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I have no issues with the boobs being out, for what it's meant to be... But the huge head is a little off putting, and the hips and thighs seem a little chunky for an elf.

Other than that, I like it. A little re-scaling and I would be all over these.

Absolutionis wrote:It's sensible that they're changing it back to being 28-30mm, but what's with SciFi gamers wanting 32mm? Most major SciFi games are 28mm and fantasy games are 32mm or 28mm.

Their sci fi stuff tends to fit into 40k the best (not-Dark Eldar Archon, not-Commisar, not-Ork Warboss, not-Nurgle Daemon Prince, etc). So by 'sci fi gamers', they likely mean 40k gamers.

Kroothawk wrote:

Spoiler:

The upper legs have more circumference than her waist.

My comments in the RH blog:

SIZE: Call the scale “28MM” – and make sure you do the minis between 28-32 mm from base to eye level.

The GW Witch Elves are all 28-29 mm, the Juan Diaz Daemonettes (GWs best girls ever – no one calls them too large) are 29-31 mm and the newest Dark Elf Sorceress (also from GW) is 32 mm (+ scenic base). High heels and long legs = tall minis.


SCULPT: Amazing. I love that the head is rather large (makes them fit with GW) – but perhaps make it a little smaller at the forehead?
Different faces, some screaming – for headswap reasons.

Definitely keep them topless, you are aiming at a different crowd than kids that shop in stores with their moms money.

Metal is also fine – but please try to have the hands/weapons “free” from the hair/body so that we can just bend wrists/elbows or do weapon swaps (I will give many of them knives) to make unique minis. The pictured mini is really nice – but as her right arm/weapon is entangled in her hair it will be hard to create variations on the pose.

It is OK to make them in pre-defined poses but please consider that many buyers would want to do weapon swaps and bend arms etc. in order to make more unique poses – 10 different poses is not enough if you aim to sell >30 to each customer…


If you nail the scale and posability price is unimportant.
Sign me up for, at least, 10 boxes.

Definitely 'shrink the head' a bit - please!

Mmmm, more Dark Elf goodness. Those witches sure would look nice next to my manticore...

I agree they're a little oddly porportioned atm, but im still liking what im seeing.

-Loki- wrote:

Absolutionis wrote:It's sensible that they're changing it back to being 28-30mm, but what's with SciFi gamers wanting 32mm? Most major SciFi games are 28mm and fantasy games are 32mm or 28mm.

Their sci fi stuff tends to fit into 40k the best (not-Dark Eldar Archon, not-Commisar, not-Ork Warboss, not-Nurgle Daemon Prince, etc). So by 'sci fi gamers', they likely mean 40k gamers.

I understand, so why are these "Sci fi Gamers" wanting 32mm models?

This must have been an error.

- Make head smaller, way too big

- Waist/abdomen wider, less chunky legs, her thighs are bigger around than her stomach

- No blatant nudity please, or at least give me the option for a breastplate to cover the chest..I play a lot of games in hobby shops were children hang out, not to mention some of my regular opponents are younger kids (14-16)

Just some suggestions. Pretty excited for these, and the overall concept and quality of sculpt look great.

I think the head is too big, as other have said before.

However, as a side note, i find funny that people here is complaining about that, and at the same time, they buy tons of GW's models, that precisely, always have huge heads...

Anyway. If my opinion could be interesting for somebody, i think the waist are too thin, and the uber-hair is nice in one or two models, but i would 'trim' that hair on some of them, as well as they could be fine without those head adornment, ornament, half-helmet or whatever is called

cheers

Leave the proportions as they are, head size, breast cup size etc. is perfect - and would fit with GW if scaled to 28-30 mm from base to eye level.
A smaller head is more realistic - but most gamers would want minis that do not look out of place among their existing ones (i.e. with extra large head, hands and ...).

Here I have scaled a Blood Vestal to 28mm (base to eye level) and compared it to some of my GW female Dark Elves.

As you can see, 28-30 mm would probably work best.

The problem, Kendoka, is that I don't like most of the models you've compared it to there... the head really is too large imo, as evidenced by most of the comments here.

Absolutionis wrote:

-Loki- wrote:

Absolutionis wrote:It's sensible that they're changing it back to being 28-30mm, but what's with SciFi gamers wanting 32mm? Most major SciFi games are 28mm and fantasy games are 32mm or 28mm.

