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latrodectus wrote:

Dr. What wrote:

Leth wrote:I was thinking 3 or 4 units of 3 bikers and a unit of nob bikers with stormboyz dakkajets and battlewagon support

Perhaps this?

Wazdakka

Warbikers X3 - Nob with Power Klaw and Bosspole (Included in Total)
Warbikers X3 - Nob with Power Klaw and Bosspole (Included in Total)
Warbikers X3 - Nob with Power Klaw and Bosspole (Included in Total)
Warbikers X3 - Nob with Power Klaw and Bosspole (Included in Total)
Boyz X20 - Shootas, 2 Big Shootas, Nob with Power Klaw, Bosspole, and 'Eavy Armor (Included in Total)
Boyz X20 - Shootas, 2 Big Shootas, Nob with Power Klaw, Bosspole, and 'Eavy Armor (Included in Total)

Deffkoptas X2 - Twin-Linked Rokkit Launchas
Dakkajet - Additional Supa-Shoota, Fighta Ace (Keeping this despite the struggle to avoid arguing and I play against Tau a lot.)

Battlewagon - 4 Big Shootas, Grot Riggers, Kannon (NOT a Kilkannon), Deff Rolla
Battlewagon - 4 Big Shootas, Grot Riggers, Kannon (NOT a Kilkannon), Deff Rolla


Automatically Appended Next Post:
That's 1.5k

I actually have been thinking about a similar list to this... Here is what I was considering at 1.5k:


Zhadsnark (my group allows FW rules/Characters, and this is the Biker Boss from IA8)

Warbikers X3 - Nob with Power Klaw/Bosspole
Warbikers X3 - Nob with Power Klaw/Bosspole
Warbikers X3 - Nob with Power Klaw/Bosspole
Warbikers X3 - Nob with Power Klaw/Bosspole
Warbikers X3 - Nob with Power Klaw/Bosspole
Gretchen x23 - 2 Runtherds

Lootaz x5
Lootaz x5
Lootaz x5

Dakkajet - Additional Supa-Shoota
Dakkajet - Additional Supa-Shoota
Dakkajet - Additional Supa-Shoota

Aegis Defense Line - Quad Gun Emplacement[

The gretchen obviously go with the Defense Line in the backfield, taking down fliers, and getting ridiculous cover saves. MSU Lootaz are kind of the norm, so that should be self explanatory. The Dakkajets are just REALLY good. They kill everything. Also, what rules are being argued when it comes to the Fighta Ace? FAQ says to reference the BRB for Strafing Run, which is painfully clear.

I like the MSU approach for Warbikers as well, since most armies seem to have large units that concentrate fire. This limits the potential to run your entire force off the board, and it's a good way to get PKs into whatever you like. Also, Dakkaguns are SO good! Glancing side armour to death is tons of fun.

If you're not able to take IA characters, you could drop some Gretchen and a Runtherd and change to Wazdakka... but Zhadsnark is so fun, and his model is gorgeous...

Thoughts?

I can't take IA, mostly because I can't even afford the books. :(

I'm thinking the mobs of 3 work best. They're Orks that should cripple the opponent with shooting, then assault (Hammer of Wrath!) to finish them off.

Deffkoptas without rokkits could provide even more anti-infantry. Then let the PK's or Battlewagons deal with the few tanks left.

So yea I was doing the math for Powerclaw vrs big choppa and it is difficult. Cause outside of combat you basically get another biker and all the shooting he offers. In combat combined the powerclaw nob is much better against marines, but worse if you consider that he is striking at the same time instead of before powerfists and axes. Against vehicles it is a tough call because the vehicle is most likely going to die to all those attacks from the orks(4 each at strength 4)

But also it is just the number of points across the army that it would cost to give them all power claws. An extra 20 points per unit adds up really quickly. I think for fewer units then it is claws, but for more units then choppas.

I was also thinking of something like
Wazdakka
12x bikers with Claw nob
2x3 bikers with big choppa nob and banner

Throw Wazdakka in either the smaller units or the really big one and then use the smaller units to eat overwatch/take on 5 man marine units or 10 man GEQ units.

