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(well obviously it will be made of paper and probably a rectangle... I mean besides that)

So Fantasy and 40k are getting demon books, what will they contain?

I can't speculate about fantasy (don't play it) but for 40k:

No Lost and the Damned (<-say is that a new Ork? Good one!)

HQ
4 kinds of greater demons with a bevy of special rules
Build your own demon prince?

Troops
4 kinds of lesser demons.
Nuglings? Gibbering hoards?
Furies?

Elite
???

Fast
Furies?
4 kinds of demon Cav
???

Heavy
Unbound defiler
???

Seems a lot of blanks in there.
Also I've heard we're getting plastic Bloodthirsters and Daemonettes, anyone know about Plaguebearers or Horrors? Will there be any humans in it at all? Sorcerers and the like?

I was going to write something extremely witty along the lines of "A4, softback, blah blah", but you are too wiley for the likes of me.

There also are:
Demontanks, cavalry-style units (eg Moloch of Khorne) and of course Heralds. Think you named the rest of the lot.
Deamon Princes might be Elite.

Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Will there be any humans in it at all? Sorcerers and the like?

Probably not. But you'll never know until it's released.

I'm hoping to see some truly fresh ideas and models come out in the new demon book. It would be a shame to lose them in the C. Space marines for a lame army.

Can't think of having seen Heralds and Demontanks in 40k...may you enlighten me why they aren't fresh units?

Oh...does any one know if there will be a ally-system similar to DH/WH?

a juicy selection of Demonic Engines/artillery in Heavy Support would be fabulous - there are certainly plenty of Epic ideas to borrow. Or some heavy-weaponed monsters, so long as they're not too carnifex-like. But maybe hoping for a big new kit is too optimistic...

some possessed human slaves as meatsheilds would also be interesting - hordes of individually weak unarmed humans but they're fearless and have i5+ saves and will bite your head off if they can and by they way they come in units of 30.

Clang wrote:
some possessed human slaves as meatsheilds would also be interesting - hordes of individually weak unarmed humans but they're fearless and have i5+ saves and will bite your head off if they can and by they way they come in units of 30.

Yeah...we all got our dreams, right?

Kid_Kyoto wrote:
HQ
4 kinds of greater demons with a bevy of special rules
Build your own demon prince?

Troops
4 kinds of lesser demons.
Nuglings? Gibbering hoards?
Furies?

Elite
???

Fast
Furies?
4 kinds of demon Cav
???

Heavy
Unbound defiler
???

Here's what I'd guess (based on the rumors I reposted a week or something ago):

HQ
Bloodthirster / Keeper of Secret / Lord of Change / Great Unclean One
Herald

Elites
Demon Prince?
Heavy Demon Cav (Bloodcrushers, Plagueriders)?
Unbound Defiler?

Troops
Bloodletters / Demonettes / Horrors / Plaguebearers
Flamers
Nurglings

Fast Attak
Flesh Hounds / Mounted Demonettes / Screamers / Furies
Heavy Demon Cav (Bloodcrushers, Plagueriders)?

Heavy Support
Demon Engine
Unbound Defiler?
Demon Prince?

Since each unit will now be unique demons again, this army has a HUGE amount of variety, without bringing in any cultist / marine elements. And for those already fearing another 'Zilla list, well this is where the giant monsters should be IMO - reality-warping demons vomited from Hell itself, charging in to tear you limb from limb. The bugs have just made a wonderful concept into dirty with all their guns and nonsense

Thinking about it, the rumored "unbound defiler" may just be the demon fire support engine rumored elsewhere. I could see heavy support being the demon engine + demon prince (odd place, but as noted in the other post they have to compete with other, better things when amongst real demons). Possibly some other demo fire unit?

- Salvage

What are heralds again? Are they super duper greater demons, or just super lesser demons?

Slightly super lesser demons, think you might even get 2 for an HQ choice. Perhaps.

I gather they're quite cheap, and all have distinct stats (ie Khorne is different from Nurgle etc) and a few demonic chaos gift type upgrades. They can all ride demonic mounts too I believe. Suspect they'll be independent characters too.

I've heard/ guessed at the Demon Princes as Elite.

I imagine it will have a humanoid alien with an odd color for his flesh on the cover. It will probably have mutations due to radiation. It might be covered in skulls, standing on skulls, or wearing skulls. Lastly, and I know this for a fact, it will have one arm raised (or pointed) and will be screaming.

