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I want to buy a super-heavy for both spearhead and apocalypse. My friend keeps on yapping about the Baneblade being an "awesome all-round super-heavy". But i keep saying that i think that a 120" str D ap 1 weapon is something you don't want to be pointed at you. So what do y'all think? Baneblade or Shadowsword ?

The shadowsword hands down. Str D auto pens, ignores smoke (coversaves), autowounds and inflicts instant death regardless of toughness. You can also upgrade to BS 4 if you remove the lascannons and take targeters instead.

Depends,
baneblade has autocannon,demolisher cannon, 3 twin linked heavy bolters, 2 lascannons, and a 10" str10 blast

shadowsword has 3 twinlinked heavy bolters, 2lascannons, volcano cannon (only 5" blast)

its really up to you and what your opponents fielding

Unless you know your going to come across titians I'd take a baneblade. It covers pretty much every thing from anti-horde to anti-tank and is a bargin (points cost wise) for what you get.

aneblade has autocannon,demolisher cannon, 3 twin linked heavy bolters, 2 lascannons, and a 10" str10 blast

The baneblade's main gun is only Str 9. The co-ax autocannon has to shoot what the blast marker goes after. Cover, smoke launchers can bounce all of that. Str D blows through it all. Who needs more lascannon shots, etc. when you still have the rest of your army for that? Str D is a huge advantage in a Spearhead game.

also remember that even a partial hit will Auto-pen a vehicle as 1/2 of StrD is D, so its possable to hit multiple vehicles with an auto pen.

Grey Templar wrote:also remember that even a partial hit will Auto-pen a vehicle as 1/2 of StrD is D, so its possable to hit multiple vehicles with an auto pen.

Huh...I didn't know that! Looks like I need to spend more time with my Apoc book .

Anyway, in my case I will be using a Baneblade for the forseable future, since I already have one painted and ready to go!

Shadow sword, keep the las cannons. Being able to insta kill anything without having to roll helps alot, because even strength 9 against toughness 1 will spare 1/6 of the victims.

The Baneblade keeps on shooting and therefore being dangerous even after suffering a weapon destroyed result, where the Shadowsword ceases to be really dangerous after only one weapon destroyed result because of its one big gun.
While shooting, especially at range, the Shadosword is far more dangerous than the Baneblade. The Baneblade needs to get within 24" to use its firepower to the fullest, so it's more of a close support tank.

Getting a super-heavy tank is also dependant on what army you want to field it with. If you are mostly playing a static gunline, I'd say the Shadowsword. If you are fielding a more diverse force, then I would go with the Baneblade as a nice centerpiece.

I myself am thinking of getting the Stormblade from ForgeWorld. It is equipped with a plasma blastgun, and can dish out more template goodness than the baneblade at longer range, whilst still being effective against enemy tanks. I think that it would compliment my mechanized force quite well with some long ranged firepower.

Shadowsword all the way. StrD just takes models off the board. I don't recall if the Shadowsword's Volcano cannon is actually AP1, but if it is it gains +2 on the damage chart; StrD gives you +1 on the damage chart, as well as the +1 from AP1. It hits hordes, auto-wounds them, ignores cover and armor with a large blast. That's more effective than the Baneblade. It hits tanks, auto pens, ignores cover, can pen multiple tanks in a single blast (Spearhead formations baby!), and gets +2 to the damage table? To me there just isn't any contest.

To Bonde, the Shadowsword's gun is considered a "Main Weapon" which means that it can ignore the Weapon Destroyed result on a 4+. Even if the weapon is destroyed, it can make attempts to repair it as part of the Super Heavy rules. While this is also true of the Baneblade, its gun is a whole lot less potent.

StrD just make it an AutoPen. there is nothing that gives you +1 for StrD. and the Volcano cannon is AP2.

the problem with the shadowsword is that it's terrible compared to a Warhound, for the points.

a warhound costs as much as a Shadow sword and a LR with upgrades.

of course the Warhound is better. 3 SPs and 2 Voids + it can put down 4 StrD Pieplates a turn if you want.


the Shadowsword is best for when a titans voids are down and you need an easy roll on the table. Lascannons and other lighter weapons take down the Voids, the Shadowsword delivers a hammerblow each turn.

