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Yeah, It's hard to imagine this game getting any more IoM-centric.

How many points is that squad of vangaurd vets? How do they compare in effectiveness? Cant make an arguement without doing the cost benefits comparison.

Stormboys look good, especially if timed with the wagghh

Interested to see how the bombers work with the new rules

Reading the rulebook...

- Strength is still capped at 10.
- Abilities that set stats are used after modifiers. So Mob Rule would always overrule negative modifiers.
- Charging through terrain is 3d6, drop highest dice.
- If you allocate one wound to a model with a better save/multiple wounds, you must keep allocating wounds until it either dies or no wounds are left to allocate. Taking the first wound on the nob doesn't work anymore.
- The highest, unmodified initiative is used for sweeping advances. It's time that the world learns about our warboss' initiative of 4.
- You may only multi-assault if you can not reach the primary target, as well as losing the charge attack and furious charge bonus. There is really no reason to multi-charge with orks anymore.
- You can attempt to regroup normally as long as 25% are allive. No further limitation.
- You can also attempt to regroup normally if you have less than 25% of your models alive, if an independet character is joined to the unit.
- You always regroup on , no matter how many models are alive.
- Fleet allows you to reroll one or two of your charge rolls. So if you roll , you are allowed to just reroll the .
- A biker warboss makes a unit he joins unable to use fleet given by the Waaagh!
- IC no longer have move through cover or skilled rider.
- Slow and Purposeful prevents running, Overwatch and Sweeping Advances. It no longer slows normal or charge movement
- Bikes can never be pinned or go to ground, but get Hammer of Wrath and ignore Terrain when charging unless it's a barricade or Aegis defense line.
- A biker warboss can now smash dreads without worrying about instant death
- Big Gunz are T7 W2 3+. Statistically it's the same as before, except you don't need an adamantite skull to understand it. Your opponents always have to wound against T7 when shooting the crew. That's right, T7 models for 3 points a piece
- All models in an artillery unit must shoot the same target, including ICs.
- If bored, warbosses, MANz or stormboyz can now throw a single stikkbomb for a S3 blast. Totally not worth a single point, but nice if it's free anyways.
- Any 6 rolled to hit in combat or shooting by a nob or IC allows you to decide who gets shot. TL-Shoota anyone?
- Badrukk will be the bane of valuable models, being able to shoot three S7 AP2 ignore cover shots with three rerolls to hit, allocating half of his hits however he likes.
- A challenged character's ld can not be used if he refuses. Nice against anyone not bringing the strength to beat down a nob.
- If da boss is in a challenge with a single enemy, every five boyz that are watching allow a reroll of either to hit, to wound or saves. Charging an MC with 30 boyz? 5 rerolls to hit or wound!
- Deny the witch is 6+ for all units, 5+ if any amount of weirdboyz are in the unit.
- Still unclear whether deff rollas are hull.
- All vehicles may move 6" instead of shooting if they have not tank shocked. Fast vehicles may move 12", for a total of 24" for trukks.
- Shaken prevents shooting any kind of ordnance or blast weapons.
- Penetrating hits count as two wounds for the purposes of combat resolution. I guess, if your warboss picks up a rhino and breaks it in half, even marines run for the hills. It is possible to lose combat against vehicles that deal damage during the assault phase.
- Passengers can fire overwatch. Assaulting any kind of ork vehicle suddenly become an extremely stupid idea - especially for burna wagons. This counts towards combat resolution.
- Burna bommers may fire only two skorcha missiles per turn.
- Open-topped no longer reduces the strength of explosions.
- Vehicles and passengers may fire snap-shots after ramming.
- Bikers can use their 4+ armor against wounds from terrain.
- Gretchin going to ground in area terrain still get a 3+ cover save.
- Almost all command traits are useless to orks. Personal traits are hit-and-miss, some are great, some are not, depending on who your warlord is, and you have a chance of simply getting furious charge again. Irony has it that strategic traits are all pretty good for orks.
- The KFF can protect necron, tau, CSM and imperial guard vehicles. It also works for all our mistrusted allies, but moving them into KFF range will result in lots of red buttons being everywhere.
- High chance of night fighting either at the beginning or end of all regular missions.
- All objective missions have silly objectives that provide stealth, shoot at planes or explode.

Could someone point me in the direction of a ruling for cover saves on squadrons? If only 25% needs to be covered, like on single vehicles, does that mean I only need one killa kan in range of the KFF to get the 5+ for the whole unit?

You allocate hits to the closest vehicles, then roll for penetration, then take saves.
Vehicles can only take cover saves if they are obscured, obscured does not have a majority rule.

So only if the kan currently getting hit is within 6", it would be able to use the 5+ save.

I'm liking deffkoptas more.

