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dagsta2 wrote:why do 79 people hate tau

Those were the Tau players.

Vaktathi wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:

I am not saying that Tau had more firepower. At any point. I am saying in 4ed they were able to out-shoot IG. Having units that have two weapons, each roughly the equivalent of a devastator's weapon, that can dance around anything with their blingin' jet packs is definately helpful.

To be fair, IG were often outshot in 4E not only by Tau but also SM's (lol 6 devestator squad armies... min/max'd las/plas squads, Iron Warriors Gunlines, etc), Eldar and even Orks at the tail end of 4E (max's lootas units, tons of shoota boyz...could definitely outshoot many 4E IG armies). IG in 3E/4E were...awful , I remember well those dark days, overcosted infantry, some of the most expensive heavy weapons in the game, terrible tanks and core tank rules, and little ability to maneuver, plus terrain rules that often meant nothing ever saw further than 24" away.

My point was Tau could outshoot all/most armies when they were freshly updated.

Puppies suck.

Ultrasmurfs... I take back whatever was my last vote and say Ultrasmurf cuz I'm sick of all the hate we hear about them as well as hating them.

Kilkrazy wrote:You've missed out the Black Templars.

no i did not

I hate Imperial Guard the most. They just seem like 40k for WWII enthusiasts. Everything else is sci-fi/Fantasy, Marines and Eldar are obviously futuristic, Orks have the whole Mad Max style, Nids are Aliens. Then IG roll up in cammo looking like something from the 1950s and managing to be neither futuristic or fantasy, all while getting insane amounts of butt love from GW and FW regarding their tanks. Leman Russ battle tank is an ugly piece of crap too, and so is the Chimera and all their variants. But most annoying of all is IG fanboys (even more than Space Marine fanboys). Not a day passes on Dakka without someone dribbling on about how IG beat everything because there are billions of them and the... JUST SHUT THE HELL UP ALREADY!!! ><

I think my 2nd would be Space Wolves. Putting aside the whole 'Wolf McWolfingson riding a wolf' thing... The Space Wolves theme ever since 2nd edition seems to be: "We pay less points than regular marines, but have better units". Though what bugs me most about SW is that all the stupid wolf paraphernalia makes their figures almost impossible to use in any other chapter armies.

My honorary mention is going to be SoB... They are okay, but they are really just female Space Marines. Also I heard they were due a codex update so inb4 Saint Pure of Purethrax armed with Pure-grenades and the Hammer of Virginity that gives her purity +1. I'm going to get my hate in now before everyone and their dog starts playing them.

Chaos in general.

GAWD I FREAKEN HATE THE ELDAR!!!!

I HAAAATTEEE THHEEEEMM!

I can almost never freaken win!


Also Grey Knights now....HATE THEM!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Smacks wrote:I hate Imperial Guard the most. They just seem like 40k for WWII enthusiasts. Everything else is sci-fi/Fantasy, Marines and Eldar are obviously futuristic, Orks have the whole Mad Max style, Nids are Aliens. Then IG roll up in cammo looking like something from the 1950s and managing to be neither futuristic or fantasy, all while getting insane amounts of butt love from GW and FW regarding their tanks. Leman Russ battle tank is an ugly piece of crap too, and so is the Chimera and all their variants. But most annoying of all is IG fanboys (even more than Space Marine fanboys). Not a day passes on Dakka without someone dribbling on about how IG beat everything because there are billions of them and the... JUST SHUT THE HELL UP ALREADY!!! ><

There are QUADRILLIONS Of Humans all over the universe. Probably a lot more than that. So yes.. They win by numbers and pure artillary. INAPPROPRIATE COMMENT REMOVED.-Mannahnin

I think my 2nd would be Space Wolves. Putting aside the whole 'Wolf McWolfingson riding a wolf' thing... The Space Wolves theme ever since 2nd edition seems to be: "We pay less points than regular marines, but have better units". Though what bugs me most about SW is that all the stupid wolf paraphernalia makes their figures almost impossible to use in any other chapter armies.

Oh Really? PERSONAL ATTACK REMOVED-Mannahnin ! For a Fully Equipt Grey Knight Troop I am playing 250 Points Each! That about more or less a land raider redeemer or crusader I think. x6..I need 1500 to make just for troop choices. My Terminators cost much more than vanilla marine termies.

We pay our points just like everyone else. Finally...Well...PERSONAL ATTACK REMOVED-Mannahnin OF COURSE THEY HAVE WOLF SKINS AND INAPPROPRIATE VERBIAGE REMOVED.-Mannahnin
!!! They are called Space Wolves PERSONAL ATTACK REMOVED-Mannahnin ! They live on a planet call Fenris, Where giant wolves live. Their Geneseed took a wolf like Aspect to it when it mutated. They live on an ice planet with Wolves. So complaining that you cant use them in another army like a vanilla marine is PERSONAL ATTACK REMOVED-Mannahnin . Really? Their Wolf Cloaks makes it hard to use them in other marine armies? Tha PERSONAL ATTACK REMOVED-Mannahnin

Space wolves are different than the others just like grey knights. What your complaining about would be like complaining that you cant take Grey Knight Terminators and use it in another army...because you CANT! They are Obviously different than any other terminator! Regardless of how you paint them or remodel them . Any bit you put on them to disguise them will still not be enough because they are THAT unique from any other termis and wont look the same.

