Are chosen a good idea?

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**whrextheimpaler**

Fair enough sounds like a plan,

should i leave the plague marines in toward the back and give the rhino to my chosen?

**wuestenfux**

defiler
landraider
3 obliterators
1 squad 8 plague marines w/ rhino
1 squad 8 khorne bezerkers w/ rhino
5 raptors
5 termis
10 chosen
2 dp one nurgle one slaneesh w/ wings

Well, I'd take a 5 men Chosen unit with 4 meltas and mount them into a Rhino.
You can deploy them normal, or let them infiltrate (if you go first), or outflank. The first option is generally the best.
They can seriously slow down the advance of the BT armored wall.

**minigun762**

I guess I'm failing to see how Outflanking is really that risky.

The worst that happens is you arrive on the wrong side of the board but you're still in a transport, so you just have to spend a turn moving to get in range.

As for loadouts, I feel that the smaller, cheaper squads are the way to go. I'm partial to 5 guys, Rhino with 3 Meltaguns and 2 Flamers. The entire squad runs me 165 points and is a valid counter to most anything on the board. Never forget that you can hide in the Rhino and use the fire points instead of deploying normally.

**MekanobSamael**

I run mine all meltaguns, in a rhino, outflanking with an icon of Chaos Undivided. For 180 pts, you get 24" worth of melty goodness (from whichever side of the board we're talking about, but the enemy can rarely keep all their armor in the central 2 feet), plus another icon in case you get lucky with your terminators. It's not as reliable as it could be, but the scare value of that much anti-tank in one unit is enough to distract any opponent. I also paint 'em up nice and shiny with spiky helmets n' stuff to make them look extra important. Laugh all you want, but any turn you're not shooting my defiler, I'm happy.

**Sanctjud**

@MekanobSamael:

Technically, it's not 24".
If you move 12" from a rhino, you can only shoot out if they disembark.

So: 12" move, 2" disembark, 1" base hanging out of the zone, and then the 12" range.
Totals 27", makes more of a different with respect to the range to get the extra die.

But this also means you will likely lose that squad, but if they do their job, great. If not, well.../shrug.

**wuestenfux**

A single squad of outflanking Chosen is not the answer.
I'd take three of them. Then at least two of them should get their job done.

**Sanctjud**

That also means you are not taking the awesome-sauce-named-because-it-works Termicides

.

**mercer**

I've started using Chosen and found in small units of 5 in Rhinos do well. I take Rhinos as mech is king in 5th and gives a lot more of protection, plus adds target saturation with my other Rhinos. Infilitrate is cool, but lets face it the weapons the Chosen can move and shoot with are short ranged so you may find the Chosen dead before they do a lot - outflank is probably best to get a annoying back field target i.e Manticore.

Oh, reason for 5 is to reduce costs. Rhino can only fire 2 guns out the hatch so no point loading up on specials when you want to stay inside the metal box as long as possible, and no point having extra body bags costing more. If the Chosen achieve their role and then die then so be it, they've done what they need to go and don't cost a bucket of points.

Here's some Chosen tactica: http://www.imperiusdominatus.com/2010/02/chaos-space-marine-chosen-tactica.html

**minigun762**

I didn't put two and two together for some reason but the 2 weapons from the fire point makes it seem like taking 5 Chosen and a 2:2 mix of Flamers and Meltagun would be better. Just ride around in your transport blasting out double shots of whatever you need to use.

That is assuming people are ok with the whole "Flamer from a fire point" issue.

**mercer**

Yup you could do that. Personally I don't, but I understand what you mean.

**Xca|iber**

whrextheimpaler wrote:They are kitted out to fight a ork horde. Dreads cc Landraider has a missile launcher forget wat its called has twin linked autocannons and hurricane bolters on the sides and a multa melta.
His Rhino has same missile and storm bolter

The LRC has a TL Assault Cannon, not Autocannons.

**kight**

LordWynne wrote:As always, whether a unit is worth taking or a good idea or whatnot depends on the rest of your army. Consider your army as having a particular mix of synergy, flexibility, and redundancy, and the units within it also having these properties. You need to balance all of these properties at the army level and the unit level, and across both levels in order to maximize the army's effectiveness.

Chosen can outflank, infiltrate with an Icon, and can be outfitted in a variety of ways. Consider whether they can do that the rest of your army cannot (whether they enhance the army's flexibility), whether they can do what the rest of your army can (whether they can enhance the army's redundancy), and whether they will do it better in concert with the rest of your army (whether they can enhance the army's synergy).

