Seems an odd thing to be angry about. A new model for Calgar wasn't necessary. I'm not going to buy it, and after deciding not to buy it, it ceases to have any effect on my life.
If GW decides that a new Aun'va will sell, the existence of an updated model for Calgar won't change the calculation on that either way.
Asmodai wrote: Seems an odd thing to be angry about. A new model for Calgar wasn't necessary. I'm not going to buy it, and after deciding not to buy it, it ceases to have any effect on my life.
If GW decides that a new Aun'va will sell, the existence of an updated model for Calgar won't change the calculation on that either way.
Well if that is how you view it, it is good. But imagine this point of view. You are a BA player and you think like this. Instead of designing BA models too look nice, turning DC in to a shoulder pad and removing wings or jump packs from Sang Priests, GW was working on another Calgar, more ultramarine units and special characters. And your codex came out this edition, so it is not like GW going to come and fix it with a second wave of releases. Or you are a GK player and wonder why your update was a upgrade sprue to NDK you already have probably max number you can take. An ultramarine player can say , well I already have a Calgar I don't need more, but a different faction of marines player can think that this could have been Karsaro on bike or Pedro Cantor.
There's nothing suggesting the DE release couldn't have dropped in a slightly less busy weekend in early 2024. Instead they've dragged it out until near the presumed end of the edition.
Space Marines are going to Space Marine. GW have long decided they should get 2 releases an edition - and they probably sell well so I don't really blame them for that. In some respects it probably speaks to GW's development cycle - because I assume this new Calgar got greenlit after the success of Space Marine 2 about a year ago.
Thus, if you are offering me an apology for the tone of your prior post, I am happy to accept it. I will likewise apologise if my response came across as overly angry/aggressive.
All good man- the break from forums yesterday did wonders for me. I finished my painting challenge- A Haemonculus, 5 Wracks, 5 Mandrakes and a Court of the Archon; most of it had already been completed, but I had three wracks that needed finishing, and the deadline was today, so staying away from forum posts was a good thing. I flubbed my last three painting challenges in a row, so this one was really important to me. I'll be posting the tale of the Crusade soon. Posting creative stuff is less contentious than rules debate.
Anyway, you my apology and I accept yours- peace man.
Tyel wrote: Tbh the rub for me with DE is "why now?"
There's nothing suggesting the DE release couldn't have dropped in a slightly less busy weekend in early 2024. Instead they've dragged it out until near the presumed end of the edition.
Maybe GW was umming and ahhing over whether to release the bigger update for this edition or leave it for a later year, and delayed the release until after management made up their mind.
Thus, if you are offering me an apology for the tone of your prior post, I am happy to accept it. I will likewise apologise if my response came across as overly angry/aggressive.
All good man- the break from forums yesterday did wonders for me. I finished my painting challenge- A Haemonculus, 5 Wracks, 5 Mandrakes and a Court of the Archon; most of it had already been completed, but I had three wracks that needed finishing, and the deadline was today, so staying away from forum posts was a good thing. I flubbed my last three painting challenges in a row, so this one was really important to me. I'll be posting the tale of the Crusade soon. Posting creative stuff is less contentious than rules debate.
Anyway, you my apology and I accept yours- peace man.
Glad we're back on good terms.
Also cool to hear that you finished your painting challenge.
Though, a little sad that the models included the now-removed Court of the Archon. Hope you can find an alternative use for them.
Odd that they say that captain is not limeted, but joining the SM range. We just got a JP captain. Now this guy is significantly better looking then the old guy, just odd to have 2 in fairly recent times.
We heard you like Smash Captains so here's another Captain with Jump Pack. No of course we couldn't have included these weapons in the other kit. BUY IT AGAIN!
Also: told you there were going to be Marine characters!
I don't mind the calgar thing knowing how the pipeline works, and that the modeling team gets 100% control over what gets made. It's not a financial thing, they just had something they wanted to make and were proud of it. The new victrix are a big improvement so hey, fine.
But man, I really wish they'd get the same desire to do named chaos marines. Iron Warriors, Word Bearers, and Night Lords have never had a named character. Alpha Legion only had a forgeworld one for Vraks. That leaves just Black Legion as a legion with any plastic named characters... and Red Corsairs as renegades.
Astmeister wrote: Are they silently letting Primaris die with this release?
You mean the distinction between Primaris and Firstborn? That effectively went away with the Codex, when they removed all the "Primaris" versions of the character models and made them the defaults for Captain, Librarian, Apothecary, etc.
parakuribo wrote: This isnt just toy soldiers when one of them, who got the Primaris treatment in 8th, does not need another sculpt!
8th was seven years ago, and Marneus has traditionally had the ability to take either power armour or terminator armour. I don't see a problem with more options. I thought that was what your crowd wanted.
parakuribo wrote: This isnt just toy soldiers when one of them, who got the Primaris treatment in 8th, does not need another sculpt!
8th was seven years ago, and Marneus has traditionally had the ability to take either power armour or terminator armour. I don't see a problem with more options. I thought that was what your crowd wanted.
It would be nice if they kept both models and both datasheets, but that seems unlikely.
I don’t think any UM players really were asking for a new Calgar. Sicarius and new HG? Maybe.
I’d personally preferred they used the release slot and sculptor time to fill more needed gaps in other ranges. But GW is going to make what they think is going to sell and make their numbers look good. It’s not that marine players ask for all this , but we do open our wallets for it, so GW delivers.
I just find it hilarious Cato sicarius has his name on a banner, not ultramarines, not ultramar, not courage and honor, just his own name. Of course he’d carry around a big banner in his own name, because he, Cato sicarius, deserved more honor and recognition than everyone else.
Is there any rumors about IG vehicles remodeling? I know we have "new" dorn and new sentinel, but we have all other like russ and chimera derivatives which looks a bit old may be
There's a bunch of models like Falcons, Vypers, Carnifex, IG Tanks - that are all pretty long in the tooth. That said a good few of the tanks like the Leman Russ have had a good few revisions over the years.
Meanwhile I think the Eldar and Tyranid ones I noted have been almost untouched since they originally came out.
Right now I've heard rumour of the Eldar getting an update but nothing on IG
MajorWesJanson wrote: To give Ultramarines a unique unit of their own to bring them more on par with the other first founding chapters who have multiple unique units and models plus all the basic sm stuff?
You mean, you think that the personification of the Codex Astartes should get snowflake units? Should the other five Codex-compliant chapters start getting all sorts of unique kits?
MajorWesJanson wrote: To give Ultramarines a unique unit of their own to bring them more on par with the other first founding chapters who have multiple unique units and models plus all the basic sm stuff?
You mean, you think that the personification of the Codex Astartes should get snowflake units? Should the other five Codex-compliant chapters start getting all sorts of unique kits?
Yes. Same for the legions. Nemesis Claw was a good start, I want more.
Not sure those minimal changes justified a new model as it looks from a glance like just a Malibu Marneus with new hat situation even more than normally for GW. The victrix look pretty nice though.
MajorWesJanson wrote: To give Ultramarines a unique unit of their own to bring them more on par with the other first founding chapters who have multiple unique units and models plus all the basic sm stuff?
You mean, you think that the personification of the Codex Astartes should get snowflake units? Should the other five Codex-compliant chapters start getting all sorts of unique kits?
I never thought about this before and went back to some older Space Marine codecies...
When they lay out the "Codex Compliant Force Org. Chart," I don't see "Honor Guard for Chapter Master."
Does this mean that the Ultramarines aren't Codex Astartes compliant after all?
Roboute has been revising the codex, chapters are allowed to go over 10 companies now. The ultramarines have essentially 11 and a half now, with an extra scout and honour guard company.
In 4th, they were introduced as a UM unit. The members were not part of a specific squad, but were brothers from different companies who had earned the high honors of serving. So it did not mater what companies were on Mcragge, there would be suitable marines present to fill the role.
In 5th, they went more generic, and in the marine org chart, they are included in chapter command.
How things are organized has changed over the years, especially as GW releases more models.
Edit: The 1,000 marines has always be line strength, not total strength. If you add up all the command squads, specialists, etc, you end up with closer to 1,500+ marines.
kabaakaba wrote: Is there any rumors about IG vehicles remodeling? I know we have "new" dorn and new sentinel, but we have all other like russ and chimera derivatives which looks a bit old may be
The current Russ and Chimera are fairly recent. The original plastic kits were much more difficult to build, although I liked the extra vehicle accessory sprue that came with them.
I don't think GW is in a hurry to redesign the current sprues.
JB wrote: The current Russ and Chimera are fairly recent.
The current Imperial Guard Leman Russ/Chimera are from 5th edition are they not? They came along side the plastic Valkyrie. So that would make them what... Around 2008/9ish off the top of my head? I wouldn't exactly call that recent.
JB wrote: The current Russ and Chimera are fairly recent.
The current Imperial Guard Leman Russ/Chimera are from 5th edition are they not? They came along side the plastic Valkyrie. So that would make them what... Around 2008/9ish off the top of my head? I wouldn't exactly call that recent.
It also makes me feel really quite old.
Well they're not SPACE MARINE recent - Calgar is replaced after 7 years. But for Xenos recent they're practically babies...
JB wrote: The current Russ and Chimera are fairly recent.
The current Imperial Guard Leman Russ/Chimera are from 5th edition are they not? They came along side the plastic Valkyrie. So that would make them what... Around 2008/9ish off the top of my head? I wouldn't exactly call that recent.
It also makes me feel really quite old.