Oh Really? Edit by the moderati.

Woah! cool the flame jets kid. The topic is which armies you hate. The topic was not: fap furiously over Space Wolves and nerd rage at anyone who dislikes Space Wolves with the fury of 1000 holocausts.

Space wolves aren't that special. They are just a Twighlight Warewolves version of Space Marines. Occasionally I will get a mixed lot of marines on ebay or something. Space Wolves take more effort to convert to vanilla marines than any other chapter like BA or DA or BT which is reason enough for me to be annoyed with them. YMMV try not to be TFG about it.

Field Gen wrote:

Oh Really? Your such an insulting personal remarks are not appropriate

First up, calm down. Second up, statements like these reflect a lot worse on you than they do on the person you're calling an idiot.

My Terminators cost much more than vanilla marine termies.

But have Counterattack and far more weapon options and cost less base.

We pay our points just like everyone else.

Smacks wrote: Though what bugs me most about SW is that all the stupid wolf paraphernalia makes their figures almost impossible to use in any other chapter armies.


You're not supposed to use them for anything else. If you want marines for another army, THEN USE VANILLA MARINES!!!



I swear, dakka sign up should have a check-off box in their sign-up that says "I am not a third grader", just to screen them out.

I don't hate any army. I'd rather see all the current armies stay in the game than any one get knocked out, because I'd hate to mess with someone's little plastic army men. No, that's wrong of me to say . . . to the hobbyists for sure and a lot of the gamers, they're more than just plastic men. We've spent good money on them, we've taken the time to assemble them, to paint them, to take them from a sprue of plastic parts into small pieces of artwork. For me to say, "No, your collection is useless in the game now due to my personal prejudice," is just wrong.

They all have good points and bad points. Even my beloved Sisters of Battle have the unfortunate tendency to slaughter innocents when it's called for.

SickSix wrote:

dagsta2 wrote:why do 79 people hate tau

Those were the Tau players.

I loled. Sorry.

I 'hate' Nurgle and Space Wolves armies because I must. All glory to the Changer of Ways! All is Dust!

I dislike playing against GKs and DEs though since they seem to be tailor made to crush my 'Nids.* I'll play them and enjoy the challenge, but there is a difference between a challenge and getting blown away by Cleansing Flame, Psycannon Spam, or having an army of DE mock you from their raiders as they zip around the board after taking out your only chance of blowing them up(Hive Guard).

*which is what I play nowadays until Chaos returns to it's former glory

There should've been an option for "all non-codex marines". But then no-one would vote for anyone else. As it is, I would say DA, simply because a few hundred marines get a whole codex to themeselves, and it plays pretty much exactly the same as basic marines.

im2randomghgh wrote:

thefarseerofnorthryde wrote:I go with space wolves. putting half-mad wolf-men in 40k is stupid. space wolves should be some sort of fantasy army.
also, i think tau should go. they're just a little overpowered

HAHAHA

Tau are amongst the most drastically under-powered armies in wh40k, and they're usually not even considered competitive. They need to be made significantly more powerful. When an army designed for shooting is less shooty than armies not designed for it, you have a problem. All space marines, IG, DE, and even eldar can more often than not out-shoot them.

Except when i played, them, I was undefeated until I sold the army and moved on to shpess marines.

wow, a lot of hate for all the marine flavours. TIL that if it were up to dakka, the last three armies standing (as of this post) would be CSM, Orks, and Nids.

I can understand non marine players wishing there were less marine codices clogging up the releases of their new dex. But trying to combine them all into one dex would be impractical.

Even though you can look at some units in a vacuum and compare them to other chapter's units and say "well that's the same" they really do have their differences. Sure a lot of what DA can do is now in the SM codex, or taking all terminators in GK codex, they are not the same. And they were much more unique when the codex came out and will *hopefully* be more unique once they get their new dex. I play DA and vanilla marines, and my armies still play really different, something adding a few IC wouldn't replicate.

Then trying to cram all the different dexes into one massive dex would have several problems.
1) internally balancing all the units/abilities/characters ect.
2) trying to make it so droves of existing models/units we not made unusable.
3) trying to cram all the different play styles, rules, units, and characters into one dex and not make it way bigger and more expensive.
4) updating that massive codex would take much longer and eat up at least 2-3 normal dex windows anyway.

