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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





I eagerly got a new tyranid codex today and just gave up reviewing it. The tyraind codex reads like a 1985 choose your own adventure written by a Primary school student, : Critter: for the special rules turn to page 24, if you want points values turn to page 78, if you have the vorpal blast turn to page 22, then cross refernce page 3 if you have... It's absolutely maddening!

This codex is layed out in the same irritating format as the Eldar codex with special rules for units spread all over the book, it was positively nerve wracking to flip for 5 different sections for rules for a single unit when there is clearly a unit entries section that should have everything.

This is hands down the hardest codex to just read through. I give it an F for layout.

Some examples of stupidity abounding:

Why list a special rule for armor type in every entry when the info is already in the save stat line right there?

Why even have a psychic power section for many powers when they are unique to a creature type (not listed in the descriptions)?

Asinine special rules actually called: "Its after me", "What was that", "Where is it", "Where'd it go?", "Why is it?", oh just kidding last one was fake, other 4 are really rules, and they appear in the army list entry like that, making the reader wonder what they all mean...

Why have a weapon summary section that references a unit entry for special weapon rules? Just put the rules there, thats what the section is for!

For some units, a player has to flip to: Tyranid Army Rules (instinctive behaviors), Army entry, Psychic powers page, Biomorphs page, Weapons description page and Unit description, to see all the rules, why, that's insane! 5 different section for one unit entries worth of rules.

Claws and Teeth is actually a rule that does... NOTHING, why even print it? Space marines don't have a rule for "Combat Knife, Fists and Profanity: No really, Space marines actually count as having the base number of attacks listed on their stat lines".

Why is the psychic powers section before the painting guide at the end of the unit descriptions instead of with all the other summary sections?

For the love of god, stop renaming USRs in the interest of fluff, if a unit has rage, just call it by the same name as the rulebook please... I don't want to cross reference 3 entries and 2 books to read! Instinctive Behavior>>Feed>>Rage really? How about put Rage in the army entry and leave the fluff in the fluff sections!

Lets have a (meaninglessly combined) Weapons AND Biomorph section, and then put entries in there for only about half the weapons and biomorphs and make the players lookup up the other half in the descriptions entry, arbitrarily? Why are there page references to the unit descriptions for weapons that should just have the rules there in the rules summary? Completely inexplicable.

Maybe this will end up being a decent playing codex, but this load of convoluted references screams for a real crib sheet and summary page. 96 pages of maddening cross referencing that forces the reader to read all the juvenile names and marginally creative fluff.

Index for all the silly names would have been to many pages perhaps?

In my opinion this is the worst structure in a codex ever produced. I suspect GW's Editor(s) like making things more complex for no reason, or there is no one who reads technically on the staff. What say you?
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Hillsboro, Oregon

WOW, that sounds crappy...
Not as excited about getting my new codex.
How do you think GW hires people...do they hire friends to do the diffrent jobs.
I think they should hire lawers to write the rules and codexs. One lawer to represent every army and five to write the rulebook. Thats how you do it!!! j/k
I do really wonder what makes someone qualified to write a codex, what qualifications must you have on a resume to get that job.

 
   
Made in us
Infiltrating Oniwaban





Fayetteville

It's been the same pattern for a while now. I liked the older layouts better. Maybe they do it to go after the pirates by making them print out the whole codex instead of just a few parts.

The Imperial Navy, A Galatic Force for Good. 
   
Made in ca
Dakka Veteran






Nova Scotia, Canada

Which is still cheaper than buying the dex...
Arschbombe wrote:It's been the same pattern for a while now. I liked the older layouts better. Maybe they do it to go after the pirates by making them print out the whole codex instead of just a few parts.

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Made in ca
Infiltrating Broodlord






I just read it front to back, seemed alright to me.

Tyranids
Chaos Space Marines

 
   
Made in us
Prescient Cryptek of Eternity





Mayhem Comics in Des Moines, Iowa

I agree with everything you say about the layout of the book, except for;

Asinine special rules actually called: "Its after me", "What was that", "Where is it", "Where'd it go?", "Why is it?", oh just kidding last one was fake, other 4 are really rules, and they appear in the army list entry like that, making the reader wonder what they all mean...


I LOVE the names of Deathleaper's special rules. Taken as the whole, and in context of what he does, they're awesomely funny names for a really cool character.

 
   
Made in us
Executing Exarch






Odenton, MD

This is the exact reason I use E-books...


When Properly bookmarked reference is a snap.
   
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[MOD]
Otiose in a Niche






Hyderabad, India

THANK YOU! I thought I was alone in my crusade to lay out books so that are actually useful and pleasant to use.

I'm still flipping through mine and getting more and more lost.

 
   
Made in us
Arch Magos w/ 4 Meg of RAM






Mira Mesa

Its interesting, because the friend I got started in 40k with played Space Marines (the previous rulebook). He doesn't like to talk about it, but I suspect part of it was how damn hard that book was to read, especially compared to my CSM codex (the current one). I think he felt like he got the short end in a lot of ways with that book, and he didn't feel like investing in the game. So he quit, irritated that he'd spend several hundred dollars on it.

If nothing else, this CSM codex is really easy to read. Unit profiles and summaries first, then painting and modeling, then ALL the information for all the items, then the unit list. That was really helpful towards me learning the game and sticking with it.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/01/16 06:29:48


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Made in us
Huge Hierodule




United States

I agree that the Layout is a bit silly, but you can't blame just the Nid codex, alot of the more recent codices have had this gakky layout.