2007 for the Russ tank and likely for the Chimera as well so you are correct. They are not recent updates. This isn't the right thread to discuss which faction has older vehicle models, but they are among the oldest now. Nonetheless, I don't think GW has any reason to change them.
JB wrote: The current Russ and Chimera are fairly recent.
The current Imperial Guard Leman Russ/Chimera are from 5th edition are they not? They came along side the plastic Valkyrie. So that would make them what... Around 2008/9ish off the top of my head? I wouldn't exactly call that recent.
Edit:
The 1,000 marines has always be line strength, not total strength. If you add up all the command squads, specialists, etc, you end up with closer to 1,500+ marines.
To say nothing of Rhino drivers.
I still say Rhino drivers (+Land Raider, Predator etc) are actually servitors, perhaps crippled marines turned into servitors, but that's just me.
I think the issue with age is also whether the model is any good or not. Not really convinced a high definition version of the Leman Russ would meaningfully do anything.
The Falcon is ancient. But maybe it's bias, I still think it's a great model.
Arguably this is the issue for plastic DE. Sure the sculpts are from 15~ years ago, but most of them hold up well. I can't see "New Kabalites" being a dramatic improvement. Same for Wyches.
Which is why I wouldn't want replacements, I'd want new stuff.
Astmeister wrote: Are they silently letting Primaris die with this release?
That was my thought with these releases; Calgar is a lot less Primaris-y than the previous version and it does feel like they are slow walking back to the older style of marines.
Astmeister wrote: Are they silently letting Primaris die with this release?
That was my thought with these releases; Calgar is a lot less Primaris-y than the previous version and it does feel like they are slow walking back to the older style of marines.
He looks less Primaris because he's in Terminator armor.
Also, did anyone else catch this at the end?
WarCom wrote:As for what this means for the Space Marines of the Ultramarines Chapter, we’ll have more news later in the year. Stay tuned to Warhammer Community for all the latest news.
Feels like they're setting us up for Codex Supplement: Ultramarines.
Tyel wrote: I think the issue with age is also whether the model is any good or not. Not really convinced a high definition version of the Leman Russ would meaningfully do anything.
The Falcon is ancient. But maybe it's bias, I still think it's a great model.
Arguably this is the issue for plastic DE. Sure the sculpts are from 15~ years ago, but most of them hold up well. I can't see "New Kabalites" being a dramatic improvement. Same for Wyches.
Which is why I wouldn't want replacements, I'd want new stuff.
Falcon, aesthetics wise, does still hold up. But, as a kit it’s showing its age. Very bare Sprues, could potentially do with some crisper detailing etc.
Not a fan of the new UM. Nice bitz for UM players, thats about it. I'm kind of giving up hope on 40K marines, 30K marines seem way cooler nowadays, 40K gets more derp with each passing year.. or its just the paintjobs, I dont know..
Tyel wrote: I think the issue with age is also whether the model is any good or not. Not really convinced a high definition version of the Leman Russ would meaningfully do anything.
The Falcon is ancient. But maybe it's bias, I still think it's a great model.
Arguably this is the issue for plastic DE. Sure the sculpts are from 15~ years ago, but most of them hold up well. I can't see "New Kabalites" being a dramatic improvement. Same for Wyches.
Which is why I wouldn't want replacements, I'd want new stuff.
Falcon, aesthetics wise, does still hold up. But, as a kit it’s showing its age. Very bare Sprues, could potentially do with some crisper detailing etc.
The “soft” details is a little bit more forgivable on the curves of the falcon, but the sprues are so sparse compared to the new ones. Just updating to how tight they pack modern kits onto the frames, they could probably fit all the Eldar tanks (falcon/WS/FP/NS) into the same number of sprues used for just the falcon. OK, I may be slightly exaggerating, but not a whole lot. Old sprues are just that roomy compared to now.
The “soft” details is a little bit more forgivable on the curves of the falcon, but the sprues are so sparse compared to the new ones. Just updating to how tight they pack modern kits onto the frames, they could probably fit all the Eldar tanks (falcon/WS/FP/NS) into the same number of sprues used for just the falcon. OK, I may be slightly exaggerating, but not a whole lot. Old sprues are just that roomy compared to now.
I don't know that making a more densely packed sprue is really the goal here. The Falcon/Serpent kit is old, from the pre-digital era. It does not fit well, and has clear imperfections in the surface texture and details. It should just be redone to bring it up to modern standards of quality.
The “soft” details is a little bit more forgivable on the curves of the falcon, but the sprues are so sparse compared to the new ones. Just updating to how tight they pack modern kits onto the frames, they could probably fit all the Eldar tanks (falcon/WS/FP/NS) into the same number of sprues used for just the falcon. OK, I may be slightly exaggerating, but not a whole lot. Old sprues are just that roomy compared to now.
I don't know that making a more densely packed sprue is really the goal here. The Falcon/Serpent kit is old, from the pre-digital era. It does not fit well, and has clear imperfections in the surface texture and details. It should just be redone to bring it up to modern standards of quality.
There are a number of reasons for it needing to be redone, and also many reasons to let the old kit slide.
While old, it still fits aesthetically with modern stuff. The only big thing is the pilot is still sporting a leather jacket.
Until recently there was SO many more models in the eldar range that needed an update far worse then it.
If they did the falcon, they would either need to design it to be compatible with all the variants, or do them all at once.
Sculpting time and release slots are not infinite. There are a lot of things that should be done, but aren’t.
Which makes the new Calgar a little irritating. Not needed, not wanted, but here we are…
The White Dwarf conversion guide gave the Serpent scales along the undersides of the wings. Of course now we have Serpent Scales which project energy fields, but Serpents don't actually have scales...
Tyel wrote:I think the issue with age is also whether the model is any good or not. Not really convinced a high definition version of the Leman Russ would meaningfully do anything.
The Falcon is ancient. But maybe it's bias, I still think it's a great model.
Arguably this is the issue for plastic DE. Sure the sculpts are from 15~ years ago, but most of them hold up well. I can't see "New Kabalites" being a dramatic improvement. Same for Wyches.
Which is why I wouldn't want replacements, I'd want new stuff.
The Falcon is so ancient that when it was first introduced, there was an article in WD that explained how they used pantography machines to cut molds from 3-ups, because doing models in CAD was like, another 10-15 years off at the time.
Arschbombe wrote:
MarkNorfolk wrote: The Epic 40,000 era early version was a bit better, with an actual wave emitter between the bows.
The original FW Wave Serpent was a resin kit based around the plastic Falcon kit and included the bit between the prows.
The original original Wave Serpent is another article in WD explaining how you can make a serpent turret out of spare shuriken cannons and the bowl of a plastic spoon (and green stuff)
Nope. The Legion Basilisk and Medusa had a Chimera chassis though.
The HH Solar Auxilia Basilisk/Medusa uses a Leman hull. The 40K Astra Militarum Basilisk, Manticore/Deathstrike, and Hydra/Wyvern all use the Chimera hull. I’m curious what the lore is for when and where the guns changed chassises.
I don’t think there has been a Chimera in the HH game. IIRC several are destroyed in the Lion El'Jonson Primarch book.
Nope. The Legion Basilisk and Medusa had a Chimera chassis though.
The HH Solar Auxilia Basilisk/Medusa uses a Leman hull.
The Solar Auxiliary artillery tanks and the Legion equivalents are not the same. The Legion Basilisk uses what looks like an up-armoured chimera chassis as its base.
As for when the switch happened, some time after the Scouring. As for why? Economics, probably. The marines stopped using artillery, and the newly minted Imperial Guard was suddenly at the mercy of the Administratum rather than being an adjunct of the Crusade and thus suddenly had to deal with budgets.
Also worth noting that despite calling it the chimaera hull, the deep lore is that chimaeras are actually retrofitted basilisks, not the other way around. So some time after the Guard started using stripped down legion basilisks, someone discovered that you could take the big gun out, put in some seats, stick a turret on top and go zoom.
Nope. The Legion Basilisk and Medusa had a Chimera chassis though.
The HH Solar Auxilia Basilisk/Medusa uses a Leman hull.
The Solar Auxiliary artillery tanks and the Legion equivalents are not the same. The Legion Basilisk uses what looks like an up-armoured chimera chassis as its base.
As for when the switch happened, some time after the Scouring. As for why? Economics, probably. The marines stopped using artillery, and the newly minted Imperial Guard was suddenly at the mercy of the Administratum rather than being an adjunct of the Crusade and thus suddenly had to deal with budgets.
Also worth noting that despite calling it the chimaera hull, the deep lore is that chimaeras are actually retrofitted basilisks, not the other way around. So some time after the Guard started using stripped down legion basilisks, someone discovered that you could take the big gun out, put in some seats, stick a turret on top and go zoom.
Lion El’Johnson: Lord of the First published 2020. This book takes place before both the Heresy and Scouring. One of the older Forge World Basilisk variants looks like it used a modified Chimera hull but the current Legion one the GW site is definitely a Leman hull.
Kid_Kyoto wrote: Back on topic, sorry for knocking things off...
So what else might we expect? more Ultramarines?
Valrak seemed pretty convinced about Assault Terminators coming alongside an updated Marine Dex in advance of an all Terminator Christmas box.
Though it seems odd to me that they would do an entire end of edition update to Marines only to immediately dump the models into a discount box.
I guess they could take the opportunity to make an upcoming SM Codex an 11th edition Codex ahead of the launch, but that seems unlikely given how they are literally always the first Codex release of an edition. It may also be that there is no full Codex and it's just an update like the RG and Salamanders got.