These days I like to use my Chosen as shock troops, infiltrating with Plasma Guns, Flamethrowers, and Icons so that they can crack transports, burn the squishy goo within, and bring down my Terminators and Daemons with complete precision. They provide an immediate threat in the early stages of the game as my regular Battle Squads advance up the field towards objectives, and while my Havoc Squads provide covering fire from the backfield.

Chaos Space Marine Chosen
1x Aspiring Champion
w/Power Weapon, Plasma Pistol, Melta Bombs
9x Chosen
w/Plasma Gun, Plasma Gun & Melta Bomb, Flamethrower, Flamethrower & Melta Bomb, Icon of Khorne, Bolter & Melta Bomb, 4x Bolters.

I agree totally.

I am sorry but this is a illegal list of choosen even though you should be able to you cannot have a power weapon and plasma on anyone model nor can you have a power weapon on 1 model and 5 specials on another, that is my reasoning as to why they are not a good option exept in a very few cases. One of them is fighting Nidzilla which i am fighting this week each 10 man squad will have 1 lazcannon and 4 plasma : D. sorry not to really add anything to this forum just thought it would be a good point so the OP doesnt use a illegal list.

**DarkHound**

Kight, I have utterly no idea what you just said. I cannot decypher your broken English. However the squad that LordWynne made is legal.

**OverwatchCNC**

eNvY wrote:5 of them with meltaguns outflanking in a Rhino is always a nice surprise.

Couldn't agree more. I used to love running this unit before I got rid of most of my Chaos Marines.

**minigun762**

Yeah but what target do you need 5 Meltaguns on?

**mercer**

OverwatchCNC wrote:
eNvY wrote:5 of them with meltaguns outflanking in a Rhino is always a nice surprise.

Couldn't agree more. I used to love running this unit before I got rid of most of my Chaos Marines.

You can't fire 5 meltaguns out the hatch of a Rhino, so means you need to get out and why do you need 5 meltaguns? When you get out you cannot move as just outflanked on, so putting your troops at risk.

**Sanctjud**

I'm guessing the benefits outweight the death sentance...
Though, shooting out of the hatch lowers the 'reach' considerably as you move on only 6" to be able to use the hatch.

**mercer**

You can only bail out 2" anyway giving you a extra 3" of melta death, not massive.

**minigun762**

Sanctjud wrote:
Though, shooting out of the hatch lowers the 'reach' considerably as you move on only 6" to be able to use the hatch.

I thought they could move and fire at 12" because they were assault weapons...
Looks like its time to double check the rulebook.

**mercer**

No, if the vehicle moves 6" they can fire if it moves 12" they cannot fire - they need to get out to do that.

**Jaon**

As nurglitch said: How long is a piece of string?

**Nurglitch**

Jaon wrote:As nurglitch said: How long is a piece of string?

Quotation needed.

**IronfrontAlex**

I stomped a Logan/Ragnar/Najal Loganwing force last night with a nidzilla list, i only have 5 chosen marines, 4 plasmaguns and 1 missle launcher infultrate behind his lines, it did alot of damage especially since he saw 5 marines and went "meh" and ignored them, took out his troop choices in an objective match

**minigun762**

How effective have Melta bombs been on Chosen, as an alternative to Meltaguns?

**IronfrontAlex**

minigun762 wrote:How effective have Melta bombs been on Chosen, as an alternative to Meltaguns?

good god don't do it!

**Sanctjud**

IronfrontAlex wrote:
minigun762 wrote:How effective have Melta bombs been on Chosen, as an alternative to Meltaguns?

good god don't do it!

^That, but with more 'f' bombs.

**minigun762**

Haha, that bad huh?

**Nurglitch**

Melta Bombs aren't bad as an adjunct to Melta Guns, but they don't replace Melta Guns, even as insurance against Tank Shock because they don't have the AP1 bonus. They are very good though, particularly if you're planning on playing a relatively intact urban board, or going Walker hunting. Remember, a Walker that is Immobilized or Stunned is hit by Grenades on a WS vs WS basis rather than a flat '6', and in that case you put them on par with Power Fists for anti-Walker capability.

It's best to use them, however, to make the unit complex for wound allocation shenanigans. Remember, just because the unit is full of W1 models doesn't mean you can't pile AP3- wounds on a single model to afford saves to the others. That's why it's always a good idea to have more then five Chosen and to complexify individuals with Melta Bombs to make them better meat-shields.

**IronfrontAlex**

minigun762 wrote:Haha, that bad huh?

Yes that bad, its not worth it. Hitting vehicles on a 4+ or 6+ and walkers always on a 6+? EFFF that man, i would only throw meltabombs on one unit in the entire game, that's Wolf Scouts... and even then...

**Nurglitch**

Yeah, they also hit immobilized vehicles and bunkers automatically. So use them on vehicles you've immobilized but not destroyed with assault weapons...