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Is a Chaos Space Marine Dreadnought useful in a Chaos Space Marine army?


post your opinions please

It depends... How lucky are you? Chaos Dreadnoughts are cheaper than the loyalist pups but ours have a bit more attitude, perhaps they are mad about the whole Heresy thing.

Your Dreadnought has the potential to pump 2 MM and 2 ML shots into a friendly unit, but it also has the potential to do the same to your opponent. I like throwing x2 DCCW and Extra Armour on them, running forward, and praying that I'll get nine attacks on the charge! I wouldn't bring them to a tournament unless I was feeling REALLY ballsy, however they are a blast in friendly games.

Their models are ugly, metal constructs that are a pain to assemble. On the plus side, they're great for chucking at your opponent when you craze poorly! Get one for lulz, then just buy and convert loyalist or pick up ForgeWorld models. I recommend them for the fun factor and the potential craze results (hopefully on your opponent).

If you want a solid, reliable unit? No.

If you want an unpredictable unit that embodies Chaos as a whole? Absolutely yes.


Forgeworld models are beautiful and crazily diverse, honestly there is a chaos dreadnought for everyone.

A question i have always had about Chaos dreadnoughts is are they better shooting or running towards the enemy, this seems to be the biggest question i have towards them and i would like this answered.

if you are going to list the shooty dreadnoughts can you list the cheapest, but still effective weapon combo? this would be very helpful

He's the most mobile anti-tank you can get in the army, and is relatively cheap for what he does.

Only problem is you have a 1/3 chance to missing a turn with him. And 1/6 of the time he can hurt you. However, for the price of 4 Obliterators you get 3 Dreads with missiles and multimeltas. They're the only real mobile Multiemeltas in the army (Oblits have S&P), which means they have the best threat range (AP 1 is really important). They are also in the relatively weak Elites slot, and are the more survivable option there as well (as Termicide and Infiltrating Chosen don't last long).

Obviously, having them go crazy and shoot your units the first two turns is bad, but it shouldn't happen after that as you will have had time to move away from them. I've run them before next to Thousand Sons to mitigate the damage they do, but if you run them with a mech force then you need to be prepared to lose something.

I'd only take them if you've maxed out your Heavy, HQ, and Troops (or at least got to a comfortable amount of Troops).

Justus wrote:It depends... How lucky are you? Chaos Dreadnoughts are cheaper than the loyalist pups but ours have a bit more attitude, perhaps they are mad about the whole Heresy thing.

Your Dreadnought has the potential to pump 2 MM and 2 ML shots into a friendly unit, but it also has the potential to do the same to your opponent. I like throwing x2 DCCW and Extra Armour on them, running forward, and praying that I'll get nine attacks on the charge! I wouldn't bring them to a tournament unless I was feeling REALLY ballsy, however they are a blast in friendly games.

Their models are ugly, metal constructs that are a pain to assemble. On the plus side, they're great for chucking at your opponent when you craze poorly! Get one for lulz, then just buy and convert loyalist or pick up ForgeWorld models. I recommend them for the fun factor and the potential craze results (hopefully on your opponent).

You'll never get nine attacks on the charge, because Blood Rage doesn't double attacks anymore.

They are far more likely to double-tap friendly units than enemies, because by the time they get close to the enemy they are more likely to have been wrecked, immobilised or had their guns shot off.

However, at 100 points base they with careful management their downside can be worked around, and they are still armour 12 walkers.

I'd recommend sticking to either dual CCW or CCW + Missile Launcher, as if you keep a vehicle nearby (maybe another Dread) you can choose to fire Frags at it to significantly reduce your chances of damaging your own units. Twin CCW has the bonus that only Fire Frenzy will be a serious problem for your plans, meaning it only screws you 1/6th of the time instead of 1/3rd.

The use of a Chaos Dreadnought depends on three things:

1) How often do people piss you off?
2) Do you have any spare socks?
3) How hard can you swing said sock if it contained the aforementioned dreadnought?

If your answers are:
1) Very
2) Yes
3) Very

then it all looks good.

Seriously, they're quite sub-optimal. A lot of people prefer elites being saved for outflanking plasma/melta/other Chosen and/or Termicide.

If you're bent on running one, then do it with twin CCWs for damage control, or you can risk plasma if you're flanked on at least one side by a land raider that is ALWAYS the closest visible unit to it until you can ensure that it'll always be an enemy.