Kid_Kyoto wrote: Back on topic, sorry for knocking things off...
So what else might we expect? more Ultramarines?
Valrak seemed pretty convinced about Assault Terminators coming alongside an updated Marine Dex in advance of an all Terminator Christmas box.
Though it seems odd to me that they would do an entire end of edition update to Marines only to immediately dump the models into a discount box.
It would probably be a bunch of existing models, one squad of assault terminators, and a new terminator character like they did with Deathwing Assault (2x DW terminators, new character and new Deathwing knights)
So GW shared an article about the upcoming Knights codex, am I the only one let down by the exclusion of the Cerastus Knights? I mean, they have plastic models, so that excuse doesn’t comply…
Malika2 wrote: So GW shared an article about the upcoming Knights codex, am I the only one let down by the exclusion of the Cerastus Knights? I mean, they have plastic models, so that excuse doesn’t comply…
They're 30k models, and you can't cross the (revenue) streams...
Kid_Kyoto wrote: Back on topic, sorry for knocking things off...
So what else might we expect? more Ultramarines?
Valrak seemed pretty convinced about Assault Terminators coming alongside an updated Marine Dex in advance of an all Terminator Christmas box.
Though it seems odd to me that they would do an entire end of edition update to Marines only to immediately dump the models into a discount box.
That happened in 2023 too. GW released new Tyranid & Marine models in Autumn, then put some of them straight into the xmas boxes a couple of months later. It's why I think we'll get the assault terminator announcement very soon, so GW can sell the indivdually boxed versions before announcing the discount.
Valrak has also mentioned an updated Gulliman model and vanguard vets, so there could be quite a decent-sized release coming before the holidays.
Kid_Kyoto wrote: Back on topic, sorry for knocking things off...
So what else might we expect? more Ultramarines?
Valrak seemed pretty convinced about Assault Terminators coming alongside an updated Marine Dex in advance of an all Terminator Christmas box.
Though it seems odd to me that they would do an entire end of edition update to Marines only to immediately dump the models into a discount box.
It would probably be a bunch of existing models, one squad of assault terminators, and a new terminator character like they did with Deathwing Assault (2x DW terminators, new character and new Deathwing knights)
Spoiler:
Right, but the rumor is specifically that it's a box of Terminators, Assault Terminators, a Terminator Ancient, a Terminator Chaplain, and a Terminator Captain; all in the new BIG-inator scale. But currently the Assault Terminators are the old 6th(?) Ed small-inators, so GW would have to release Assault BIG-inators sometime between now and December to make that possible.
xttz wrote:That happened in 2023 too. GW released new Tyranid & Marine models in Autumn, then put some of them straight into the xmas boxes a couple of months later. It's why I think we'll get the assault terminator announcement very soon, so GW can sell the indivdually boxed versions before announcing the discount.
Valrak has also mentioned an updated Gulliman model and vanguard vets, so there could be quite a decent-sized release coming before the holidays.
Fair point on the Tyranids, I couldn't remember if that had happened or not.
Regarding V.Vets, Valrak recently said that 11th Ed launch going to be a wave of Marine Fast Attack, supposedly with:
Devastator Captain
new Landspeeder variant
nu-Tactical Squad
Vanguard Veterans
Flame-based Dreadnaught variant
Multipart Outriders
So if that's accurate then there won't be new V.Vets until next Summer/Fall
New thing + old stuff in big box --> later --> New thing separate
New thing individually --> include in bundle later
And launch box type bundles deal don’t always contain the entire wave.
And what if things were mislabeled from that rumor? In the WarCom article, the Victrix Guard are noted as being from the 1st company. If I told you we were expecting a new terminator hero and some 1st company vets, including an ancient and some CC boys, you might automatically convey the TDA to the second half of that. Especially as new assault terminators should be pretty high up on GW’s to-do list.
I hate to say “wait and see” but until we get at least a potatocam pic, I’m not holding my breath. So many way this could happen, with precedent for all of it. GW is not exactly consistent.
As for what other things could be in store for the Ultras,
They did not specify minis. It could be story/lore progression, a BL novel, or just an event centered around them.
For minis, there are still plenty of characters they could dust off and primarisize. Cassius, Cronos, Talion. Or any of the many who are name dropped but never got specific models.
They could do more with Tyranic War Veterans. We got a taste of what that could look like with the phobos combi vet. We could get a whole squad of grizzed vets from the Tyranic wars.
Malika2 wrote: So GW shared an article about the upcoming Knights codex, am I the only one let down by the exclusion of the Cerastus Knights? I mean, they have plastic models, so that excuse doesn’t comply…
None of the 30k Knights are in the codex. However, the Imperial Armor files will be updated and valid.
Malika2 wrote: So GW shared an article about the upcoming Knights codex, am I the only one let down by the exclusion of the Cerastus Knights? I mean, they have plastic models, so that excuse doesn’t comply…
They're 30k models, and you can't cross the (revenue) streams...
Just repackage them and done! I don’t see the issue here.
Just repackage them and done! I don’t see the issue here.
Unfortunately, I see the issue GW has with introducing the Cerastus to the 40K codex, as it would mean three £125 boxes to be added to their shelf space in their high street stores.
That said, they could make a new 40K-specific Cerastus kit that can build two new variants that are designed to reuse more components. For example, they don't have weapons that require ammo-belts or large fuel packs, and share the same head and shoulder pads.
In hindsight, I think a plastic Mechanicum Questoris kit would have been the best introduction to the 40K codex for 10th edition - building both the Styrix and Magaera. Throw in some Skiitari profiles for the Xmas detachment...we could have been having a real party for 10th edition. Then in 11th edition introduce a plastic kit for the Moirax. Instead...we get a friggin void shield that nobody asked for and two almost similar kits...
I get why 30k and 40k marines are kept separate. Not just for the financial siloing, but to prevent bloat. There is already too many marine kits to balance without dumping in all the 30k ones.
But knights? They have little enough they should just integrate.
Funny how they call out the DKoK ones as great for building armies as every unit is good to double up on…
…while the Harli one has a Solitaire, where you can only have 1 in your army.
Now would have been the perfect time to introduce a new Troupe Master model, but this honestly isn't a problem as you can easily kitbash the second Solitaire into a Troupe Master, or even as a Lead Player for Kill Team. There are going to be plenty of left over components from this new box set to accomplish this.
Even if you don't want to use the second Solitaire as a different character, there are going to be two Harlequins left over from the Star/Void weaver sprues that definitely make for easy Troupe Masters, which look very different from Lead Players. Only thing is you need to buy the extra bases for them, but for £3 its worth it for two Troupe Masters.
Also, you can paint the second Solitaire up for Blackstone Fortress as an "army of one".
Kreig aren't my cup of tea, being honest, but it seems a varied box all the same. Depends if they're popular with Krieg Bronies - sorry - Kreig players.
Kreig aren't my cup of tea, being honest, but it seems a varied box all the same. Depends if they're popular with Krieg Bronies - sorry - Kreig players.
I mean, the only other thing they were likely to put in instead was the combat eng, so I think they give it more variety. But I can see it sucking if you bought the army box. I didn't, so think this is a decent IG combat patrol especially given the demise of the old Cadian one (which was probably top 5/10 in combat patrols ever).
Right, but the rumor is specifically that it's a box of Terminators, Assault Terminators, a Terminator Ancient, a Terminator Chaplain, and a Terminator Captain; all in the new BIG-inator scale. But currently the Assault Terminators are the old 6th(?) Ed small-inators, so GW would have to release Assault BIG-inators sometime between now and December to make that possible.
Sure I'm not doubting the arrival of assault termies, just saying there's precedent for brand new products being bundled into a big box splash release or otherwise available through non-standard SKUs, often at a discount.
I like how the harli CP feels very self contained. You can embark all troupe and it’s all fast moving jetbike/skimmer things. The kind of force that might just show up and fight alongside another, without worrying about how the footsloggers/support elements got there.
Some patrols feel like a random mish-mash of units just chucked into the box. This one feels coherent.
Slightly sad to see that DkoK cavalry in there, I've been waiting for this box for a while and if it had 15-20 more infantry bodies instead it would be the perfect companion to the DkoK army box.
Malika2 wrote: So GW shared an article about the upcoming Knights codex, am I the only one let down by the exclusion of the Cerastus Knights? I mean, they have plastic models, so that excuse doesn’t comply…
They're 30k models, and you can't cross the (revenue) streams...
Yeah, there is no way they would have Armigers and Questoris in 30k, so why would the Cerastus go to 40k.
Nevelon wrote: I like how the harli CP feels very self contained. You can embark all troupe and it’s all fast moving jetbike/skimmer things. The kind of force that might just show up and fight alongside another, without worrying about how the footsloggers/support elements got there.
Some patrols feel like a random mish-mash of units just chucked into the box. This one feels coherent.
I must say that while I was impressed with the Twilight Cavalcade, this is even more better. Maybe one unit too many in comparison to most other patrols( most are 430-ish points ), but its a good mix of kits indeed.
I'm a bit miffed that GW didn't release this sooner in 10th edition's life. Its all old kits and without a coinciding codex book release there was no reason to hold this set back. Given how similar the lists are for both patrols, the Twilight Cavalcade could have been the later patrol with only the additional cost of a Shadowseer and a second Troupe kit. Once again, the Troupe Master easily kitbashed from left over components from the bundle.
Still, I'm happy with it and only need to spend £22 on a Starweaver kit to complete the patrol.
