feeling is PT test, he was a pretty big guy) that would often come in even before I shipped out to training and he would bring his girlfriend, now we all thought she was weird because she would constantly stare at us and try to talk to us privately. the sad fact was we found out later that he was physically and verbally abusive to her and she was trying to ask us for help in her own way.

Anyways at this tournament he was running a foot guard list (100pts. if I remember correctly) and had just barely tabled my buddies orks and was gloating about it like a typical Gak. I played him next and proceeded to kick the snot out of him with my airborne themed Steel Legion (back when Flyers were skimmers and could start of a table first turn). After a lengthy cryfest of calling me a cheesy, OP noob he packed up his stuff and dropped out of the tournament taking his girlfriend out into the parking lot with him. While we were picking up and getting ready for the last round we saw her trying to calm him down by their car and that's when we saw him wound up and slap her across the face. The next thing I knew i was outside and had him on the ground where I was proceeding to beat him into the pavement before the store owner and some friends dragged me off him. Later I found out she divorced him and have not seen him since nor has he ever come back to our game store.

^ that's...wow. That's a whole other level above TFG...

ImAGeek wrote:
So that s the opponent not following that rule about using the base stem, taking cover saves as it was, but then at the end acting like it had the base to take a shot, and yet the OP is the dick...

Because so far, the only person who took advantage of the stem issue was the player reporting the other one as TFG.

morgoth wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

And yes, you can pose a WK or a Riptide as kneeling. If you do then that's how it's treated. The only things ignored (last I checked) were weapons, banners, and wings when it came to determining LoS, so if it's kneeling, then it's kneeling. I'm not going to try and argue that I should be able to shoot it because it's normally taller just because that's the default way to assemble the model. To do so is frankly a dick move.

That would be modelling for an advantage.

Tell that to GW who has advertised in the WD back when the Riptide came out it kneeling as a legitimate pose to use.

morgoth wrote:

ImAGeek wrote:
So that s the opponent not following that rule about using the base stem, taking cover saves as it was, but then at the end acting like it had the base to take a shot, and yet the OP is the dick...

Because so far, the only person who took advantage of the stem issue was the player reporting the other one as TFG.

Except it wasn't because they mentioned cover saves, so they'd have taken them without the stem. It's only when the opponent wanted to take a shot that he couldn't that he mentioned the base at all.

morgoth wrote:

ImAGeek wrote:
So that s the opponent not following that rule about using the base stem, taking cover saves as it was, but then at the end acting like it had the base to take a shot, and yet the OP is the dick...

Because so far, the only person who took advantage of the stem issue was the player reporting the other one as TFG.

You seem to have some kind of serious misunderstanding of what was clearly explained and reality in general. They agreed to play it without the stem, and the person who owned the model have cover saves and LOS benefits he didn't normally have because of it. Furthermore he then tried to alter the agreement to shoot as if he had the stem despite the bonuses he'd gotten for not having it.

He was trying to have his cake and eat it too. And you are intentionally ignoring facts to create a scenario where the person who posted this story was the the "actual" TFG when his opponent tried to go back on their verbal contract on how they were playing the game.

 ClockworkZion wrote:

morgoth wrote:

ImAGeek wrote:
So that s the opponent not following that rule about using the base stem, taking cover saves as it was, but then at the end acting like it had the base to take a shot, and yet the OP is the dick...

Because so far, the only person who took advantage of the stem issue was the player reporting the other one as TFG.

You seem to have some kind of serious misunderstanding of what was clearly explained and reality in general. They agreed to play it without the stem, and the person who owned the model have cover saves and LOS benefits he didn't normally have because of it. Furthermore he then tried to alter the agreement to shoot as if he had the stem despite the bonuses he'd gotten for not having it.

He was trying to have his cake and eat it too. And you are intentionally ignoring facts to create a scenario where the person who posted this story was the the "actual" TFG when his opponent tried to go back on their verbal contract on how they were playing the game.