Can move 36" if they forgo shooting. They also have the jinking special rule, so get a 5+ cover save on top of their two wounds. Kitted with TL rokkits, they will probably strip HPs off vehicles nicely. And they get a hammer of wrath attack on the charge, which is a nice bonus.

So, heard from a mate that furious charge no longer give +1 ini, can someone confirm?

And has there been any change as to how "scout" and "infiltrate" works?

Can blitza bommaz "zoom" 36" and still drop a bomb? As a zoom isn't flat out, and I couldn't find anything about it in the new faq...

//Calle

Jag_Calle wrote:So, heard from a mate that furious charge no longer give +1 ini, can someone confirm?

And has there been any change as to how "scout" and "infiltrate" works?

Can blitza bommaz "zoom" 36" and still drop a bomb? As a zoom isn't flat out, and I couldn't find anything about it in the new faq...

//Calle

Correct about furious charge.

Scout is similar, as is infiltrate.

I think one big ork buff is snap fire. Our army was based around a poor BS, so we put out a lot of shots. Now that snap fire is BS1, we seem to be quite good at it. So, a unit wanting to charge a squad of 20 shoota boyz has to weather 40 shots, 6 or 7 of which will hit. In addition, moving vehicles get to snap fire with all weapons. So, dakkawagons or rokkitwagons seem more tempting.

doctorludo wrote:I'm liking deffkoptas more.

Can move 36" if they forgo shooting. They also have the jinking special rule, so get a 5+ cover save on top of their two wounds. Kitted with TL rokkits, they will probably strip HPs off vehicles nicely. And they get a hammer of wrath attack on the charge, which is a nice bonus.

I was reading the book some today at my brothers house, so I may be misremembering, but if you scout move you cannot assault that turn yes? If so, I think that makes koptas even worse then before

I never assaulted using my deffkoptas unless it was viable, I just had them for bombing runs

Jidmah wrote:
- Abilities that set stats are used after modifiers. So Mob Rule would always overrule negative modifiers.
.

Thanks for this post.

Does that Psychic power that strips fearless and forces a morale check still affect units that are Fearless under Mob Rule?

Jidmah wrote:

- Deny the witch is 6+ for all units, 5+ if any amount of weirdboyz are in the unit.

lol, only for the unit? They are really determined to make sure nobody uses Wierdboyz.

Fafnir wrote:I think I just broke 6th ed with that one, actually.

Play objective game.
Put objective in bottleneck.
Take unit of Boyz and Ghazzy, place within the bottleneck.
Put Ghazzy up front.
Free objective.

Look Out, Sir! is on Wound Allocation, instead of taking armor saves. So he isn't sharing his 2+ with anyone. Either he rolls it on his armor and Ghaz takes wounds (or saves it), or you take the Look Out, Sir!. If it passes, another Ork gets the wound on him. (For example, he passes a bolter round onto an Ork Boy, at S4 AP5, so the boy dies.)

Thank god.

KingCracker wrote:

doctorludo wrote:I'm liking deffkoptas more.

Can move 36" if they forgo shooting. They also have the jinking special rule, so get a 5+ cover save on top of their two wounds. Kitted with TL rokkits, they will probably strip HPs off vehicles nicely. And they get a hammer of wrath attack on the charge, which is a nice bonus.

I was reading the book some today at my brothers house, so I may be misremembering, but if you scout move you cannot assault that turn yes? If so, I think that makes koptas even worse then before

This is true. I always used them as a mobile, passably accurate rokkit platform for hitting side armours. From this point of view, they look better.

Wow, I guess Deffkoptas are T5 too...that's awesome. Now strength 8 can't ID them and they can fall back on a 5+ save. Now there's some competition in Fast Attack.

Correct. You only use the modified toughness now.

Guys, i'm afraid the Snap-shot Burnas we'v ebeen getting gleeful about doesn't work.

You can only overwatch with weapons you can snap fire with.

Per snap fire (pg 13) template weapons can't snap fire.

I'd be happy to be wrong. I'm only about 20 pages in so far.

'some weapon types, such as Template and Ordinance, or those with certain special rules, such as blast, cannot be fired as snap shots. It's important to note that any shooting attack that does not use a Ballistic Skill ... cannot be 'fired' as a snap shot.

Cool. That should deter a Psydread from attacking one.

Ascalam wrote:Guys, i'm afraid the Snap-shot Burnas we'v ebeen getting gleeful about doesn't work.

You can only overwatch with weapons you can snap fire with.

Per snap fire (pg 13) template weapons can't snap fire.

I'd be happy to be wrong. I'm only about 20 pages in so far.

'some weapon types, such as Template and Ordinance, or those with certain special rules, such as blast, cannot be fired as snap shots. It's important to note that any shooting attack that does not use a Ballistic Skill ... cannot be 'fired' as a snap shot.