Is Calgar just gone from the store now? I was half expecting them to keep both models available since the current one is so new. I grabbed two of him predicting this, I'm gonna paint up a full 10 man honor guard squad for display and wanted those sword and board victrix. Four of them plus two victrix boxes will do the trick.
Midnightdeathblade wrote: Is Calgar just gone from the store now? I was half expecting them to keep both models available since the current one is so new. I grabbed two of him predicting this, I'm gonna paint up a full 10 man honor guard squad for display and wanted those sword and board victrix. Four of them plus two victrix boxes will do the trick.
Given how the new kit specifies he is Marneus Calgar in Armour of Antilochus, there's at least a chance that the old kit will be made available again in new packaging and usable via a different datasheet.
If that happened I'd expect that it would be a fixed size unit of old Calgar & 2 guards, while the new terminator Calgar model can join a varaible 3-6 model unit of Victrix guard without shields.
Midnightdeathblade wrote: Is Calgar just gone from the store now? I was half expecting them to keep both models available since the current one is so new. I grabbed two of him predicting this, I'm gonna paint up a full 10 man honor guard squad for display and wanted those sword and board victrix. Four of them plus two victrix boxes will do the trick.
It will be interesting to see how the kits are laid out. With a little luck, the Victrix and the Bladeguard Veterans will work together. So if you wanted some sword and board victrix, you might be able to kitbash your own.
Fingers crossed we see rules for both versions in the codex.
Aside from being Ultramarines-specific. those Victrix models suffer from wearing the dumbest-looking helmets in the history of Space Marines. The Aquilastache helmet looked dumb on that one Captain kit ages ago - spreading it to a whole unit?
Malika2 wrote: So GW shared an article about the upcoming Knights codex, am I the only one let down by the exclusion of the Cerastus Knights? I mean, they have plastic models, so that excuse doesn’t comply…
They're 30k models, and you can't cross the (revenue) streams...
Yeah, there is no way they would have Armigers and Questoris in 30k, so why would the Cerastus go to 40k.
BorderCountess wrote: Aside from being Ultramarines-specific. those Victrix models suffer from wearing the dumbest-looking helmets in the history of Space Marines. The Aquilastache helmet looked dumb on that one Captain kit ages ago - spreading it to a whole unit?
Hard pass.
Ultramarines Honour Guard had them before that Captain did, except without the mouth grille he had that makes it really look like a mustache
It'd be weird if the Victrix lacked such an iconic look (especially since Gravis Calgar already established they have them already)
BorderCountess wrote: Aside from being Ultramarines-specific. those Victrix models suffer from wearing the dumbest-looking helmets in the history of Space Marines. The Aquilastache helmet looked dumb on that one Captain kit ages ago - spreading it to a whole unit?
Hard pass.
Ultramarines Honour Guard had them before that Captain did, except without the mouth grille he had that makes it really look like a mustache
It'd be weird if the Victrix lacked such an iconic look (especially since Gravis Calgar already established they have them already)
It’s a little silly, but also iconic. I’m glad they kept it.
Only the Alpha Legion may wear the Aquila on their chests. They turn out to be traitors, so the privilege is extended to all loyalist chapters. To be extra special, the Ultramarines start slapping the symbol on their faces as well as their chests.
Malika2 wrote: So GW shared an article about the upcoming Knights codex, am I the only one let down by the exclusion of the Cerastus Knights? I mean, they have plastic models, so that excuse doesn’t comply…
They're 30k models, and you can't cross the (revenue) streams...
Yeah, there is no way they would have Armigers and Questoris in 30k, so why would the Cerastus go to 40k.
But there are Questoris in 30k, just look at LImp
I know, that was the point We obviously, already have models that double in both systems. The facepalm was directed at beast_gts. but I admit, I was not clear in my communication
Malika2 wrote: So GW shared an article about the upcoming Knights codex, am I the only one let down by the exclusion of the Cerastus Knights? I mean, they have plastic models, so that excuse doesn’t comply…
They're 30k models, and you can't cross the (revenue) streams...
Yeah, there is no way they would have Armigers and Questoris in 30k, so why would the Cerastus go to 40k.
But there are Questoris in 30k, just look at LImp
Sorry, I was checking this stuff on my phone and totally overlooked the facepalm. My bad!
I know, that was the point We obviously, already have models that double in both systems. The facepalm was directed at beast_gts. but I admit, I was not clear in my communication
Malika2 wrote: So GW shared an article about the upcoming Knights codex, am I the only one let down by the exclusion of the Cerastus Knights? I mean, they have plastic models, so that excuse doesn’t comply…
They're 30k models, and you can't cross the (revenue) streams...
Yeah, there is no way they would have Armigers and Questoris in 30k, so why would the Cerastus go to 40k.
But there are Questoris in 30k, just look at LImp
I know, that was the point We obviously, already have models that double in both systems. The facepalm was directed at beast_gts. but I admit, I was not clear in my communication
It's unfair to direct it at beast_gts and not GW. Keeping models to a single system for no doubt idiotic corporate reasons is a policy we've been able to observe for a few years now. But it wouldn't be GW if they were consistent about it.
BorderCountess wrote: Aside from being Ultramarines-specific. those Victrix models suffer from wearing the dumbest-looking helmets in the history of Space Marines. The Aquilastache helmet looked dumb on that one Captain kit ages ago - spreading it to a whole unit?
BorderCountess wrote: Aside from being Ultramarines-specific. those Victrix models suffer from wearing the dumbest-looking helmets in the history of Space Marines. The Aquilastache helmet looked dumb on that one Captain kit ages ago - spreading it to a whole unit?
Hard pass.
Just so I'm clear, you like this helmet better?
If we are helmet shaming to find the worst, I always hated the pig snout helm that came with the VV kit.
Flinty wrote: I’ve always liked the wolf helms. That specific one is maybe a bit derpy, but I like the concept.
I always thought there'd be a good opportunity to make a variety of animal themed helmets. The idea's loosely inspired by the stargate helmets (if you squint a bit and with fewer Egyptian influences) but it would be a nice bonus for all kinds of animal themed chapters to give their special units or leaders.
I actually do really like that specific head. Huge upgrade over the one from the old plastic unit and nowhere near as goofy as the MIA horus heresy upgrade
Malika2 wrote: So GW shared an article about the upcoming Knights codex, am I the only one let down by the exclusion of the Cerastus Knights? I mean, they have plastic models, so that excuse doesn’t comply…
They're 30k models, and you can't cross the (revenue) streams...
Yeah, there is no way they would have Armigers and Questoris in 30k, so why would the Cerastus go to 40k.
But there are Questoris in 30k, just look at LImp
I know, that was the point We obviously, already have models that double in both systems. The facepalm was directed at beast_gts. but I admit, I was not clear in my communication
Flinty wrote: I’ve always liked the wolf helms. That specific one is maybe a bit derpy, but I like the concept.
I always thought there'd be a good opportunity to make a variety of animal themed helmets. The idea's loosely inspired by the stargate helmets (if you squint a bit and with fewer Egyptian influences) but it would be a nice bonus for all kinds of animal themed chapters to give their special units or leaders.
BorderCountess wrote: Aside from being Ultramarines-specific. those Victrix models suffer from wearing the dumbest-looking helmets in the history of Space Marines. The Aquilastache helmet looked dumb on that one Captain kit ages ago - spreading it to a whole unit?
BorderCountess wrote: Aside from being Ultramarines-specific. those Victrix models suffer from wearing the dumbest-looking helmets in the history of Space Marines. The Aquilastache helmet looked dumb on that one Captain kit ages ago - spreading it to a whole unit?
Hard pass.
Just so I'm clear, you like this helmet better?
As compared to the Aquilastache? Absolutely.
I always knew you had a soft spot for the Space Wolves.
BorderCountess wrote: Aside from being Ultramarines-specific. those Victrix models suffer from wearing the dumbest-looking helmets in the history of Space Marines. The Aquilastache helmet looked dumb on that one Captain kit ages ago - spreading it to a whole unit?
Hard pass.
Just so I'm clear, you like this helmet better?
As compared to the Aquilastache? Absolutely.
I always knew you had a soft spot for the Space Wolves.
Oh. Yeah I saw it. It's...not great, but it's not the worst design GW did.
The go-kart and wolf helmet is still worse.
But then again, I find most of GW's recent designs to be mediocre.
BorderCountess wrote: Aside from being Ultramarines-specific. those Victrix models suffer from wearing the dumbest-looking helmets in the history of Space Marines. The Aquilastache helmet looked dumb on that one Captain kit ages ago - spreading it to a whole unit?
Flinty wrote: I’ve always liked the wolf helms. That specific one is maybe a bit derpy, but I like the concept.
I always thought there'd be a good opportunity to make a variety of animal themed helmets. The idea's loosely inspired by the stargate helmets (if you squint a bit and with fewer Egyptian influences) but it would be a nice bonus for all kinds of animal themed chapters to give their special units or leaders.
There’s also a fairly weighty reveal on Monday, which is currently prepping for a speedy arrival in the hallowed halls of a battle barge high in orbit…
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Dark Eldar next week. Also lists Wracks as a new release, I presume it’s a larger set of 10?
Unexpected, but about damn time. Having one of the three core 'troop' units of the faction cost twice as much in cash while being about the same in points as the others was not good. They'll probably still be more expensive than warriors or wyches though, probably.
There’s also a fairly weighty reveal on Monday, which is currently prepping for a speedy arrival in the hallowed halls of a battle barge high in orbit…
Terminators? On a...no. It can't be that.