I think you should try reading it again.

 Bookwrack wrote:
Fortunately, the worst story I have to tell is pretty mild - playing a game against a tau player, who had a hammerhead with no base, and all game long it hadn't been a problem, just having it cruising along at ground level.

Until the last turn, when I had... something somewhere vital, but it was out of sight behind a tall wall. He pulled out his tape measure and started picking up his dice and I asked what he was doing.

"Well, if it was on its base, it'd be high enough to see them, so I'm taking the shot."

I wasn't having any of that, and he got cranky that I wasn't willing to budge on his hammerhead suddenly getting to gain a couple inches of height.

Very clearly, there is no mention whatsoever of the Tau player taking a cover save granted by the lack of stem.

But hey, if you want to be with the poster, and call TFG somebody you don't even know and who seemingly didn't do anything wrong, be my guest.

You mean like you are?

You're accusing Bookwrack of all sorts, but when people support the opposite view you're crying "invalid?"

You're adorable, like the living incarnation of Poe's Law.

Also, beside all the who had advantage and who didn't, your whole point is that you have to use the base it comes packaged with. The opponent didn't do that, so HE broke that rule. And yet the OP is being a dick for assuming he'd been using it as it was, in the edition when TLOS was a really big thing?

It clearly was just a misunderstanding but Id side with the OP if push came to shove, and in no way is OP being unreasonable about it, while you are.

 gmaleron wrote:
This happened several years ago right when I had gotten back from basic training (US Army) and was playing in a small tournament at my FLGS. Now a little back story, there was an ex marine who thought he was a badass (was kicked out for feeling is PT test, he was a pretty big guy) that would often come in even before I shipped out to training and he would bring his girlfriend, now we all thought she was weird because she would constantly stare at us and try to talk to us privately. the sad fact was we found out later that he was physically and verbally abusive to her and she was trying to ask us for help in her own way.

Anyways at this tournament he was running a foot guard list (100pts. if I remember correctly) and had just barely tabled my buddies orks and was gloating about it like a typical Gak. I played him next and proceeded to kick the snot out of him with my airborne themed Steel Legion (back when Flyers were skimmers and could start of a table first turn). After a lengthy cryfest of calling me a cheesy, OP noob he packed up his stuff and dropped out of the tournament taking his girlfriend out into the parking lot with him. While we were picking up and getting ready for the last round we saw her trying to calm him down by their car and that's when we saw him wound up and slap her across the face. The next thing I knew i was outside and had him on the ground where I was proceeding to beat him into the pavement before the store owner and some friends dragged me off him. Later I found out she divorced him and have not seen him since nor has he ever come back to our game store.

God I love street justice props mate, for beating him on TT and IRL


Automatically Appended Next Post:

morgoth wrote:
[quote=ClockworkZion 616774 7253474 9972cb26815f4fccc1b84543e945a276.png

 Bookwrack wrote:
Fortunately, the worst story I have to tell is pretty mild - playing a game against a tau player, who had a hammerhead with no base, and all game long it hadn't been a problem, just having it cruising along at ground level.

Until the last turn, when I had... something somewhere vital, but it was out of sight behind a tall wall. He pulled out his tape measure and started picking up his dice and I asked what he was doing.

"Well, if it was on its base, it'd be high enough to see them, so I'm taking the shot."

I wasn't having any of that, and he got cranky that I wasn't willing to budge on his hammerhead suddenly getting to gain a couple inches of height.

Very clearly, there is no mention whatsoever of the Tau player taking a cover save granted by the lack of stem.

But hey, if you want to be with the poster, and call TFG somebody you don't even know and who seemingly didn't do anything wrong, be my guest.

Emphasis mine. He CLEARLY was taking cover saves by having it not be on the ground. Then, when he couldn't make a shot, he tried to play it as on the stem. He was obviously TFG, not the opponent. That, or you are literally insane/in denial

ImAGeek wrote:
It clearly was just a misunderstanding but Id side with the OP if push came to shove, and in no way is OP being unreasonable about it, while you are.

