Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I'm my first game in a capaign im made up for me and two mates is tonight, I've just seen the Army list he's using and i have stumbed on atleast one BIG problem.
I'm playing with my Eldar against his Orks. Playing the Ambush mission from battle missions, I'm ambushing.
He's got a couple mobs of boys, I can handle them no problem.
he's got a squad of deffcopta's, I dont see them being any trouble
2 looted waggon's and a killacan might be a pain, but that gives me somthing to keep my dragons busy.
1 squad of flash gits i think, no problem.
Then I have a 9 man squad of nobz featuring 2 or 3 powerclaws cybork bodys a pain boy and a weird boy. Thank god their foot slogging.

What would you guys suggest I do to stop the nobz running riot?
I need to get as many KP's as I can as quick as I can, considering he can run units off the board and I can't.

I have, 2 DA squads with exarch + bladestorm, 5 pathfinders, 6 dragons (in a falcon), Eldrad, 10 banshees (in WS with the HQ), 5 dark reapers.

What should I commit to take down this nob squad? I've tried on several occassions, and only normally suceeding when im using Chaos
I wouldnt normally care but i need to get my side of the campaign off to a good start

Please help

Gorechild wrote:I'm my first game in a capaign im made up for me and two mates is tonight, I've just seen the Army list he's using and i have stumbed on atleast one BIG problem.
I'm playing with my Eldar against his Orks. Playing the Ambush mission from battle missions, I'm ambushing.
He's got a couple mobs of boys, I can handle them no problem.
he's got a squad of deffcopta's, I dont see them being any trouble
2 looted waggon's and a killacan might be a pain, but that gives me somthing to keep my dragons busy.
1 squad of flash gits i think, no problem.
Then I have a 9 man squad of nobz featuring 2 or 3 powerclaws cybork bodys a pain boy and a weird boy. Thank god their foot slogging.

What would you guys suggest I do to stop the nobz running riot?
I need to get as many KP's as I can as quick as I can, considering he can run units off the board and I can't.

I have, 2 DA squads with exarch + bladestorm, 5 pathfinders, 6 dragons (in a falcon), Eldrad, 10 banshees (in WS with the HQ), 5 dark reapers.

What should I commit to take down this nob squad? I've tried on several occassions, and only normally suceeding when im using Chaos
I wouldnt normally care but i need to get my side of the campaign off to a good start

Please help

I play orks. There really isn't a way to defeat them without taking casualties. My friend pulled wraithlord and Eldrad Ulthran. Plus a bunch of DA

A seer council will tarpit the nobz nicely. The council will probably get wiped but it will take two full turns at least (four assault phases). The rest of your army should be able to kill orks while the nobz and council are fighting. Alternatively you can use fire prisms which instant kill nobz.

Use fire prisms or BL/EML mounted Falcons. Preferably 2 prisms and 1 falcon. No armour save and no FnP plus insta gibbing= profit

Hit them with some S8+ weps, wound them *just* enough to force moral tests every turn.

have a hearty laugh when nobs go running.

I did that to drop 2 units of nobs in Ard Boyz this weekend.

All I really have is a maybe 2 turns of dark reaper fire and banshees with eldrad. The dragons and troops will be tied up fighting the rest of the army for me. would it be a good idea just to try avoid them? unless I can focus all my attention on them for maybe 2 turns I cant see them dropping.

@olypia- I dont have a seer council in the list I have to use. The only thing I have to insta-kill are my dragons really and there are 3 vehicles I need them to munch through. I dont have prism either, this is my problem.

You don't really need the fire dragons to take out the looted wagons and the kan. They will fall to lower strength shots (low AV)

You can use the dragons to melt some nobz, use other stuff to knock out the vehicles, then spam everything at the nobz (only if you really want to kill them)

S_P

As far a other weapons go I have 4 dark reapers with S6, a twinlinked star cannon, a starcannon and a pulse laser, should that deal with the armour? I dont want to under compensate and take too many strong weapons away from the nobz

As an Ork player, first let me assure you that you have to give up some nice stuff to get those nobz. I normally don't take them, because they don't rumble too well with terminators (or Space Wolves, damn my friend and his Space Wolf army), and they don't necessarily solve anything that a PK Nob in a Boyz mob doesn't.

That being said, they're tuff. 2/3rds chance of saving any wound.

Hysterically for what should be a (in fluff terms) 'ard CC unit, they're amazingly vulnerable to anything charging them and dumping a pile of dice on the table. As orks, my favorite thing to do is throw a slugga boyz mob at them. They'll FC, kill some nobz, then MY nob with a PK will be eating their face, while THEIR PK nobz are cleaning 6 point boyz off the table. Fearless can do a number on the boyz, but unless I get ultra-unlucky, it usually at least kicks the crud out of the squad.