That sounds like a fat Space Marine. I now expect a fat Space Marine. I'll be thoroughly disappointed if it isn't a fat Space Marine.
There’s also a fairly weighty reveal on Monday, which is currently prepping for a speedy arrival in the hallowed halls of a battle barge high in orbit…
Terminators? On a...no. It can't be that.
That sounds like a fat Space Marine. I now expect a fat Space Marine. I'll be thoroughly disappointed if it isn't a fat Space Marine.
There's already a whole faction of them.
As for the Thuderhawk: Since they're obviously so keen to capitalize on Space Marine 2, is there really much else they can do in that regard?
There’s also a fairly weighty reveal on Monday, which is currently prepping for a speedy arrival in the hallowed halls of a battle barge high in orbit…
Terminators? On a...no. It can't be that.
That sounds like a fat Space Marine. I now expect a fat Space Marine. I'll be thoroughly disappointed if it isn't a fat Space Marine.
There's already a whole faction of them.
As for the Thuderhawk: Since they're obviously so keen to capitalize on Space Marine 2, is there really much else they can do in that regard?
I mean, they're swapping out Gravis-Calgar for a terminator version, despite how iconic he was in that game so I dunno how much they're trying to capitalize now
They could do an oddball and make a terminator version of the heroes unit- a command squad of a Lieutenant, ancient, champion, and couple extras in tda
This is the most important model that needs to be released!
I definitely want this for real. With all the joking about the amount of primaris lieutenants aside, we actually lack compatible lieutenants for a lot of units. We need jump lieutenants, gravis lieutenants, bike lieutenants (though here we lack captains too,) and of course terminator lieutenants.
There’s also a fairly weighty reveal on Monday, which is currently prepping for a speedy arrival in the hallowed halls of a battle barge high in orbit…
Terminators? On a...no. It can't be that.
That sounds like a fat Space Marine. I now expect a fat Space Marine. I'll be thoroughly disappointed if it isn't a fat Space Marine.
There's already a whole faction of them.
Yeah, but they're stinky traitors. Now that Calgar is going back to terminator armor and Captain Cato Sicarius fills the blinged Tacticus niche, now is the time for the glorious return of Gravis Captain Paunchus Maximus from Dark Imperium!
El Torro wrote: Not sure what this is all about. A new campaign book? Do we get new models? If so are we getting Mordian Iron Guard??? I guess time will tell.
It says in literally the first paragraph that it's an event at Warhammer World next weekend, lol.
Looks like we're going to Mordian, of all places. Imperium vs Chaos, Harlequins and Necrons.
Not sure what this is all about. A new campaign book? Do we get new models? If so are we getting Mordian Iron Guard??? I guess time will tell.
Grand Narratives are GW's official Narrative events. This is just the background and characters that the organizers will be LARPing for the one coming up.
Fair enough, I just figured it was the start of something bigger. But hey, you know what they say, hope is the first step on the road to disappointment.
Solid work. They didn’t need to go wild, and they didn’t. Just a solid upgrade of an old kit.
TDA ancient is cool.
I’ll need to see the price point on that box. I don’t really need more reg terminators, actively don’t want the chaplain, and already have a TDA captain I like, even if he’s a little short.
Nevelon wrote: Solid work. They didn’t need to go wild, and they didn’t. Just a solid upgrade of an old kit.
TDA ancient is cool.
I’ll need to see the price point on that box. I don’t really need more reg terminators, actively don’t want the chaplain, and already have a TDA captain I like, even if he’s a little short.
Importantly, for me at least? The Lightning Claws aren’t the Knuckle Duster style. I’ve always preferred the built into the glove look.
Nevelon wrote: Solid work. They didn’t need to go wild, and they didn’t. Just a solid upgrade of an old kit.
TDA ancient is cool.
I’ll need to see the price point on that box. I don’t really need more reg terminators, actively don’t want the chaplain, and already have a TDA captain I like, even if he’s a little short.
Importantly, for me at least? The Lightning Claws aren’t the Knuckle Duster style. I’ve always preferred the built into the glove look.
Agreed.
Looking like the 1st company is probably going to end up happening. I need to finish the primaris battle company first, but between this and the Victrix guard, a lot of vets are going to end up on the shelf.
If only Liam Neeson and Danny Huston had wore these suits of Terminator armour, with Lightning Claws, then they could have challenged each other as true Kodak Bears.
Nevelon wrote: Solid work. They didn’t need to go wild, and they didn’t. Just a solid upgrade of an old kit.
TDA ancient is cool.
I’ll need to see the price point on that box. I don’t really need more reg terminators, actively don’t want the chaplain, and already have a TDA captain I like, even if he’s a little short.
Importantly, for me at least? The Lightning Claws aren’t the Knuckle Duster style. I’ve always preferred the built into the glove look.
Correct.
These look nice, and the Lightning Claws especially look much better.
Those were some funny looking Drukhari to post about during Drukhari preorder week.
Not that I expect everything to be Drukhari- especially since they'll need some left over to hype between preorder and release. But with my slide into seasonal depression, I think the last thing I need is to hear about marines right now.
Always find cheeky to count teleport beacons or aeldari terrain bits as a miniature, but these 18 miniatures box is probably going to be very expensive. £200 ???
I'll give them credit for actually giving options to equip the whole squad with the same weapon. If it was Chaos or Xenos you'd have 2 with claws, 2 with Hammer and 1 with weapon you never heard of that gets OP rules for the next two years.
Sgt. Cortez wrote: I'll give them credit for actually giving options to equip the whole squad with the same weapon. If it was Chaos or Xenos you'd have 2 with claws, 2 with Hammer and 1 with weapon you never heard of that gets OP rules for the next two years.
I know I’m in the minority, but I always preferred to field my assault terminators with a mix of weapons. You could always take casualties from the side less useful in your current battle, but having a little bit of both prevented them from not having the tools to deal with threats.
But that’s my TAC Ultramarine talking, not the min/maxer who mathhammers out the best pic and spams it.
I hope we will still be able to field mixed squads. We can now, so I don’t think it would change, but sometimes GW does silly things.
kabaakaba wrote: Box looks nice, at least for whom have not any terminators, but common, when they stop add barehead options? What a point in TDA if your face is open
It looks cool, nothing in 40K is practical. And they come with enough helmets that you can give each model one if you so wish.
And the models look excellent. I wish there were more of those crotch plates the sergeant has, I think it looks good and adds to the solid-brickness of the armour. I wish terminators had better rules though, I hope they improve them in the next codex.
The standard bearer is fine too, though I really wish they'd stop doing these chunky sculpted banners. It looks weird, and you need to painstakingly sand and smooth it if you want some other picture in it.
The box looks very tempting, but probably too pricey for me. And I'm not sure I need that many terminators.
Crimson wrote: [I wish there were more of those crotch plates the sergeant has, I think it looks good and adds to the solid-brickness of the armour.
Yeah, it's a small detail, but it really enhances the silhouette. I'll just model plasticard facsimiles onto all my Termies if there's not enough of those parts in the kit.
These guys are screaming to me in my head, "You don't need food! You don't need to sleep inside! We would make excellent units for a Deathwing army! You always wanted a Deathwing army! Buy us... convert us!"
Very nice looking updates, kind of looks like the Ancient has an alternate weapon option they chose not to show off (in the close ups of the alternate heads he clearly has a different right arm attached).
PenitentJake wrote: Those were some funny looking Drukhari to post about during Drukhari preorder week.
Not that I expect everything to be Drukhari- especially since they'll need some left over to hype between preorder and release. But with my slide into seasonal depression, I think the last thing I need is to hear about marines right now.
Every non-Dark Eldar release is just another plaything for the Drukhari.
I definitely understand the frustration of yet more marines.
I'm also a little disappointed the termie box only has 5 shooty termies. I guess the intention is that this will stack with the combat patrols that also have 5, but it feels like cheaping out.
ScarletRose wrote: I definitely understand the frustration of yet more marines.
I'm also a little disappointed the termie box only has 5 shooty termies. I guess the intention is that this will stack with the combat patrols that also have 5, but it feels like cheaping out.
If they put 10 of each, the price point would probably be ugly.
And I’d rather see 10 of the new guys in the launch box bundle.
Ahh, finally the Assault Terminators get revealed. Splendid. This kit looks to have a lot of synergy with the existing multipart plastic Terminator kit. We get new aquila style chestplates, and new waist poses to kitbash with. I am only disappointed they didnt give us any of the alternate Indomi Termie suit marks, like were featured on some of the Space Marine Heroes miniatures.
Looks like we dont have to wait long for the individual kits either, judging by the article. They will probably go to preorder a week or two after the big box, which I am certainly not getting. I just need one Assault Termie kit and one Ancient, and I'll have everything in place.
ScarletRose wrote: I definitely understand the frustration of yet more marines.
I'm also a little disappointed the termie box only has 5 shooty termies. I guess the intention is that this will stack with the combat patrols that also have 5, but it feels like cheaping out.
If they put 10 of each, the price point would probably be ugly.
And I’d rather see 10 of the new guys in the launch box bundle.
Plenty of the shooty ones out there already.
I'd have preferred five of each at a lower price point.
I've always kind of hated the Termi shields but I honestly kind of like them here. Not exactly sure why, maybe just that the posing makes better use of the kind of shield it is, but I kind of like them.
Lord Damocles wrote: The duplicated poses between the two assault Terminator units shown is really not doing them any favours.