The OP called the other guy a TFG based on a misunderstanding and you find that reasonable ?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 jreilly89 wrote:

morgoth wrote:
[quote=ClockworkZion 616774 7253474 9972cb26815f4fccc1b84543e945a276.png

 Bookwrack wrote:
Fortunately, the worst story I have to tell is pretty mild - playing a game against a tau player, who had a hammerhead with no base, and all game long it hadn't been a problem, just having it cruising along at ground level.

Until the last turn, when I had... something somewhere vital, but it was out of sight behind a tall wall. He pulled out his tape measure and started picking up his dice and I asked what he was doing.

"Well, if it was on its base, it'd be high enough to see them, so I'm taking the shot."

I wasn't having any of that, and he got cranky that I wasn't willing to budge on his hammerhead suddenly getting to gain a couple inches of height.

Very clearly, there is no mention whatsoever of the Tau player taking a cover save granted by the lack of stem.

But hey, if you want to be with the poster, and call TFG somebody you don't even know and who seemingly didn't do anything wrong, be my guest.

Emphasis mine. He CLEARLY was taking cover saves by having it not be on the ground. Then, when he couldn't make a shot, he tried to play it as on the stem. He was obviously TFG, not the opponent. That, or you are literally insane/in denial

The non-Tau player had something somewhere vital, which was out of sight behind a tall wall.
Maybe you need to re-read it again.

morgoth wrote:

ImAGeek wrote:
It clearly was just a misunderstanding but Id side with the OP if push came to shove, and in no way is OP being unreasonable about it, while you are.

The OP called the other guy a TFG based on a misunderstanding and you find that reasonable ?

Well... Yeah. He didn't actually say he was TFG at all, and said 'the only case I have is pretty mild'. Also made no mention of the guy being a dick, or an donkey-cave, or any kind of attack like that, he just said that he'd used his tau skimmer near the ground all day and at the end said about a base it wasn't on (which as you keep saying is a rule the opponent was actually breaking...)

I don't see anything he said that was unreasonable. You called him a dick, and TFG, so you're unreasonable. And a hypocrite.

Morgoth is obviously not going to budge from his stance on the situation. Would the rest of you please be so kind to move on to another point ?

At this point I am totally lost-I've read the damn post, and it looks like this:
-Tau player has tank not on base
-Non-Tau player (OP) is fine with this
-OP has important object
-Tau player tries to shoot it, claiming his tank would have been able to see it if it was on base, but can't when off base
-both players agreed it was being played off base, not on
-OP refuses this "back and forth"
-Tau player is a dick


Does that about sum it up? Because if I'm right in all that, anyone on the side of the Tau player is an asshat.

That sums it up yeah.

Great. Lets move on. If you support the tau player, you're an asshat. Good for you. You're also TFG, even if we're not playing a game currently.


(This is a general "you," not saying "you" to the poster above me. Just wanted to be clear )

I can't wait for one of your opponents to post his version of the story online and have some random people who didn't even bother to understand the situation judge you.

Sounds like your just salty morgoth.

morgoth wrote:
I can't wait for one of your opponents to post his version of the story online and have some random people who didn't even bother to understand the situation judge you.

\

Nobody likes people being salty Morgoth.

morgoth wrote:
I can't wait for one of your opponents to post his version of the story online and have some random people who didn't even bother to understand the situation judge you.

Like you did to the OP? Pot, kettle...

Morgoth is definitely PJSalt right now

This thread is in danger of being packed in salt and shipped off to the mines.

Can we all maybe just drop the skimmer base argument and move on with our lives?

A TFG story: I had played a grand total of one game of WHFB, was about 15 years old and had 2000 points of dwarves.
This was the time of WH Magic, with the cardboard cards that had ridiculously powerful items on them.

So the guy invites me for a game at his place.

We setup on a table that must have been like 96" long, about 40" apart.

