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Fetterkey wrote:He's right, CSM can't really run with the big dogs (er, Wolves) anymore.

"Used to be best army, now is just a good army" does not mean uncompetitive. CSM still takes high spots in tournaments.

Anyone who thinks you can't win with Chaos is just not taking the right options. Chaos can be stupidly powerful. Stupidly monobuild and stupidly generic and un-fun. But stupidly powerful none the less.

Jayden63 wrote:Anyone who thinks you can't win with Chaos is just not taking the right options. Chaos can be stupidly powerful. Stupidly monobuild and stupidly generic and un-fun. But stupidly powerful none the less.

I'd disagree there, there are plenty of ways to build a list, provided your goal isn't to crush your opponent stunningly. I've seen plenty of flavoured yet good-in-a-fight lists at my local store.

I make no apologies for my opinions stated in this thread. CSMs suck, they're the only faction I actively dislike, but their codex is good (Better than half the codices in use today) so they're ranked higher than Necrons. If Necrons gain interesting fluff and a revitalized army list, CSMs are going right to the bottom,and staying there until GW doesn't make them look like spiky failures with daddy issues in my eyes.

Moving right along, let's talk about the next army in the list. It was a bit of a toss-up between three armies,

but in the end of the three I would say that...

14: TYRANIDS


... are the ones I have the least desire to play, for fluff and rules reasons. They make great enemies, but a lot of their fluff is overblown even by 40k standards, and the fact that people are constantly saying there are thousands if not hundreds of thousands of hive fleets out there just annoys me. Their personality is limited, and in most cases nonexistent, and they're constantly pushed as the unbeatable enemy (which is boring) by the fans. However, they rank higher than the previous armies because they're actual living creatures, and the synapse creatures DO have personality. It's limited, and very little of it is expounded upon by the fluff, but it IS there. I also have a fondness for Lictors, but unfortunately GW decided not to give us an Alpha Lictor commander, which would have been fairly sweet. That Lictors basically suck in this edition's codex also really disappoints me.

But I actually quite enjoy fighting Tyranids. I may not like their fluff, but they make for extremely enjoyable opponents in tabletop, there's just something visceral and cool about fighting them. Whether it's monstrous creatures or gant/gaunt spam, the codex, despite its flaws (inability to deep strike the tyranid prime for example, and the suckage of Lictors), saves the army for me. Eventually I might even be tempted to start the army, though that's hampered by the aformentioned absence of an alpha lictor commander (Dawn of War 2 really increased my opinion of them as far as playstyle goes, and this character is, specifically, why). The Tyranid Prime however is an interesting HQ unit and so if I did start a Tyranid army, it would probably be my choice in lieu of the previously mentioned nonexistent unit.

I actually kind feel bad for putting Tyranids here, but at the same time, something has to go here and of the three that are to come (sort of a lower-mid tier of armies), this army is the one I'm least likely to start playing. But from here on comes armies that I like to play AGAINST, or at least don't mind. Tyranids are fun opponents, with a good amount of variety which makes up for their lackluster fluff. Certainly I'd rather see a Tyranid army across the trable than any of the previous ones, and probably moreso than the next one as well.

I always liked that Alien-esque feel you got from fighting 'nids, myself. It's hard not to feel like the hero of the movie in such a situation.

Cant say I agree or disagree.

Subbing the thread to see where this goes and I hope it does not get closed by the mods so lets play nice!

Crons - While i do play them, i agree


CSM - Dont play them, wont do either.
Last dex was nice, but that was due to the serious chapter changes you could make use of (you know, things that make armies fluffy)
Also, HQ's got nerfed a little.
Allways did like a khorne prince with glaive and some other goodies for unit hunting.
However, the new dex is by no means terrible game wise.
Lash + oblitz spam is still around, and hasnt changed when it works.
So i wouldnt say not competative, just not top tier.


Nids - Ill hold my tongue on this one since im a huge nid fan
Fluff wise - has it weird bits, just like all other armies.
Rules - Cant really pick any faults.
Granted lickies aint beasts, but they arent designed to be.
They are simply for helping on reserves, hunting down small weak units / characters and generally getting in the way.