In a more general sense, I voted none. I would hate to see any player suffer through buying, modelling, painting, ect... an army only to see his/her codex vanish and not be playable. Or even half their army not playable and need to buy half another army since their codex was half heartedly crammed into another one. Or being forced to convert a finished army to be "counts as" some other army they didn't want to play or they would have started with them in the first place.

Would you really wish that on another WH40k player? Maybe the local TFG WAAC power gamer and his GK? Well what about the people playing them since back in the day? It's not their fault GW annoyed you with their new shiny dex, do they deserve to have their hard work and money flushed away?

pwntallica wrote:Even though you can look at some units in a vacuum and compare them to other chapter's units and say "well that's the same" they really do have their differences.

We're not trying to say that they're literally exactly the same, but the overlap is astonishing. You could easily replicate a vast majority of BA and DA, for example, with simply passing out a few special rules to a regular space marine army. Could you do literally exactly everything? No, but come on, you could do practically everything.

Compare the differences between SM and BA, and then compare the difference between SM and eldar, and you can see why people question all the SM 'dexes, especially ones as poorly done as BA.

pwntallica wrote:In a more general sense, I voted none. I would hate to see any player suffer through buying, modelling, painting, ect... an army only to see his/her codex vanish and not be playable.

Certainly, but you could EASILY make a splinter army work in the same codex. If you made a BA army, and they got appropriately rolled in, they wouldn't lose "half their army". Their tac squads would still be tac squads. Their rhinos would still be rhinos. Their captains would still be captains. Their dreadnoughts would still be dreadnoughts. Their drop pods would still be drop pods. Their land raiders would still be land raiders. The list goes on and on of models that they had that they would still be able to field as red marines rather than blood angels.

Really, there would only be a tiny number that would be excluded, but even then, you could still include them as something else. Power armor is modular that way. That mephiston model could still certainly be fielded as a chapter master, for example.

pwntallica wrote:1) internally balancing all the units/abilities/characters ect.

Do you think that the various splinter armies are MORE balanced now?

Having them all in the same codex would practically guarantee balance, as you wouldn't have some chapters (like BT and DA) getting old and falling behind, while having other armies (like GK and BA) being made with no tether to reality. Codices may not be 100% balanced between each other, but they do tend to be pretty well internally balanced. Putting more things into one codex would make balance better.

pwntallica wrote:2) trying to make it so droves of existing models/units we not made unusable.

Once again, what wouldn't be useable? Throw in Dante with a special rule unlocking death company with chapter tactics of black rage. Throw in Ezekiel that makes it so that terminators can take apothecaries and count as scoring. Throw in Hellbrecht which unlocks neophytes and has the chapter tactic of that thing that makes BT charge forward whenever they take casualties.

It would be SO EASY, and you wouldn't even need to exclude anybody's models.

pwntallica wrote:3) trying to cram all the different play styles, rules, units, and characters into one dex and not make it way bigger and more expensive.

True, but it would also be a better value. A single marine 'dex is going to be cheaper than having to get a SM codex AND a BA codex AND a GK codex AND a DA codex, and, and, and...

Plus, you can't even BUY a BT codex anymore. This is just another problem that would be solved.

pwntallica wrote:4) updating that massive codex would take much longer and eat up at least 2-3 normal dex windows anyway.

That would be true if there was only a single codex writer, but there's not. Having one person take longer with their codex in no way slows down anybody else's work on their own codex.

See, the issue is just that: All the different Marine codices are only different in points costs, special rules, and unit upgrades.

So Blood Angels have Assault Marines that can take a plethora of Meltas, or Space Wolves have Devestator Sergeants that allow you to split fire- Make it like Chaos Warbands (I think that's what it was) where taking a certain Special Character makes the army 'Blood Angels' or 'Space Wolves' (or an upgrade for a Chapter Master or Libby or something) and have the Assault Marines and Devestator entries have upgrades that say "If the army is Blood Angels, then _____ can be taken for __ points"

Things like that.

All Marines use the same weapons (aside from silly differences, like Blood Talons and such, but again, simple upgrade) and vehicles.They can use the same Codex.

Or, hey, howsabout you don't even have specific chapters! Just add some options to the vanilla codex, and get rid of the rest of them. If someone wants to play Dark Angels, they can do the same as the folks who play Imperial Fists, and just paint them the right way!

Orks don't have a Codex: Bad Moons, or a Codex: Snakebites, even though those two Clans play much, MUCH different than the standard "Lotsa Boyz, couplea toyz" lists.

Eldar don't have (anymore) a Codex: Ulthuan and a Codex: Alaitoc, though in Fluff, they fight much different.

Tau don't have Codex: Farsight and Codex: Etherials

Chaos doesn't have a different codex for each major God.

Tyranids don't have a seperate codex for every Hive Fleet.

Imperial Guard don't have seperate codices for Catachans and Death Korps and Cadians.

Why should Space Marines have separate codices for separate chapters?

This really wasn't worth digging up, please be aware of the posting dates in future.
Thanks.