Thats 700 points and a solid core to the army

2 mandatory dakkajets(cause I loves them such awesome models and fun to play with going "DAKKADAKKADAKKA whenever I shot with it) thats another 260

960 gone, Then I like to take necron allies
Nemesor, variable unit of immortals(change it up to make he points work for the odd numbers) with a pulse tek(give my bikes those yummy improved cover saves) and a doom scythe. Thats another 500 on the dot(right now)

Sitting at 700 plus 260 plus 500 Thats 1460. Add in two more immortals, or if I freed up about 30 points I could instead get an aegis defense line with the re-roll for reserves that the immortals will sit on as they guard my home objective. Or just 10 points for the line by itself. So final list for 1500 looks like

Wazdakka
12x bikers with power claw nob
2x3 bikers with big choppa nob and boss pole
2x dakka jet with extra shoota and ace fighter
Nemesor
7x immortals
Doom Scythe

For 2000 I would add in:
Warboss - Powerclaw, Attacksquig, cybork, bosspole and warbike

5x nob bikers - Stickbombs, cybork body(more for CC than shooting but with the number of template weapons I expect to start seeing, or things that ignore coversaves(looking at you tau) I want that back up.
Pain boy with grot orderly
2x nobs with big choppas
1x nob with waggghhh banner
1x nob with power claw and shoota/skorcha

Exactly 500 points, I could add some or lose some here pretty easily

So how does that list look to you guys?

Da yella 'eads wrote:

Im not using rokkits, they are stock, with 1 having a buzzsaw. The TL bigshootas and DAKKAgun match up very nicely, and they cause quite alot of damage to units and low armor. And sticking a buzzsaw in there also allows the unit to have some bit all its own, not to mention they are all T5 multiwound models, so they can really take a beating, specially with a BP boss in there. They also confer hit and run as well, not to mention if I want to break them apart I can, AND the unit is mostly there to keep the bullets from killing off my boss before he gets to the lines and does what he does best, kill things with ease

Ah, sorry I misread it. Yeah, the big shootas will match up well and run 10 points cheaper than rokkits. I can see the Hit And Run gain being extremely useful since it makes it easier to stay in CC rather than getting shot to pieces (great for the warboss). Also, you can leave the opponent stranded at the end of their turn so they can be shot to pieces, and you can then recharge next round to regain Furious Charge. Nice.

I also love the idea of a biker boss riding out and being escorted by a bunch of crazy kopta pilots to the tune of Ride of the Valkyries.

You know what, I'm gonna try out this combo!

Yea see, sometimes its best to think about as many possibilities of different unit builds for that reason. You think koptas and instantly think TL rokkits, because they pack such a punch. When really its the TL bigshootas that do the damage just by sheer volume, and all the goodies you get from the 2 units coming together. Its pretty nice and really tough against anything STR4 or less in CC

Leth wrote:So yea I was doing the math for Powerclaw vrs big choppa and it is difficult. Cause outside of combat you basically get another biker and all the shooting he offers. In combat combined the powerclaw nob is much better against marines, but worse if you consider that he is striking at the same time instead of before powerfists and axes. Against vehicles it is a tough call because the vehicle is most likely going to die to all those attacks from the orks(4 each at strength 4)

But also it is just the number of points across the army that it would cost to give them all power claws. An extra 20 points per unit adds up really quickly. I think for fewer units then it is claws, but for more units then choppas.

I was also thinking of something like
Wazdakka
12x bikers with Claw nob
2x3 bikers with big choppa nob and banner

Throw Wazdakka in either the smaller units or the really big one and then use the smaller units to eat overwatch/take on 5 man marine units or 10 man GEQ units.

Thats 700 points and a solid core to the army

2 mandatory dakkajets(cause I loves them such awesome models and fun to play with going "DAKKADAKKADAKKA whenever I shot with it) thats another 260

960 gone, Then I like to take necron allies
Nemesor, variable unit of immortals(change it up to make he points work for the odd numbers) with a pulse tek(give my bikes those yummy improved cover saves) and a doom scythe. Thats another 500 on the dot(right now)

Sitting at 700 plus 260 plus 500 Thats 1460. Add in two more immortals, or if I freed up about 30 points I could instead get an aegis defense line with the re-roll for reserves that the immortals will sit on as they guard my home objective. Or just 10 points for the line by itself. So final list for 1500 looks like

Wazdakka
12x bikers with power claw nob
2x3 bikers with big choppa nob and boss pole
2x dakka jet with extra shoota and ace fighter
Nemesor
7x immortals
Doom Scythe

For 2000 I would add in:
Warboss - Powerclaw, Attacksquig, cybork, bosspole and warbike

5x nob bikers - Stickbombs, cybork body(more for CC than shooting but with the number of template weapons I expect to start seeing, or things that ignore coversaves(looking at you tau) I want that back up.
Pain boy with grot orderly
2x nobs with big choppas
1x nob with waggghhh banner
1x nob with power claw and shoota/skorcha

Exactly 500 points, I could add some or lose some here pretty easily

So how does that list look to you guys?