T1, his high elf sorcerer (ML max ? Tyrion maybe ?), equipped with two items, one that gives total power every turn and causes one unsavable wound per turn, the other that heals two wounds per turn, casts pillar of heavens or something.

He then proceeds to nuke my army without any chance for me to retaliate.

My dwarves try to march across the field, but 6" per turn doesn't prove to be very effective, and by the time the high elven cavalry is there, the high elf mage had killed at least half my army.

I don't think I realized what happened back then, but that guy was TFG that day.

 Vector Strike wrote:
Not much to tell. Apart the fact new gamers around here all want to start with Space Wolves rules and I used to play Eldar with them... not all enjoyed the game

Yeah, it's no fun if your power armored opponents didn't have a chance.

OMFG this is hillarious!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_UXan8lQa4

"the borrower" segment was hilarious.

I actually caught my opponent stacking the tactical objective deck. I thought it was strange that he always seemed to draw the objective I had moved away from. Turns out while I was focused on moving my models, he was looking through a second set of tactical objectives and putting the objective he would need on top of the deck. It took a tremendous amount of self control not to just deck the guy.

Instead, I calmly packed up and left without saying another word to him.

The store was having another beginners game.

Now normally people have pretty tame units as it is a beginners game so you get Dark Vengeance models, 2 Grey Hunter Squads with Bolters, some Skyclaws perhaps. You get the idea - standard units are not powerful.

So on one side against the TFG you get a grand total of two 10 man Tactical squads in Rhinos, the BaC praetor and five Cataprachtii Terminators.

The TFG has an ally of a Dunewalker thing and Skitarii Vanguard.

The TFG himself bring ten scatterbikes and ten Wraithguard with Wraithcannons. This is the toned down version as upon seeing a pair of Rhinos he tried bringing out a Wraithknight.

This is becoming what I'd call a more balanced beginner game nowadays.

I had a funny TFG experience:

Guy deep-strikes a squad with flamers near my infantry. He spends a few minutes trying to position the template correctly and declares it can proudly it X of my guys; in reality it was maybe half of that. The big issue is a terrain piece that blocks much of the unit and messed with the angle/LoS. We go back and forth for a few minutes and then ask a judge who declares that I'm right.

That wasn't enough, though. He's so convinced that he says, "Fine, but I'm going to prove I'm right." Before I can stop him, he picks up and moves MY units not in terrain away to get a better view, places the template at a new angle and says, "Ha, look, it covers them!"

"Yes, but you just removed the other units, so we'd have no way of knowing how it'd cover at that *new* angle."

He got this look of confusion followed by incredulity and then just pouted back. It was great.

I made my own thread in tactics, but the gist of it was that he brought an illegal formation, an uber-competitve list against a fun SW list. Actually had a couple people come over to the table and calling him a dick

He was also a little salty. He'd complain about his gakky rolls way too much, even though he tabled me turn 5.

Not TFG, but there was one game I had against a strangely belligrerent opponent, which peaked at the exclamation of 'bs!' when I told him his IG platoon command squad did not get armor in CC against a carnifex. It took me aback for a second, especially since models were Catachans.

Not a TFG by nature, but a strange TFG moment.

We were playing a match. I was doing well but it was still close, maelstrom at...8 to 6? Something easily come backable from.

I have sternguard near a rhino. Some sternguard can look over part of the rhino at a nearby squad (based on the nearby terrain). I get cover when they try to shoot and fail their charge.

I then try to shoot the enemy squad with the heavy flamer in this sternguard squad. It goes over the rhino somewhat but I can there's LoS from the Sternguard's head and shoulder. The opponent gets very upset and says it can't shoot through cover. After we argue about the rule, I say "well it's fine, they just won't do that and they'll just shoot normally w/o the flamer."

Doesn't matter. At that point he packed up and forfeit, being extremely angry. I seriously didn't understand what the problem was, and to this day I don't.

