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sourclams wrote:

Night Lords wrote:

sourclams wrote:

Repeating it doesn't make it true. Dakka Pred (1 autocannon, 2 heavy bolters) versus T4 is going to inflict 3.7 wounds before saves are made. With cover, it drops to below 2 models actually killed.

No horde player cares a whit if he's losing 2 guys per turn to your 100 point tank.

Uhh...what the? Horde armies dont have saves. And if they do get saves, so does the 2-3 guys under the plasma cannon template. So that means 1-1.5 dead guys. Congrats?

See, this is why I think you're playing with a predominantly 4th ed mentality (which does not succeed in 5th, by the way).

A dakka predator wounds T4 3.7 times. It's very simple math. 6 heavy bolter shots, 2 autocannon shots at BS4, 3.7 wounds versus T4.

Everything will have a cover save. This is a simple truth of 5th edition. I don't believe that anybody disagrees with this that has played 5th edition to any extent. Even a 5+ KFF save will cause you to do less than 3 wounds against 6 point Ork boyz.

Your Predator can fire for seven turns and kill less than one squad of Boyz. That is *not* anti horde firepower.

.

Uhh, even in cover the pred makes its points back. Less guys running at you means easier time for the boys in front. A plasma cannon will hit 5?? Are you kidding me? What do you do? Put them right next to each other? They have to almost be base to base for that to happen.

Plasma cannon will hit MAYBE 3. If youre lucky and your opponent didnt move right, or you got the perfect scatter. Again, this is all assuming you dont scatter away, dont overheat, and dont roll 1s: its 1.5 wounds - great anti horde we got there.

Small blast templates are pathetically easy to dodge.

Tank shock.

Your plasmacannon now hits 5 guys (or more).

Predator, on the other hand, still kills 2.

'whoo'.

And "making its points back" is another 4th ed mentality.

But you forget about the Havoc Launcher. If you can get 5 under that small blast, so can the Havoc Launcher. Then say it fails two wounds, and you get 1 or 2 more kills after cover. If I had a anti-infantry problem, I'd go for a Dakka-pred over Oblits. The enemy is ALWAYS going to have infantry on the field, so it will never run out of targets. Some games it won't perform as well as it will in others though, while Oblits will perform about the same every game.

Yep. Havoc launcher does indeed do very well against hordes.

But you can put them on your Rhinos and ignore the Predator completely.

The havoc launcher will probably kill as many hordelings as the Dakkapred anyhow.

Or you can put them on your Rhinos AND your Pred. There, now you chew appart infantry like nobody's buisness, and you are still less expensive than 3 Oblits.

Or you can put Havocs on your rhinos and have the option of deep striking your Oblit off of rhino-mounted icons, giving you a balanced army capable of taking on all comers with anti horde, anti armor, and anti infantry fire support....

See what I did there?

I see what you did there, but you are paying for it. Instead you can take the Pred and Havocs for superior anti-infantry and use the points you save for some anti-tank. You get two elements instead of everything in one package, so you have more targets the enemy has to kill and you are able to do both at once, which is something Oblits can't.

The bonus that the Chaos Space Marine Predator has over the Space Marine is the Havoc Launcher.

I stated it already but the Havoc Launcher is pintle mounted , meaning on top of the turret, what ever the turret fires at the Pintle will be able to.

So you actually get.

2 ST7 ap 4, 3 STR 5 ap 4, 1 Heavy 1 ST5 AP5 Twin Linked.

Thats a lot of firepower for only 115 points.

Its a great bargain and I have now subbed it and like it ALOT; oh and I use Dirge Casters, cause seriously its five points for a -1 to a tank shock.

Also your forgetting one thing about the Predator that the Obliterators do not have. Long Range support anti infantry .

The maximum antiinfantry for Obliterators is 3 Plasma Cannons at 36 inches. If you consider the lascannon anti-infantry go for it

The Dakka Predator has a 48 inch range on the Autocannons and a 48 inch range on the Havoc Launcher.

6 S5 AP4 shots if you are outside of about 5 inches where the firing arches cross.

I just dont count that and always say in my "theory" that one side will definitely shoot where as one will not have LOS.


Again the Dakka predator is excellent Cheap Long Range Anti Infantry.


edit:

Cheap Trick 101

Take some 3MM or so very thin Plasticard and mount it underneath the sponsons of a predator congrats you just gave a wider fire arc.

PS

Dont do this.

PPS

I have seen several people do this and its almost impossible to catch unless you physically pick up the model and look at it next to another Predator.

PPPS

I may have done this.

Even in the BRB the Predator is shown with firing arcs that convene inwards. Only the Leman Russ can't fire with both its sponsons, as they are locked on a 45 degree arc. The Pred has something like a 118 degree arc on each sponson however.

I don't know maybe its the new predator which I do not have I have the old 2nd edition one.

That is probably why.