Now, even with Warbikers, is a PK that necessary?

IMHO, even Ork Warbikers are glass cannons that rely more on mid range shooting and cover to achieve there goals.

That is why outside of the warbosses there are only two. Also the kill ratio between regular/choppa and a claw is huge. Even if you add in another bike instead of the power claw it is much better than both combined in CC. Trade off is another shot and I would only really increase the size of the immortals unit or add an aegis defense line.

So I played this today against daemons and had success.


Bikez n Bulletz (Orks)
HQ - 140
Warboss (140)
power klaw; warbike; cybork body; bosspole.

Elites - 225
15 Lootas (225)
Mek.

Troops - 450
6 Nobz (410)
Painboy; 3× big choppa; 2× power klaw; 3× slugga; Waaagh! banner; warbikes; cybork bodies.

10 Gretchin (40)
Runtherd.

Heavy Support - 197
3 Big Gunz (87)
6× additional Grot Krew; 3× ammo runts.

Battlewagon (110)
4× big shoota.

1,012 points

I know this is an awkward point total, but this is what my opponent wanted. Lootas were run in Dakka Battlewagon, and did really well against a flying MC.

Nob Bikerz were amazing as always, but the real surprise was the 3 Kannons. They managed to kill 3x their points before whiffing during a shooting phase and being assaulted the next opp turn. I can see running more at higher points.

Yup, I totally misunderstood the Zzap Gun. My memory told me that it auto-glanced as long as it hit - sooooo... completely wrong on that regard.

Grabba Claws, for only 5pts, are a very interesting anti-flier piece of wargear. If you can get that wagon so that the Grabba Klaw is within 2" of the flier, there's a 50% chance it's going to crash and burn at the start of your opponents turn. (at least, until it's FAQ'd).

Challenges haven't been an issue for me, though. Denying a challenge so that my boys can strike at the character isn't a loss, particularly if I have two Klaws in the unit, so one will always get to strike. And, of course, placing models so that your character can't accept a challenge, then moves in on his initiative phase to strike as normal. Taught a Necron player some very hard lessons on how to bypass challenges ;D

Again, I can't see me dropping my Kanz. Their effectiveness, particularly with blast clipping in 6th, is too tempting. The Dakka Jet speaks for itself, though I've had mixed experiences with it and vehicles. My first time using it, it caused a single glance on a Venom :C

I DID, however, use it in conjunction with my Kanz to completely wipe out a 20 man strong Necron Warrior unit with Despair Tech and Res Orb Lord in a single shooting phase. That was beautiful. Against a rhino, though... a single glance... yet I can't see myself dropping it

Yeah I recently changed my blitza bommer into a dakkajet and I prefer it much more. Havin that many shots TL hitting on a 3+ is just great.

Tactic for Trukks.

Help me out here.

I've been seeing posts that Trukks aren't worth it anymore... I think I disagree and here's why:
1) Trukks are 3 HP and glances don't do anything other than take HP. So... no more wreckage via Glance shots (-1 on vehicle chart) ala 5th ed.
2) If I'm reading the fast vehicle rules right... they're even faster in 6th. 12" move in movement phase plus the additional 12" in shooting phase (flat out). That's MUCH better than 5th.
3) When a vehicle explodes, it's STR4 to occupants irregardless if vehicle is open-top or not. HOWEVER, Trukks always roll on the ramshackle table in the ork codex... and kaboom! states that the orks takes STR3 wounds (not STR4).
4) The only nerf that I see is that fact that if you're wrecked/exploded on your opponent's turn, you can't assault.

So... to me, trukk armies are as viable, if not better than 5th.

Thoughts?

whembly wrote:Tactic for Trukks.

Help me out here.

I've been seeing posts that Trukks aren't worth it anymore... I think I disagree and here's why:
1) Trukks are 3 HP and glances don't do anything other than take HP. So... no more wreckage via Glance shots (-1 on vehicle chart) ala 5th ed.
2) If I'm reading the fast vehicle rules right... they're even faster in 6th. 12" move in movement phase plus the additional 12" in shooting phase (flat out). That's MUCH better than 5th.
3) When a vehicle explodes, it's STR4 to occupants irregardless if vehicle is open-top or not. HOWEVER, Trukks always roll on the ramshackle table in the ork codex... and kaboom! states that the orks takes STR3 wounds (not STR4).
4) The only nerf that I see is that fact that if you're wrecked/exploded on your opponent's turn, you can't assault.