Their sci fi stuff tends to fit into 40k the best (not-Dark Eldar Archon, not-Commisar, not-Ork Warboss, not-Nurgle Daemon Prince, etc). So by 'sci fi gamers', they likely mean 40k gamers.

I understand, so why are these "Sci fi Gamers" wanting 32mm models?

This must have been an error.

Because 40k is actually about 32mm now. And again, their primary sci fi customers are likely 40k customers, since their stuff plugs right in to 40k. 28mm actually looks very small compared to 40k models (I've been noticing a lot lately, since I've got some infinity stuff next to Tyranids on my desk)..

Kanluwen wrote:

DPBellathrom wrote:no no, nude is fine by me ^_^ remember these are fanatical, depraved elves who bathe in blood to retain their looks. did you really expect to see clothes......that being said the head could be about a fraction smaller

and only 5 euros per box : D I think I might be starting my wych cult up again

edit, didnt read it properly....but still I'll be grabbing a few

They're based off "fanatical, depraved Elves" who are also devotees of a god of murder and battle. The Witch Elves that GW has done--while scantily clad--have also retained armor in their various iterations. Look at the concept art that MGS posted. That's still outwardly "sensual", yet not "boobs!".

and? there is still armour in this one, its just that the boobs are out rather than in. add a tabard and a bra and your pretty close to the concept art posted earlyer

I think it looks pretty awesome, but the head does indeed look too big, and I'm not a fan of the boobs sticking out, would it kill her to wear a bra?

Honestly, I'm almost 20 and no prude, but nudity on a model is almost a for sure no sale. I don't want my models to be naked (scantily clad, whatever, just not nude), so the extra time needed to fix said problem when I have so little extra time as is, it makes it tough.

Long story short: I'd like to buy them, give the girls bras and I'll purchase them.

kendoka wrote:Leave the proportions as they are, head size, breast cup size etc. is perfect - and would fit with GW if scaled to 28-30 mm from base to eye level.
A smaller head is more realistic - but most gamers would want minis that do not look out of place among their existing ones (i.e. with extra large head, hands and ...).

Here I have scaled a Blood Vestal to 28mm (base to eye level) and compared it to some of my GW female Dark Elves.

As you can see, 28-30 mm would probably work best.

If you scale her like that, she looks less that a dark elf, and more like strippererella as a half-gnome.
XP

I think you guys are making a mistake.

Her head is perfectly in ratio with most of the miniature company's scale.
As in, the limbs are like 25% too short.

As you can see , her head looks noticeable "smaller" when I removed the hair.
Your eyes just couldn't adjust to it with hair there.

Remove the hair, her scale looks just like every mini out there.
Also her features are not too large either, not after you paint the eye liner on, the eye will actually look small.





Lastly, for gods sake, GW fans whining about scale, REALLY?

Luna can I order the one on the right? And would that also be 5 euros a box?

Johnny-Crass wrote:Luna can I order the one on the right? And would that also be 5 euros a box?

You can buy these instead
http://www.ebay.com/itm/REVOLTECH-SCI-FI-010-10-TOY-STORY-WOODY-FIGURE-AP1010-/220975194454?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item337325e156

johnny&crass

The Fragile Breath wrote:I think it looks pretty awesome, but the head does indeed look too big, and I'm not a fan of the boobs sticking out, would it kill her to wear a bra?... but nudity on a model is almost a for sure no sale.

Sorry, but you are wrong.
The head is perfectly scaled (although a little thick at the temples) and the topless thing will sell 10 times as many miniatures as if fitted with a bra.
GW will probably release their new WE within a year and they will look as the ones in WAR (i.e loincloth, metal bra etc.) and RH needs to differentiate their product from theirs.

Less heroic sculpt, with bra and larger scale would cater for another (much smaller) customer group willing to convert them into another line than GW DW WE.

Making them 28-30 mm (base to eye), topless and with fantasy gear will make the RH line a sure hit.
Hopefully such a hit that they can later take the plunge and make plastic moulds, selling many thousands of boxes (AoW-style).

Died laughing Luna thank you. Now back OT I am becoming more disinchanted with the model the more I look at it

RH has a fairly good track record of listening to their customer base - I'm hopeful that they'll listen to the concerns about scale/head size/etc.!