Mark my words.

Seems weird that the Demon Prince and Defiler would be in the list if there is No CSM...
I mean did the Prince leave his boys at home to put their feet up?

I'm also not convinced there is enough demand for demon only forces...

I hope there is allied IG and CSM lists...

Panic wrote:I'm also not convinced there is enough demand for demon only forces...

I concur.

I wonder if this Codex is something G-Dub planned all along or something to calm the Chaos players who got screwed with lesser demons.

"Shucks those chaos players are pissed."
"Why don't we give'em that WFB Demon Army book as a Codex to shut them up?"
"That's a Fantasy book. How could we do that?"
"Simple, different cover, round bases, no modifiers to worry about. Plus they'll buy anything we put out."
"Sounds good Jervis, I'll pass it by Darth Kirby."

Seens odd.. if the rumours are true, then without much fanfare at all, GW is basically creating a brand new 40k army.. a mostly footslogging CC-oriented force just trying to get across the field protected only by 5+ Invulnerable saves.

It's not brand new. It was an army is 1st and 2nd edition, only to disappear in 3rd edition.

Perhaps we'll see a Codex where Demons become elites if they are different from a marked general, a la the marked marines in the old Chaos Dex?

You take undivided and you can take any of the basic demons as core. But if you take a Nurgle HQ, then you're stuck with demonettes and bloodletters as elites.

Something like that and BOOM!--instant elite slots.

Yeah, that would fit in with how they've done the Ork Codex. Buying certain HQs make certain units into Troops.

stonefox wrote:I imagine it will have a humanoid alien with an odd color for his flesh on the cover. It will probably have mutations due to radiation. It might be covered in skulls, standing on skulls, or wearing skulls. Lastly, and I know this for a fact, it will have one arm raised (or pointed) and will be screaming.

Mark my words.

I feel like sigging this just so we can all see how right you are when it comes out in the spring.

What are the fantasy battle daemon army units?

You can field up to 4 different Herolds and that there is no undivided Greater Deamon...ah...no...that Elite choices becoming Troops just doesn't make sense here...

PS: Darth Kirby? lol But isn't he 'out of business'? At least a bit?

PPS: How old is Jervis btw...maybe he want's to retire and hang out on the Bahamas anytime soon?

PPPS: Dreams are great...I know...I had a odd nightmare last night...it was about GW publishing the perfect ruleset in 5th ed and with every WD you bought you got a personal serial number for watching a flash battle rep on their homepage, played by top ranked players. Maybe the glue and paint smog went straight up my brain...

Flagg07 wrote:

Panic wrote:I'm also not convinced there is enough demand for demon only forces...

I concur.

I wonder if this Codex is something G-Dub planned all along or something to calm the Chaos players who got screwed with lesser demons.

"Shucks those chaos players are pissed."
"Why don't we give'em that WFB Demon Army book as a Codex to shut them up?"
"That's a Fantasy book. How could we do that?"
"Simple, different cover, round bases, no modifiers to worry about. Plus they'll buy anything we put out."
"Sounds good Jervis, I'll pass it by Darth Kirby."

Nah, this was the plan all along. The daemons were left out of the CSM codex so that they could get their own codex to go along with the release of their new plastic models. Obviously release schedules are dictating game design.

"Wow, these daemons are selling like hotcakes."
"Yeah, that's why we're doing them in plastic."
"Great! But when should we release them? With the WHFB Hordes of Chaos or with the WH40K Chaos Space Marines?"
"Neither!"
"What you say?!"
"Neither! We'll release them on their own!"
"That's highly unorthodox! We never release a new range of models without releasing new rules to go with them! With no codex or army book we won't generate nearly as many sales..."
"But we will! We'll simultaneously release Daemonic Legion books for both WHFB and WH40K to coincide with the release of the plastic daemons. This way we can sell the same army to both WHFB and WH40K players. We'll kill two birds with one stone! Bwahahaha!"
"Interesting. But what of the Chaos Space Marines? Why would CSM players want rules for Daemonic Legions if they already can use the full line of daemons in their CSM army?"
"The CSM will be dealt with. I am sending Gav Thorpe to 'take care' of them."
"Ah... perfect."
"Exactly. It's so perfect, it's slowed..."

It has been said that all the old demons will be supported, even those that they nolonger make (like beasts of Nurgel) but one that I'm curious about can be found at the bottom of this page here: http://www.solegends.com/citcat9x3/c92402chaosspacemarines-03.htm

The Bloodslaughter Demonic Robot of Khorn was always a little silly in design, but I DO like the idea of a giant robotic killing machine that never stops!