So... to me, trukk armies are as viable, if not better than 5th.

Thoughts?

The problem isn't the trukk, its what's inside it. 12 boys are hardly enough to threaten most targets, and unless you're chargin two or 3 squads into a unit, they won't do a ton of damage. I gave them a try the other day, and the losses they suffer from overwatch hurts way worse than you would think. You've only got 12 boys to begin with. Even losing one or 2 is a huge blow and really hurts what minor killing power you had to begin with.

Nobz and meganobz can probably be ok, but I would much rather have them in a proper battlewagon than a flimsy AV 10 trukk.

I dunno, a trukk for a MANz mob is only 35pts, where as a BW is 90 before upgrades. You can put a bunch of gak into an Ork build with those points.

Lessee... Assuming we want maximum Meganobz per mob, that'll be 240 per, with 2 Mobz at only 200, to fit some Mega Warbosses. So 3x275, 2x535 (assuming a 100 point 'cheap as chips 'Megabozz). Add in some Kombi-weapons and dealez for the Trukks and Warbosses, you have yourself a nice little shockforce at 2000 points, maybe even with Grotsnik and Cybork if you're going to 2000.(as an extra HQ). That'd be 27 Meganobz, all with Cybrok, along with 2 Megabozzes, anand Grotsnik. Something skary.

whembly wrote:Tactic for Trukks.

Help me out here.

I've been seeing posts that Trukks aren't worth it anymore... I think I disagree and here's why:
1) Trukks are 3 HP and glances don't do anything other than take HP. So... no more wreckage via Glance shots (-1 on vehicle chart) ala 5th ed.
2) If I'm reading the fast vehicle rules right... they're even faster in 6th. 12" move in movement phase plus the additional 12" in shooting phase (flat out). That's MUCH better than 5th.
3) When a vehicle explodes, it's STR4 to occupants irregardless if vehicle is open-top or not. HOWEVER, Trukks always roll on the ramshackle table in the ork codex... and kaboom! states that the orks takes STR3 wounds (not STR4).
4) The only nerf that I see is that fact that if you're wrecked/exploded on your opponent's turn, you can't assault.

So... to me, trukk armies are as viable, if not better than 5th.

Thoughts?

Open topped vehicles are assault vehicles, which allows their passengers to assault, even if the vehicle is nothing but a smoldering crater.

Also keep in mind that Kaboom! still leaves craters as per the ork FAQ.

whembly wrote:Tactic for Trukks.

Help me out here.

I've been seeing posts that Trukks aren't worth it anymore... I think I disagree and here's why:
1) Trukks are 3 HP and glances don't do anything other than take HP. So... no more wreckage via Glance shots (-1 on vehicle chart) ala 5th ed.
2) If I'm reading the fast vehicle rules right... they're even faster in 6th. 12" move in movement phase plus the additional 12" in shooting phase (flat out). That's MUCH better than 5th.
3) When a vehicle explodes, it's STR4 to occupants irregardless if vehicle is open-top or not. HOWEVER, Trukks always roll on the ramshackle table in the ork codex... and kaboom! states that the orks takes STR3 wounds (not STR4).
4) The only nerf that I see is that fact that if you're wrecked/exploded on your opponent's turn, you can't assault.

So... to me, trukk armies are as viable, if not better than 5th.

Thoughts?

Trukks are still one of the easiest vehicles to destroy in the entire game, and we don't get items to save the trukk from blowing up (like flicker fields).

That being said, every game has a 50% chance of having night fighting first turn, and you have a 1/6 chance of making it night fighting on the first turn via a strategic warlord trait. So add a KFF, and get lucky on the night fighting rolls, and you're trukks have anywhere from a 3-5 cover save.

Or you could just win the starting roll, and not worry about it.

Eitherway, I think I might try this out.

Bomb Squig wrote:Yeah I recently changed my blitza bommer into a dakkajet and I prefer it much more. Havin that many shots TL hitting on a 3+ is just great.

4+.

Strafing run grants you +1 against 'ground' targets, Fights Ace grants +1 against skimmers, jetbikes and fliers only.

Edited to include fliers.

So Dakkajets are still BS2 against jump infantry, or is it BS3?

It has been said many times in this thread that Fighta Ace gives BS3 against flyers. But you can only get official rules from the digital copy on the ipad.

Dribble Joy wrote:

Bomb Squig wrote:Yeah I recently changed my blitza bommer into a dakkajet and I prefer it much more. Havin that many shots TL hitting on a 3+ is just great.

4+.