Justus wrote:It depends... How lucky are you?

Dirty Harry wrote:I know what you're thinking. "Did he fire six shots or only five?" Well, to tell you the truth, in all this excitement I kind of lost track myself. But being as this is a .44 Magnum, the most powerful handgun in the world, and would blow your head clean off, you've got to ask yourself one question: Do I feel lucky? Well, do ya, punk?

after reading these replys i can see that dreadnoughts are very risky, but useful.

on to a diffrent question, which is better for a some-what mechanized army, 2 dreadnoughts with 2 DCCWs or 1 defilier... just wondering because i could have one or the other in my army

i also need to find a spare sock..

Defiler is the single most important Chaos unit. If only because it has spider-legs.

Defilers are my favorite unit in the code minus chaos lords. I run 3 of them and would suggest at least running 2 as 1 will get shot off the board immediately. They are GIANT fire magnets.

the list im going to run has a Deamon prince, Land Raider and Abbadon, so im shure the defiler or dreadnoughts will be safe untill they get close, but by then its too late

then again im running a horrible 1500 point list so ill see what happens after i get more info on how to make a ok army useing Abbadon.

Abbadon will be inside the Land Raider with 8 Khorn Bezerkers

I like Chaos Dreads. I run one with MM/HF often, and he always finds a way to be useful. Virtually all CSM infantry are capable of clearing hordes and light infantry without any additional equipment. I use my Dreadnought like the Codex Astartes says to: they are close support for the infantry. His guns are great, but it his ability to trash hard targets in close combat that makes him valuable.

Defilers compete with your Heavy Support, and while they provides similar close combat support (his footprint is irritatingly large), his armaments simply aren't as flexible. The Battlecannon is not as useful as a tank killer as a MM or TL-LC, and while you can get the latter on a Defiler it is relatively more expensive. The Dreadnought is simply just right.

I like to run the dread phalanx, 3 dreads shoulder to shoulder with heavy bolters always good for a laugh

DarkHound wrote: The Dreadnought is simply just right.

Except for his penchant to fire frenzy?

(I'm not a chaos player so I don't speak from experience)

One loadout people swear by is DCCW/missile launcher. Run two or three of them at the enemy. If they shoot at each other, have them fire a frag missile, it can't hurt the front or side armor.

Other folks say the dread's a vehicle & will only fire in its' 90 degree front arc. I'd discuss that with your opponent before you try to pull that off in-game.

Darth Badguy wrote:One loadout people swear by is DCCW/missile launcher. Run two or three of them at the enemy. If they shoot at each other, have them fire a frag missile, it can't hurt the front or side armor.

Other folks say the dread's a vehicle & will only fire in its' 90 degree front arc. I'd discuss that with your opponent before you try to pull that off in-game.

That would be correct. But I like to play the 4th ed way for the character, hence the phalanx, which works with ML's too

I've been dying to test some loadouts for my 3 new Dreads in "Phalanx". In the case where one is willing to gamble with some risk, what do you guys think about all the different long-range weaponry available?:

-TL Lascannon 48" S9 AP1
-TL Autocannon 48" S7 AP4
-Missile Launcher 48" S4/8 AP6/3
-Plasma Cannon 36" S7 AP2
-TL Heavy Bolter 36" S5 AP4
-Multi-Melta 24" S8 AP1

I fear Las and MM might do more harm than good. Whilst ML and PC are a nice compromise between crazy and blowing gak up.

Has anyone ad success running 3 with Plasma Cannons? I will try it in my next game

severedblue wrote:Except for his penchant to fire frenzy?

There are two views that must inevitably be brought up when discussing the Chaos Dreadnought. According to how the 5th Edition rules interact with Fire Frenzy, the Dreadnought will only target models in his immediate LoS before rotating. His LoS is defined by the 45 degree arches of his guns, as is written in the Walker section. Most people confuse the fact that because you get to rotate your Dreadnought for free in the shooting phase, he has 360 degree LoS like infantry. However your target is only selected once the walker has rotated to face it. Fire Frenzy goes about the process backwards; pick a target, then rotate towards it.

The end result is that unless you walk your units in front of the Dreadnought after knowing he's going to Frenzy (you have the entire movement phase to duck for cover), he'll shoot at the enemy. Also, if you spend the first few turns staring off the side of the board, he'll keep his sanity and continue marching.

Artanis wrote:In the case where one is willing to gamble with some risk, what do you guys think about all the different long-range weaponry available?