GW always fall into that hole as they are a bit allergic to kitbashing. There are 15 new scale vanilla terminator bodies once these guys are released (easy build, multi part and assault terminators), swapping the arms over to get some variety is easy enough. And there are 20 pairs of assault terminator weapons in the big launch box - build all 15 terminators in the box as assault terminators if it suits you.
New scale Deathwatch shoulder pads would do them some favours though.
Lord Damocles wrote: The duplicated poses between the two assault Terminator units shown is really not doing them any favours.
GW always fall into that hole as they are a bit allergic to kitbashing. There are 15 new scale vanilla terminator bodies once these guys are released (easy build, multi part and assault terminators), swapping the arms over to get some variety is easy enough. And there are 20 pairs of assault terminator weapons in the big launch box - build all 15 terminators in the box as assault terminators if it suits you.
New scale Deathwatch shoulder pads would do them some favours though.
While they don’t officially advertise it as such, that could be part of the reason they threw the 5 shooty terminators in there - gives you the option of 3 units of assault terminators with different sets of bodies between the two units with the same weapons.
Though I’m probably thinking too highly of the there.
Nevelon wrote: Solid work. They didn’t need to go wild, and they didn’t. Just a solid upgrade of an old kit.
TDA ancient is cool.
I’ll need to see the price point on that box. I don’t really need more reg terminators, actively don’t want the chaplain, and already have a TDA captain I like, even if he’s a little short.
Importantly, for me at least? The Lightning Claws aren’t the Knuckle Duster style. I’ve always preferred the built into the glove look.
Agreed. They look to me more like the 2nd ed designs than the plastic updates. GW really mining their nostalgia.
I'm wondering if I should get the battleforce and Lysander, and paint them as Fists, or Calgar, and paint them as Ultras. Decisions, Decisions. I wonder if they might be coming out with a new Belial. That would be a real sweet indecision loop to get caught in.
Dudeface wrote: Not to be that guy, but do we really need yet another space hulk?
The fact that Space Hulk isn't the next Warhammer Quest with a really chunky core boxed set and several expansions is baffling!!!
Plus the nature of it means that you could have other factions join in too. It's hulks floating in space, everyone can get involved (and should). Sure have the core box with Genestealers and Terminators and then - EXPAND!
Dudeface wrote: Not to be that guy, but do we really need yet another space hulk?
The fact that Space Hulk isn't the next Warhammer Quest with a really chunky core boxed set and several expansions is baffling!!!
Plus the nature of it means that you could have other factions join in too. It's hulks floating in space, everyone can get involved (and should). Sure have the core box with Genestealers and Terminators and then - EXPAND!
Dudeface wrote: Not to be that guy, but do we really need yet another space hulk?
The fact that Space Hulk isn't the next Warhammer Quest with a really chunky core boxed set and several expansions is baffling!!!
Plus the nature of it means that you could have other factions join in too. It's hulks floating in space, everyone can get involved (and should). Sure have the core box with Genestealers and Terminators and then - EXPAND!
Yep and also plastic corridor floor tiles!
So we want boarding actions with plastic floor... Sounds good
Dudeface wrote: Not to be that guy, but do we really need yet another space hulk?
The fact that Space Hulk isn't the next Warhammer Quest with a really chunky core boxed set and several expansions is baffling!!!
Plus the nature of it means that you could have other factions join in too. It's hulks floating in space, everyone can get involved (and should). Sure have the core box with Genestealers and Terminators and then - EXPAND!
Yep and also plastic corridor floor tiles!
So we want boarding actions with plastic floor... Sounds good
No, floor tiles like space hulk cardboard and just some doors as connectors. Dont need walls at all.
Dudeface wrote: Not to be that guy, but do we really need yet another space hulk?
The fact that Space Hulk isn't the next Warhammer Quest with a really chunky core boxed set and several expansions is baffling!!!
Plus the nature of it means that you could have other factions join in too. It's hulks floating in space, everyone can get involved (and should). Sure have the core box with Genestealers and Terminators and then - EXPAND!
Yep and also plastic corridor floor tiles!
So we want boarding actions with plastic floor... Sounds good
No, floor tiles like space hulk cardboard and just some doors as connectors. Dont need walls at all.
I like walls, space hulk with walls gonna looks better.
The original Space Hulk ended up with rules for fielding Power Armour Marines (swifter, more numerous, but much, much squishier) and Orks. Oh, and Traitor Marines/
There may also have been rules for Imperial Guard, but don’t quote me on that, I may be thinking of Space Crusade.
I wouldn’t say no to a series of Space Hulk Big Boxes. Start with the classic, natch. Give it a Deathwing style expansion or two to flesh out the Astartes and Genestealer Hybrids. Next one? Ork Freebooterz exploring and nicking everything that’s not nailed down on a Chaos Ship. Then Mechanicum Explorator Crew trying to nick everything that isn’t nailed down in a Necron Tomb. Dark Eldar raiding a Craftworld, yes nicking everything (and anyone) that isn’t nailed down.
Imperial Guard got Space Hulk rules in Citadel Journal. As long as the comm link was alive, you could call in a new squad to be haplessly slaughtered by aliens.
Lord Damocles wrote: Imperial Guard got Space Hulk rules in Citadel Journal. As long as the comm link was alive, you could call in a new squad to be haplessly slaughtered by aliens.
Well, in one game a single hybrid with lasgun killed my Captain and a heavy weapon terminator. On the other hand I slaughtered PA marines in another game without much sweat.
All of the optional lists were pretty unbalanced. I guess some random hybrids were okay (but without the psychic rules) and the additional weapons for terminators too.
I'm not sure what the Dark Angel upgrade has to do with anything. The "gravis" sized upgrade pads work fine, this is just an upgrade that has a lot more options in general and the plasma cannon, but doesn't have anything directly to do with Deathwatch.
I'd not expect anything that really support the Deathwatch Terminators any time soon. The faction was supposed to be gone last year with this latest kit just serving as a resculpt for the Agents unit anyone can take. Any change of plans to unsquat the DW probably won't make it through the production pipeline for a couple years at best, if they've even truly decided to unsquat them at all.
Ones that they can still rerelease in plastic are:
- Ortan Cassius, Master of Sanctity (used to have an old metal model, we got an brief plastic version of him but it was back when he was still in the Deathwatch and before his heavy cybernetic modification), I could see him being added in alongside Tyrannic War Vets if GW ever wants to release that as a standalone unit - Sergeant Telion, Scout Sergeant - Antaro Chronus (not super likely, might be brought in alongside a new tank, possibly a land raider refresh)
So they still have at least 3 named ones they can bring in at some point, and that's not including GW's willingness to add new Ultra primaris characters either.
Can't wait to see what [word I want to use but can't] lore reason are they going to give for Ferrus getting his head back. Dudes dead. Let him stay dead. Could have bought back Russ, Corax, Vulkan, Dorn or the Khan. Nope. Lets resurrect the dead fella.
I'm not sure what the Dark Angel upgrade has to do with anything. The "gravis" sized upgrade pads work fine, this is just an upgrade that has a lot more options in general and the plasma cannon, but doesn't have anything directly to do with Deathwatch.
That seems pretty easy to fake, really doubt it's real personally.Even if they're doing legion of the damned, I could see their centerpiece model being more of a "ferrus" inspired character but not explicitly named as him.
Grimskul wrote: That seems pretty easy to fake, really doubt it's real personally.Even if they're doing legion of the damned, I could see their centerpiece model being more of a "ferrus" inspired character but not explicitly named as him.
LD 1+ seems like a giveaway unless the plan is for 11th edition to make battleshock a 1D6 roll.
Grimskul wrote: That seems pretty easy to fake, really doubt it's real personally.Even if they're doing legion of the damned, I could see their centerpiece model being more of a "ferrus" inspired character but not explicitly named as him.
Well...if we take the idea that the Emperor is essentially more of a Chaos God by now (Order God?, no, Chaos seems right) then he naturally would have demons and greater demons. The Damned definitely qualify as demons (insubstantial, appear in areas where psychic instability seems high...such as a vital engagement going very badly), so that checks off the small fry. And since the Living Saints (Celestine, Anais, Sabbat, and others) are essentially named demons, they would qualify as Greater Demons.
So why not Ferrus Manus? I mean, likely his head would just be something ablaze with holy fire...or he would now sport a LoD helmet. Perhaps the helmet would float a few inches above his neck?
So why not Ferrus Manus? I mean, likely his head would just be something ablaze with holy fire...or he would now sport a LoD helmet. Perhaps the helmet would float a few inches above his neck?
Damn Now I sort of do want GW to make a Ghost Manus riding a Hellcycle (or would that be Holycycle?) leading the Legion of the Damned!
Can't wait to see what [word I want to use but can't] lore reason are they going to give for Ferrus getting his head back. Dudes dead. Let him stay dead. Could have bought back Russ, Corax, Vulkan, Dorn or the Khan. Nope. Lets resurrect the dead fella.
Not An Expert Nor Claiming To Be Disclaimer?
I think that’s fake. Most of the text isn’t in proper focus, except for the unit names. Especially the Legionaires.
Whining about GW's weird turn on art has been done before, and may be redundant since they are probably only a few years away from going "eh, just get AI to do it".
But I can't work out who thought it was "good". I guess if they are phoning stuff in because "eh, its New Marines this week, that'll do" it sort of makes sense - but it seems a bit bizarre in the context that all of this is marketing.
I guess its subjective all the way down, but I feel there's been an awful lot of "misses" from about 2016 onwards.
So why not Ferrus Manus? I mean, likely his head would just be something ablaze with holy fire...or he would now sport a LoD helmet. Perhaps the helmet would float a few inches above his neck?