StrD blasts are good for taking out hordes of Lemun Russ or Land Raiders as it isn't interested in your AV(or your T)

Grey Templar wrote:StrD just make it an AutoPen. there is nothing that gives you +1 for StrD. and the Volcano cannon is AP2.

Apocalypse, page 96 wrote:In addition, when rolling on the appropriate damage chart, add +1 to the result.

Now, what "appropriate damage chart" actually means is anyone's guess. It could mean that it only effects Super Heavies as the Super Heavy Damage chart specifically states what modifies it (notice that it lacks +1 from AP1). I always assumed it the appropriate damage chart refered to how there were two damage charts in previous additions (I'm a child of 5th), and should be ignored. I can't imagine that Str D gets +1 to the damage table against Super Heavies, yet against a vastly smaller vehicle it does not gain an advantage.

another thing that annoys me is people thinking you can get "Inside a Void" a distance where a void no longer protects against damage.

i have looked and looked and the only description for Void shields says the ignore a damaging hit and go out and only apply to ranged attacks.

there is no minimum range for Voids people.

Grey Templar wrote:another thing that annoys me is people thinking you can get "Inside a Void" a distance where a void no longer protects against damage.

i have looked and looked and the only description for Void shields says the ignore a damaging hit and go out and only apply to ranged attacks.

there is no minimum range for Voids people.

Were did they start to think that? mabye they think it works like 4th edition KFF?>

there are people who say the way to kill titans is to get some Melta guns in close, Under the Void shields.

the rules for Voids is a single paragraph that explains a little fluff and says what they do.

Polonius wrote:the problem with the shadowsword is that it's terrible compared to a Warhound, for the points.

There are a couple subtle differences between a Warhound and a Shadowsword. First and foremost, strap 2 Double Barreled Turbolasers on anything and it will never see a game. No one will play against it. Second, I'd take cover saves over Void Shields any day.

Grey Templar wrote:another thing that annoys me is people thinking you can get "Inside a Void" a distance where a void no longer protects against damage.there is no minimum range for Voids people.

Void Shields, no. Power Fields, however, yes. Most people wouldn't bother to make the distinction.

i thought they were the same thing.

the Mek Stompa says they count as void shields.

I looked through all the published Stompas I could find. The Stompa (pg 130 of Apoc) doesn't have any kind of shielding. The Big Mek's Stompa on the following page uses Power Fields. The Goff Klawstompa on page 23 of Apoc Reloaded doesn't have any shields. The Evil Eye in da Sky [Stompa] on GW's Datasheets has 2 Power Fields.

guess i misremembered.

Grey Templar wrote:another thing that annoys me is people thinking you can get "Inside a Void" a distance where a void no longer protects against damage.

i have looked and looked and the only description for Void shields says the ignore a damaging hit and go out and only apply to ranged attacks.

there is no minimum range for Voids people.

OK I AFB so I might be inserting my foot in my mouth, but I swear that void shields only work against attacks from over 12 inches away...

Anyone got a quote handy for me?

EDIT: OK home from work with book in hand. Power fields only stop shooting attacks from 12 or more inches away, and void shields are the same "These work exactly like Power Fields, with the exception that collapsed void shields can be raised again".

So that explains that. Note this make me thinks a house-rule preventing deepstriking within shields (treat it like landing with in 1 inch of an enemy model) might be a good idea, since most of the titan type critters are so vulnerable to melee heavy hitters, you at least need to drop its shields before landing terminators all over it.

Jack

Hmm, str D really is devastating. Even if you get twice the blast size at str 10 ap 2, the str D template would be a lot more versatile because of MC's, tanks and the possibility of cover saves.
If you were to find a lot of marines or other tough troops like terminators out in the open (it IS apocalypse that we are talking about) the 2x 7" str 8 ap 2 blasts from the plasma blastgun would be more effective.

So str D makes for a more effective and versatile weapon, where the str 10 ap 2 weapons are more situational, but CAN be more devastating when used against footslogging troops, because of the bigger blasts.