Strafing run grants you +1 against 'ground' targets, Fights Ace grants +1 against skimmers, jetbikes and fliers only.

Edited to include fliers.

Oops, I meant 3 BS, 4+. Sorry about that

wasent the whole point of a trukk was to get the boyz into combat as quick as possible? and then once the boyz are in combat they are basiclly mobile cover. I think trukks are going to be just as effective in 6th as they were in 5th.

Dribble Joy wrote:

Bomb Squig wrote:Yeah I recently changed my blitza bommer into a dakkajet and I prefer it much more. Havin that many shots TL hitting on a 3+ is just great.

4+.

Strafing run grants you +1 against 'ground' targets, Fights Ace grants +1 against skimmers, jetbikes and fliers only.

Edited to include fliers.

You hit jetbikes with 3+, +1 bs from starfing run and you get bs 3 (rule says that you count as having bs 3 against flying "things" including jetbikes) from fighta ace.

So Saim Hann...

I thought jetbikes weren't included in the rules for strafing run?

Rulebook says that bikes are affected and excludes skimmers and flyers.

I'm just assuming it means all bikes.

G00fySmiley wrote:to me the mad dok has never really accomplished anything unless he is snikrot'd in and this time he can't even assault out of that move so he and his unit could be kited around the board fairly easily by one biek jet bike of jump infantry group while they shot the unit to shreds

mad dok is a cool model with a neat back story but one scaple short of a medpack did not change so he still sits in my case unused

Try Mad Dok in an Apocalypse game with the Apocalypse formation of 100+ boys .... it was awesome !!!!!!!!!!!

I've played a few game lately and my biggest problem has been AV 14. Every game I've managed to kill everything on the board, but leaving landraiders with no way of killing them.

I have been thinking of running a suicide Warboss on a bike, to run with my Nobz. The Boss would only be there to solo assault Landraiders.... What do you guys think?

mrfantastical wrote:I've played a few game lately and my biggest problem has been AV 14. Every game I've managed to kill everything on the board, but leaving landraiders with no way of killing them.

I have been thinking of running a suicide Warboss on a bike, to run with my Nobz. The Boss would only be there to solo assault Landraiders.... What do you guys think?

I might go with a little more subtle change first. Before dumping a ton of points on a Biker Boss, just to address AV14, try massing a number of Rokkits and give them a go.
With the new hull point rules, Rokkits are better than ever.
My personal fav is Rokkit Buggies. Cheap, Fast, and Twin Linked.
Koptas and BWs are great platforms as well.

mrfantastical wrote:I've played a few game lately and my biggest problem has been AV 14. Every game I've managed to kill everything on the board, but leaving landraiders with no way of killing them.

I have been thinking of running a suicide Warboss on a bike, to run with my Nobz. The Boss would only be there to solo assault Landraiders.... What do you guys think?

So what? Just leave the stupid box where it is and dodge it. If it's Godhammer (I believe that's what the regular one is called?), it will never kill enough orks to make it worth its points anyways. The redeemer can really hurt you if you aren't careful - however, if spread out correctly, not even those flamestorm cannons are that dangerous anymore. Keep in mind, that the sponsons my not templates covering their own hull. The most dangerous one is actually the crusader, as its weapons can kill droves of boyz and its increased transport size means more deadly cargo. Make sure to block it with your vehicles to force it to either ram or go around them. If you manage to kill everything but the landraider, you should win about any mission anyways. Land Raiders can't even contest your objectives anymore.

If you want to kill it however, possible options beside the warboss would be deff rollas, DCCW on kanz or deff dreads, tank bustaz or maybe blitza bommers.

I have played 3 games so far of 6th edition. The last two have been with a Big Mek with a KFF. Even with the 5+ save it gives now, I think it is still worth it. It has saved my green orkish butt several times. I don't know why, but last edition I never really used my burna boys. I have used them in all three of these games. They do awesome.

Just thought I would share

I'm debating on getting some psyker defenses and thinking of options.maybe having something like a farseer with runes of warding on a jetbike cowering way in the corner 6' from anything else with maybe some cheap jetbike troops or something *maybe a last turn contest*. Necron fliers doen't scare me with the amount of bodies I tend to run with now a days but I fear that psychich powers will really mess me up down the line.

What do you guys think?

Eldar are desperate allies, so they can't score or contest objectives.

Jidmah wrote:Eldar are desperate allies, so they can't score or contest objectives.

ahh darn, oh well I can probably still go use those jetbikes to fly forward and charge/suicide something while I hide the farseer in the corner.