My Chaos Daemons verses a heavily tailored 30K Space Marine Army, The Raptors I believe. He made the army list and painted an entire 2000 point force entirely just to face off against my Chaos Daemons, which he had been unable to defeat with his Ultramarines.

Why Raptors instead of Ultra Marines I asked ? He tells me they have 2 special rules, rending on Bolter weapons if they don't move, and an extra VP for every Psyker they kill. I accuse him of tailoring his list, he denies it. My army is Fateweaver, and nothing but pink horrors and heralds of Tzeentch. There is literally nothing in my list that isn't a Psyker. We've already set up the miniatures and terrain, and I honestly figure it will be fun playing at disadvantage.

He then scouts everything up. WTF ? Okay they have that chapter tactic, like Ravens, but he didn't say that in the beggining.
I have ZERO ranged weapons, and his entire strategy is evidently to walk backwards 6" every turn, to try and stay at maximum bolter range, and collect VPs for killing stuff before the clock runs out. BTW he has nothing but bolters, regular and Heavy, to take advantage of the rending.

Turn 1, He can't really shoot anything of mine. My army is cowering behind cover, trying to summon reinforcements.
Turn 2, He moves back, shoots, and tries to claim rending. No, they moved. Dig out book, read special rule. Doesn't manage to kill anything.
Turn 3, He moves back, shoots, belly aches about not getting rending while trying to kill greater daemon with bolter fire.
Turn 4, He moves back, shoots, kills some pink horrors. Tries to claim extra VP for EACH pink horror. I insist that is insane, since they are brotherhood of psykers, ridicule him for tailoring his list again, he denies it again. I read the chapter tactics. NOTHING about extra VPs for Psykers. He tells me it's because of special character's rule. Read the Special Character's rule and..... it's an extra VP for each Psyker the SPECIAL CHARACTER KILLS IN ASSAULTS.

At this point, everyone there is amazed. He clearly tailored his list, and spent time building and painting an army around it, and he completely got the special rules and tactic wrong.

Now he want's to throw in the towel because he can't get rending and extra VPs.

I call bs and insist this donkey cave finish the game after all the crap he put me through.

I table his army, and he never again brings this, absolutley not tailored, army ever again.

Raptors are not 30k, just fyi. They do have Heavy1 rending bolters if they don't move though.

I think my favorite part of this thread so far is that you have people studiously ignoring the incredibly heated rules argument that has dipped into being totally hostile, in favor of actually sharing stories.(a good way to both vent and feel connected to like minded players.)

Normally it would be derailing the thread but here it really adds to the overall experience. I mean, you hear this story about some guy doing something awful and go 'man how can people be like that?' and then you scroll down to one of the rules debate posts and go 'oh, that's how.'

I once jokingly told a guy at my store that you could fit a Wraithknight at 500 points.

Guess what he was rolling at the next 500 point Beginners tournament. And when I asked him what he was doing he said it was just fine, after all I was the one who originally brought it up.

There's some 14 year old kid with nothing more than Start Collecting! Space Marines and a Rhino who's only played two games before and he thinks it's okay to bring a Wraithknight.

What about rending is tailored against Daemons? Seems an odd choice.

Rihgu wrote:
What about rending is tailored against Daemons? Seems an odd choice.

For ignoring their armor on 6's of course. What else would it be for?

Rihgu wrote:
What about rending is tailored against Daemons? Seems an odd choice.

He thought the AP2 from Rending would help against Greater Daemons, it doesn't. He was upset about that.

I played Orks, he brings Ultramarines.
I played Necrons, he brings Ultramarines.
I played Daemons, he brings Grey Knights or a Space Marine Chapter he thought got extra VPs for every Daemon he killed.

 Hashbeth wrote:

I have sternguard near a rhino. Some sternguard can look over part of the rhino at a nearby squad (based on the nearby terrain). I get cover when they try to shoot and fail their charge.