I was thinking earlier today while reading this thread "If Melissa says Tyranids as the next army, she just hates 'the bad guys' "



Prove me wrong! haha

Nids and Necrons are probably my favorites , mostly because they are the bad guys

I have a feeling the Wolves are gonna rank low on this.

You know, beating up the Sisters of Battle and all...

Cryage wrote:I was thinking earlier today while reading this thread "If Melissa says Tyranids as the next army, she just hates 'the bad guys' "



Prove me wrong! haha

Nids and Necrons are probably my favorites , mostly because they are the bad guys

I don't hate bad guys. I hate uninteresting bad guys.

You'll find I will put Orks fairly high on this list...

I was just about to call orks very high on your list if not first.

So far I only really disagree with you on the Necrons. They can be played rather well (even being hoed by phase out and cover saves) and personally I like the fluff and units. I think a new codex is indeed needed and the fluff/units be tweeked more. They have ALOT of potential to be one of those well liked armies but they just need that right nudge to get there.

I love the Necrons

I was sitting at home flipping between my home page tabs of youporn, dakkadakka and the lazytown fanclub. I was wondering what does Melissa think of all the 40k armies. I would really like to read her thoughts and insights on the game. I am so pleased to participate in this thread. I sit on the edge of my seat waiting for number 13.

tgf wrote:I was sitting at home flipping between my home page tabs of youporn, dakkadakka and the lazytown fanclub. I was wondering what does Melissa think of all the 40k armies. I would really like to read her thoughts and insights on the game. I am so pleased to participate in this thread. I sit on the edge of my seat waiting for number 13.

...





But in all seriousness, this thread is entertaining. It reminds me of The Nostalgia Critic's top 11 videos. I like it.

I really hope this thread doesn't get locked due to flaming. In fact I think after this I outta make a thread like this.

Im gona ghess the next guys.........
Its Tau?

Melissia wrote:I don't hate bad guys. I hate uninteresting bad guys.

You'll find I will put Orks fairly high on this list...

I like Orks. I find them funny, awesome, fun to watch... But interesting?

Is there really ever more than two types of Ork personality? I mean, I don't think that makes them any worse, but swinging the "uninteresting" label at Chaos Marines with all their variety and characters and then throwing praise at a purely Chaotic Neutral species that has no real goal other than krumpin a few skullz is a bit odd.

Also, I love Necrons, but I agree with your issues. I like Necrons for the visual style and the potential they have, but that potential hasn't been used very well.

I honestly like reading these lists. Opinions are always fun, whether I agree or disagree.

Terminus wrote:I don't think I ever really heard anyone complain about the Chaos codex being uncompetitive, but rather being really bland and having only one or two decent builds.

Being boring and having only a couple of competitive builds basically being the definition of an uncompetitive army. DE (for the moment), and =I= both fall into this camp. That the CSM codex is behaving like a 10 year old codex all of 3 years into its existence shows how really poorly it was done.

Basically, the current version of CSM is SM, except they have way fewer options and everything is more expensive. I recently played a couple of games with a person who ran beautiful CSM models, but played with the space wolves codex. I was surprised by the number of random comments I got from people saying that they knew someone personally who was playing their old CSM army with a light-side codex until a new CSM codex comes out.

I'm kind of surprised that tyranid are being ranked so poorly here. Their fluff is sort of shoddy, granted, but they are actually fun to play against and have nice models, and actually have a decent variety of lists that they can field. Why did they lose out to staler, less competitive codecies like DE and =I=, or even tau?

Wow, so far my two favorite armies have ranked last, now I just wonder where deldar will end up. I agree on the necrons section, lots of potential but instead we get lotsa fail. I also get the sinking feeling that they may be the most hated race :( I always manage to pick the most unpopular options in all things.

Chaos codex is kinda boring no argument there. Fluff wise I used to hate CSM but as I read more about em they warmed up to me. The paradoxes, crazy metaphysical nature, and odd interactions with human emotions of chaos itself is far more interesting than chaos marines imo and that's why I play em. In summation I think you need a good custom background to go with your chaos army.