Also note without a boss pole, Nobz do have to take leadership tests, and can fail them in the worst possible ways (hence not really rumbling with termies well). Even with a pole it's no sure thing.

Not sure the statline on Striking Scorpions or Harlequins (can you tell no one at my FLGS plays Eldar?) but I've heard they're nasty in close combat, and if they drop a pile of dice on the table, the nobz are going to be hurting. With Cybork bodies, you can't count on negating armor saves, but a 5+ invulnerable is still just not all that, and anything that negates FNP will cause some pain.

The worst thing to shoot at them is expensive, low shot weapons that usually hit, frequently wound, and don't negate FNP. Don't be throwing expensive shots at them.

Ork Nobs tend to do badly when without supporting units. For instance, throwing away Nob bikers at an enemy completely surrounded by their friends is bad, as charging Orks is far better than being charged by Orks.

Make sure that the Nobs you are fighting against are isolated, and if the enemy runs out of mechanized elements, a few shots from big gunz (Str 8+) should do the trick in slaughtering them.

At worst, throw sacrificial units at them to slow them down, then when they consolidate and sweep, nail then with what heavy weapons you have if there are no other pressing concerns on the board.

Remember priorities. Those nobs may look menacing, but they have to get to you in order to do some real damage.

Have you tried using a Farseer to cast Doom on them, and then charging them with the Banshees?
No armour and no FNP is a good thing, after all.

agreed. the best way with an eldar army to take them out is with a *full* squad of buffed firedragons. the firedragons will ignore even mega armor/FNP and insta-kill. 10 guided vanilla firedragons vs doomed nobs account for 7-8 nobs DEAD with one turn of shooting (without cover or cybork armor so apply that as needed).

Well cant really just say apply cover as needed considering they *always* have cover against fire dragons.. So really you'll kill between 3 and 4.. Still good, but not 8

If he's footslogging those nobs, you should have no problems. Pathfinders (AP1 on a 5+ to hit...), bright lances, starcannons... you should have plenty of time to shoot them down, pin them, drive them back off the board.

Kirasu wrote:Well cant really just say apply cover as needed considering they *always* have cover against fire dragons.. So really you'll kill between 3 and 4.. Still good, but not 8

how do they always have cover? they have no inherent rule that gives them an automatic cover save.

PBS+Callidus.

edit: Missed the Eldar part. The new Nightspinners may cause them trouble, if only by slowing them to a (dangerous) crawl while you kill troops/capture objectives. You don't have to beat the deathstar to beat the player behind it.

For Eldar, if you're taking an all-corners list, I'd turn your brightlances on them. Its not like you'd have anything else for them to shoot at. If you're wanting to make a list tailored to fighting Orks, I recommend Avatar, Eldrad and Wraithlords. They might chew up a WL or two, but I'm sure those would do far more to them than they could do back. Nothing like taking something that a powerklaw only wounds on a 4+

warboss wrote:

Kirasu wrote:Well cant really just say apply cover as needed considering they *always* have cover against fire dragons.. So really you'll kill between 3 and 4.. Still good, but not 8

how do they always have cover? they have no inherent rule that gives them an automatic cover save.

Any model on a warbike gets a 4+ cover save.. Been that way in the 3rd and 4th edition rulebooks.. Check the warbiker entry

I like to use C'Tan against Nob spammers. The deceiver specifically. He can deny them their charge bonuses, making him extemely difficult to wound without a lot of expensive PKs. And ork shooting isn't exactly fearful, so they're unlikely to take him out anywhere else.

Kirasu wrote:Any model on a warbike gets a 4+ cover save.. Been that way in the 3rd and 4th edition rulebooks.. Check the warbiker entry

Except they're footslogging.

First thing kill the Deathkoptas as they'll hit you first, then hit the looted wagons, then the kans, then the flash gitz. By this time Anti infantry should have decimated the boyz. Basically they're a very slow unit that if they're footslogging shouldn't have that much of an impact.
Tips:
-Do not commit the Dragons unless a vehicle is about to hit your lines and then make sure they aren't retaliated against. Whan it comes to killing the Nobz deploy them with the Banshees just behind and after shooting charge through the gaps (no cover that way).
-Pulse laser those Nobs for all they're worth.
-Kill the nobz support before them
-Remember your psychic powers and when they should be used (before anything else, including resserves)
-Runes Of Warding should nullify the WB reasonably and once the Nobz unit starts going down he stops doing it on ld 10. Also remeber that 2 or 3 headbangs/PotW should kill him.
-Pathfinders will deal a good amount of damage to vehicles (1 result from guided PF vs AV11 if theres 5) and reapers will do reasonably aswell.
-Only bladestorm if you need to or if you'll get charged
-Don't get Eldrad into B2B with a PK