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Made in us
Prescient Cryptek of Eternity





Mayhem Comics in Des Moines, Iowa

I would also like to point out I much prefer the simple drawings of the critters next to the unit entries that you found in the last book, vs the much harder to make out details of the drawings in this one.

 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Try reading the Malifaux book and get back to me on horrible rulebook layout.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





DarkHound wrote:Unit profiles and summaries first, then painting and modeling, then ALL the information for all the items, then the unit list. That was really helpful towards me learning the game and sticking with it.


Precisely.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Kid_Kyoto wrote:THANK YOU! I thought I was alone in my crusade to lay out books so that are actually useful and pleasant to use.

I'm still flipping through mine and getting more and more lost.


Me too. I feel your pain.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/01/16 09:16:57


 
   
Made in dk
Stormin' Stompa





What I really hate is the order of the entries in the Forces part.

It is not alphabetical, it is not according to the armylist.....it is "these two kinda seems alike so they should go together, and Hive Tyran gotta be in front....and we really need to have Carnifex, Hive Guard, Biovore, Pyrovore and then Trygon! Oh and sandwich in the Lictor between Genestealer and Gargoyles. *Snicker*".


Aaaargghh!

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Made in nl
Boosting Space Marine Biker



Netherlands

Clthomps wrote:This is the exact reason I use E-books...


When Properly bookmarked reference is a snap.

I gave up trying to get E-books after finding only horrible scans for the Tau codex. Are there properly OCR'ed dexes out there?
   
Made in in
[MOD]
Otiose in a Niche






Hyderabad, India

The lack of pics in the unit section is really annoying. I think the 4th ed codexes got it right, these books have just been annoying since the Eldar codex.

 
   
Made in us
Shas'la with Pulse Carbine





Have to agree the Eldar Codex and those following it just seem designed to frustrate the end user. I honestly don't understand why GW does this.

When people find your product too difficult to use they will try to use it in a manner in which they want. In this case this means e-books.

While the rest of the industry has gone on to unit cards that summarize everything in one place, GW goes the other way. Yet, apparently different unit move rates are too difficult to remember. ??
   
Made in us
Krazed Killa Kan






Minnesota, land of 10,000 Lakes and 10,000,000,000 Mosquitos

Personally, I hate that the modeling section is smack in the middle of the book for all of the new 5th Ed codices. It wouldn't be a problem if the order of the book were just Fluff - Modeling - Units - Wargear - Army list, but no, they have to feth it up by making it hard to read. Fluff first, then units, then part one of wargear, then the modeling section, then part two of wargear, followed by the army list.

They had it right in 4th Edition. While I admit it's nice in the new codices to be able to just flip to the back page for the summary, they completely screwed it up by throwing the modeling section right in the center of the rules section, so if you ever need to look at things, you have to flip through the 16 or so pages of modeling info to get there.

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Made in us
Huge Bone Giant





Oakland, CA -- U.S.A.

The layout in the previous codex was 100000000% better, without resorting to hyperbole.

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Fixture of Dakka





Runnin up on ya.

Shrubs wrote:
Clthomps wrote:This is the exact reason I use E-books...


When Properly bookmarked reference is a snap.

I gave up trying to get E-books after finding only horrible scans for the Tau codex. Are there properly OCR'ed dexes out there?


Try www.scribd.com

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[MOD]
Otiose in a Niche






Hyderabad, India

I've read Palladium books with better layout than the Nid Codex.

There.

I said it. And I'll stand by it.

 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran






Honestly the layout for the codex doesn't bother me all that much, I mean could it stand a little re-organization in the fact of section order but as its written it's fine with me. I'm not very picky though.

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Made in ca
Fixture of Dakka




Arschbombe wrote: Maybe they do it to go after the pirates by making them print out the whole codex instead of just a few parts.


You know I never thought of this. I guess it's GW way of just sticking it to them a bit. Dosn't really do much but make them annoyed right? But then we have to suffer it since we buy the codex.

Agies Grimm:The "Learn to play, bro" mentality is mostly just a way for someone to try to shame you by implying that their metaphorical nerd-wiener is bigger than yours. Which, ironically, I think nerds do even more vehemently than jocks.

Everything is made up and the points don't matter. 40K or Who's Line is it Anyway?

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Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






SoCal, USA!

Augustus wrote:This codex is layed out in the same irritating format as the Eldar codex with special rules for units spread all over the book, it was positively nerve wracking to flip for 5 different sections for rules for a single unit when there is clearly a unit entries section that should have everything.

Asinine special rules actually called: "Its after me", "What was that", "Where is it", "Where'd it go?", "Why is it?",

Do you not have the IG or SM Codices? It's not just the Eldar Codex that's this way. I don't understand why GW can't go back to the 3E layout.

What The F*ck?

   
Made in us
!!Goffik Rocker!!





(THIS SPACE INTENTIONALLY LEFT BLANK)

Are we still talking about this like it's some sort of wacky surprise?

I don't understand why GW can't go back to the 3E layout.


I don't understand nearly a decade later why you can't let that gak go.

----------------

Do you remember that time that thing happened?
This is a bad thread and you should all feel bad 
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

Its hardly believable that the layout is that crappy.
I thought GW's policy is to streamline and simplify codices (and army books).

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