I don't know too much about nids effectiveness (though I thought their codex was pretty neat) I couldn't agree more on the fun to fight part. I think they are the best enemies along with tau.

This is a most strange thread! Nids are No3 because they have too much fluff? You're pissed at some races for not having enough fluff but also berate some for not having enough.

You claim to like fighting Nids but also infer that you don't because you will now list those armies that you do like fighting against. Your arguments are confusing. Nids rank higher because they are living creatures?

I am all for the thread and find your choices interesting but the cases you put together is just a convergence of words and don't add to any logical basis.

This is a very enlightening thread, I shall like to see how this finishes (hopefully not locked).

I agree necrons are dead boring, they need more character.
CSM's aren't that bad, they can kick my guardass any day of the week.
Nids, yes they are fun to fight but I don't like them as an army to collect myself.

Melissia wrote:

Cryage wrote:I was thinking earlier today while reading this thread "If Melissa says Tyranids as the next army, she just hates 'the bad guys' "



Prove me wrong! haha

Nids and Necrons are probably my favorites , mostly because they are the bad guys

I don't hate bad guys. I hate uninteresting bad guys.

You'll find I will put Orks fairly high on this list...

Heh.

Heheheheh.

BAWHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA *cough* aaaaaa.

I'm sorry, Orks are more interesting than Necrons or Chaos? I bet you'll probably say pyromaniac nuns are probably the most interesting.

I haven't slept in many hours, but I'll be back in a bit to discuss this further when I get to work.

In my opinion, orks are entertaining, but not interesting. lol

Personally I'd put orks at the bottom rung, they're too hodge-podge and anachronistic for me

The fun thing lists like these have is that they are opinions. And with all opinion lists you get people who disagree to the point of agressiveness.

>.> That said I'm hoping for an average of my favourite 3 armies that's about 6. The initiasl 15 is a little painful to this goal, but I watch with interest.

To me, without Orks, there is no 40k.

I will say no more until I get to Orks in this list.

Until then, let's move on to...

13: Black Templars

This is going to be a short little rant. This is an army I see little of. This ranking totally a matter of feeling and opinion, as on this particular army I'm not really sure know how to explain these opinions.

I really have mixed feelings for this army. I like the crusader aspect, it's part of the reason I like Sisters, and yet... somehow, it just doesn't work out as well with the Templars. I don't know if I can really explain it, but Black Templars just don't "click" with me. I don't really enjoy seeing them on the field as my opponent that much, and I don't really think I'll ever play them, despite the fact that I like their concept.

The army list itself isn't bad per se I suppose. It's certainly more interesting than Blood Angels as far as varying from the basic default codex (though in other aspects, such as variety, it is lacking like any non-fifth edition codex). But it seems to be showing its age, and there's something I can't put my finger on that makes it feel flawed and unfun. I don't know if it is (I have not seen that many of these players), perhaps I just don't see the army enough to judge it, but in the end I think the army really needs to be revitalized before I can take it seriously, much like Necrons in fact.

While not as bad as third edition codices, it feels like a very flawed codex, and the fluff itself, despite me liking the concept, does not endear me to the army as much as I would like. Every time I read it I just can't seem to appreciate the chapter. The army's concept is something I can get into for starting it, if it's revitalized sometime in fifth edition (after tau probably), certainly moreso than Tyranids, but currently I'm just held back from really liking the army or its fluff for some reason. Consider this army tied with the previous one, and next one which should come later today.

wait, individual SM codecies are getting their own ratings? In which case, why aren't all of them (except possibly blood angels) below tyranid? I'm surprised DA even beat CSM.

16 codices, 16 ratings. Pretty simple concept.

Another ''***** celebrates x posts'' thread?

Yes. Hell Yes.

I'll be following this thread ( and I agree with most of the things you say, Although I think Sisters are boring).

Yeah, should be a laugh Mel.

Though sometimes, I do wonder if I could have seen what I start those months ago I would have chosen differently.