Damn Now I sort of do want GW to make a Ghost Manus riding a Hellcycle (or would that be Holycycle?) leading the Legion of the Damned!
Tyel wrote: I guess its subjective all the way down, but I feel there's been an awful lot of "misses" from about 2016 onwards.
It might be a rare miss for Dainton as far as the face is concerned (unless GW thinks Malys should look like Jared Leto crossed with Marilyn Manson), but the overall composition and chiaroscuro is strong here.
Whining about GW's weird turn on art has been done before, and may be redundant since they are probably only a few years away from going "eh, just get AI to do it".
But I can't work out who thought it was "good". I guess if they are phoning stuff in because "eh, its New Marines this week, that'll do" it sort of makes sense - but it seems a bit bizarre in the context that all of this is marketing.
I guess its subjective all the way down, but I feel there's been an awful lot of "misses" from about 2016 onwards.
What I don't understand is why the model's face looks so drastically different. Every imperial character's face looks like it's art - Calgar coming out looks like the SM2 art. The model's face is generic fnatasy elf which is bad, but then the art is this weird design that's neither fantasy art nor the angular haunted alien beauty aesthetic GW used to use for eldar. Really unsure what the hell they were doing.
To the comments about space hulk previously - I feel they could get Kill Team boxes to do double time with a space hulk release. Write space hulk lists for each box and release online or in the box book. The core box can be a terminator team vs genestealers, but then anyone can use a kill team box to replace the terminators.
Hot take: Scale creep has made a good new edition of Space Hulk impossible. The (original and best, first edition of the) game barely fits on my 4’ x 5’ gaming table with 25mm based terminators and genestealers. I would need an 8’ long table with if the game were scaled up to accommodate 40mm bases.
Pariah Press wrote: Hot take: Scale creep has made a good new edition of Space Hulk impossible. The (original and best, first edition of the) game barely fits on my 4’ x 5’ gaming table with 25mm based terminators and genestealers. I would need an 8’ long table with if the game were scaled up to accommodate 40mm bases.
My Space Marine: Tyranid Attack game has a smaller board, but still gives the same experience of Space hulk and has 32/40mm Marines in the game.
I guess this is what happens when you hire on attitude and not artistic talent.
Are you joking or is this something they've said? I hate the anodyne GW monoculture art these days.
It’s something they said, but not specifically about art. Just the we hire for attitude, not talent.
IIRC it was during the Kirby years, so a lot of unhinged things were said. But also, you can teach people skills, so getting employees with the right mindset can make sense. To a point.
Most typical elfish features would be hard to catch at that angle. The artist painted it as it would actually look, while most artist would have just painted a familliar face you would expect from a cruel drukkhari, regardless of the angle.
The end result was not great in my opinion. Lack most of the menacing feeling you want from DE
Fayric wrote: Most typical elfish features would be hard to catch at that angle. The artist painted it as it would actually look, while most artist would have just painted a familliar face you would expect from a cruel drukkhari, regardless of the angle.
The end result was not great in my opinion. Lack most of the menacing feeling you want from DE
Part of the Drukhari 'thing' is that they really look like disgusting monsters, but all that soul-eating lets them affect a glamour that makes them look more elfy. Any art depicting them should be at either extreme end of the repellent spectrum, not this middle-ground.
Lathe Biosas wrote: So, does anyone know how many officers exist for the Ultramarines now?
Aren't we about to hit the saturation point and run out of named Ultramarines to release?
I mean, while you can just represent them with the basic versions of the models, like heavy intercessors, you could make a whole new model for each of the space marine 2 classes. Titus is a lieutenant and got his own model, why not? Six new character space marine models, Valius the vanguard, Vespasius the assault, Decimus the vanguard, Quartus the bulwark, Scipius the sniper, and Straban the heavy. Each of them could lead their respective units and give them buffs or act as lone operatives (as some of my teammates love to do to me). Plus, could always add gadrial and chairon if they’re desperate.
Nothing about the Malys model or artwork really suggests a figure crazy enough to cut out her own heart and replace it with a weird crystal she just won from some magical hobo she met in the webway, using a sword which moves on its own, and then got significantly more unhinged after that.
Lord Damocles wrote: Nothing about the Malys model or artwork really suggests a figure crazy enough to cut out her own heart and replace it with a weird crystal she just won from some magical hobo she met in the webway, using a sword which moves on its own, and then got significantly more unhinged after that.
How would one show that in a single picture of someone? I agree that the art isn't the best, but that feels like an excessive ask.
Lord Damocles wrote: Nothing about the Malys model or artwork really suggests a figure crazy enough to cut out her own heart and replace it with a weird crystal she just won from some magical hobo she met in the webway, using a sword which moves on its own, and then got significantly more unhinged after that.
How would one show that in a single picture of someone? I agree that the art isn't the best, but that feels like an excessive ask.
Dunno. I'm not being paid to be an artist.
Something more than 'just another evil elf' though, probably.
Lord Damocles wrote: Nothing about the Malys model or artwork really suggests a figure crazy enough to cut out her own heart and replace it with a weird crystal she just won from some magical hobo she met in the webway, using a sword which moves on its own, and then got significantly more unhinged after that.
How would one show that in a single picture of someone? I agree that the art isn't the best, but that feels like an excessive ask.
Dunno. I'm not being paid to be an artist.
Something more than 'just another evil elf' though, probably.
To be fair, she is not an incredibly uniqe character. Was not important or spectacular enough to get a model of her own back in 5th edition.
Fayric wrote: To be fair, she is not an incredibly uniqe character. Was not important or spectacular enough to get a model of her own back in 5th edition.
She's more unique than most of the Space Marine special characters.
Fayric wrote: To be fair, she is not an incredibly uniqe character. Was not important or spectacular enough to get a model of her own back in 5th edition.
She's more unique than most of the Space Marine special characters.
Whaddya mean? You can't tell one raging bald white dude in power armour from another raging bald white dude in power armour?
Lathe Biosas wrote: Whaddya mean? You can't tell one raging bald white dude in power armour from another raging bald white dude in power armour?
Eh...
I mean this maybe sounds like a reach - but to use recent examples I'm not sure many generic SM characters could be confused with Calgar.
I, Cato Sicarius was memed to the point he's so bad he's good - but he's kind of unique too.
My issue with Malys is precisely that the model could just be a kitbashed Archon. And this art could also just be... anyone?
Much like how the new Archon... could just be a kitbashed Archon.
Some people will like that. But I don't.
I don't know how - in art, or as a mini - you'd encapsulate something beyond "female kabalite with a fan".
But this is presumably why Yvraine got a weird base size, a massive dress and a cat. Because even if the model is getting a little dated, its clearly not something you made from a bunch of Dark Eldar bitz.
I think its sort of why I still have a soft spot for the original Archon. Sure, its kind of a derpy model. But you see it and think "that's an Archon". Its not a Sybarite with delusions of grandeur.
Because of nostalgia. People love to have a reference to former editions rather than make up new players.
Nostalgia in this case, and in a few other cases has a bit of an edge to it: this is the first Malys model we've had. It's not that we are longing for a recreation of an old thing- GW gave us teaser rules and never followed through. Malys feels more like the fulfilment of a long lost promise more than nostalgia. Sliscus, Sathonyx and Kheradruahk would feel the same... As would, say Exodites.
Now, sure, I'm a guy who also wants Vect back, and that WOULD be a far more conventional sort of nostalgia- as was the Zoat and the Ambull, and to a certain extent, the GSC and Votann.
Fayric wrote: Most typical elfish features would be hard to catch at that angle. The artist painted it as it would actually look, while most artist would have just painted a familliar face you would expect from a cruel drukkhari, regardless of the angle.
The end result was not great in my opinion. Lack most of the menacing feeling you want from DE
Part of the Drukhari 'thing' is that they really look like disgusting monsters, but all that soul-eating lets them affect a glamour that makes them look more elfy. Any art depicting them should be at either extreme end of the repellent spectrum, not this middle-ground.
Part of the Drukhari 'thing' is that they really look like disgusting monsters, but all that soul-eating lets them affect a glamour that makes them look more elfy. Any art depicting them should be at either extreme end of the repellent spectrum, not this middle-ground.
I dont remember ever reading that anywhere?
So, I wouldn't have described the phenomenon using the same words as Shakalooloo, but the phenomenon is there. It is similar to classic vampire mythology (as opposed to the "sparkly vampire mythology" of Twilight). Starving makes you look gaunt, hollow and withered; feeding restores lost strength, vitality and vigour.
The condition is known as Souldebt. While Slaanesh wasn't able to kill all Aeldari in the moment of her birth, she did claim their souls, and begin withering those who survived. This withering, if left untreated, will lead to death, and deliver the soul to Slaanesh.
The 9th ed dex, pg 9:
"Those who could not sate their need for anguish suffered a horrific withering of spirit. They became shadows of their former grandeur, desperately seeking any morbid sustenance. Fading to husks, these unfortunates weakened until they were easy prey for other pain-hungry Drukhari. Meanwhile, those who had recently fed on the most subtle and rare of agonies shone with a cold aura of vigour. Dull eyes regained their malicious gleam and a supernatural potency invigorated their souls."
I don't read that as them casting a glamour but more that its their actual mental, soul and physical being which directly show it.
Ergo one who is at the top of society can appear almost like normal Eldar; whilst those at the bottom are withered husks.
I think some project of impressions of DE is influenced by the first generation models. The warriors were for the most part in helmets with a few exposed faces; whilst the leader was doing a Silence of the Lambs "wearing someone else's face" so looked horrific.
