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mrsako wrote:I think the blurred page did say something about a STR4 hit to rear armor to the Dread (i.e. don't roll a 6) if something something something...

Anyway... yes, a lander carrying a Furioso is exactly what we need... I can imagine a big maching dropping down from the sky and running into the enemy, clawing and destroying everything in front of it, and a squad coming out from the back.

Now we need more pics. :(

The dread takes the hit if the Stormraven is destroyed while carrying the Dread.

There's not a single pic of the model in the codex, trust me we all looked, in the art, in the colored pics... nothing... perhaps it will be a huge "april fools' unveiling on the part of GW

If the Lander blows up with the Dread riding in it, it takes a S4 hit to it's rear armor.

Scarella, are the Vanguard Vets jump infantry standard in addition to their drop in points?

They are pretty standard to the Space Marine ones, just cheaper by 2 termagants to compete with the other Jump-pack infantry choices in the codex.

BA Vanguard still do have the Red Thirst rule though despite being cheaper, and do not have the descent of angels rule. However, they have hand flamers and infernus pistols replacing some options and have no Relic Blade option for the SGT.

IIRC, adding models is the same being worth 4 termagants, and so is adding jump-packs being worth 2 termagants each.

The Heroic Intervention rule is still there.

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=248074

A nice summary of the rumors being collected.

Really, can we stop with the "costs 2 Termagants, 3 Carnifexes and a Happy Meal" nonsense.

The whole point (haha!) of not posting points values is that we don't want to re-post the Codex up on Dakka. Just saying "it costs 5 points" though isn't going to have the GW C&D Dragon swooping down to eat Yakface & Co. As long as you're not posting sections of the Codex verbatim, we'll be fine.

So really, just say what they cost. The alternative is really silly.

Hmm, overall I think I prefer that fan dex.

Initial reactions (warning hyperbole present)

- red thirst looks very fluffy but pretty tricky to get any decent use out of and a bit random for marines. The games when the devvys get furious charge and the assault squads are all just normal guys will be hilarious but the games when 4 or 5 squads fluke furious charge aren't going to be much fun for the other guy.

I predict a return to some of the 3rd ed builds, people are going to max out on dedicated cc troops so that when they do roll up furious charge they get some benefit out of it.

- Seth's ability to improve the odds is good though and fluffy for fleshtearers without being as OP as that fandex fleshtearers was.

- Oh, they have literal angels now. That qualifies as exactly unimaginative and goofy as the wolves riding wolves were. Still his stats look beastly and a good model might sway me to liking it.

- Baals are fast! all the time! In fast slots! AND SCOUT!! Were they not good enough already? Fantastic, now instead of morticon chucking 3 of them at me I can look forward to having 3 of them AND some vindicators chucked at me or 3 plus 3 landers each flinging 3 uber-cc dreads at me. Still I guess they compete with attack bikes.

- fast rhinos and razors for a pts increase seems fair, you need a lot of them so the pts swiftly add up but you get increased utility out of it, particularly for razorbacks (move 12" fire off assault cannon and deploy a squad to double tap/drop a meltagun or 12" flamer turret and handflamer/combi-flamer/flamer easy bake death). Fast vindies arejust stupid though. Fast vindicators, for those highly mobile seigecraft. Its like they don't even read their own fluff.

- flyers in. With this much chatter I suspected it would be. Not happy about the dread carrying (who decided BA were the dread chapter? Surely the guys who slowly and irrecovably go insane would have the least dreads?) or the assault ramp but at a pts cost of close to a land raider and using up a heavy slot that's fair. You can pull of an almighty alpha strike with them but they burn up pts and leave you with small squads.

- DC as a unique choice that are non-scoring troops is the best solution to representing the DC that GW have yet come up with. Not sure about the 30man uber squad though. And why relentless?

- jump packing troops are in, good.

- exalted/sanquinary guard whatever I'm not sure on. I like the concept but very expensive killy guys with no invulnerable is always a dicy prospect. Descent of angels is a nice rule though and teamed with a stormraven you could pull off an interesting alpha strike.

- vanguard, do they compete with baals? Because if so you will never see them. Ever. Every BA player worth his salt will twig baal spam is awesome the second they open the dex.

- sternguard, I'm not a fan of the fluff change. I liked the VG/SG split for UM but it doesn't make a huge amount of sense fo BA. Oh well, drop pod sternguard should mesh well with the playstyle of this list at least.

- scouts are troops, well hooray. People will use them again. Furious charging scoring infiltrators for a cheap price with locator beacons to call in deep strike units. That sounds like a fluffy BA build and fun to play/against.

some questions

do they get landspeeder storms?

Nice to see that there's no word of a plastic Furioso.

I just love metal dreads for some reason. I just gotta figure out how to model it with a flamer instead of a storm bolter on one arm.

Oh and the magna grapple?

I can't decide if that's awesome or unbelievably stupid.

bravelybravesirrobin wrote:Oh and the magna grapple?

I can't decide if that's awesome or unbelievably stupid.