The head is enormous, her arms are noticeably short and her overall physique looks like it was pulled from a hentai fan-drawing. The gratuitous boobage is done better here than it is in a lot of "pin up" models, but it still seems a little forced and unnecessary. I give this incarnation of the model a thumbs down, but I'll be watching to see if Raging Heroes rehabilitates the overall product before it goes to release.

Time for a better comparison with my GW female Dark Elves.



Bigger picture: http://hem.spray.se/kendoka/rh_gw2_1280.jpg

I think the RH mini would look its best in 30 mm (base to eye)
- although it would probabbly be wise to call it "28MM" (considering the high heels) as that is a more common name for "GW-scale".



And the head and breasts actually somewhat *smallish* - compared to the GW line (viewing closeups of 28 mm could mess with your sense of proportions).

If that is correct they look fine as is

Waist smaller than thighs is dangerous for humans (even people doing corset training are advised not to take their waists below thigh diameter), but plausible for space elves who have made pacts with Satan.

Ian Sturrock wrote:Waist smaller than thighs is dangerous for humans...

Nahh.
Statistics clearly show that there are far more people dying from being obese
- than there are people suffering from having waists smaller than their thighs

If we are to care about the welfare of our miniatures I would suggest tend to the Space Marines
- as they often have heads smaller than their own fists (http://images.wikia.com/warhammer40k/images/d/d0/Emperor_of_Mankind_by_genzoman.jpg, http://webpages.shepherd.edu/KFORD04/pics/random%20pics/UltramarineChapterMasterCalgar.jpg)
and that must be really tough.

LunaHound wrote:I think you guys are making a mistake.

Her head is perfectly in ratio with most of the miniature company's scale.
As in, the limbs are like 25% too short.

As you can see , her head looks noticeable "smaller" when I removed the hair.
Your eyes just couldn't adjust to it with hair there.

Remove the hair, her scale looks just like every mini out there.
Also her features are not too large either, not after you paint the eye liner on, the eye will actually look small.





Lastly, for gods sake, GW fans whining about scale, REALLY?

I know there is a logical, well though out message being conveyed here.. however I can't stop looking at the picture on the right.

BlueDagger wrote:

LunaHound wrote:I think you guys are making a mistake.

Her head is perfectly in ratio with most of the miniature company's scale.
As in, the limbs are like 25% too short.

As you can see , her head looks noticeable "smaller" when I removed the hair.
Your eyes just couldn't adjust to it with hair there.

Remove the hair, her scale looks just like every mini out there.
Also her features are not too large either, not after you paint the eye liner on, the eye will actually look small.





Lastly, for gods sake, GW fans whining about scale, REALLY?

I know there is a logical, well though out message being conveyed here.. however I can't stop looking at the picture on the right.

Agree completely - a very eyecatching photo!

Thank you, Luna!

Padre^.

Just a quick but sincere note to thank Kendoka for doing his line-up.

I think it helps everybody realize that the perception of the proportions of a miniature dramatically changes if one looks at the mini in actual size or if one looks at a blown-up image.

We’ve spent the last 2 days tweaking proportions and faces but, indeed, if we go for more elegant proportions, we end up with something very beautiful when seen as a large image, but completely uncastable (too fragile) or unpaintable (too tiny) when the mini is shrunk back to 28-30mm. We’re still fiddling with it and expect to launch pre-orders tomorrow, if all goes well.

We could easily create sculpts that look far more attractive and elegant (and have done so for ourselves), but they absolutely cannot be translated in workable 28-30mm minis. It’s no accident that so many companies are now moving to 32mm scale, as these 3 or 4 extra millimeters open up a whole new world of possibilities in terms of elegance and proportions.

Note1: To convince yourself of this strange optical effect, just size up a few different 28mm female mini (men’s anatomy tend to be less affected by this effect) to the size of the Bestal on our blog and you’ll get a clearer view of what we mean.

Note 2: We will be posting new images and more responses to comments on our blog tomorrow.

Well after looking at Kendoka's line up, I must say the wicked blade girls look absolutely fine in comparison to other GW elves. Paint one of these ladies up and put it next to a Dark Elf mini and I am sure people will be completely convinced.