Tactics:
-DO NOT STAY TO CLOSE TOGETHER, the shortest no-transported weapon in your force is 18". You can support from distances
-Stay mobbile, you have 2 static units everything else has assault or pistol weapons. Make sure your always moving back and shooting (transports and DA) or move,shoot and assault (Eldrad and banshee's) or move and shoot (Dragons)
-Fire order vs Nobz = ID weapons, then a Mind war or 2 to get PB and/or WB to get rid of their best boosters.
-If you have to bladestorm you may as well charge afterwards.

I just want to add, dont discount Flash Gits just because so many people believe them to be a joke unit. Ive used usually a mob or 2 for the last few games Ive played (testing out a down the road Gitz army lol) and I have to say that they can REALLY bring the pain, specially when you arnt expecting them to. They are NOBS after all with incredible guns. So they can shoot the holy tar out of you and still hurt you in CC if need be.

Now comparing them to a hoped up Nobz mob is laughable but they still can make you scratch your head in disbelief. I agree with alot of the above on them though. If you have the rest of the army pretty much taken care of, you need to get as many insta kills on them as you can. That unit has the potential to creme half your army if you let it, but the major heel in that unit is the fact that its size isnt hard to manage. If you grab a couple insta deaths a turn while they march your going to be totally fine. You figure on average the points per model will be over 25pts a pop, ones with PK will go over the 50pts mark, so any that you kill will be hurting the Ork player more then anything else

Good luck

Love the 1st post saying you cant do it without casualties

simple.
S8+ weapons tear through them.
No playing with wounds since its instant death, straight to the point.

A prism or 3 should work great, throw in a few EML's here and there and problem solved.



If they had bikes or were in a wagon then they are a real pain, but slogging, they are a fething huge waste of points.




Also, dont ignore the koptas.
Its a mistake that alot of people make.
Eldar tend to use mobility to the most, with a unit that will hit you 1st - 2nd turn you need to get rid of them.
If they have a buzzsaw then fire a few S8 weps thier way 1st.

EML is still pinning, right? Use that, force LD tests until they break. Keep in mind that since it's footslogging, you don't need to worry about them much after they're pinned

I was going to say Battlecannon (Try to wound-allocate that, diversified Nobz!) , or PBS+Callidus, but since you're eldar....that's what I got.

Kirasu wrote:

warboss wrote:

Kirasu wrote:Well cant really just say apply cover as needed considering they *always* have cover against fire dragons.. So really you'll kill between 3 and 4.. Still good, but not 8

how do they always have cover? they have no inherent rule that gives them an automatic cover save.

Any model on a warbike gets a 4+ cover save.. Been that way in the 3rd and 4th edition rulebooks.. Check the warbiker entry

except he's talking about regular nobs and not bikers. been that way since the original post. check the thread.

Your best bet is to hose them down with firedragons until you can force a break check, then escort them off the board. Eldrad should also be using Mind War to snipe out the Painboy, getting rid of their FNP. Karandaras puts out alot of hurt against Nobz as well since he has a S8 powerklaw.

I'd advise against charging the nobs until they are down to about 5-6 models, as anything greater than that they still may be able to spread wounds around and dish out alot of attacks.

Your goal is to basically get them to be "Non-Fearless" by reducing their number and then forcing brake checks by tank shocking with your falcon. You should give the falcon a holofield and spirit stone just in case he decides to get ballsy with Death or Glory. That way you are free to have your banshees charge a doomed unit of boyz vice committing suicide by charging Nobz.

You can concentrate fire on the Nobz, just make sure the Fire Dragons shoot first, and I'd have Eldrad Guide them. Otherwise, he will spread the wounds around from your other shooting and he will take melta instant death causing wounds against wounded models.

Good Luck, but you should be able to handle them. Footslogging Nobz without bikes and without a KFF are pretty vulnerable.

Have you Tried Running away? XD

Well try Pathfinders in cover. They get a +2 cover save while in cover and with a Warlock squad or two on jet bikes with singing spears your only worry is the day he affords
to field Meganobs in battlewagons with Ghazghkull and Mad Doc or a Big Mek with Shock Attack Gun.

full army lists would be helpfull as then we'll know things like mob size, DA squad size, weapon loadouts.