If my reading of it is right, you can tank shock an enemy unit. With their own tank.

I believe that qualifies for "Crazy awesome"

bhsman wrote:

bravelybravesirrobin wrote:Oh and the magna grapple?

I can't decide if that's awesome or unbelievably stupid.

If my reading of it is right, you can tank shock an enemy unit. With their own tank.

I believe that qualifies for "Crazy awesome"

We need a head/desk emoticon.

bravelybravesirrobin wrote:Oh and the magna grapple?

I can't decide if that's awesome or unbelievably stupid.

awesome. i'm having trouble though accepting the "it's raining land raiders" theme without a $800 forgeworld thunderhawk at the tableside.


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bhsman wrote:If my reading of it is right, you can tank shock an enemy unit. With their own tank.

I believe that qualifies for "Crazy awesome"

agree with the awesome but warseer's threads (and possibly here too.. it's a blur) say that the vehicle stops 1" away from models or at terrain. i doubt you'll be able to tank shock. personally, i think you should be able to do this harpoon scorpion mortal kombat attack at monstrous creatures too... heck, if you're playing captain ahab with your dread, i'm pretty sure the freakin' white whale is a monstrous creature!

bhsman wrote:

bravelybravesirrobin wrote:Oh and the magna grapple?

I can't decide if that's awesome or unbelievably stupid.

If my reading of it is right, you can tank shock an enemy unit. With their own tank.

I believe that qualifies for "Crazy awesome"

Seriously, Slaaneshi Daemons being able to make Dreads and Kans dance is certainly 90 times dumber than a dread being able to drag a tank 7 inches through an enemy unit.


What I wanna know is if I can still assault after. And if it moved 6 inches the previous turn, but it moves another 6 due to magna-grapple, does that mean that I only hit on a 6 during assault?

Drag Leman Russ from squadron through enemy unit, charge it, kill entire squadron which explodes and finishes off fleeing guardsmen...sounds fun to me.

Jack

P.S. Of course squadrons are actually less vulnerable to this as they can make sure to assign the grappler hit to the furthest model.

As I'm going through the BA rumor confirmations, I'm thinking this is the most ridiculously stupidly awesome Codex GW has ever produced.

I will definitely be playing it.

Yeah, so even if you can't get close enough with your 22+ inch move and assault range you can scorpion a vehicle over to rar! on.

Good times.

Gonna be hard pressed to get all that in with 1200 pnts spent on death company

bravelybravesirrobin wrote:- Baals are fast! all the time! In fast slots! AND SCOUT!! Were they not good enough already?

GW has a new model to sell.

You do the math.

Honestly I'm surprised that they didn't also give it Rendi... oh wait...

H.B.M.C. wrote:

bravelybravesirrobin wrote:- Baals are fast! all the time! In fast slots! AND SCOUT!! Were they not good enough already?

GW has a new model to sell.

You do the math.

No they don't....

Gornall wrote:No they don't....

GW has been systematically getting rid of hybrid models with each new release.

The Baal is one of the last remaining Marine hybrids.

And we all saw the pic.

blood angel wrote:Yeah, so even if you can't get close enough with your 22+ inch move and assault range you can scorpion a vehicle over to rar! on.

And yet, isn't this a far more elegant HtH-accelerating mechanic than Lash?

As long as you cry out "Get over here!" in a deep booming voice each time you do it, yes.

I completely agree. I welcome our new blood angel overlords.. obviously.

JohnHwangDD wrote:And yet, isn't this a far more elegant HtH-accelerating mechanic than Lash?

And yet still more fun...since its purpose specific and cover can actually protect against it.

Jack

H.B.M.C. wrote:

Gornall wrote:No they don't....

GW has been systematically getting rid of hybrid models with each new release.

The Baal is one of the last remaining Marine hybrids.

And we all saw the pic.

I thought you were talking about the Lander.

Ah. I can see how you made that mistake, what with me specifically quoting a section of Sir Robin's post that dealt with the Baal.


Wait...

It's late.

Glad to see the order I placed of 5 jump pack boxes will not go unused.


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Question: Do DC come with jumppacks included in cost, or is there an option to buy them, or do they not get them at all?

blood angel wrote:Yeah, so even if you can't get close enough with your 22+ inch move and assault range you can scorpion a vehicle over to rar! on.

Good times.

Gonna be hard pressed to get all that in with 1200 pnts spent on death company

22" inch move and assault range? If you're talking about the lander, nothing can assault after disembarking, unless I read something incorrectly (or more precisely, didn't read something correctly)

And besides, even if DC cost the same (not likely), you're looking at 900 points base. I doubt 300 of that would go to wargear, unless there is no limit on the number of powerweapons available to them.

so do the death co dreads that now count as troops have the current weapons load out (in addition to the magna grappler)? do they get the extra d3 attacks on the charge like death co dreads do now? can they take normal dread weapons like twin lascannons or plasma cannons?

That was supposed to be taken with a little sarcasm.

And yes, mrsako, you have missed the cut off 'special rules' section on that page where the next rule seems to start with Ass- assuming assault.