I then try to shoot the enemy squad with the heavy flamer in this sternguard squad. It goes over the rhino somewhat but I can there's LoS from the Sternguard's head and shoulder. The opponent gets very upset and says it can't shoot through cover. After we argue about the rule, I say "well it's fine, they just won't do that and they'll just shoot normally w/o the flamer."

You can't shoot a flamer through terrain, they require LoS. Also, you cannot hit your own Rhino with your own flamer.

I have a semi recent example of TFG behavior.

Our local games, generally speaking, do not allow for Lords of War without at very least clearing it with your opponent beforehand. Double CAD, Formations, and Fortifications are all well & good, but if you want to bring a LoW it's understood you at least let you opponent know so they can bring one themselves or plan accordingly. Note, one does not have to say what kind of LoW they're bringing, but at least tell your opponent you're bringing one.

I set a game up with an opponent I've met and gotten to know over a couple of months. He's in his early to mid 20's, and a bit on the odd side, like he's trying really hard to impress everyone he meets with how bad ass he is with regular references to his military service (National Guard) and the fact that he's a prison guard. I'll also preface that I respect the guy for his military service and work he does in the Corrections field. I also work in law enforcement as a police officer, and have just over 8 years logged in my career so far. The guy constantly compares his job to mine and insists that his job is more dangerous at regular intervals. I usually just ignore the comments, and dismiss them with a change of subject, as both jobs come with very real dangers and comparing them is, in a word, superfluous. This constant comparison is grating over time, but I'm willing to give the guy a chance in hopes that during our game he'll focus on that, and not work.

Game day arrives and I get there early to set up the table and get terrain placed out. I'm running Imperial Guard with Blood Angels allied in. No fortification or anything 'competitive'. Just a singe CAD+Allied Detachment consisting of a couple of Leman Russes as HQ's (Not Pask, I'll note just a Vanquisher commander and an Exterminator squadron mate), a couple of Chimera mounted Veteran squads, a Griffon mortar tank, with the allied BA being a 5 man tactical squad in a rhino, a jump pack Captain, and a 5 man Command Squad with some storm shields. I think the point value was 1250 points for the game if my memory serves, as it was a week day game and we weren't going to have a ton of time for a large game.

He arrives and informs me he's running pure Tempestus Scions. Cool deal, I figure it'll be an interesting game with lots of drop squads and deep striking going on. He starts to set his army out and appears to finish. I'm looking at his force and doing the math in my head, then ask: "You running a couple of flyers or something? Your list looks a little small for 1250."

He laughs and says "Oh, I forgot to get something out" as he reaches into his bag and pulls out a mostly assembled (No carapace/shoulder armor) and partially painted Imperial Knight. I cock my head to the side, and comment "I believe I asked if you were bringing any lords of war with you when we set this game up, and you told me you weren't, what gives with the Knight?" He replies "I'm almost finished painting it and wanted to try it out."

I shrug and keep setting up, letting him know that in the future he needs to at least let his opponent know if he's bringing a lord of war, as it's common courtesy at the game store and among the playerbase to inform folks if there is or isn't going to be a LoW prior to the game. He then tried to tell me that the Knight wasn't a lord of war but an allied detachment to his scions. I gave him a stern look and let him know that the Imperial Knight is in the same category as an Eldar Wraithknight as far as power level, and is a Lord of War. He grudgingly agreed with me after being confronted.

I wind up winning the game by a combination of playing keep-away with the knight and feeding it chaff units while amassing objective points while focusing down the rest of his forces. By the end of the game he has just the knight left standing with half of its hull points removed. He constantly rules lawyered as we played, and made the entire game quite unpleasant with regular smoke breaks further delaying the game between the aforementioned job/work comparisons at regular intervals while we played.

I wished him well and told him good game at the end, and have not played him since. Not going to call the guy a pure TFG, but he's certainly one I plan to avoid playing unless in a tournament format and have no way to avoid it.

That's my story. Take it easy for now.

-Red__Thirst-

Thread is being locked due to thread necromancy.