Glamour casting is more of a straight slaanesh deamonette thing. They 100% do cast an illusion around themselves to project a body of beauty whilst being twisted chaotic demons behind it. They also mix it up with pheromone musks and such too
I thought the idea was that left in isolation Dark Eldar are aged, shrivelled, hollow, ghoul-like things (some debate on the vatborn here but ignore that) - as she who thirsts is continuously drinking their souls. This is a doom from which there is no natural salvation. The Dark Eldar don't gain meaningful sustenance by food or sunlight etc. This is how they appear to psykers because their souls are so thin/weak.
But they can absorb pain, suffering, horror and souls. And when they do it's like rain onto dry grass. Once again they are the tall, thin, conventionally beautiful Eldar. Indeed the Dark Eldar are stronger, than their craftworld cousins, with quicksilver swiftness and cat-like reflexes. Not as some illusion, but as an actual physical transformation.
There seemed clear parallels with Dark Elf WHFB lore. Hag queens are ancient decrepit crones, withering from the years. Roll on Death Night, hop in a cauldron of blood and voila, back to being forever young, beautiful, super strong and fast.
I thought the idea was that left in isolation Dark Eldar are aged, shrivelled, hollow, ghoul-like things (some debate on the vatborn here but ignore that) - as she who thirsts is continuously drinking their souls. This is a doom from which there is no natural salvation. The Dark Eldar don't gain meaningful sustenance by food or sunlight etc. This is how they appear to psykers because their souls are so thin/weak.
But they can absorb pain, suffering, horror and souls. And when they do it's like rain onto dry grass. Once again they are the tall, thin, conventionally beautiful Eldar. Indeed the Dark Eldar are stronger, than their craftworld cousins, with quicksilver swiftness and cat-like reflexes. Not as some illusion, but as an actual physical transformation.
There seemed clear parallels with Dark Elf WHFB lore. Hag queens are ancient decrepit crones, withering from the years. Roll on Death Night, hop in a cauldron of blood and voila, back to being forever young, beautiful, super strong and fast.
Gav Thorpe's Path of the Eldar novels show Eldar can use psychic energy to accelerate their healing.
I see the Dark Eldar feeding as a basic instinctive manipulation of psychic energy even if they are not active psykers. In this case, the torture of others causes the release of psychic energy from the victim and this is what the Dark Eldar then absorb/feed off to both metaphysically replenish their dwindling soul and to physically regenerate. That is how they stay young and immortal far beyond even natural Eldar lifespans, and how they regenerate from apparent death when their remains are put into the regeneration pods of the Haemonculi, who basically run a life insurance business.
That said though, the Dark Eldar do eat food as they still have a biology. The poor in the Dark City seem to scavenge the dead, while the rich can dine on whatever luxuries are imported or captured from throughout the galaxy. It is just that in 40K, physical nourishment is not enough. Without the soul, living organisms in 40K die or become mindless husks with no will and motivation.
The only problem is it seems over time the Thirst has a greater hold so it takes more and more pain to achieve the same result. That is why one of the Codices described the most ancient Archons as wearing masks as the Thirst had progressed to the point where they could no longer physically look young (or at least without prohibitive amounts of feeding), or how the Covens supplement said the most ancient and depraved Haemonculi of the Everspiral Coven needed the radiated stored agony from a Cronos Pain Engine at all times just to avoid crumbling to dust.
Overread wrote: I don't read that as them casting a glamour but more that its their actual mental, soul and physical being which directly show it.
The 2010 codex, page 5:
"They stride through the fires of battle with the surety and poise of demigods, but their magnificence is only skin deep. Viewed with the witch-sight, Dark Eldar are repugnant monsters, eternally thirsting for the anguish of others in order to fill the aching void at their core."
Overread wrote: I don't read that as them casting a glamour but more that its their actual mental, soul and physical being which directly show it.
The 2010 codex, page 5:
"They stride through the fires of battle with the surety and poise of demigods, but their magnificence is only skin deep. Viewed with the witch-sight, Dark Eldar are repugnant monsters, eternally thirsting for the anguish of others in order to fill the aching void at their core."
So, pretty much Skeksis.
I still see that as their bodies are whole and sound - its their soul that the witchsight is seeing into. The ache in them is to deliver extremes of pain on others to feed their own withered souls and stave off being consumed entirely by Slaanesh.
Their bodies only reflect their souls when they run out of sources of anguish to inflict upon others and then they start to fail and crumble. Seeking machinery, grafting, cloning and other means to preserve their physical body whilst it keeps crumbling like their soul.
Overread wrote: I don't read that as them casting a glamour but more that its their actual mental, soul and physical being which directly show it.
The 2010 codex, page 5:
"They stride through the fires of battle with the surety and poise of demigods, but their magnificence is only skin deep. Viewed with the witch-sight, Dark Eldar are repugnant monsters, eternally thirsting for the anguish of others in order to fill the aching void at their core."
So, pretty much Skeksis.
I still see that as their bodies are whole and sound - its their soul that the witchsight is seeing into. The ache in them is to deliver extremes of pain on others to feed their own withered souls and stave off being consumed entirely by Slaanesh.
Their bodies only reflect their souls when they run out of sources of anguish to inflict upon others and then they start to fail and crumble. Seeking machinery, grafting, cloning and other means to preserve their physical body whilst it keeps crumbling like their soul.
The 2014 codex (guess which batch books I just managed to stumble across today), p.7:
"A Dark Eldar who has recently fed upon the torment of others shines with a cold and startling aura, his form restored to perfection even as his soul festers within. One who is starved of such energies for long enough will become a shadow of himself, desperately hunting for a taste of pain"
That's not as good, since the 'startling aura' makes my mind think more of Twilight than Dark Crystal.
Indeed - that's not a glamour - that's their very body making actual physical changes, augmented by some of the psy aspects of their race.
Similarly when their body withers when starved of energies the body physically withers and changes.
A glamour would have their body fully withered the whole time no matter their energy state; with the aura hiding their actual form. Just like how Deamonettes do.
Instead the Dark Eldar are the opposite.
The 2014 codex (guess which batch books I just managed to stumble across today), p.7:
"A Dark Eldar who has recently fed upon the torment of others shines with a cold and startling aura, his form restored to perfection even as his soul festers within. One who is starved of such energies for long enough will become a shadow of himself, desperately hunting for a taste of pain"
That's not as good, since the 'startling aura' makes my mind think more of Twilight than Dark Crystal.
This sounds a lot like the depiction of Vampires in the Old World.
If they haven't fed in a while, then their bodies resemble what they really are - decaying corpses, animated with dark magic.
However, when they feed on blood their forms are restored (at least outwardly) and they may even appear beautiful. But, of course, inside they are still horrors of dark necromancy. They can just take on a vestige of their former humanity.
Sweet preview of Drukhari Crusade rules! Now I'm looking forward to the book. Adding in Commorrite Rivals to up the Drukharimunda vibe was a brilliant idea, and it looks like they're really trying to beef up the connections beteen the game on the table and the meta-theatre of the progression system.
I can't wait to see how Agendas and requisitions interact with Rival Actions and Hostile takeovers.
PenitentJake wrote: Sweet preview of Drukhari Crusade rules! Now I'm looking forward to the book. Adding in Commorrite Rivals to up the Drukharimunda vibe was a brilliant idea, and it looks like they're really trying to beef up the connections beteen the game on the table and the meta-theatre of the progression system.
I can't wait to see how Agendas and requisitions interact with Rival Actions and Hostile takeovers.
Personally, I think the reward for controlling all 12 districts is one of the best Crusade rules yet.
The new Wracks box price is a pleasant surprise! I have enough already, but that's more of a saving that I was expecting GW to slap on the doubled up squad size. Lady Malys though...
BorderCountess wrote: Having watched the Tabletop Tactics video, it looks like part of the issue with the model for Malys is, once again, the paintjob.
But since I suck at faces, I'm probably going to use the veil.
That seems to be a common issue as of late. The 1k Sons Robots looked better in almost any paint job than the one they previewed.
BorderCountess wrote: Having watched the Tabletop Tactics video, it looks like part of the issue with the model for Malys is, once again, the paintjob.
But since I suck at faces, I'm probably going to use the veil.
That seems to be a common issue as of late. The 1k Sons Robots looked better in almost any paint job than the one they previewed.
True, its their abition to make good marketing and deliver a clean showcase of the model details. Mostly leave it lacking in personality.
Another annoying thing is that they usually provide some pictures of the model in diferent settings, but always at the exact same angle.
BorderCountess wrote: Having watched the Tabletop Tactics video, it looks like part of the issue with the model for Malys is, once again, the paintjob.
But since I suck at faces, I'm probably going to use the veil.
That seems to be a common issue as of late. The 1k Sons Robots looked better in almost any paint job than the one they previewed.
Agreed, the same for raveners kill team for example, in GW paintjob they looks strange. But once I build minis they are way different. And thats for many miniatures they have
They keep on recruiting new dudes to replace the dead ones, and I assume that the Guard can even replace Shaeffer with some cosmetically-modified body double to continue the legend.
They keep on recruiting new dudes to replace the dead ones, and I assume that the Guard can even replace Shaeffer with some cosmetically-modified body double to continue the legend.
Also, I don't see anything wrong with having rules for dead models.
It'd be a bit weird to have, say, Horus in 40k, since he was NEVER around for it.
But Yarrick or the Last Chancers? Sure, give 'em rules.
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