Well, first, see the above. Now, I find that the 24" on the MM is sufficient to start shooting on turn 2. I've been tentatively trying the TL-LC, but you can't keep him at range because a broad LoS makes his Fire Frenzy very dangerous. The only way to effectively mitigate his crazy is to bring him closer to the enemy. In the end, I'll probably take a ML instead. I need anti-tank, but the TL-LC isn't flexible enough to cope with Fire Frenzy going off on infantry. Frankly, it is best to keep the Dreadnought cheap: MM, ML, PC, HF.

So, if im reading this right, if i keep 2 Dreadnoughts side by side with a DCCW + ML then im somewhat safe if i roll a fire frenzy by makeing them shoot at each other with frag missiles untill they can assault the enemy theirfore makeing them useful.

right?

hand banana wrote:So, if im reading this right, if i keep 2 Dreadnoughts side by side with a DCCW + ML then im somewhat safe if i roll a fire frenzy by makeing them shoot at each other with frag missiles untill they can assault the enemy theirfore makeing them useful.

right?

yes, but If you read darkhound's post above, It depends if you're playing 4th or 5th ed LoS for the dread. So you won't FF so much on your units unless you uhhh...let them walk in front of the crazy dread. So If you do play with the 5th ed RAW, they make great PC/MM platforms. But If your going 4th for style, ML works fine as yes you can just double fire frag missiles. As a small note, If you have 2 FF's in a row with one dread in the phalanx, you might end up firing two frag missiles into the rear armor of another dread, and can glance on a 6 (better than a 6 HB shots glancing on 5+!)

ill be useing 5th ed LoS rules for the dreads, so...uhh..... please correct me if im wrong but what i previously said will still be right?

im sorry im just confused as im wondering if i should replace them with 9 plain Raptors so im not thinking so good at the moment. also i am a new player, theirfore im a idiot

When you measure LoS from a vehicle, you do it from the weapon mount. So If he goes FF, the closest unit in the 90 degree arc from your primary weapon is what he will be plowing into. Unless you put something in front of him, he's probably going to be facing the enemy, therefore NOT FF'ing into your units.

IF you play using the spirit of the rule when it was written (4th ed) and let the sucker pivot before shooting, and you have 2-3 dreads rubbing shoulders, you can choose indeed to fire frag missiles so you CANNOT hurt each other (str 4 cannot glance AV12). Now, If you have said 3 dreads, and one goes FF and shoots harmless frag missiles into the others, big whoop. But those two are going to keep marching down the field. If you roll a FF AGAIN, you might end up firing into the rear armor of one other dreads. However, two small blasts that glance on 6's are not effective anti-vehicle weapons, your chances of hurting your dreads.


Does that help ?

that helps greatly, and now i understand that basicly my Dreads are safe from killing each other and my own guys makeing them actually useful in my army as long as they are close together or in CC with the enemy

well now it seems that dreads might be useful afterall....

One other thing to keep in mind is that a large number of weapons a Dread can choose are twin-linked. Twin-linked is "may" reroll misses, not "must". So feel free to not reroll if you happen to miss with your twin-linked lascannon into the back of your own Rhino.

How on Midgard can you go wrong with this?

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Warhammer-40000/EMPEROR%27S-CHILDREN-SONIC-DREADNOUGHT.html

Oh and he's fething pink.

Shadowbrand wrote:How on Midgard can you go wrong with this?

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Warhammer-40000/EMPEROR%27S-CHILDREN-SONIC-DREADNOUGHT.html

Oh and he's fething pink.

can i get some rules for that god-like Dreadnought

i must get one of those if the sonic weaponry isnt too expensive

The counterpoint myself and others would make is 'fine, your dreadnought can only see 45 in front of him. That means I can deploy my infiltrators 12" behind your dread and melta him off the board since he can't see them.' Arguments break out and it gets out of hand ...

The much simpler way to get around fire frenzy is to give them a blast weapon and put them in base-to-base. If they fire frenzy, the closest unit is the other dreadnought and when you place the blast marker you hit yourself. This isn't legal - so your dread reverts to sane and you are good to go!

No blast weapon you can give a Dread uses the 5", so there will always be a legal position for the template that doesn't hit yourself. The hole in the marker doesn't have to be centered on the target model.

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1181495_Chaos_Space_Marines_Datasheet_-_Emperor%27s_Children_Warband.pdf