Template (not blast) weapons can overwatch, but cause D3 auto hit attacks at the weapons str and AP

Ok.. some inconsistency there then

Not surprising, all things considered

Ascalam wrote:Guys, i'm afraid the Snap-shot Burnas we'v ebeen getting gleeful about doesn't work.

You can only overwatch with weapons you can snap fire with.

Per snap fire (pg 13) template weapons can't snap fire.

I'd be happy to be wrong. I'm only about 20 pages in so far.

'some weapon types, such as Template and Ordinance, or those with certain special rules, such as blast, cannot be fired as snap shots. It's important to note that any shooting attack that does not use a Ballistic Skill ... cannot be 'fired' as a snap shot.

What do the mean about the special rules? basically can Lootas get d3 snapshots off?

Matt.Kingsley wrote:
Template (not blast) weapons can overwatch, but cause D3 auto hit attacks at the weapons str and AP

Yep flamers do D3 hits so charging a burner boy squad might not be the best of things to do...

IF Burna boyz fire at people charging them does that mean they can't use their burnas as Power Weapons? (Or is it only "if they fire in their shooting phase they can't use it as power weapon?)

Ranting Fool wrote:

IF Burna boyz fire at people charging them does that mean they can't use their burnas as Power Weapons? (Or is it only "if they fire in their shooting phase they can't use it as power weapon?)

Another oversight in the FAQ

Seriously, GW isn't even trying

the things I'm most concerned about are Kommandos and Snikrot. Now that units can't assault the turn they come on from reserves, they're not going to get the chance to do much of anything before getting shot to pieces.

On the other hand, now the only real drawbacks to Meganobz is that they can't run or sweeping advance (but can otherwise move normally), they seem like a much more viable option.

Also, it seems like battlewagons loaded with lots of guns could actually provide some useful fire-support while they run around, crashing into things

"It is possible to lose combat against vehicles that deal damage during the assault phase."

Remember folks, we can buy Wrekkin' Balls. Our vehicles can potentially break squads that haven't even looked at us funny yet.


Also, they've basically fixed everything that was wrong about Tankbustas and Flash Gits- Bustas Glory Hogs aren't completely stupid, and Gitz not only ignore cover, but in over 2000 points (and who would take Gitz in less?) can buy some Transports for them- one of the biggest complaints people had was the lack of such.

Jidmah wrote:Reading the rulebook...

- Strength is still capped at 10.
- Abilities that set stats are used after modifiers. So Mob Rule would always overrule negative modifiers.
- Charging through terrain is 3d6, drop highest dice.
- If you allocate one wound to a model with a better save/multiple wounds, you must keep allocating wounds until it either dies or no wounds are left to allocate. Taking the first wound on the nob doesn't work anymore.
- The highest, unmodified initiative is used for sweeping advances. It's time that the world learns about our warboss' initiative of 4.
- You may only multi-assault if you can not reach the primary target, as well as losing the charge attack and furious charge bonus. There is really no reason to multi-charge with orks anymore.
- You can attempt to regroup normally as long as 25% are allive. No further limitation.
- You can also attempt to regroup normally if you have less than 25% of your models alive, if an independet character is joined to the unit.
- You always regroup on , no matter how many models are alive.
- Fleet allows you to reroll one or two of your charge rolls. So if you roll , you are allowed to just reroll the .
- A biker warboss makes a unit he joins unable to use fleet given by the Waaagh!
- IC no longer have move through cover or skilled rider.
- Slow and Purposeful prevents running, Overwatch and Sweeping Advances. It no longer slows normal or charge movement
- Bikes can never be pinned or go to ground, but get Hammer of Wrath and ignore Terrain when charging unless it's a barricade or Aegis defense line.
- A biker warboss can now smash dreads without worrying about instant death
- Big Gunz are T7 W2 3+. Statistically it's the same as before, except you don't need an adamantite skull to understand it. Your opponents always have to wound against T7 when shooting the crew. That's right, T7 models for 3 points a piece
- All models in an artillery unit must shoot the same target, including ICs.
- If bored, warbosses, MANz or stormboyz can now throw a single stikkbomb for a S3 blast. Totally not worth a single point, but nice if it's free anyways.
- Any 6 rolled to hit in combat or shooting by a nob or IC allows you to decide who gets shot. TL-Shoota anyone?
- Badrukk will be the bane of valuable models, being able to shoot three S7 AP2 ignore cover shots with three rerolls to hit, allocating half of his hits however he likes.
- A challenged character's ld can not be used if he refuses. Nice against anyone not bringing the strength to beat down a nob.
- If da boss is in a challenge with a single enemy, every five boyz that are watching allow a reroll of either to hit, to wound or saves. Charging an MC with 30 boyz? 5 rerolls to hit or wound!
- Deny the witch is 6+ for all units, 5+ if any amount of weirdboyz are in the unit.
- Still unclear whether deff rollas are hull.
- All vehicles may move 6" instead of shooting if they have not tank shocked. Fast vehicles may move 12", for a total of 24" for trukks.
- Shaken prevents shooting any kind of ordnance or blast weapons.
- Penetrating hits count as two wounds for the purposes of combat resolution. I guess, if your warboss picks up a rhino and breaks it in half, even marines run for the hills. It is possible to lose combat against vehicles that deal damage during the assault phase.
- Passengers can fire overwatch. Assaulting any kind of ork vehicle suddenly become an extremely stupid idea - especially for burna wagons. This counts towards combat resolution.
- Burna bommers may fire only two skorcha missiles per turn.
- Open-topped no longer reduces the strength of explosions.
- Vehicles and passengers may fire snap-shots after ramming.
- Bikers can use their 4+ armor against wounds from terrain.
- Gretchin going to ground in area terrain still get a 3+ cover save.
- Almost all command traits are useless to orks. Personal traits are hit-and-miss, some are great, some are not, depending on who your warlord is, and you have a chance of simply getting furious charge again. Irony has it that strategic traits are all pretty good for orks.
- The KFF can protect necron, tau, CSM and imperial guard vehicles. It also works for all our mistrusted allies, but moving them into KFF range will result in lots of red buttons being everywhere.
- High chance of night fighting either at the beginning or end of all regular missions.
- All objective missions have silly objectives that provide stealth, shoot at planes or explode.