I would put it in Fast attack and make it a fast moving walker (able to move 12 inches, or give it fleet) with AV 10, S6, FC and power weapons.

If its anything like the last couple of codex's, it is going to be weaksauce.

HQ choices, probibly the new token heavy,
Oblits, and the big daddy oblit landraider thing, the deamons as troop choices, and the other whimsical dealings of the warp.

This must be the new and improved Slaves to Darkness.

I'm not really excited about just another half hearted attept at game development by Jervis's kid.

Grot 6 wrote:If its anything like the last couple of codex's, it is going to be weaksauce.

...

I'm not really excited about just another half hearted attept at game development by Jervis's kid.

I find the 3x whine & cheese in your post funny in relation to a second Chaos book (that you assume is another product of Jervis' kid). You want cheese? It isn't in C: CSM and may or may not be in C: Demons, though your post clearly infers that the opposite is true! Now if you had mentioned any of the über-codexes written by Phil Kelly in the last couple years ... :S

I for one am excited to see where C: Demons goes, and will probably buy the codex, regardless of how many metal demons I have waiting since their demonbomb was defused with the latest Chaos 'dex

- Salvage

Boss_Salvage wrote:

Grot 6 wrote:If its anything like the last couple of codex's, it is going to be weaksauce.

...

I'm not really excited about just another half hearted attept at game development by Jervis's kid.

I find the 3x whine & cheese in your post funny in relation to a second Chaos book (that you assume is another product of Jervis' kid). You want cheese? It isn't in C: CSM and may or may not be in C: Demons, though your post clearly infers that the opposite is true! Now if you had mentioned any of the über-codexes written by Phil Kelly in the last couple years ... :S

I for one am excited to see where C: Demons goes, and will probably buy the codex, regardless of how many metal demons I have waiting since their demonbomb was defused with the latest Chaos 'dex

- Salvage

Right.
What he said....still less filling, but tastes great!

swize1 wrote:Seens odd.. if the rumours are true, then without much fanfare at all, GW is basically creating a brand new 40k army.. a mostly footslogging CC-oriented force just trying to get across the field protected only by 5+ Invulnerable saves.

Rumor is that they'll enter via "warp gates." This of course means the army will likely be overpowered or underpowered, as balancing a deep striking assaulty army would seem to be a tricky thing.

It's not brand new. It was an army is 1st and 2nd edition, only to disappear in 3rd edition.

Not exactly. The 2nd edition Daemonworld list included rules for Beastmen and other units, not just daemons. Why GW felt that they couldn't include a Mutant/Beastmen entry to represent the teeming hordes of Mutants on Daemonworlds (and throw LatD players a little bone) is still a mystery.

Dead Horse wrote:
I feel like sigging this just so we can all see how right you are when it comes out in the spring.

I suddenly have a bad feeling GW will do a completely 180 and will instead show a demon girl who's really high on drugs and is smiling with glee. The cover will be safe for work of course, to go with the recent women's rights movement demongirls went through to cover their bare bodies in a vane attempt to halt the ongoing view of themselves as sexual objects. Because men have always been the centerpoint in GW's games, women's empowerment is the new theme to bring in (omg) girls. Just covering my bases.

gorgon wrote:Not exactly. The 2nd edition Daemonworld list included rules for Beastmen and other units, not just daemons. Why GW felt that they couldn't include a Mutant/Beastmen entry to represent the teeming hordes of Mutants on Daemonworlds (and throw LatD players a little bone) is still a mystery.

No models = no rules. And yes, Beastmen have models, but they're WHFB models. How are little Jervis Jr and his friends going to find them at the store? Those aren't Daemon army models! They're Beasts of Chaos army models - it says so right on the box!

I wager that very few people have squads of 40K beastmen. GW only made, what, two or three 40K beastmen? I'm not saying that they shouldn't be in the army, I'm just saying that hardly anyone is getting screwed by the lack of beastmen.

For the record, I'm in favor of 40K beastmen. I must have a company of the little buggers for Epic.

Pariah Press wrote: I wager that very few people have squads of 40K beastmen. GW only made, what, two or three 40K beastmen? I'm not saying that they shouldn't be in the army, I'm just saying that hardly anyone is getting screwed by the lack of beastmen.

What?