where does it say we can use KFF with certain allies? As far as I know, we can only share abilities between armies that are "battle brothers". Orks only get up to "convenient ally" at best, so it shouldn't be allowed according to that. I don't remember seeing it in the FaQ either. I'm not trying to rag on you by the way, just want to know where you saw it so I can look it up tomorrow. If so, my IG just found their new best friends

Also, whats the word on nob units? Thinking about trying a large unit of them out using several barebones ones at the front to eat the initial wounds, and having 4 or 5 PK's at the back to come up and finish the enemy off towards the end. Probably going to use between 6 and 8 in a 1,000pt game and see what happens. I doubt they'll be as insane as 5th ed nobz, but I still think they'll pull their weight.

When a Force Weapon is activated, does it ignore Feel No Pain?

another con - KMBs now Get Hot even on vehicles, with a 50% chance of a glancing hit if you first roll a To Hit of 1, which is bad news for kan walls - I guess a lot of players will be rearming with rokkits? (I'm so glad I magnetised my kan weapon arms)

On the other hand, it's only a 1 in 12 chance, so maybe we don't care? the same apparently applies for all Gets Hot weapons for all races, even the super-plasma variant of the Leman Russ.

TedNugent wrote:When a Force Weapon is activated, does it ignore Feel No Pain?

Does it inflict instant death?

TedNugent wrote:

Jidmah wrote:
- Abilities that set stats are used after modifiers. So Mob Rule would always overrule negative modifiers.
.

Thanks for this post.

Does that Psychic power that strips fearless and forces a morale check still affect units that are Fearless under Mob Rule?

I think you are talking about BA's Fear in the Dark or something?

Fearless makes you auto-pass pinning, morale, regroup and fear checks, but not regular leadership tests. You also can not go to ground for any reason, including pinning.

Jidmah wrote:

- Deny the witch is 6+ for all units, 5+ if any amount of weirdboyz are in the unit.

lol, only for the unit? They are really determined to make sure nobody uses Wierdboyz.

Yeah, lame. At least you have further 6+ to stop JotWW.

MrMoustaffa wrote:
where does it say we can use KFF with certain allies? As far as I know, we can only share abilities between armies that are "battle brothers". Orks only get up to "convenient ally" at best, so it shouldn't be allowed according to that. I don't remember seeing it in the FaQ either. I'm not trying to rag on you by the way, just want to know where you saw it so I can look it up tomorrow. If so, my IG just found their new best friends

The KFF has kept it's funky wording that it affects all vehicles, not limited to orks or even friendly vehicles. As the BRB FAQ is gone now, the KFF would even provide cover to enemies.

TedNugent wrote:When a Force Weapon is activated, does it ignore Feel No Pain?

They both are done at the same time(exact same wording now). A new rule says that if two things happen at the same time, the active player decides the order of operations. So, if it's the force weapon player's turn yes, otherwise, no.

So, just like GK Paladins, I hear Nobs are characters? Meaning that you can do Look Out, Sir! saves in a nobs mob on 4+, essentially meaning wound allocation shenanigans are still intact. Can anyone confirm/deny?